DJT- Daily Japanese Thread #1981

[Anonymous No.]

This is a Japanese language learning thread designed by and for those interested in degeneracy media such as anime, manga, light novels, and Japanese video games.

Read the Guide linked below before asking how to learn Japanese:
http://djtguide.neocities.org/

Check the Cornucopia of Resources before asking where to download X or Y:
https://djtguide.neocities.org/cor.html

Previous thread >>19596279

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605000

カタカナ　ディッド　ナシング　ロンッグ～！

[Anonymous No.]

So how do you differentiate between ッ and シ?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
Ｗｈａｔｅｖｅｒ　ｗｏｒｋｓ　ｆｏｒ　ｙｏｕ．　Ｉ　ｍａｄｅ　ｉｔ　ｓｉｍｐｌｅ－　ｔｓｕ　ｉｓ　ｍｏｒｅ　ｖｉｏｌｅｎｔ，　ｂｒｉｅｆ　ｓｏｕｎｄ－　ｌｉｋｅ　ｓｏｍｅｔｈｉｎｇ　ｈｉｔｔｉｎｇ　ａ　ｇｒｏｕｎｄ．
ｓｏ　ツ　ｈａｓ　ｍｏｒｅ　ｖｅｒｔｉｃａｌ　ｄｏｔｓ　ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ　ｉｔ’ｓ　ｆａｌｌｉｎｇ　ｄｏｗｎ．　Ｓｈｉ　ｉｓ　ｍｏｒｅ　ｓｏｆｔ　ｓｏｕｎｄ，　ｌｉｋｅ　ａ　ｓｗｏｒｄ　ｇｏｉｎｇ　ｔｈｒｏｕｇｈ　ｆｌｅｓｈ，　ｓｏ　シ　ｉｓ　ｍｏｒｅ　ｈｏｒｉｚｏｎｔａｌ－　ｌｉｋｅ　ｋａｔａｎａ　ｓｌａｓｈｉｎｇ　ｈｏｍｅｌｅｓｓ　ｄｕｄｅ　ｔｏ　ｔｅｓｔ　ｎｅｗ　ｓｗｏｒｄ．

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
With your eyes. っis smaller than し.

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
Very very simple

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012

[Anonymous No.]

私は鯨

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
ッ is more smug

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
Tsu, T, dashes start from the top ツ
Shi, S, dashes start from the side シ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605011
When I fist learned the katakana they were cute and it was like sounding out English words with a terrible accent. Now they just slow you down. They're everywhere

[Anonymous No.]

As for 私, ゲイ.

[Anonymous No.]

What's the deal with the other site that was being linked in the op a few threads ago, are there two djt sites? I was going to ask about it earlier but the thread fell off the catalog before I could ask.

[Anonymous No.]

I've seen people complain more about katakana than kanji. Katakana is the real pleb filter.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605285
This, although learning katakana only takes the first few days.

[Anonymous No.]

Is reading vns even considered reading? You won't be exposed to situations that happen in them.
What can you even read? Novels? 2chan? Internet articles?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605308
There is no such thing as reading.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605308
What vns are you reading? Stuff in fate happens in most people's lives if you account the fiction and history books the average high school graduate is supposed to have read.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605308
Newspapers?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605351
Time to start that Core10k then.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605418
How real is this?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605351
>newspapers
not reading because reading is not reading

[Anonymous No.]

>氷の刃
Doesn't mean what I expected it to, but I'm loving all these chuuni words that have existed since god knows when

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605504
What's chuuni about it?

[Anonymous No.]

Remember to read the best nihongo guide ever made to become the best nihongoer in thread

https://nihongobyjamal.neocities.org/

[Anonymous No.]

You accidentally the shift key, jamal.

[Anonymous No.]

i didnt actually post that lol

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>19604447
Changing font from default fixed it after all, thanks

[Anonymous No.]

How hard is kokoro?
www.aozora.gr.jp/cards/000148/files/773_14560.html

[Anonymous No.]

just read it

[Anonymous No.]

just read manga

[Anonymous No.]

just take a look at these

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605694
I can read that. Are visual novels reading?

[Anonymous No.]

no

[Anonymous No.]

yall can decide the retard shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605643
This site is useful.
http://sosekiproject.org/kokoro/index.html
It's not too hard for something written in 1910s but different enough from modern Japanese that you will misinterpret a lot if you have no experience with old novels.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605717
That looks like a neat website!
>pic related
oh whelp my understanding of grammar is nowhere near solid. Better book a class with my local uni.

[Anonymous No.]

go to college like your mom does

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605896
Two or three years of college-level Japanese study is the equivalent of reading Tae Kim and like one book.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605916
More like a Japanese major == a month of /djt/

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605907
I'm very proud of my mom who's 67 and yet still want to learn about business accounting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012

[Anonymous No.]

i think the kid in japanese 101 at community college steamrolls the average djter at this point

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605916
you mean just doing genki for 2 years. you can finish tae kim in like a month

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605931
He's probably far better at talking.

In general, not just Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605945
yeah 2 years of genki is the equivalent of skimming tae kim and reading like one book
what was hard to understand

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605261
word on the street is the site can't be transferred to a new maintainer for some reason so someone rehosted it and started making it sexy (it's not sexy) and dark (at least it's dark)

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605308
are you one of the people who thinks anime will damage your ability to act normal
there's plenty of valuable language in many vns and even if there wasn't you'll at least gain vocabulary with which you can discuss fiction, probably one of your interests
you can worry about learning how real people talk when your comprehension isn't shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605991
This. Reason is that the current/old site has a premium account.
>>19605261
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605931
That'll change in a few months when I've finished RTK and started reading.

[Anonymous No.]

your comprehension will always be shit till you start fuckin with real ninjas

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606013
Also I was wondering something. When someone asks me how long I've been learning Japanese should I include the time I spent in RTK even though I didn't learn Japanese while doing it?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606028
if you don't, you're lying to make it look like you used your time more wisely

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606028
the more time you say youve spent on it the more likely they are gonna ask you to say something for them and then youre truly fucked

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606015
nice self own

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606028
also the reason the average will go up is because you will realize that you can't learn japanese and leave djt

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606028
You start counting the day you've been learning Japanese the day you started kana.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606059
But I knew that RTK isn't learning Japanese so I'd be lying if I included the time spent in RTK.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606078
what if i learned kana 11 years ago but didn't put another minute into japanese until this year

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606073
? you did that wrong

anyway trust me once youve spent some time in the streets pushin product and watchin ninjas blood get spillt over ￥5000 bills youll look back on the you of this time and realize how virgin you truly were

speaking from experience here

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606081
why don't you solve this problem by just giving them more detail:
"well i spent 3 months memorizing 2000 symbols and not learning japanese and then i spent x months learning japanese"
yeah they're not going to get it if they don't know that kanji aren't words but you'll be doing the best you can without dumping too much unwanted trivia on them

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606089
Then you end up with a worse record than nukemarine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606099
did you at least walk away with a lot of 万
i bet that's how you got your pc98

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606099
Nice comprehension too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606107
if you didn't learn kana long before you committed to learning japanese you don't belong on this board

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606114
i totally comprehended that youre trash at posting

[Anonymous No.]

ps bring back flags

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606113
nah i just had one before they were considered retro or whatever

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606100
I think I'll do this, but I've considered just subtracting 110% of the time spent in RTK off of the time spent on actual Japanese (when I get to actual Japanese), because of the longterm speed benefits of RTK.

[Anonymous No.]

lmao someone just sent me this

i remember some of you were wondering how to make money now that you know japanese and well i have the answer

mirror mirror on the wall whos the strongest amerifat of them all

is it (you)?

[Anonymous No.]

Are 6k Core + all kyouiku kanji enough to read VNs?

[Anonymous No.]

spoiler you dont even have to be able to read kanji to easily read a hentai game what with all the text hooking and whatnot

what you need to do is know japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606168
With frequent use of a dictionary, yes.

[Anonymous No.]

After working my way through Genki 1+2, Shin Kazen Master N4, Tae Kim's guide and 5 chapters of Tobira, I was pretty burned out from doing textbooks. My way of practicing reading comprehension up until now was reading whatever is included in the reading sections of the books and NHK Easy. Then I discovered DJT and read the guide and saw that people here generally recommend learning primarily through reading. So I got myself some raw manga. I got SoL manga and harem manga as I heard those are easier to read. Naturally, I kept my expectations low as I knew I won't be able to understand all of it. I thought my biggest hurdle would have been constantly looking vocab and I was correct to some extent in that regard.

Yes, I do have to look up words every sentence but I don't mind that. However, my comprehension utterly sucks. Which is weird because 80% of the grammar I come across isn't foreign to me and I'm able to recognize the patterns and yet I can only understand about 50% of what I read. So far I only finished one volume and I'm getting into the second one. The first one I understood about 70% of it but that's because I watched the anime so I had some idea of what was going on. I'm into my second one and not even done with the first chapter and I'm completely lost. And it's just your typical harem stuff.

At this point, I don't know what to do. Do I just give up and hit the books and then try again? Or do I continue to bang my head against the wall? What did you guys do?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606210
quote this post >>19606015 to the guy on reddit that you copied that post from

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606192
that applies to core2k and no additional kanji as well

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606224
it also applies to the top 500~1000 words of core plus some mining to fill in the remaining obscenely frequent words that fell out of core 2k/6k

[Anonymous No.]

Could someone help explain to me why the の particle is used in situations like 私のばか or the more infamous お兄ちゃんのばか?
I understand it in the possessive sense, and in the noun connecting sense such as 高校の先生, but it seems out of place in a descriptor like this because wouldn't this be a は for the subject?

[Anonymous No.]

フリーターになりたい

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606315
You answered your own question.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606334
Noun connecting seems vague though, and wouldn't the subject identifier take precedence in this type thing as its describing an aspect of the person?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606354
Okay here you go
https://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/jn/171157/meaning/m0u/%E3%81%AE/

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606315
When in doubt, hinative
https://hinative.com/ja/questions/461777

[Anonymous No.]

Hi r/djt been a long time since I've been here, how's the thread been?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606389
shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606367
>>19606386
thanks anons.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606386
I had no doubts before opening that.

[Anonymous No.]

What kind of an abomination is this 蹴

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606399
don't worry it's just the power of foreigners

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606408
Can't you even post the download link to this very interesting manga?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606408
please post in english no one in this thread knows that language

[Anonymous No.]

My new favorite genre of YouTube video is turn of the 21st century テレビ ドキュメント detailing the lurking danger of ネトゲ addiction and the degeneracy of the ニート/ひき 性格.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5TfQKn73t4

What are you gays watching?

[Anonymous No.]

Epic namefagging, how exciting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606408
Lost me at the second line. I don't know what に is doing there.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606408
>早くませんでしたか

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606422
>It's Japanese.
well that explains it, yeah no one in this thread knows that language

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606424
君のケツに蹴り

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606435
>>19606441
>>19606408
W-what are you even trying to say? Are you asking for translations or is this some kind of ARG?

[Anonymous No.]

please do not attempt to communicate in japanese if you do not know japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606441
you seem to be new here or at least you haven't been around lately
i was making a self-deprecating humor about the absolute state of djt
冗談だよね

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606434
Your ass is kicked? Gets kicked? Got kicked? But I don't see what role に plays there, I'm just guessing based off yomichan vocab.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606453
英語できません場合は、英語を使わらないでください。

>>19606456
You're replying to something that is either a bot or someone with severe autism .

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606464
>使わらないでください

[Anonymous No.]

8 years on this site and I just filtered my first person. Wow.

[Anonymous No.]

Oh yeah by the way reports seem to have a rule-being-infringed selector now, so if you report someone you can make it much more likely that your report is understood and interpreted correctly.

Just saying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606464
if it's a bot i'm far more impressed than if it's a human
regardless they're not the worst we've had

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606453
私がすごい語に日本人は出来るあります。

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606480
僕もうできるできる

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606469
I'm just intrigued by how little sense you make.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606487
>https://www.teamgaki.com/
Oh shit, I haven't watched the Batsu games since...hospital? News office? Gonna go spend half a day on this

[Anonymous No.]

Is this that literally insane shitposter that uses google translate?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606504
>穿孔包皮
Oh noo

Also I just realized 包茎 and 包皮 are different.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606510
Thank you for shedding some light. I don't think google translate could fabricate such unnatural Japanese though...

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606004
I unironically agree with the guy that said if you speak like anime character that that is great. They are paid money to speak.

[Anonymous No.]

Is there any way to turn around all cards in a deck?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606504
>タイキック
A literal classic, this one

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606539
Depends. You will speak clearly but in super casual settings you won't sound very natural because it uses intonation and word slurring not found in anime.

[Anonymous No.]

i like this guy

cheers mate

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606545
what do you mean 'turn around'?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606545
if you have to ask this, you are probably too inexperienced to not know whether it's actually a good idea to swap your card fronts and backs (hint: it's usually not a good idea)

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606548
But it gets you into that good enough range that you're understandable, and they're understandable, so everything works out, albeit awkwardly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606548
do you believe that you wont notice the speech conveys a certain attitude, or that it's difficult to fix from listening to others speak?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606552
As I said. Change question and answer sides.

>>19606553
I'm trying to improve my recalling since I'll be going to Japan in a year but there's no decent deck to practice recalling.
I already know a decent amount of Japanese, recognition is hardly a problem anymore, but I'm obviously continuing my recognition deck as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606574
You can edit the formatting of the cards by going to "Browse" and then..."Cards" or "Format". Sorry, don't have anki with me at the moment.

[Anonymous No.]

imoto tan is that you wildin out over there

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606574
if you mean recalling japanese words via english translations, don't do this
you are reinforcing the habit of bad translating what you want to say
even if it wasn't a bad idea synonyms will fuck your retention
if you want to be able to hold a conversation more naturally, have conversations

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606574
>I'm trying to improve my recalling
you want english on the front and japanese on the back? that's called a production card
in general it's NOT a good idea to turn a deck made for recognition (e.g. core) into a production deck because there are too many synonyms

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606593
reinforcing the bad habit of translating
i'll go learn english now

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606570
俺はメヒコ国籍

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606574
>As I said. Change question and answer sides.
Go to Browse and select "Cards...". Then just swap the thing on the "Front Template" box and the thing under the <hr id=answer> on the "Back Template" box.

Of course, this all depends on the complexity of your deck.

Also don't do this

[Anonymous No.]

わたしはゲイALLDAY

[Anonymous No.]

「ではないでしょうか？( ^)o(^ )」Why is this grammar so comfy

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606617
japanese is comfy

[Anonymous No.]

how do i filter namefags?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606593
>>19606596
Sorry, yeah, production.
Since you're so curious: I wanted to try making a deck with Furigana on the front and Kanji on the back as I mainly want to practice writing Kanji in combnation with words. I already have a deck to practice individual Kanji writing, but I have troubles producing actual words since I forget which Kanji is used when.
(I'll have Japanese classes in Japan so I'll have to be able to write by hand)

>>19606578
>>19606611
Thanks guys, worked perfectly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606631
the garbage is part of the djt experience, don't avert your eyes, next thing you know you'll be filtering half of the thread and living in denial

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606635
fair enough
be careful you don't create ambiguous cards (homophones with no disambiguation)

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606635
>I wanted to try making a deck with Furigana on the front and Kanji on the back as I mainly want to practice writing Kanji in combnation with words
a deck like core should work for that. you can have kana and english translation on one side, and kanji on the back

[Anonymous No.]

>story happens in osaka
>unassisted comprehension instantly drops from 90 to 70%

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606648
Yeah, that's pretty much what I did.
Best about the 6k deck is that the sort field is the Kanji field so it was really easy to suspend all the Hiragana/Katakana words.

[Anonymous No.]

I have learned my hiragana and katakana multiple times and forgotten them multiple times. That's about as far as I get every time I try to learn Japanese. Months pass between attempts. Am I NGMI?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606720
You're forgetting them because you're not reading every day and reinforcing them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606548
Then watch jdramas and YouTube.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606720
only you have the power to gmi or ngmi

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605021
>>19605025
>>19605048
>>19605075
>>19605205
>>19605928
You can't be serious

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606738
Why not?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606738
what's wrong with the middle two

[Anonymous No.]

ふぐ

たべたい

[Anonymous No.]

pisses me off so fucking much that yomichan usually only has audio for the dictionary form of verbs

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606839
Why would you need anything else?

[Anonymous No.]

勝った方が負けた方に、素直に『ごめんなさい』と謝る
Who apologizes to who? 99% of retarded Japanese learners will get this wrong.

[Anonymous No.]

おちんぽ

超しゃぶりてえ

[Anonymous No.]

>SES instead of IQ
lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606917
Winners to losers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606951
Wrong

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606917
you to me

[Anonymous No.]

is すごいでかい more grammatical than すごくでかい, and if so, why?
doesn't it take an adverb to describe an adjective, or does that not apply in nihongonese?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606959
Explain yourself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606990
it's slang

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606995
I don't get it either.

[Anonymous No.]

in djt people will tell you youre wrong for no reason

but its the people who get tripped up by it look even worse

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607026
Where did you find it?
>>19607036
I don't care dude I want to learn. I know I'm in the wrong place for that but I can try.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607045
In what I was reading. It's not actually the whole sentence either.

[Anonymous No.]

Have been studying japanese for 1 year and just took the j-cat. How retarded am I?

Honestly I am shocked that reading is my lowest score as I feel reading is my best strength.

I also think the listening section is more a memory test than anything else.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
You're only retarded for thinking that's a bad score after only one year, it's normal as fuck. Did you think you were fluent now?

[Anonymous No.]

Only N3 after an entire year? I hope I don't learn that slow.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607228
I don't neccessarily think it is bad, if anything I though my grammar would be worse as I never really study grammar. But I would hoped to be at least n2 and I feel cheated on the reading.

[Anonymous No.]

なんでアメリカは

にほんにげんばく

おとしたの？

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
you prolly literally were lost on the majority of that test

so i highly doubt reading is your strength

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607293
過去は過去で今は今

今日も遊ぼうぜ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606917
The loser should apologize for not giving a good enough fight, if anime is any indication.

[Anonymous No.]

10000 hours of anime is literally the keys to the lac

then its up to you to get it in the ignition switch

you bitch

[Anonymous No.]

or you can get a ride with one of those fancy push button starts

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
At least you did better than nukemarine and the japaneseinayear guy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607343
what did they get

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
this is a completely fine score for a year of studying

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
How much daily study to you usually do?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606004
Depends on your level of self-awareness. I know people who talk like anime characters who can't even speak Japanese because they watch so much anime they've just forgotten how real social interactions are supposed to work. It's the same shit with retards who watch too many American sitcoms, they get rude and petty and think that sarcasm is the funniest thing in the world. If you have a shred of self-awareness you should be fine.

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/user/NukeMarine/live
Our guy is live. Already learned a lot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607310
ひどい

あたしのことは

あそびだったのね

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607411
>It's the same shit with retards who watch too many American sitcoms, they get rude and petty and think that sarcasm is the funniest thing in the world.
I knew so many chinese girls that acted like this.
Was kind of cute.
Then it wasnt....

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607411
>It's the same shit with retards who watch too many American sitcoms
Could you BE any more wrong?

Anyway, what country's sitcoms are recommended?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607418
なんで感情的になるの

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607397
for my first 7 months I wasted a lot of time on anki and genki and stuff like that, but I started reading for like 1.5 hours a day 5 months ago and started watching raw anime for at least an hour a day like 3 months ago.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607433
きっとあのおんなとも

ニュークリアするきなのね

うわきもの！

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607411
More people should talk like anime characters

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607439
よしよしおいでおいで

わたしのかわいいニンジャよ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607435
Good progress then.

[Anonymous No.]

is there a way to filter kana posters?

[Anonymous No.]

How is this pronounced?

[Anonymous No.]

filter yourself out of existence dweeb

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607481
[choking noises]

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607461
べっ

べつに

ゆるしたわけじゃないんだからね

かんちがいしないでよね

[Anonymous No.]

is kanaposting the power of not remembering the kanji?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607220
JCAT is a random number generator pre-N1 level. Do you think they asked enough questions to grade you out of 100 in each category?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607481
ughghthghghhghgh

>>19607485
うんわかった

おにいちゃんはどこにも行かないよ

キミのそばにいるからね

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607481
put some throat into it my man

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607499
Honestly I will be inclinded to agree. I bet the percent error is quite high I bet as much as 20 points plus or minus.

[Anonymous No.]

i picked c for every answer and scored higher than that guy

how pathetic is that

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607525
どうしてウランをのうしゅくして

ひとのくにでばくはつさせようとおもったの？

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607561
そんな話どうでもいい

大切なのはキミとわたしだけ

ほかの誰もいらない

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606720
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKVbqhDlUO8

[Anonymous No.]

置いたままになっているスーツケース

Haven't seen ままに before. Does this mean "suitcases that were left behind"? Why not just スーツケース置いたのが？

Thanks for any help.

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FE0cVhQdh30

[Anonymous No.]

何もわからないままに次の敗者が現れた

[Anonymous No.]

Daily reminder

[Anonymous No.]

which one are you

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607733
does anyone know enough kanji to make this look like it was edited by someone who knows japanese

[Anonymous No.]

nah that shits not salvageable

its a great representation of djt tbqh

[Anonymous No.]

内野の人間は相手にボールを当てられたら外野へ。　外野には最初にひとりだけ置いておき、その人物は　内野で最初にリタイアした人間と交代で中に入る」

What does this mean?

[Anonymous No.]

it means your out

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607818
It means they are playing dodgeball

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607818
ドッジボールはドッジボールだけど

だれがはじめたのかはしらない

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607844
Well yeah, but I can't understand what this sentence 外野には最初にひとりだけ置いておき、その人物は　内野で最初にリタイアした人間と交代で中に入る is conveying.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607854
Game starts like this and then blue throws a ball

[Anonymous No.]

maybe you should watch the classic comedy film "dodgeball"

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607872
Oh okay.

[Anonymous No.]

I always got picked last

[Anonymous No.]

ill pick you first bro

[Anonymous No.]

Kinda gay

[Anonymous No.]

Are these websites feeding us bullshit about the SOV word order like Tae Kim said on his website, or is he incorrect about the so-called "myth"

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607995
How many books have you read in japanese?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607995
>Tae Kim
>Correct
Pick one.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608004
>>>/v/
Pick one.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608000
I've read plenty, but am still a bit unsure because of my minimal level.

>>19608004
What's wrong with Tae Kim?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608018
If you read enough you will find the answer you want on your own. The truth like most things is that they are both right. Things might lean more towards one side or the other but that depends on what you are reading.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607995
In the grand scheme of things, does it really matter if Japanese is SOV or not?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608018
According to the people who can speak Japanese here, Tae Kim simplifies his explanations of grammar a bit too much.

According to the Masters of Moon over here, reading even a glimpse of Tae Kim will ruin your grammar forever. Literally forever, literally ruin.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608028
Japanese sure is a SOB

[Anonymous No.]

From a book I'm reading :
While planning things, B and C are having a heated argument over how to go about holding a certain event. A mediates by suggesting they settle the issue with a 勝負 and is telling them the win/lose conditions
A「勝った方が負けた方に、素直に『ごめんなさい』と　謝って、一緒に行事を盛り上げる約束をするんだ」
The thing is to me, I understand this as the winning side (勝った方が) has to apologize to the losing side (負けた方に) and I cannot wrap my head on how the grammar here could mean the opposite. Later dialogue makes it clear the loser will be apologizing too, there's no joke or mistake in all of this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608029
Reinforcing misleading or incorrect grammar when you're too early in your studies to understand why it's wrong is retarded no matter how you spin it. Shitty grammar guides like Tae Kim should be avoided at all costs.

[Anonymous No.]

Why the fuck is this in core?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608054
It's one of the most common forms of gambling in japan.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608028
I supposed not, but I can't wrap my head around these websites feeding people about the SOV bullshit because it makes people second guess if they're grammatically correct.

>>19608029
>According to the Masters of Moon over here, reading even a glimpse of Tae Kim will ruin your grammar forever. Literally forever, literally ruin.

I cannot tell if you're just fucking with me, But the content Tae Kim shits on his website isn't much different than the Genki Books, JFZ, and other contents I've read so far about grammar. The only difference between them is his breakdowns is a bit confusing and less upfront.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608063
>Genki Books, JFZ, and other contents I've read so far about grammar
Those will also ruin your grammar. Don't read them.

[Anonymous No.]

im not worried about ppl reinforcing bad grammar because spending time with nihongo is gonna mostly fix that

its the reinforcing bad interpretation of various things in nihongo because you have no checks and balances in place to keep you from running amok so youre allowed to just think whatever you want about things thing that im concerned about

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608054
Pachinko is the popular gambling methods in Japan, and maybe the only one at that since it's strictly forbidden.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608061
>>19608072
I wonder how much skill is there in this game, or if it's mostly glorified slots.

[Anonymous No.]

if you get caught fuckin around in pachinko youre gonna get your fingertips cut off

[Anonymous No.]

Looking at lists like these makes me realize learning English must be just as frustrating.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608067
Then what book or method do you recommend? Because those are the most popular sources that was brought up to study grammar.

>>19608076
It's luck based like slots.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608083
The only reason I get through English learning was because One Piece was translated into English far faster than it was translated into Indonesian and I like telling my friends spoilers about future chapters/volumes.

Also Friends.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608083
Learning Japanese for a while made me open up a bit about the English Language and know whoever want to learn it will have just as much of a tough time if you're in Jap land since it is a literal language.

[Anonymous No.]

friends ftw

[Anonymous No.]

nobody i know growing up loves friends, they're all into Seinfeld

[Anonymous No.]

おやすみなさい, /djt/

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608130
good choice

[Anonymous No.]

wait do parsers actually do what they sound like they do? why would anyone want to use that, are they literal brainlets that can't tell where words begin and end? parsers aren't reading

[Anonymous No.]

>>19602254
Thank you very much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608190
I used a parser for a while since I used Translation Aggregator for my VN reading before the glorious Firefox+Rikai+Clipboard Monitor combo. It was more annoying than helpful because it was wrong a lot.

Same thing with programs that add furigana to kanji. Beginners think they are the best, but there are so many words that can be read multiple ways that they aren't very useful at all. Nothing annoys as much as having a word with multiple readings and not knowing which one is correct. Fuck 触れる and 間.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608210
Incidentally, ふれる is "touch" and さわれる is "Touch". Help any?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
シ (she) is looking him at ツ this guy

>>19605928
This is also top-tier mnemonics.

>>19608190
I used parsers for awhile until I got use to where words ended and where they started, then I ditched. Parsers are a crutch but crutches can be used to teach you how to walk as long as you don't stick with them too long.

[Anonymous No.]

I'm not sure if I properly understand what I'm reading.

Do I just go on reading, moving on with what is possibly misunderstood?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608237
I aim for a modest 80% understanding, if I can't understand at least that much even with googling then the reading is above my level and I'll have to try again later.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608237
If there is a translation you can check it if you want to know for "sure" (Remember most translations are bad/wrong). If there isn't a translation then you don't really have a choice. Most misunderstandings get cleared up if you keep going.

There were times where I spent 10+ minutes trying to understand a single line before finally giving up and moving on. Then after reading the next line I understood everything perfectly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608219
さわれる means able to touch. さわる is the base.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608289
Read the post I was responding to before responding to me.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607481
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44SMjWulTqM

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MEoYKHUELeA

Poor man, leddit fucking hates Steve.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608372
He hadn't even started the AMA, how do you know leddit hates Steve?

Also, which leddit? Maybe r/languagelearning is different.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608382
I posted on the Japanese learning subleddit for awhile. At one point I had brought up Steve and that people should read and listen a lot and I got downboated to like -50 (a ridiculous amount for that sub) and people starting replying to me saying that Steve was fake, only knows set phrases he's seen in readings over and over again, scripts his videos, etc. Mind you this wasn't just one person, it was a horde of morons.

But you're right, /r/languagelearning might be completely different. I get into the habbit of thinking all the subs are the same which is probably unfair to say.

I hope they like him so I can read the thread afterwards and actually get something from it.

[Anonymous No.]

I hope reddit hates him because he's our guy and every redditor that users ineffective methods is a redditor that won't learn japanese

[Anonymous No.]

You guys don't know how lucky you are here, your arguments about X vs Y method are proof of our freedom. Just bringing up lots of reading and listening on the japanese subleddit is grounds for post deletion. It's autism at its finest, really.

>>19608394
This is a really good opportunity to have him talk about stuff that he might not normally talk about so I do actually hope he's well received.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608406
It's funny because you're less likely to get downvoted into oblivion if it sounds like you're trolling, by like, recommending that everyone read shittons of doujinshi, than if you merely say that lots of reading and listening is good for you.

[Anonymous No.]

Answer to every question is LingQ

[Anonymous No.]

>山村
>さんそん

fucking why

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608422
Welcome to the Japanese language.

[Anonymous No.]

Any way to get the Google Cloud Text-to-Speech wavenet thing into Anki? It sounds a lot better than all the other TTS.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608388
I don't believe you.

[Anonymous No.]

I'm scared of writing things in Japanese because I know I'll make errors, so I think I'll just stick to reading, forever.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608480
You better believe it. I'm not willing to dig through leddit to find more examples but they're actually this stupid.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608485
good choice, stay safe

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608505
It's funny because Steve is actually one of the few megapolyglots that isn't full of shit while also not being a savant. None of the people shitting on him know his actual skill level in other languages. Yes, being N3-like in a language is a basic level of competency that is actually useful, and that's what he's like in most of them, except he's ~actually at that skill level~, not just someone who memorized enough to pass an N3-like test for those languages.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608512
He also doesn't even try to pass it off as fluency. Pretty much every time he ever comments on his level in anything other than Japanese or Chinese he says it's at the level where he can read what he's interested in and that's it. He constantly brings up his Arabic and Greek as "not there yet" too. Steve is one of the most honest man you can hope to ever find.

[Anonymous No.]

Does ithvnr not work with the ppsspp emulator anymore? It was working fine a couple of days ago but now it won't hook any text.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606720
>kana learning discussions
There should be a month-long ban for this shit. Just enough for you to learn enough Japanese to stop asking questions about the writing system.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608570
Oh well, time to learn Japanese, then.

[Anonymous No.]

>日本語をずっと前から勉強してきて、結局はやめた

Why is 勉強してきて in te-form instead of 強してきた?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608597
because it's not the end of the sentence

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608590
how can they start learning japanese if they don't know the secret optimal method
they'll just take another month off and come back fresh and ready to ask how to learn kana again

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608598
Oh. Is it really that easy? I've been overthinking it then.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608604
yep

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608610
I might as well ask my other question then, isn't the sentence technically the same if you omit してきて?
日本語をずっと前から勉強、結局はやめた is a proper sentence right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608618
if i'm not literally insane, that can be misinterpreted very easily, if not by default

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608038
Can anyone explain this? I don't get it either.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608599
Permanent ban for repeat offenders.
If memorizing 46 doodles is a problem, they definitely can't learn Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608618
You can't say "I've been study(noun) japanese .." , it has to be a verb - 勉強する. So no, it's not the same.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608634
it's actually grammatical, sorry, it just doesn't mean what they want

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608618
勉強し would work, I think

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608628
It sounds to me like the winner has to say sorry (probably a cultural thing about being humble) then the two will work together to do the winner's idea without any bad feelings.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608638
So 日本語をずっと前から勉強し、結局はやめた means the same as 日本語をずっと前から勉強してきて、結局はやめた ? The motion verb attached to 勉強 in the latter is just there for emphasis on "way back"?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608631
In English (or other languages), we remember the alphabets by their relation (what comes after H? I) but not by their position (what's the 17th alphabet). I wonder if Japanese is even looser.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608653
The nuance is different but I don't know Japanese enough to say in which way exactly. Using stem for conjunction is more of a formal style though

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608653
Yes. te-forms or verb stems is a way of combining two clauses/sentences/verbs

[Anonymous No.]

how fucked am i

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608739
How long of a break did you take

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608739
Not at all.

Nobody's gonna come to your house and kill you for not finishing all the Anki reviews. Just do what you can, when you can.

Unless you have a literal deadline for finishing your anki deck, you shouldn't have to worry. The most reviews I do is ~350-400 for RTK when I shifted to 70/day new cards.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608739
this is a japanese language learning thread, post about learning japanese not about memorizing symbols

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608756
SAVAGE

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608660
I understand that. My question was about 来る (きて) being attached to 勉強, when it seems to not change the meaning of the sentence. You could just have the te-form of 勉強する (して) for the same result.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608766
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/pages/dojg.html#basic%E6%9D%A5%E3%82%8B%E3%83%BB%E3%81%8F%E3%82%8B(2)

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608790
So basically "I've studied from a long time ago" vs "I studied a long time ago".

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608654
There are at least two ways to order the kana, but I don't see any reason to learn them.
Children in elementary school just read this table like you would read a novel (top to bottom, right to left).

[Anonymous No.]

Any good mnemonics for hirigana?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608823
The ones you make

[Anonymous No.]

>シツソノ
Broken language

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608823
Don't overthink it. Just grind hiragana for one day, then katakana for another one, and then mix both on third. That's one weekend for whole kana.
Make separate sessions for each row. Then combine rows.

You will be using it so much in the future that you will not forget it anyways (well, katakana can be tricky in that regard, but you will cope).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608833
>dbqp
Broken language

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608833
>>シツソノ

＋ン
＋リ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608766
>勉強してきて　
is more natural for the reason you've written(emphasis on "way back")
>勉強してきたが or 勉強してきたけれど
is even more natural in this case.
でも、どの文でも意味は通じるけどね！

other examples:
続けてきた努力が 実を結んで[pay off]、試験に受かった
（続けた努力が実を結んで、試験に受かった is less natural）
去年から少しずつ節約してきて、やっと100万円たまった
（去年から少しずつ節約して、やっと100万円たまった is less natural）

[Anonymous No.]

>I don't know any words with this kanji, but I know its English meanings

[Anonymous No.]

Do the videos in the Tae Kim guide give additional information, or are they just there for people who are too lazy to read?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608833
>ガソリン
Gets me every time when I'm going the hellblazing speed of 40kph.

>>19608848
>I'm going to memorize 2000 latin roots before starting my English journey!

>>19608868
There's no additional information and if there is then it's negligible.

[Anonymous No.]

Is there any way to increase size of Japanese characters with appchanx? I would like to have latin characters regular size, but kanji and kana a bit bigger. I just increased font size in settings, and it increases everything obviously, is there any extension, or something to do it?

[Anonymous No.]

>今日も一日頑張るぞい！
>now day something one day stubborn lengthen something
Thank you Heisig

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608878
>頑張って下さい
Firmly stretch the down. How is Japanese hard again?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608871
i would be surprised if there's a way to do this with html/css without parsing text and putting the japanese characters inside of divs or some sloppy hack like that
so the answer is probably no

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608848
Joke's on you, I'm learning obscure English words while learning obscure 漢字.
What's a Wisteria trellis? I don't know, but at least I can write it in Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608871
I want to bury my face into those socks

[Anonymous No.]

holy SHIT i just realized the second kanji from 頑張るis 張る from core

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608896
どうも、兄貴～！

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608878
>>19608894
>投票
Throw ballot. Thanks based Heisig.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608905
張る
Yeah, I also learned
貼る
along the way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608900
how is wisteria trellis obscure, are you esl?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608054
Core has a lot of words that you wouldn't expect are that common in most forms of literature like 大蔵省 (Ministry of Finance), which according to Takoboto isn't even in use anymore. It also has some relatively obsolete katakana words like ワープロ (word processor).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608076
>>19608091
If you watch Kaiji you'd be able to see how it can be skill-based but realistically speaking it's probably mostly luck-based. I guess there's slightly more user interaction than with slots though, no? Since it's a mechanical system you can somewhat influence how the balls will drop by choosing timing and so on. It's more like those coin pusher games I guess.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608914
I am, and I had never heard of either a Wisteria or a trellis.
They're both somewhat botanical terms, so in my opinion it falls under specialized vocabulary.
Never heard of a droshky before reading Russian literature either.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608847
>>勉強してきたが or 勉強してきたけれど
Hopefully these are later on in Tae Kim because I don't understand that yet.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608934
i don't know much about it but i think the influence is kind of an illusion, it seems like a chaotic system, the smallest difference makes too big of a result in the outcome for any control to actually exist

[Anonymous No.]

>状況
Status quo but of course. Thank you Heisig.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608944
makes sense then
as a native i did learn a few obscure words that were new to me, but those words weren't

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608958
具体的

[Anonymous No.]

i wanna give misa the dick

i watch her videos every day in an effort to learn japanese and have fallen in love with her

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608958
選手

[Anonymous No.]

>dict-tion-ar-y
>word state being characterized
ありがとうございます、ヘイシグさま！もう英語ができます！

[Anonymous No.]

>警察
Admonish guess. Based Heisig.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608958
代表

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608991
>警察署
Admonish guess signature. Nice one Heisig.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608986
Unlike 奴ら, 貴様 seems like it would be polite.
Is it meant to be ironic?

[Anonymous No.]

>ピッザ八つください
Pizza volcano please. Thanks WaniKani, $80 well spent!

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609008
?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609008
>>19608958
People who do this kind of criticism don't understand the point of RTK / similar programs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608909
Me again. I found

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/advanced-font-settings/caclkomlalccbpcdllchkeecicepbmbm/related

It is supposed to increase font size according to settings, but if I increase Japanese fonts it increases all fonts including English... Too bad, but it gives me hope there is a way to do it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609016
WaniKani teaches 八 as volcano

>>19609017
I'm not criticizing RTK even though it seems like it, I'm satirizing the idea of drilling kanji while ignoring actual study of the language. Sorry if it seemed otherwise.

[Anonymous No.]

¿λ

[Anonymous No.]

л

[Anonymous No.]

Does x時間目 where x is a number always mean xth hour? Or can it mean xth time or xth period or whatever?

[Anonymous No.]

Most of these combinations actually make sense if you understand the actual meaning(s) of the characters and not just a single ambiguous English counterpart.
However things like お洒落 or ご馳走様 don't make sense unless you have specific cultural/historical knowledge, for which I don't know a comprehensive resource.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609024
A bug?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609017
民 誰 為 斯 kind of 批 為 勿 尤 岳 RTK / 似 program

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609045
I mean, the volcano thing
I don't use WK, but as far as I know it teaches actual words

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609045
It's intentional. They also teach ヨ as Wolverine.

[Anonymous No.]

wanikani's component names are actively retarded

[Anonymous No.]

>mnemonics

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605075

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609059
t. st bernard dog and chihuahua with a human leg

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609076
stroke directions help

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609076
extept　

ツ =/= つ　
シ =//=し

And your explanation looks like it should.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609024
Are there really so many people who cram Heisig before doing *any* Japanese?

I started doing RTK months into my studies and I'm finding it helpful in locking down those words that I haven't been able to keep memorized just by learning vocab. It helps distinguish between similar kanji in a structured way.

Like, say that you learn the word 時間 and then a week later you learn the word 特別. The first character differs by only a single radical so you might be forcing your brain to make weird leaps like 'oh it's the kanji for time but with a sticky thing instead of two squares' but this will get you messed up later when you encounter a word like 待つ. Or worse, you might think that 特 and 待 are actually the same.

Doing all of RTK is probably too much effort for too little gain but doing a few chapters of it and skimming the rest of the book has helped me dissect and distinguish kanji better. I'd also tried radical study before but RTK worked better for me, and it's more interesting imo.

I prioritize reading and vocab but RTK is a useful supplement I think.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609090
I meant it the other way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609092
>Doing all of RTK is probably too much effort for too little gain
this combined with the fact that rtk is designed to be done in its entirety and not partially is the biggest problem with rtk
doing a little bit of it on the side is not a terrible idea

[Anonymous No.]

I wonder if Maatt actually has managed do troll someone to do RTK1 and 3 before learning any Japanese words to go with the characters.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609120
how many patrons does he have? how many of them have been patrons for over 4 months? probably at least that many have been successfully trolled

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609092
>Are there really so many people who cram Heisig before doing *any* Japanese?
Yes

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609090
sorry it was an epic ruse

[Anonymous No.]

oh man

i've been speaking gay japanese all this time

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608900
藤 is pretty important to learn since it's a very common Kanji for names.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609148
that means you are gay now

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609148
Yeah saying you're American is pretty fucking gay

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609120
He has, I've seen some things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609092
Believe it or not, the only characters I've ever had trouble distinguishing from each other are 識, 職 and 織, and that's only because I learned them in a single Anki session yesterday and they haven't sunk in yet. And also because 識 and 織 are both しき

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609172

omitting the da and saying amerikajin yo is gay japanese speech according to misa sensei

straight japanese say amerikajin da yo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609189
But 織 is おり

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609190
wait does this mean we should be saying 私はゲイよ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609199
組織

[Anonymous No.]

Opinions on radical approach to kanji? I can recognize Simple distint kanji but i notice that some have frighteningly similar looks bar like, one or two tiny sticks poking out elsewhere.
Do experienced readers still look at the character for more than an instant?

[Anonymous No.]

Are there any historical reasons why the 信 in 織田信長 is read as のぶ ?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609200

saying noun+yo or na adjective+yo without the da is gay. that's what she means. that's supposedly how stereotypical gay characters talk in anime

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609213
Learning to write them made it way easier for me to pay attention to small changes. But it's a lot of extra work, not sure if it's worth it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609213
I made a deck based on content tagged as radical from Kanji Damage and went through it quickly. Helped a lot (I still look up new kanji on KanjiDamage though).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609217
｛動｝のびる（ノブ）。のばす。つかえずにまっすぐのびる。〈同義語〉→申。「屈而不信＝屈シテ信ビズ」〔→孟子〕

[Anonymous No.]

Does anyone unironically still do drills? I was once told that "actually" is wrong for 実は because the answer "had to be two words for this exercise" (on a real life drill).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609217
織田ってかいて

おりたさんもいるんだよ

どっちかにしてほしいとおもう

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609564
aside from the fact that any learning app is a scam for lazy fucks
drilling sentence translation is clearly an awful idea

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609589
Thanks I'm glad I'm not the crazy one here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609564
Duolingo is the place where beginners "learning" 13 languages at the same time give bad advice with the confidence of a 60yo professional linguist.
And also the other guy is right, don't translate Japanese, understand it. You'll get to translating things when you're good enough and only if you actually need that skill.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608526
He is too pure for this world he is a saint.

[Anonymous No.]

わたしはアメリカ人よ

[Anonymous No.]

俺様はムリカ人なんだぜ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609596
unsure if you are disagreeing

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609665
I 100% agree with you, sorry for the ambiguity.

[Anonymous No.]

Starting over anki from the beginning because of dropping japanese for a year is the absolute worst.

[Anonymous No.]

Is this the Kansai-ben I've been warned about?

https://e-hentai.org/g/1267128/75083c9f35/

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609695
Pretty cute.

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9A_ybIlH_8
BASED NIGGERS

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609189
You haven't done Heisig?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609801
So far I haven't felt the need to.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609820
Could you please describe how you learn vocabulary with characters you haven't encountered before?

I sometimes feel like I may be doing something wrong so I am curious how other people do it?

Do you try writing them? Do you deconstruct them to different radicals? Etc.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609189
>識 I have discriminating taste. I'd rather listen to the words of a lecture than attend a kazoo concert. (Picture some snobby guy in a tweed jacket turning up his nose at entering a loud raucous kazoo recital).
>職 Worst post in history: quality checker at the kazoo factory. Imagine the toll on your ears!
>織 Spiderman weaves his way through the skyline while listening to his theme song on his ipod. It is played, of course, by kazoos.

Based Heisig

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609838
What the fuck do any of those stories have to do with the meanings of the kanji, what's his obsession with kazoos? You rtkids are worse than I thought.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609847
You dont know Japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609835
1) See a new word
2) Look it up on Jisho, because Core6k arbitrarily picked translations rarely tell me anything about the meaning of the word
3) Look how to write the kanji (or just write it, if I already figured out the correct stroke order)
4) Write it until I feel like I remember it
5) Fail the card until I can write it without looking at the card more than a fraction of a second

And I do it every single day, of course.

[Anonymous No.]

Imagine believing that 戠 is a kazoo.

[Anonymous No.]

What's a kazoo?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609890
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-sgw9bPV4A

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609890
t. I've never been on /f/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U873j77Njc0

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609838
Jesus, is this what RTKfags waste 4 months on?

[Anonymous No.]

Nice language you got there japs. Be a shame if you needed to express a simple idea in a timely manner.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609910
4 months vs mixing up kanji for the rest of your life

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609919
I'm not mixing up anything.
You do realize there are thousands of fluent JSLs who have never heard of RTK?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609919
That is a vast overestimation of how much more difficult not studying kanji through RTK makes things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609919
In fact, RTK is more of an EOP thing. How many languages has it been translated into?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609937
What sort of a person would study Japanese before English as a second language?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609949
Probably nobody, but just the fact that you CAN learn Japanese using English-language study materials doesn't mean that you WILL do it. Some prefer not to bother with language laddering.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609962
If you can't study in English, you probably don't know it yet.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609877
Thank you. I might try doing something similar, looks like I tend to spend too little time on new words and consequently forget them too frequently.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609962
English-language study materials are usually of a way higher quality than otherwise. I mean, take the djt guide. Should I have used only the study materials in my native language, I would've probably been stuck with a shittier Genki analogue and maybe some equally shitty Anki deck if I found out about Anki some way.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609925
Look man, do what works for you. RTK is not the only way but it's a good study aid for some. It's only truly shit if you don't do anything else and just assume that you'll learn the language organically after you know the kanji, but you can say that about vocab too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609919
>4 months
I've been doing LOTS OF READING AND LISTENING for about half a year now. I caved in just today, actually, and started studying JLPT kanji. I just did N5 and N4 kanji and didn't see a single one I didn't already know, about to do N3 soon. Don't get me wrong, I expect to come across kanji I don't know (I definitely don't know all 2,136) but the fact I haven't seen a single one yet and I'm already into N3 I think says a lot. And I don't think I'm particularly special in my kanji-learning abilities.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609981
Most people don't.

>>19610005
I know, I'm an Ameriboo, too.
But there are plenty of people who want to study more than one foreign language without reaching Upper Intermediate / Advanced in English (I personally know a girl who speaks Turkish better than English).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610050
> I'm an Ameriboo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610073
I used the term jokingly, but whatever.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607995
It matters zilch. Only smug worthless morons on reddit would care enough to criticize Tae Kim's mistakes.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607995
There are plenty of times it's not SOV but they might not be "grammatically correct". In the end it doesn't matter, read a lot and see for yourself. These explanations, even TK's, are for people who are afraid of reading and who will never see it in the wild so they have to be told about it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19608083
I've often used various idioms, knowing what they mean by seeing them used in countless contexts, only later going back and thinking about the words in the idiom to realize why the idiom only roughly makes sense. tl;dr literal translations are stupid and you can only acquire a language through input.

[Anonymous No.]

minna genki?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610453
watashi wa genki da desu

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610453
jisatsushina

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609847
>the meanings of the kanji
The extent to which an English keyword in RTK mimics a kanji's meaning is a bonus. It is not the point of RTK.

[Anonymous No.]

meerisan borupen kudasai desu

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609120
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs-cnMtTLh1_zymgji1KFxA/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheJapanCode/videos

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610453
Sayonara gozamaisu.

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2-QSKXGQ2Y

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610506
So it doesn't even teach you kanji meanings? It's even more useless than I thought.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610591
It uses a keyword roughly in line with the kanji's meaning in the majority of cases, but learning the meanings of kanji in English is only somewhat beneficial. The main point is to have a strong visual memory of all the kanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610605
So I have to go through tens of kazoo stories to remember 識, but then I can't even look it up or type it in because I don't know its reading or meaning?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610605
>People who go out of their way to learn all the kanji don't even do it right

Why would you not at least learn the keywords/meanings? The entire point of learning all the kanji is so you can see a word, let's say 扇風機, and say "oh, that's the kanji for fan, wind, and machine." What you're advocating is seeing 扇風機 and saying "oh, those are the scribbles I recognize."

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610627
You need to know an actual word the kanji is used in, preferably the one with the fewest homonyms, in order to "type" the kanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610632
I'm not advocating that Heisig change the keywords or that relevant keywords don't help you remember the Japanese word that a kanji comprise? I'm saying that they help but they're not the main point of RTK.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19609949
Chinese people

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610723
These certainly don't need RTK in any form

[Anonymous No.]

Mnemonics work better if you come up with them yourself. What the hell is the point in studying someone else's mnemonics?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606917
>>19608038

Are you guys saying this is suppose to mean the loser is apologising?

All I can see is winner apologise to loser. Am I missing something?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610777
Words work better if you come up with them yourself. What the hell is the point in studying someone else's words?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610787
Kanji meanings are factual, mnemonics are just a memory device.

RTK sucks

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610777
It's a lot of work to come up with them yourself and you can still get a lot further with someone else's mnemonics than no mnemonics.

[Anonymous No.]

rtks fine but you dont need it

its like grinding low rank gear in monhan so you have the best low rank gear before going into high rank

stop being noobs and just get some rank bitch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CIbBugfqeQ#t=74

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610787
The most retarded post in this thread so far. That's an achievement.

[Anonymous No.]

I actually just learned to differentiate between ッ and シ.
What I did was hang the signed pictures of both above my monitor and just stare at them from time to time.

[Anonymous No.]

Mnemonics are fucking retarded. If you have to review them then they are no more useful than just learning the actual information. The only people who use mnemonics are like elementary school kids and the non engineering students in basic science classes.

[Anonymous No.]

mnemonics are cool when used effectively but encoding japanese into them is indeed retarded

[Anonymous No.]

then again its rtk im surprised people still misunderstand its purpose

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610918
what's wrong with http://www.kanjidamage.com/kanji/761-far-away
for example?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610921
mnemonics are never good. only retards would think that. I must be better than like 90% of the people in this thread, because it shocks me how people in this thread still talk about kanji even though It is such a beginner topic. Just learn japanese no japanese person "knows" any kanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610939
no mnemonics are truly an epic memory hack watch some youtube videos about it youll see

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610930

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610939
it's crazy the extent to which people will say retarded shit like this just to troll against rtk

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610939
>no japanese person "knows" any kanji
japanese people spent 12 years of schooling being forced to write characters hundreds of thousands of times
it would take years of practice to come close to that kind of muscle memory
alternatively you can learn a few mnemonics, srs a dozen reviews over a few months and end up with a decent chance of being able to write most kanji when you need to

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610972
rtkさん please demonstrate your amazing japanese. Oh wait, you are going to say that an e-celeb who didn't use rtk until years after starting learning told you that rtk is useful, and that you have the potential to learn faster. Let me guess, you also use anki?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610986
forget rtk, you said mnemonics are retarded. answer >>19610933

[Anonymous No.]

but decoding your idiotic mnemonics to write kanji means you arent truly using japanese

go ahead write some kanji and tell me what you feel

hollow and empty inside regurgitating some stupid story about she who sells seashells at the sea shore

is that any way to live

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610961
ハムちゃん・・

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610991
>but decoding your idiotic mnemonics to write kanji means you arent truly using japanese

you don't decode anything after couple dozen times. unless you have problem recognizing kanji you forgot, you can look at individual parts you know and then use mnemonics to remind yourself that kanji.

[Anonymous No.]

>腕立て伏せ３０本
Long cylindrical things they said....

[Anonymous No.]

Teach me the use of うち

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610990
How does thinking of that part tell you how to pronounce the words? or how 猿 means monkey. when reading recognizing kanji is practically useless. the most difficult part is knowing pronunciation, because we understand language through audio recognition. meanings come through seeing a bunch of words that use the kanji over and over.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610991
the mnemonics are a backup, you end up being able to write most common kanji components without using them. at that level of abstraction, most kanji just have one or two components and most of them even make sense (e.g. car + roadway = take along)

[Anonymous No.]

but youve already perma fucked your memory by encoding kanji data into english mnemonics

youre not gonna outgrow and discard that information

even if you become proficient at nihongo that shits still gonna be there

i literally feel bad for anyone who drank heisigs kool aid and got memory aids because you cant just zero it out and reformat your brain

you reap what you sow noobs

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610961
エビチュ意外のハムに興味ない

[Anonymous No.]

To all you rtk fags when was the last time you wrote something for another human being that was not basic expected info like name and addressなど?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611017
You clearly have no idea how mnemonics actually work, stop calling people retarded when you are the one who didn't notice "used in" sign part written in bold letters on the page I linked....

[Anonymous No.]

>don't leverage your L1, learn your L2 like a 5 year old would

[Anonymous No.]

>dont learn a language just memorize it like an autistic retard would try to

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611040
It's true though, at least for Japanese.
Your native language is absolutely useless here, everything is too different.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611038
I did how is that pnemonic useful for 猿? trying to memorize some stupid story for a word like that is a waste of time. when I see all the words that these kanji are used in I instantly think of the word not some terrible story. and I do not even use anki. you guys are just wasting your time.

[Anonymous No.]

you hear that boys

literally just wasting your time

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylbmc1hAofg

[Anonymous No.]

>日本人女性より外人女性に興奮する僕は変わってますか？
is he saying that only foreign women are attracted to him or that he's only attracted to foreign women?

I thought he was saying that he's only attracted to foreign women, but one of the replies made me think that he's saying that only foreign women are attracted to him

[Anonymous No.]

the stupidity in this thread is overwhelming
>checks clock
ah yes, amerifats must be getting up around now

[Anonymous No.]

read に section of tyler kim

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611067
When I started learning, I quicky learned kana and read through Tae Kim in a week for basics of how the langauge works and jumped straight into a visual novel. And I can tell you all kanji for a beginner look the same. Like even seeing the difference between 大-犬-太 is super hard and actual similar looking ones like 網-綱 or 線-綿 etc is virtually impossible. So you have to draw them cause you don't know what they mean every time. Which is also funny, cause if I see new kanji nowadays and can't guess the reading, I quicky memorize what components it has and draw it in google translate in 5 seconds, but when you are new you are gonna alt-tab back and forth between game window and google translate for every stroke and it takes like 2 minutes to even draw kanji and by that time the whole "context" of what the kek are you ever reading is out the window. And if you only had to draw all of them once it would be nice but the reality is that the next day you'll forget the once you've already looked up anyways. So here's a true story and one example. I did just try to power through and persist with reading for a bit over a month. During that month I saw word 確認, which is super common word so no wonder, like 8 times and each time I just saw it it new context, my brain would go "fuck, I should know this, I already looked it up...can't remember....draw it again -> get mad that couldn't remember -> draw it like 10 times by hand -> 2 days later, can't remember it again, repeat cycle!" And to the point where I was about to quit learning the langauge. So if you are not interested in stuff with furigana, and I'm not (I'd rather shoot myself then read manga or NHK easy), recognition is a crazy issue for a beginner. It's hard to sympathize when you are already literate, cause it seems like you can tell everything just from context, like how do you tell the difference between 湛える and 堪える? literate person will say, it doesn't matter, you'll read the 傷の痛さを湛える even with wrong kanji cause you won't even look at it, you'll just read through but that's not true for anyone who's not literate yet so you need to put yourself in their position.

So yeah, my point, people who recommend "knowing 2000 kanji" ahead, it's not for trying to guess words, I can assure you people still look up every new word they see unless it's pronounced and super obvious to guess what it is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611090
There's no 'only' in there. He's asking if he's weird for being more attracted to foreigners than to Japanese women.
Not sure how where you'd get that 'only' from.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611095
to post in this thread is to be on mount stupid after all

[Anonymous No.]

HELP DoJG DECK!!

I've been using the DoJG Deck from https://dojgdeck.neocities.org/ with the "Core Random" style which uses javascript to randomize the first example phrase.

Big issue is that while using ankidroid the first example phrase gets randomized TWO TIMES meaning that when you flip the card you have another first example sentence being displayed.

I've done some searching and apparently it's due to the fact that Ankidroid DOESN'T save state between Front and Back.
I've found this site :https://yingtongli.me/blog/2015/03/15/random-question-generator-on-anki-using.html#c11r1r1
which claims to have found a work around for this issue but I CAN'T get it to FUCKING WORK with the DoJG deck.

Can someone help me on this? I'm loosing my mind.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611095
> eurofag
Thanks for confirming that not only am I better at Japanese than you, but I am also better at English than you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611115
try wiping front to back instead of back to front

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611115
Stop doing the dojg deck, this is the best help you'll get.

[Anonymous No.]

reading dsotroyevskye in japanese?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611015
Speaking of which.
How do you guys learn counters?
Is it best to learn them by reading more?
It seems only the most basic counters like 日 or 人 have easily definable usage.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611116
English is my first language unlike the bastardised abomination you speak in murica

[Anonymous No.]

In which month of your studying did you learn this?

[Anonymous No.]

>アへ顔
What did she mean by this?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611038
Cringe

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611151
I see, angry Britfag. Don't blame you mate, your woman are what we use to illustrate what ブス means.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611151
General American is objectively superior to the posh cunt dialect, at least in the way it sounds.
Not a single ESL speaks like a bong these days.
t. ESL

[Anonymous No.]

cant you all just be friends under the pretense of having terrible fucking nihongo

[Anonymous No.]

jamal is my best friend now.

[Anonymous No.]

We don't learn nihongo here.
We only give tips on how to differentiate ッ and シ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611175
>>19611185
>>19611207

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611222
>there are people itt that learn jap for this

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611228
You should see the sakamichi general.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611231
In your defence I understand we are sitting with american asians or canadians here.
Hell, you might be even one of them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611228
愛
我慢
暖
ガンバレ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611231
愛
我慢
暖
ガンバレ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611257
delete this post again but dont repost it thx

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611257
>tfw learned 3 of these words from yuri hentai

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611153
2nd month since that's when I noticed it being posted here. I learned "plug up" from RTK which consists of "hole" and "climax" on the right. Combined with "flesh" or "body part" on the left and "vagina" is really easy to remember.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611151
>Mad britnigger angry that everyone find his version of "English" inferior
Kek

[Anonymous No.]

dont think i aint see that ignant shit

[Anonymous No.]

>「動物的な本能に従って、いろんなこと判断してるから」
;judges things in various ways;
How do I know it's the ^ instead of judging variously.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611318
Wait, he is also kokujin?

OK, angry britanon- keep going. I feel ya.

[Anonymous No.]

judge various things

[Anonymous No.]

Is reading names the final boss?

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
Yeah, I gave up for now on that even though there's a pretty good deck for anki. But my repetition rate was so low, it was just sad.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611389
Flyable Heart so easy I would put it before hanahira.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
No, food is.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
That's speaking

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606005
>https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/
Is this an elaborate joke? A blind monkey could design a better looking, less bloated site.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
Nah, I usually just feel them out and I'm right. At least for non-fictional names.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611424
thats why we have https://nihongobyjamal.neocities.org/ for the real seekers of nihongo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611424
>itazuraneko
>is that a joke
You should learn more Japanese instead of wasting time here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611424
The owner of the site said that if you think it's bloated you should get a more powerful machine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611436
that's some dank css

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611466
no frills no bull shit

just the real shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611389
Thanks for this. I want to do Flyable Heart before Hanahira even though I'm only at verb particles in Tae Kim.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611500
moege is cancer

[Anonymous No.]

>>19606005
>>19611424
My problem isn't that my desktop can't handle this website, but that the website just feels gross and awkward to use because of the hidden submenus and slide-in and shit. Change that and I'd be fine with it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611509
I hate the subject matter with a passion but everyone says they're the easiest so that may as well be my first.

[Anonymous No.]

The site is fine and has a clean interface. It's just some autist sperging out about the inclusion of jquery when it actually has no effect on the loading speed or performance of the page. Don't mind them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611518
>going for the easiest first

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
青春

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611519
t. web artisan

[Anonymous No.]

autist sperging about site made by an autist

seems par for the course

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611372
Waste of time. Unless the name 田中健太郎 or something, it most likely has several possible readings.

[Anonymous No.]

Janitor- senpai please ban angry- kun for spamming. TANOMU~!

[Anonymous No.]

a name would be pointless if it didnt mean something

maybe thats the secret to learning how to become familiar with names in addition to just i dont know seeing them all the fucking time

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611500
Sounds like you're good to go.

[Anonymous No.]

次点で登校拒否だ。 What the hell is going on here?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611519
The site is fine and should be promoted over the old one in case someone wants to make changes but I still don't like the slide in.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611519
>clean interface
are you trippin mate

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611576
He won't know what's going on even if he reads the whole book lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611578
Are you sure it's not 時点 and that there's nothing before that?

[Anonymous No.]

look guys when i finish my summer course on web design my sites gonna be so epic that youre gonna have no choice but to learn nihongo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611595
「保科君は、明日から毎日女装して学校へ行けって言われても平気な人なの？」
「それは自殺するな！」
次点で登校拒否だ。
It's not lol.

[Anonymous No.]

dont you have a flashcard or two for this sort of thing

you know maybe a mnemonic to get your memory joggin

[Anonymous No.]

you cunts are boring

yo jamal where ya at bro? let's get this party rollin' eh

[Anonymous No.]

Why is japan so weird? I'm reading a moege with mc being with a girl and I would literally never think or act any of those things.
Why is Japan so focused on forcing feminity? I've seen it all in most anime too.

[Anonymous No.]

guys am i fucked?

500 kanji into RTK, I realise i've been learning how to write them the computerised way.

I've tried looking up ways to change the font in HTML, but the kanji and story are in the same field, so it's not an easy fix i think

should i just keep learning this way until i finish, and correct my writing afterwards?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611705
There are only a few points where computer fonts are different from the handwriting, like 言, 辶 and 令 components. It's enough to remember them.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611705
Out of curiosity- what's wrong with learning kanji the way you will be encountering them 99.99% of the time?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611025
The same thing happens when you encode input into misleading grammar explanations from shitty grammar guides like Tae Kim. RTK and early grammar study should be avoided at all costs in favor of a mas input approach through native content.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611705
Use manga sans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611705
your writing will improve over time. it's not bad if your handwriting looks like computer fonts because they are kind of similar to handwriting. it's not like russian where literally everyone writes cursive while everything else is printed. you can use a stroke order font, but they won't always give you the same strokes as the ones heisig wants to teach you. examples are 嘲喩辻捗. you need to memorize those differences. i do what matt vs japan suggests and use four different fonts when reviewing. i put the keyword and story on front and the kanji on back like pictured. if you take time to notice the subtleties (i.e. how certain lines line up with each other, space in between lines, etc.) and write as you see it you'll be ok. once you start writing fast your own style will develop, but it's good to start with a proper framework. so basically correct it now. get it right the first time because it's hard to break muscle memory habits like handwriting

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611760
apparently writing them like 言 or 知 (with the square like a rectangle) is unnatural. i was just wondering if it was a detrimental mistake.

but since >>19611744 says it's cool then I'll keep at it like this. thanks guys

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611519
The problem is that a page only containing a couple of links uses javascript where it doesn't really need to.

In my opinion it doesn't really make the site easier to navigate or anything. I appreciate that someone is maintaining the site for us, but I have to admit that as far as usability goes, I actually prefered the old one.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611705
https://youtu.be/8wZZ6rkMDeE?t=617
He shows you how to easily slip 4 different kinds of font into your RTK deck.

Well, normally it'd be easy but having kanji and story in the same field might make it hard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611780
just wanna say i <3 u guys sometimes. always nice to have a place for a quick response

[Anonymous No.]

dunno what to read

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
hanahira

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611834
Already read some of it ages ago. Couldn't finish it because it was boring as shit and way too easy.

[Anonymous No.]

Take Kim's website is kill. How will we learn Japanese now?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611666
ok >>19605587

dance

>>19611765
thats prolly truer for nihongo than anything else

i didnt read how to nihongo grammar resources i just eventually learned what feelings went with what which means a lot of listening

but i learned the most when i learned how to make others feel things and react using what language i had learned up to that point

[Anonymous No.]

>>19607481
Go watch some virtual youtubers and turn the Japanese subs on.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
monobeno

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
Try something from Mareni-hakase's œuvre.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611797
Yes the sliding is questionable.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
吾輩は猫である

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
http://vmashup.com/2uKSdLWV

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827
Utawarerumono

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611827

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611871
when reading old shit like this, should I man up and read it with the old kanji forms, or shinjitai it up like a mo'fo? I see that there's two versions up on aozora bunko... I guess the reason to learn the old kanji forms would be to read old shit, but if all the old shit has "modernized" versions then I won't bother. please tell

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611975
If you know enough kanji you'll meet most kyuujitai forms in compounds anyway, like 瀞 for 靜 (as opposed to 静) or 懸 for 縣 (as opposed to 県). So learning to read kyuujitai would be fun and not hard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611765
>misleading
got any good examples?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611424
paranoid obsessive br detected

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611975
IMHO reading old books with outdated kanji is about as autistic as reading 18-19 c. Russian literature with all its і's and ѣ's.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612036
just read some djts for a while

youll see

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ9vIzOf-OI

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612036
>らしき
why is there so much grammar like this that's only in kireicake? why don't they put it in normal dictionaries?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612068
fug i didn't mean to link

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612068
because dictionaries aren't for grammar. your actual grammar application is supposed to handle lookups for formations of words in the dictionary data. it just happens that most don't

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612068
i dont see your problem

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612068
http://www.edrdg.org/jmdictdb/cgi-bin/entr.py?svc=jmdict&sid=&e=1918343

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612058
>ѣ
I hate you for making us drop this letter
t. Bulgarian

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612081
dictionary application*

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612036
There's one on the first page even, see if you can find it

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612121
>searching me on a hunt for nothing
Does anyone even do it?
Give me proof or gtfo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612097
Did you need it that much?
I mean, that damn letter was nothing but pain in the ass.

[Anonymous No.]

https://vocaroo.com/i/s1oaOyng8TRO

[Anonymous No.]

>https://pastebin.com/v65Vt37v
>Fixed version of the grammar dump pastebin. I reread all the example sentences and replaced and retranslated some of them.

>I can't believe I read "それに、まだパンツを履いていないので……あの、履いてきてもいいですか？" like five times and kept reading a なくて into the second half of it. Dyslexia sucks.

>A couple bits of wording were dumb.

>That's about it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612133
We have some extremely complicated rules on whether ѣ is 'я' or 'е'. Like we have singular мляко but plural млека. Also most dialect pronounce it either always 'e' or always 'я'.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612058
I can read this at about 50-70% speed of a normal Russian text. First time seeing this kind of writing. Gotta say, "съ" and "къ" are the most autistically written words I've ever seen.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612155
>Russians dislike everything I like about OCS orthography
Life sucks

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612097
транло ти ли си?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612158
The punctuation is bad enough, I don't feel like memorizing 150+ (arbitrary) morphemes where "ѣ" is used instead of "е" just to tell apart the homonyms that only a complete retard can mix up. Russian isn't Japanese, homonyms are far from a pressing issue.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612081
Ever heard of a morphological dictionary?

[Anonymous No.]

>確か
>静か

>食べる
>比べる
>調べる

Am I just being autistic, or did these words belong to separate classes at some point in history?

[Anonymous No.]

I still don't understand why the fuck this thread hate romaji that much, like wtf unless you're a native you don't start being a master in japanese, I needed use text hooking by 3 years straight to read(slowly) my first manga without furigana, not to say the 2~3 years using romaji as furigana to then change to hiragana and at last after 4 years using text hooker I could read without any help and I'm not a bit shamed by it as I racked my brain out at the start to understand and learn the fucking language (not to say I needed to learn by half a year english first to then even start thinking of reading japanese)

It just triggers me the autism of many of this thread that just attack without reason the learners of this stupid hard language(to this day I still hate the kanjis).

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612058
ѣ and ъ everywhere are stylish as fuck, removing them were commies' mistake. Then again, commies mutilated Chinese orthography beyond any measure, in comparison Russian had it easy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612185
yes
dictionaries that use jmdict are supposed to, and do, have their own morphological dictionary, for example https://github.com/birtles/rikaichamp/blob/master/data/deinflect.dat
also whatever jmdict-based dictionary you're using is using a very outdated version of jmdict >>19612096

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612193
Herro, britfag kokujin kun. Your anger gave you away TT.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612192
I see that shitty anime with the 血小板 cap and it's an incredibly stupid comment every time, what gives?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612195
As I mentioned before, this "stylishness" came at the expense of memorizing enormous amount of useless shit just to spell correctly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612218
>shitty anime
You take that back, はたらく細胞 is AOTS.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612227
That 'enormous amount' is nothing compared to the whole language.

[Anonymous No.]

>see 兄妹
>read is as けいまい
>dialogue always says きょうだい
I hate it!

[Anonymous No.]

if you hate being retarded then stop

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612270
Learn the more common pronunciation then

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612270
If you read it there is nothing wrong with it.
I assume it's not used in real life conversations though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612270
I've literally never heard keimai until now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612257
Which I don't have to learn, because I'm a native speaker.
Old orthography was created for an older version of the language. The commies were not the first to address the issue, people wanted to get rid of useless spelling rules back in the 18th century when the differences in pronunciation had completely disappeared.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612304
behold the power of anime y los mangas

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612232
Alright, I'll watch it. Sounds like it's like 3 min. per episode.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612192
I don't understand your question.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612232
no ゆらぎ荘 is

[Anonymous No.]

Steve's AMA is up if anyone has questions

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612443
I mean, there has to be a reason why か was left in kana, as if these ""カ-adjectives"" used to be conjugated.
Same with ""べる verbs"". There are no such verbs as 比る, 調る and 食る, so why was it necessary to write べ in kana?
I'm just guessing though, I don't know Classical Japanese or any other older form of the language.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612460
Only if you're not old enough to post here.

[Anonymous No.]

We have reached a point where djt shitposters are trying to spread "tae-kim grammar guide is shit" meme.

This place was garbage but I didn't expect this amount of autism.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612611
Might be "linguists" AKA dekinai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612611
Every grammar guide is shit because language cannot be acquired through grammar books.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612170
Wait you know me?

[Anonymous No.]

Does anyone know starting when J CAT won't be free anymore?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612686
This is how I know you don't know how to use a grammar guide

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612769
when flash dies

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612777
You're supposed to rote memorize every word and sentence and recall them point blank at any moment.

[Anonymous No.]

>慮る
>おもんばかる
oh come the fuck on

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612536
you mean not healthy enough shakin my head

[Anonymous No.]

>every beginner resource and e-personality stresses to not be afraid, Japanese is not hard
Why do they lie to us? It's incredibly hard. Anything that takes 2-5 years of hours of daily study is hard. Are they just insecure? They should own up to their accomplishment.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612880
time-consuming =/= hard

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612899
is playing the violin hard

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612901
if youve learned how to play properly no

proper technique + much time spent practicing correctly = effortless playing

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612901
no



playing it well is though

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612912
So what is hard, advanced mathematics? The vast majority of skills become effortless through extensive practice.

[Anonymous No.]

im licking my chops at the sight of this fresh meat nowhere near ready to enter my domain

ill tell you whats hard: life

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612232
But that's wrong, it's ヤマノススメ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612912
This renders the concept of "hard" almost meaningless.

[Anonymous No.]

im sorry for your *snorts* difficulty in understanding the concept of *爆笑s* hard

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612782
So 2020?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613043
Yes actually.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19610991
mnemonics are just training wheels. you soon outgrow the need for them as the characters are instantly recalled from memory at the prompt of an english word. the next step is to take that mental storage of the character image and build on top of it with japanese. it's not hard to see the benefit of having a perfect recall of common use kanji and the ability to effortlessly distinguish them if you're any bit proficient with the language

[Anonymous No.]

and what exactly pray tell are you gonna do to "build on top of it with japanese"

and no youre not gonna just undo the way you trained yourself to think when you deal with written japanese as a result of your epic rtk training

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
you're blind

[Anonymous No.]

can't tell if this guy is leeching off the "grammar guides will permanently fuck you" troll or if he's really that stupid. just kidding, i know he's trolling and i'm taking the bait, which makes this thread even worse.

[Anonymous No.]

you ever get spanked so bad for not knowing what youre talking about that your only response is to say theyre trolling and call them stupid lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613220
They will though, there's a reason most ESLs still mess up extremely simple grammar. It's because they learned misleading rules from grammar books and reinforced them thousands of times during the input process, so that by the time they realize it's wrong it's too ingrained in their mind to ever be corrected even if they're consciously aware of it.

If you want to fuck up your own Japanese then go ahead but stop forcing it on beginners who don't know any better.

[Anonymous No.]

>referencing a grammar guide is bad because a few ESLs drilled grammar and didn't offset misleading rules via enough input and conscious effort
same song and dance every time. you gotta find a more compelling argument.

[Anonymous No.]

their grammar is bad because so much of their input comes from other ESLs with bad grammar
next

[Anonymous No.]

to be fair it would be nothing short of a christmas miracle if anyone outta djt could speak japanese as good as a chinese person from chinatown in nyc speaks english

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613268
>a few
>"An European": About 2,670,000 results

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612988
Because most thing aren't hard if you know how to do them. People give up because they don't put enough time in and say its hard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613272
so whats people in djts excuse when they only expose themselves to entertainment media

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613283
>don't put in enough time
It's almost like effort required over an extended period factors in whether something is considered hard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613297
But is it really hard to walk 100 miles over the course of a year? You dont have to rush. It is hard to learn Japanese in half a year though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613278
https://vocaroo.com/i/s1r375Mp6Bi1

[Anonymous No.]

dont bother talkin about the real shit with nooblets itt who are only able to conceptualize difficulty from the choices given to you in a video game menu

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613320
why you do this lmao

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605587
>普通
>axanael
Thought axanael was supposed to be easy as shit?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613425
It's easy to force your way through with a mouseover dictionary because it has extremely short sentences and is fairly short overall, and the subject matter is also such that it's very hard to lose track of what's going on due to misunderstanding a few lines of text.

[Anonymous No.]

why would you take jamal seriously? if he were trying to help he'd explain shit like that from the start. he's just trying and failing to be funny.

[Anonymous No.]

where do i find audiobooks for free

[Anonymous No.]

>1.7k in Anki
>haha I'll do one last day of Anki before starting on reading...
>Never doesl
Someone help me lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611411
>>19611500
>>19611518
threadly reminder that hanahira being the easiest is a meme
i don't know about the others but flyable heart, leyline, and nanatsuiro are all easier than hanahira
admittedly my perspective might be biased by the fact that they didn't make me want to jisatsusuru so i actually kept reading
axanael is probably harder but i haven't read it yet

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613112
are you being serious? you read japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613461
>are you being serious?
no it's the newest bait here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613456
Its like Yotsuba where the subject matter is boring and annoying. Yotsuba is good by itself but if you already read it it becomes boring to reread since it is slice of life on top of slang since yotsuba is a kid. Hanahira actually made me stop studying for a while because i could somewhat understand what they were talking about but was bored. And I can and do watch slice of lifes so its not like I wasn't prepared. Compelling content is key.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611591
Isn't this how a lot of people learn through? They stumble their way through their first VN barely comprehending shit, move on to the next VN, and so on?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613455
>lol
Why don't you just kill yourself?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613485
Yea you are also supposed to refer to a grammar guide or dictionary if you are unsure about something. Just dont stress too much if you understand the first time because you obviously will run into the same grammar situation again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613501
Because I want to live

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613280
are you going to come up with a new go-to example or recycle the one that's been argued to death for the rest of your life

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613536
Like it matters when everyone knows education is joke even at the college level.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613455
Do you want to be able to read and listen to things in Japanese and understand them? Then start reading and listening to things in Japanese or you never will.

I have the opposite problem to you. I fucking hate anki and put it off all day in favour of reading and listening (which I actually enjoy) because I don't want to do it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613461
wow im sure just "reading japanese" is going to teach you how to do something

rtk teaches you how to do something

leaving someone to their own devices does not as evidenced time and time again in djt

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613536
>argued to death
"professionals and academics simply don't care about sounding retarded" is not a convincing argument.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613480
comparing hanahira to yotsuba is an insult that yotsuba doesn't deserve
although i hadn't already read it so that helped
hanahira also made me stop reading for a month or so

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613561
that wasn't one of the several arguments that have been presented dozens of times and you know it, fuck off and stop trying to "win" while ignoring the same arguments every week

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613436
nothing about djt is a laughing matter

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613480
Cool story but manga isn't reading.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613560
yeah reading japanese teaches you how to read kanji and if you do rtk then congrats you can write everything all nice and easily distinguish similar looking characters. i really don't see your point. if you can't learn japanese by reading japanese then you probably will never learn japanese and should go to reddit and talk about duolingo or the newest beginner app

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613563
No I agree Yotsuba is one of the best shounen manga. But if you already read it you are gonna have a bad time. I would rather struggle with boring One Piece and have to learn both fantasy and pirate terms I would never use than go through Yotsuba.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613556
>I have the opposite problem to you. I fucking hate anki and put it off all day in favour of reading and listening
what about this is a problem
that you might get too good at japanese to be allowed in djt?

[Anonymous No.]

If you use a grammar guide or dictionary while reading you are permanently fucking your brain and will never learn Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613577
the only people worse than those who cant learn japanese are the people who falsely think theyve learned japanese in their little bubble

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613569
That was the argument, "they haven't fixed it because they haven't put in a conscious effort to do so because they don't care." That was the only argument ever presented and it's retarded because if even tens of thousands of hours of input can still leave an extremely simple grammar rule involving the most common word in the entire English language unfixed without conscious effort then it just proves my point. Also I've brought this up like 4 times at most

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613583
What do you suggest people do instead of using a dictionary?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613583
Yep its like learning how to breath, eat and walk without a coach. You will permanently fuck your brain and never breath, eat, walk, or sleep right again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613587
who cares what you think though? you don't even have an argument

[Anonymous No.]

dont get it twisted my fuck ninjas my only beef was with rtk (which i still think is fine) and yall comin out talkin about dictionaries and grammar guides

>>19613597
i dont argue

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613588
it doesn't prove your point. you were called out on making these dumb assumptions previously but you always dodge it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613608
What assumptions? That an academic with broken grammar most likely learned English through a formal education system? Now why would I assume that?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613615
1 that they got tens of thousands of hours of input
2 that their grammar wouldn't be poor without formal instruction
3 that they care enough about their grammar mistakes to fix them

[Anonymous No.]

seriously all you need is 10000 hours of ptbr subbed anime and to complete vjg and you can do the rest from there all the way up to the likes of soseki and tanaka romeo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613580
>But if you already read it you are gonna have a bad time.
It's not possible to read it so there's no problem.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613588
>That was the only argument ever presented
an european may indicate a misunderstanding of the pronunciation of the word european which is a mistake that you have probably heard before
a/an is not a terribly uncommon typo from natives particularly when changing wording
feel free to ignore or dismiss these points again, i look forward to the next time you shitpost about a/an because there's nothing i love more than repetition

[Anonymous No.]

we all love doing the same shit over and over again

its only insanity if you expect a different result

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613608
I know you are not falling for his bait but he will never believe us unless 'science' and 'research' proves our point. Based Krashen and Steve aren't enough for him. He wants education schools to teach it that way before he even tries. Even though there are language schools that do focus on input based learning.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613627
I am grateful to you guys. Manga has way too many hints to really learn from. And its bad advice to read novels of stuff you watched the source material because you can guess and not have to really learn Japanese when you read books.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613653
>because you can guess and not have to really learn Japanese when you read books.
the fuck

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613653
I meant anime or manga of.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613633
i wonder if this thread is bingo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613621
>1 that they got tens of thousands of hours of input
If you're working as a journalist or author in English then obviously you've got somewhere around this number or very close to it.

>2 that their grammar wouldn't be poor without formal instruction
You have yet to provide me with a single example of somebody who learned English it who makes the same simple grammatical errors. I've seen NEETs on 4chan who play video games all day with better English grammar than journalists, that tells you something about the value/harm of grammar drilling.

>3 that they care enough about their grammar mistakes to fix them
If they publish work in English they care.

>>19613629
How about "an useful"?
>About 1,180,000 results

>>19613641
Krashen does not support your viewpoint that grammar drills work. My learning methodology is based entirely on Krashen's input hypothesis.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613661
>somebody who learned English
through input*, I meant to say

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613657
You will know that the character is drinking water because the picture will show your waifu drinking water. If you read it in a book you have no hints. You actually have to understand it to read the Japanese. How do you not understand that?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613661
>How about "an useful"?
this does not sidestep either of those points
how about literally any example other than a/an

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613661
Journalism isn't a hard degree. It doesn't surprise me that a neet gamer who has pretty much unlimited free time will read more material even with games than a journalist who is learning in school.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613667
visual cues are what reinforce japanese conceptually to idiot eop retards who dont get why the e>j dictionary doesnt help them actually understand anything

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613661
>If you're working as a journalist or author in English
>If they publish work in English they care.
ok, this still tells us nothing of the number of people making grammatical mistakes who got tens of thousands of hours of input or not.
>I've seen NEETs on 4chan who play video games all day with better English grammar than journalists
what if the NEETs on 4chan got more input? and these are people who likely took english classes in school. so any "grammar drilling" was offset by input.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613671
An example of ESLs fucking up simple grammar because they drilled general rules that don't apply to exceptions? They're countless. a/an is important because it's literally the most used word in the entire English language, and if after thousands of hours of input they still mix it up there is something wrong.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613667
actually that's a great way to learn because you are associating common words with images. and you're still reading real japanese...

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613671
He is speaking from is own personal experience. He is using memes for his voice.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613677
And then they wonder why they can't read the word for water when they read it in a different context. Even though they did recognize it when their waifu drank water.

[Anonymous No.]

If you use a keyboard or web browser while posting to djt you are permanently fucking up your brain and will never learn to post well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613667
to be more accurate
in a book you probably do have hints
all of the hints are more lines of japanese
this is even better than no hints
the dialogue and narrative support each other and you figure out what is going on through japanese alone

[Anonymous No.]

when your a idiot does it really matter if you know the difference between a/an because at the end of the day youre still an idiot

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613685
I meant not

>>19613682
read >>19613695

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613695
i dont have experience with being that retarded unfortunately so i dont know how to deal with that notion

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613678
>ok, this still tells us nothing of the number of people making grammatical mistakes who got tens of thousands of hours of input or not.
It does, because it can be assumed that anyone who publishes work in English has got at least the number of hours of input necessary to learn the very basic a/an rule.

Anyway I'm done arguing this point, the evidence is there and you can make of it what you will. I will encourage beginners to avoid using grammar guides with misleading simplifications they don't yet understand at all costs so they don't permanently fuck up their Japanese ability forever.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613667
>How do you not understand that?
i think the part i'm having trouble with is that you think you won't learn to read that the character is drinking water regardless of the hint

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613700
exactly but that is productive to actually learning japanese. Whereas the other way you are getting better knowing when your waifu is doing a thing when you have both words and a picture.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613680
>because they drilled general rules
you are assuming this because it fits your narrative
>a/an is important
i just don't ever want to hear about it again because of you

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613709
Thats good that is why we are saying manga isn't reading

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613722
its only not reading when youre not reading the words

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613702
ok i read it but i don't share that experience. for example when you read death note and read 心臓麻痺 and see someone die of a heart attack in multiple contexts it sticks pretty well. multiply that for the thousands of words you easily acquire reading manga and you can quickly build up a nice vocabulary base while having fun. still there are a lot of literary words that you must learn by reading books, i am not disputing that. reading novels is different than reading manga, but i believe you can learn a lot from manga

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613713
yeah i completely agree
pictures make you feel like you're understanding more and maybe make it easier to enjoy the material without progressing
but you learn language when you NEED to, when it's the only way to figure out what you want to know, and non-language hints interfere with that

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613719
>you are assuming this because it fits your narrative
Why else would they use a/an incorrectly? They will literally never encounter an incorrect usage if they only consume native content. There's no reason why they should come up with a false general grammar rule of their own.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613710
no, you're still making all sorts of wild assumptions, like the input these ESLs are getting. then you jump to "well what about journalists specifically?". we weren't originally talking about journalists, but this still doesn't tell us much. those 4chan NEETs very well may be getting far more input than these journalists, assuming there's an actual pandemic of ESL journalists who confuse a/an, and assuming that this is because of formal instruction, and assuming that they care enough to fix these mistakes.

again, these are assumptions you're making. and it's difficult if not impossible for you to show reasonable evidence that anything you're saying is true. but once again you're just gonna repeat yourself without providing jack shit, so gg you baited me hard.

[Anonymous No.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOWJ2Vdk3jo

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613712
If you read manga like we used to recommend all the time. You are going to see 水　pop up a bunch of times with a character drinking water. And you are supposed to do rtk and core so you will know the word. But when you read it in a context without a similar picture like a book or visual novel you won't necessarily know the word without the hints. It's the same thing with audio. You know what お兄ちゃん　sounds like so if you play a visual novel and hear oniichan you are going to know it without needing to recognize fully how it is written with kanji and kana.

And I don't even know Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613735
>They will literally never encounter an incorrect usage if they only consume native content.
you found millions of them, do you really think none of them were accidents from natives?
i agree that consuming native content is important, but assuming that every single person with bad grammar has their brain damaged by looking up a grammar guide is insane and unsubstantiated

[Anonymous No.]

no ones gonna fuck up 水 use something a little less everyday if you wanna make it at least a decent example albeit still fuckin retarded

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613754
>And you are supposed to do rtk and core

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613740
>we weren't originally talking about journalists
We were in the last discussion (which you brought up, by the way). Google incorrect usages and the first few pages of results will usually be articles by professional journalists. Journalists who will have consumed thousands of hours of input of their own and still not figured out the very simple rule that "an" comes before a vowel sound only. If that's not reasonable evidence for the harmfulness of stressing grammar drilling over input I don't know what is.

>>19613756
Yes because it sounds extremely jarring to the native ear and they will never make that mistake of their own, except maybe in typos. Are you seriously telling me you've heard natives before who use "an" incorrectly?

[Anonymous No.]

認めたくないものだな
自分自身の出来なさ故の過ちというものを

[Anonymous No.]

New argument:
People who think learning grammar helps learn a language are monolingual.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613768
But you should get it anyway. There were people who didn't recognize simple words that they recognize in anki and it was deep learned and couldn't remember it when they read novels.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613769
were

its not recommended now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613773
>except maybe in typos.
this was one of the two points i repeated for you that have been brought up literally every time we've had this discussion
>Are you seriously telling me you've heard natives before who use "an" incorrectly?
as an aside, do you even know what human speech sounds like, speech is not grammatical, it is filled with false starts and noises and mistakes

[Anonymous No.]

so to conclude this installment of the epic fail that is djt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4t8Fuk-SCQ#t=52

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613781
because they probably learned the word in anki instead of from a natural japanese context. anki is for reviewing stuff you already learned so you don't forget it, not bruteforcing lists of words you've never seen or learned before

[Anonymous No.]

>>19605012
ツ I associated with thunderer as in it's looking down on me.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613791
>Rap ''music''
It can't get any worse than this.

[Anonymous No.]

Guys. I'm still having trouble with katakana. I know all of them it just takes me a while to read them since I rarely come into contact with them. It's been a few months since I've learned the kana, but katakana is still at the same level were I struggled to read through in my head and have to read it out loud like a retard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613788
>this was one of the two points i repeated for you that have been brought up literally every time we've had this discussion
It is not, because I pointed out before that the correct usage ("A European") returns only ten times more results than the incorrect. Unless natives are making very frequent typos this suggests that most of those are actually from non-natives who have learned incorrect grammar.

>as an aside, do you even know what human speech sounds like, speech is not grammatical, it is filled with false starts and noises and mistakes
Answer the question. Have you ever heard a native speaker use "an" incorrectly?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613791
japanese rap master

is there a distinction between mainstream fronting trash and underground meaningful lyricism in japan

apologies as i do not know japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613997
but how else am i gonna be able to read japanese the first time i open up a book

[Anonymous No.]

>>19613773
>which you brought up
i don't think so.
>Journalists who will have consumed thousands of hours of input of their own
assumption. compare them to the 4chan NEET, that NEET that probably also got english instruction in school but doesn't make as many grammatical mistakes. though of course this is all hypothetical nonsense.
>the harmfulness of stressing grammar drilling over input
no one is arguing that you should drill grammar. just against your fatalistic nonsense that drilled grammar can't be corrected through input, or that you can't make these mistakes via input.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614017
jesus... this is why you start with manga and subtitled videos

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614015
>Answer the question. Have you ever heard a native speaker use "an" incorrectly?
yes
it is very obvious between natives when a grammatical mistake was an actual mistake versus the expected mistakes that come from coming up with what you're saying as you say it
however, it is less obvious to a foreigner learning from them

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614019
>i don't think so.
>>19613569

>just against your fatalistic nonsense that drilled grammar can't be corrected through input
It obviously can't, or basic grammar mistakes in otherwise well-read non-natives wouldn't be so common.

>or that you can't make these mistakes via input.
Why would you? The rule is obvious, you have to actively learn it incorrectly to mix it up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614014
What do you want us to tell you? We can lie and say smoke bath salts and that will somehow help you read katakana faster.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614040
I was wondering if anyone had any resources to just read katakana shit, or if anyone else was having the same issues as I was. Fuck it I might just download a loan word deck and go through that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614016
there is

most of the shit i link is the former

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrfMAYDAnl8

this ones a deep and meaningful track about their aniki who got thrown in a cell for like a year because he got caught with a doobie and they are just givin straight respect

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614037
the post you linked isn't me.
>It obviously can't
so because some people make mistakes, the mistakes can't be corrected? not sure how that logic works.
>The rule is obvious
no...it's not? you might not pick up on the difference.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614028
You also start with English subbed anime. You will learn Japanese naturally because you are hearing Japanese and understand thanks to the accurate horrible/ crunchy roll subs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614037
>It obviously can't, or basic grammar mistakes in otherwise well-read non-natives wouldn't be so common.
not that this is a new discovery but you clearly don't understand logical reasoning
>you have to actively learn it incorrectly to mix it up.
which can happen from input, haven't you ever met uneducated people

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614058
It wouldn't hurt. Take out Audio and pictures.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614058
>I was wondering if anyone had any resources to just read katakana shit
Pick a random modern Japanese book. Or even better, pick one you're interested in.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614065
Yea even natives make grammar mistakes in america.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614060
>>19614065
It does follow, because how else do you explain that 10% of all pages on the internet that contain the words "a/an European" use the grammar incorrectly? Again, this is an extremely common word, the most common in all of English, with a very basic grammar rule that no native would ever use incorrectly. I'm convinced at this point you're baiting me. Won't bother responding so enjoy your last word.

[Anonymous No.]

last word: stop making giant leaps based off dumb assumptions.

>>19614093
particularly youths.

[Anonymous No.]

actual last word

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614103
Are you European? Most Americans dont speak propa English anyway. At least not in the south where I live. They still understand the grammar when they read or listen but when they write or speak they use incorrect grammar all the time.

[Anonymous No.]

fuck the queen innit mate

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614126
Unironically fuck the queen, the immigrants and the northeners, claiming benefits. Sons of bitches the whole lot of them.
I'm just joking, calm down NHS

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614110
I'm a college graduate who majored in mass communication with a minor in creative writing. Things might be different in the UK but in the states most authors just pay an editor to correct their spelling and grammar mistakes. Most books go through and editor who fixes their mistakes.

[Anonymous No.]

you ever just preface your post with how you have a worthless degree but then just keep writing anyway like someones reading it after that point

[Anonymous No.]

actually i should take that back your degree can get you a job teaching english in japan

your path to the chosen land is calling

[Anonymous No.]

What's the dakuten for here? Is he making a "vu~ vu~" sound?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614150
If a degree scare you when all degrees are worthless because higher education Is a joke and you know it but ignore what i am saying. I'm sorry but that makes you a low IQ brainlet. I took publishing classes at school. This is how the professional publishing industry works. Famous authors pay someone to fix their grammar. That is reality. Do your own research on the publishing industry yourself. You dont have to take my statement as proof at all. Hell if you are lazy go YouTube it. And then come back with your bs claims about natives being perfect when they produce grammar in their writing or speech.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614159
Why do that when I can just do mext? And go to school for free.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614178
you even have a picture to reinforce the idea of what it sounds like!!!!!!!!!!!

>>19614184
oh i wasnt trying to argue about whatever bullshit yall were talkin about i just wanted to take a cheap shot because im a bully and an asshole

i agree that higher education is worthless but only if you dont have a good specific reason for doing it

its sort of like taking the jlpt

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614150
Use your own brain not memes you heard from 4chan

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614202
sorry we were laughing at block head マスコミ majors in the 80s too dude

you were prolly single digit age when haruhi dropped

*drops the mic*

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614184
i'm on your side but is there anyone who actually doesn't know what an editor is

[Anonymous No.]

ill tell you what an editor is

a destroyer of art

[Anonymous No.]

then why do authors always thank their editors profusely in the foreword

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614197
Its worthless but a degree can be useful. Even with my worthless degree I am qualified to apply for a scholarship to get my masters and doctorate with self taught programming and get a computer science doctorate degree. If I followed the dont get a degree bro they are worthless I wouldn't even have the option to try and get a free good degree. I'm sorry the people telling you not to go to school are selling you their business courses. And then when you inevitably fail they will ho you gotta try harder and educate yourself more bro. Degrees are stupid but another one of my courses man you just didn't try enough. Long rant finished.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614235
because if they dont they dont get by published

the publisher is the evil overlord

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614239
shoulda self-published

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614229
Mainly in the industry we are interested in. Hell genshiken taught me that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614236
if you can go to school boundlessly and not go in debt and are too retarded to have any idea on how to get money then sure go to school for whatever its better than not

i dont know what that shits like though

>>19614245
god bless the modern net

>>19614249
rare mention of good anime spotted itt

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614252
How can you be a fan who is dedicated enough to learn Japanese not read at least 100 Japanese works at minimum. Are they doing this because of a fad?

[Anonymous No.]

i really do feel sorry for the people who are too afraid to really dive into the shit they really like because they think they are going to ruin it forever or something like it was good in the first place

real ninjas know the greatest joy in your nihongo journey is learning how to shit all over the shit you thought you liked because now you can see the shit for how shit it really is

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614252
Most people are too retarded to go to schools or run a businesses to make real money. Especially the ones who are 'smart' and dismiss it thinking they are going make the next Facebook without personal industry experience. They are being trolled hard. The irony they fail to see is that most of the people who say that be have degrees themselves. Really makes this 29 year old boomer think.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614283
im gonna blow your mind

instead of go to school

just start one

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614297
the ultimate con

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614281
I like crap though but you have to read crap to truly know what you believe to be good is even decent in its genre.

[Anonymous No.]

一年間練習したから、ピアノが弾けるようになった
Because I practiced for one year, I became able to play the piano.

If I take out なった:
一年間練習したから、ピアノが弾けるよう
Is the translation now:
Because I practiced for one year, I am able to play the piano.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614297
That is the true Matt and Katz way. Even better if you make it cult like like puas and claim you have the secret and they will tell you if you donate money to their patreon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614305
It becomes an incomplete phrase that doesn't make sense because it's incomplete.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614299
At least with linq his son made it.

[Anonymous No.]

わたしはゲイになったから、どうやらピアノが弾けるようだ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614297
Dont even have to know anything about what you are teaching or talking about like anime and video game reviewers. You actually will be less popular if you know what you are talking about. This is the society we live in.

[Anonymous No.]

Is
ピアノが弾けるようになった
wrong? Should it be ピアノを弾ける？

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614329
isnt it the greatest irony of all that everyone is connected and the internet has just become a giant mass of noise and negative energy when at one point it wasnt quite so

seeing people walking around staring at their phones freaks me out

and everyone is fuckin mad ALL the time and people dont have compassion and patience anymore

instant gratification perma fucked more human brains than heisig could ever hope to

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614343
im gonna ask you why you think so and then wait tapping my fingertips together while you post your day one grammar guide response

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614343
そのりろんはおかしい

よりせいかくには

>ピアノでショパン６４－２を弾けるようになった

まんなかに、きょくめい、をいれるよ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614343
No.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614360
Never mind, got it. Was a stupid question.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614371

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614351
That's why you pretty much have to try no fap Jr something similar and only mainly use the internet for self improvement to make it. Our parents told us what they believe is the best for us but they and our teachers are brainwashed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614371
Please explain it to me, I don't get it either.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614412
No, it would be very embarrassing if I explain and it turns out I got it wrong.

[Anonymous No.]

i wont let anyone give you shit about it if you post your explanation i promise

ill be like your yojimbo lol

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611101
I went through the same issue when I finished tae kim and went through the first 1k core cards. I would fuck up the same cards every review session unless I wrote them down 50 times and even then... it broke me to a degree. Took a break learned all 214 "radicals" like so many articles told me and that did jack fucking shit. Radicals only gave me 1/4 of the puzzle sometimes not even that(not counting radicals that are also kanji). Lies after lies I finally tried rtk the one thing I've been running from since everyone(reddit,articles,4chan) was telling me you don't need to learn how to write and lo and behold 500 kanji before I finish I can distinguish 20+ similar squigly lines with a glance like blood on a white wall. Now I have so much space in my head to focus on readings without all his stress of forgetting or mixing things up. Studying this language really taught me not to trust the fucking majority. 20 more days to go.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614418
This is an anonymous board senpai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614431
pretty much, also there are now fucking putrid retards trying to spread "grammar guides are bad" meme."

This place is truly fucking lost

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614412
The piano became playable.

If this explanation is wrong, I'm not the poster you replied to.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614431
so when are you looking to pencil in the actual learning of the language

>>19614442
no that smell is your upper lip

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614431
Did you write the radicals as much as you did with rtk when you learned them?

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614431
keep at it mate, ignore the rtknais

[Anonymous No.]

妹は、あいつのうんこが一番好きなのだ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614453
thats not an explanation

thats a translation

its also not right

[Anonymous No.]

i guess its time to dust this bad boy off so hopefully a pair of eyes that can truly benefit from it can see it and be saved from a lifetime of fucking it up

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614453
I think this is one of those cases where 私は is implicitly supposed to be there so 私 is the subject and not piano.

But I probably don't know what I'm talking about.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614469
Ok how about
ピアノが私が弾けるようになった
if this is wrong we need an intervention

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614475
wow that's a lot of not japanese there on that page good luck learning japanese

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614487
かんぜんにおかしい

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614431
>>19614463
If you didn't do the same thing with radicals that you did with rtk. Then you didn't have to do rtk to get the results you got.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614495
あれは文法の筋道を表すため文章だった。おかしいのは当然だが、問題は正解かどうかだ

[Anonymous No.]

>>19612957
Sorry, the genre is now dominated by Yuru Camp.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614501
rtk is still generally a good order to learn kanji in, and the breakdown of kanji into nameable components is something anyone can do sure. rtk is just sort of an all in one package

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614487
i already knew that

>>19614540
i really already knew that

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614309
How would one say:
>Because I practiced for one year, I am able to play the piano.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614581
Thats fine but if you do the radicals and write them as much as rtk makes you do. You don't need to do rtk to not get confused. If you only memorize shapes you wouldn't learn using the rtk formula either. It wouldn't matter. You have to write them if you can't learn them through reading.

[Anonymous No.]

I'm getting kicked out on the 1st of next year if I don't get a job. My NEET days are over. I wonder if I can get good enough to do translation by then. I'm around N2 level right now I'd say, maybe a little lower.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614613
you have 4 months to just get a job and not make your parents have to evict you

just do the right thing and face reality

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614442
Even worse are the retards trying to spread the "pure input is bad" meme.

[Anonymous No.]

a lot of people way worse off would kill to be able to still live at home and have a job as a assumedly a single male with no real obligations in life

thank god for your situation and start grindin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6HMycpw8As

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614630
you don't have to think pure input is bad to think that reading something can't permanently damage you

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614601
i agree with you. if you're looking to get your kanji all in order in your mind though and dont want to spend a long time rtk is certainly an expedient roadmap for you to follow that builds up in a mostly pleasing and sensible way. if you want to make your own system of learning kanji that's awesome but rtk works well enough where you can memorize 2200 characters in a month or two which is good enough for me

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614613
if you don't start looking for a job immediately you're going to get kicked out
you can try the incompetent translator route but you'd better start looking now because it might take more than four months for that path

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614634
It's not just reading it though, it's drilling it and referencing it every time you read something you don't understand instead of figuring out grammar patterns through context on your own naturally with mass exposure. That absolutely is going to reinforce bad habits and permanently damage you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614613
I wouldn't be so sure if I were you.
There's plenty of people learning Japanese in college, and not so many places where those people can work.
You with your self-taught eroge Japanese can't compete with them. Unless you can somehow start fansubbing and fool enough people into supporting you on patreon, you should consider something more feasible.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614613
If you need to ask, the answer is no.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614652
i agree that you shouldn't do that but you're still insane if you think bad habits can't be unlearned

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614664
they can be but you need someone elses help first

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614664
They can, but it requires an inordinate amount of conscious effort that shouldn't be necessary in the first place. It's not worth having it slightly easier in the first month of learning the language.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614683
its not effort that it takes its being taught how to do the thing you were doing wrong right

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614652
Yeah, it's much better to invent you own "Japanese" through mass exposure to materials you don't understand.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614689
Yes, that's how we acquire languages.

[Anonymous No.]

you can call it 僕のニッポン語

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614652
And there is nothing natural about learning a second language as an adult, you fucking moron. Human didn't leave the tribe they were born in. Second language acquisition is a completely different process.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614699
you dont wanna go down this road noob because newsflash

life isnt natural

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614694
No, it's not how we do it.
I dare you to raise a child by doing nothing but reading Marvel comics out loud.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614706
Stop using the word "natural" in your crappy arguments then.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614711
wasnt my argument

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614708
you cant be with your kid all the time

hes gonna figure out how to do shit away from his crazy idiot dad and be just fine playing with all the other kids who have crazy dads too

with the added benefit that he has a leg up because his dad actually read to him and got him going on language development

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614699
That's not what the word 'naturally' means in this context. Let me guess, you're an ESL who learned English through grammar books.

[Anonymous No.]

im telling you this thread needs fuckin flags

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614581
>rtk is still generally a good order to learn kanji in
You don't know Japanese.

[Anonymous No.]

seriously it would instantly clear up all these kinda misunderstandings without having to post about them and further pollinate the thread with more aids spores

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614727
the discussion would somehow be even more offtopic

[Anonymous No.]

no way cause when a likely esl posts a weird reply to you you can just look at the flag and go yea well that explains it theres nothin else here to say to this guy and go about your business as opposed to having to ask

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614724
That sentence could by translated into my language 1:1, so I really doubt it has anything to do with my English reading comprehension.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19611519
>The site is fine and has a clean interface.
Hiding navigation links behind menus is cancer, they should be fully accessible to everyone without having to click anything extra or allowing javascript. In fact, there is no reason why anything on that entire website requires which cannot be achieved using html and css. The moe-uguu /a/ images also need to go, alongside a color redesign that doesn't make your eyes bleed. We don't need a bloated meme site for what a shared google document and pastebin already fully covered, that website is an exercise in narcissistic delusion nothing more.

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614746
what kind of porn do you jack off to

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614746
the site works fine if you have javascript disabled

[Anonymous No.]

>>19614746
that's cool but how much of that isn't just your personal narcissistic opinion