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/jp/ - Otaku Culture


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20998208 No.20998208 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

Let’s have a REAL convo about Japan. Time to get educated.

Ever thought about a why loli in anime/games, lolita fashion, the school girl fetish, and so many other similar things exist specifically in Japanese culture?

There is actually a perfectly logical answer, chronology, and social shift that happened in Japan which not only explains it, but it also condemns members of society previously considered to be normal. From living in Tokyo the past 5 years, I’ve stumbled upon some surprising stuff younger folks or the less informed may not know.

Before the year 2000, the Internet age, and it’s globalization of media, Japan had a prolific pornography industry that included girls from ages 12 and even lower posing nude in art books and VHS gravure.
You had a 20-30 year window in Japanese society where appreciating the nude body of a junior high school aged girl was considered totally normal and nobody really thought twice about it. The celebrity actress Kuriyama Chiaki (Gogo Ibari in Kill Bill / Chigusa in Battle Royale) posed nude in art books at the age of 12 before she ever became a movie celebrity.

In an attempt to meet global standards, Japan passed a child protection law, set 18 as the new minimum and halted production of the major industry.

Even then, it wasn’t until the quite recent infamous ban of 2013 that criminalized the sales and possession of under 18 contents, making shops pull materials from their shelves and arresting people who owned something that was legal to buy a mere decade prior. (Ruroni Kenshin’s creator Nobuhiro Watsuki, for example)

Japan then created a rift in their society. It fetishized young girls for over three decades of media and then just pulled the plug. Men who reached sexual maturity long before 1999, or even 2013, whose fetish was teen girls went from not even being on society’s radar, to being disgusting criminals. There is now a large caste of Japanese men, rougly between age 30 and 70+, who are managers, CEOs, teachers, officials who were raised up in a society that mass produced and encouraged a fetish that it since demonized quite recently.

With that in mind, what are your thoughts on the Japanese concept lolicon and even the prevailing “kawaii culture” to this day?

>> No.20998251

It arouses me. I hope the Olympics don't defeat it.

>> No.20998321

I was born in the wrong generation.

>> No.20998332

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2LQMElLoLs
I want to mating press some lolis.

>> No.20998383
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20998383

Do Japanese schoolgirls really actnlike they do in the moe-kawaii shows?

>> No.20998521

>>20998383
No, they act like in Crows, Punpun, Emergence. But it's likely there are those that try to cosplay animoo moeblobs too.

>> No.20998573

>>20998208
It's the same in the west. No one gave a shit about liking teens and/or petite bodies in the 80s. All this shit recently is the consequence of letting retarded kids and their retarded parents on the internet (previously full of non-retarded nerdy kids and intelligent adults) as broadband became popular, and the resulting scare over imaginary internet boogeymen preying on kids online.

>> No.20998671

I don't know enough to really comment, but japan's mindset before global standards crept in just seem more natural to me. The current western mindset celebrates violence and death and looks at the youthful human body as something shameful and criminal instead of something to appreciate. This also means such material only appears from criminal or exploitative sources in the west now, further reinforcing the mentality people have, it's a shame.

>> No.20998731

>>20998573
>imaginary internet boogeymen preying on kids online
Sorry but the pedophiles actually exist, they are not some kind of boogeyman. The problem is that the fear and insecurity blew out of control and internet started being more and more accessible to sensitive people and gave voice to those people.
Basically, internet reproduced on the virtual world what would have happened if suddenly, all the continents came to be linked together again with zero border aspect: clash of cultures with some more crude (and less victimized) than others and people are making an allergic reaction, with Twatter being the channel where those allergic people could vent, gather a personal army and use their influence to change the world to however their desires want to it to be and create their own perfect world where nothing will ever break their little bubble.
That said, as I said above, I've talked with a few Japanese friends and they told me that pedophiles do act in Japan and are causing trouble, albeit to what extent, that I don't know. Media tend to censor/fake things that displease them or they are not interested in.

>> No.20998870

>>20998731
While pedos exist, the fears came from kids doing things like cybering each other and the news telling parents that pedos were grooming their children through chat rooms, instead of it just being the children being disruptive. There's real shit, like all the "child modeling" gravure websites that existed before the pedoscare got people to crack down on them, but it's mostly just boogeyman shit.

Also people always say "it was legal in Japan" but then they talk about photobooks and gravure which technically wouldn't even be illegal in America as nudity is not inherently pornography. I say America too, because it it were truly global standards, child pornography would most likely be defined as "under 14-16" like the majority of the western world accepts as old enough to consent. But on my point, did Japan actually make actual real deal sexual material before then?

>>20998208
>(Ruroni Kenshin’s creator Nobuhiro Watsuki, for example)
I'm pretty sure he had real deal stuff and not just some old collection of photobooks.

>lolita fashion
Has nothing to do with loli or children. It's just old women dressing up like dolls, popularized by a hair metal drag queen. It's like a combination of western goth and steampunk subcultures glued together with Japanese kawaii.

Also teenagers and middle school students aren't pedophilia.

>With that in mind, what are your thoughts on the Japanese concept lolicon and even the prevailing “kawaii culture” to this day?
I think lolicon itself is a disease of the mind. Not because they are attracted to young girls but because they obsess over signs of youth and other such stuff. When they're like "ungh loli piss quaff quaff quaff" you know they have a problem. It's not that they're a little girl, it's that they're a little girl in gym shorts and sailor top holding a recorder and with a bandaid on her knee.

There's nothing wrong with loli art/manga/anime/games however. There is the problem of people thinking giving them tits makes it okay. If saying they're adults, even when there are people who are petite as adults or even never go through puberty, isn't okay, then giving them tits when you convert a manga to anime isn't either. I do think focusing on stuff like artwork takes away focus from real issues.

I also think eventually Japan itself is going to come under assault, not just loli/shota manga but all ero manga, gravure, idols, and even cultural stuff like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBVxGv1tS4s (which I suspect will be taken down by tomorrow after being fine for years.) will probably come under fire.

>> No.20998927

Fuck globalization, it ruined the world.

>> No.20999027

>>20998927
Unironically. It pushed cultures close to one another and when cultures mix, they get diluted/dissolved into nothingness. The whole "muh diversity" is nothing but a lie from the ****** masterminds, it aims at only one thing: depriving countries of their national and cultural significance and backgrounds so that the NWO can be easier to enforce. We're most likely talking about a hundred years plan, not something immediate.
When people say that culture evolves and changes, they fail to understand that countries were still no linked together when cultures did change. But now that it's all "coming together" and differences are being erased, where will we see cultural differences between countries building up due to history and isolationism?
Funnily, internet might actually have been the worst thing to have ever happened to culture.

>> No.20999057

>>20998208
The "demonization" and even atracction to underage girls has to do whit the rise of feminism and the influence of western crhistian values that make people ashamed and scared of their own sexuality.

>> No.20999131

>Ever thought about a why loli in anime/games, lolita fashion, the school girl fetish, and so many other similar things exist specifically in Japanese culture?
Girls got married younger back in the days.
It's not uncommon to see them married at the age of 13-15.
People like to argue "but back then the average life expectancy of people are lower, of course they get married sooner!"
It doesn't change the fact that for thousands of years, people got married at a younger age, hence their DNAs are wired to seek young partners for the best chance of survival.
Some states in the US still has 14 as the age of consent for girls. Japan raised the age of consent to 18 by prefectural laws, but nationally it's still 13.
I live in a backwater third world country, and until around a decade ago, you can still marry a 13 year old. This whole "18 is the legal age of consent" is a very recent thing, and honestly I feel it's a very flawed concept.

To begin with, the concept of "age of consent" was introduced because of emancipation of women. The concept of dating is a very recent thing from biological evolution perspective. Back in the day, girls didn't get a say about their marriage partner. Their parents chose it for them. Women were always under the watch of their parents, or their husbands. The dangerous side of this the concept of "age of consent" is when people came under the illusion that a person can automagically make sound decision after reaching said age of consent. What's worse is how we overly protect anyone under that "age of consent", treating a 15 year olds like they are 11 year olds, thereby preventing them from learning how to make sound decision by learning from experiences and making mistakes.

>With that in mind, what are your thoughts on the Japanese concept lolicon and even the prevailing “kawaii culture” to this day?
No matter how hard you try to shove down social engineering, you can't fool biology.
I'm waiting the day this whole experiment blows up so hard it also hit the face of whoever thought of this. I hope I'm still alive when that happens.

>> No.20999133

Since I stick to 2D I don't have a lot to say, but >>20998671
>The current western mindset celebrates violence and death and looks at the youthful human body as something shameful and criminal instead of something to appreciate
this is something I've also noticed and it's completely disgusting. When you romanticize the depiction of some of the most severe crimes around: murder, you aren't in a position to criticize anything else.

>> No.20999139

>>20999027
Why would someone develop and participate in a plan that they couldn't reap any immediate benefits from?

>> No.20999142

>>20999139
The masterminds do benefit from it.
The country leaders that participates, either participated willingly in exchange of something (money, power), or were forced at a gunpoint. The term "USA spreads democracy" didn't came out of nowhere.

>> No.20999146

>>20999131
If it "blows up", it's going to be feminism causing guys to fuck young boys like romans, greeks, and old japanese did rather than some lolicon revolution.

>> No.20999263

>>20998208
>>20999027

>>20985957

>> No.20999306
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20999306

>>20999133
It's not exactly like romanticizing murder, although that's around, it's more a deep ingrained fetish for death that probably stems from Christian dogma and a martyr complex. Life is sin and suffering and death is eternal paradise, but you're not allowed to just kill yourself because that'd be cheating, somebody else has to do it. And everyone wants to be a victim of something, so things that are generally harmless are blown out of proportion and cause a lot of unneeded pressures in society. These people aren't exactly practicing christians either, they've just inherited their mentality without realizing it.
Similar ways of thinking exist all over the world, but it's gotten so prominent due to "globalism" that's really just American hegemony and influence. America was always a haven for religious zealotry and puritanism, from the first people that colonized it, the Great Awakenings, temperance movements, and so on. But that seems to be diminishing and things will probably return to normal sooner or later.

>> No.20999325

>>20999142
>>20999027
back to /pol/ with your ****** masterminds, faggot

>> No.20999325,1 [INTERNAL] 

Basis

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