/jp/ - Otaku Culture

[Anonymous No.]

Oh shit, guys. I just realized something. Cirno may actually be the (potentially) strongest Touhou. Ever. Bear with me on this one.

So, fairies are supposed to be like little gods in Gensokyo, right? They embody a concept or thing, and the only way to truly kill them is to remove that thing from existence. But Cirno embodies cold. Cold is a relative concept, meaning as long as anything anywhere in the universe is even one fraction of a degree warmer or colder than anything else, it exists.

The only way to kill Cirno is to either return the universe to a pre-big bang state of singularity, or wait for total energy death across the universe. And entropy takes a long-ass time.

tl;dr, Cirno's continued existence is tied to the universe's very state. She may not be able to beat many people in spellcard duels, but she's effectively immortal even to high rollers like Yukari and maybe even dragons.

pic is mfw

[Anonymous No.]

smoke weed everyday

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404362
You cannnot kill her but she can't kill anybody else either so, she is weak.
All other gods are immortal so are onis, vampires, ghosts, Phantoms and some youkai like Yukari and Yuuka.
Now behold the true strongest Touhou, pic related.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404375
Forgot my pic.

[Anonymous No.]

She's not the embodiment of cold. She's a fairy of ice. Frozen water and "the concept of coldness" are not even the same thing, you powerlevel obsessed secondary.

Furthermore, fairies are not "little gods", they're just bits of nature that got up and wore dresses like most other youkai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404377
Imposter. My pic was obviously Yukari.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404383
Nah, shes the embodiment of cold. Thats why shes stronger than other youkai who are the embodiment of seasons. Cold is much more powerful than a simple earth season. Cold stretches across the universe. I think Cirno is just being modest, she could kill the planet with a thought if she really wanted to.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404387
Yeah, like anyone is going to believe that. 3/10 for getting me to respond.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404389
Nah. If anything, Cirno is just dumb enough to not realize she has that power.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404389
>Nah, shes the embodiment of cold.
because... you say so?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404399
That exactly what an all powerful god would want you to think. Other wise every jackass would be pounding on your door at all hours of the day with their problems.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404362
Cirno's power level is almost on par with Marisa
Marisa even said that Cirno has gotten stronger and that it was a tough fight

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404424

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404402
Perfect Memento in Strict Sense says so, but then again lolakyu.

If we're talking about untapped powerlevels, then there's a group that's possibly even more powerful.

The fairy trio. Particularly Sunny Milk. She is the fucking embodiement of light. Taken to extremes this potentially means a whole lot of superpowers. Superspeed, heat rays, give energy, give skin cancer.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404451
You tell em, Cirno.

[Anonymous No.]

That's why I keep saying that Cirno and Mokou will have to duke it out in the end. Who ever wins determines the death of the universe. Heat death or big chill.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404481
That would not make sunny milk more powerful than Cirno, it would make her the balance of power. Cold comes with a wide assortment of powers, anti gravity, slowing, shattering and countering pretty much everything Sunny Milk can do. If they clashed, Entropy would would sweep across the universe.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404362
oh god

[Anonymous No.]

>entropy

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404494
Moku isnt the embodiment of anything. Shes a human match that never goes out. Id hardly compare a match to even a speck of heat in the universe like the sun.

[Anonymous No.]

mmm... Hearing all these responses, theorically the fairies are the some of the strongest beings in Gensokyo without any dubt, BUT I think the fairies are probably too pure-hearted too know the destructive power that dwells in them and probably they will never reach the strongest use of their powers without external advice.

When I transform in a wizard I will go to Gensokyo and teach Cirno how to use her powers more effectively. The future generations will love that game.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404514
infinite life * any amount of unnatural heat increase = you're fucking retarded

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404514
So, Okuu?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404524
>any amount of unnatural heat increase.

Id hardly call a camp fire limitless.

[Anonymous No.]

Many people in this thread can't seem to type very well and end up sounding retarded.

Just another Touhou thread on /jp/

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404510
Rumia. That is something to think about. She's the embodiement of darkness. However darkness is merely another absence, the absence of light.

Does this mean Rumia embodies nothingness? The great void? Or does it mean she is antithesis to everything that lives in the light? And what about her appetite? Does it represent the ever consuming maw of darkness that doesn't truly consume anything making her ever gluttonous?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404538
Shes not the embodiment of darkness. No one is sure what Rumia is.

[Anonymous No.]

>The only way to kill Cirno is to either return the universe to a pre-big bang state of singularity

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404494
Their apparent immortality seems to be different, though. I think it was mentioned in Ghost team's ending in IN.
Yuyuko said something to the effect of not wanting more people like Kaguya, as they can never cross over. Mokou is obviously the only other true immortal like Kaguya, and from the Extra, we know that Yuyuko cannot invoke death on true immortals, so we know there are only a handful of beings that can't be forcibly invited to death.
On the other hand, fairies are numerous, so I'd say they're not included in the aforementioned group. I think fairies, like youkai, can still die. It's just that their concept of death is different to our concept of death, and their death is also different to a youkai's death. There must be a way to kill them, but simply slashing them to pieces would just cause them to respawn.

Also! lolquoting touhouwiki aside, the article on ghost mentions this little bit:
>they can come from anything, living or not
This implies that ghost can also come from animals, plants, household items, and also, nature itself, or the embodiment of it. Hence, I believe fairies can die, as they can possibly become spirits.

[Anonymous No.]

Isn't Keine the strongest since she can erase history?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404549
Orin's zombie fairies are a proof that fairies can die somehow so yes i agree with you

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404556
It's been agreed that she cannot do that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404565
They are just fairies playing pretend though
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/The_Grimoire_of_Marisa/Orin%27s_Spell_Cards

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404567
Agreed by whom? Is there a difference between consume and erase?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404567

I certainly didn't agree to that. And yes, Ex-Keine is definitely the strongest being in Gensokyo: not only is she omnipotent, she is omnipotent retroactively. What she wills was always true. or like Zun himself put it: "There is no history in Gensokyo other than what Keine writes."

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404556
Some people misunderstand what that means. What you're thinking of is the past. History is not the past, it's merely what humans figure the past to be.

When Keine erases history, she does not erase what has happened. Just the records of it. Basically it allows her to hide and cover things up. Like the Human Village in IN, it was still there, just unperceivable due to Keine having eaten its history.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404549
>I believe fairies can die, as they can possibly become spirits.

Your logic isn't sound, but it appears to be true, as confirmed by Cirno's scenario in PoFV.

>>8404565
Orin's zombie fairies are cosplaying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404575
I ate a cheese burger today. Certainly the cheese burger still exists but it really isnt what it used to be...

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404580
Did Cirno die in PoFV?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404571
Actually in Akyu's footnotes on Keine's PMiSS article she notes that Keine's power has no effect on the Hiede chronicles.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404575
>>8404571
She does NOT erase history. She can either hide it (normal Keine) or alter it (were-hakutaku), but not in the sense that she can change the past.

As have been mentioned, history is just what humans perceive the past as. In were-hakutaku form, Keine can change what we THINK about the past, but the past itself is left unaltered. It's like she can change it so that history dictates you were never born, and everyone will cease to know who you are, but you're still there, and anyone you know who were not affected by her abilities will still know who you are. Damned useful ability, but nowhere near omnipotent. I bet it has its limit too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404584
Huh, who said that? No, she just got told by Shiki.

[Anonymous No.]

Fairies in Gensokyo and in Asian folktales in general aren't "little gods" or "embody of anything". They're the leftovers that nature has. In other words, the purest, most natural kind of excremental spirit.

They channel nature to use their power, which is elemental like wind, ice, fire, etc. They're not nature.

Fairies aren't immortal. They regenerate when destroyed, that's not fully correct. Imagine that they're like a cup water, you splash it all over the place but if the water can get together, it's can fill the cup again. So what if you put more force? Like, boil the water?
Yeah, they're gone forever.

So someone with magical brute force like Patchouli, Byakuren, Yukari, Utsuho or even Mokou (providing she has the power of Phoenix). Cirno is as dead as a dodo.

The only character that probably has direct connection with/control over nature is Kazami Yuuka.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404604
If I turn my space heater on, the cold goes away, doesnt mean I killed cold, cold is still there. Come up with a way to kill cold and perhaps then Cirno can die, good lucky forcing entropy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404614
Applying real world logic and physical laws to a fantasy world running on fairytale and magic. Wow.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404631
>applying Gensokyo logic to natural phenomenon that encompasses the universe and not just Gensokyo, Wow.

Also, learn to imply.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404604

I agree with this guy completely.

>>8404584

Shikieiki tells her about what she should do if she doesn't want to get fucked up when she dies. Yeah. Die.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404595
Yes, in the sense that she can change the past. Forget the pop-culture usage of the term, changing the past does not actually imply changing the present.

>>8404604
>So what if you put more force? Like, boil the water? Yeah, they're gone forever.

Don't make shit up, anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404604
What's your source on Gensokyo fairies being like that?

[Anonymous No.]

Even when she's the strongest, if she can't make use of her power she's still weak.
I remember when people going "omg absolute zero is the shit!!!!!!111"

Gentlemen, I don't even think she can pull that off. Well, maybe she can, but how wide is the area of effect? Her house? Misty Lake?

At this very moment I do not consider Cirno a threat. People gets strong, so does Cirno. But at the time she can control the universe, the final bosses already gang bang Nagato Yuki.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404645
Well, it hardly matters if Shiki destroys the universe, shes the one that has to deal with the rush of souls.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404651
It changes into another form, but yeah, the "water in the cup" is gone.
I wouldn't dare to step further in this conversation unless I fully understand how body and soul work.

And that stupid Hourai Elixir.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404654
How is Cirno water in a cup? How do you boil cold? I am very curious how you accomplish this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404644
Who are you quoting?

Your whole argument is dependent on the notion that Cirno is, in fact, the embodiment of cold. She is not.

And don't start applying the law of our physical universe to Gensokyo. The sea at the moon there connects to Earth, for fuck's sake.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404654
>I wouldn't dare to step further in this conversation unless I fully understand how body and soul work.

Pretty much my point.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404657
Its stated in the came shes the embodiment of cold. Stupid fucking newfag. Hell, pretty sure someone in this thread even linked to it. Try to keep up moron.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404657
Our physical laws can be applied to some extend.
Like an Oni's punch can break a rock, so we can calculate how messy it can be when Yuugi perform a fisting on Iku.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404664

I couldn't help but laugh.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404664
>Implying Yuugi would ever do something like that and not just mess her satch with her horn
Magical bitches love that sort of thing more, you know

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404661
I only read the translated profiles... couldn't see " embodiment of cold" anywhere. Only "manipulation of chill".

I'm a newfag, tho.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404664
That would imply that Tengu are made of soft human flesh. Pretty sure they are made of Yokai flesh.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404672
>machine translations

Ohh boy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404661
>frothing at the mouth rage
Again, she is not. She is a fairy of ice. She can manipulate cold to some extent, but she's not an embodiment of cold itself.

[Anonymous No.]

What a terrible thread.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404678
Sorry but Zun disagrees.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404671

He didn't even mention any Tengu on that post.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404671
I don't care, Aya's legs are fucking divine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404679
But anon, ZUN have stated that he disagreed with you.

See, unless you provide your source, two can play at this game.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404686
Who the hell is Iku then, I dont have an Iku folder and apparently I am confusing someone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404691
Read the thread, dolt.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404697
She is the single most beautiful woman Touhou can offer. She's perfect.
If you do not know of Iku, then you should re-watch Touhou.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404697
Tenshi's... guardian?

She's #1 in the frills department.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404706
>posts Yukari
>implying she looks like Yukari
>Beautiful
Nope.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404697

Here. Not Tengu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404726
I came.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404697
>post on /jp/
>don't know all the Tohos
you're going to have to rethink either one of these brah

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404688
You realize that ass is fucking gigantic, right? It's badly drawn.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404700
Can't see shit, captain. There's only baseless arguments and accusations all around. Why don't you show which post was the one that without a shadow of a doubt tells us that Cirno is the embodiment of cold?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404730
I pass over most old hags. You mad?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404706
Bugger off you gap cheat.
Here is our one true idol

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404734
No, just humored.
It's your loss, anyway.

Also, calling Iku a hag is like calling Sakuya or Meiling hags.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404736
Uh?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404706
Bugger off you gap cheat.
Here is our one true idol

[Anonymous No.]

ptkan's Iku is the best Iku.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404575

If Keine shoots a bullet and erases the bullets history, then determining the trajectory and speed of the bullet would become impossible, since you only know the exact moment of existence of this bullet. Therefore her projectlies are impossible to dodge.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404528
She's not immortal... right?

>>8404529
You obviously cannot into math.

>>8404549
This realization was brought you by the letter "O".

Thanks.

[Anonymous No.]

I would like Cirno, if she weren't an ice fairy.
I don't want to love an ice fairy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404752
Even if she erased the history of the bullet, it's still fucking right there in front of you. Unless she can make the bullet accelerate to faster-than-Touhou speed or change the trajectory arbitrarily (well, she could probably do the latter, but...) after erasing the history you can still dodge the bullet.

[Anonymous No.]

About the bitching around "she is the embodiment of cold/ she isn't":

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Cirno

Not a word about it. I don't remember any mention of it on any game, as well.

[Anonymous No.]

I always think of Keine's ability the same as Remilia's.
Like, you do one thing that's certain to fuck every other thing up. Time paradox, people never met, the consequences all changes, stuffs like that.

But if she just erase the records, then it's like, a tale that never been told? Mokou's still fucked, but Kaguya forgot about it?

[Anonymous No.]

Fuck you.

Iku thread.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404780
The event happens, but the knowledge of the event itself is lost to anyone perceiving it.

She then could do something like kill someone and make it looks like another person killed the victim. She cannot, however, make it so you were never born.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404789
The perfect power for a pervert.
Wait, she's an elementary teacher right?

Lucky kids.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404778

No.

You just see the bullet and in the next moment you see the bullet in some other place and wonder how it got there.

I give it to you, that it's possible to dodge a bullet that goes in a straight line, since most people would assume that it does and therefore try to evade it based on this assumption.
However if the bullet is arcing (like every second one in tawhaw) then it will most likely hit, since you dodge the wrong way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404786
Fuck you power levels thread.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404798
It would be way harder to pull off than you make it sound to be, though. She has to time it just right; too early and her enemy will have a giant timeframe to dodge. It will look like she just fired a normal danmaku, albeit at a closer range than usual. Too late and the enemy would have dodged already. Remember that Touhou have faster-than-lightning reflexes, and so Keine will need to time her ability just right to make it effective. Even then, I think it will just be similar to Sakuya's time-stop. Bullets suddenly appearing out of nowhere, right?

And arcing bullets? You mean like curvy lasers? But that's tough even without additional hax!

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404816
Eirin > Watatsuki
/thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404821
True dat

Sage of the moon representin

[Anonymous No.]

Bitch please.

[Anonymous No.]

Power threads always end the same way.
Wakatsukihime "the manga bitches"
Yukari "the gaphax"
Shinki "unknown god mode on"
Yuuka "ultimate power even ZUN doesn't know of"
Reimu "main character plot"
Flandre "the destruction"

blah blah blah

Why not unite them and go fuck someone else like Nagato Yuki, Type-Mercury, Kami Tenchi or Demonbane?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404362

"Cold" does not exist. There only exists heat, and the theoretical absense of it (absolute zero...no electron movement...no transfer of energy).

So technically this Cimo chick is already dead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404868
Cirno is stronger than Yuyucko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404850
Even Demonbane can't defeat Demonbane.

[Anonymous No.]

That feel when I'm a boss and never make it to top 10 strongest.

[Anonymous No.]

That feel when I'm a goddess and never made it to top 10 strongest characters.

[Anonymous No.]

Typical powerlevel discussion:

"Yukari is the strongest because she can manipulate the border between reality and non reality."
"Eirin is the strongest because she can use her infinite knowledge to find out how to change the reality."
"Keine is the strongest because she can erase the concept of reality with her power."
"Cirno is the strongest because she can freeze the concept of reality and then do whatever she wants while it's frozen."

I find it sad how Yukari always gets this powerlevel shit the most despite having one of the least vague powers in the entire series(transport of physical objects through gaps).

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404901
>(transport of physical objects through gaps)

Only that's not what Yukari's power is.

>The ability to manipulate boundaries is a terrifying ability capable of fundamentally undermining reality.
>As far as we know, everything is built upon the existence of boundaries.
>If there was no water surface, there could be no lake.
>If there was no sky line, neither mountain nor sky could exist.
>Were it not for the Great Barrier, even Gensokyo itself wouldn't exist.
>If there were no boundaries, everything would probably exist as a single enormous object.
>Thus, the ability to manipulate boundaries is by logic an ability of creation and destruction.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404917
shut UP

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404901
>Yukari
>can do anything as long as she says "mumble mumble borders" first
>least vague

haha

you're funny

Seriously the "gap" thing is such a minor and trivial thing that it barely even counts as a power for Yukari. It's like saying that Cirno has the least vague power, the power of flight, when that's completely beside her point.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404917
Are you seriously quoting something out of PMiSS?
Or are you a just a clever troll?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404901
>the least vague powers in the entire series(transport of physical objects through gaps).
that's why she can canonically lengthen for example a night's duration, because it's a transport ability

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404927
Too American, didn't read?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404942
>It's like saying that Cirno has the least vague power, the power of flight, when that's completely beside her point.

Good argument, bad example.

Reimu is the one with the "power of flight".

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404952
Oh god oh god oh god I just thought of something awful.
Sankakyuu Complex

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404969
Stupid sexy Akyuu.

I'll forgive you if you post more sexy Akyuu, anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404983
Non-loli form or any?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8404952
Yes, I'm seriously quoting something from PMiSS. Your point being?

You are aware that Yukari pretty much wrote her own article, right?

[Anonymous No.]

NO OTHER TOUHOU CAN COMMAND YOUMU TO MAKE IT RAIN ON DEM

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405046
why does#
it always rai
n on me??

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405007
Guess I got let off easy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405054
Is it cause you lied when you were seventeen?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405007
>>8405087
No you're not forgiven yet. Any form will do; now repent for your sin.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405108
Figured you would've just wanted non-loli.

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405118
Forgiven now?

[Anonymous No.]

>>8405185
Sorry that was full of artifacts for some reason, different one.

[Anonymous No.]

>You are aware that Yukari pretty much wrote her own article, right?

Who's to say that Yukari didn't embellish on her own abilities then? I can write a lot about how great I am but it doesn't make any of it true. Yukari is a long-term trickster. Her motives are mysterious. Should you believe the written word of a youkai who has lived as long as she has and is known for being unpredictable?

Example: Just because I wrote this, one might assume that it is my mindset and I actually believe it. It's not, and I don't.