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5160034 No.5160034 [Reply] [Original]

Wasn't Eva pretty much confirmed as the culprit in episode 3?

>> No.5160057

Too obvious. Also, Nanjo.

>> No.5160053

No.

It can be self-defense, or her hunting for the real culprit.

>> No.5160066

Aren't you guys burned out on Umineko already?

>> No.5160072

>>5160066

Not till ep 6 is translated. WIIIITTCHHHUUUUNNNNTTTTTT.

I bet ep 7 will be out +3 months before we even see 20%.

>> No.5160078

>>5160053
>self-defense
Wat.

>her hunting for the real culprit.
That's certainly a bizarre way to do it,

>> No.5160086
File: 28 KB, 228x180, 0%.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5160086

>>5160072
>before we even see 20%
Maybe you should go check WH

>> No.5160109

>>5160086

...

I stand corrected. We may see 50% before ep 7 release. I wouldn't hold my breath for anything past that till christmas time, however.

>> No.5160128

Episode three is a fucked up piece of the puzzle, the way I see things.

Eva is the 'new culprit' as she became Beatrice and survived with some knowledge of the truth to make the Ange we know exist.

However, while it may not be that simple, I say the simplest solution is that the real culprit died the first twilight and Eva had to take over the rest for some reason. But it's loveless, and episode 4 is like LOLNO At it, so who knows.

>> No.5160235

She probably only carried out a few of the murders to ensure that she kept the gold.

>> No.5160264

>>5160109
Heh, nah, give them some credit.

They finished the 1-4 patch, and are almost done with part 1 of Episode 6.

>> No.5163601

No. Eva is almost confirmed innocent.

>> No.5163608

>>5160034
>Wasn't Eva pretty much confirmed as the culprit in episode 3?
Like Natsuhi for Episode 5, right?

>> No.5163642

Don't you love this MYSTERY?

>> No.5163680

Eva only killed Battler. And even then, that was understandable. She was ill, her husband was after dying, along with her beloved son. That, and the pressure of all those 'visions' were clearly too much for her. No wonder the poor woman snapped.

>> No.5163712
File: 11 KB, 200x259, 4b92bc3bb4768264fbeda57344ee7f2e.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5163712

Do you think Rosa would act the same if she lost Maria?

>> No.5163920

>>5163680
>That, and the pressure of all those 'visions' were clearly too much for her. No wonder the poor woman snapped.

Yes, but the Eva that Ange remembers is a normal woman. She's evil but she didn't lose her sanity, so she shoot battler for a reason, not because she was crazy or something. Besides, she never feel sorry for killing Battler, she never said Ange that she killed him, so could it be that she really thinks that he's the culprit?

>> No.5163926
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5163926

>>5163920

maybe Eva discovered that Battler is not the real Battler and that he caused it, that's why she killed him

>> No.5163933

>>5163920
I don't think so, she wouldn't of taken Ange on if she thought he was the culprit.
She would of handed her over to Kasumi & that would be that, but no she made an honest go at being a mother to her.

>> No.5163952

>>5163933
I believe it is in fact another point why Eva would take Ange under her wing.

Having a murderer as a sibling would prolly be a very heavy thought for a young girl like Ange. So if the tanabata thing was really what happened before the batshit, perhaps Eva wanted to confort herself with her last family, and preventing Ange to look futher about Battler (if he is considered as the culprit by Eva).

>> No.5164074

>>5163933
Guilt.

>> No.5164088

Maybe Eva went to the Kwadorian because she saw the real culprit running, so she followed him/her. However the culprit runned away. To be sure that nothing would happen to Ange, the last Ushiromiya child, Eva took care of her. She also imprisioned her in ST. Lucia so the culprit would never find her.
I don't believe Eva hated Ange, even if Ange flashbacks say so, because, if you look to Higurashi Onikakushi-hen, Rena was trying to protect Keiichi while he believe that she was mad.
Now you will say "but the situations are different!"
Yes, the situations are different, but I believe that it's pretty reasonable that Ryukishi would use the same idea of people trying to protect a beloved one while this person thinks that it's actually bully.
I believe Eva, she's a good mom and a good person.

>> No.5164089

I think it's pretty obvious that Eva didn't kill a single human being, except Battler, in EP3.

>> No.5164097

>>5164089

She didnt even kill Battler, you fucking idiot.

>> No.5164104

>>5164097

Huh? She did kill Battler.

>> No.5164110

>>5164104

Okay. Show me the re-

oh waaaaaaaaaait

>> No.5164114

>>5164097
R07: Concerning the scene where Battler is shot, since Battler witnesses the moment the gun is fired, basically there is no mistake about that. You fucking idiot.

>> No.5164118

>>5164114

Okay buddy. I'm going to laugh when it's revealed Jessica shot him.

Since it was never confirmed in red, and Ryukishi's faggotry runs deep to the point where nothing not in red can be trusted.

>> No.5164124

>>5164118
I think you need to reread the games, buddy.

>> No.5164125

>>5164118
**Her eyes were completely blocked. It's impossible for her to carry out a murder like that**

>> No.5164160

>>5164125

It wasn't murder. The gun accidentally went off.

>> No.5164164

Why is Umineko's art so shitty?

>> No.5164181

>>5164164

Because R07 can't draw.

>> No.5164214

Maybe she shoot but it didn't kill battler?she could be shooting something behind him, like happens in lots of series. Author make you believe that random person is bad, then when it looks like that person is going to kill someone with a gun, for example, the person is just shooting something behind him/her, like the real culprit.

>> No.5164218
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5164218

>> No.5165866

>>5160034
EP 4, Okonogi hints that Eva wouldn't kill husband and son. Implies she killed someone (at least Battler), she probably didn't kill Rosa and Maria, as she was at least partially ill at the time (witnessed by Krauss and the other relatives), since Kyrie found Hideyoshi's cigarette we know that Hideyoshi was smoking, Battler assumes that the butt was in an ashtray, but all we know is that it is Hideyoshi's. So, what if Hideyoshi, mad at Maria and Rosa for disturbing Eva, follows them out, tries to stop Rosa from beating Maria, ends up pushing Rosa back so that she trips into the fence, and bit know his own strength in the panic, strangles Maria while trying to keep her quiet. So, no Eva killing there. Then, once Kyrie, Rudolf and Hideyoshi get to the mansion, they question him, and, reflecting the magic scene shown, Hideyoshi gets Rudolf to fire at Kyrie and vice verca. Then, to kill Hideyoshi. After George sees Shannon, he beleives that he can revive Shannon, by blood. Again, from the magic scene we see Hideyoshi pleading to a relative, but this time it's his son. So, George kills his father, returns to ressurect Shannon, and fails. Relizeing that he killed his father for no reason, he searches for a way to undo what he did, in a frenzy, he trips over the knight statue and peirces the lance. So, again, no Eva. Eva was with Battler so Eva didn't kill Jessica or Nanjo, so the only person Eva killed was Battler/end theory/

>> No.5166090

>>5165866
Hideyoshi said in red concerning the murder of Rosa and Maria:
**I was in the room the whole time. Both before and after the time period of the crime.**

>> No.5166113
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5166113

>>5165866
I don't buy the cigerette identifaction, it's not in red for starters, not to mention the other werid shit found with it.

>> No.5166130

>>5166113
>not in red
What? It's an evidence found by detective, it have to be genuine.

>> No.5166771

Fucking idiots playing detective....

>> No.5167764

>>5165866
IF that's the true, it would be a sad, sad solution...

And doesn't explain why Old Eva snapped at Ange like that ("YOU WILL NEVER KNOW THE TRUTH!") and shit.

>> No.5167778

>>5166090
Guy from >>5165866 here

Dang, was watching the anime too much. Well, to begin, that can't be true, he obviously can't be there while they were all reading the letter from Beatrice. So he wasn't always in the room before, and since that is false it can be assumed the other end is false as well, but taking it to mean before and after the crime of the 2nd twilight ok, how about this revision (revision following if space allows)

>> No.5167784

>>5167778
Nanjo did the 2nd twilight, he is no where to be seen during the vast majority of the whole situation, and was blackmailed into the murders for his grandson's safety by Beatrice (whoever that is), Nanjo consoled Maria, and, quietly as instructed by "Beatrice" told Maria about the Golden Land and how everything would be fine, Nanjo burst up, stunning Rosa and knocking the gun out of her hand and rammed her head through the fencepost. Afterward, he killed Maria, who was begging to be taken to the Golden Land. As far as the explanation for the magic scene, Nanjo was talking about Beatrice to Maria, therefore he was representing Beatrice, however, Maria recognized that this was not the real Beatrice, and Nanjo is not, otherwise he wouldn't murder. The various and grotesque ways Eva-Trice is shown killing may mean a few things, the first is that Eva-Trice of ep 3 is the Beatrice of ep 2 (terrible taste), or, Nanjo is Eva-Trice, Nanjo is shown to be a lover of mystery, so its assumed he knows several ways how to kill a person, and lastly, Eva-Trice is related to Eva, may not be a blood relation, but is related to effect Eva, IE, Hideyoshi begged Eva-Trice to give back Eva, Eva felt like she was being stolen, really, the more I type this, the more Eva sounds like Krauss in EP 5, but anyhow, Nanjo did the 2nd twilight on Beatrice's orders. Rudolf discovered the murders and went to check on Eva/Hideyoshi he saw only Hideyoshi's cigarette butt and took it to Kyrie, figuring she'd know what to do. Everything else can stay the same, it just makes Hideyoshi's death a little more tragic because hes not a killer until he gets Rudolf and Kyrie.

>> No.5167790

>>5167784
Also, another, easier route, is to just go around his red. So, what he said was (from game script:I was in the room the whole time. Both before and after the time period of the crime.) As we've seen in 4, the way you word red truth really matters. So, he was in the room the whole time, yup it's in red. The issue is he was in the room the whole time, before and after the crime, during the crime, he was outside, committing the crime, he then returned to nursing Eva. /end theory correction/

>> No.5167827

>>5167790
this

>> No.5167837

>>5166113
For one thing, just because the cigarette butt was in the room doesn't mean that Hideyoshi smoked it during the period he was giving Eva an alibi. For all we know, he smoked it the previous day.

>> No.5167848

>>5167764
It should, because Eva figured it out, hence her mental distress. I mean, how would you feel if you figured out your husband and son were murderers (hinted that she figured it out as she solved the Epitaph, after all, she felt like she was losing herself each time Eva-Trice appeared, Eva-Trice appeared each time her family members were killed, and (having not actually played ep 6) I think that might be the case in that as well. It would be a tragedy, but looking at 07's other work in the When They Cry series, Takano had it pretty freakin bad, but she was still the villain. Similarly, even though Eva lost her son and husband, she still killed Battler

>> No.5167869

>>5167848
curiosuly enough, then Battler died believing the culprit had been Eva.

How does your theory explain Nanjo's death?

>> No.5167896

>>5160128
Despite the fact that this thread is pretty terrible, I'd like to say that I agree that it seems likely that the main culprit got killed in E3 1st twilight. It's subtly different from the others in what actually happens, and of course the fantasy scenes are completely different, what with Evatrice and all.

>> No.5167942

>>5167837
Everything presented should be accepted as a clue. I mean, looking at Higurashi, if K1 had given Mion that freakin doll... But, breaking it down, handkerchief, ok, most people carry those from my knowledge. Tissue, this one interests me, Eva wasn't feeling well, we've established that, so who is the most likely to have need of a tissue, Eva. This furthers Kyrie's reasoning that Eva was the culprit, Rudolf likely gave it to her as well. Key to house..., could make something of it, but that would have almost no basis. Boat ticket that I'm going to assume is from the boat they got here on, lighter, because Rudolf smokes, the butt we've discussed, and a 100 yen coin, symbol that Kyrie is sensible, because you never know when you need a dollar.

>> No.5167952

Or they really are both innocent.
So you just have to think: Why did Kyrie have a cigarette butt in her pocket?
Kyrie is a very suspicious person given her actions in the first four episodes.

Let's say that Eva and Hideyoshi is innocent, we know that Kyrie desire to go to the mansion wasn't for food or whatever but for an unexplained reason, and Kyrie has a cigarette butt in her pocket.
But we don't know where she found it.
Suggestion 1:
Kyrie or Rudolf killed Rosa and Maria, later Kyrie found a cigarette butt outside and realized that Hideyoshi could have seen the scene, she decides to trap him with Rudolf.

Suggestion 2:
Same thing, except Hideyoshi stayed in the room and Eva went outside and saw the scene.
Kyrie really found the cigarette butt in the room and deducted that Eva could have went outside and saw everything.
The way Eva reacted was because she was afraid for her life, at least it could be what Kyrie thought.
Since she couldn't get to Eva, she decided to trap Hideyoshi with Rudolf, maybe to see if he knew anything or to take them one at a time.

>> No.5168022

Eva probably killed the mastermind behind the murders and hijacked that shit.

>> No.5168049

>>5167869
This is the tough one, and I'm borrowing from I think S-Sol's theory on Animesuki, but Kyrie lived through her "death". Nanjo, being in league with Beatrice, declared her dead and wrote her off. Kyrie didn't like this, and after seeing Nanjo with a blinded Jessica, assumed he was going to "misdiagnose" her. Pulled her stake out, stabbed Nanjo and died. This gets through Eva-Trice's red, at the time, Kyrie was dead. The time being at the end of the time Nanjo died. After all, there's only some much blood you can lose. I have no hard evidence to back this up other than the idea that in EP4, Ange received the same notice Nanjo's son did, which linked Nanjo and Kyrie at least that much. We are only shown three characters that receive such letters, if Ange properly investigated (and she should have since she had the means) should would have found more, but she didn't. Which means another reason could be that when Kyrie was misdiagnosed by Nanjo, she though he was behind mailing. Why else would he call her dead, she probably figured. And then when she came upon him and an injured Jessica, there it is. /end possible explanation/

>> No.5168090

>>5168049
actually, "injured not death went to kill him and then died" thoery I had heard, but it's nice to know someone was actually capable of pulling it out.

So it's Hide+Nanjo+Original Beatrice the culprits?

>> No.5168104

>>5167952
Could work, but doesn't explain the meta aspect. For example, Kyrie nor Rudolf know about the real Beatrice, but Maria clearly was pleased to encounter Beatrice, then distressed that it was not the Beatrice she knew.

>> No.5168119

>>5164114
Remember that after the 12' o clock, witnesses don't count for shit.

Still, considering what she said about the Wolf and Sheep thing, I believe that, since Battler was (appereantly) the only one left, she was sure that he was the culprit and, thus, killed him.

>> No.5168265

>>5168090
As far as the actual stakes go, ep 5 says they were made in Brooklyn, and Rudolf and Kyrie are having problems in America. But, more realistically, its been established that its really hard to kill someone with one of the stakes, and the likely thing is that the stake didn't go all they way into Kyrie, leaving enough of the handle and end of the stake visible enough to see the design is like a drill. Twist it out and it should be easy, if extremely painful and leaving you with little blood.

The culprit is Original Beatrice, who I still have no idea. She obviously has sway with the servants, hence all of their deaths, and Nanjo is a servant, a guest, but a servant. Original Beatrice was able kill the servants, then using that threat, control Nanjo, who aided her. Hideyoshi, while a killer, was unintentional. Hideyoshi is never shown to be anything more than a fun loving, caring guy. Thats why he begged George to stop (George being Evatrice that Hideyoshi talked to). Hideyoshi was just in for the ride, caught up in the deaths, Kyrie found him out and, as he didn't want to die, kileld Kyrie/Rudolf (Meta scene with Belphagor and Evatrice, Belphagor died to protect Eva-Trice, but, rather than ending up like Belphagor caught in the middle of Evatrice and Rudolf, Hideyoshi got out of the way of Kyrie and Rudolf, who shot each other. After that, George walks in, heartbroken over Shannon, sees his dad next to dead bodies, snaps, kills his dad (Hideyoshi begging Eva-Trice) and then dies accidentally in his madness.
(continued next due to text length)

>> No.5168273

>>5168265
So, essentially, its all a tragic accident, which is what Battler wants to believe. Note: This does not offer explanations for the Seistas. As noted in ep5, they are related to the crimes. I was about to re-read ep1-4 before this topic, so maybe after I'll have a better hint, but as of now, I got nothin, they might be co-conspirators with Beatrice, but I don't really want to make the Seistas or Stakes people, because if its really that easy, it shouldn't be a mystery.

>> No.5168666

>>5168273
(could use verification for this, if I'm wrong, I want to know so I'm not using a false premise for future ideas)

>> No.5168819

>>5168666
nice triple get.

But the Siestas are Maria's bunny figures, what relation could they have with the crimes? They represent Sniper Rifles?

>> No.5168867

Jessica is the culprit
anything after episode one doesn't count

>> No.5169123

>>5168819
Thats what I thought as well, I mean even one of the Seistas is dead, as well as one of Maria's rabbits, but according to ep 5, they were investigating them as weapons. I guess It could be said that they were just using "a character" to represent what was occurring, but I'm not for sure.
>>5168867
If nothing after EP 1 counted, I was going to go with Battler is actually Dante.

>>
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