Touhou Fanon vs. Canon

[Anonymous No.]

Is there a fanon depiction of a 2hu you like more then canon?

[Anonymous No.]

I think I like the Seiran we had in the fanbase before UDoALG more than the one presented there, because it made her a fightfag, made it so she doesn't know Ringo well at all, and aside from giving us her crying because she wound up in Hell, I don't think it added much of interest.

[Anonymous No.]

Touhou characters have barely any canon personality to begin with

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Any Aya that gets bullied is a good Aya

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874195
They have plenty of personality if you read any of the print materials

Well those who get screentime do

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Shinki
because I have a mom fetish

[Anonymous No.]

I don't know about the best but Kaguya, Tenshi and Eiki have the worst fanon depictions in my opinion.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874661
Agreed. Also, while I don't think it's anywhere near as awful, I don't think anyone has managed to get Patchouli to the level that ZUN writes her. They always forget some crucial element.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874661
I know Tewi also tends to have her later stuff ignored, 99% of the time works involving her stick to her initial description in the IN Omake as being a fairy like youkai.
Of course they usually omit the shyness, but I think I've only seen Zounose do a shy Tewi when she interacted with Kanako.
Heck I don't even think ZUN has Tewi be that shy, excluding her high stealth capabilities.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
What's the joke in that image I don't get it

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875636
Canon Aya meets fanon Aya

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875636
Fanon Aya is a deeply unserious person

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Well, in my personal (and thus objectively correct) opinion, Fanon > Canon if you go by highest highs, but the other way around if you go by lowest lows (with few exceptions).

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875708
Is there any real difference between canon and fanon Ran? She's basically just the same mommyhu there.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
I liked fanon Shinmyoumaru a lot more than the canon Shinmyoumaru we saw in the mangas, fanon usually depicted her as a very pure-hearted, kind reclusive princess who was gaslit by Seija into using her power to start an incident because she had been tricked into believing the weak were being oppressed.

Canon Shinmyoumaru just behaves like an annoying brat and doesn't show the slightest remorse for what she did, nor any resentment for Seija.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875708
I'd move Joon and Shion into better in canon because fanon just makes shion even more pity bait than she is in canon and joon into a piece of shit when in reality they're like a comedy crime duo who'll still go to bat for each other

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875715
Sometimes it's less about the difference in personality and more about the difference in depiction and plots.
For example, Fanon Keine or Sekibanki are not that different from Canon, except writers actually do something interesting with them.
>>46875763
I like both versions, so I've put them in both.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875708
>Sakuya
>Equally Good
Yeah no, canon Sakuya is far superior to any fanon versions I,ve seen, be they the "pedo" one that pervs on Remilia, the emotionless perfect maid one or otherwise.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875708
How do you determine some of these? Because like, Enoko for example doesn't really appear enough in fanworks, and the one she does kind of stick closely to canon (well as far as her relationship with Marisa goes anyway), so she doesn't really have a fanon personality to compare.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875875
One of my favourite moments of Sakuya is at the end of IN, where when Remilia asked her to make preparations and look into how to build a rocket so that they can fly to the moon, Sakuya told her to fuck off and learn the definition of a maid.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
It really depends, the more popular 2hus such as Reimu, Sakuya or Marisa have mutiple fanon versions so you have to pick and chose with them

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875877
Right, I misplaced some characters. Now it's fixed.
It is a bit vague. Those whose personalities are similiar are often put into "Both" categories, but they can also be there if I just like all interpretations.
There must be a better way of doing this.
>>46875875
I don't read yuri, so I've no clue about those inferior depictions.
Canon Sakuya's only (although large) boon is that's she's one of the few characters that's consistently funny. Otherwise I'd put her into "Better in Fanon" 'cause without that she's rather boring.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874661
>Tenshi
Doesn't the whole "Tenshi is a masochistic" thing come from "The Grimoire of Marisa" where Marisa rated one of her spell cards as such dispite the fact that said Spell Card specifically makes it so "where she becomes unable to feel any pain"?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876088
>Tenshi is a masochistic
Be thankful that Hisami took away that trait from her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875986
Rumia is a bit odd since I tend to see two different fanon versions of her, one which is used in grim doujins who can kills humans effortlessly in order to show how weak humans are compared to youkai and another who'd a friend of the Cirno, the fairies, and sometimes the grassroots network.
Neither really tend to ply into her sicklyness that much, but she doesn't have much going on in canon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876088
Wasn't it way back during her debut in SWR? Something about her enjoying the fight with other girls that somehow got twisted into her being an M.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876631
she had a line that was something like 'you'd better punish me if you don't want gensokyo to be destroyed.' which is her goading the protagonist into fighting her, but it's not exactly her being a masochist as much as it is her wanting a good fight

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876663
The line between a battle junkie and a masochist is a thin one.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876344
>Neither really tend to ply into her sicklyness
Hasn't she only appeared in Eosd? I never got a sickly feeling from her, just a more carefree kind of girl with a simple mind.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876794
In the printworks she's mentioned to be sickly and weak, with even villagers and outsiders being able to beat her up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876821
fake news

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876821
Which one would that be? I don't remember rumia having any real appearances even in fairy manga.
I thought she was ineffective because the whole 'can't see where they're going' and 'being sealed' thing

[Anonymous No.]

Lily White truly is one of the characters of all time

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876842
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Bohemian_Archive_in_Japanese_Red/Rumia

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876842
Page 46 and 47 of BAiJR

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Someone hasn't kept up with the written works.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876858
>>46876856
All that says is that she avoids the sun because like lots of youkai, she's weak in sunlight. Unless you mean the 'you have a definency of some kind' line, which seems more like banter than something meaningful

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876970
this guys is stupid

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876970
this guy is stupid

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
I still can't believe this is canon

[Anonymous No.]

>>46878064
>>46876917
Qrd?
>>46874100
Youmu.
In fanon, she is portrayed as a more serious character, closer to the games, still simple minded and straight foward in her thinking while being clumsy and not getting Yuyuko, but shes not Utsuho levels of no brain like she has been portrayed in the recent mangas.
Although one thing I DONT like is that she is often portrayed with only one sword.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875708
I WONDER
WHAT KIND OF HAG
IS BEHIND THIS POST

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Yukari. She's been a punching bag in Canon, and I like the idea that she's terrible at speaking with people where she falls back on saying cryptic bullshit to cover that she's just incapable of being forward. Not that she's a complete pushover, if it absolutely comes down to it I think she can kick some ass.
Mima too because there's no other option.
>>46874661
I like Kaguya and Mokou's canon depiction and relationship better. They're mellowed out. I like that Kaguya is outgoing and carefree seeing that she no longer needs to hide away in Eientei. Tenshi's in a weird spot, canon did a number on her between the fighting games. She's an overconfident attention seeker. Eiki being depicted as naggy is a crime, people only dislike her because the truth hurts and she goes into detail which also takes a while, but she really wants people to improve and be the best they can be and her lectures are absolutely worth listening to. On the otherhand I refuse to see her as anything but short.
>>46879052
It's an illustration for Alternative Facts in Eastern Utopia. It's also where the Kirisame Magic Shop ad came from. Simply put, Tengu are very lewd creatures.
https://mangadex.org/chapter/b52b5d89-5618-4a45-a5ed-ec1f5426ef9b/1
>one sword
Yeah I hate that too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
A few, though they tend to be rare. Mostly based around actually having a backstory. Like, I prefer most depictions of Sanea that actually make her a character. Even if it's just by giving her a tragic past.


Also, and this was technically canon, but I prefer old school shy Nitori. She's just kind of a unpleasant bitch nowadays, and not even really in a fun way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875800
>except writers actually do something interesting with them.
Let me correct that for you:

They do something with them.

[Anonymous No.]

Karaagetarou's Nitori is best Nitori.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
lmaoing at all the people arguing in the comments on Danbooru

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
Why is this a thing that is canon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
Considering the tabloid was meant to be distributed mainly to the human village, does this mean tengu women knows how desirable they are to human men?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46879247
That's a pretty good article, honestly for mow much I disagree with Aya and think her yellow journalism is rotten I can't help but feel bad for her.
Stuck in an overly hierachiel society where she'll never rise through the ranks because she was born in the wrong caste.
Seeing the Tengu, especially Momiji complain about their bosses and jobs is nice, and Momiji has a point, Youkai Mountain is dangerous enough without the patrol and most Tengu are far stronger than a villager so why do they even patrol?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876990
I must be stupid too I don't know how anyone gets sickly and weak from those pages. Is the translation wrong or something?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Problem a long of secondaries run into when they get into the canon personalities is that most Touhou’s are unlikeable shitheads with no redeemable qualities other than how hit they are, so fanon interpretations try to woobify them too much to try to make them more appealing.

Like it says a lot that people get mad when “fanon” depicts Flanders as a psycho who craves destruction instead of a sweet little cinnamon roll with no friends, only for her first print work appearance in like 10 years to be like…

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881170
That scared Marisa is way too cute...

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881170
>Like it says a lot that people get mad when “fanon” depicts Flanders as a psycho who craves destruction
Tbf most of fanon psycho Flan depicts her as some sort of "nuclear baby" who's barely sapient enough to know what she's doing, while canon psycho Flan is more like Vegeta's arrogant ass where she's not actively stirring shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881282
Mariscared

[Anonymous No.]

Fanon is better because most 2hus in canon have little or no paizurers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881170
Is she the messiah?

[Anonymous No.]

fanon > canon

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Not so much fanon over canon, since she barely ever gets speaking roles in canon, but Okuu has a bunch of interesting dynamics beyond just "lol dumb bird" that canon works don't really bother with but fan works pry into on occasion.

What's the relationship between her and the god stuck in her chest? - is the Yatagarasu still alive, can she talk with it, how do they feel about each other, or is it dead and the power has fallen wholly into Utsuho's hands? How does the rest of Former Hell, esp. the Komeiji 'family', feel about her new power? What exactly prompted the gods of Moriya Shrine to give her this power? Did they know her before, and if so did the Komeijis know about this relationship? etc.
>>46875986
I'm going to mail horse semen to your mother's house

[Anonymous No.]

>>46880909
>Stuck in an overly hierachiel society where she'll never rise through the ranks because she was born in the wrong caste.
A thousand years old, and STILL stuck writing garbage newspapers. I feel bad for her. She has to have a very strong will to put up with the soul crushing work and static hierarchy for that long, this could be down to that she's a Tengu and is predisposed to deal with it like how the chinese are perfectly content to be the human equivalent of an ant colony, but I still feel for her. If I were in her shoes I'd either go full Kaczynski or drown myself in the ravine before the first century was out.

Even if you've become very powerful, that means nothing and if you're a low caste like the Crow Tengu you can go fuck yourself. Spellcard rules may exist as the universal equalizer, but that only further devalues your strength and it's also circumvented by the power of the bureaucratic engine and the press. You really can pinpoint the exact moment her heart rips in half as she's forced to face the reality that she's powerless. She gave it her all trying to solve that incident only to be punched down like this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881755
>what exactly prompted the gods of Moriya Shrine to give her this power?
please actually play the games

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881776
I think crow tengu as a whole are higher caste, especially compared to white wolves. They can go anywhere and more or less do what they want while the white wolves aren't even allowed to leave the mountain

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881776
>Even if you've become very powerfu
The thing with Aya is that she IS very powerful to the point where she defeats people on accident. The whole fastest in Gensokyo thing isn't just a boast but a statement even Reimu and Marisa agree with. Plus even Yukari sees her how strong she is and offered her to become her Shikigami alongside Ran. After all these years, she's still the strongest Tengu we've seen so far dispite being the first one to be introduced.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881786
Fuck you, the games barely touch on it apart from the most perfunctory "Kanako has this god juice she needs to put it somewhere; oh look here's a particularly dumb hell raven, perfect". There's a huge amount left undiscussed

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881882
no, secondary-kun, the games tell you what she is, why she did it, and who was involved, and then SoPM tells you why she picked okuu, what her end goal was, and what she's planning
please do not get angry when you don't know what you're talking about

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881868
She is powerful, which is why it's all the more devastating when you know that it means jack diddly squat in the context of Tengu society. It's a cruel irony that despite her immense power and speed, she's still a caged bird. Cant help but sympathize.

>>46881886
It's all pretty well spelled out in the accompanying text files in SA.

"——The Kappas' Energy Revolution

The plan by this name has safely concluded its first phase and is on its way
towards practical implementation.

The plan involved using the now-dormant Blazing Hell as a super-high temperature
furnace in an attempt to tame a power that it is said the outside world won't
attain for hundreds of years: nuclear fusion energy.

The first step was to find an exemplary hell raven.
Then, to bestow upon it the personification of the sun, Yatagarasu.
Then, to rekindle the flames of the Remains of Blazing Hell.
Then, to tame the crow.

The geyser was proof of the plan's success.

Unlike fission energy, fusion reactions are less likely to go out of control. In
addition, it doesn't create such lethal waste.
So, because it is very safe and produces massive amounts of energy, it is an
almost dream-like energy production method."

SoPM just adds extra details to the why, mainly that because the leftover power coming from the outside is getting smaller so they need a domestic solution.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
all of them, since fanon and canon aren't mutually exclusive
if someone puts real genuine effort into making a character dynamic and interesting, then it is good
touhou gets hit with it a lot because it has both a shitload of characters and most of those characters have been flat out forgotten by ZUN
Someone's gotta flesh them out, let it be writefags

Fanon Momiji is always better because canon Momiji barely has fucking anything at all

[Anonymous No.]

>>46880882
they must, since they're the ones that shapeshifted themselves into these attractive forms
Just because humans aren't supposed to yearn after yooks doesn't mean the yooks don't like feeling pretty

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881170
It depends on what you mean by psycho, is flandre acting like a chuuni? Yes, but I don't think she's acting like she's psychotic or has anti-social personality disorder.
She neither goes out of her way to hurt people for it's own sake and of her own volition and is aware of her own and other people's strength.
She's not some mad dog barely held in line my Remilia or some wooby trapped in the basement because she's dangerous.
A fanon Flandre wouldn't have stopped and would've killed Marisa without intervention or never joined up with Yukari at all.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46882393
anyone who calls canon flan a psycho is a complete retard when that's the same girl who let byakuren cheap shot her and throw her through a building because she was trying to move the fight outside so shou could use her pagoda
psycho flan is completely incompatible with the flan we've seen in CDS and 17.5

[Anonymous No.]

>>46882412
If anything, she has some symptoms that match the diagnosis of histrionic personality disorder. But it's Touhou, so there's no point in delving too deep with that train of thought because she'll just change in the next installment when Zun fails to keep her consistent (along with everyone else).

[Anonymous No.]

>>46883934
ZUN rarely done that, and in the cases he does it's usually because a 2hu doesn't have much characterization in the first place, a key example being Tewi in IN.
Most of the time people say ZUN has changed a character is because their more familiar with fanon like Nitori being shy or Koishi being a pure nice girl.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46884362
He does, he's just grown more subtle and light-handed the further his world has gone on. Am example is the extremely hard reboot from the pc-98 world, then further reboot/change with the backstories of the SDM crew that later never saw the light of day. As for a character not having much to go by on the first place, Flan met that criteria, and Zun said so himself when he made her-she was an afterthought akin to "cool secret boss that was radically different from the rest of the game" like the older ones he played growing up. It's only that she became fleshed out later. Even though he may have went off the initial framework he had planned, to say he wasn't influenced slightly by his own fan theories worksheet be completely accurate. But that's part of the world's charm, in that even our favorite characters are living beings that can, and do, grow and change, and that includes their mindset. The problem we have with cinnamon bun Flan vs. psychosocial Flan, is that she's both a little girl and a long lived woman, trapped in the mindset of a predatory species. The ones that treat her more like a housecat are the ones that get the closest to capturing what "Flandre Scarlet" actually embodies-totally harmless and relaxed, likes to spend time with others just as much as she likes her solitude, but God help whatever fuzzy thing catches her eye as it darts across the floor at 3am.

As for things like Tewi, Nitori, and Koishi, while I do agree with you about the fanon aspects, they have both changed by his hand from the earlier works. Is this inconsistency with characterization, or is it showing that these characters have more than two layers, or is it going the "Reimu acts different because it's from the point of view of different people and that's how they see her" type of thing? Only a man, his beer, and his maybe real-maybe not guest with the fox and cat pet that show up when his wife isn't looking may ever truly know.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46884362
>their more familiar with fanon like ... Koishi being a pure nice girl.
I feel as most understand Koishi's charm as an impulsive nut and not just the fact that she's so upbeat. Probably have her dialog in Urban Legends in Limbo to thank for that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46882393
>>46882412
I mean her fight with Marisa shows she absolutely enjoys fighting people and hurting people for the sake of it, even if she has an alterior motive in mind as well. Her entire fight in 17.5 is also her indulging her ability to have a challenge and destroy something that someone cant destroy.

Thats honestly not even that far off a lot of canon interpretations of her character, especially in CDS. Just because she's able to show a bit of reason and follow through with a plan doesn't mean she ain't fucking nuts.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874661
Add Fanon Alice to that and I agree with it

[Anonymous No.]

>>46885694
There's a difference between enjoying fighting and being an uncontrolable monster, for instance in both of those cases she doesn't go out of her way to cause trouble and fight people for the sake of it without some upset.
That's way more subdued than most of the trouble causing Youkai and fight fags like Tenshi who go out of their way to cause trouble.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874170
Aw what a cute image, I've never seen Seiran drawn with her mom before, I guess I'll go find the sauce!
https://danbooru.donmai.us/posts/7553152
Nevermind. Kill yourself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46885952
I found it on twitter and wouldn't have known it was holoshit without it being tagged as such so I don't care

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
>>Is there a fanon depiction of a 2hu you like more then canon?

Sanae being a loose JK

[Anonymous No.]

>>46885694
Flan can "destroy" me any time

[Anonymous No.]

>>46884576
Thinking about it, Flan is quite like a cat.
Although I agree with certain characters, like in Tewi's case it's more like ZUN is revealing new things than contradicting old ones, I guess that would also make the shyness mentioned in her old IN omake more like reclusiveness.
She's not shy, she just has her own things going on so doesn't get involved in matters outside the bamboo forest much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46885952
Cute fanart is cute fanart, m8

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
No. ZUN may be a hack but the japs around him drawing his franchise somehow manage to be even bigger hacks.

[Anonymous No.]

Would normally say fanon Shou, but she got some great time in CDS. Bonus for ZUN remembering to show her temper.
>>46875730
The ideal Shinmy for me is somewhere in the middle even if most artists go for pure cute.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46889346
You know what would be great? If she learned how to use that spear instead of depending solely on the pagoda.
That would be rad.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46889377
Nah screw that, she should just drop both and go full tiger with her claws and teeth.

[Anonymous No.]

I like how Youmu is an air-headed dork in canon

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
Sex with Youmu

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
It's a universal fact.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
>>46890634
Youmu is retarded, but so is Yuyuko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46889377
You could say the spear is just for shou

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
I hate it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46889377
she uses it for one attack which she misses because she's a jobber

[Anonymous No.]

>>46891074
Thing is, Yuyuko is merely pretending to be retarded, since shes on par with Yukaris both 4D chess shenannigans and tremendous mental retardation.
Youmu is not pretending.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874307
Except there are different personalities in different print works

[Anonymous No.]

>>46893739
Leave.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
A dork since the very beginning.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46885926
You can still be a psychotic and enjoy hurting/destroying people for fun and be able to control that impulse when it’s convenient. Even Fanon Flanders doesn’t automatically blow up Gensokyo every time she shows up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46891074
>Rocks are Rocks
Is this some "2smart4you" Pure land Mahayana Buddhism Koan right here?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46895996
Rocks are just rocks anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
I guess HRtP characters for starters since they don't talk and got forgotten even in MS.
>>46879052
>Although one thing I DONT like is that she is often portrayed with only one sword.
Usually nips keep more in mind that sword + dagger is the way to go, but still they forget it a lot... Although even in the fighters Roukaken becomes mostly a two handed sword and Hakurouken is barely used.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896098
>even in the fighters Roukaken becomes mostly a two handed sword and Hakurouken is barely used
Yeah I know, I wished people portrayed her using both swords at the same time more often, we have already several sword wielding characters, but Youmu is the only one that uses two, how annoying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896010
>Looks at rock garden
>Sees Koishi's face on all of them
>Blink
>Who the hell was that?
>... What am I talking about, again?
>turn to the others
>"Yeah, Youmu-the rocks are just rocks."
>(.... why does my head hurt? And where are my pants?)

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896348
Maybe writefaggotry was a mistake

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896616
You say that as if there's any possibility writefaggatory can't be a mistake.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896638
As if writing wasn't a mistake

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896697
>>46896638
>>46896616
Just kill all the fun, why don't you?
Fun Nazis.

Yuyuko thought it was funny.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896724
Go back.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896724
>Yuyuko
Speaking of, her fan interpretation is probably the closest to canon.
Beautiful, easy to get along with, knows things, but only brings up her knowledge when it's useful and not to brag, has a mischievous side, eats a ton...
Damnit, I think I'm in love.

[Anonymous No.]

lern to write
lern to use quotes correctly
use writefag threads for writefagging
lurk moar

>>46896786
be careful, death wont free you

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896786
I wish more fanworks would show how much of her personality loves trolling Youmu and lying to Youmu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896794
>be careful, death wont free you
It's funny, I think that's the case for like 90% of Touhou characters. Imagine rushing into danger to either escape from Yacchie's gang only to die and end up right back in her service but, as canon dictates, she will inevitably be faced with a situation she didn't plan and trip over herself for the next week. In hindsight, I really do love UDoALG for establish that trait.
>>46896813
>I wish more fanworks would show how much of her personality loves trolling Youmu and lying to Youmu.
Absolutely. Just imagine getting to make the little bob-head dork squirm every day, Yuyuko is the luckiest Touhou character by far.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896234
Her duel sword style is usually reserved for her ultimate attack, or desperation move.
Her double body technique is mostly ignored in general, which is funny considering how people like using Flan's four of a kind move.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896813
She's fun in Ten Desires.
"I doubt that some troublesome individual is about to make a return,
or that there's any secrets or anything in,
say, the cemetery behind the temple... "

"Hm?
A-anyway, I'll be off."

"Bring me back a souvenir!"

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896751
Go fuck yourself.
I never left.

>>46896786
>>46896895
She's also a secret mastermind playing a fool playing a mastermind.

>>46896794
^this guy blows goats. I have proof.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896902
>She's also a secret mastermind playing a fool playing a mastermind.
Now enough about Tewi and Suwako, how about we talk about Yuyuko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896894
I swear when I get good at drawing I will make sure to remark those 2 features of her, specially the double body one, I still find it weird that most people treat her phantom half as anything other than another her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46897094
In danbooru konpaku_youmu + dual_wielding has 91 pages and holding_sword has 124 so I guess dual wielding Youmu is drawn more than I initially thought.
The phantom clone feels underused tho, but some things of the fighters seem to get underused and others like Yukari's train get popular.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46896895
Tge problem I have with Yuyuko is that she talks nonsense most of the time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359

This is why Sanae/Youmu is my favorite pairing.

[Anonymous No.]

MY [headcanon] > your [headcanon] >>>>> actual canon
Simple as that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46898401
>MY [headcanon] > actual canon >>>>> your [headcanon]
FTFY

[Anonymous No.]

>>The phantom clone feels underused tho

Because in Imperishable Night it says that Youmu herself is human and the other "half" of her is a phantom. The other half isn't a clone, it's just a spirit/phantom.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46898421
The cloning technique is also not unique to her. The fighting and phantasmagoria games implies it's something most characters can do. Marisa calls it visualization practice or image training, Patchouli calls it image-splitting, Remilia calls it an afterimage, Ran calls it shikigami practice, Suwako says Gods can split themselves infinitely, list goes on. I think Aunn is the only one where it's something unique to her since being two places at once is a defined trait.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
Honestly I can relate to this scene.

[Anonymous No.]

Everyone from UM basically has nothing to go off of for cannon personalities

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902220
sannyo's had multiple manga appearances (not a sentence I thought I'd be typing in 2021) and while megumu only had one manga appearance, she did get to do a fair bit during it. Tsukasa obviously has two games worth of material to draw from and a wide range of interactions, and while chimata did get an appearance in 18.5 and in LE, she didn't feel like she was any more fleshed out there.
Mike, Takane, Misumaru, and Momoyo are dead in the water unless ZUN actually uses them again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902371
Green nitori is never being used again lmao yamawaro literally don’t matter as much as kappa only thing they did was make the arieal tram way for Moirya shrine that’s it good riddance

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902398
kappa hands typed this post

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902371
I fell like Takane gets a lot of disproportionate love when compared to her few appearances and other newhus, but Momoyo is such a shame.
A practically naked tomboy insect princess, hope she shows up again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902415
>Takane gets a lot of disproportionate love
This is news to me I always thought she was forgotten like the rest of the new early stage bosses

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902489
I've seen her here in a few threads, but not much elsewhere, probably just a few dedicated Takane fags.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902415
the fact that there weren't more people drawing her in a cute frilly dress is absolutely tragic

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902693
Tomboy's being embarrassed while wearing frilly dresses is top tier, of course there's only so much people can go off of from one appearance.
But I like to imagine she's weak to romance and such, it's a cute trait for tough girls to have.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902398
t.

[Anonymous No.]

I actually wonder how blurry the line between Canon and Fanon is. I mean ZUN probably has intial ideas of what his characters would do/think but I want to know how much of it were influence by fanon stuff.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46903723
for ZUN himself I think it's just when something comes to his attention in a way he can't ignore, like only realising that Flan had fans because he saw a drawing at her at his daughter's school. I think Cirno's wings becoming detached was probably something similar.
but for the artists he gets for the manga I think he just lets them incorporate more or less whatever he wants unless he sees something he doesn't agree with.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881776
>Kaczynski
Now I want someone to make a doujinshi where Aya becomes the Joker/Kacynski

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
only the fanon breast sizes

[Anonymous No.]

>>46898421
I guess calling it phantom human form would be clearer since the only phantom half clones are the one's when Youmu gets power items or in the fighters in lunatic.
>>46901088
I thought the Phantasmagoria was just a gameplay mechanic, although in PoDD you had Reimu being the only character that sends an orb as a boss instead of appearing herself.
There's also Heca aside from Aun with the multiple bodies but she doesn't really use it in game, gods iirc where said to be able to split their spirit indefinitely but only posses one body(except Heca I guess).
>>46903723
ZUN seems pretty lax on one hand with canon but seems to not like to be influenced by it on the other hand. I'm not sure if maybe he made Flan relevant again after keeping her silent for more than a decade might be him getting influenced by fanwork or if he just thought she would be perfect for the job in 17.5 and it was all his plan all along or just some drunk whim.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875730
>fanon usually depicted her as a very pure-hearted
She's still very pure hearted in canon, it's just that she well as ZUN puts it:
>The type who straightforwardly sees the world as evil and themselves as righteous.
She has absolute faith in her beliefs and won't stand for whatever tramples over them or tries to stop her.
Her crashing the danmaku firework festival because it was making a mockery of it really is my favourite beat of hers. While it is a bit of a mischievous act, it's done with pure intentions, it's not done with malice really.
She's so pure even her dream self wasn't much different from her real self (before the whole mix up bit, which is my least favourite beat, fuck that part).
I don't think she should show remorse for the DDC incident, she was quickly forgiven as she wasn't the main instigator (even in one of the endings, the other besides ReimuB where she is being punished are just her being bullied, she didn't even know about the mallet side effects), and while her perception of the strong/weak dynamic in Gensokyo was wrong, her belief stand. It's not like she now believes that the strong should trample on the weak, just that they aren't doing that.
Her relation with Seija is weird, in ISC it did seem like she was turning against her, but they're back to being friends in GoU. I guess allies are hard to come by for this tiny inchling... But well they seem to be good friends regardless, being used by Seija granted her the mallet, and they both share the same values.
Basically, I love this never-backing-down inchling! Fighting to the end for her beliefs, building a paradise for the weak!

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904198
The Shimmy of GoU isn't the same Shimmy of DDC.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904240
Anon, the whole point of a dream self is for you to inhabit it in your dreams. The only reason Shinmyoumaru and her dream self swap places is due to the Perfect Possession incident, and Jo'on and Shion round up all of the dream selves by the end of their route, presumably including the ones off-screen.
Even if they hadn't, dream Shinmyoumaru is still the same person as regular Shinmyoumaru.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904240
I just think she's in a different position. In DDC she's (thinks she's) fighting against the weak's oppressions, while in GoU she's free to lead her own "battles". Personnality wise, they seem very much alike.
Unless you mean literally because of the whole dream self shenanigans but this anon answered well >>46904251
Shimmy's ending also has her say she's unsure which one she started as, so even if they didn't clean them off off-screen, so you can always headcanon she's the original one. I know I am.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904198
I to this day still believe on the theory that says that the dream and real versions of her got switched, with the real staying trapped in the dream world and the dream world is stealing her life, thats the only explanation I have about why she still Seijas bestie, I really despise the toxic relation of those 2, even though I dont have anything against Shinmyoumaru.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904310
You just know Seija has used Shinmyoumaru as a dildo. Repeatedly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46898421
Its not about that shes its a clone, never implied it was, and hell, not even that shes the only one to do it, I just want more people to portray her ability to morph her phantom into another her and do crazy shit with it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874972
>I found CountFrogula's Patchouli in "The Keeper of Voile" quite accurate.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46902371
>Tsukasa obviously has two games worth of material to draw from and a wide range of interactions
which is hilarious because she's never actually the boss in either gameplay or her actual plots, to the point I'd say that ZUN making that perpetual midboss the most nefarious 2hu is his best joke.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904968
ZUN just loves his "all according to keikaku" characters. Why else do you think Mamizou made as much appearance as she has.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881536
Based megamanbro

[Anonymous No.]

>>46903738
>only realising that Flan had fans because he saw a drawing at her at his daughter's school
Woah, when was this?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46904524
Can't find that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46911629
https://archiveofourown.org/works/4145988/chapters/9352089
For weirdo names like that your first instinct should be to check fanfiction sites like AO3.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46911923
thankyu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46912107
Tenkyu?

[Anonymous No.]

God, I hate canon manga.
Literally the worst part of Touhou.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46924282
SSiB and Three Fairies are comfy.

[Anonymous No.]

These threads should be made more frequently, I want to discuss canon without having to interact with grimfags.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46925734
I think it was neat how SSiB's plot and resolution was that Yukari just really really wanted to fuck with Eirin

[Anonymous No.]

>>46926816
Says a lot that you can't have canon discussion without them unless it's about how fanon impacted the characters and setting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46927399
Check the archives, the last cannon thread, the one with the Kaguya op had people discussing canon itself without fanon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46927399
I really do not care whatsoever about what kind of package the thread is wrapped in, I want to talk about canon without it devolving in a slaughter fest about how Gensokyo is a fucking concentration camp and about how 100% of the characters are irredeemable fucks with no exception.
Surely, thats not hard to understand.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46925734
SSiB and Sangetsusei were the only good ones.
>>46927538
Blame ZUN for enabling grimshitters.
Imagine thinking on nothing but the most dull and uninspired parts of the setting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931125
this is why I just default to PMiSS lore because it's when the setting was more interesting

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931157
I just assume PMiSS is speaking from the perspective of the future where the chronicles are completed instead of assuming everything is a retcon. Now we can have your cake and eat it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931157
Right, everything about interactions wth youkai being "pretend" had much more unique tone than whatever Masqerade bullshit we've been having since WaHH.
Modern Touhou is just farcical Shinsekai Yori.
>>46931341
Given the direction of modern Touhou, it's hard for me to believe, though not impossible.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931359
I could believe it if I just assume that the end goal of LE is for humans to find out that youkai frequent the village a lot, so it becomes more of an open secret and eventually leads to the village being the way it is in PMiSS with youkai businesses and stores catering to youkai at night
it's amazing how much ZUN torpedoes his own lore sometimes. look at PMiSS misty lake vs the latest (the TTRPG flavor text he wrote and various comments in DS)
in PMiSS anglers go to the lake often, they fish there and there's youkai who hang around there to relax. flash forward to now, and the lake is completely devoid of fish apart from wakasagihime apparently, no one goes there apart from the fairies who live there like cirno, it faintly smells like blood, and anyone who tries to go there gets attacked by youkai on the way.
shit just made it a non-location for no real reason

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931341
>I just assume PMiSS is speaking from the perspective of the future where the chronicles
Akyuu being the one who wrote them wuld make this a little hard... How old is she in canon again?

>>46931157
I'm kind of curious where CDS will go about this, since it'll be exploring Gensokyo's past compared to its current state. Will the past be closer to what we had in PCB prologue, or something different? If ZUN does his usual thing of status quo, Mizuchi will have to back down somehow, will it be shown Gensokyo is actually all still pretend but just extreme LARP, so she'll be convinced to back down?
ZUN's reaffirmance of villagers not being killed period in CoLA is interesting considering how the village is portrayed in LE (for a recent work, you can still compare with FS and WaHH) where villagers are still seemingly scared for their lives, despite the fact no one should have died from youkai since the ban.
LE exploring Reimu's relation with youkai also souds interesting with the whole pretend angle. I really wonder how it'll go.
I think I might summon grimfags if I keep speaking like that, so I'll shut the fuck up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931430
>ZUN's reaffirmance of villagers not being killed period in CoLA is interesting
Yeah, interesting because it just contradicts earlier stuff so much. Like, part of Mokou's motivations for escorting villagers through the Bamboo Forest is so they wouldn't get killed by youkai, which obviously wouldn't be a problem if they never killed people to begin with.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931537
to be fair you could argue that mokou flat out just doesn't know. Rinnosuke probably only knows because yukari keeps hanging around at his store and he's weirdly knowledgeable about a lot of things like the hakurei god's name. Mokou keeps to herself in the forest 90% of the time and is never really curious about anything, so I could see her not knowing that the youkai don't actually kill anyone anymore

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931564
She lived there since forever, and she's been decently active for the past three hundred years.
I find it completely unbelievable that every single one of the youkai could reach a completely unanimous consensus that they shouldn't kill villagers and Mokou would be completely ignorant about it.
That's not the kind of thing that could ever remain a secret, especially since many would consider Mokou a youkai, too.
Plus, she's close to Keine, who is half-youkai, and would be privy to such knowledge as well.

It's just a retcon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931537
>>46931564
It's been shown multiple times in print works that not every youkai in Gensokyo understand or cares about the "not killing/hurting human villager" rules, especially the non-sapient animalistic/monstrous youkai

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931430
The past was probably more dangerous, Aya complains about it being less dangerous in CDS if I remember.
She's kind of a youkai boomer who wants things to go back to the good 'ol days before the spell card rules when humans were humans and youkai were youkai.
i.e they had a more antagonistic relationship and fought all the time.
Although even among her friends I don't think it's a popular position, Suika seems fine with humans and Mamizou tries to influence the villagers to be more open to youkai.
Which is why Miko moves against them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931686
I need all manga chapters that feature the yamawaro be it in name or they actually show up. This extends to all of the mangas I want to know more yamawaro information

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931838
Aya needs some forced breeding to chill out about humans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46936652
I volunteer for this task

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931838
>Mamizou tries to influence the villagers to be more open to youkai.
Her Canon and Fanon interpretations are pretty close. Damn Tanuki, stealing my food, but I can't get too mad because she's like a therapy animal...

[Anonymous No.]

>>46941510
Mamizou is a pretty hard character to mess up, characters which people have weird or wildly incorrect assumptions abut like Tewi and Kags either didn't have a lot around their first appearance or have their first appearance playing the part of a character.
Meanwhile a neweer 'hu lie Mamizou has a lot more on her more recently and acta fairly straighforward even if she's a mastermind type.
Compared to Tewi who's always acting and who's plots barely touch Gensokyo and thus we never see.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
i miss suppetenko

[Anonymous No.]

>>46944557
>Kags
Is this the 'gerou or 'guya?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46944599
'Guya of course, there's not much to Kagerou and if I remember correctly people mostly get her right.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46944633
>there's not much to Kagerou and if I remember correctly people mostly get her right
Speaking of, I think it's funny very few people remember she's supposed to be full-hairy kind of werewolf and not just get cute wolf ears and tail during full moon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46946099
she's a wolf regardless so she has the ears and tail all the time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46946099
I remember, I just choose to write her having extra bushy pubes during a full moon while being an attractive anime wolfgirl because that is my fetish.

[Anonymous No.]

I might be in a minority here but I like the NEET Kaguya fanon. It's fun and also literally me

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876851
Apparently she's really strong and sunny milk hates her because she's a freak of nature

[Anonymous No.]

>>46949043
Funny considering how Cirno is similarly a strong freak of nature by fairy standards yet the Three Fairies of Light are fine with her.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46950408
Cirno is too charismatic to be hates

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876631
Yea a throwaway line in Alice route kick started it iirc

[Anonymous No.]

>>46879350
This used to bother me too before an anon pointed out that in MoF she probably was just larping as a shy girl meek girl and pulling muh friendship with humans out of her ass so the protagonists would take care of Kanako.
At least that explains why she then goes on to act like.......that in the fightans.
Anyways I should check out her SA dialogue

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881791
Good momiji is for abuse

[Anonymous No.]

>>46956817
Personally, I like the idea that she was just timid in making friends at first

[Anonymous No.]

>>46949043
I understood it to be because Lily only ever shows up to announce spring, so she doesn't participate in typical fairy activities, by contrast, Cirno does do typical fairy things, like freezing frogs I guess, been a while since I read sangetsusei thought

[Anonymous No.]

>>46879052
>Qrd?
Aya being obsessed with panty shots is a lame meme that was at the peak of its popularity during the late 00s, being the culmination of jokes people used to make regarding Aya seemingly taking pictures from underneath the bosses during StB.
It's just a more forgettable incarnation of shitty "Sakuya pads" jokes, though at least the Aya jokes died eventually.

>>46875875
Sakuya fanon is a good metaphor for Touhou fanon as a whole. It usually goes either far too deep into edgy trash or far too deep into shallow cgdct jokes. People seem to struggle to find the balance that Touhou exists in.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46960057
Yeah these "jokes" that completely take over the character suck ass

[Anonymous No.]

>>46895996
Actually, the rocks that are spoken of are not rocks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46898416
>>MY [headcanon] > actual canon >>>>> your [headcanon] >>>>>>>>>>>>> collective [headcanon]
Fuck that, fuck you

[Anonymous No.]

>>46881327
THE PRINCESS OF ALL VAMPIRES FURANDORU-SAMA

[Anonymous No.]

>>46931686
Honestly, I really like this detail. It explains why the villagers are still wary of the youkai and fits well with the whole "balance" thing.

[Anonymous No.]

I am the only one in this thread that understands touhou characters

[Anonymous No.]

>>46966907
No one gets them, not even ZUN.

[Anonymous No.]

If nitori used to be shy and “nice” but later on is actually a complete cunt which makes one think she was putting up an act in MoF. how does the idea of Takane being portrayed as “rude” on the surface but turns out be a grounded and hospitable person sound?
A simpler way of explaining this would be this:
Nitori = fake nice and is actually a cunt
Takane = Comes of as rude but is actually reasonable and genuine person

[Anonymous No.]

>>46967262
her profile even says that the reason she's the de facto leader of the yamawaro is because she's SLIGHTLY nicer than the rest
>Takane is a leader-esque presence amongst the yamawaro.
>As for why? People say it's because she speaks just a tiny bit more politely than others of her kind.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46966931
Touhou characters don't even get Touhou characters

[Anonymous No.]

bump

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876851
what did she do?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46959020
Nah it's just straight up don't mess with her or be obliterated

[Anonymous No.]

>>46974666
didn't some kid from the village manage to catch her once and give her a hug but she told him to let her go so nothing bad happened to him because he did

[Anonymous No.]

>>46974684
Yeah that happened. My guess is that she knows that humans die permanently, unlike fairies,so she's way more gentle with them

[Anonymous No.]

>>46974684
when did that happen? Also imagine hugging lily white

[Anonymous No.]

>>46978888
PMiSS

[Anonymous No.]

>>46974666
>>46974684
It makes sense when you consider how her heralding arrival is depicted in a way that everything immediately blooms into the season as soon as she's on the scene. It gives this idea that she's the physical manifestation of spring in its purest and most powerful state, so to disrupt Lily is to disrupt nature itself in Gensokyo.
Thus, you better have a damn good reason to get in Lily's way like a season-related incident that plays into the greater picture of Gensokyo's balance to justify your actions, or you're potentially incurring nature's wrath.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46978908
I WANT TO TAME LILY WHITE

[Anonymous No.]

>>46974666
I love the idea of fairies being far more powerful than they appear to be if they were connected to a specific concept.
I remember Yukari saying something similar about Luna since she's connected to the moon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46979342
I think the way that presents itself is by Luna acting more 'human-like', she reads books, enjoys coffee which is apparently very rare for fairies, and generally has more common sense than some of the other fairies, and the moon (or moonlight) seems to be connected to youkai's power directly, even if Luna herself isn't really all that strong.
I guess the opposite is true for Cirno, where it's her actual strenght and not the concept of nature that she's associated with that puts her closest to becoming something other than a fairy

[Anonymous No.]

>>46980129
I like the idea that the ability she and the other three fairies of light have are actually more powerful than they know, but due to being fairies and never applying themselves they never meet their potential.
While Cirno's just a hard worker, well comparative to most other fairies.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
Why did Aya decide that was the best picture to put in a discussion about the unfairness in Tengu society?

[Anonymous No.]

>>46981693
sex sells

[Anonymous No.]

>>46981693
It is very common for tengu (a female-only species of yokai) to have sex with humans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46981693
See, that's how she gets ya.
Imagine, if you will, you sitting alone in a bar when suddenly you're approached by a raven-haired beauty. Within seconds she's sending you signals so obvious every patron can sense she has a very deep ache only you can soothe. As the night grows older, you escort the mysteriously alluring woman to your bedroom, when suddenly... BAM! 10 hour rant about society, her job, her bosses, everything. You HAVE to listen.
Such is the way for the wicked Youkai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46982077
Can't wait for Aya's anarchist joker storyline in the next manga

[Anonymous No.]

>>46981693
It works

[Anonymous No.]

>>46982077
If she throws in some tips on analogue photography I'll listen to whatever.
Hell, I don't even care about the sex anymore, if she wants to explain lenses and shit to me I'd sit there for a week, bathroom and food breaks permitting. Ayaya's 'tism on the subject is both cute and relatable.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46982077
Can I at least rub on her thighs

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876917
>Hatate

[Anonymous No.]

Nicetack's take on Koishi cracks me up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
I'll be honest, the fanon just feels more like 2hu kayfabe to me. Like the characters are just acting out a script in an attempt to appeal to a wider audience using the most repetitious, vapid gimmicks imaginable. And when you already know how the characters were originally intended or how
their temperament is so far removed from how they are(calm, laid-back character becomes nagging and thin-skinned), it kinda insults your intelligence. Because you know the author really wants to make their own OCs but play it safe, dressing them up in 2hu skins out of fear of them being a flop.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46986711
Can't relate. I came to hate canon to such an unreasonably high degree, that any deviations from it seem preferable, even objectively bad ones.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46986711
Maybe 10 years ago. Touhou isn't big enough anymore to be the go to franchise for fotm slop.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46987197
More like 14.
Such a golden time. Canon wasn't yet poisoned, and it didn't weigh on fanon as heavily as it is now...

[Anonymous No.]

>>46988242
Nobody's forcing fanworks to be canon compliant except for trolls and autists on here.
Also 2010 is when WaHH started, while CLiR, SSiB, PMiSS, and BAJiR already all eixisted.
I guess you'd exude FS, SoPM, AFiEU, FDS, Whale tits, and every game after fairy wars.
If you want to go even further back I think excluding everything past 2005 and only have the first windows era of characters, EoSD to PoFV is the classic era of touhou and predates any possible changes in directions of retcons with only the characters in their purest form, it also has a much smaller cast and is much more down to earth with lower stakes until IN which acts as the end of the trilogy of classic games and is still to this day considered one of the best Touhou games.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Any Aya that gets bullied is a good Aya

[Anonymous No.]

>>46986711
Well then the shit I have seen and the shit you have seen are wildly different, because in the fanfics I read the characters are just less assholes, thats it, besides that they behave like normal.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46995954
>the characters are just less assholes
Heh, not in my fanfics
(Not the guy you were talking to)

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
I like Cirno precisely because she's one of the few characters that is more-or-less consistent across both canon and fanon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46989504
>I guess you'd exude FS, SoPM, AFiEU, FDS, Whale tits, and every game after fairy wars.
Yes, that's the point, the printworks of this era are nails in old Touhou's coffin. I'd also put WaHH there, such a shitshow, almost to FS levels.
As for going further, that would basically be just re-starting with a clean slate, which, honestly, I kind of want to do one day.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46876851

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996111
What point would a reboot serve? There's already been one. If Zun wants to retcon stuff he can just do it, and if you have a specific vision of Gensokyo, you can easily just make it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996108
No she isn't.
Fanworks just make her retarded all the time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996138
Why did you think I was saying ZUN should do it? This is a fanon thread, of course I was just talking of my own version.
Besides, I don't want ZUN to rewrite anything - he'd just fuck it up more.

[Anonymous No.]

etc. etc.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996120
Cuteee

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996111
What exactly do you not like about the new print works, and why did they poison canon?
Honestly I think if you're going to reboot Touhou it's better to scrap everything after IN and PoFV

[Anonymous No.]

>>46998156
The largest offence that was commited by the new printworks was retconing/recontextualising of interesting PMiSS-era lore, replacing it with a generic Brave New World style dystopia. That alone is cyanide, and that's not even taking into account the general bad quality of the stories presented. It's like he tries to write the same mystery story over and over again, only for it to come out to be boring and pointless each and every time, with the only remotely interesting parts of it being somewhat dry mythology trivia. It would honestly be about as interesting to read about 2hus watching paint dry, if not more.
Multiply that across 14 years and you get modern Touhou - bland, boring shell of it's former self.
Keep in mind that I haven't re-read the printworks in a while and haven't read CDS and Lotus Eaters. This is deliberate, as I want to keep my mind clear for the future rewrite.

Also, don't know if this>>46989504 was you or not, but allow me to clarify this:
>it didn't weigh on fanon as heavily as it is now
What I meant was doujin and fanfic authors forcing themselves to be closer to canon. Back in the day, no one would retcon their work to fit with canon more. Interpretations of characters were also a lot more diverse. Not always good, but at least interesting. Nowadays, only old characters are allowed to have differing interpretations, newer ones are always too close too canon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874661
Fanon did Eiki so dirty, i hate it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46999641
It isn't much like BNW, 1984 is a better but still flawed comparison. BNW has lots of drug use, recreational sex even among children, and eugenics, the dystopia is pretty open to in BNW and they just send outsiders to their own shitty commune.
If anything Gensokyo is more like those tribes of humans kept as zoo exhibits in BNW than the society of BNW.
This is just me, but even with new characters I see a lot of fanon, Okina has her whole loli thing while everything past HSiFS is just too recent to have a lot on them. Even then, Okina isn't that popular when compared to her contemporaries except for her whole pedo thing.
For middle windows characters you still see a lot of variety, except for Kokoro who tends to be pretty homogeneous.
Do you have any specific or notable examples of characters being retconned to be more in line with canon?
But personally I don't have a problem with it either way, the only real Gensokyo is your personal Gensokyo and personal interpretations of the characters and I don't think ZUN takes Touhou too seriously, it's just his dream diary in game form, a personal art project which he makes money off of.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46999673
I much prefer her canon personality, but I will NEVER budge on her being short. It's gap moe, you have this very calm and mature person handing out judgements and lectures on how to live a virtuous life and the nature of things, but you have to look down to make eye contact because she's 4'2".

[Anonymous No.]

>>47002379
Perhaps we can compromise and give her a really big hat, instead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47002379
Alternatively, tall girls wearing miniskirts is cute.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996140
and?

[Anonymous No.]

>>47015560
He's just delusional, there's not much too Cirno and only fairy huffing retards think otherwise.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875986
>Canon Sakuya's only (although large) boon is that's she's one of the few characters that's consistently funny. Otherwise I'd put her into "Better in Fanon" 'cause without that she's rather boring
Then obviously you really haven't been paying attention, not like this isn't entirely just one's lazy bias anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
This is the prettiest I have ever seen Youmu drawn. It is almost uncanny because I don't normally associate her with being pretty, at least not like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47002379
She simply has the look of a short person if that makes sense.

[Anonymous No.]

With fanon, writer being a hack is a chance.
With canon, it's a certainty

[Anonymous No.]

>>47022752
Zun's style was just so much more inconsistent (drunk) back then, that it was hard to even tell the lolis(midgets) from the adults.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46875875
Canon Sakuya I think is difficult because her personality is so out there and hard to describe. She's hyper competent, but she's also an airhead, but she's also telling jokes yet no one in universe regards her as funny or even a joker.

Personally, I just interpret it as Sakuya having an awful sense of humor, but everyone else in Gensokyo has the mental image of Sakuya like she is in fanon (a serious and skilled maid) so they treat her as completely serious. Her trying to open the window of a rocket is one such example of her autistically bad sense of humor.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023627
I think of Sakuya as being a bit like my mom, where it's hard to tell when she's being careless and dumb, and when she's trying to tell a joke.
Made worse by the fact that she plays into peoples perceptions of her for her jokes and deals with young children so she'll sometimes try to explain simple things to people as if they're unaware of them and it's hard to tell if she's being serious of not.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46996289
Why is Tewi a Nigger

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023657
>>47023627
>Her trying to open the window of a rocket is one such example of her autistically bad sense of humor.
Yeah because the thing with the Sumiyoshi god or whatever that was keeping them safe in the rocket was already explained to her by Patchy, like not being weightless and still having air, so she knew. Also liked how Marisa thought Sakuya was dumb for leaving the burning oil in the detachable compartment yet
still managed to discover a utility function within her mini-Hakkero to heat the tea, that even she didn't know about (probably from when she """borrowed""" it from Marisa). So even Marisa can't really figure her out but with her powers making her occasionally 'airheaded' and her consciously playing that up on purpose
for giggles, is obviously made to be paradoxically on purpose, where you can never truly figure her out. As well as her also being a horrible troll, kinda reminds me of that asshole butler from Umineko. Could just be her way to entertain herself and others to stave off boredom or to contrast and offset what she was may
have been like in her speculative bloody past.

One other thing I like from SSiB, was when the rocket took off and everything was tumbling around while she stood perfectly still, just as a show of a quick demonstration of how well disciplined she is. That and that hold she put on Yorihime, showing she was physically stronger.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47024055
>That and that hold she put on Yorihime, showing she was physically stronger
Nta, A hold is meant to compensate for difference in strength, it doesn't mean much desu. The rest of the points stand

[Anonymous No.]

>>47024055
No, her opening the window will always be a moment of genuine stupidity to me.
It's funnier that way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023627
The thing with canon Sakuya, or at least how I see her, is she is utterly enigmatic and impossible to figure out. Like >>47024055 said, a lot of her supposed stupidity and clumsiness are actually not dumb at all, probably done on purpose for her own amusement.
In universe Sakuya is a mystery that confounds the likes of Eirin, in passing, yes, but still notable. No one knows her past, thoughts, motivations, even as little as her real name is known by very few people. On one hand you have the cold, unflappable, perfect maid, on the other you have the curious, mischievous girl, both at the same time being part of the personality of Sakuya.
Despite being supposedly human, she is the most "out there" of the SDM crew by a lot, a fact that I've never seen anyone properly show in a fan creation. To be fair, a character like that sounds very tricky to write properly, I can see her very easily being accidentally reduced to a comic relief or a "so random lol" type character.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47016655
>>47023627
>>47024829
Call me blind, but I just don't see it. Maybe my memory is failing me, but it's probably because all of ZUN's good writing is just flukes, so I just can't believe he could write something like this deliberately and succeed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47024530
Maybe, though I've managed to muscle out of similar holds from larger people, other than my father's. She still seemed rather helpless, forcing her to use that Atago flame bullshit just to break out of it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47024829
>I can see her very easily being accidentally reduced to a comic relief or a "so random lol" type character.
She often is actually, which also severely dumbed her down for many fans over the years. "She's a ditzy workaholic, ice queen, who's secretly tsundere for Meiling,lol! *knifed*"
I can honestly say the only one artist out there, who truly does her any justice would have to be Hikawa Shou ,if you read a lot of his stuff.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46981693
People will pay more attention if they see that type of picture

[Anonymous No.]

>>47026606
Perhaps you just be built different, but when I get put in a proper hold I become helpless. Especially headlocks and the like, but I also suck at fighting so there's that.
Although the meta reason? The artist and ZUN didn't want to make it a battle manga.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47027266
>The artist and ZUN didn't want to make it a battle manga.
Speaking of, why does Zun seem to use mostly women for his manga?

[Anonymous No.]

>>47026843
I don't blame them when I tried writing her I always found myself dissatisfied.
There's a real discrepancy to how Touhou has developed over the years and what its fans want out of it. It stands to reason why the 'kuya would end up like that if an author tries to stick a bit closer to canon yet still try to deliver a fun, lighthearted piece.
Either way I personally like silly 2hu and mystical, dystopian critique of modern society, damn near incomprehensively... 2hu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47027589
The prints, like the games, are the quintessential 2000's Otaku works where everyone is a cute girl, ZUN just took it further with a rule of 'no boys allowed' that happened by accident. By the time he realized it and thought to put in a male final boss it just felt weird to do so all of a sudden. So he didn't.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023627
>>47024829
I think it makes sense to develop such a personality if you have such a power. Like you could be an absolutely clumsy fuck and just correct any mistake with time stop. So you can get a clumsy and elegant personality overlapping.
Time stop also probably disconnects from other people since you're kinda alone in time stop. Probably not a good power to abuse.
Maybe a bit like being a functional member of society and then make a bunch of anonymous post telling people to kys or going full coombrain. Nobody knows what she does in stopped time.
>>47025287
I think it might be kind of intentional. Sakuya seems to have her personality traits based around DIO's, where he acts as if he owned the whole world and then loses his shit the second he realizes he might not be alone in his world. Sakuya is more of a comedic version of that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47028874
>Nobody knows what she does in stopped time.
She definitely pervs on people's genitals and masturbates in stopped time, then pretends nothing happened when time resumes and people suddenly feel like their clothes shifted slightly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47028874
>Nobody knows what she does in stopped time.
Nobody also knows when she actually rests or sleeps so I presume she does that in time stop

[Anonymous No.]

>>47028903
Imagine Sakuya peeing in time stop but because time is stopped when it leaves her body it smacks down as a massive deluge of girl pee and then someone annoys Sakuya enough to make her sneak into their home when they're sleeping during time stop and pee right over their face.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023627
>she's also telling jokes yet no one in universe regards her as funny or even a joker
Poor Sakuya, she's trying her best yet one is laughing at her jokes

[Anonymous No.]

Not to say I disagree with other people's opinion of Sakuya. But my personal take on her is just that she's a idiot savant. Like, she really is a perfect elegant maid, but that is all she knows how to do. The moment she's forced in a situation outside her comfort zone she comes across as a dumb weirdo.

This also goes along with my headcanon theory of her being a orphan raised by Remilia. So, I'll admit, I am a bit biased.

[Anonymous No.]

My headcanon is that they all want to have sex. with my oenis

[Anonymous No.]

>>47030484
They'd rather cheat on you with other girls, bigot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47030546

[Anonymous No.]

>>46874100
Youmu is a weird inverse case where "Fanon" mostly portrays her similarly to the games, but the canon printworks flanderizes "dork" into being her sole character trait to the point she is nothing but a comedy relief character with practically zero importance or development.

So compared to that printwork side of canon, fanon is infinitely better.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031072
implying Youmu isn't a dumbass dork through and through

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031141
Look up what flanderization means

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031205
you can't flanderize someone on their second appearance, at that point her character's barely even been set out
youmu was this from the start. She, like most characters, can sometimes be a bit more serious during an incident, but this always was her character

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031232
PCB to PoFV plus IaMP clearly showed & set her character. Now look at the printworks and try to name me literally a single time she was shown gardening, training, having an actual battle or something else that actually uses Youmu's character beyond comedy relief or simply being relatively minor & unimportant.

Game Youmu is a dorky but diligent swordswoman & gardener. Printwork Youmu is a comedy-relief dork and that's it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47028933
Sakuya's idea of joking is to threaten to rob a cat at knifepoint. It's such a bizarre scene that only makes sense if you think she's autistic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031072
Funny you say that, there was another Youmufag earlier complaining about the same.

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>47031811
>threaten to rob a cat at knifepoint
To be fair, if I saw Sakuya do that I'd piss myself laughing from the sheer ridiculousness of the situation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47032384
>>47031811
The people in Gensokyou have no sense of humor, Sakuya is hilarious

[Anonymous No.]

>>47030221
>The moment she's forced in a situation outside her comfort zone she comes across as a dumb weirdo
Wouldn't that just give her too much overlap with Youmu? An area where I guess she may come off as weak could be her understanding of modern science where, unlike Sanae, she appears to be from a more archaic background, (well really so does everyone else
who isn't Sanea) despite both being outsiders to Gensokyo. One theory I have is SDM most certainly came from a different time line (1700-1800s) and Gensokyo can also take in places from any time period. Things that just disappeared from reality or time forgot, that the "outside world"
no longer had any need for. Like BAiJR stating "The existence of the whole mansion in Gensokyo may show that the vampire and maid are the illusionary beings that do not exist in the outer world anymore."

Something else none of the fanon ever brings up is that apparently Sakuya is really good at climbing mountains and has no qualms sleeping/surviving the outdoors, as referenced in SWR and UM. Perhaps that might give a little more insight as the kind of region Sakuya may have
originally derived from?

[Anonymous No.]

>>47032985
>the kind of region Sakuya may have originally derived from?
You know it's that time again

[Anonymous No.]

>>47032985
>Wouldn't that just give her too much overlap with Youmu?
Kind off? I still think they are different because Sakuya doesn't really show weakness. It's why her stupid moments seem more surprising.

While I like your theory, I also think her general archaic background still makes sense if you assume she was some kind of stray or orphan that Remilia picked up. Also, about regions, I think she can canonically write and read English. So, make of that what you will.

>>47032990
I tend to assume China to be honest.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47032990
Easy, the City of London.
She's called Jack for a reason.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47033411
HOW PLEASED YOU ARE TO CHOP AWAY, SAKUYA THE RIPPER.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47033432
The name Jack didn't actually come from the killer himself anyways, relatively recently it was found out the Jack letters were probably written by a journalist looking for publicity and so he sent fake letter to the police.
Honestly I like to think Sakuya is pretty embarrassed by the whole affair and Jack but name, Remi thinks it's a cool momento of their time in Victorian London so it's kept around even if Sakuya doesn't like it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47033451
I vaguely recall that 'Jack' was just one of those names they gave to unknown or anonymous persons because it was a common name, like John or Jane

[Anonymous No.]

I remember one fan interpretation of Sanae speaking in early 2000s slangs that feel out of place.

[Anonymous No.]

>>46890359
I miss this artist

[Anonymous No.]

>>47023590
Yuyuko in game looks like a little girl, it's so weird seeing her like that after years of consuming hag Yuyuko's images

[Anonymous No.]

>>47024829
I think Sakura has just developed a new sense of entertainment for her mistress after years of service, you know, you gotta come with something new

[Anonymous No.]

>>47035218
>Sakura

[Anonymous No.]

>>47035174
Kindly reminder that Yuyuko hanged herself while she was a teen/young woman, hag Yuyuko is just fanon pretending she is older for some reason.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47035174
Also according to Zun's emails, she's actually around the same size and height as Reimu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47035344
Canon Yuyuko...

[Anonymous No.]

Fanon giving Medicine doll joints was a huge upgrade

[Anonymous No.]

>>47034746
I like the idea of sanae being old as shit compared to Sumireko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47037765
I find it funny how ZUN really went out of his way to keep them from interacting in any meaningful way.
The Simpsons time bubble would go out of whack if Sanae is reminded that she is supposed to be in her mid 30s now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47038067
I think Sanae would literally turn into dust like the main villain in Tangled if she ever met Sumireko.

[Anonymous No.]

>>47038067
I bet it's also the reason she never appeared in CoLA.