/jp/ - Otaku Culture

[Anonymous No.]

So, I haven't been around /jp/ and I've just stumbled upon several spoilers for EP7. I haven't played it myself. So, I'm not sure whether the info I have is correct or not.

Basically:
>Taiwan Theory confirmed
>Beatrice's human counterpart is a person nicknamed Yasu.
>>Yasu is the baby Natsuhi dropped 19 years ago. This person is the offspring of Kinzo and the Beatrice Rosa met. The Beatrice Rosa met is also Kinzo's daughter. The original Beatrice was Italian and her name was Beatrice Castiglioni.
>>Yasu's given name is unknown, but the name Kinzo planned to give him/her is Lion/Leon/Lyon.
>Yasu is a very deranged person, and creates many imaginary friends.
>>Amongst these imaginary friends we can count: Gaap, Shannon, Ronove, Virgilia and Kanon.
>>At some point Yasu imagined himself/herself as a witch, and started living as Shannon.
>Shannon was a fan of mystery books. Battler shared this hobby and they became friends. Eventually, they fell in love and Battler promised Shannon to come back to take her out of the island. However, do to the issues with his immediate family, he never returned to Rokkenjima - i.e. until 1986.
>>Shannon waited for him for years, but it was in vain. At some point Battler sent some letters to everyone, but there was none for Shannon. She lost hope at that point.
>>Shannon, or more accurately, Yasu decided to move and created role to play, this would be Kanon. Additionally, this is when Yasu took the form of Beatrice - i.e. Battler's ideal woman.
>Eventually, Yasu also fell in love with George and Jessica, and played a role for each one of them. Shannon for George and Kanon for Jessica.
>Yasu (as Beatrice) challenged the Epitaph and solved it. Then Genji took him/her to Kinzo, and (s)he learned the truth about himself/herself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024297
>Time passed, and Yasu's feelings for George and Jessica grew. Since Yasu couldn't decide who (s)he liked the most, (s)he came up with this game. If they solve the Epitaph the can take the gold and be happy, and if they don't they blow up.
>Yasu seemed to be as fucked up as Maria, and believes that a place like the Golden Land where everyone can be happy after death actually exists.
>Yasu's appearance seems to be androgynous. That, and it seems (s)he has a serious injury in his/her body, which according to himself/herself, makes him/her unable to love, and this is how the furniture complex was born.
>In the real version of the events in Rokkenjima, the Epitaph was solved by the adults. Yasu didn't carry out any murders, but the adults start murdering each other anyway. Kyrie and Rudolph were the main killers.
>Eva was able to kill them both. She survived.

Is all of this correct. Am I missing anything?
Hopefully, I'm wrong, because this sounds like the biggest pile of crap I've ever read.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024297
>>6024298
I forgot to add that his/her sex seems to be dubious too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>Shannon waited for him for years, but it was in vain. At some point Battler sent some letters to everyone, but there was none for Shannon. She lost hope at that point.
Yasu/Beatrice takes away Shannon's love into herself. The love is still there, it only changes which "persona" feels it.
>>Shannon, or more accurately, Yasu decided to move and created role to play, this would be Kanon. Additionally, this is when Yasu took the form of Beatrice - i.e. Battler's ideal woman.
We never see Kanon being "created". Yasu and Shannon discuss the personality of the new little brother, and then when Shannon wakes she's told by a real stake a new servant has arrived. It's not clear how Kanon works inside this thing. It could be he's just a delusion and just gaining the requisites to "love" means he actually starts taking control of the body like Shannon and Yasu.
She was also Beatrice even before (Minttrice), she just changed her appearance to Suittrice.
>Eventually, Yasu also fell in love with George and Jessica, and played a role for each one of them. Shannon for George and Kanon for Jessica.
Never confirmed. All we see about romance in ep7 happens in the family conference. We're never shown anything before that.
>Time passed, and Yasu's feelings for George and Jessica grew. Since Yasu couldn't decide who (s)he liked the most, (s)he came up with this game. If they solve the Epitaph the can take the gold and be happy, and if they don't they blow up.
>Yasu seemed to be as fucked up as Maria, and believes that a place like the Golden Land where everyone can be happy after death actually exists.
>Yasu's appearance seems to be androgynous. That, and it seems (s)he has a serious injury in his/her body, which according to himself/herself, makes him/her unable to love, and this is how the furniture complex was born.
this is all just speculation and never confirmed besides the injury thing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024298
>>6024297
It's correct.
Though it seems Yasu actually doesn't really believe in the golden land crap, she just plays a role.
She came up with the game to have fate decide for her destiny or something.

[Anonymous No.]

It's not clear whether it's a DID where she doesn't realize the actions of her other personalities, or she's perfectly aware of that and just acts so. We have hints for both.

Yasu became Beatrice and former imaginary friend Shannon inherited the body. Beatrice visited her in her dreams. Also Beatrice was the night ruler of Rokkenjima and played pranks. It's Shannon who fell in love with Battler. When she lost hope, she indeed transfered her love to Beatrice to wait for him. If he ever returns, she should return it. She created 'younger brother' to soothe the pain of Shannon and recreate her world (2 people needed).


Also why the fuck can't you read it at least with the Translation Aggregator? You already spoiled yourself, it's not like there's any fun to ruin and there are many small details which people forget/don't care when writing spoiler and summaries.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024324
The flashback and R07 confirms that the romances are real and they are a big part of Beatrice heart.
Even Claire states that what was shown that happened during the 2 years, the romances, were extremely important to understand her motive.

You need a red text confirmation of everything or something? Nothing will ever be confirmed for you then.

[Anonymous No.]

shkanontrice deniers like using yasu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024334
I know they are real, I was just saying we don't know how it works, considering people are still split between DID and anti-DID factions.
There's also no proof she did it just because she was "undecided". There's that speculation about personalities growing stronger and killing the others once they fulfill their love, but again, nothing is said clearly.
I just thought it prudent to warn OP before he starts thinking that's the truth and doesn't form an opinion for himself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024352
Well it's either this or that.
Either it was a battle royal between personality or she was just undecided and decided to create a situation where everything could happen to force fate to decide for her.

Reading what Claire said, there is pretty much no other choices

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024324
>>6024327
I see, I had read several pieces of info saying (s)he believed in the Golden Land, and that's why she had no problem with blowing the place up - much like how Maria doesn't seem to care if people are dying around her, because she believes all of them will go to the Golden Land and be happy.

>>6024333
Yeah, I had read that DID wasn't confirmed, and that it was quite likely Yasu was basically play-acting.

As for why I didn't use Translation Agreggator... I did that for EP6, and luckily I was able to understand half of the episode, yet I think I didn't get any of the important details. So, I think it's a waste of time - at least for me.

I was still able to enjoy EP6 a lot when I read it. So, I have no problems with reading spoilers.

[Anonymous No.]

There's also Battler's family being the best family in case you missed that

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024352
>>6024361
To be honest, I'm still not clear on how this battle royale of furniture works. I mean, we saw it in EP6, but at that point, I hadn't connected it with the epitaph murders and the whole thing. To be honest, I still cannot. No matter how I may try to reason it, it makes no sense.

The whole deal about leaving things up to fate has the same effect on me. I mean, no matter how I may try to see it, I just cannot make any sense out of it.

The whole deal about "without love it cannot be seen" just feels like complete rubbish, since this whole deal ends up in a massacre.

I also don't see why Battler would have the reaction he had in EP5 when he reached the truth, if this is what things were like. I mean, none of these motives/reasons justify the murder of his family.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024401
Something really doesn't add up. Both Battler and Will acted like Beatrice was a tragic victim and were made out to be heroes because they wanted to defend her. I don't really think Ryukishi is that out of touch when he's basically telling us how we're supposed to be responding to her character.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024401
There is absolutely nothing that can justify the muder of 15 people, especially not what a 19 years old who neither need money nor revenge can think of.

[Anonymous No.]

So Eva killed Battler in EP3 because of Kyrie & Rudolf?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024407
>>6024401
Battler and Will responded to the meta characters though.
Will defended Leon who is an innocent in this whole thing.
Battler defended meta-Beatrice who acted like a scapegoat to hide the truth that the real murderers are Rudolf and Kyrie.

[Anonymous No.]

On completely unrelated note,Is there anyone who can post link to EP7 torrent?

I had to do hard format and everything fucked up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024419
it's in nyaa

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024416
Featherine and Ange in EP6 indicate that Battler's reaction is something we should use as a clue to the nature of Beatrice and whatever her motives were on the board. Meanwhile, Will went on about how Beatrice never had anything but tragic ends and always died in despair, and that's why he would save her. They were responding to whatever they found out about the truth of her piece.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024401
That is why I said to OP to not take the spoilers as granted and form his own opinion.
People here are quick to say "it makes sense to me, so it's what actually happens and you're a retard if you think otherwise!"

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024431
It's just R07's crappy logic.
Yasu didn't even had a hard life, overacting much?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024426
I know but it has 2.7 GB.

If I recall correctly Umineko games were bigger....right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024415
It was Auau's interpretation of events, because Eva is the only known survivor. We don't know what happened to Battler in reality, since Bern didn't show us it in her "truth" (suppose it's the truth), though it would be perfect way to troll Ange further.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024407
I think the same, but from what I've read, EP7 leaves no room for any other possible motive.

>>6024408
I know, which is why I'm complaining, because R07 had presented Beatrice as some sort of tragic heroine, yet her motives are extremely selfish, not to say completely unreasonable.

>>6024416
Meta-Beatrice is also the representation of the real person, though. I think this has been made clear throughout all these games. At least, this is how things seem to me.

It's really sad because I was seriously expecting Umienko to have a decent ending, at the very least. However, we have a non-nonsensical villain, which will most likely be redeemed because of love...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024436
Yeah, I don't buy that. There's something more there. Otherwise, this portrayal is hilariously schizophrenic and would have to be deliberately incompetent writing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024447
Except Claire's said that everything had been said, either in episode 7 of in episode 1-6 for the blank of 2 years.
There is nothing more.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024443
>from what I've read
Quite a few Japanese fans aren't really sure what's going on, either, and they actually aren't working from spotty spoiler summaries. Yes, Clair and Will say that we should be able to work it out from episodes 1-6, but that doesn't mean the easy leap to selfish indecisive bitch must be right, especially, again, with the huge deal made out of the responses by the people who work out the truth.

[Anonymous No.]

We still don't know anything about the two years prior to the conference, where Yasu gets told about her origins, and she starts making plans as indicated by the credit card and explosive tests.
Sure, it's not that "tragic", but I don't think finding out you're the child of an incestuous rape is really that healthy to your already deranged psyche, but maybe that's just me.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024454
From what Claire's said, it should be obvious.
And her whole "leave it to fate" and the theme of the roulette that is so prevalent.
Then you have stuff like "didn't do it for greed or revenge".

There is no other alternative I can see, I bet you can't either.
If you don't want to believe this so much why don't you replay episode 1-6 and try to work an alternate theory? I doubt you'll find anything though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024454
>Yes, Clair and Will say that we should be able to work it out from episodes 1-6

Just like how we were supposed to be able to know personalities/imaginary friends can die by EP4, right?

I'm calling bullshit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024443
But even if we accept anything as it is it, though end of ???? implies that there's more to it, it's not that bad.
She didn't kill anyone in reality. So her tale is really sad and pathetic if you think about it. It's like that pic of cripple real-life Sanae imagining her being a powerful miko in a dream world.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024463
The "leave it to fate" thing is part of what bothers me. Clair talks like she's resigning herself to total passivity. Total passivity and resignation is really not what comes to mind when I think of someone who actively made all of the plans that Beatrice apparently did, and her presentation of the roulette/epitaph is a complete non-sequitor if the core of it is her troubled, indecisive love life.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024469
So I should feel sad for her because she failed to kill anyone?
It's pathetic, yeah, not sad though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024469
The thing is, whether she killed anyone or not, she still planned to murder about 15 people. I don't see how that'd make her a tragic heroine.

Hell, even Takano had a really trafic life and she was portrayed as a massive bitch.

[Anonymous No.]

i still say shkanontrice is proven, why people hate her so much? i like shanontrice and battler NRT fat fat fat.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024483
Shannontrice has been proven, Shkanon not so much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024483
Too bad they are all dead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024489
Denial much.
ShKanon is so fucking proved it hurts, there is nothing to argue anymore.

[Anonymous No.]

BEST
MOTIVE
EVER

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024536
Uh, oh. You have JUSTICE for random unrelated people as the motive for the serial murder in classics.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024556
It's better than "I'm a whore who can't decide between 3 people so let's happily kill everyone".

And at least the authors of these mysteries don't whiteknight these murderers so fucking much, unlike R07.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024297

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024568
There's also that part about mystery and understanding, but you wouldn't know, since you didn't read it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024597
Wow, this summary is pretty terribly off on a lot of things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024597
Whoever wrote this is retarded or can't read shit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024597
>Shannon represents his angel
>Kanon represents his evil side
>people still believe in this bullshit
>ahahah.wav

[Anonymous No.]

Wow. I left off at EP5 and just when I thought things couldn't get more twisted and messed up.

What's this about a Taiwan theory? The gold's in Taiwan? How'd people work that out?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024797
The beloved hometown of the epitaph is Taiwan. The hints were supposed to lead you to an occupation-era train (the river) station name (Qilian). A kanji pun would give you the initial key: the Land of Gold instead of Golden Land = Land could be read as Quadrillion of Gold.
Quadrillion - Qilian = rest of the letter get ordered as "Lord U" according to twilights.
On the chapel's door there were the letters "Quadrillion" which George partly read in another episode, you just had to push them in that order, and the secret room (ex-military base from Kinzo's time) would open with the gold, Yasu and the bomb inside.

Basically, English speakers stood no chance.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024822
>gold, Yasu and the bomb inside.

Yasu was inside the secret base? I thought he/she was supposed to be running around, pretending to be various people (Shannon included?), murdering the shit out of everyone except Battler...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024841
she probably does, but when the adults solve it, they find her there.

[Anonymous No.]

Sadly, I must say that after ep7, I find George almost pitiable and sympathetic. Damn, because of ONE episode. Damn you, Ryukishi.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025096
And I'd say I changed my opinion of him to the worse in the last two episodes. His cold-blooded premeditation, envy and manipulativity would've probably rivaled Kyrie's in the future. Good thing he's dead.
And he may be one of the causes of this event, if he really hid the letter for Shannon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025162
Well yeah, I suppose both interpretations are fine. If he did the letter thing, he's an asshole. Just like ep4 and ep6 were showing. But if he is innocent... ugh... this scene with Rudolf...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024298

Stakes and magical circles don't exist in the real incident.

Gee Ryukishi how were we supposed to figure that out?

Fair Play mystery my ass.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025206
Maybe using the knowledge that all episodes are fictions?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025224
Which we were told only in episode 5 or 6?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025233
More like hinted in episode 1 epilogue and openly told so in ep4.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025224

That's awfully general. All that theory led me after right EP5 is that Beatrice wrote the episodes and Battler is literally her audience and the audience surrogate. EP5 really laid it on thick on that angle. That's only partially true though, I still don't get how we were supposed to figure out Tohya's existence.

There should be at least a single scene specifically pointing out the stakings not happening. Them being paperweights won't count since a driver could still pound them in.

I'm really questioning the validity of this being a fair game.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025245
It wasn't. The trick was making you think it was, but it actually wasn't. Why do you think R07 put in so many "my readers are bawwing" jabs in 5-6? He tried to make it a TWEEST but instead just made fun of his readers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025255

I guess that's what makes him an asshole.

Man what a waste.

I think I'll just spend my time trying to figure out what the hell happened after Erika's summation in EP5.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025224
It still doesn't change anything, you know?
So yeah.

>>I'm really questioning the validity of this being a fair game.

If ep7 is the truth, according to me it is not but who cares, you don't even need to question yourself.
A fair mystery is not something solvable me making X000 crazy theories using one random word in the script when everything aside could work as well. It is just luck here.

>>Knox's 6th
>>It is forbidden for accident or intuition to be employed as a detective technique.

Exactly the case here. Red herrings everywhere. Red herrings which works perfectly because the author want them to work perfectly.
So the only way to find the truth is to make X000 theories with everything on the screen, fantasy or not, and waiting for one of them to be proved by chance. After all, with this fiction bullshit, there is not way to know what part is real and what part is not. And if Kyrie wanted to have fun with stakes in the real rokkenjima, is it impossible?

Fair mystery, he?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025224
It still doesn't change anything, you know?
So yeah.

>>I'm really questioning the validity of this being a fair game.

If ep7 is the truth, according to me it is not but who cares, you don't even need to question yourself.
A fair mystery is not something solvable by making X000 crazy theories using one random word in the script when everything aside could work as well. It is just luck here.

>>Knox's 6th
>>It is forbidden for accident or intuition to be employed as a detective technique.

Exactly the case here. Red herrings everywhere. Red herrings which works perfectly because the author want them to work perfectly.
So the only way to find the truth is to make X000 theories with everything on the screen, fantasy or not, and waiting for one of them to be proved by chance. After all, with this fiction bullshit, there is not way to know what part is real and what part is not. And if Kyrie wanted to have fun with stakes in the real rokkenjima, is it impossible?

Fair mystery, he?

[Anonymous No.]

This is why I hate people who just read spoilers and then think 'oh, then I know EP7'

Go read the fucking EP.

Get ATLAS and AGTH and start reading.

Spoilers don't really do the EP justice. Small details which are constantly missed in them are skipped over and make the EP all the more sweeter.

For instance, Shannon just 'didn't get a letter and cried.' No, she waited for 2 years and convinced herself that it was a trial. A trial of love to endure. And suddenly, when everyone seemed to have forgetten Battler, he starts writing everyone. And like an excited school girl, her hearts starts racing about getting a letter from him. Kyrie takes out the envelope, George opens it and passes the letters around to their respected owners. And what does Shannon get from George? THE FUCKING EMPTY ENVELOPE!

tl:dr readin EP7 faggot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025245
>how we were supposed to figure out Tohya's existence
Why would you need that? Maybe you tried to figure out Cornelia's existence too? Instead of Tohya it could be just different, random forgers, making their own stories, that was said in ep4.

The clue is that the reality is different from fiction, and people aren't so stupid in it. And why a different, real killer would use the occult murders? Therefore, they happened in different way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025285
This this this. It is well established that EP7 is full of shit that sounds stupid in summary form. But it's a really good, well-written ep that sells that stupid-sounding shit impressively. This is from someone who was dead convinced before reading it that either Shkanontrice or fiction, let alone both, would ruin Umineko forever.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025279
Well, Will wasn't able to defeat Bern's "truth" with his 20 wedges and he even used red for the 1st.
He cites his rule and says that there are no clues that Kyire and Rudolf are murderers. Bern says that all clues were destroyed in the explosion. Will says, that "it's impossible to claim something as truth then". Bern laughs her ass off at how he, mystery man, tries to hide the truth in a catbox. Promises to kill him. Kills. Therefore, there are enough clues for that reasoning, as much as I hate to admit that tea party makes sense.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025285
>>Small details which are constantly missed in them are skipped over and make the EP all the more sweeter.

... By the word "sweeter", I think that you don't understand the fact that most people are criticizing because of the "mystery" part. The story being well presented or not doesn't change anything here.
Well, details count in every case. But the "sweeter" sound too much " yeah, the solution is stupid but it is touching so it's okay like this" for me.

By the way yeah, I agree, people should read the ep before talking, especially about the mystery side... But /jp/ should also not forget that some of these people have already read this ep and that everybody here is not illiterate.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025304
Will ;_;

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025285
I'd recommend Translation Aggregator for multiple translators, because ATLAS fucks the shit up pretty badly sometimes. And the most important part is the brain to combine them together and extract the sense.

>>6025302
I agree, I feel almost convinced by him, though I used to think the same.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025285
>And what does Shannon get from George? THE FUCKING EMPTY ENVELOPE!
Don't forget the look on his face as he gives it to her.

The part that got me, and what gets me annoyed when people call Yasu an indecisive slut, is when Shannon and Beatrice are talking and she admits that it was dumb of her to act like this, and it's not Battler's fault.

They should also read the tea party and the scene between George and Shannon before convincing themselves from spoilers that they know everything that's going on in Yasu's head.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025347
She is an indecisive slut because she decides to put people in danger just because she can't make a choice.
And don't try to make it sound sweet, that's just how it is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025293
>>6025293

Well, that's what I meant. The existence of another set of forgeries made by someone other than "Maria". It just came as a complete surprise, and that's not just supposed to happen in mysteries. Surprises need to accompanied by "Shit, that was foreshadowed all along. I should have got it". Problem is, I really don't remember anything concrete pointing to another bottle forger's existence. I don't ask for much, Ryukishi just needs to show at least one scene or line for it to be foreshadowed.

>The clue is that the reality is different from fiction, and people aren't so stupid in it. And why a different, real killer would use the occult murders? Therefore, they happened in different way.

Problem is, the stakings have been a constant since EP 1. They've been both a cornerstone and stumbling block for several theories. It was one of the things we were sure of. And ritualistic devices in murders are not outside the realm of possibility in real life, much less in murder mysteries. Saying to yourself, this is not plausible, therefore it does not exist is quite useless in this genre where icicle shooters, complicated traps designed to fool people into a suicide verdict, paper mache disguises, miracle murders, and locked rooms comfortably become classics. Mystery is in itself a kind of fantasy, it conforms to rules, and presents itself as a puzzle.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025354
Seems like she made a choice to me, bro. Too bad you didn't read it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025365
She only made the choice of leaving fate decide by creating a situation where everything could happen.
Work your reading comprehension.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025359

Umineko is false representation pure and simple if it ends up that we were supposed to abide by the standards of real life.

The reasoning you state sounds like something created after the fact. It has no basis in the text as far as I remember other than what we now know.

Dine's 15th. The most important rule we know.

>15. The truth of the problem must at all times be apparent — provided the reader is shrewd enough to see it. By this I mean that if the reader, after learning the explanation for the crime, should reread the book, he would see that the solution had, in a sense, been staring him in the face-that all the clues really pointed to the culprit — and that, if he had been as clever as the detective, he could have solved the mystery himself without going on to the final chapter. That the clever reader does often thus solve the problem goes without saying.

>>6025304

This interesting. It implies that the clues don't lie in physical evidence but in testimony and stories by the victims and culprits, and we've been getting that, filtered as it may be, from the very beginning. I guess there are clues to everything, but I still feel kinda cheated in the meantime, until I/someone else finds them.

This doesn't even make me angry Ryukishi, just real disappointed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025372
Work on your reading to begin with.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025354
except that would make her incredibly selfish, and Battler said there aren't bad guys. I think Ryukishi can honestly think killing because of indecision can not be seen as an extremely morally bad choice.

tl;dr wait for ep8, confusing readers before the finale is Creative Writing 101

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025302
>>6025347
>>6025321
Agreed.

>>6025309
Well, yes, this is a pretty crazy way for everything to trick down two two days of murderers. But look at it this way. We already should have known that with

-'I wouldn't put it past Kinzo' catchphrase.
-Erika and Bern twisting any and all truths in EP5 just to get a 'fun' win out of it.
-This dysfunctional set of people on this island known as a family. (I swear, the most normal ones, besides Shkanon, is the servants.)

So yes. With crazy circumstances, I wouldn't expect a normal mystery. But was it fair? I'm not too sure. I just know it was a bit over the top for many people to completely figure out.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025379
Episode 7 said that everything about the motive have been told, what the fuck do you want more?

R07 won't spell it in episode 8.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025372
Not the scene I was talking about. I think you need to work on yours.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025304
>>Well, Will wasn't able to defeat Bern's "truth" with his 20 wedges and he even used red for the 1st.

Who cares about the red?

Seriously, it is like knox. Dlanor uses knox in red, but she is not sure that the game, mystery or not, follow theses rules.
His red only mean "this is the first rule of van dine". But if theses rules are not supposed to work in this story, well...

And the problem is that almost everything in this fight is skipped and then the credits comes, and we come back to Lion, running. Quite useful when you don't want to show something or the answer that Bern had. If it was only a "lol no reality no dine" it would not be a problem to show it. She was already saying it earlier.

Also, sorry, but no, I don't trust everything bern say.
I will not say that the complete game is useless, but this ep is already a complete mess by itself, so a twist would not be surprising.
Moreover, here, they are talking about Lion's world, which should not exist to begin with, when we are talking about the truth, and is a "fiction".
They are not talking about "our" Rokkenjima anymore.
Especially if she "is not the game master" and have doesn't influence the reality.

And then I will not even start talking about the meta-meta, because here you can think almost everything you want...

In any case I trust Ryukishi/author more than Bern, and making fun of his readers would be suicidal for him who is always talking about trust. I don't think a lot of people would call what he did here something good, and support him after this. And he is not stupid and must know it Except if it is funny for him to lose half of his reader, ...
It would be courageous from him as an author, but unlikely for me.

>>Because they don't want to write what they consider a masterpiece and be hurt when no one reads it.

>>Because they don't want to reason about what they consider a masterpiece and be hurt when they realize it was all useless.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025392
>I don't think a lot of people would call what he did here something good, and support him after this.

Except it's seems like the majority of people who have actually read the ep are. Amazing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025376

Seriously Dine 15 is the entire murder mystery genre codified. Everything is negotiable save that one. It's what makes this genre unique.

>Though people read Golden Age detective fiction for a variety of reasons, certainly one of the key appeals of the genre is a sensation which one might be call “sudden retrospective illumination.” This sensation is referred to by many other names, including “paradigm shift,” “epiphany,” “the Homer Simpson effect (D’Oh!)” or, in Aristotelian terms, the convergence of “anagnorisis” (recognition) and “peripeteiea” (reversal). By whatever name, it entails the seemingly paradoxical simultaneous experience of surprise and inevitability (or, at least, deterministic causality).

>Well, as I feared, I haven’t explained it at all well, but I suspect that most of you know what I’m talking about ( I also have another theory [by Anne Elk!] that the appeal of this sensation is tied to a subconscious validation of our very existence… but I’ll bore you with that one another time). At any rate, I believe that for many of us, this sensation is largely what defines a great whodunit denouement, and Dorothy L. Sayers described the joy of it thus:

>“The aim of the writer of this type of detective story is to make the reader say at the end, neither: ‘Oh well, I knew it must be that all along,’ nor yet: ‘Dash it all! I couldn’t be expected to guess that’; but: ‘Oh, of course! What a fool I was not to see it! Right under my nose all the time!’ Precious tribute! How often striven for! How rarely earned!”

>Now, so far as I’ve been able to discern, the clues suggested all provide this sensation… well, perhaps I should more accurately say, the relationship between the clues and the truths they are ultimately shown to indicate provide it. As such, they allow for solutions which surprise us, and yet are entirely consistent with all data we’ve been given earlier.

[Anonymous No.]

From the comments I read on the Japanese side, they liked episode 7 as a whole though they found Yasu's past boring but they found the tea party awesome.

But there is also a lot of criticism of the overall plot.

I think it can be seen as an universal view, episode 7 was well executed but I don't think many people can be satisfied by the plot of Umineko as a whole.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025359
>>6025359
If there had been one message bottle, claiming that its story was the truth would be reckless, but not impossible.
However, because there were two, that made both of them doubtful.
If someone was plotting to make out those two days to be the work of a witch, that was really superfluous.
**And because there were two, it suggested that an undiscovered third one, or possibly even more might exist.**
......In other words, the two differing contents made it harder and harder to swallow.
But despite that, the contents of both matched in that they told of a witch in a tale.
In other words, does that mean that this is what the writer wanted to tell us.........?
......I can only imagine that someone who wanted to give rise to an illusion of a witch carried out this crime for attention.

Without waiting for the magazines' reasoning, it's very suspicious whether the message bottle really is a diary.
......After all, the amount of writing was massive.
It's hard to imagine that someone actually caught up in the middle of a serial murder like that would be able to calmly write it down.
In that case, it's probably more realistic that this diary was written slowly over a long period of time up until the day prior to the accident.
In that case, .........would it mean that everything on Rokkenjima had been a 'planned crime', where everything had been prepared for over a long stretch of time...?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025400
We must not see the same people. Seriously. I am not talking about the lolyasu bullshit here, I am talking about the " HOW DOES IT FEEL TO THEORIZE ABOUT RED HERRING DURING TWO YEARS, GUYS?"

No, I have not seen a lot of people linking this.
And I doubt that theses people will ever trust Ryukishi again and take his mysteries seriously if it is the truth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6024298
Don't forget that Eva avoided the bomb by hiding in the second mansion.

Seeing this all listed out like this makes sense.

I'll be pissed as fucking hell if all the meta characters just disappear and the real characters die on the island.

Also who wants to bet: Yasu's injury has to do with his/her penis/vagina.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025408
Or to make it simpler, people liked how the answers were told but not the answers themselves.

Anyways there is definitely a tons of criticism about the plot and Umineko as a whole in may.

And for some people here, there are also discussion about whether Yasu has DID or not over there and they don't seem to be sure too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025420
By the way, it don't really change anything.
Assuming that you are taking this as the truth before ep5.
The only thing which will change is that now, you know that you can not trust anything. And so you have to make, again theories with absolutely everything. And the mystery part become the biggest red herring in history, and Ryukishi's words... well.

Even if you take this as true, it just change umineko into a giant joke, with Ryukishi having fun of everyone. Insulting reader who don't think, and having fun of people who are thinking. Way to go. That's all.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025420

Thank you. Is this from EP4? I guess I focused on the wrong line of text back then.

>......I can only imagine that someone who wanted to give rise to an illusion of a witch carried out this crime for attention.

instead of

>**And because there were two, it suggested that an undiscovered third one, or possibly even more might exist.**

It's meta as fuck to have the released EPs be bottle letters themselves, including the one where the possibility itself was presented. That requires some serious mind bending thinking. I wouldn't put it past Ryu though. Cheese problem etc.

I guess combining this clue with the existence of the Witch Hunters, plus fandoms propensity for fanfiction is a valid enough clue for Tohya.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025436
>Also who wants to bet: Yasu's injury has to do with his/her penis/vagina.
I still can't get my head around how falling from a cliff can break your penis/vagina with surgical precision while leaving the rest of your body intact.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025438
Because ep7 is technically screaming " NO " and giving other answers. And aso a lot of symbolism.
But it screams "YES " in the same time because for the moment we don't see any other possibility.
So... Yes. We don't know.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025456
Or, of it is a girl, her womb or boobs. It could also work. But you still have the same problem, just like you said.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025456
Maybe she/he hit her head on the fall and her pituitary gland was effected. Makes sense. What doesn't make sense is how she didn't turn to baby jam on the cliff.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025420
Actually, while looking for this part in ep4, maybe I've noticed something interesting.

Eva had the ring of the head in the future. (Did Beatrice mention the ring in Bern's truth? I can't remember.) Meaning that she cared enough to find it after the all events that had happened.
She also had a huge money problems, which forced her to sell Ushiromiya library. Meaning that she didn't care enough to pick the bank card with a billion yen despite writing down the PIN for it.
Something is strange here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025285
This justifies mass murder.

Oh wait, no it doesn't. She was messing around with George herself as well, so it's not like she was Shirou and Saber in F/SN, waiting around for eternity for one another.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025420
Not OP, but I will add onto this. You are right, but this was spelled out completely in the EP7 tea party.

Claire's/Beatrice's reasoning for throwing out not one, but two bottles is to convoluted what happens at Rokkenjima. She is literally saying "this is the truth" with a troll face on.

Think of it this way, in how EP7 kept saying with the Cat Box:
Beatrice threw out two messages out to the people outside this cat box:
>The cat is dead!
>The cat is alive!

Though it's not completely contradicting as this example, this was the intent behind those two letters thrown out to sea. Of course, Claire researching "And Then There Was None" as to make it sound like a plausible truth also helped.

In addition to EP7's train of thought, even in EP3&4 had a messenger, who was Eva, that kept the Cat Box closed until her death from everyone, including Ange.

All in all, I am still with everyone. To know that we were reading someone else's fanfic for the first six episodes, is kind of frustrating.

[Anonymous No.]

The tea party was a complete mess.
1. Its the first ever game where no LOLMAGIC happens AT ALL.
2. We dont see any monologue we only see the external actions, we don't have a clue of what is going on in their heads.
3. ACCIDENTS. ACCIDENTS EVERYWHERE

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025421
To be fair, R07 did say people who thought of this like Higurashi with answer arcs and such would definitely fall prey to this.

That still doesn't mean I like it though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025516
She waited for a thousand years though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025520

When did she cast the letters off? Before her planned murder?

[Anonymous No.]

I just can't get my head around the motive.
It just seems so stupid, and no amount of sweetening it can change it.t

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025528
You mean 6.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025524
He said they will have a hard time. But it don't change anything, I don't even see the link with higurashi here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025521
Maybe because Bern is implying that it's the truth and not a game. It would be hard for her, if it contained lolmagic, don't you think?
We see a few thoughts of Rudolf.
Well, only 2. And then Kyrie missed trice. And misidentified fatal blow to the head. Anything else is real, Bern swears.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025524
He said they will have a hard time. But it don't change anything, I don't even see the link with higurashi here. I mean, he was talking about something else, here.

People will have an hard time if they try to solve it in the same same they did with higurashi.

And, later, he said that Chiru arcs are not answer arcs.

But I still don't see the link here. "red herrings" are not reffering to 5/6. They are reffering to almost everything in 1-2-3-4.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025530
Most likely when no one solved the epitaph or when things started to become a shitstorm. So probably around the beginning of the second day, when it hit midnight. She wrote out these fanfics long before the conference.

[Anonymous No.]

Who the fuck didn't know Kyrie was evil? I mean really. Ever since they showed her batshit sister, I knew she was just in it for the money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025524
He said it differently IIRC, but it still don't change anything,
I don't even see the link with higurashi here. I mean, he was saying;

People will have an hard time if they try to solve it in the same way they did with higurashi.

And, later, he said that Chiru arcs are not answer arcs.

But still, I don't see the link here. "red herrings" are not reffering to 5/6. They are reffering to almost everything in 1-2-3-4.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025535
NAH YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND HER SUFFERING.

EVA AND ANGE'S SHITASTIC LIFE IS NOTHING.

SHE WANTED A PONY

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025550
People expected her to be an evil mastermind.
Not the third rate villain that she showed to be.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025520
>Think of it this way, in how EP7 kept saying with the Cat Box:
It was said in ep4 itself:
"Because the only survivor, Ms. Ushiromiya Eva, has remained silent about what happened on that island, the events of that entire two day period are shrouded in darkness.
These two diaries, of all things, presented two theories to wipe away that darkness. With either diary, you could explain those two days. However, we don't know which is correct, or even if there is anything correct contained within them."
――Schrodinger's...cat box.

>>6025530
>Later on, it was confirmed that a similar message bottle had been recovered from the nearby ocean on the day of the accident by the police in their search for lost articles, and this caused a sensation.
She definitely wrote them before the accident.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025540
>Anything else is real, Bern swears.
>ahaha.wav played 0 times in EP7
>ahaha.wav played 100 times in EP7 tea party

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025548
Am I the only one wondering why Ange is not there both in the fanfics and in reality?
Coincidence?
I don't think so.
Still, it is strange.

[Anonymous No.]

Is it me, or is the Ring of the head a +40 to intellect -200000 to having a happy life ring?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025557
That's what I was trying to say. The Cat Box, since, I think, EP3 where Lia and Battler discussed the first magic fightan scene, was around.

Needless to say, it is definitely a theme in Umineko.

[Anonymous No.]

Jessica seems to get the shit no matter what happens. What did she do to deserve death, again?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025559
Who knows? Maybe Maria told Claire-Beato-whatever that Ange probably won't be coming for other reasons. Like them having a fight, or maybe having a weak body prone to sickness.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025559
Oh, fuck. It really is. Ryu better to explain this among countless other things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025579
being sexually confused?

[Dread of The Grave No.]

>>6025582
Yeah, Anon, I'm your new theme now. Battler's a useless faggot, so I leave this mystery to you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025557

Then they really were her original murder plans. Interesting, I wonder how Tohya was able to figure out that she wasn't able to go through with it, along with the rest of truth? Aside from the obvious (Eva survives) of course.

Another point of interest is that the other main difference between EP 1-2 is whether or Shannon accepted George. I wonder if this is in any way relevant.

[Anonymous No.]

So what the hell is Yasu's motive in the end? I'm still lost.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025579
The correct question is, what did she do to deserve *such* death. And the answer is having too good reaction and brushing the gun off.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025599
Shannon: "George-san"
George: "Sayo, I would like for you to mar-"
Battler: "''Sup guys!"
Shannon: "OMG! Hi Battler-san!"
(Shannon pushes George to the side)
Shannon: "Didyoumissme?Imissedyou!It'sbeensixyear!Wheredidyougo!?"
Battler: "Who are you again?"
George: ;_;

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025606
Have sex with Battler, George and Jessica and then explode

[Anonymous No.]

7 eps of shit for nothing. Fuck this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025620
Kyrie is just too use to placing the beat down on women. AKA jealousy mode.

[Anonymous No.]

Ange not being there in "Bern's reality" could make sense f Kyrie was a ""very good mother"" and wanted her to become the new heir.
But the whole thing about her not being there in the fanfics are also strange. Yea, marriage sorciere did break, but saying that " Beatrice don't want Ange in her story because of maria" is just... Well...

The problem is. If Beatrice want to keep to box closed, it is really a stupid move.
Ange is supposed to come. Kyrie even wanted to bring her even if she is sick, but finally did not.
So writing TWO stories where she is NOT there when the real ange is supposed to be here... It would clearly show that everything in these two letters are false.
If Ange is not in the letters, Claire must have some kind of guarantee that she will not come, and not only a "she is sick". If she does, her whole letters become useless.
Ange could also be stillborn or something in real life, but then a stillborn not coming because she is sick don't really look convincing to anyone studying the incident...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025645
That's called a plot hole.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025620
Jesus Christ, Jessica.

Her mistake was trusting her friends and family. I'm sure her purgatory is about learning how everyone is an asshole.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025656
A plot hole for a character who had her own episode which was pretty long?
I'm not really convicted.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025645
This.

Basically, Ange is walking evidence that makes people believe that the two letters have some truth to it. "Just as Planned" for Beato.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025663
I suspected set up since like 4, it's impossible for Ange to not be on the island in ANY kakera unless there is a force manipulating it.

Either yasu or kyrie

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025645

Maybe Yasu pulled some strings to force her to stay at home? She did give her monetary compensation, and Ange was part of the Alliance before.

Battler coming back wasn't part of her plans weren't they? I mean for her to write him in her bottle letters means she has some sort of guarantee he'll come back too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025667
Though it loses credibility with Eva being alive with Ange.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025636
Well, she was going to just shoot her from behind, but things went the wrong way and she became a little carried away...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025678
battler/ange status in letters means either:
1. Bern's lying/doesn't about something
2. FILE LOGIC ERROR AGAINST R07

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025686
>she became a little carried away...
>little carried away...
>little

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025678
"Let's have my ex-lover be the main character!"

No, seriously. With Ange not being there and Battler being there, this Beato must have planned things the way she was expecting them to.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025701
Or it's just a plot hole.
I don't see how she could manipulate Ange not coming, and why.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025701
which is why the 1 year earlier/later thing mentioned in 7 was either lies or error. or doesn't apply to non-alt world

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025667
>>6025645
>>6025656
>>6025559
>>6025701
>>6025693
>>6025684
So let's review. If the letters were written beforehand, Beato would have to:

1) Know Ange wasn't coming
2) Know that Battler WAS coming
3) Not know Eva was going to escape.

[Anonymous No.]

Alternatively, the real reason Ange was left behind was different from the reason presented in the Episodes, and was known by Yasu prior to writing the bottle letters.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025678
She didn't expect him to come initially. We don't know exactly when the letters were written and when Battler informed them, that she'll return though.
Ange received the letter only after the incident.

>>6025693
It has nothing to do with Bern. We knew that letters were written before the accident before ep7.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025667
A walking evidence which either result from a dumb luck (not here for any reason in real life/sick in the fanfic), either from something shady between Ange and Yasu, or anyone else. (not here in real life because of someone/sick in the letters).

I really don't like the idea of "yeah, and Beato just had luck on this point, that's all".

IIRC, marriage sorciere was broken a while ago (if it also happens in the real world...), so Maria was not able to have informations Rosa didn't had about Ange. The same thing goes for Yasu/Beatrice.

But in the same time, if Ange is... Well..."dead" ,or something like this, in real life, then it would not fit with the letter neither because the year of her death would be easily findable.

So Beatrice needed to have a guarantee that Ange will not come, but not something "too serious" Ange herself or anyone could remember.

And everything without having any contact with Battler's family, I suppose.
If she was able to ask this to Rudolf, she could also ask him where the fuck Battler is in order to get in touch with him again.
Also, it means that the two letters are not so old, in fact.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025706

Nanjo housecalls and drugs her?

I'm more curious about Battler. What pushed him back there? He never really elaborates on it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025706
One part does. Bern's world in 7 states the battler coming 1 year later/earlier causing the problem.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025712
>3) Not know Eva was going to escape.
Not necessary. Her two messages have Eva killed. Ep3 written by Auau based on the 2 existing + real world.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025717

If Ange did die young though, this would give free reign to Tohya and her fabrications. I could see her slandering long dead people, but doing that to someone alive is a bit iffy.

I've really had my doubts with Ange's journey in EP4 since before anyway. It's just too weird that her development occurred in parallel with 1998 and the meta world. It smacks of literary devices.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025717
So it's impossible for her to have known either? Does this mean she's just really good at speed writing?

[Anonymous No.]

actually i think r07 would just deny it with one line along the lines of.
"Guest lists/attendence sheets were give to servants before hand to prepare for the conference."
"Sudden changes would be informed via telephone"
"kumasawa/jessica went to pick them up, so one of them could have called for shannon to edit the bottle"

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025738
I would not say impossible, but I don't see how for the moment.
For speed writing, well... She is still a maid and have her duty, and, if you believe it, at least 2 personnalities.
Writing so much AND being Kanon and Shannon in the same time, and Being with George during her free time... Well.
>>6025718

I'm an Ushiromiya family member, but the truth is that these six years, I've been living with my grandparents from my late mother's side, and I've been using her family name.

Those grandparents passed away one after the other, so I had no other choice than to go back to the old bastard's place.
Don't get me wrong, it's not like I ran away from home.
The pig-headed one at fault is my dad.
If you believe Yasu's fanfictions.
In real life... Well... who knows. If it is the same thing, Yasu REALLY have a good information network. Really. It is surprising that she still don't have Battler's phone number with this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025718
That's true. They say many young children can get a fever just from getting immunity shots.

As for Battler, I guess finally coming to terms with his father isn't good enough? I'm not entirely sure myself. But I do know that Everyone knew Battler was coming to the island before the conference. After all, all the servants and even Jessica said

"You are the special guest this year."

inb4 loldoublemeaning

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025741

>"Sudden changes would be informed via telephone"

Oh yeah. Jessica's call in 5. I've forgotten about that.

Man. Yasu must write fast.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025765
Didn't they say something about that at one point of EP7? About calling Battler via telephone?

[Anonymous No.]

>"You were sick in bed starting October 3, 1986. And Beato's game board is cut off starting October 4. ......You are not given a chance to avoid getting sick. ...In other words, you are fundamentally an existence which *certainly* cannot rise to the game board."
Sounds like a someone's (Beatrice's?) plan.

>"My my, I wonder, ufufufu, I do wonder...! Our George is still undependable. Ah, but more importantly, how's your little Ange-chan? I heard she was vomiting?"
>"She always catches a cold when the seasons change. She's very frail... The truth is that I wanted to bring her, but my family will take care of her this time."

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025771
I need a drawfag to make me a pic of Beatrice/Claire writing like Light Yagami/Mikami

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025779
I think that they talk about this at one moment, but I'm not sure about, it has been a while since I read it. So a confirmation from someone else would be nice.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025771
Are we talking about the story? or just the scroll screen at the end?

story will be hard and kinda plot hole-ish. Though boat trip and early notice works too.

if it's just the scroll screen then i makes sense that battler dies at the end cause she found out late and added that on. people found that and wrote a corresponding story. plus battler "disappeared/eaten by demons" sounds like off the top of head stuff

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025771
Yep. However, no Ange before the beginning of the conference. Write fast and keep a sense as a mystery, so correcting must be really, really hard...

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025792
Multiple edits?

I know I can write a story a lot quicker, regardless of it's length, if I've been writing it over and over again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025792

I thought the implication was the bottle letters were the entire Episodes, or close enough anyway. Ange calls them by their proper titles, Legend of the Golden Witch and Turn of the Golden Witch.

I guess I could accept it if Yasu's been planning this the whole time, she'll just need to write a plot outline and fill in the details later. Characterizing Battler must have been fun for her anyway, so she'll have no problems with writer's block there.

I also just realized that those must have been fuckhuge bottles.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025812
maybe she writes really really small?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025812
Well, if it is the whole episode you can say that in must at least be 40 or 50 sheets ... probably more.

[Anonymous No.]

Picture of the officer in charge taken at the time the first Rokkenjima bottle was found.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025834
Too true

Well, if you don't put the meta-world in it, it is much smaller. But it is still huge and incomplete. How are you supposed to write the dawn or banquet we know without meta-scene?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025847

Maybe we don't know the real Episodes there. They'll be awfully short, but I remember Ryukishi saying that we should be able to reconstruct what twilights are missing. Plus, this is a mystery otaku net novel right? I don't think Tohya's bottle letters would be doorstoppers anyway. It's just pulp she likes to write because she knows the truth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025847
The EP after 1 & 2 don't need to be in bottles.

But it does make me wonder about whether the Meta antics of EP2 were there with red. Along with Rosa torture and Musou Rosa.

... why would Beato even care about Rosa being that way? Did Maria help write that one or something?

And the red? You would think that the letter with red ink would be more plausible/interesting (somewhat) than the one without it.

Captcha: acceptances, misled

[Anonymous No.]

Well, all I can say is that I can't wait for Witch Hunt's translation.

We're probably getting it around Christmas like EP5, right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025812
the ending credits hold most of what you need to know to not contradict what Ange saw.

Scroll screen for #1 also included pictures of the circles, stakes, and what not. Also had the title, some of the letter materials that the family got, and also the twighlights/how each person died/when

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025889
do bottles include tea party/????

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025910
Good point. I don't think it would since the credits roll at the end, saying the bottles were found.

EP6's story ends at the tea party when Ange finishes reading the story to Tohya. And EP7 is the same, but with Bern and Auau in ????.

So it might vary.

[Anonymous No.]

>>6025910
I was also wondering about this.
Technically, it is in our "real" episodes, so it should.