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7269318 No.7269318 [Reply] [Original]

So, are there any other known Counter Guardians besides Arc and EMIYA?

>> No.7269343

I don't think Arc is one. Jeanne D'arc is one

>> No.7269351

>>7269343
Arc pretty much gets to be one by default.

Counter guardians protect the earth, and thats kinda her only purpose for existing besides being a future vessel for a very cranky transgender type.

>> No.7269367

So why can't you summon Type Moon as a servant?

>> No.7269380

>>7269367
No one ever tried using a moon rock as a catalyst, also he doesn't really fit the class system.

(arc got a pass as berserker because roa's blood did make her a little bonkers)

>> No.7269389

>>7269367
You can't? So what was that fuckery with Arc being summoned as Berserker in Fate/Extra?

>> No.7269396

>>7269389
I didn't think Fate/Extra was even canon.

>> No.7269397

>>7269389
I'd say Fanservice, also they couldn't think of a good berserker who would make you shit your pants like Herc did.

>> No.7269405

>>7269396
Its not. But people argue things like it and strange/fake have canon elements.

(Gilgamesh did not become a cool guy by wrestling with a loli trap for days)

>> No.7269412

>>7269396

Fate/Extra is canon to its own universe. Like what Tsukihime is to Fate/Stay Night.

>> No.7269421

>>7269412
I thought tsukihime and fate were the same universe different times.

>> No.7269423
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7269423

>>7269405
>(Gilgamesh did not become a cool guy by wrestling with a loli trap for days)

>> No.7269432

>>7269421

I thought they were different universes but alright bad example then. What Mobile Suit Gundam is to Gundam Wing.

That should be more fitting.

>> No.7269458

>>7269432
Pretty sure its:
Notes - Tsukihime - Fate/Stay Night(Zero)

Not sure where KnK should fit in though.

>> No.7269474

>>7269458
knk takes place around the same time as tsukihime as some of the characters are even related to one another.

>> No.7270820

>>7269351
Arcueid isn't a Counter Guardian. CG are Heroic Spirits who made a pact with Alaya. Arcueid is the planet's ultimate guardian against threats from nature and alien threats, while the purpose of CG is just to deal with human made threats, and they are nobody, so she can't really be compared to a CG. Plus, Arc is also in charge to babysit humans (that's another purpose of the True Ancestors. She is kinda like Minerva from FFVII; the Goddess of Earth or the planet given form, not just a mere guardian of the planet.

Also, she and Crimson Moon are the same person, so she is not a transgender.

>>7269396
Fate/Extra was never stated to be non-canon. The F/E universe was exactly the same as the Fate universe until the year 1980. The Moon Cell doesn't follow the same rules as the original Holy Grail, which is why you can summon Arc and Divine Spirits like Buddha, it's not just limited to Heroic Spirits.

>> No.7270862

Arc isn't a Counter Guardian, she's a mimic of an Aristoteles.
What Aristoteles do, we're not really sure. Be completely boss, I guess.

The Counter Force can probably use Arcueid when necessary, though, as an Earth elemental.

>> No.7270895

You know what /jp/?
It really is noticeable that beasts lair is back in existence with all this incorrect shit floating around here

>> No.7270898

>>7270862
ArcheType Earth is an Aristotles, not a mimic of an Aristotles. And what is the purpose of Types? to protect their planets, I mean, why do you think Gaia wanted to create a Type?

>The Counter Force can probably use Arcueid when necessary

Uh? Of course, that's why Gaia created Arcueid, her main purpose is to protect the planet from aliens and natural disasters, as thus she will be summoned by Gaia every time the planet is threatened by alien threats or threats caused by nature. See, is stated in fuyuki, those are the known elements of the Counter Force:

Other elements of the Counter Forces:
Guardians - The Guardians of Alaya, aka, Counter Guardians. Heroes with little reverence or no divinity. Reacts primarily to "correct" disturbances caused by humans.
Beast of Alaya - ? Probably another term for the above.
True Ancestors - A Counter Force of the planet with a form.
Beast of Gaia - Primate Murder, a big dog that has the ultimate priviledge of killings primates. Takes some 7 Guardians to control.

>> No.7270910

>>7270898

>ArcheType Earth is an Aristotles, not a mimic of an Aristotles.

No she isn't/yes she is.
Arcueid isn't Archetype: Earth anyway.
They share the same body and mind, but they're not identical in the same way Emiya Shirou isn't Archer and Tohno Shiki isn't Satsujinki. Something happens between X and Y that makes them different people.

>And what is the purpose of Types? to protect their planets,

We don't know that.

>I mean, why do you think Gaia wanted to create a Type?

We have no idea.

>> No.7270919

>>7270910
>Arcueid isn't Archetype: Earth anyway.
Actually, it's been said that she is. However, for her to regain this form, she has to take back her hair from Altrouge.

>> No.7270924
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7270924

But Arcueid is mai waifu.

>> No.7270927
File: 159 KB, 800x600, altrouge.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7270927

ALTROUGE HIJAK LOL

>> No.7270928

>>7270910
>No she isn't

Yes she is. Nasu only added the Arche to show what Type means, not to show that she is different from other Ultimate Ones.

>Arcueid isn't Archetype: Earth anyway.

Yes she is. ArcheType Earth is only a title anyway. Plus, AE/Crimson Moon Arc or Princess Arc is the true Arcueid, so she is more Arcueid than the current Arcueid. Just like Void Shiki is the true R. Shiki. They are the same person.

At any rate, once Arcueid is summoned by Earth she will be at full power, just like in MBAA.

>We don't know that.

It stands to reason.

>We have no idea.

Yes we do, did you even read the prologue in Plus Period. The planet attempted to immitate the Moon and create a Type, but it couldn't, so Crimson Moon and his children acted as its Type/Counter Force in order to protect it.

>> No.7270935
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7270935

>>7270928

>Plus, AE/Crimson Moon Arc or Princess Arc is the true Arcueid, so she is more Arcueid than the current Arcueid

Okay, now I'm starting to think you're actually Roa.

SHIKI DISAGREES

>> No.7270944

>>7270935
>SHIKI DISAGREES

Uh?

'I am speaking to her. You're Arcueid.'

'---such a foolish human. How many times must I tell you? I am just an aspect of Arcueid Brunestud. The Arcueid you know is a different being.'

'I told you, I know that. But you're an aspect of Arcueid, aren't you? Then it's the same thing. You have long hair, you talk with an accent, and you don't know me, but that's not important at all. If you're a part of Arcueid, then that means you are Arcueid.'

Shiki only said that she is not the Arcueid he knows and likes, althought he still likes her since she is also Arcueid. At any rate, it doesn't change the fact that she is the true Arcueid, since 1. that's her true and original form and 2. that's the default personality that comes with her body, just like Akasha/root/third Shiki.

>> No.7270950
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7270950

>> No.7271043

Since Fate/Extra was mentioned in this thread:
What exactly is the Moon Cell Holy Grail? Does it do anything?

>> No.7271046

>>7271043
Shitty fan fiction that Nasu had to rewrite to make even half way decent.

>> No.7271053

>>7271046

Oh I know Fate/Extra has a horrible plot with horribly stupid servants (nurrr, let's give everyone Reality Marbles, no wait, let's make a SERVANT a Reality Marble!) but I just wanted to know what the Moon Cell Grail was. Since the Heaven's Feel Great Grail is a cup of souls that is also a giant mana-drill designed to reach Akasha.

>> No.7271059

>>7271053
It's some sort of ancient super computer that scans the entire earth and everything on it every couple of seconds.

>> No.7271062

>>7271059

To what end? Why's there a Master/Servant war going on about it?

>> No.7271071

>>7271062
I don't remember.
This should have some of the info though.
http://nrvnqsr.us.to/showthread.php/138-Fate-the-Fact

>> No.7271072
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7271072

All your Arcueids are samefag.
It's pretty easy to understand actually, faggots.

>> No.7271092

>>7271072
You are just mad that nobody talks about your favorite character. Simply because it doesn't provide for an interesting topic in comparison.

>> No.7271095

>>7271071

Wait. If Fate/Extra only splits from F/SN in 1980, does that make this moon recorder canon?

Would that mean this Moon Grail is the property of the Crimson Moon?

>> No.7271103

>>7269474
KnK occured from 95'-99'
Tsukihime began in 00', not counting the time dealing with Kouma and the Nanaya clan, first meeting with Aoko, etc.
I'm pretty sure that's how Touko managed to create mystic eye killer in time for Shiki to be able to use it in Tsukihime. You could reason out that Touko met with Aoko sometime in 99' by that when she left town in murder speculation part two.

>> No.7271105

>>7271095
I believe Nasu said it was more or less the same as the main universe until 1980.
Otherwise, the existence of the Moon Cell would fuck up with Melty Blood's storyline or something.
Anyway, the Moon Cell is supposed to be older than our solar system, so no it wouldn't.

>> No.7271114

>>7271095
No, more like, Crimson Moon was created by the Moon Cell. The Moon Cell is omnipotent and has more power than the Holy Grail.

>>7271105
1980 is just when the universes of FSN and Extra split off from one another. It is exactly the same as the Fate universe until the year 1980.

>> No.7271118

>>7271105
More or less the same event wise that is, but still completely different.
If that makes sense.

>> No.7271120

>>7271103
KnK and Tsukihime are two different universes. Specially considering what Ryougi said to Arcueid in MBAA.

>> No.7271126

>>7271118

This makes the most sense.

>> No.7271140

>>7271118
>>7271126
No, that won't work, specially since the Moon Cell was directly referenced in MBAA. The Moon Cell is canon to the main nasuverse.

>> No.7271141

>>7271120
MB goes against a lot of shit in Tsukihime though. kinda iffy myself to consider MB.

>> No.7271147

>>7271140
Moon Cell is just what Ciel calls DoO's magic, nothing else.
If the Moon Cell existed, it would make what DoO and Wallachia were trying to do absolutely pointless.

>> No.7271148

>>7271140

Waitwhat

>>7271114

What exactly does the moon grail do? Why is it running a Holy Grail War? Does the winner REALLY get a wish this time?

>> No.7271158

>>7271148
At one point Ciel calls DoO's magic "Moon Cell" or something in AA.
>>7271147
And by this I mean if the Moon Cell exists in the capacity that it does in F/E.

>> No.7271182

>>7271141
>MB goes against a lot of shit in Tsukihime though

No it doesn't. If it does, then please name some. Aside from all the lol powerlevel thing, since Hisui can beat Nrvnqsr and all that, but we already know that MB powerlevels aren't canon according to Nasu.

>>7271147
Why would it? Why should Dust of Osiris know about the Moon Cell? not to mention that the Moon Cell is from the moon, just like the name says. If an alien from another galaxy comes it will not stop by the moon to search for earthly stuff. Plus, Arcueid also stated in her dialogue against Osiris that what she was planning to do was pointless because it had already been done.

>>
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