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/jp/ - Otaku Culture

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2492661 No.2492661 [Reply] [Original]

I'm starting to learn Japanese,

Currently I have All About Particles, a Japanese Kanji Dictionary, the Genki books, and I am using http://www.hellodamage.com/kanjidicks/main.htm and http://www.guidetojapanese.org/

Is there anything else? nyoro~n

>> No.2492666

Your interest. You will lose it not far from the time you will start studying.

>> No.2492671

>kanjidicks
>kanji
>dicks
What

>> No.2492672

Plenty of raw manga

>> No.2492681

Lots of raw anime and manga to keep your interest.
Oh, and torrent a copy of Rosetta stone.

>> No.2492682

Keep your motivation. Limit the time you spend on english sites. Download Anki. You only really need Anki and a bunch of japanese media. Textbooks suck.

Japanese is easy to learn by yourself, it just takes time. Goodluck.

Source: I'm pratically fluent.

>> No.2492687
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2492687

>>2492681
>Rosetta stone

>> No.2492707

>>2492682
How the hell doy ou learn from anki? it just gives you the kanji then the name of the kanji at the bottom, then you click next, like, srsly, how the hell do you learn from that?

>> No.2492710

二次元世界の入口に行こう

>> No.2492712

>>2492707
Kanji memorization. srsly.

>> No.2492724

>>2492707

I have it set up so it gives me the meaning of the Kanji then I write it down and grade myself according to how hard it was to remeber. It works. Once you finish the 2042 general use Kanji (took me about 2 months) move onto inputting full sentences into Anki.

>> No.2492734

>>2492724
Also, buy (download) Heisig's "Remembering the Kanji" and download the Anki deck that goes with it.

>> No.2492736

>>2492724
what type of file did you use for anki? remember the kanji or something?

>> No.2492758

ITT people who read AJATT. Wake up people, its a new-age feel good language learning technique, and is to language learning as scientology is to religion.
You're not going to learn a language from being a fat basement dweller who watches anime all day, if that was true there'd be hundreds of people fluent in Japanese by now.

>> No.2492768

>>2492758
AJATT is not a feel a feel good method, it's hard-fucking-core drilling kanji and sentences, and it works.

>> No.2492770

>>2492758
>hundreds of people fluent in Japanese by now.
...but, there are. A hundred isn't a lot.

Besides, it works, especially if you only want to learn Japanese to understand anime/manga/VNs anyway. Enjoy never being able to experience your waifu in her original language.

>> No.2492772

Ok, quick question the hiragana for 明日 is あした, yet the kanji 明　has the kunyomi of めい and 日 has the kunyomi of たち and じつ then why the hell is it said as あした

>> No.2492775

>>2492772
becuz ur a faget

>> No.2492777

>>2492775
:(

>> No.2492784

Also, isn't heisig bad, because it doesnt teach you what the kunyomi or onyomi are for all the kanji? Fucking you over.

>> No.2492791

>>2492772
Not all kanji are read by their readings. Same with 今日, 明後日　(あさって), etc

>> No.2492797

>>2492784
Yeah, pretty much. Heisig is essentially useless, as you'll only know vague english meanings and won't have a clue how to read them.

>> No.2492798

>>2492791
So only a few kanji are not read by their actual meanings, and youll just have to know it by heart in order to understand it?

>> No.2492802

>>2492784
I think Volume 2 does, but everybody says it sucks so I never bothered with it.

The meaning is more important that the reading and the reading is much easier to learn once you can understand sentences. Heisig is the way to go.

>> No.2492804

>>2492797
So when people reccomend it, I guess their just trolling, because even if you manage to memorize every single kanji in heisig, you wouldn't have two shits how to even pronounce the character let alone be able to read it in a sentence properly.

>> No.2492810

>>2492804
bingo

>> No.2492813

Here's a question: how many onyomi and kunyomi readings should we memorize for each kanji? I mean, some of them have a shitton of readings, and sometimes the readings aren't even used in the compound word (明日 for example). Would memorizing the two most common on and kun readings be enough to pass?

>> No.2492830

>>2492813
If you use http://www.hellodamage.com/kanjidicks/main.htm he teaches you in a way that textbooks dont teach you, and teaches you from his experience, rather than proffesors in a japanese major who dont know shit.

99.9% of the time you use the first kunyomi/onyomi they give you, the only other time is with special words with historic value, like someone above posted, about pronouncing 明日。

>> No.2492835

Is it correct that wa, is written as は in sentences?

>> No.2492838

You're going to end up adding many months to your study time if you don't use Heisig, plus it will be boring and you'll probably lose interest.

The reading IS NOT THAT IMPORTANT. You can wait until you start drilling sentences to learn it. Plus IMO it's easier to learn in the context of a sentence.

>> No.2492841

>>2492813
I read example sentences on jisho.org and get the examples of useful words for each kanji on kanjidicks, then compare the two, generally taking jisho's word over kanjidicks, since the latter has some occasionally funny omissions. Once you know the common words it's used in, memorize the on and kun readings that are used in those.

>> No.2492850

>>2492838
0/10

>> No.2492852

>>2492838
You're the perfect example of why no one likes Heisigfags. You always say this shit in absolutes, as if no one else would be better off with a different study method.

I also think you fucks get off to the fake sense of achievement it gives you

>> No.2492859

>>2492852
Are you a Japanese Major?

>> No.2492899

Just out of curiosity, could anyone who has been studying Japanese exclusively by himself explain how he went about it exactly? I keep reading suggestions after suggestions, but I guess I've missed out on one that can walk you through each step pointing out which book you must complement your learning with.

>> No.2492912

>>2492899
Mine was pretty much
Learn kana > Tae Kim > All About Particles > Simple manga > Harder manga > anime/VNs

>> No.2492961

ITT: Butthurt people who learned their kanji over several years and now troll people who use Heisig.

I have to agree that learning the readings first is not important. Sure, you will need to know them in the end, but mindlessly roting them is not going to do any good for you.
What I did, and damn glad I chose that path, was going through Heisig's first book, skipping the readings alltogether and instead started learning words.
I put the most common words I encountered into my SRS and learned them with their readings. This way all the pieces of the puzzle fall to their places in your mind, and you learn useful words with their meanings and writing instead of trying to force you to memorize abstract sounds that barely have any logic in them.

I assume most people here watched a lot of anime, listened to thousands of hours of Japanese speech in VNs and such. Even though you understood almost nothing of it back then, your mind memorized the sound of thousands of words, and you will have a much, much easier time associating words with those memories instead of starting to learn single characters from scratch that make no sense on their own.

>> No.2493032

Look into a bunch of methods, if something doesn't work for you, move onto the next one.

Heisig seems to work for the majority of of people that try it, including myself. Because of that, I would reccomend you try it first. If Heisig fails, try sight-reading, if that fails, try Japanese school-style rote memorization, etc.

>> No.2493149

bump

>> No.2493232

I began drilling basic level 4 kanji
then I went drilling grammar structures
then I went drilling more kanjis
All while reading VN/ watching mango, etc.

I now don't need even a dictionary to play schoolife eroge.
books are for faggots.

>> No.2493349

I recently switched from Mnemosyne to Anki. Should have done it sooner, as Anki is clearly superior.

>> No.2493373

Memorizing individual readings is a waste of time. You're going to learn words anyway, so you might as well learn the readings as part of words. This is very easy if you're already learned the Heisig keywords.

>> No.2493537

last bump

>> No.2493933

http://www.jlptstudy.com/4/jlpt4_vocab-list.html

I am using this list in an Anki file to memorize it. It's probably actually a waste and I'm not looking to study JLPT, but it seems pretty basic / comprehensive.

Also,
http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/cgi-bin/cgiwrap/jwb/wwwjdic?9T

Can be helpful,

http://www.tofugu.com/2008/10/21/top-10-online-resources-for-learning-japanese-for-free/

Some useful resources?

Just, don't memorize kanji and nothing else.

Also, Heisag and Radicals are useful but they only indicate meaning half the time. So you might know what it's going on about but no idea how to pronounce?

僕は日本語先生じゃないと此の語例えば。

>> No.2494113

Japanese is pretty づごいいいいいいいいいい

>> No.2494165

Where should I start to learn Japanese? I was thinking the elementary genki guides to learn basic word, then start learning japanese through the above websites (kanjidicks), then particles, and then grammar and shit from guidetojapanese.

Is this good?

>> No.2494237

>>2492724
Where's that File?
and anyone got the Genki I answer key?

>> No.2494239

>>it doesnt teach you what the kunyomi or onyomi are for all the kanji? Fucking you over.

Probably troll, but this is exactly the point of Heisig (and why it works so well for so many people). Just like Heisig himself explains in the prologue of the first book.

Nobody is claiming that Heisig is all you need to learn the language, but that it is an ideal first step for a lot of people. Well, to be more precise, the Heisig-style method is. Heisig's own implementation of it has some annoying shortcomings (such as a few really weird keyword choices), but that's what sites like kanji.koohii.com are for.

I haven't checked kanjidicks out in detail, but the main idea in its writings and keywords seems to be similar to Heisig's. The weird thing about it is the way it tries to teach readings at the same time, and through English words no less. I mean, I haven't checked it in enough detail to really criticize it, but I feel the mnemonic-style approach just doesn't work nearly as well with readings as vocabulary drilling... This is, after all, the very reason why Heisig's second book is so unpopular even among the most hardore Heisig fans.

>> No.2494298

>>2494165
Still trying to find a solution to my problem.

>> No.2494310

>>2494298
You really won't have any use for the basic words until you know at least some kanji and grammar.

>> No.2494328

to people who are saying heisig is useless: why do you think it is that chinese students learn japanese so much faster than western students?

>> No.2494350

>>2494328
Because Kanji is made from Hanzi you fucking idiot.

>> No.2494353
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2494353

>>2494328

Fuck, please tell me you were trolling.

>> No.2494359

>>2494328

Same reason why an Italian student has French down to a intermediate-advanced level sooner than an English one?

>> No.2494365

>>2494350
>>2494353

but you guys were saying just a while ago that not knowing the readings makes knowledge of the kanji (or hanzi in this case) completely useless, so that can't be the reason

>>
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