Immortality

[Anonymous No.]

Which 2hus are canonically immortal?

This confuses me to this day, mostly because of characters like Yukari. Like, this is in the Magical Astronomy cd:
"...Immortality doesn't mean absence of death; it means the boundary between life and death disappears, and you are in a state neither alive nor dead. Just as if you were in the living world and the Netherworld at the same time, a Necrophantasia."

In my opinion, ZUN is practically screaming that Yukari is immortal because of her powers, but we also have many other examples of her powers having limitations. I don't think she's immortal, but...

[Anonymous No.]

Eirin!

[Anonymous No.]

Kaguya!

[Anonymous No.]

Mokou!

[Anonymous No.]

>>39339409
>>39339444
>>39339516
Correct, those are the ones that are explicitly immortal.

But for example, all gods are immortal? If they can only live as long as a fair amount of people believe in them, is this really immortality?

[Anonymous No.]

Chang'e!

[Eilienen !!QEIAmWnR8w1 No.]

In one dream, I was in a museum. I thought that I had sold my soul to The Devil, so I will become him, collecting souls for several cycles of the Universe before eventually disappearing into The Abyss with my "score." What's the point of collecting souls if I just disappear into The Abyss with them? I wondered that until I saw a post in a Berserk thread talking about how souls in The Abyss are sucked up as fuel for Idea of Evil, perhaps it's something like that.
I dreamt I entered a physical shed that was also a shitcord server, my opening line was "Will I be the first person to prove The Abyss wrong?" The people there looked at me funny so I said "No one has ever escaped disappearing into The Abyss." I saw the admin of the server disappear for a moment, then come back out with a light gold name, a role called "Immortal"
I was going around with Sanae doing errands, she was opening portals to summon a giant snake in different locations. After we do this we get to name something, like naming a star. Sanae gave a name to a place "thicc snake" I saw that Yukari had been doing errands too and she names things "Yukari" with a number after it. I admired the way she seeks after Immortality.
I was Megumu flying over an Abyssal swamp, out of the swamp stuck a popular car brand name, though even that was barely jutting out of The Abyss. My tengu shoes could allow me to walk upon The Abyss, I believe it may be related to The Ivory Tablets of the Crow, a religious text that teaches the Books of Dreams, also called the language of the Tengu, the Footprints of the Crow, though I haven't seriously practiced it, I think my dreams saying that "the tengu like you", hanging around tengu and having tengu girls swarm over me are due to having at least dabbled. I once dreamt about standing at the opposite end of a train from several Cult of Nyazir members, they hostilely questioned who I was, probably because I am just an outsider dilettante, and now I shitpost about their esoteric way upon this board.
I dreamt of Manus lamenting near the Firelink Shrine's bonfire over the First Lords' machinations, and how immortality is a lie.

As for Hourai immortals, it's probably just like Relius said to Hazama who was experimenting with destroying Rachel. Hazama wondering if chopping her up into bits and throwing them into The Boundary(The Abyss) would kill her. Relius was uninterested, saying he knows several methods of destroying immortals. Perhaps Izayoi's Immortal Breaker could destroy Hourais.

8G4G8

[Eilienen !!QEIAmWnR8w1 No.]

Cult of Nyarzir*

[Anonymous No.]

>>39339383
Youkai are not immortal and can die, be sealed, stop existing, etc. Kaguya, Mokou, and Chang'e at least are immortal as much as immortality can exist. ZUN's never said if they can stop existing or not, just that they cannot die and stay dead. Fairies are also immortal and will live as long as their concept exists, so someone like Cirno will probably exist forever unless the universe reaches a state where hot and cold are no longer distinct from each other. Other than that, magicians would be the next step as they aren't mortal in the sense that they don't age anymore so they could live indefinitely, but they have no special ability besides that and you could just strangle one to death.

Kami may or may not be immortal, but are probably not. There's not that much difference between a kami and a youkai except that a kami is born when someone starts treating something as a kami and then fades away when they stop. Like fairies they might not even ever exist in any real stable form so you could consider them immortal in the way a rock is immortal since the kami will be created if you venerate the rock, die if you stop, and be revived if you start again. Fairies are essentially kami, but only of nature objects and not concepts like words, rituals, the space between book pages, etc, and don't require faith. If Eirin is immortal or not is questionable. She was possibly never a human/lunarian so it's doubtful if the elixir would have had any effect on her if she actually took it. ZUN once said she's been alive for millions of years so it's possible there's a class of kami that just exist and actually created stuff. Either that or history is retroactively made. The latter is fairly likely because of powers like what Keine has. Anything else is mortal and can permanently stop existing is some way. Theoretically youkai can die of age as well, so after houraijin, fairies, and magicians, ghosts/souls would probably be the next closest to immortal thing since they only stop existing if they ascend to a state of nirvana or something weird like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39345016
Thank you, anon. That clarifies a lot, specially that part about Kami, I had no idea about that.

I'm still confused about the Necrofantasia cd thing, but I'm starting to think that ZUN had one idea for Yukari, started developing it, but then gave up on that original idea. Maybe she was meant to be immortal, but right now, she obviously isn't.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39346453
Why are you even obsessed over it, what does immortal mean to you? She probably doesn't age and she can probably be brought back if she was killed just by continued belief in her existence or whatever keeps youkai existing. She's not mortal in the normal human sense, but she's not a live-until-the-end-of-the-universe type being, although she and Sakuya could probably manage that if they wanted.

Also you should read the fairy manga

[Anonymous No.]

>>39346608
I'm retarded and easily obsessed over small things.

>Also you should read the fairy manga
I downloaded it, I need to stop being lazy :(

[Anonymous No.]

>>39339383
>believing words of 2hu jobber

[Anonymous No.]

>>39347332
What's the correct version then?

[Anonymous No.]

>>39347814
This anon already explains >>39345016 Just saying you shouldnt take everything she says seriously 'because she is experienced and intelligent because of her long life', when there are carefree youkais like Aya and Tewi who are as ancient as her or even older and are just as intelligent.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39339383
>Which 2hus are canonically immortal?
Me.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39347332
Aren't all 2hus Jobbers?

[Anonymous No.]

>>39345016
> If Eirin is immortal or not is questionable.
Eirin is immortal, CDS confirmed it

[Anonymous No.]

>>39345016
>If Eirin is immortal or not is questionable. She was possibly never a human/lunarian so it's doubtful if the elixir would have had any effect on her if she actually took
She confirms that she's drank the elixir in a Netherworld ending for IN.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39345016
also hourai are less about not dying and more about fully being removed from the cycle of life and death by becoming a weird permanent fixture which cannot be removed. Notable since afaik every other immortal can be killed/destroyed

Also, a few youkai are noted immortal iirc, like vampires. Celestials are immortal which feels like another way of saying "the divine" are immortal.
Ghosts can't be called immortal, as they are, well, *dead*, but they do permanently exist until exorcised or until they pass on.
The qualities of "life" and "death" are tied to ideas of purity and impurity in a way I couldn't explain. I do know that all living beings are impure (including lunarians) and that the dead are pure (so ghosts and phantoms), seemingly implying that a quality of "being alive" makes you filthy. Hourai are supremely impure due to an attachment to life, but ghosts and their grudges/attachments are pure so idk

[Anonymous No.]

>>39346453
An important thing you and a lot of fans really ought to realize is that Yukari says a ton of shit

How much of it is true? Well, certainly not all of it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39346608
>she can probably be brought back if she was killed just by continued belief in her existence or whatever keeps youkai existing
not how it works. The concept of "gap youkai" would mean the "species" of gap youkai could still exist, but if you die as a youkai you just die, like how oni were being slaughtered so frequently in the past that it made them want to leave

[Unipux !!H92TheXQpan No.]

>>39347332
>>39367449
>>39377800
Eat my shit bitch niggers trying to drain away my wife's money.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39377761
Just look up kegare. Kegare is basically the dirtiness of biological processes.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39377813
You should know from the last game that just because a youkai is killed doesn't mean it is dead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>39377813
>like how oni were being slaughtered so frequently in the past that it made them want to leave
they left because they were fed up with humans being deceivers

[Anonymous No.]

>>39394708
Maybe they should have not kidnapped people to sex them to begin with

[Anonymous No.]

>>39347332
Who are you quoting?