/jp/ - Otaku Culture

[Anonymous No.]

I'm playing through Heaven's Feel and I'm pretty sure that Mato Sakura is the most offensive character in fiction.

She has an extremely passive personality riddled with shyness and sexual confusion as a results of years of physical and sexual abuse. The way she is portrayed makes her seem like a "Japanese dream woman" and tries to make her character more cute than tragic. Was anybody else bothered by this? I felt like Nasu is trying to play into some sort of dark otaku fantasy of having a young, sexually confused, damaged goods girlfriend to exploi- I mean, take care of.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889848
tl;dr: Sakura's "cute" traits are a result of horrific abuse, Nasu knows this and so do you, shit's fucked up

[Anonymous No.]

>The way she is portrayed makes her seem like a "Japanese dream woman"
She just rties to escape her horriuble, horrible life by playing the Yamato Nadeshiko with Shiro.

[Anonymous No.]

You're thinking about this too much. All the heroines have to be wish fulfillment of some sort, no exceptions.

Sakura is just a really nice person. She remains cheerful even though she was abused

[Anonymous No.]

I like her as a character in the story and as a villain but she is a terrible heroine. Thank god that route had plot, that was the only thing going for it.

[Anonymous No.]

If I had the choice of abused ladies I'd pick Caster over Sakura every time

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889861
>wish fulfillment

That's exactly what it is, and I think it's fucked up. I imagine that they're playing into some kind of wish to have a girl with serious emotional issues crawling all over you just because you're the only person who's nice to her.

What I think is really offensive is how they try to make her qualities that result from abuse (shyness, insecurity, passiveness) seem "cute" when they're actually psychological issues resulting from a shitload of abuse.

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6889848
I'll be honest, she's not that bad
Nasu just did a really hamhanded job of trying to make her sympathetic
but don't quote me on that

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889918
>Nasu just did a really hamhanded job of trying to make her sympathetic

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6889917
some people just like characters that need to be protected
it's an archetype
see Sakura, Kohaku etc

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6889921
oh you

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889923
Sakura and Kohaku were pitiable and understandable.
Aeka is a whoreslut just made for whiteknightfagottry.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889923
Why didn't she let Kouhei have sex with her without a condom if she just planned on killing herself after anyway?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889960
The herp, who knows where Kouhei has been.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889967
Huh? you're implying he may have STDs? Why would she care either way?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889917
I think that's what makes her an interesting character, though. Like what >>6889856 said, she only acts out the role of the Yamato Nadeshiko as a sort of fantasy. She hates her life and finds escape by playing as the traditional Japanese housewife. I don't really see what you find so offensive about her character.

[Anonymous No.]

I didn't like Sakura until Heaven's Feel. The opposite of most people really.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889977
She is boring even when she is evil, that's why I don't like her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890160
You're boring

[Fujiwara no Mokou !!WMmFy7x/tgp No.]

>>6890155
Same here. She was a really nice girl, and seemingly like the new Satsuki, but my gripe with her was that she was "just a muggle", which HF fixed.

[Anonymous No.]

Worst character, worst route. If you like her I'm sorry.

[Anonymous No.]

HF has best scenes, with the least ridiculous writing.
HF is really about Shirou continuing the fight between Kiritsugu and Kotomine.

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6890331
really?

[Anonymous No.]

>> I felt like Nasu is trying to play into some sort of dark otaku fantasy of having a young, sexually confused, damaged goods girlfriend to exploi- I mean, take care of.

He was, no one in Japan likes her though, so mission failed

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890341
That's the real reason everyone hates Sakura. She's not a virgin.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890344
Sakura is a virgin at heart since she never enjoyed the sex.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890349
Of course she didn't.

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6890344
but plenty of people like Kohaku so that logic doesn't work at all

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889848

What the fuck are you talking about?

She acts the part of "Japanese dream woman" to hide her true abuse, and to be with Shirou. The game makes it quite clear that her past is *not* a good thing, and Shirou most definitely does not "exploit" Sakura in any way.

>>6890155

Yeah, me too.

>>6890358

Whether or not she "enjoyed" it (which is debateable since Shinji made no effort to make her do so, and indeed from the way the game describes it it seems like she just "zoned out" every time he did it), she still did not *want* it.

[Anonymous No.]

I found it offensive how shitty she was.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890928
You were just upset your perfect waifu was a worm fucking slut.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890973
Except I disliked Sakura from the very beginning of Fate when she was introduced.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6889861
Nicely put. To an extent every one of Nasu's characters are a myriad of fetishes rolled together to suit a market, this pertains to all the other females, like this guy says, with no exceptions.

What people miss apart from the upfront housewifey elements are things in shown in Fate and UBW. She is also resolutely stubborn if she finds something to believe in, but concerning her homelife

As to her situation being too much, it's pretty much an excuse people make up. This universe has some of the worst shit happen to people all the time. Vampirism, Inversion Impulse, absorbed by abominations. These things are the norm. Nasu just basically wrote a story that is an example of fucked up shit happening to a little girl and how she persevered. Because it isn't to the degree that people wanted seems ridiculous.

"I can't believe that such things could happen to one girl." Well, they did. Nasuverse history has shown people are capable of doing this and much worse.

Instead of saying that Nasu hammered you with these things, I say the fact that she still stands on two legs is worthy of praise, in a world that quite frankly on a daily basis chews people up and spits them out. Nasu doesn't make you feel for her anymore than the other characters, he's just telling a story. I'm certain he might have been mildly surprised at the reactions he got, but who isn't intrigued at the reactions people have to their work?

[White Ren !YLuFFdRcFQ No.]

Superiorest damaged goods, reporting.

HIMAWARI WILL GROW LARGER.

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6891055
superior or not you still got made into a joke character

[White Ren !YLuFFdRcFQ No.]

>>6891065
No, White Ren got made into a joke character.

Kohaku spans multiple dimensions, now. She can be comical, and then completely ruin your day by reminding you how shitty her life was, all with a smile.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891065
Sakura was always a joke character.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890342
>He was, no one in Japan likes her though, so mission failed

No. I think mission accomplished, because the Japanese fanboys seem to realize that she's not meant to liked at all but rather invoke thinking and analyzing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891055
I liked her, but eh. Her development as a character wasn't all that interesting in her route. She was far better in Hisui's.

She mellowed out because of a little sex, meh.

[Nitori's Faceless !FRIENDgj1s No.]

>>6891075
I'll let you have that one for reminding me of these
http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/360458
http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/468540
(only linking because not hard translated)

[Anonymous No.]

>>6890994
>"I can't believe that such things could happen to one girl."
It's actually sad to believe there are sheltered people who think there aren't girls with just as shitty pasts in life, even if they don't include magic eating worms.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891065

Sadly yes.
Honestly abuse victims or mentally disturbed characters usually end up that way, because they are more "likable" that way, because people fail to understand mental disorders. That and people use these things too often in jokes about these types of characters that get old all too quickly. Things like Kohaku's crazy mad scientist persona and Dark Sakura's jealousy and envy.

Not just the creators, but the fans cement their viewpoints on this facets, and they don't grow further like the other characters. It's kind of a waste of character potential, because they could be so much more, and even the games their in show more behind the mask then people would like to admit.

>>6891106

Ain't that the truth. And because they can't perceive it, it becomes a thing of comedy (sometimes, some people genuinely find dark humor in it) because it is "something unimaginable and exaggerated"

The Nasuverse has shit that is that bad, bad things happen to everyone, all the time. Heretics and perverts like Kotomine, Zouken and the Einzberns are probably more frequent than legitimate magi like Rin would like to admit.

It's a fucked up world, with no afterlife (at least not for regular people, though this might be a comfort for some, lol) and shit happens.

[Anonymous No.]

This is the reason why I like Rin more; she seems less a caricature and more a person.
Rin has pretty complex family, social, and personal issues at hand and tries to cope with her strong personality. Sakura was sort of presented as

>Here's this abused girl that went through hell and wants to be the perfect waifu because Shirou is awesome, now have sex and cooking

It just felt, weird...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891246
>complex family
None.

>social
Almost none. Distant A-grade student.

>and personal issues
Errr

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891071

Erm, no, that's complete bullshit. Nasu has made no statement to that effect, and there is nothing whatsoever in her story that is designed to make her unlikeable. Further, Nasu himself seems to actually like her (at least to some extent), and certainly seems to favour the Shirou x Sakura pairing.

>>6891246

Rubbish. Sakura is every bit as much of a "person" as Rin is, and given the situation she's in her character is entirely realistic. She acts like she does because she's *broken*, as someone would be after that sort of abuse.

>>6891301

What, apart from Sakura, and her father's insistence that they not communicate despite clearly caring for each other?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6892461
>her character is entirely realistic. She acts like she does because she's *broken*
Funny how double standards work, Shirou is like that but he gets is "he tries to fight when he has a knight servant lol he's dumb XD"

[Anonymous No.]

>>6891301
>>complex family
>None.
yeah, being separated by her sister, her father being killed and her mother going fucking nuts when she was just a child counts as totally normal, I agree
>>social
>Almost none.
Except for the fact that she can't get too intimate with anyone because she's a magus and has to project a constant facade.
>>and personal issues
>Errr
she's just a student and has to live by herself and keep up with both studies and her magus family tradition, which the narrative clearly explains to you is hard as balls.

You may not like Rin as a character, perfectly understandable, but saying she doesn't have issues is just missing what's under your nose.

[Anonymous No.]

You need to throw away all your preconceptions and ethics when you read fiction, otherwise you just end up getting offended at nearly everything. I know I did. Realize that although the EVENTS that occur might parallel reality in some instances, the way they are explained and perceived should never be taken seriously or literally.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6892528
The point here is that Rin isn't any more "real" because people generalize another character. If we did that, then Rin really is just her facade with the cliche "heart of gold" underneath, but as we go through the story, we find out there is more to it than that. It's the reasoning for these so-called personality quirks, not the quirks themselves that are so interesting.

>>6892529
Except that is the reason that people are intrigued and enjoy fiction, because they project their feelings onto it. You can't completely detach yourself and still say you enjoy fiction. To an extent you immerse a part of yourself when you digest it.