At least 30,000 people commit suicide in Japan every year, and the numbers are rising even more now because of the global recession. How does that make you feel, /jp/?

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Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:40:49 2010 No.4045341 [Reply] [Original]

At least 30,000 people commit suicide in Japan every year, and the numbers are rising even more now because of the global recession.

How does that make you feel, /jp/?

>>	IN elite !EienTEi9N6 Sat Jan 2 08:43:47 2010 No.4045364 The only good nip who doesn't produce OC is a dead one. Also people don't when they're killed anime still makes me kinda made.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:43:49 2010 No.4045368 Indifferent

>>	IN elite !EienTEi9N6 Sat Jan 2 08:43:49 2010 No.4045369 The only good nip who doesn't produce OC is a dead one. Also people don't when they're killed anime still makes me kinda mad.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:44:49 2010 No.4045373 >>4045341At least 30,000 people commit suicide in Japan every year Crap, that is a lot of people. I wonder if there's a connection with that high number and the fact that they are largely an unChristian nation?

>>	Annoying Type-Moon Fan !SHIKIazrn2 Sat Jan 2 08:45:49 2010 No.4045378 feels good man

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:45:49 2010 No.4045384 >>4045373 don't even start it man

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:45:49 2010 No.4045385 >>4045373 There's not any connection.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:47:22 2010 No.4045388 The (mass) death of human beings brings a smile to my face. Fuck all of you.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:47:49 2010 No.4045389 >>4045373 are you trying to start a shitstorm?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:47:49 2010 No.4045390 155,000 people die worldwide every day. That's 56.5 million a year.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:47:49 2010 No.4045392 >>4045373 No, social pressures to become Salarymen quickly divide people into "cans" and "can-nots". This gives the general Japanese population a feeling of highhanded bitterness or despair, depending on their side of the equation.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:49:49 2010 No.4045405

>>4045389
No, it's just being a Christian myself, I can say that Christianity brings hope to people. Also it's bad in Christianity to commit suicide. I just wonder if Japanese people don't have as much hope about their future since most of them aren't Christians.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:50:49 2010 No.4045411

>>4045373
Actually there could be, but probably not in the way that you're thinking.

Much of Western morality is shaped by thousands of years of Christian influence. Christian morality has created the idea in the west that suicide is morally wrong. Even people who are non-Christian tend to believe this pretty strongly.

Christian morality has never had much sway in Japan, the Japanese versions of Buddhism aren't so hardline on the issue, and Shinto doesn't say anything about it at all. There's no historical tradition of suicide being considered morally wrong, so it should come as no surprise that it's not generally thought of as wrong today. It's not unreasonable to expect that if suicide is not viewed as inherently immoral, more people are likely to do it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:50:49 2010 No.4045412 >>4045405 Oh god not this shit again.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:50:49 2010 No.4045413 >>4045392 Not if you choose the middle route and go NEET! Become a shut-in otaku your whole family can be proud of! Have meals delivered to your door! Mooch off of your family until they die! Yatta!

>>	Milfeulle is my Waifu !iS.Yuri/S. Sat Jan 2 08:51:49 2010 No.4045417 >>4045405 lol christianfag

>>	Annoying Type-Moon Fan !SHIKIazrn2 Sat Jan 2 08:51:49 2010 No.4045418 Suicide is glorified in Japan.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:52:49 2010 No.4045422 File: 40 KB, 344x400, top-10-countries-with-the-highest-suicide-rates-16.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045373 Probably, the countries with the highest suicide rates in the world are predominantly indifferent to religion.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:52:49 2010 No.4045423 >>4045417 It's a troll. Nothing to see here.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:52:49 2010 No.4045424 >>4045411There's no historical tradition of suicide being considered morally wrong, so it should come as no surprise that it's not generally thought of as wrong today. Interesting.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:53:49 2010 No.4045425

>>4045405
I'm very sorry good sir, while I see that you may actually have good intentions here, the religious beliefs of this board are spread very far apart, and usually extremist due to our hardline conservative nature.

I can tell you are not from around here, so I can clarify this moreso.
If you had made a post talking about "fucking niggers", or even better, "Fucking Americans", then you would get a warmer response than the subsequent discussion you are about to create with your religious post.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:53:49 2010 No.4045431 >>4045422 >Russia >lol

>>	IN elite !EienTEi9N6 Sat Jan 2 08:53:49 2010 No.4045432 >>4045422 All but one of those is Slavic...

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:54:49 2010 No.4045438 >>4045405 That's why crime rates are higher in countries like Sweden, Norway, Finland, and Japan than the peaceful US, UK, or Canada right?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:54:49 2010 No.4045439 >>4045422 It's the snow. It gets to you ;_;

>>	Annoying Type-Moon Fan !SHIKIazrn2 Sat Jan 2 08:55:49 2010 No.4045440 File: 181 KB, 284x555, âïâöâBâA01a(Æå).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045422 I thought Finland was full a happy people?!

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:55:49 2010 No.4045441
File: 48 KB, 800x600, penne rigate.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOJa
panese bird cooking spaghetti

>>	Lyin !v7YNS/isK2 Sat Jan 2 08:56:49 2010 No.4045444 >>4045405 >I can say that Christianity brings hope to people Umm...I'll refrain from saying anything more

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:56:49 2010 No.4045447 >>4045438 see >>4045411

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:56:49 2010 No.4045450

>>4045411
Its also funny that in modern day Japan suicide is not bad because its immoral or inherently bad, but because it burdens others and causes them extra stress. I always giggle a little to the news where some family had to pay out of their ass because their angsty teenager son/daughter jumped under a train.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:57:49 2010 No.4045452 File: 78 KB, 500x393, 1262041757119.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Japanese bird contemplating 自殺してing

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:57:49 2010 No.4045460 >>4045450 It kind of makes you wish there were clean, neat little booths a la Futurama

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:58:49 2010 No.4045469 >>4045450 The fact that it burdens others is the reason for it being considered immoral in the first place.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:58:49 2010 No.4045470 File: 645 KB, 878x1172, hortus_deliciarum_-_hell.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045444 Sure it does. It also teaches that if you kill yourself, you go straight to hell. That certainly kept me from killing myself back then.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:59:49 2010 No.4045473 >>4045469 Not from a Christian viewpoint.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 08:59:49 2010 No.4045480 >>4045411 Dont forget >lovers suicide = awesome >i want to be a buterfly in my next life they think some things quite differently than i do

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:00:49 2010 No.4045486 >>4045469 Death always burdens others, that's unique to suicide. We're all going to die someday, I don't see why it should matter if someone wants to have control over when their day comes.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:01:49 2010 No.4045487 >>4045470 I guess you do not also eat meat on Friday, lest you go to hell?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:01:49 2010 No.4045491 >>4045470 You'll be going to hell anyway. I hope you enjoy it. I certainly will.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:01:49 2010 No.4045492 What's a better reason to not die? >GOD SAID SO OR YOU BUUUUURN or >I don't want to burden my family/friends

>>	Lyin !v7YNS/isK2 Sat Jan 2 09:01:49 2010 No.4045494 >>4045470 Ah, good for you then. Perhaps its me, but it's tiresome having evangelist staying near me and trying to convert everyone.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:02:49 2010 No.4045500 >>4045341 Source?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:04:49 2010 No.4045505 >>4045469 Burden in this case being loss of money, missing a powermeeting or being late from your love hotel date.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:04:49 2010 No.4045511 More rapes occur in the US than suicides in Japan, discuss. >There were an estimated 93,934 forcible rapes reported to law enforcement in 2005 -USA

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:04:49 2010 No.4045513

>>4045486I don't see why it should matter if someone wants to have control over when their day comes.

Well, for one thing, as long as you're not dead, there's always hope and the possibility for things to get better. Also Christians believe that God has special plans for each person to live a fruitful life. If you die then your life is over and you can't get anything else accomplished.

Also I'm not sure, but I think something like your life isn't your own, but God's, and that's why you shouldn't take your life.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:04:49 2010 No.4045514 >>4045492 Both are pretty ridiculous if you ask me.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:04:53 2010 No.4045510 >>4045492 >I don't want to burden my family/friends T

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:05:49 2010 No.4045518 >>4045470 So you got scared into it? Oh wow.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:05:49 2010 No.4045521

That just proves that a high pressure conservative culture like Japan isn't sustainable.

>>4045422

What, Finland? Finland is an awesome place to live. I guess suicide rate and quality of life aren't directly related. There are unfortunately other factors here... but I'd say in Japan it's definitely down to the stress.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:06:49 2010 No.4045531 >>4045513 >God is omnipotent >God knows your future >Your future is already known, therefore there is only one outcome >There is no free will >Suicide was part of the master plan

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:07:49 2010 No.4045537 >>4045531 There is free will. Just because God knows the future doesn't mean that what you do isn't your own choice.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:09:49 2010 No.4045546 >>4045537 You didn't choose it, that "choice" was predetermined way back when God created the plan. You have the illusion of choice. Enjoy your play of a life created by God.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:10:49 2010 No.4045554

>>4045511
>More rapes are reported in the US than suicides in Japan

fixed
sluts are too brazen over here.
"She was drunk? That's rape."
"She decided she wasn't enjoying it right before you came? That's rape."
"She was coerced? Rape."
"She just really hates you and accused you of rape? That's rape."

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:10:49 2010 No.4045556 >>4045546that "choice" was predetermined way back when God created the plan. No, what I meant was God has a special plan for people. Whether they take that plan is up to them. Therefore, it's free will.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:10:49 2010 No.4045558

>>4045513
Don't read things in that aren't there. I never said anything about things being bad. I just said I don't see anything wrong with someone wanting to control the day they die.

Also, if you're going to suggest that I have no control over my life because it belongs to God, then you might as well be telling me I can't eat tacos on Tuesday because it'll upset my asshair thetans. I'm not interested in supernatural bullshit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:10:49 2010 No.4045561 "If there is a god, it must be a man. Cause no woman can ever fuck things up this badly" - George Carlin http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:11:49 2010 No.4045568 >>4045561 George Carlin was fucking awesome.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:11:49 2010 No.4045572 >>4045556 Then you admit that God doesn't know everything? That's not quite what the bible says.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:12:49 2010 No.4045577 >>4045546 lets kill god.

>>	Milfeulle is my Waifu !iS.Yuri/S. Sat Jan 2 09:13:49 2010 No.4045583 >>4045556 God is just like Bern. He's just fucking trolling us because he's boring.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:13:49 2010 No.4045586 >>4045577 God's been dead for a while. Or atleast he's been senile for a while.

>>	IN elite !EienTEi9N6 Sat Jan 2 09:14:49 2010 No.4045588 >>4045568 Amen.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:14:49 2010 No.4045591 File: 931 KB, 1000x1500, bern BAAAAW.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045583 >Bern >boring What the hell dude?

Milfeulle is my Waifu !iS.Yuri/S. Sat Jan 2 09:15:49 2010 No.4045600

>>4045591
Fuck, I mean
>because he's bored
GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI GOMENASAI

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:15:49 2010 No.4045601

>>4045558I never said anything about things being bad. I just said I don't see anything wrong with someone wanting to control the day they die.

I was just saying why it might be considered or be bad to control the day you die.

>Also, if you're going to suggest that I have no control over my life because it belongs to God

No I was saying that you should take care of your body since it says in the bible to treat your body like a temple since it's something God gave to you.

>>4045572
How did I admit that God doesn't know everything?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:15:49 2010 No.4045602 >>4045591 Bored and boring. Humans are more creative in screwing themselves up/

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:16:49 2010 No.4045604 Most philosophers agree (even the ones that try to hang on to god) that abrahamic religions as they are now can't be true. Dualism, problem of evil, etc...

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:18:49 2010 No.4045617

>>4045601
>How did I admit that God doesn't know everything?
If god knows everything, there can be no choice. Since it's already been determined. The only way that there can be free choice is if there is uncertainty. But there is no such thing as uncertainty if God already knows the outcome of everything.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:19:49 2010 No.4045620 >>4045617 Except there is uncertainty....for us. God knows everything, but he's not the one making the choices. We are.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:19:49 2010 No.4045626 The Bible and other books are bullshit. Whether or not there is a god is uncertain.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:20:49 2010 No.4045629 It must be tough being Japanese.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:20:49 2010 No.4045631 >Japan's homicide rate is 0.44 per 100,000. The U.S. is 5.4 per 100,000. Wow, that's a crapload more murders. I wonder if it's because they're a largely Christian nation?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:20:49 2010 No.4045633 >>4045620 Then there is no point of him existing.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:21:49 2010 No.4045641 >>4045620 That's an illusion of uncertainty, God already knows. For example, God knows that you will turn right at that next light, and then when you reach the light, you can consider going both ways but you can only ultimately go right. Illusion.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:22:26 2010 No.4045645 >>4045617 >If god knows everything, there can be no choice. >God knows your future >Your future is already known, therefore there is only one outcome You're debating religion here. It's bad form to make assumptions about the nature of the universe.

>>	Annoying Type-Moon Fan !SHIKIazrn2 Sat Jan 2 09:22:49 2010 No.4045644 WHAT IF GOD WAS ONE OF US?

>>	Milfeulle is my Waifu !iS.Yuri/S. Sat Jan 2 09:22:49 2010 No.4045650 File: 41 KB, 960x540, syahand.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I love how this turned into a trying to negate God thread. Never change /jp/.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:23:49 2010 No.4045655 >>4045617 >If god knows everything, there can be no choice. >God knows your future >Your future is already known, therefore there is only one outcome You're debating religion here. It's bad form to make assumptions about the nature of the universe.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:23:49 2010 No.4045657 File: 93 KB, 676x720, UndressHaruhi2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045644 I bet she'd be pretty moe.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:23:49 2010 No.4045658 File: 474 KB, 543x964, 1bf7571cdfe80886c5dcd56f3d1ba6fb.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045644 Shit you found me out.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:23:49 2010 No.4045660 File: 39 KB, 480x360, 1261131079911.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045631 80% of those deaths are niggers and spics

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:24:49 2010 No.4045667

>>4045645
If the future is already known then how is it possible that there is more than one outcome? That makes for at least two possibilities, which means that there is an uncertainty. How can an uncertainty if God is all knowing?

There are two possible explanations:
1. God is all knowing and there is no free will
2. God is not all knowing, there may or may not be free way

>>	Kooh !9WUSc85B6o Sat Jan 2 09:24:49 2010 No.4045668 File: 30 KB, 848x481, facepalm1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] make it stop.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:24:49 2010 No.4045672

>>4045601 No I was saying that you should take care of your body since it says in the bible to treat your body like a temple since it's something God gave to you.

You totally missed the point of my statement. I was pointing out that invoking supernatural bullshit to prove your point does not prove your point.

How is the Bible telling me to treat my body like a temple on account of God more valid than this bar napkin telling me not to eat tacos on Tuesday on account of asshair thetans? Do you see where I'm going with this? If you're going to base an argument on some outside authority, you first have to establish that said authority actually exists.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:25:49 2010 No.4045675 >>4045641 It's not God's free choice, you dingbat. It's ours. Why are you talking about God knowing everything when we (people) can still have free will? It may not be uncertain for God, but it certainly is for us.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:25:49 2010 No.4045681 >>4045650 Have you read the thread? Where has anyone refuted God? The only thing going on is the questioning of the nature of God.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:26:49 2010 No.4045684 Take it to /r9k/ easy!

Lyin !v7YNS/isK2 Sat Jan 2 09:26:49 2010 No.4045687

>>4045620
>>4045641

>For example, God knows that you will turn right at that next light, and then when you reach the light, you can consider going both ways but you can only ultimately go right.

If you turn left, thats where a different timeline splits

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:27:49 2010 No.4045691 >>4045675 Jesus, you're thick. I won't waste time explaining basic philosophy to you. Good night.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:27:49 2010 No.4045698 You guys are fags. God can control us but he won`t. It is more interesting that way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:27:49 2010 No.4045700 Can we all agree the Bible is bullshit and leave it at that?

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:28:49 2010 No.4045703

>>4045672How is the Bible telling me to treat my body like a temple on account of God more valid than this bar napkin telling me not to eat tacos on Tuesday on account of asshair thetans?

Well, first of all, why avoid tacos just on Tuesday? That doesn't even make sense. Also if you don't believe that the Bible is an authority that's your choice, but there are plenty of people that do.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:28:49 2010 No.4045706 /jp/ - Robot 9000

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:28:49 2010 No.4045709 >>4045698 Or perhaps there is no God and we do whatever the fuck we want, and the result is the same. Why add him in the equation?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:28:49 2010 No.4045714 >>4045691 Whatever. It's not like what you were saying even made sense.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:29:49 2010 No.4045718 God is the ultimate troll. Only he could ever provoke such huge shitstorms.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:29:49 2010 No.4045720

>>4045667

Try this on for size. God knows all possible outcomes.

At the same time, all possible outcomes occur.

There is no uncertainty. There is still free will.

This defaults god to be a bit more calvinist, and more of a dick, as he only honors the outcomes where he knows you will accept him.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:29:49 2010 No.4045726 >>4045687 You're thinking of a theory about the nature of time, which does not involve god. If there is a split, then there are two choices, left and right. But then there will be uncertainty, ergo God does not know all, if what you said is true.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:30:49 2010 No.4045734 >>4045718 Humans provoke bigger ones. Be it the internet or the real world.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:30:59 2010 No.4045730 >>4045709 Because i thing there is a big fat nerdy guy up there eating popcorn while he is watching us. Like in a VN he will make choices for us now and then.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:31:49 2010 No.4045737 >>4045709 Because i think there is a big fat nerdy guy up there eating popcorn while he is watching us. Like in a VN he will make choices for us now and then.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:31:49 2010 No.4045739 OH MODS IF YOU EXIST, I WILL GIVE YOU EVERYTHING JUST TO SEE YOUR SMILE! TAKE MY WEALTH! TAKE MY CHILDREN! TAKE EVEN MY LIFE! MOOOOOOOOOOOODS!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:31:49 2010 No.4045740 >>4045726But then there will be uncertainty, ergo God does not know all, if what you said is true. And why wouldn't God know all in this case? Can you explain?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:31:49 2010 No.4045744 File: 220 KB, 550x730, 1218981671297.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Pic unrelated

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:32:49 2010 No.4045750 >>4045720 Wrong, "you" are ultimately stuck on one course, but there are other "you"s that experienced different things but still ultimately stuck to "their" timeline.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:33:49 2010 No.4045752 File: 11 KB, 413x244, rance god.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Our god is the same.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:33:49 2010 No.4045756

>>>/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/ ttp://boards.4chan.org/r9k/ >>>/r9k/

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:34:49 2010 No.4045757 >>4045341 I almost commited suicide after watching H2O Seriously.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:34:49 2010 No.4045759 >>4045740 Uncertainty and certainty are mutually exclusive.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:35:49 2010 No.4045764 >>4045759 Not at all. I'm certain this is a terrible thread, but I'm uncertain how long it's going to stay on the front page.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:35:49 2010 No.4045765

>>4045750

As I said. It is bad form to make assumptions about the nature of the universe when speaking against religion.

In this instance, free will exists as if it didn't, neither would those outcomes. Even if in the end the end result is a linear path, it would not even have existed without free will.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:35:49 2010 No.4045766

>>4045667That makes for at least two possibilities, which means that there is an uncertainty. How can an uncertainty if God is all knowing?

The way I see it, God knows every possible way things can happen with every possible variable. That's how powerful he is.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:36:49 2010 No.4045774 >>4045764 Those are on two different things. Can you be certain that this board is part of 4chan and uncertain that this board is part of 4chan? No, you can't.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:37:49 2010 No.4045777 >>4045766 Are you talking about the Biblical God? He wasn't all powerful.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:37:49 2010 No.4045778 >>4045777 Source.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:38:49 2010 No.4045787 There is no God. The universe is deterministic, there is no free will. /thread.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:38:49 2010 No.4045788 >>4045726If there is a split, then there are two choices, left and right. But then there will be uncertainty, ergo God does not know all But WHY would there be uncertainty if God knows everything?

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:39:49 2010 No.4045792

>>4045703
There are lots of things in religion that don't make sense. Why does the God of Abraham abhor uncircumcised penises? That's irrelevant.

>Also if you don't believe that the Bible is an authority that's your choice, but there are plenty of people that do.
In the context of this argument, this carries one of two possible connotations:

1) The Bible is an authority because lots of people happen to think it is. This is stupid, because there are even more people who think it is not. That might be slightly more tenable if the majority of the world were Christian, but it is not.

2) Matters of morality are up to the individual. If so, why shouldn't a person commit suicide if he does not personally believe it to be morally wrong? This invalidates the God argument.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:39:49 2010 No.4045793 >>4045778 Read your whole bible instead of picking and choosing. You may learn something.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:40:49 2010 No.4045796 >>4045788 Look, retard/troll. Whichever. Pick "Free Will" or "God is all knowing", you can't have both.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:41:49 2010 No.4045809 >>4045796 holy loli! cognitive dissonance in a christian? say it ain't so~

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:41:49 2010 No.4045813 >>4045792Matters of morality are up to the individual. People have different ideas on what good or right morality is. Doesn't necessarily mean that they are all right about it. They just have their own opinions.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:42:49 2010 No.4045822 >>4045765 >would not have existed without free will Now who's the one making assumptions? Splits in timelines are not necessarily caused by choice.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:43:49 2010 No.4045828 >>4045796 They don't understand how they're mutually exclusive. Not only that, they think they've tapped on a higher truth by believing in something that apparently contradicts itself.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:43:49 2010 No.4045830 Isn't our understanding of free will at the moment based on the uncertainties of quantum mechanics?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:43:49 2010 No.4045834 Remember Tears to Tiara? Some day god will mindrape us like the white spirits did to mankind.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:44:49 2010 No.4045838 >>4045830 We aren't talking about the actual possibility/impossiblity of free will. We're speaking hypothetically IF god existed.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:44:49 2010 No.4045841

Just because there is no uncertainty, doesn't mean that we have no free will. We are free to do anything that is possible within our means and ability. Why would you even WANT to do something that isn't possible? We have free will in that we can accept or reject God and Jesus, and we can live a fruitful Christian life, or we can live a wasted life.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:44:49 2010 No.4045843 >>4045813 >implying it's possible to be "right" about morality Also, this thread is full of faggotry. Go away.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:45:49 2010 No.4045847 >>4045734 Not really seeing any starting wars lasting hundreds of years, confusing everyone, and causing earthquakes and hurricanes. And to top it all off we can't even prove he exists.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:45:49 2010 No.4045849 >>4045822 I am the one arguing for an all-powerful invisible friend. The very basis of my argument is making assumptions. You, however, don't have that option.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:45:49 2010 No.4045851 >>4045843 Implying it isn't.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:46:49 2010 No.4045854

>>4045830
In the Einsteinian universe, you could find the location and velocity of all particles at one moment in time and predict everything that would happen from then on. In the modern universe, it turns out you can have location or velocity, one or the other, but not both. What I mean to say is, yeah, I'm pretty sure modern science has proved that the universe is not pre-ordained.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:47:49 2010 No.4045861

>>4045841
>Just because there is no uncertainty, doesn't mean that we have no free will.
If you are free to do what you want within your ability, then that means not everything is certain

If there is no uncertainty, then your free will cannot exist

I suggest you jump off a bridge to your death

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:48:49 2010 No.4045864 >>4045861 I suggest you do the same because you are fucking stupid and annoying. Take your uncertanity/cerntainty bullshit and shove it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:48:49 2010 No.4045868 The world is a MMORPG. Free will is just a bug the GMs are too lazy to fix. Alpha males are hackers and good looking people are chash shop users.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:48:49 2010 No.4045869 >>4045854 What we are sure of is that we cannot predict quantum events. This doesn't mean they are not pre-determined.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:49:49 2010 No.4045871 >>4045854 The Heisenberg uncertainty principle, concerning position and momentum, eh?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:49:49 2010 No.4045872 >free will vs predetermination Wow, THIS has never been argued before, especially not with these very same arguments being pushed back and forth by either side.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:50:49 2010 No.4045879

Ask yourself these questions:
1. Can you entirely choose what environment you grow up in?
2. Can you choose your genetics?
3. Can you entirely choose your socioeconomic background?
4. Can you entirely choose what influences you?
5. Can you simply ignore 1-4 to be "free" regardless of the above 4? True freedom does not exist.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:50:49 2010 No.4045881 >>4045869 Oh but it does. The universe itself doesn't even know how it's going to be configured the next second. It has an idea, but it doesn't know for sure.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:51:49 2010 No.4045887 Hey guys, I think we scared off the christfag. Can we go back to touhou and VNs?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:52:49 2010 No.4045889 >>4045881 >implying since humans can't do something it can't be done.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:52:49 2010 No.4045893 >>4045879 What about the amazonian tribes unaware that there's civilization out there?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:52:49 2010 No.4045894 >>4045881 >implying the universe is sentient

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:52:49 2010 No.4045895 /jp/ - Philosophy/General

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:52:49 2010 No.4045897 average atheist = 12 years old angsty teen, suicidal. average christian = Mature man, happy in his life.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:53:49 2010 No.4045900

>>4045766
So, God knows that for a given event E, there could be any one outcome out of O[1,2,...,n], where n is the number of possible outcomes? That's simple enough.

Unfortunately, this argument assumes that God does not know the final value of O until E occurs, thereby invalidating the assertion that God knows everything. Put another way, while God knew all of O[1,2,...,n], God did not know that O[7] would be the actual outcome until it had already occurred.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:53:49 2010 No.4045902 >>4045893 What the hell does that have to do with anything?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:53:49 2010 No.4045904 >>4045879 "a lack of true freedom" and "pre-determination" are entirely different things. Just because you are dealt a particular hand of cards doesn't mean you play it the same way every time.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:53:49 2010 No.4045905 >>4045897 [statistical citation needed] >>4045893 What do they have to do with anything?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:54:49 2010 No.4045910 >>4045897 Oh you.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:55:49 2010 No.4045917

>>4045897
You're confusing "Atheist" for "anti-theist". An "atheist" isn't necessarily one of those people that go after religion all the time, simply someone without belief in god.

Surely you aren't a christian. "Mature" people know the difference between those kinds of things or at least make sure they know the definition of words, right?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:55:49 2010 No.4045918 >>4045902 They are free.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:56:49 2010 No.4045919 0=1

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:56:49 2010 No.4045922 >>4045918 What the flying fuck kind of logic is that?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:57:49 2010 No.4045926 >>4045919 I wonder how my computer works then. Those 1s and 0s are the same.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:57:49 2010 No.4045928 >>4045918 How does a lack of knowledge of outside civilization translate to free will? You are so brutally retarded it pains me to know that you walk the streets of the world unrestrained.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:59:49 2010 No.4045933 File: 151 KB, 1024x1024, 1228739183289.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] this thread

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 09:59:49 2010 No.4045937 Mature adult: Avoids speaking about religion of politics unless it's a good friend. Children: BAWWW I'M A BUTTHURT CHRISTFAG, ATHEISTFAG, AGNOSTICFAG, ISLAMFAG, X-RACE FAG. BAAWWWW

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:00:49 2010 No.4045939 >>4045928 Saying "No, you're wrong!" isn't an argument.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:00:49 2010 No.4045942 >>4045937 FUCKING THIS.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:00:49 2010 No.4045944 Libertarian atheists are the cancer killing 4chan.

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:00:49 2010 No.4045945

There may be more suicide in less-religious countries, but there's far more crime in religious countries.

In the United States, most criminals are religious (albeit non-practicing, ie, they didn't go to church last week, but they still say they're christian, muslim, jewish, etc.)

This paper was published in an accredited journal at Creighton University in Baltimore, Maryland, and backs up those claims.

http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2005/2005-11.html

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:01:49 2010 No.4045949 I think the most important thing we can take away from this thread is that I'm gay.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:01:49 2010 No.4045951 >>4045939 Can we get this guy locked up? He can't comprehend 5th grade English or something, possibly mentally challenged or brain damaged and dangerous.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:01:49 2010 No.4045952 Now you realize 95% of this thread ist trolling.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:01:49 2010 No.4045953 >>4045944 Christians are the cancer killing the real world. I know which I'd prefer.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:02:49 2010 No.4045957 >>4045939 Neither is saying "LOL WELL AMAZONS DONT KNOW I EXIST THEREFORE THEY ARE FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE" It is a nonsense leap of logic with no conceivable bridge

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:02:49 2010 No.4045961 >>4045952 >now Jeez, you're a slow one.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:03:49 2010 No.4045964 >>4045961 Just completed reading all of this.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:04:49 2010 No.4045972 >>4045952 I bet no half-wit would even take this thread seriously in the first place.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:04:49 2010 No.4045973 Hi guys, how do I learn Japanese?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:05:49 2010 No.4045975 File: 126 KB, 400x400, cirno_lol.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] GOD Exist!?!?!?! I sure didn't know that?!?!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:05:49 2010 No.4045977 >>4045972 I think the MMORPG argument was solid.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:05:49 2010 No.4045980 Embarrassingly enough I've never played Touhou or a single VN, I want to fix that. Can you guys tell me where I can start?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:06:49 2010 No.4045983 Japanese bird cooking spaghetti.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:06:49 2010 No.4045984 File: 97 KB, 1000x750, suwako ring.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045975 Forgot your archenemy?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:07:49 2010 No.4045990 GET 555555555555555555555555

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:07:49 2010 No.4045991 Typical atheist = "God dont real LOLOLOLOLOLO" Typical theist = "My God is exist LOLOLOLOLOLO" Typical Agnostist = "I don't know but we should treat each other with respect"

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:08:49 2010 No.4045993 File: 219 KB, 700x738, 1260769319671.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045984 You a GOD? You're a mere frog

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:08:49 2010 No.4045995 >>4045991 Where's agnostic? "there is insufficient evidence for either way, but God seems highly unlikely, however I will not outright say that he/she/it does not exist since disproving is impossible"

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:08:49 2010 No.4045996 >>4045991 more like sitting on the fence unable to move forward lololol It is a troll do not respond to it in a serious manner

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:08:49 2010 No.4045997 File: 111 KB, 576x768, suwako cthulhu.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045993 A fucking great old one!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:09:49 2010 No.4046003 >>4045991 >i'm trolli'n LOLOLOLO

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:09:49 2010 No.4046004 ANONTALK SPAMMAN THINGAN LOLOLOLOLOL SPAMMING THE SHIT OUT OF YOU WILL GET YOU TO COME TO ANONTALK.SHIT

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:10:49 2010 No.4046012 Skanon theory. Try to disprove it!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:10:49 2010 No.4046018 File: 36 KB, 465x334, 1258778057460.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4045997 Disgusting...NOW DIE!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:11:49 2010 No.4046024 >>4046018 Can`t do that.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:11:49 2010 No.4046025 I heard Japan did some bad things in World War II.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:11:49 2010 No.4046028 >>4046004 Be careful. If you say anontaIk.com you can get banned for a day.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:11:49 2010 No.4046030 >>4046025 FUCKING WHALES!

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:12:49 2010 No.4046031

>>4045554
I know I'm late on this one, but I can't believe nobody called this guy on the fact that the vast number of unreported genuine rapes easily evens (if not outweighs) out the number of drunken slut "rapes".

I know this is /jp/ and 4chan in general is chock-full of raging misogyny, but come on.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:12:49 2010 No.4046034 Japanese literature = shit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:13:49 2010 No.4046044 >>4046034 Saying that on a board full of people who read VNs? Eh...?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:14:42 2010 No.4046049 ゆっくるレープしていってね!!!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:15:49 2010 No.4046053 >>4046049 >Misspelling レイプ lol

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:15:49 2010 No.4046054 >>4046034 >Because I haven't read any

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:17:49 2010 No.4046068 I'm hitting the hay, /jp/. Fun thread!

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:18:49 2010 No.4046071

I'm agnostic.

If there is a God, I'm absolutely certain it is not a personal God who made us in his image. It doesn't necessarily know we're here, it doesn't know of our problems, and it doesn't micromanage our lives. There's just too much evidence against a personal God when you look at the big picture.

I'm absolutely certain that every religion is a man-made fabrication.

The only noble pursuit is science, which is an attempt to reverse engineer the universe and get at the real facts. Everything else is bullshit.

I can therefore say, without uncertainty, that if there is a God or some force that triggered the creation of our universe, that scientists are in fact closer to it than any so called "holy" person.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:18:49 2010 No.4046078 What do you call it when you go with the null hypothesis when it comes to things like gods because I think I'm that.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:22:16 2010 No.4046097 I WISH I was a 2D girl, or at least a real girl so i can do sexy cosplay

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:22:49 2010 No.4046090 >>4046071 Agnosticism is not a "maybe" midway point between atheism and theism. Stop using it that way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:23:49 2010 No.4046100 Feels indifferent man. It's their life.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:24:49 2010 No.4046105 >>4046090 Note how I said I didn't believe their might be a God. I only stated what I believe given a precondition. Just because I'm agnostic doesn't mean I can't explore different possibilities and weigh their probabilities.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:26:49 2010 No.4046115 I WISH I was a 2D girl, or at least a real girl so i can do sexy cosplay AN HERO NOW, maybe my next life will be like that!!!

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:27:49 2010 No.4046120 >>4046105 To clarify, I meant >Note how I didn't say I believe their might be a God. I only stated what I would believe given a precondition.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:28:49 2010 No.4046127 File: 19 KB, 336x310, 1261730998437.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4046115 >AN HERO NOW

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:28:49 2010 No.4046131 File: 77 KB, 468x415, clam_shell_completely_worksafe.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Religious discussion, in my /jp/? It's more likely than you think!

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:31:49 2010 No.4046145
File: 241 KB, 793x598, definately_not_elementary_schoolers.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

I find it hard to believe that people can actually honestly believe there is an invisible man in the sky with the power to do anything, who loves everyone but will torture you for all eternitiy if you don't do exactly as he's told you, and if you don't donate a portion wealth to an organisation who are given special power and status in your life. From no other evidence besides your parents/teachers/society/otherpowerfiguresinyourlife telling you that it is true

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:34:49 2010 No.4046157 >>4046145 Yeah, if such a God exists, he is an insane psychopath. I'd rather, in spite, spend eternity in his hell then worship him and his madness for eternity in heaven if he does indeed exist, which I highly doubt he does.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:34:49 2010 No.4046158 >>4046145 I guess true love(coming from god) must be in the form of S&M

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:36:49 2010 No.4046169
File: 200 KB, 799x602, Teaching_elementary_schoolers_SICP_is_a_crime.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

As Lenin said though, "Give us the child for 8 years and it will be a Bolshevik forever". Since these myths were drilled into some people in the earliest parts of their life, they come to accept them as being something slightly more than complete nonsense. Even those who have the self will and determination to declare themselves not to be "Christians/Muslims/Jews/Scientologists" against the grain of their respective societies, will find themselves at times troubled by guilt since it was embedded in their minds to believe that, say, any sexual intercourse outside of consensual sex in the missionary position with the lights off, is wrong, simply because an old guy wearing funny robes said it was.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:38:49 2010 No.4046183 >>4046145 >>4046131 I didn't think there was any way to save face, but 奇跡がおこった

Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:39:49 2010 No.4046189 [SPOILER]

File: 78 KB, 467x600, yotsuba_riding_a_cock.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>4045937
>Mature adult: Lobbies politicians to force people to live by the rules spouted out by whatever robed maniacs they think spout the rule of the "true" God(s).
Fixed that for you.
Yotsuba riding a cock not related.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 2 10:44:49 2010 No.4046224 File: 114 KB, 850x680, sample-aaae2eb87c6035cf39a9a45e48bd1072.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>4046183 Kanon reference?

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/jp/ - Otaku Culture