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5250888 No.5250888 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

Oh toyohime, you so crazy....

>> No.5250937

>>5250888
It is funny, because she means sex!

>> No.5250940
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5250940

>>5250937
o rly?

>> No.5250941
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5250941

>> No.5250957

>>5250888
Pet fucker. Fanfiction.net tier character.

>> No.5250990

Is Aki Edo male or female?

>> No.5250993

>>5250990
Edo is male, just like his brother Al.

>> No.5250995

>>5250990
both

>> No.5251008
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5251008

>>5250940
pfft..

>> No.5251030

>>5251008
FFFFFFFFFFF DAT HELMET

>> No.5251033
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5251033

>>5251008
>Just as planned.
Trying to start a powerlevel thread so early in the evening? How rude of you.

>> No.5251059

>>5250990
Female
true story, bro

>> No.5251175

Is bunnyfucking a sport in the moon?

>> No.5251184
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5251184

>aki eda

>> No.5251187

>>5251175
No, it's just a way of life.

>> No.5251244

>>5251033
Early in the evening? It's just barely past noon.

>> No.5251402

>>5251008
How'd yuka handle this situation?

>> No.5251618

>>5251402
Yukari pretended to be captured by the moonbitch in order to create a distraction. It was a part of her plan. The reasons why she didn't want to fight is because a) victory to her meant no bloodshed, and b) had she fought every youkai within a mile of that area would have been reduced to ashes by the moonbitch's ultimate moontech.

Eirin makes a comment on the next page about how surprised she was that everything was going according to Yukari's plan; consequently, she was worried about the competence of her successors.

>> No.5252005

yorihime's my waifu <3

>> No.5252126
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5252126

>>5250888
>A moon princess who Eirin once looked after. Her ability is as yet unknown, but she seems to have a simple, innocent personality. She seems to have REALLY LOVED her old pet rabbit "Reisen" ...

>> No.5252130

>>5252005
Nice emoticon faggot.

Read SSiB, then try saying that: http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Silent_Sinner_in_Blue

She's a Mary Sue.

>> No.5252258

>>5252126
she has good taste

>> No.5252292

>>5252130
How can you consider her a mary sue in a series which has as its main character a lazy shrine maiden who never works hard yet always seems to waltz through fights with ease... then makes friends with every character she just beat up? The fact that there's another shrine maiden out there (with training from Eirin) who can do the same to Reimu bothers you?

I know Reimu's the most popular touhou character but it was only inevitable she ran into someone stronger.

>> No.5252419

>>5252292
She already has run into stronger foes. Have you not read any of ZUN's writings? The only reason why Remilia, Yuyuko, etc... didn't shred Reimu into pieces is because killing Reimu would destroy the Hakurei border which in return would destroy Gensokyo. SSiB was one of the first times Reimu couldn't rely on the aforementioned clause. (I.e., Lunarians couldn't care less about Gensokyo.)

>The fact that there's another shrine maiden out there (with training from Eirin)
I don't know if you know this but Reimu defeated Eirin with relative ease. Though, apparently she was holding back.

>> No.5252432

The only reason she's proclaimed as a Mary Sue is because she didn't stick to Gensokyo's spell card rules. If they had to stick to danmaku they would have probably lost, and if everyone else had ditched the rules they would have lost too, except just with a bunch of damage done to everything.

>> No.5252449

>>5250888
lol it's funny because I thought the punchline would be she can't shit properly.

>> No.5252467

>>5251618
> b) had she fought every youkai within a mile of that area would have been reduced to ashes by the moonbitch's ultimate moontech.

Yes, this includes Yukari herself.

>> No.5252489

>expecting danmaku battle
>get all your bulletspam reflected with random magic invocations you weren't expecting

I don't see how this is a Mary Sue.

>> No.5252496

>>5252489
Aki Eda didn't write it.

>> No.5252498

>>5252467
Well yeah, after:
1) Yukari completely let her guard down.
2) Allowed her to sneak up on her.
3) Let her place a seal around her that was capable of restraining Gods.

The whole time the moonbitch was approaching her Yukari had a smirk on her face.

>> No.5252525

>>5252498
Meanwhile, the Ghost from the Calamitous Nirvana walked inside the Moon Palace, right into the treasure trove.

If that didn't send a message, I don't think what could.

>> No.5252533

Yes, powerlevel thread.

Eirin > moonbitches > Yukari

discuss

>> No.5252538

SSiB should have just been cute girls sipping tea together, because holy shit the moon plot was dumb.

Seeing the moon bitches stomping through every Touhou, conveniently having the exact counter needed to win was retarded.

>> No.5252551

>>5252538
I'm fairly sure a lot of Touhou encounters come down to luck in the end anyways. The idea of the system is that you can get blindsided by random strategies you weren't expecting and lose even with theoretically superior power.

>> No.5252556
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5252556

Did they tie up Ran's tails too?

I wonder if they simply forgot about the spinning tailsaw attack or it was an order from Yukari not to do anything.

>> No.5252581
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5252581

>>5252467
>>5252498
As seen during the battle with Sakuya, the (stronger) moonbitch was taken off guard by Sakuya's ability of time manipulation. Is it not safe to say the moonbitch who was apprehending Yukari would have been taken off guard by Yukari's abilities? After all, it's hard to reduce someone to ashes when they can pop in and out of dimensions at will.

>> No.5252599

>>5252581
Yukari was intentionally being taken hostage, I thought was the reasoning.

Also, she didn't really want a large portion of Gensokyo being razed for no reason.

Also, she cheats against Sakuya by introducing a solid wall of bullets, doesn't she? It's been a while since I've read it, though...

>> No.5252630

Oh look, a powerlevel discussion where everyone horribly underrates Eirin.

Just like always.

>> No.5252647

>>5252630
And all was right with the world, perhaps she should get a personality and a moe trait next time.

She's a goddamn nurse, it should be easy.

>> No.5252666

So if the moon bitches had worked hard for their victories would everyone stop bitching about SSiB? Or is it just the fact that their favorite Touhous lost set off the rage?

>> No.5252678
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5252678

I don't know if the moonbitch fans are aware of this but the moonbitches didn't win anything. All they did was rely on the power of their summons and moontech. An analogy would be a 13 year old girl defeating a 25 year old male by relying on her assault rifle. (Yeah the kid wins in this analogy, but can we really conclude that the kid was stronger?)

>>5252533
Eirin lost to Reimu, despite the fact that she had no incentive for losing. So much for the moonbitches' master. Maybe Eirin should have relied on the power of one of them Lunarian gods. Maybe then, she wouldn't have lost. wwwwwwww Yukari is the superior lifeform. If you were to have a child with any of the aforementioned girls, Yukari's child would be the strongest.

Boundary hax and super human intelligence > Moontech

>> No.5252680

Moonbitches are overrated. Remi was beating the shit out of Yorihime before she taunted her to drop her umbrella and then summoned the sun goddess.

>> No.5252683

>>5252666

>666

AH, MY OLD ENEMY, NERON CAESAR....

...before we fight, I shall parley with you.

>Or is it just the fact that their favorite Touhous lost set off the rage?

I, for one, thought that the best and only good part of SSIB.

The instance where Yorihime whipped her sword out and blocked Marisa's MS had me yelling, "DENIED, BITCH!" while pumping my fist in the air like I was at a football game.

>> No.5252688
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5252688

Watatsukifags are just butthurt because Yukari wins even when she loses.

>> No.5252706

>>5252688

Hey, you remember when Yukari led an invasion of the moon with a group of youkai, and the Lunarian war machine sent her packing as quickly as she touched down? That was cool, right?

>> No.5252712

>>5252688
Is there even such a thing as a Watatsukifag? The moon princess seem to be the most hated characters in the whole franchise.

>> No.5252718

>>5252666
Probably. These cunts just come out of nowhere and beat some of the strongest Touhou's without breaking a sweat, yeah, fuck you and your powerlevel bullshit ZUN, that doesn't even make sense.

>> No.5252720

>>5252712

Hi, I'm a Watatsukifag.

>> No.5252723

>>5252706
Her army lost. She won by "teaching them their lesson".

>> No.5252726

>>5252718

>These cunts just come out of nowhere and beat some of the strongest Touhou's without breaking a sweat

That was so awesome.

I was instantly sold on the Lunarians after that. Sold, I tell you.

>> No.5252728
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5252728

Shiki >= Suika == Yukari >= Watatsuki sisters > * > Eirin

>>5252630
>Oh look, a powerlevel discussion where everyone horribly underrates Eirin.
Eirin lost in her battle against Reimu; the Watatsuki sisters on the other hand did NOT lose in their battle against Reimu. I therefore conclude the students have surpassed the master. Now you know why Eirin had no choice but to flee from the moon (instead of just holding her ground against the students she mentored).

>> No.5252738

>>5252726
But you're a dangerous minority, you're always in the wrong.

>> No.5252746

>>5252728
Reimu's battle with Eirin was based on random bulletspam. Reimu's attack on whichever moon princess it was was based on random bulletspam, countered by random magic she was not prepared for. You can't fanwank powerlevels out of that.

>> No.5252749

>>5252738

>dangerous minority

Woah, woah! Don't start jumping from Troll level One to Troll Level Five without including the interstitial levels!

You forgot to mention how LIBRULS are enabling these 'dangerous minorities'.

>> No.5252751

>>5252706
>Lunarian war machine sent her packing as quickly as she touched down

So much bullshit.

1. It was never stated how long that war was
2. it was stated youkai sieged the moon capital
3. Yukari wanted her army to loose

>> No.5252766

>>5252728

>Eirin lost in her battle against Reimu

Eirin THREW the match against Reimu AND YUKARI.

P.S. LOOK AT YOUR OWN PICTURE AND REMEMBER BORDER TEAM IS REIMU + YUKARI.

P.P.S. Yes, threw the match. Read Eirin's IN profile, she's explicitly "much stronger" than she was in-game (already a stage 6 boss, mind you), but considerably handicaps herself so as to not make Kaguya look bad.

>> No.5252773

>>5252766

I was about to come in and say this, but yeah.

>> No.5252778
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5252778

>>5252712
>The moon princess seem to be the most hated characters in the whole franchise.
That's because ZUN took a page right off of fanfiction.net and introduced characters that beat up the canon characters. I couldn't even look at Marisa and Sakuya after seeing them lose that badly.

>> No.5252780

>>5252723
>Her army lost. She won by "teaching them their lesson".
More like Yukari was told a lesson.

>> No.5252785

>>5252751

Looks like I've touched a nerve.

>> No.5252787

>>5252728

Eirin is a scientist/tactician and not a frontline fighter.

>> No.5252790

>>5252766
She maintains her power at a level lower than Kaguya's out of respect, was what it said.

What makes you think she was holding back during such a crucial battle? Remember, she's got the secrecy of Eientei on the line here.

Also, power doesn't necessarily translate into bullet-spamming ability.

>> No.5252794

>>5252778
A large part of my rage with SSiB was how useless he made Marisa.

>> No.5252795

>>5252778
They don't lose forever, you know. A rematch could go either way.

>> No.5252796
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5252796

>>5252778
>That's because ZUN took a page right off of fanfiction.net and introduced characters that beat up the canon characters. I couldn't even look at Marisa and Sakuya after seeing them lose that badly.

You must really hate Suika.

>> No.5252799

>>5252787

She's also a top-of-the-line magician of the highest order.

Remember that spell she cast in IN? The one that SEALED THE ENTIRE PLANET EARTH? And she outright states that is NOT her strongest spell?

>> No.5252809

My only complaint about the whole Lunarian saga?

They didn't explain in detail about the chain of command going on, the full tactical loadouts of the average LDC soldier, the techniques and ways of battlefield control used, not to mention the technology used to upkeep all of this.

They also made no mention of ranks, medals, the vehicles, the motto, the official song...all of these things, ZUN and Aki Eda should have fleshed out.

I'm spoiled by Tom Clancy, though. His descriptions of private military companies really have ruined me for anything else.

Maybe I should send ZUN a copy of Rainbow Six. Then he can introduce Counter-Terrorist Touhous into the story.

>> No.5252810

>>5252790
You know, come to think of it...

Yukari has her gaphax, which seems to have many different kinds if usage. I wonder how effectively would Eirin use her "medicine creating" power. I mean, would she shoot poisoned arrows or something? Or drop mustard gas on you?

>> No.5252818

>>5252790

"In truth, she has power well beyond that of Kaguya's. She saves her power and maintains it at a lower level out of respect for Kaguya."
>Well beyond
Kaguya is a stage 6 boss.

>> No.5252821

>>5252809
Are you serious? Honestly?

>> No.5252826

Yukari herself in CoLR states that NO youkai can stand up to the Lunarians do to their technological superiority. Hell isn't that a reoccurring theme in this series? Technology>magic and spiritual power.

>> No.5252837

>>5252821

I am fucking super serious, bro. I've never been more serious in my entire life. Genuinely, the only part of Touhou I really care about is the awesome Lunar Military/Lunar Defense Corps.

I would sit down and read a manga or novel about them, and only them. Fuck everyone else.

>> No.5252846
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5252846

>>5252809
Oh please, Arc, stop ruining Touhou with this "coherence", this "explaining" and "consistency" bullshit you're trying to enforce.

>> No.5252855

>>5252837
Make it up yourself. It counts as original content.

>> No.5252861

>>5252818
And I'm saying that that doesn't mean she threw the match. Danmaku battles are ritualized duels. Actual powerlevels have little impact outside a general ability to make bullets dance in more complex ways.

>> No.5252865

>>5252846

You don't just run around doing things as a soldier.

There has be to be a Central Headquarters, which receives reports from a Forward Command Center, which also receives reports from a Base...you get the idea.

Read Tom Clancy's OP Center series if you really need to grasp it. While you're at it, read his non-fiction books MARINE and ARMORED CAV.

>> No.5252881

>>5252865
Jesus.

Would it really upset you so much to learn that the LDC is a bunch of silly schoolgirls with rifles?

>> No.5252885

>>5252766
Eirin had no motive to lose. The Watatsuki sister defeated Reimu without breaking a sweat. She said she could win another 30+ million times if she needed to. That means she defeated Reimu only using 0.000001% of her power (or shall I say her summons' powers). Eirin has no excuse for getting defeated by Reimu. Also, Kaguya ended up having to rescue Eirin in her battle.

>Eirin, I grant you one more chance with my power.
>Don't you dare lose again...
>You two, human and youkai!
>Eirin's true strength, the medicine made by my power... you will never forget this!!

http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Imperishable_Night:_Boundary_Team%27s_Scenario_2

>> No.5252892

>>5252881

A bunch of silly schoolgirls with rifles can't repel a lethal youkai army, which suggests that there are some holes in your clever theory.

>> No.5252895

>>5252865
Moon capital is built by a bunch of old sages who got bored with Earth and just kind of flew there.

Since all old sages are eccentric at best and batshit nuts at worst I wouldn't be surprised if your rank there was determined by how far you can piss.

>> No.5252908

>>5252826

No. Lunarian tech is a mix of ultra advanced technology and magic/divine powers. It was never stated that technology > magic. The most powerful lunarian, Yorihime, don't use hi-tech gadgets at all. Her katana is most likely made from some ultra durable sci-fi metal and that's it.

>> No.5252911

>>5252892
They can if the youkai are frightened of flying pieces of metal, which wouldn't be surprising.

>> No.5252913

>>5252895

>Since all old sages are eccentric at best and batshit nuts at worst I wouldn't be surprised if your rank there was determined by how far you can piss.

Ah! Reminds me of the Feudal era.

>> No.5252929

>>5252911

>They can if the youkai are frightened of flying pieces of metal, which wouldn't be surprising.

Highly implausible, since danmaku would send even the boldest youkai running for cover under these circumstances. And, given the popularity of danmaku...well, I guess I don't need to impress upon you the holes in your statement.

>> No.5252934

>>5252885
Oh, you're that guy from that other thread that keep downplaying Eirin.

Didn't now that sealing the Earth from the Moon was a "low-level" magic ability. Oh wait it isn't? Because she almost did and that wasn't even her strongest.

If Yukari was so powerful, why didn't she stop the spell herself instead of chasing down its caster. I think border hax could have negated it easily.

>> No.5252956

>>5252929
"fuckfuckfuck why is there metal in my shoulder how am I supposed to dodge this"

Well, I'm not interested in debating this with you much further, since it's an inherently silly topic, but I'll just say I wasn't really impressed with what I saw of the LDC in SSIB.

>> No.5252959

>>5252837
>Genuinely, the only part of Touhou I really care about is the awesome Lunar Military/Lunar Defense Corps.
Awesome you say? They almost lost to America's military of the 70s:

>"These filthy humans are exploiting the power of the moon and trying to build a base here. We've been urging them co-exist peacefully with us, but they never listen. We're up against a wall. We've decided to declare a final war against them.

>"The tide of war is currently slightly in their favour... Their modern weaponry is far better than we expected. But don't worry, we have the wisdom and pride of our millennia of history... We will never lose.

>> No.5252960

>>5252885

She already summoned Amaterasu against Remilia. The most powerful shinto god.

Just understand that they are super proud bitches that see earthlings as trash. They would never admit that battle was hard. Remilia was winning against Yorihime.

>> No.5252965
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5252965

>>5252934
But that's not fun~

Eirin looks like the type who would do her best to protect something while being serious.

Yukari looks like the type who would do her best to protect something while dicking around like a jackass.

>> No.5252967
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5252967

>>5252885
>Eirin's true strength, the medicine made by my power... you will never forget this!!
Do you have proof that Reimu and Yukari cleared that spell on Lunatic?

>> No.5252971

>>5252855

>Make it up yourself. It counts as original content.

Ha ha, I don't think you understand the breadth of this statement.

Consider this:

How does the Defense Corps of the Moon wage warfare? Do they use SHOCK AND AWE like the US Military? Do they prefer to engage their targets from afar instead? Do they use tactics that result in massive bunny casualties, or do they prefer to emphasize rescuing wounded soldiers? How much value do they place on a single soldier? Does this influence how the battlefield commanders carry out their operations, or do they operate without regard for the amount of casualties amassed? What are the political motivations of the Top Brass in the Lunar Defense Corps, and what ideologies do they follow?

You really need to read Tom Clancy's MARINE and ARMORED CAV books to understand the complexity of Modern Warfare.

The task you're suggesting is gigantic in size, equal to rewriting the Gensokyo canon from the ground up.

>> No.5252979

>>5252959

The US Military - which as we all know is immensely powerful and feared worldwide - was brought to a complete standstill in the Middle East by farmers with rusty AK rifles.

I wouldn't be so quick to assume things if I were you.

>> No.5252989

>>5252892

And why not? They are all just a bit below Reisen in power. They are led by two crazy bitches that can match best youkai in power. Back then they had Eirin to help and plan things too. And they most likely have fucking star destroyers flying circles around moon is stealth mode.

>> No.5252991

>>5252934
I couldn't care less about the Yukari circlejerk. I'm just saying:

Watatsuki sisters > * > Reimu > Eirin

Eirin lost against Reimu; get over it. Protecting Kaguya meant everything to her. Why would you assume she would take the chance of losing everything just for the sake of hiding her powerlevel from Kaguya?

>> No.5252996

>>5252967
Now you're just being silly and desperate. If it's programmed to have a good ending after it, it's canon.

>> No.5252999

>>5252979
You dimwit, that's because they weren't sure which farmers with AK-47s they were supposed to shoot. It hardly applies to a theoretical lunar conflict.

Anyways, I'm not sure how America managed to send troops up there without anyone on Earth noticing.

>> No.5253023

>>5252999

America does a lot of things without people noticing!

I assume the situation on the moon was similar to our situation in Iraq - a small, very determined force(NASA) drove back a much larger one(Lunarians) using guerrila warfare tactics.

>> No.5253035

>>5252971
Not interested, thank you.
Also, I don't think Lunarian warfare should be considered "modern".
Also, Gensokyo canon isn't that gigantic.

But even if the whole task is that big, why not take it up anyway. You look like you can accomplish it.

>> No.5253047

>>5252991

Repeat.

Imperishable Night Border Team is Reimu + Yukari.

Not. Reimu.

And no, solo teams are not canon.

>> No.5253050

>>5253023
As far as I know, launching rockets is still a huge and expensive endeavour, and it's still the way we get to space.

And yes, considering that officially only about twelve people have ever landed on the moon, I'd say there's some conspiracy going on here.

>> No.5253053

Power levels? Theoretical US army invasion? You've managed to take a shit thread and make it shitter.

>> No.5253056

>>5252959
>The tide of war is currently slightly in their favour

LDC is made from a dozen of lazy bunnygirls. You are really surprised war was slightly in the US's favor? It was most likely instant kill the moment moonbitches moved their lazy asses and joined the fighting.

>> No.5253058

>>5252956

>"fuckfuckfuck why is there metal in my shoulder how am I supposed to dodge this"

Oh, please.

Yuuka eats metal and shits gunpowder. You can't honestly expect me to believe, after all the many times /jp/ assured me that firearms are useless against Youkai, that some schoolgirls with guns turned back a mighty invasion force that Yukari the God-Border Bitch herself raised.

I think there was more to it than that. But I'm a dumb tripfag, so don't bother listening to me.

>> No.5253071

>>5253058
They're, uh, magic guns.

I don't know.

>> No.5253077

>>5252991
Kaguya can't die. There is no need to protect her.
Her fights with Mokou tell me that Eirin does NOT protect Kaguya.
Kaguya knows that Eirin is stronger than her.
Eirin didn't fight Reimu alone, but Reimu and Yukari, probably even Yuyuko, Youmu, Remilia, Sakuya, Marisa and Alice.
It is not stated that Border Team has cleared all spellcards. ZUN shows you how strong they are by their last spells. Be happy that you don't have to survive them.
Reimu did not lose against Yorihime, she gave up. The only other outcome would've been both losing.

>> No.5253079

>>5253047
This anon knows what hes talking about.

Yukari + Reimu + Ran (yeah, since she was using Ran too) > Eirin

Well duh, doesn't say a whole lot when 3 vrs 1

>> No.5253086

>>5252971
>>5252979
>>5253023
The war on the moon was getting so desperate that Reisen (a pet of one of the moon princesses) was on the front-lines. Suika alone could defeat the entire US military of the 70s. The Lunarian military must be weak. And no that's not an exaggeration about Suika. The black magic humans used to hold back the Onis has been lost. Suika would be unstoppable according to ZUN.

>> No.5253094

>>5253086
Reisen was most likely on the frontlines from the beginning, being part of the LDC and all.

>> No.5253105

>>5253086

>The Lunarian Military

Tell me, where have we seen the Lunarian Army or Navy?

We've only seen the Lunar Defense Corps.
Of course they can't drive back a fully mechanized army like the United States Army.

That'd be like asking our Coast Guard to defend us from a full-scale invasion by Russia.

>> No.5253107

>>5253058

They only look like normal guns. When they shoot them it looks just like Reisen using her bullet like magic.

>> No.5253110

>>5253047
Yukari didn't fight in that battle. Eirin lost to Reimu in a fair battle.

>> No.5253119

>>5253105
Do you have any idea how much it costs to send a tank to the moon? Any American commandoes up there were probably only relying on space suits and moon buggies.

>> No.5253123

>>5253053
Now with magic guns.

>> No.5253128

>>5253110
>Yukari didn't fight in that battle

Whoa, [citation needed]. Just kinda threw canon away did we?

Solo battles aren't canon in IN.

>> No.5253130

>>5253086
The lunar army was so weak that it obliterated a large army of Youkai who had the element of surprise do to gap manipulation.

>> No.5253134

>>5253110

While no focus mode is possible, it is highly improbable.

>> No.5253136

>>5253119

>Do you have any idea how much it costs to send a tank to the moon?

You don't know that.

For all you know, in this scenario, the Saturn V rockets were carrying a full compliment of US Marines, AND Armored vehicles to transport them.

Conspiracy, remember?

>> No.5253141

>>5253058
His whole statement has the major hole of "flying pieces of metal", implying bullets, which Lunarians probably didn't even know of during Yukari's invasion (of course there is a chance I'm horribly wrong here, so if anyone can provide some citation, be my guest). Which also leads us to our next question: what kind of weapons did the bunnycorps carry before they got their silly rifles?

>> No.5253159

>>5253130

Except Yukari wanted to loose that war.

>> No.5253165

>>5253141
Ouch. I'd forgotten that that invasion was a long time ago. Let's all beat up on the ignorant guy, eh?

>>5253136
Well, in general Touhou canon makes very few changes to the outside world. The only ones I can think of are a) that supernatural monsters actually exist, b) there's a secret civilization on the Moon descended from Asian legends c) this civilization has been fighting the Americans.

I suppose there's room for ascribing whatever military strength to the US astronauts you want, but I don't much like it.

>> No.5253174

>>5253105
1). Sending two crews, let alone an army, would have bankrupted any nation back in those days.
2). Lunarians had obvious advantages such as the ability to breath in space and magic.
3). The Lunarian society existed millenniums before the USA. If the Lunarians are so great, how come we managed to catch up and surpass them? Our western inventors are good, but I didn't think they were that good.

With the exception of a few, the Lunarians are pathetic. Just the fact that you like them is proof of your bad taste Arc.

>> No.5253197

>>5253141

I bet they used the same rifles. Moontech didn't improve so much.

And just look how those rifles shoot. There is one panel where a bunnygirl shot at a fairy maid. It works like a magical minigun.

>> No.5253203

Oh, thought of something.

It's said that spiritual attacks are more effective against supernatural entities (hence the rituals used traditionally to hold them off). If the Lunarians shoot magic bullets, does that make them less effective against regular-old armour?

>> No.5253205

>>5253174

>1). Sending two crews, let alone an army, would have bankrupted any nation back in those days.

Again, you and I don't know if that was really the case.

>2). Lunarians had obvious advantages such as the ability to breath in space and magic.

The United States had obvious advantages in Iraq, such as UAVs. Why come the Farmers with AK's were still killing our troops?

Same logic applies here, I assume.

>3). The Lunarian society existed millenniums before the USA. If the Lunarians are so great, how come we managed to catch up and surpass them? Our western inventors are good, but I didn't think they were that good.

I don't recall anyone saying that the US surpassed the Lunarians, merely that they caught them off guard. Of course, you're welcome to show me where exactly it was proven that the Earthlings had far surpassed the Lunarians in tech.

>> No.5253217

ITT: ZUN gets a heart attack from laughter due to people trying to explain his comics.

>> No.5253226

>>5253174
They can't breath in space, Eirin states that the lunarian inhabitants can't survive in the harsh conditions outside of the moon capital in SSiB. Which complicates this matter further.

>> No.5253234

>>5253226

Well, of course he's just making shit up as he goes along, that's usually how these threads unfold, isn't it?

Stupid wanker.

>> No.5253240

>>5253205
When there was an actual cohesive force to oppose the Americans, they were crushed. The reason farmers with AK-47s are having (limited) success is because you can't tell the farmers who want to shoot you apart from the farmers who don't want to shoot you until they start shooting you. This doesn't apply on the moon and anyways this criticism only weakens your defense of the LDC, since saying that "farmers with AKs" could beat the US makes it reasonable that silly bunnies with rifles could as well.

>> No.5253251

>>5253174

It was never stated they were surpassed. Just that earth weapons were better than they expected. They were probably expecting a bunch of niggers with spears wearing grass skirts who get to moon using some magical trick.

And honestly we know shit about what really happened. Reisen run away before the war even began. All we know is that US had a slight advantage at the very beginning and that lunarians won.

>> No.5253257
File: 71 KB, 500x383, z3vf.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253257

>>5253130
>The lunar army was so weak that it obliterated a large army of Youkai who had the element of surprise do to gap manipulation.
It was a small army of weak youkai. Yukari is strong but there's no way she had enough influence to send youkai on Suika's level up there. The whole point of it was for them to lose & learn not to invade.

Also, humans such as Reimu are able to defeat youkai by relying on holy/spiritual weapons. (ZUN said that's the ONLY way to hurt them.) But that's not the case with the Lunarians. Americans managed to (almost) defeat them relying ONLY on science.

Your argument has been systematically debunked. How does it feel?

>> No.5253261

>>5253240

>since saying that "farmers with AKs" could beat the US makes it reasonable that silly bunnies with rifles could as well.

Not when the bunnies are at a tactical disadvantage they can't, which is why I've been telling you to read up on modern warfare so that you can understand how very important these factors are.


Also, the Lunar Defense Corps does not equal the Lunarian Military. They're like our Coast Guard. Or our National Guard. By rights, they shouldn't even have been fighting.

>> No.5253277

>>5253257

>Americans managed to (almost) defeat them

I do not recall ever reading this. perhaps you'd like to expand more with sources?

I do, however, recall that the Lunar Defense Corps was brought to a stand-still by the Earthlings, and that was on the abandoned side of the moon.

>> No.5253290

>>5253261
But the Japanese Self-Defense Forces DO equal the Japanese military. I don't know where you're getting the idea that they have some vast military force they're not showing us.

Also, I just said that saying the US is easily beaten by farmers with AKs makes it easier to see bunnies with rifles beating them as well, meaning it's a silly point to defend.

Regardless, I don't know where you're getting the idea of a tactical disadvantage from either. I can only assume that one existed, of course, since it would have been stupidly expensive to send more than a few guys up there with guns and they apparently held their own.

But hey, we don't even know what the battles were like. Maybe it was three American astronauts versus a squad of five moon bunnies in a light skirmish, maybe that was their "war".

>> No.5253305
File: 97 KB, 700x535, 1274991484442.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253305

>powerlevel discussion
>no saging
>implying you think your opinions are worth seeing by others
>my face

>> No.5253321

>>5253290

>But the Japanese Self-Defense Forces DO equal the Japanese military. I don't know where you're getting the idea that they have some vast military force they're not

Japan does not equal the Lunarian civilization, so this point is completely irrelevant.

>Also, I just said that saying the US is easily beaten by farmers with AKs makes it easier to see bunnies with rifles beating them as well, meaning it's a silly point to defend.

Because you're looking at it from the wrong perspective.

On the moon, the astronauts played the part of the farmers with rifles. The Lunarians played the part of the vast technological forces.

>Regardless, I don't know where you're getting the idea of a tactical disadvantage from either. I can only assume that one existed, of course, since it would have been stupidly expensive to send more than a few guys up there with guns and they apparently held their own.

Does the phrase 'airless, cratered surface' ring a bell? The Lunar Defense Corps can't breathe in vacuum, nor can they easily navigate the barren terrain. Anyone who knows the slightest bit about military operations knows that the terrain can defeat you quicker than the enemy.

>But hey, we don't even know what the battles were like. Maybe it was three American astronauts versus a squad of five moon bunnies in a light skirmish, maybe that was their "war".

I am of the opinion that it was a series of tactical operations involving the security of certain prioritized targets. I am assuming that the Lunar High Command - which I will refer to as HIGHCOM so as not to repeat the names of the 'Moonbitches' - sent small fireteams of bunnies to secure these positions. I do not think it was ever a large-scale offensive the size of, say, D-day.

>> No.5253323

>>5253251
>Reisen run away before the war even began. All we know is that US had a slight advantage at the very beginning and that lunarians won.
Play the games next time before commenting on stuff you don't understand you secondary:

>The rabbit had escaped from the front line of a war, leaving her allies behind...
http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya_Houraisan#Imperishable_Night

>You bear a large sin.
>You abandoned your allies, letting them die,
>while you're the only one here living happily.
>That's right, you're a bit too selfish.
http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Phantasmagoria_of_Flower_View:_Reisen's_Scenario

>> No.5253354

>>5253323

But none of that says a single thing about the US totally surpassing the Lunarians, I'm afraid...

>> No.5253379

Arc just ruined another powerlevel thread by bringing in military garbage. Can't you see the whole point of a powerlevel thread is to focus on the characters.

Military circlejerks are NOT powerlevel discussions; consequently, you should leave them on /k/ and /new/. Also, is there a reason why you keep making walls of text?

>> No.5253391
File: 33 KB, 316x464, lily01.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253391

>>5253379

Is there a reason why you're so butthurt?

I think everyone should read this book, and then come back and discuss the Lunar Defense Corps. Even me. I'll re-read because it's just that awesome.

>> No.5253395

>Japan does not equal the Lunarian civilization, so this point is completely irrelevant.

It's a counterexample, meaning it's not irrelevant at all. Your assertion that the LDC is equal to the American National Guard is entirely unfounded. They're the only military force the Lunarians are known to possess, and ZUN is, obviously, Japanese.


>Does the phrase 'airless, cratered surface' ring a bell? The Lunar Defense Corps can't breathe in vacuum, nor can they easily navigate the barren terrain. Anyone who knows the slightest bit about military operations knows that the terrain can defeat you quicker than the enemy.

Human astronauts also have difficulty navigating the moon, and space suits are pretty bulky. Since the Lunarians have been living there for millennia, I'd say they know how to get around pretty well. Obviously the terrain would play a big role, but it's not like you can perform guerilla strikes when you yourself are in a foreign environment against a foe that likely isn't very large. Remember, the guerillas are always the defenders, attempting to harass a larger force into giving up. That's not really possible here. I assumed that the US thought that lunar magic rabbits would be rather easy to subdue when you have bullets and thus thought that sending a few guys across the gap of outer space would be enough.

>> No.5253397

>>5253391
>Tom Clancy
Yeah, no.

>> No.5253434

>>5253323
>We've been urging them co-exist peacefully with us, but they never listen. We're up against a wall. We've decided to declare a final war against them.

From a letter when Reisen was already on Earth. She run away before the war began. Her sin was to leave her friends to fight and die while she was living peacefully on Earth.

>> No.5253458

is tom clancy a touhou? who's her lesbian partner?

>> No.5253461

>>5253434
Derp. Just admit you were wrong.

>> No.5253474
File: 395 KB, 600x760, 121.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253474

I like talking about characters, but why's it always moon topics that end up horrible, and full of assumptions with no clear distinctions of what's just a guess or a unique interpretation and what's 100% clear in canon? Or that there may be weird conflicts in canon material that can be used to argue for both sides?

Why can't we all just get along?

>> No.5253483

>>5253395

Japan is a very special case. Japan not allowed to posses normal army.

LDC is more like some sort of border guard.

>> No.5253491

>>5253395

>It's a counterexample, meaning it's not irrelevant at all.

So it's not irrelevant just because -you say so-? Okay..

>Your assertion that the LDC is equal to the American National Guard is entirely unfounded.

No, that's just because the Lunarians have been shown to have their own navy, their own military, and so on. They are fully capable of space travel, they have a force strong enough to send soldiers in to re-capture Kaguya. Anyway...

The Lunar Defense Corps, as far as SSIB as show, is just a peace-keeping force. I should say they're like the UN.

>They're the only military force the Lunarians are known to possess

That does not rule out the possibility of their having a larger task force availible.

>Human astronauts also have difficulty navigating the moon, and space suits are pretty bulky. Since the Lunarians have been living there for millennia, I'd say they know how to get around pretty well.

With one caveat - they do not go to the barren side of the moon. It is all but ignored by the vast majority of the Lunarians. They have rarely, if ever, had reason to venture out onto the Dead section of the Moon.

The side of the moon that the Lunarians inhabit is quite Earth-like, with the exception of low gravity. That is what the Lunar Defense Corps are used to patrolling and training in. Can you see now how it would present an obstacle to them if they were forced to operate on the barrren portion of the moon?

>> No.5253493

Whatever the case it still seems odd that the Apollo 11 crew were carrying weapons at all on a trip to the supposed lifeless moon. Where they prepared for a bunny attack? Also considering humanity made multiple trips to the moon after the first lunar landing, as well as starting to colonize the moon in Maribel's time. Does this mean that the outside is not completely ignorant on the matter of the spiritual/magical world that's hiding from them?

>> No.5253497

>>5253491

>Obviously the terrain would play a big role, but it's not like you can perform guerilla strikes when you yourself are in a foreign environment against a foe that likely isn't very large. Remember, the guerillas are always the defenders, attempting to harass a larger force into giving up.

If you bothered to read Reisen's backstory, you would know that the humans captured and held Lunar soil. They had their own small portion of the Moon to defend, placing them in the role of the Defenders that you're describing here. Hence, it is no long shot to assume that they used guerrila warfare against the Lunar Defense Corps.

>That's not really possible here.

(says you)

>I assumed that the US thought that lunar magic rabbits would be rather easy to subdue when you have bullets and thus thought that sending a few guys across the gap of outer space would be enough.

I think not.

I think that, instead, the astronauts were accompanied by US Marines, in order to ensure the safety of the missions, and also to provide some level of security for the astronauts on the Lunar surface.

On seeing them land, it is easy to understand how the Lunarians may have thought that the United States was going for a full-scale coup d'etat.

>> No.5253512

>>5253458

>is tom clancy a touhou? who's her lesbian partner?

Tom Clancy is the Touhou of Modern Mechanized Warfare.

Her lesbian partner is General Stanley A. McChrystal.

She's kinda like the 'Moonbitches', but instead of raping rabbits, they Oscar Mike while Staying Frosty.

>> No.5253616

Putting this Lunar War shit aside, I don't really hate moonbitches.

And they are NOT overpowered. Yorihime didn't beat Reimu, it was a tie. And she had really hard time with Remilia. If not for the sunlight hax with Amaterasu and Remi's pride she would likely loose. And Sakuya was all "I don't really give a fuck". Besides she could have stabbed Yori at least twice if she was serious.

The only terrible part of SSiB is how weak they made Marisa. She really gave her best and still didn't stand a chance. Looks like in Gensokyo hard work is worth shit.

>> No.5253620

>>5253493

>Does this mean that the outside is not completely ignorant on the matter of the spiritual/magical world that's hiding from them?

Not only that, but it suggests that in the Outside - which is like our world, but fundamentally different - the Moon landing went different. To the best of my knowledge, there are no colonies of humans on the moon.

I could be wrong about that.

>> No.5253671

>>5253616

>The only terrible part of SSiB is how weak they made Marisa. She really gave her best and still didn't stand a chance. Looks like in Gensokyo hard work is worth shit.

The other terrible part was not showing us more about the Defense Corps. I, for one, vote that we should send ZUN some books on modern warfare so that he can flesh them out a bit more.

>> No.5253686
File: 17 KB, 394x357, yuyu.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253686

Yuyu fucked up the moon bitches good and proper.

>> No.5253714

>>5253616
Marisa went from being my favorite to least favorite after SSiB. Thanks ZUN. We really needed more useless side characters that are just stepping stones for the main character. It's like I'm really reading a shonen manga.

>> No.5253736

>>5253671

I don't really care about LDC, but it's a fucking crime we saw so little of the moon capital. Even thought half of that manga took place on the moon we still know nothing concrete about lunarians. Except that they like fruits and rape rabbits.

>> No.5253740 [DELETED] 

>>5253671
Will you fuck off about the Defense Corps. No one cares.

>> No.5253760

>Not only that, but it suggests that in the Outside - which is like our world, but fundamentally different - the Moon landing went different.

Fundamentally different in the existence of the supernatural. As far as I can tell, the existence of armed Moon expeditions is the only other difference (and, of course, the fact that world governments knew about the secret Lunarian civilization). As far as I can tell, the Touhou world is supposed to be generally indistinguishable from our own.

>>5253493
They must have known the bunnies existed or they wouldn't send weapons.

>>5253491
No, it's not irrelevant because its purpose is to point out that there are some countries where a "defence force" is in fact the entirety of the military power. It's not irrelevant because it's not meant to prove anything, it's meant to disprove your ability to prove anything.

Forced to operate on the barren side of the moon? As far as I know, the moon in Touhou is composed of two parts: airless moonrock and magic bubbles that enclose all Lunarian settlements. What sort of Defense Corps would be incapacitated by the very act of defending the moon?

>They are fully capable of space travel, they have a force strong enough to send soldiers in to re-capture Kaguya. Anyway...

They sent emissaries. For all we know this is like two or three people who rode a magic carpet down from the moon to Earth, accompanied by Eirin and maybe two bunny-soldiers. I also want to know where you're getting the idea that their armed forces are more than just the LDC.

>5253714

lolwut

Did you not see how the other main character was just as handily defeated?

>> No.5253788

>>5253760
Actually, you know what, I have no idea why I'm even bothering to engage someone in discussion after they claimed the only thing they liked about Touhou was some bizarre conception of tacticool bunnygirls which they are clearly reluctant to let go of.


And it's a shame, because tacticool bunnygirls would actually be kind of cool.

>> No.5253807

>>5253760
>Did you not see how the other main character was just as handily defeated?

Except they were not. Sakuya even caught Yorihime, if she was serious moonbitch would end with a dagger in her ass. Remi was winning until she dropped her only sun protection just to be fried by a sun goddess. And Reimu wasn't really defeated.

Marisa was the only one that got completely dominated.

>> No.5253818
File: 386 KB, 1000x1400, 1273291933698.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253818

>>5253740
Disregard that. I'm happy you intercepted this powerlevel circlejerk with Tom Clancy's moon wars. Now I can finally do something else with my time. By all means, do it again in the next powerlevel thread, Arc.

And to the guy that started this powerlevel shitstorm, don't start it so early next time. Also, you're only supposed to make these threads once per-week. Now I'm starting to miss the Yuka vs Yukari threads. Say what you want about Suigin but the man had class. (I suggest you research it.)

>> No.5253823
File: 20 KB, 337x300, 6a00d83452254a69e200e54f69ee1d8833-800wi.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5253823

This is an amazingly entertaining thread if you don't understand a word anyone is talking about.

>> No.5253835

>>5253818
God, what an asshole.

>> No.5253842

>>5253807
Big deal. Marisa was beaten for the same reasons as everyone else was beaten; the moon princess pulled an invocation out of her ass that countered her bullets on a conceptual level when in general she expects her to try to dodge them.

>> No.5253851

I don't get why you guys like arguing.

>> No.5253876

somebody explain to me whats going on

>> No.5253889

>>5253876
An exact copy of all the moon threads we've had.

>> No.5253902

>>5253876
Stoners talking about Tom Clancy.

>> No.5253909

>>5253889
what are they saying

>> No.5253919

>>5253760

>.No, it's not irrelevant because its purpose is to point out that there are some countries where a "defence force" is in fact the entirety of the military power.

The Lunarians are, as far as I know, not one of these countries. They are a sovereign nation in space. So far, you have no conclusive evidence proving beyond a shade of doubt that the Lunar Defence Corps is the only armed force on the Moon.
They have been portrayed as a peace-keeping force. Never as an outright armed force of the moon. Their mission statement is to ensure the safety of the Lunar dwellers. You can re-read SSIB and see for yourself.
However, if they had outright stated that they were the first and only armed force that the Lunarians had at their disposal, you may have had a point. So far, you've only offered conjecture and opinions as to whether they are the only armed force on the moon - and no concrete evidence.

Thus, I am disinclined to believe you.

> It's not irrelevant because it's not meant to prove anything, it's meant to disprove your ability to prove anything.


Unlike you, I am not attempting to prove anything.

You are only speculating on the absence of a larger military force.

I, however, have seen nothing in all of the Touhou Canon that suggests the Lunarians have only the Defense Corps to protect them.

It would be blind foolishness to assume that simply because we haven't seen the Lunar Military at work, that there is none. The same goes for the Lunar Navy.

>> No.5253923

>Forced to operate on the barren side of the moon? As far as I know, the moon in Touhou is composed of two parts: airless moonrock and magic bubbles that enclose all Lunarian settlements.

On the contrary. The light novels, such as Cage In Lunatic Runagate, prove that the side of the moon that the Lunarians live in, in quite comfortable and Earth-like, provided you ignore the lower gravity.

Naturally, no one bothers to explore the dead side of the moon. I highly doubt that the Lunar Defense Corps makes a point of traversing this portion of the Moon on a regular basis. It stands to reason that they would encounter a number of difficulties in logistics, planning, preparing, and mobilizing their troops on that particular portion of the Moon.

>> No.5253932

>>5253923

>What sort of Defense Corps would be incapacitated by the very act of defending the moon?

Bringing into consideration that the side of the moon that the Apollo missions explored was long-abandoned and left as a desolate wasteland, uninhabited by any sort of life, it is fairly obvious that the Lunar Defense Corps would have been ill-prepared to counter such a threat.

I have mentioned before that the nature of the Moon's barren side presents obstacles to the Lunar Defense Corps. The Humans were fully prepared for it. They knew what they were in for. And they equipped themselves as necessary. You can see how the Defense Corps was caught unawares by this, as they are unused to operating in this environment...and we all know what happens when an army is unfit to wage war on unfriendly ground.

>They sent emissaries. For all we know this is like two or three people who rode a magic carpet down from the moon to Earth, accompanied by Eirin and maybe two bunny-soldiers.

Says you. Perhaps I might be swayed if you weren't merely creating conjecture off the back of your hand. It took Eirin to kill them, which suggests to me that these 'emissaries' were armed combatants. These don't sound like simple envoys who were sent to negotiate with Kaguya in diplomacy. They intended to re-capture the Princess, or die trying. Sadly, they died in the attempts, thanks to Eirin's power.

>> No.5253942

>>5253932

>I also want to know where you're getting the idea that their armed forces are more than just the LDC.

We have seen nothing, nothing at all that suggests the Lunar Defence Corps is the only armed force the Moon has in its possession.

They are a large, imperial monarchy. They are not a small, empoverished nation that can only field a small Defense Corps.

They have enough money and resources to spend on luxuries, arms, technology, research, development...from all of this, it is fairly easy to assume that they have the funding and the resources at hand to field a standing army.

They can also engineer spaceships, without too much economic trouble. They appear to be enjoying a surplus, if anything. Note how relaxed the LDC soldiers are. A military strategist would tell you from the get-go that this indicates a very well-fortified, well-equipped force.

However, if you can find me an instance where ZUN definitively says that the LDC is the only armed force on the moon...or a quote from one of the Lunar characters along those lines, from a canonical source, then there will be some support to your argument.

>> No.5253942,1 [INTERNAL] 

>>5253876
>somebody explain to me whats going on
Since there hasn't been a lot of Yuka vs Yukari threads in a while a new challenger appeared. --> Toyohime. Thanks to her relationship with powerful Touhous, Eirin and Yorihime got dragged into it as well.

This powerlevel battle between Yukari and the Watatsuki sisters was destined to happen.

>> No.5253952

>>5253909
>Moonbitches
>Arc saying shit
>People saying shit
>Arc's "weel that wat u think"
>More bitching

>> No.5253959

>>5253952

WE ARE DISCUSSING TACTICAL SPACE OPERATIONS FROM AN OPERATIONAL STANDPOINT.

Read Tom Clancy's 'Marine' and 'ARMORED CAV' books for more info.

>> No.5253968

>>5253952
do they know everything was part of yukari's plan and they held back in those fights or no

>> No.5253981

>>5253919
I don't want to further engage in this debate. I haven't read Cage in Lunatic Ranagate. But let me just say a few things.

>You are only speculating on the absence of a larger military force.

>I, however, have seen nothing in all of the Touhou Canon that suggests the Lunarians have only the Defense Corps to protect them.

You're speculating on the existence of a larger military force, aren't you? The only difference between what I'm doing and what you're doing is the fact that the burden of proof lies on you, because no evidence supports the existence of a larger force beyond your idea that as a moon nation they should have one. The fact of the matter is that no information exists either way.

And I bring up Japan because I don't think it's far-fetched for ZUN to apply his own country's military outlook to a Japanese/Chinese moon paradise of his own devising.

>> No.5253988

>>5253788

>...some bizarre conception of tacticool bunnygirls which they are clearly reluctant to let go of.

Well, someone in this thread has a bizarre conception that the Lunarians don't have an actual army, and that they're so destitute that the LDC is all they have.

The person in question isn't dishing up any evidence with that, so...

>> No.5253988,1 [INTERNAL] 

>>5253942,1
Also, Arc came along and messed up the flow of the powerlevel discussion with his walls of Tom Clancy pasta. Now instead of the topic being about Yukari vs [insert moonbitch] it became a battle about the Lunar Defense Corps vs whoever the fuck Arc was ranting about.

>> No.5253998

>>5253968
I don't even know what's going on anymore.

Like I said, just like the other moon topics.

>> No.5254010
File: 145 KB, 850x602, 1273292757789.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5254010

>>5253968
>do they know everything was part of yukari's plan and they held back in those fights or no
They're willingly ignorant, but I expect nothing less from IN fans.

>> No.5254024

>>5254010
wow just wow

>> No.5254035

>>5253981

>I don't want to further engage in this debate.

Because you are aware of the implausible nature of your claims? I'm inclined to say that you're trolling, but I'm a nice guy. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, and hear out your statements, however unfounded and unsourced they may be.

>You're speculating on the existence of a larger military force, aren't you?

No. I am suggesting that there is more to the Lunarian nation than you're imagining. And I am suggesting that it is not so unthinkable to assume that they are capable of fielding an army.

They have the resources available, they have the manpower, it would be completely nonsensical for such an advanced nation to have only a small border guard protecting their interests.

It occurs to me that the first war with the Youkai would have completely smashed the Lunarian capital to the ground if they truly lacked a real standing army. If they only relied on the Defence Corps, as you're suggesting, they are either incredibly lucky to have survived this long as a sovereign nation, or there's more to the story than we think...and that is what I'm suggesting.

>> No.5254042

>>5253981

>The only difference between what I'm doing and what you're doing is the fact that the burden of proof lies on you

I am not trying to prove anything, so it really does not. I suggested that the LDC is not the only Lunarian armed force, which isn't such a nonsensical idea considering the size, span, and influence of the Lunarian Monarchy.

>because no evidence supports the existence of a larger force

The crushing of the Youkai army suggests this.

Also, the fact that the Lunarian Nation has remained an unparalleled bastion of technology for millenniums on end, without being conquered, taken over, or otherwise suffering insurgencies, suggests that your idea of a group of silly schoolgirls with guns being their only armed force is quite...silly.

>beyond your idea that as a moon nation they should have one.


And the fact that they crushed Yukari's invincible youkai army, who /jp/ said could conquer all of Earth without raising her little finger.

Let me repeat that:

The Lunarian Monarchy CRUSHED a highly powerful Youkai invasionary force.

That doesn't sound like something some silly schoolgirls could do. Yuuka alone would tear those silly schoolgirls some new assholes on her own, if you ask me. Now imagine an army of Yuukas.

Scary, isn't it?

>The fact of the matter is that no information exists either way.

Which renders your point completely irrelevant. You can't prove that the Lunarians have no navy or army, beyond a shadow of doubt, and yet you seem tremendously determined to prove to me that they, in fact, have only a few silly schoolgirls with single-shot rifles...protecting a vast Moon Monarchy with millions of innocent souls on the line.

Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it?

>> No.5254051

The U.S never invaded the moon. Russia did it.

The Russians made it to the moon and discovered that there was already someone else there. Deciding not to disclose this to the Americans (who would ask for peace and happiness etc.) they decided to invade and claim the moon by right of conquest.

This endeavor cost so much that it caused the collapse of the Soviet Union.

>> No.5254060

>>5254051

Oh God, a horde of Russkie conscripts yelling, screaming, waving assault rifles...yeah, I can see how the LDC was brought to their knees by that assault. Imagine how Hitler must have felt when Russia came down on Germany. Sheesh.

>> No.5254061

>>5254035
I am honestly not trolling here.

It seems to me that there is no way that either of us can convince the other. There just happens to be no information on the subject. I've tried to tell you that your fanwanking is just as groundless as mine, but you're not having any of that, so I don't see any reason to continue. You have countered or ignored every single one of my arguments, just like I have yours. I don't see any point to continuing.

>> No.5254087

>>5254042
see:
>>5253257

>And the fact that they crushed
It was a weak force. If it was a strong force it would have been an army of Oni youkai on Suika's level. Again, Yukari is strong but she's not strong enough to command around powerful youkai like Suika and Yuka.

>Yukari's invincible youkai army, who /jp/ said could conquer all of Earth without raising her little finger.
When humans fight youkai their ONLY way of winning is by relying on the youkai's kryptonite. The Lunarians are so weak humans managed to (almost) win with their science alone.

>The Lunarian Monarchy CRUSHED a highly powerful Youkai invasionary force.
The was the point. Yukari wanted them to lose in order to teach them a lesson about invading other places.

>> No.5254094

>>5253942,1
>Since there hasn't been a lot of Yuka vs Yukari threads in a while a new challenger appeared. --> Toyohime. Thanks to her relationship with powerful Touhous, Eirin and Yorihime got dragged into it as well.
I see
well Toyohime and Eirin aren't even worth comparing with Yukari
Yorihime is only a problem if she drags a high tier goddess like Shinki to it

>> No.5254102

Yuka beats Yukari just because of that yellow ascot. It gives her strength.

>> No.5254116

>>5254102
you slept with suigin, right?

>> No.5254119

>>5254102
>yellow ascot
Not canon.

>> No.5254123

>>5254061

>I am honestly not trolling here.

Famous last words...of many a troll.

Is it not the business of Anonymous users of /jp/ to troll Tripcode users? But like I said, I'm allowing you an exception. Perhaps you're not just acting out of spite, a hatred of tripcode users, and you genuinely care what I think. I will allow that possibility. But that's water under the bridge, my friend. Let me continue with the next portion of your post...

>It seems to me that there is no way that either of us can convince the other.

You are labouring under the impression that I want to convince you. It honestly does not impact me in the slightest if you think the Lunarians are a bunch of bunny-raping idiots with a fleet of silly schoolgirls wielding ancient single-shot rifles and nothing else, however implausible it may seem given the circumstances.

I am simply offering up reasons why this may not be the case. As an author, it is my duty to create a water-tight story. I like to give people answers to their questions. As such, I am answering your questions about the Lunarian armed forces, using the evidence I have gleaned from reading Cage In Lunatic Runagate, SSIB, and the other works ZUN created, as well as the backstories behind Imperishable Night.

>> No.5254126

>>5254061

>There just happens to be no information on the subject.

Perhaps if you read CILR you would have some information. It worked for me. But you don't seem to want to do that, so I shan't bother invoking it.

>I've tried to tell you that your fanwanking is just as groundless as mine

Groundless, but entirely plausible, given what we know. It's not any long stretch of the imagination, what I'm suggesting here. You seem to think it's bizarre. I, however, think it's perfectly possible, under the information about the Lunarians that we currently know.

>but you're not having any of that, so I don't see any reason to continue. You have countered or ignored every single one of my arguments, just like I have yours. I don't see any point to continuing.

I find this a good little exercise for the mind. I have written multiple stories about space empires and their armed forces. I have read stories about space empires and their armed forces. I have read about and studied modern military tactics, and read military fiction on a regular basis.

As such, it's fun to try explaining the nuts-and-bolts behind the Lunarian armed forces. It's an enjoyable conversation, and a HELL of a lot better than 'Which Touhou would you cum inside'. I'm actually glad you chose to engage me in this today, I was dreadfully bored.

>> No.5254147

>>5254116
I'll take him any day over these IN guys.

>> No.5254160

>>5254087

>It was a weak force.

Again, that's you saying that. Perhaps if you offered a source, this would be a more convincing argument. I find it highly illogical that Yukari would take on weak, small youkai. They wouldn't care about fighting. They would go home and hide under their covers if they were told they had to fight.

>If it was a strong force it would have been an army of Oni youkai on Suika's level.

Oni can be turned back by throwing beans at them, they're not all-powerful.

>Again, Yukari is strong but she's not strong enough to command around powerful youkai like Suika and Yuka.

She commands Suppatenko(ran) who is tremendously powerful, as well as being a walking computer. Ran is also dangerous in a fight. Nothing to laugh at, my friend.


>When humans fight youkai their ONLY way of winning is by relying on the youkai's kryptonite. The Lunarians are so weak humans managed to (almost) win with their science alone.

Again, the invasion was ultimately unsuccessful, and nowhere in the canon does it say that the Humans were ultimately winning the fight. They slowed the advance of the Defense Corps, who had been expecting a bunch of idiotic apes.

Instead, they came up agains another organized military force. You can see how this would have ruined their chances. Many a military operation has been shot to hell by bad intel. You can't simply assume that they were weak because of faulty intelligence and bad terrain.
>The was the point. Yukari wanted them to lose in order to teach them a lesson about invading other areas

They put up a hell of a fight, though. It's not like the Youkai arrived, saw the bunnygirls, and then did an about face and went back home instantly. And I'm sure you, of all people, know that fighting a Youkai is very, very serious business.

>> No.5254161

Lunarians are mary sues in a whole setting of mary sues.

>> No.5254171

"Lunarians" kinda sounds like "Lesbians"

>> No.5254175

>>5254171

I prefer to call them 'Citizens of the Lunar Monarchy', but nobody cares what I think.

>> No.5254198

>>5254160
>and nowhere in the canon does it say that the Humans were ultimately winning the fight.
>"These filthy humans are exploiting the power of the moon and trying to build a base here. We've been urging them co-exist peacefully with us, but they never listen. We're *up against a wall. We've decided to declare a final war against them.

>"The tide of war is currently slightly *in *their *favour... Their modern weaponry is far better than we expected. But don't worry, we have the wisdom and pride of our millennia of history... We will never lose.

They had a head start (read: millenniums) and they still were struggling to defeat a group of hairless monkeys that just discovered electricity a century ago. Good job Lunarians.

>> No.5254219

>>5254198

>>"The tide of war is currently slightly *in *their *favour..

Slightly in their favor, not WINNING THE WAR HUMANS FUCK YEAH, as everyone's implying. At the most, that implies the LDC had some setbacks.

So that does a pretty good job of undermining your argument. But I digress...

>They had a head start (read: millenniums) and they still were struggling to defeat a group of hairless monkeys that just discovered electricity a century ago. Good job Lunarians.

Again, the old story of a small, determined force beating back a larger, well-equipped one is nothing new. And you have to admit that they were working with bad intel as well as hostile terrain. Not the best conditions to wage war.

>> No.5254281

>>5254123
Although I have at times been dismissive of your points and derisive in my tone, I honestly have not been trolling at any point. If I didn't believe I had a point to defend, I wouldn't have spent all my time typing this. Actually, the fact that you've accused me of trolling suggests to me that you don't believe I have a viewpoint worth defending; all the more reason to break off this discussion.

I'll stop posting with this (no promises for that other guy): you've demonstrated to me that the story can be consistent with the existence of a Lunarian Army and Navy. However, I believe the story is equally consistent with the Lunar Defense Corps being the entire armed might of the Moon. And, since there is no evidence at all that directly or indirectly mentions a Lunar army or navy, I feel that to assume that they exist is pointless, and that the default position should be to assume they don't.

>> No.5254322

>>5254281

>However, I believe the story is equally consistent with the Lunar Defense Corps being the entire armed might of the Moon.

The only way this works is if the LDC is massive.

And I'm okay with that. But everyone is stolidly saying that the LDC is solely made up of twelve schoolgirls with rifles.

That doesn't make sense. It really doesn't.

Not with all the fantastic things the LDC does, such as crushing youkai invaders, keeping the peace of a large monarchy, and so on.

However, them having an Army and a Navy makes perfect sense. It's not implausible. Like I said, they have the ability to field them. I see no reason why they would not, and there's no proof that they wouldn't.

> And, since there is no evidence at all that directly or indirectly mentions a Lunar army or navy, I feel that to assume that they exist is pointless, and that the default position should be to assume they don't.

However, there's enough evidence to support the theory that there may indeed be an army and navy. You lose nothing by assuming that they exist, and it certainly isn't implausible to assume that they exist.

You've given me no solid, plausible reasons why they would not. You didn't even say things like,

>Well, the Lunar Economy couldn't handle arming an entire battalion of bunnygirls, so it's ridiculous to assume they could field an army..."

You're just saying...

>IT DOESN'T EXIST BECAUSE I SAYS SO, FAGET.

You're coming off as very trollish by doing this, but I am giving you the benefit of the doubt.

>> No.5254338

I appreciate your benefit of the doubt.

>IT DOESN'T EXIST BECAUSE I SAYS SO, FAGET.

No, I'm saying it doesn't exist because the story works without it and there isn't a scrap of evidence to support it, that's all.

>> No.5254368

>>5254322
Actually the LCD may have very well been massive, however the first lunar invasion and possible the following next ones taxed the lunar forces pretty badly. In SSiB one of the princess remarks that the schoolgirl patrol you see in the manga was pretty much scrounged up do to most of their original forces being wiped out.

>> No.5254374

>>5254338

>No, I'm saying it doesn't exist because the story works without it

But, you see, the story doesn't work without it.

Okay, let's try your scenario.

Twelve bunnygirls = entire Lunar armed force.

1. How will they corral millions of people? Jesus Christ, there would be insurgencies and warfare on the moon every single day, forever, if this was the case.

In fact, the Moon would probably be taken over by some crazed dictator before long. Toyohime and Yorihime would have their heads stuck on the ends of poles.

2. How will they shield themselves from Interplanetary enemies? We know there are aliens in the Touhouverse, so that means a high possibility of there being other empires are in the stars. They would just gobble up the Lunar Monarchy, and goodbye LDC. That's it. Zip. Zilch. No more moonrabbits, no more Lunarians. Just horrible abominations like Nue, or robots, or what have you. And then they would invade Earth and we would all be truly fucked.

3. How can twelve bunnygirls patrol the entire Lunar surface? Even with just half the moon...that's ridiculous. That's barely even a full platoon! And you really need a single platoon if you're going to patrol anywhere.


You see the problems with this idea?

>> No.5254385

>>5254368

> In SSiB one of the princess remarks that the schoolgirl patrol you see in the manga was pretty much scrounged up do to most of their original forces being wiped out.

Yes, and? That happens all the time. One regiment gets wiped out, and another must be pulled together to take its place. I don't see how this concludes that the LDC is just twelve schoolgirls with rifles.

>> No.5254393
File: 27 KB, 250x250, ReisenFacePalm.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5254393

>SSiB thread
>Less than 9 hours old
>199 posts and 24 image replies omitted.

>> No.5254411

>>5254393
>Touhou

What did you expect?

>> No.5254535

>>5254411

So edgy.

>> No.5254790

army of overdrive

>> No.5255220

i only read the posts about bunnyrape

>> No.5256971

derp

>> No.5258422
File: 96 KB, 385x425, 1275081809312.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
5258422

>my face when this thread was still going and people still weren't using sage

>> No.5258482

>>5254374
or their society doesn't have a foundation of fear.

If the people are happy, they're not going to rebel just for the sake of seeing if they can. That's retarded.

>> No.5258583

Quick question here guys, and Arc, if you're still here.

Does conventional firearms even work in vacuum?
What were the American troops on the moon using as weapons?

>> No.5258591

>>5258583
No. Firearms are based on quick combustion, and as you surely know, you require a pyramid for it to function.
Oxygen, Fuel and Heat. Without the 3 you can't get a fire.

>> No.5258595

>>5258591
So... What did the American astronaut-troops attack the LDC with?

They ran them over with moonbuggies?
They beat them with sticks?

>> No.5258597

>>5258591
Aren't most modern gun powders self-oxidizing?

>> No.5258618

>>5258597
They didn't use modern firearms.
They used funky firearms from the seventies.

>> No.5258622

>>5258618
Disco bombs ... no wonder the Lunarians hated us.

>> No.5258674

>>5258618
Self-oxidizing explosives like Nitrocellulose, which I believed is used occasionally as gunpowder, have been around since the the early 1900's.

>> No.5258693

>>5258618
Military issue weaponry cannot be classified as "funky".

>> No.5258710

>>5258674
Oh, okay.
I was just wondering if everyone just went retarded in this thread or something.

Turns out it was me who was retarded ;_;

Trying to seriously discuss with Arc in a Touhou thread is pretty retarded though, now that I think about it.

>> No.5259373

ITT Arc pwns all.

That is all.

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