Touhou 12.3 Thread (I need some suggestions)

File: 23 KB, 300x400, yuyuko.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Touhou 12.3 Thread (I need some suggestions) Anonymous Mon May 23 17:00:54 2011 No.7387760 [Reply] [Original]

I need some strategies on how to approach an oppressive Yuyuko. Loves using projectiles, attempts to make you graze towards her only to smash you back, etc. I was using Hong and Youmu during the fights with her, so I don't really have too many options to hit her from afar. I have a Pathcouli up my sleeve, but I'd prefer to keep her hidden for now.

Suggestions would be nice, but anything Touhou 12.3 related works.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:07:54 2011 No.7387783 >using hong against yuyuko >using hong at all Oh please.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:07:54 2011 No.7387788 >>7387783 >No fun allowed

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:12:54 2011 No.7387814 214C?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:12:54 2011 No.7387816 >>7387783 Hong isn't exactly my number one preference, but she is pretty fun to use. I prefer Patchouli and Youmu over her. I just like to be able to smash my enemies with my little unreliable guard sometimes.

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:14:54 2011 No.7387827

Were you playing against me?

Yuyu's strength is midgame and setup. As far as China and Youmu go, Yuyu crumbles under melee pressure, so keep that up. She lacks good reversals or defensive moves in general, so is highly reliant on cards to get out of trouble. Don't give her room to set up her projectiles. She also doesn't have a particularly good pressure game since she lacks tight strings and only has a single vulnerable melee attack (623) to mix into it, but be careful because it's frequently used to bait people into cards.
Other characters can deal with her in different ways, but the best way for melee characters like those two to handle Yuyu is to get her into the corner and never let up. Youmu especially can get great use out of her 623 against Yuyu.

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:15:54 2011 No.7387831

give up on meiling vs yuyu until you know the characters better

With Youmu you have a lot of options. If Yuyuko is standing still and you're approaching from the air, shes probably going to use 2b, so keep grazing if she always does that. If she takes to the air, catch her with j8a or ja, depending on if she has bullets out.

You can catch her easily with slash of eternity if shes dumb enough to use bullets on the ground when you have that. Easy damage.

But overall, you want to knock her down once and stay on top of her for the rest of the match. If you can't do that, you need more practice in general and not just vs Yuyuko. Just watch for reversals.

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:45:54 2011 No.7387963

May as well ask, how does one beat Iku? I can't be below her at any time because I'll always get smacked by a j.2a, her projectiles are stupidly fast and her range is ridiculous. I can't play against one that just abuses the air. I usually play Sakuya, Youmu and Sanae.

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:49:54 2011 No.7387983

>>7387963
The same way you beat Yuyu. Pressure, pressure, pressure. Stay on top of her and don't let up. Her ground game is even worse than Yuyu's since she lacks a good anti-air like Yuyu's 6A. She has even fewer reversals and some of the worst mobility in the game.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:50:54 2011 No.7387986 File: 90 KB, 432x728, Hong Meiling, the name is Hong Meiling!.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7387827

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:52:54 2011 No.7387996

>>7387983

I see...I have some trouble with Yuyuko, but not too many. Iku pushes my shit in every single time, she always just grazes my projectiles then j.2a combo all day every day and I can't do anything in the corner. My corner pressure is probably the worst of any player I know of, I can't even do it with Sakuya.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:52:54 2011 No.7387997 >>7387983 Oh, and if you're playing Sakuya and don't know how to apply pressure, then you have a fuckload more to learn than how to handle just one matchup.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:53:54 2011 No.7388003 I want the next touhou fighting game to use simple movesets, but have teams to still allow diversity.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 17:55:54 2011 No.7388019 host who?

Anonymous Mon May 23 17:56:54 2011 No.7388022

>>7387997

I can do midscreen pressure fine, but I can't do shit in the corner, whether I'm cornering an enemy or an enemy is cornering me. I don't know why. Every time I try to escape their crazy corner combos I get smacked, every time I try my own they graze out with no resistance. The corner just kills me.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:00:54 2011 No.7388040 File: 66 KB, 995x778, Patchyflowchart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Mon May 23 18:08:54 2011 No.7388067

>>7388022
Play more, and learn to take it easy. Seriously, a lot of the people you'll play who don't already have a reputation for being very good will essentially kill themselves when they're in the corner. They'll feel this compulsion that they have to get out right away, rather than watching and waiting for the right moment to graze, 4A, BE, or reversal.

Anonymous Mon May 23 18:13:54 2011 No.7388078

>>7388067

I see...I get killed because I'm always left blocking too long and I always get myself broken in the corner. On one occasion I got broken three times in a row against a Meiling. I don't really have much experience with BE so I don't use it, since I tend to use it at terrible moments that get myself killed. I dunno, I'm just really terrible at defensive play. I tend to play more evasively.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:18:54 2011 No.7388096 >>7388078 The best thing you can do right now is play more. When you're just starting out, it's the easiest way to improve.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:20:54 2011 No.7388097 >>7388096 I'm not exactly new, but I play on and off so my skill tends to fluctuate a lot in the lower mid areas. I remember the things I need to do but my playstyle changes every break I take.

Anonymous Mon May 23 18:22:54 2011 No.7388104

>>7388022
Are you me?
I can't come up with a good corner block-string which won't drain all of the spirit in no time...
And enemies always react to 6A...
I hate Iku, but I hate Yomu much more for her insane pressure...yet the worst is Alice, just can't do shit against her, while she limits me on each hit. Damn Alice.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:25:54 2011 No.7388110 File: 42 KB, 931x608, imlucflowchart.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Mon May 23 18:25:54 2011 No.7388113 File: 198 KB, 931x608, 1293397553630.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7388110 I prefer this one.

Anonymous Mon May 23 18:27:54 2011 No.7388123

>>7388104

Iku is my only true weakness. Other characters may give me troubles but they're not as bad for me. I also feel kind of bad for Sanae because I feel as if she has absolutely no corner pressure so I'm stuck spamming j.2C with a mix of melee moves. It's obviously not that great a strategy though.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:37:54 2011 No.7388154 >>7388123 Well, Iku is abuser. Once you get used those gimicks, it becomes relatively tolerable.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:41:54 2011 No.7388179 /jp/'s lack of interest in TH12.3 upsets me. But well, there are simply to few people on /jp/ now, can't be helped I guess.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:42:54 2011 No.7388182 >>7388154 I guess. I still can't get past that ridiculous j.2a range though. I'll probably be complaining about it for a long time.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 18:48:54 2011 No.7388204 >>7388182 Her j.8a is not that nice either. But the true problem of Hisoutensoku is...it is pretty old and most of the ones who still play it are pretty skilled, it's not that easy to reach their level from 0 now, kinda late.

Anonymous Mon May 23 18:59:54 2011 No.7388249

Iku's neutral game is the best. Try to not let her do anything. She's tall, slow and has no good reversal options or pokes. Her groundtech goes far so you better predict it.

When you are a full screen away, beware of her 6C and set up some stuff to make the j.2A approach a little harder.

Also try to get down what to do in reaction to BE. Iku needs it more than any other character.

Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Mon May 23 19:03:54 2011 No.7388276

>>7388204
Eh, I dunno. I was able to find a whole bunch of people at or slightly below my skill level through convincing people I know to play and a few threads on /v/, and play fairly often through Steam contacts.

Though I am kinda sad about the lack of recent netplay threads.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 19:06:54 2011 No.7388291 >>7388249 Would it be a good idea to stay above her? Or would being in front of her be better? All I know is that I can't be below her. I'm always kind of used to having Sakuya's 3a for anti-air but it's so worthless against Iku outside of comboing.

Anonymous Mon May 23 19:22:54 2011 No.7388363

>>7388291
Not above her, but on about head level. She has the same problems as Alice, though she's not that helpless against someone on that height. Alice whiffs 5A,2A,6A,3A here and 66A as anti-air is insane. Iku still has 4A and 6A but they are slow and wouldn't hurt as much as a j.5A from you to Iku's face.
You shouldn't forget that her j.2A and j.6A miss completely if you hug her either. If you think Iku's relying way too much on your defensive play, try to jump into her some time.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 19:25:54 2011 No.7388373 >>7388363 I see. My biggest problem is that I tend to use the ground more. That and when I try to dash at her for something I get smacked away or have to block.

Kudryavka !!wEyYEw5OlKU Mon May 23 19:34:54 2011 No.7388402

Beating Yuyuko: Play Iku and make her ragequit with your stupid ENORMOUS STAFF OF ELECTRICITY alt skill. Beats all runaway since it goes through everything and does total bullshit chip damage.

Beating Iku: Um, I dunno. Maybe if you're really, really good with Remi or Sakuya. Iku has no fucking counters as far as I'm aware.

Anonymous Mon May 23 19:46:54 2011 No.7388441

>>7388373
Rule 1 against Iku is: Never dash if you are in her doom zone.(j.2A) This includes her flying over your head.
Approaching her ground to ground shouldn't be too hard. Block against a grounded Iku is not as bad as you may think. If you can react to her 5C and know her drill/IAD traps, there's not much left to be scared of. Except the corner of course.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 19:48:54 2011 No.7388452 >>7388441 I see. Every Iku I've seen goes into the air quite quickly though. Getting her in the air is really tough for me.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 19:50:54 2011 No.7388458 >>7388402 If you can't beat a slow skill that is completely grazeable and whiffs at range, you've already lost. There's a reason everybody runs Iku's other alt instead of that.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 19:53:54 2011 No.7388466 File: 41 KB, 261x223, 1272848402468.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7388441 >Iku >grounded

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:00:54 2011 No.7388490 >>7388276 Lobby killed netplay threads. It's still nowhere near as good as Caster, but it's a fuckload better than Soku's direct connect.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:17:54 2011 No.7388549 >>7388490 Lobby?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:20:54 2011 No.7388561 >>7388549 http://www.plus1coins.com/projects/soku_lobby/

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:26:54 2011 No.7388577 File: 54 KB, 1190x703, 1285183481115.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:47:54 2011 No.7388640 >>7388561 Thanks.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:52:54 2011 No.7388651 >>7388561 >>7388490 Hm, is that actually good?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:53:54 2011 No.7388655 >>7388651 Sucked before, now it's starting to become better and better. Next big version will finally support spectating, after that maybe stats and such will start getting implemented.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 20:54:54 2011 No.7388657 File: 1.00 MB, 400x225, bc85da8ae1d8e7aa7cd16718f72f8b4d1305017201_full.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Play as Sakuya, kick some ass. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7FuhNkyVoQ

Anonymous Mon May 23 20:58:54 2011 No.7388665

>>7388655
It's very prone to crashing and has some pretty severe issues if you're on a wireless connection since any slight lag spikes fuck it up for a good 2-3 seconds since it goes "OH SHIT, LAG, BETTER SET THE DELAY TO 40" and doesn't update again quickly enough.

If you've been hosting before on a direct connection, it'll probably feel worse than before. If you've been joining, then it'll feel better.

>>	Anonymous Mon May 23 21:02:54 2011 No.7388678 >>7388657 You suck at this game, smash harder.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 00:49:54 2011 No.7389353 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9fMriIV9bk

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 00:53:54 2011 No.7389359 File: 338 KB, 600x536, yukarimoji.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] someone post the Yukari/Ken flowchart, pls

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 00:57:54 2011 No.7389362 >>7389359 I feel bad because I made the Yukari flowchart but I lost the image in a hdd failure a year ago.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 00:59:54 2011 No.7389366 >>7389359 I'm reminded that I need to practice Yukari some.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 01:02:54 2011 No.7389369 File: 40 KB, 578x746, Youmu flowchart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 01:06:54 2011 No.7389384 File: 289 KB, 1007x1700, tenshi eating pc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] did anyone ever make a Tenshi flowchart?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 01:09:54 2011 No.7389389 >>7389384 You could make your own if you wanted to. Just replace Shoryuken/Loliball/whatever with j.2C.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 01:11:54 2011 No.7389397 File: 1.00 MB, 512x512, —].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7389384 Tenshi doesn't need one, you can win blindfolded, hands and feet tied behind your back, and controller/keyboard unplugged. That is how good Tenshi is.

Anonymous Tue May 24 03:04:54 2011 No.7389673

>>7387963

Iku's one glaring weakness is her lack of a decent reversal and a fast melee. The result is that when she gets up from a knockdown or when she's in a pressure string, her only option are to block and border escape or high jump out. To make an Iku matchup easy, you're going to have to learn how to use meaty attacks and bullets as well as learn a reliable blockstring and all it's escape points.

I'm not a Youmu and Sanae player, so I'll have to rely on my limited Sakuya knowledge. First of all, Sakuya's 214b/c works well while your opponent it knocked down. Because of the delay between your recovery after the move and the time when the move actually bounces toward your opponent, you can force your opponent to deal with both you and the knives at the same time. If you force him to block block your knives and your opening melee attack (preferably your j5a) at the same time, you can now begin your blockstring. My biggest weakness with Sakuya is my lack of a reliable string but 5aaa 6c j6D j5a j2a j2b reset and 5aaa 6c j6D j5a j2b reset should get you started.

This video may help. It features one of the best Sakuya soku players.
http://www.youtube.com/user/sibladeko#p/c/2D39AC7C6E8AD8F7/117/OVjgjRC7zzc

Anonymous Tue May 24 03:05:54 2011 No.7389675

The more difficult and complicated part to describe is how to achieve this knockdown in the first place. As you know, Iku has long normals and a fast bullet, both of which lead to decent damaging combos. In addition, she has blockstrings that are difficult to border escape and her j2a is one of the easiest hitconfirms in fighting games in general. So, how do you combat all these strengths? By predicting what your opponent will do and reacting accordingly.

Let's simplify Iku to 6 of her possible options. We'll assume she's in the air because jumping is quick, airblocking is so hard to break, and Iku's most dangerous opening come from being in the air.
1) Long air to ground melee j2a
2) Fly in and land a short range air melee j5a
3) Long quick bullet j6c
4) Slow meaty bullet j5b
5) Long air to air melee j6a

Each move has the following strengths
1) and 5) will beat out movement inward as well as interrupt any moves with long startup. In addition, they can be canceled into j6c on block essentially making it relatively safe to spam.
2) will beat out movement inward and can start a blockstring making it relatively dangerous to just sit there and allow her to sit there and land it. In addition, any fast bullets will be wasted on her flying in.
3) will interrupt any long startup setups
4) will make it harder for you to approach and make it easier to land a j5a.

Anonymous Tue May 24 03:06:54 2011 No.7389677

Note that these options have the following weakness
1) and 5) can get interrupted by a fast bullet. They can't be canceled on whiff, and if you have a bullet already set up, you can force them to get hit by simply blocking their attempt. Sakuya's fastest bullet is her j6a. Also, because it's not cancelable on whiff, you can bait it and rush in after it misses.
2) can also get interrupted by a fast bullet. You can actually beat it out with some of your longer normals as well. j6a works relatively well. Like Iku's other melee, you can bait it and rush in when it whiffs.
3) can be beat by just flying. You can even fly up and down just Iku to waste meter on bolt that will never hit. Essentially, you win by being defensive and letting iku burn out.
4) can get interrupted by a fast bullet and many times, a thicker bullet will go right through it.

If you properly adjust to how you think Iku will react, you can sucessfully get through Iku's full arsenal and gain the momemntum necessary to score that all important knockdown. Then you'll be free to unleash your full arsenal of pressure against her.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 03:29:54 2011 No.7389729 File: 27 KB, 189x617, #hisouten in a nutshell.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 05:15:54 2011 No.7390020 >>7388657 YOU SUCK

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 05:31:54 2011 No.7390060 Where do people play this game now? I only played in the threads that were made but never see them anymore.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 06:01:54 2011 No.7390149 File: 57 KB, 1154x825, Youmuflowchart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7389369

Anonymous Tue May 24 06:10:54 2011 No.7390171

>>7390060
Lobby, but I don't like it much. 95% of the players fall into three categories. Laggy South Americans, newbies who play every character by flying into the the top corner of the screen, and people who bitch about lag. Every now and then I find someone both decent and isn't a whiny cunt, but I could count the number of times on one hand. I mostly just dick around with alts because it's still preferable to the AI.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 06:19:54 2011 No.7390184 File: 70 KB, 1565x849, Tenshiflowchart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7389384

Anonymous Tue May 24 16:48:54 2011 No.7391902

>>7389673

Sheesh, I'm not even half that good. It makes me think I may need to alter my deck since all of the spellcards I have set are meant to combo from 66B. Actually, that's kind of how I do it with all characters, except with different spellcards for different combos. May need to alter my playstyle.

>>7389675
>>7389677

I kind of get it I guess. I think I'll need to get better at knockdown pressure as well, I'm not very good at prediction.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 16:49:54 2011 No.7391910 >>7390184 Any more?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 16:55:54 2011 No.7391968 >>7388657 Awful. I'm horrible at this game, and this video was painful to watch. Why. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRLeb-a1pV4 At least post something decent if you're going to claim Sakuya is good.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:01:54 2011 No.7392012 >>7391968 Damn. That makes me realize how slow I am. The more I keep watching, the more I feel as if I'll never get any good. I'm just slow.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:05:54 2011 No.7392024 >>7392012 Don't worry, almost everybody is shitty, so you have no expectations to live up to.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:12:54 2011 No.7392051 >>7392024 Maybe, but I kind of want to dominate my enemies. Losing all the time is no fun.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:13:10 2011 No.7392058 >>7392051 Then go to the IRC channel and e on bad people like me.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:14:54 2011 No.7392062 Then go to the IRC channel and pick on bad people like me.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:14:54 2011 No.7392064 >>7392051 Dominating people all the time isn't very fun either. The most fun comes from even matches, or matches where the other guy is a bit better than you. Something like that is hard to find, though.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:16:54 2011 No.7392071 >>7392064 Perhaps. But I like to be the guy that's a bit better instead. Sometimes I get a thrill out of completely destroying whoever I'm slightly better at though.

>>	Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Tue May 24 17:36:54 2011 No.7392143 File: 100 KB, 905x611, 1296441386566.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7389362 This one?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:41:54 2011 No.7392161 >>7390149 This chart really needs to be updated, since you can easily SOE off a j5A. Best of both worlds.

>>	Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Tue May 24 17:43:54 2011 No.7392170 >>7392161 Only on counterhit though, right? In any case, why is Youmu's soku wiki pages so much more detailed than anyone else's?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:50:54 2011 No.7392192 Kind of makes me want a Sakuya flowchart. But I don't play her the same as everyone else, although I do use a kind of flowcharty playstyle for her...

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:52:54 2011 No.7392198 >>7392192 2b, j.2b -> do you have 2-4 cards? Yes -> 66b spellcard, No -> 2b, j.2b Enjoy winning every match against people from low to mid skill levels.

Anonymous Tue May 24 17:53:54 2011 No.7392202
File: 3 KB, 63x92, alice AHAHAHAHA_1.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7392170
>In any case, why is Youmu's soku wiki pages so much more detailed than anyone else's?

I dunno, Alice's seems even more detailed than Youmu's. Are you referring to the http://hisouten.koumakan.jp/ wiki, or a different one?

I've been out of the soku loop for a while, but it's good to see there are people as crazy about Alice as I used to be

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 17:55:54 2011 No.7392204 >>7392170 Not necessarily, non-CH j5A > 66A > SC connects at low height, like non-CH j5A > land > j5A > ... does. Nevertheless, non-CH j5A > SC would be too hard to hitconfirm, while it's easy with a CH.

Anonymous Tue May 24 17:57:54 2011 No.7392212
File: 424 KB, 640x480, Sakuyadeck.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>7392198

I actually do that spellcard thing, except with a couple additions. Enemy above me? 3a-66b-spellcard. Sometimes I do 5fa-3a-66b-spellcard, or 2a-3a-66b, or sometimes I can just do j.2a into spellcard. My deck reflects this.

>>7392202

I'd play her if I could get used to her terrible, terrible close range game.

Anonymous Tue May 24 17:58:54 2011 No.7392217

>>7392204
By the way, low-height j5A into 66A is something you would want to do anyway, even on block, as 66A is air-unblockable and has a decent vertical reach. From that, either alt. 236 or 22 into combo, or any spellcard. That's something I haven't ever seen any Youmu do, and it gives her something decent for air strings.

>>	Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Tue May 24 18:00:54 2011 No.7392230 >>7392202 Nah, not even her. Youmu's got those subpages like http://hisouten.koumakan.jp/wiki/Konpaku_Youmu/Normal_Moves that go into even more detail.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:02:54 2011 No.7392237 >>7392230 Utsuho is in the same boat.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:22:54 2011 No.7392325 File: 118 KB, 1500x1500, alice chibi unamused_1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7392230 I am ever-so-slightly jealous

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:43:54 2011 No.7392409 Alright /jp/ I'm gonna bite. I downloaded the game, and I have no previous fighting game experience. Am I going to suck?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:44:54 2011 No.7392410 >>7392409 What do you think?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:45:54 2011 No.7392417 >>7392409 Yes. Because that's how it is with all games you start out with. It's relatively easy to get into after a while though, don't expect to be amazing though.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 18:47:54 2011 No.7392419 >>7392410 I think my downloaded version just now didn't work.

>>	Youmu Konpaku !MyonHUTINA Tue May 24 18:52:54 2011 No.7392445 >>7392419 Dunno why nobody's download is working these days, but here, have mine. http://www.2shared.com/file/6A_i4s_T/Touhou_123_-_Hisoutensoku.html

Anonymous Tue May 24 19:02:54 2011 No.7392473
File: 331 KB, 640x480, Suika_chilling.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Can't believe no one suggested it yet, best way I've found to get through her spam (pretty much anyone's spam actually) is with Suika. She has this one alt move (Unpleasant Mist, 214BC) where she turns into vapor and simply can waft through whatever projectiles are on screen for as long as it lasts (depends on how many times you pull the card), and as a floating puff you can aim yourself wherever you want while being invincible.

Depending on the version you use (B or C), you can either do a quick get-away but have a lag when coming out, or have a slight lag going into mist but be able to hit basically as soon as you come out (that's the one I always use, then again I use it offensively to float through projectiles and then pop out near/on top of the enemy). It takes some practice getting used to it (and luck pulling the card) but once you get the hang of it it's way better than normally grazing through a bunch of projectiles .. it can save energy + you're fucking invulnerable, plus as a puff if you do lots of small movements before you come out there will be some smoke covering up your immediate trail, and it can be very hard for the opponent to know exactly where/when you're coming out. Don't be predictable with the mist otherwise you'll get punished bad once the other guy figures out your routine.. but there's a lot of options with it so it shouldn't be hard to shake it up. Best thing imo is to bait them into attacking you as a puff (like fly above them or at them suddenly), but then pop out right after they swing and punish them, works well for most opponents.

Reisen also has an alt skill that will -ABSOLUTELY- fuck up Yuyuko, from maximum range at that.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:04:54 2011 No.7392477 >>7392473 Well, he doesn't use Suika. Actually, I'm not sure many people use Suika at all.

Anonymous Tue May 24 19:08:54 2011 No.7392489

>>7392477

Seems everyone dropped her once that one fireball punch move got nerfed, however Suika is still actually very very good.. what it is, is that some people just migrate to whatever character is most broken at the time (like they might be playing Okuu now), although I really like Suika's fighting style (lots of options/tricks, and I just like Suika, period) so she's still my main.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:10:54 2011 No.7392494 >>7392489 I hear you on that, although I'd say it's less of overpowered and more of who's easiest to dominate worse players with. I've always stuck with my main no matter what so yeah.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:12:54 2011 No.7392501 >>7392473 That alt is awful and there's no real reason why you would take it over babies, especially when babies can eat wisps.

Anonymous Tue May 24 19:17:54 2011 No.7392506

>>7392473
>Reisen also has an alt skill that will -ABSOLUTELY- fuck up Yuyuko, from maximum range at that

Everything you said in your post was insane, but this was particularly insane. Are you from another dimension with a completely different version of Soku? I bet Alice is top tier there.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:22:54 2011 No.7392522 >>7392506 Have you never fought a Reisen that knows how to use Eyesight Cleaning?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:52:54 2011 No.7392585 >>7392522 Actually no, I haven't. Because nobody is that retarded.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:54:54 2011 No.7392596 >>7392506 >>7392522 >>7392585 This calls for no items, Yuyuko v. Reisen, Voile, the Magic Library.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 19:58:54 2011 No.7392614 File: 342 KB, 1000x864, #hisouten would be instantly disqualified.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7392596 Only one place could handle a match of such magnitude.

Anonymous Tue May 24 20:04:54 2011 No.7392634

The only advantage eyesight cleaning has over default laser is that it's air usable. Otherwise, it's much slower, much weaker, cancel is much later, and has less vertical coverage. You know how Yuyuko beats eyesight clearing with bullets? By pressing C or in a real pinch, 214. Any 214. But if you're trying to use long-range attacks against Yuyuko with Reisen, you're fucked to begin with.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 20:33:54 2011 No.7392749 >>7392445 Thank you, but I've already found a copy on /rs/ patched to 1.1 I'm assuming everyone has it patched to 1.2, so I guess I'll do that now.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 20:37:54 2011 No.7392764 >>7392749 1.2?

Anonymous Tue May 24 20:39:54 2011 No.7392774

>>7392634
You're supposed to hold it down and wait for them to attack first, not use it like the laser it replaces, because that would be fucking stupid. It's a defensive counter move (that also can build up significant damage if the opponent's stupid enough), not an offensive one.

Depending on lag, you can catch people as they are trying to attack if they are in sweeping range, by simply letting the button go right when they themselves are shooting something. You need to have the sweep going in anticipation of their attacking though, you're basically stuck there waiting for them.

If you're doing it right they usually have no choice but to graze in and chase you around, it also nibbles HP on block so they can't rely on that either.

Granted, anyone good could easily still whup your ass in melee if you're not good with Reisen's close range; the Eye Cleaning is more of just a "don't even fucking think about range spam" counter. Well, unless you've got two Reisens both doing Eye Cleaning.. which is awkward..

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 20:44:54 2011 No.7392785 >>7392774 >You're supposed to hold it down and wait for them to attack first, Dude, you just went full fucking retard. You know how you counter that? Dash.

Anonymous Tue May 24 20:54:54 2011 No.7392822

>>7392785
Can't fucking dash and shoot at the same time. Do you seriously not get it still? And if they just instinctively close in once you sweep over them, you can have some shit ready to roll when they reach you.

Try playing the AI and use a Reisen with eye cleaning. Observe how you can literally use that one move to clear the game as many times as you want, by tagging them whenever they try shooting. That's a good way to practice the move actually. Since the AI is too stupid to just give up on range and close in, it's hilarious.

And getting people to give up on range is the whole point of this thread, OP had issues with projectiles.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 20:55:54 2011 No.7392828 >>7392822 Graze attacks, motherfucker. Any clue what they are at all?

Anonymous Tue May 24 20:59:54 2011 No.7392844

>>7392828
Forget graze attacks. You can beat eye cleaning by jumping. Or using bullets that approach vertically, like Yuyu's C, j.2C or 214. Eye cleaning is a shitty alt that only maybe has use at very long range, where Reisen should never be fighting to begin with.
And you quoting it as being good because the AI sucks against it proves nothing. The same can be said of most character's Cs, China included.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:08:54 2011 No.7392882 >>7392822 >Try playing the AI and use a Reisen with eye cleaning. You mean the AI that likes to sit at the opposite side of the screen and spam bullets randomly? I've perfected Soku's Lunatic AI with Yuyuko using only 5B over and over. Just stop.

Anonymous Tue May 24 21:09:54 2011 No.7392891

>>7392828

Cleaning laser will catch most of them. It fires continuously for about maybe a third to a half of a second straight on discharge, longer than most grazing frames attacks can even have, except for a few which you shouldn't even be concerned with if you're trying to eye clean them to begin with since you are supposed to be far away for it to work

Go and see.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:12:54 2011 No.7392901 >>7392891 Wow. You don't understand what a graze attack is. I think we're done here.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:12:54 2011 No.7392903 >>7392891 >Go and see. Let's. You wanna go?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:14:54 2011 No.7392911 Uh oh, are people actually going to play soku in the soku thread?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:19:54 2011 No.7392935 >>7392911 I don't think you can call whatever is going to happen to somebody that thinks Eye Cleaning is a good 214 for Reisen to be 'playing'. Euthanasia perhaps.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:23:54 2011 No.7392954 >>7392935 Maybe I'll revert back to regular soku and open the thing up for the first time in months in order to spec this. Soku euthanasia sounds like it would be fun.

Anonymous Tue May 24 21:26:54 2011 No.7392959

>>7392774
But Yuyuko's 5C goes through every other projectile in the game. You can instantly cancel her ranged moves into grazing fanspin too. And I don't see how I would do anything but graze straight at you when you got that eye active. If if you activate it or not, you'd probably get hit by any graze attack there is after it. Use the default 214 one for surprise beam instead. Yuyuko DOES have problems cleaning the screen.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:36:54 2011 No.7392996 File: 5 KB, 39x64, Ik623bc3.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Now I really want to see this Reisen in action. Finding a hidden use for shitty alt skills has always been a reason to play.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:39:54 2011 No.7393009 Come on, Eyesight Cleaning guy. I can even host. I'll even play Yuyuko.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:40:54 2011 No.7393010 >>7392996 Kind of how I feel about all of Sakuya's alts. I know they aren't really all that shitty, but I don't really like them.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:51:54 2011 No.7393050 Is it called soku lobby? or hamachi? or still irc? I've been out of the game for awhile

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 21:52:54 2011 No.7393059 >>7393050 >Is it called Is what called.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 22:00:54 2011 No.7393100 >>7393050 Not everyone uses lobby. Best place to find games is the IRC still. No idea about hamachi. No sane person would prefer that.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 22:26:54 2011 No.7393196 Oh my god, you guys. He was totally right. Just look at this awesome ownage. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2sTsv__DNo It's even shittier than I thought it was. It doesn't even cancel Yuyu's Cs

>>	Anonymous Tue May 24 22:31:54 2011 No.7393211 >>7393196 Oh you.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 02:30:54 2011 No.7394062 File: 1.00 MB, 512x512, ‹Á.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Use Marisa. Her ass has more destructive force than Yuyuko's butterflies.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 12:01:54 2011 No.7395231 File: 65 KB, 640x480, deck.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] How's this one for Iku?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:00:54 2011 No.7395373 File: 132 KB, 1274x878, Aliceflowchart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7392325 Atleast you got a flowchart

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:49:54 2011 No.7395487 >>7392230 >Frame Advantage: -4F/18F What does that even mean? Advantage if blocked high? Low? On hit?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:51:54 2011 No.7395493 >>7395487 The difference between high and low, yes.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:53:54 2011 No.7395497 how you guys play in network? using Hamachi?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:55:54 2011 No.7395502 >>7395497 Usually it's done directly using port forwarding and whatnot. Hamachi isn't recommended since it's laggy.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 13:56:54 2011 No.7395506 >>7395493 Are you telling me that 6A is +18 on wrongblock? 22F difference? That can't be right.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 25 14:29:54 2011 No.7395610 >>7395231 That's really good.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 26 05:47:52 2011 No.7399327 BUMP LOL

>>	Anonymous Thu May 26 06:55:54 2011 No.7399455 >>7395506 That would be 6[A], not 6A. The huge frame advantage comes from the guard crush.

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