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/jp/ - Otaku Culture

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174694 No.174694 [Reply] [Original]

Tell me this

is it possible to read japanese(kanji) above borderline retardation speed?

I mean holy shit

There are so many kanji characters, and they aren't easily recognizable like hiragana/katakana.How do you even keep up with titles on the TV or reading lines on a japanese RPG.

Is there a trick to it or just read/write/repeat the same character until its fucking burned into your brain?

>> No.174759
File: 42 KB, 875x960, 1205048551640.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
174759

>>174748
how is knowing 15k words absurd?

>> No.174842

If you want to learn Kanji quickly get Heisig's "Remembering The Kanji".
With that book you can easily learn 30 Kanji a day in 1-2 hours.

>> No.174839

Tell me this

is it possible to read English(words) above borderline retardation speed?

I mean holy shit

There are so many English words, and they aren't easily recognizable like UPPERCASE/lowercase.How do you even keep up with titles on the TV or reading lines on a English RPG.

Is there a trick to it or just read/write/repeat the same word until its fucking burned into your brain?

>> No.174865
File: 349 KB, 704x396, 1205049941605.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
174865

>>174751
Wouldn't this mean that spoken Japanese is incomprehensible? Yes, yes it would.

Since that Japanese are actually able to communicate, your argument is completely invalid. Delete your post and hang your head in shame.

>> No.174874

What really shitted me when i was learning english was that there was no reliable way of telling the pronunciation of a word based on spelling. I mean, that's why you have spelling tests right? To test if you remember the association between the sound and the letters that make up the word. Since there's no real pattern the only way to do it is with memory.

With asian language, once you see the kana/pinyin, you know how to pronounce the word. There's no ambiguity there at all. The thing that needs memory is association the kana/pinyin with the kanji/hanzi

>> No.174877

>>174865
how do i multiple vocal intonationed lol

>> No.174880

>>174828
How about you being a speaker of English, can you write all the words you know straight out, right now?

And no, I'm not making shit up. Every so often I come across articles from the Ministry of Education on Mandrin, and yes while I failed standard Chinese, I still managed to pass basic Chinese - which is supposed to arm me with about 5000 characters; about the same size as a primary schooler's vocabulary.

>> No.174919

>>174880
You're supposed to know all the characters you need know by the end of primary school since in high school they do not teach you anymore characters, as it is assumed you know all that is required. Learning characters is a very basic skill, so you're supposed to have mastered that by the end of primary school.

The difference in skill level in Chinese is not determined by number of characters.

>> No.174924

>>174880
Also, characters does not equal vocabulary.

>> No.174698

just practice. same as learning vocabs

>> No.174980

uh, isn't the entire point of kanji to make japanese more readable, since if it was straight kana it would look like a gigantic clusterfuck?

>> No.174701

>read/write/repeat the same character until its fucking burned into your brain

Pretty much

If you think kanji is hard try chinese, where everything is kanji (hanzi, whatever)

>> No.174702

>>174701
aren't there more hanzi characters than kanji as well?

>> No.174988

ITT, latin root is superior. Fucking Rome and their gloriously perfect language.

>> No.174710

I've often wondered, can japanese people absorb an entire paragraph or page of kanji as quickly as english readers can at a single glance? For most of us as soon as we look at a page most key words jump out at us and we kind of assemble things randomly as the entire meaning slowly coalesces in a matter of seconds.

>> No.174713

>>174710
they can. they can read everything that flashes by in a japanese talk show as if we'd read english captions

>> No.175001

>>174980
likely its (original) purpose is the same of the hanzi system it was adapted from. to make it more complicated so that only the learned (read scholars, nobles or clergy) could read giving them a dominance over the rest of the people. Its much the same reason that all written texts in Europe were written in Latin until a certain point in time.

>> No.174717

>>174702
A well educated chinese knows 4000-5000+ hanzi

A well educated japanese knows a bit over 2000 kanji

>> No.174728

>>174717
Yeah, but don't original chinese kanji only have one pronunciation/reading, as opposed to japanese bastardized kanji which can have 2-3 or more depending on what word it's a part of? Hell, 「一」 alone can be read "ichi", "hito", or "kazu".

>> No.174729

>>174717
more like 12,000 - 15,000. Goes up to 21,000 at the university level.

>> No.174730

>>174717
More like 12,000 - 15,000 for the chinese. Goes up to 21,000 at the university level.

>> No.174741

>>174728
hanzi have one pronunciation PER DIALECT, so your average person knows two pronunciation per hanzi

>> No.174737

>>174728
There are some words that have more than one pronunciation, but for the most part it usually is only one or two ways to pronounce/read

>> No.174743

>>174730
Doesn't make sense. There's only about 65,000 characters, so an average guy can't know 1/4 of them. Not even scholars know that many.

>> No.174747

>>174743
"well educated"

>> No.174748

>>174747
Even if well-educated, that number is absurd.

>> No.174751

I sometimes used to think "Man, it'd be great if Japan just switched to all-kana or something." But then I realized there's so many damn homophones it would make any written text practically illegible.

Asia is totally screwed, language-wise.

>> No.175031

All this bullshit and hassle just to deal wit the lack of spaces in written language. It's crazy, pure crazy.

>> No.174760

From the last thread:

>i'm beyond pissed right now.
i accepted a refund from her "friend's" account because paypal deemed me sol (just like some other girls that were paid via personal payment). i'm fucked one way or another, so it's like whatever, and i needed to pay my rent.

>and now guess what i just discovered when i logged into my paypal account? little hint: it's what we all expected to happen to those who got refunds from her "friend".

>i will get proper authorities involved asap. i'm so fucking done.

>>6434984

>> No.174762

They could learn to use spaces.

>> No.174763

>>174748
I'm speaking as a chink living in an Asian country. That number is not absurd. 12 - 15 thousand characters is normal for a person who has graduated from secondary school with an A in Chinese.

>> No.175040

fuck them all, everything should be in Cymraeg anyways.

>> No.174766

>>174741

都 here, 'sup?

>> No.174767

>>174762
Yeah, I would appreciate that.

>> No.174770

>>174759
>>174763
Characters, not words. You form exponentially more words from the characters.

"It is usually said that about 3,000 characters are needed for basic literacy in Chinese (for example, to read a Chinese newspaper), and a well-educated person will know in excess of 4,000 to 5,000 characters"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_character

>> No.175051

>>175031
That, and from a western perspective, the Japanese are always using CRUSE CONTROL FOR COOL because they lack lowercase letters.

>> No.174779

>>174770
If "well educated" means failed. They're right. I know more than 5k characters and I've failed my Chinese exam papers for the last 4 years of school.

>> No.175052

>>175051
katakana's sort of like their caps lock.

>> No.174785

It's it the same for learning English isn't it? Took me ages to bring my vocab up when I first started english.

I was all like "What the fuck, four tenses per verb? Irregular verbs? Silent letters? WTF is this shit"

>> No.174792

>>174779
Have you even counted the number you know? You know your computer only knows 5000 characters.

>> No.175070

>>175052
You're just full of answers tonight, Anon.

>> No.174807

>>174792
Says the guy who doesn't speak the language and quotes from wikipedia articles.

>> No.175082

Anon once posted a pdf file of a book that teaches you tricks on remembering certain kanji. I think I still have it in my HD.

Do want?

>> No.174819

Many Americans can't tell the difference between "your" and "you're"; and it makes me a sad panda.

>> No.174820

I can no longer count on two hands the number of times a Japanese person I know has professed being unable to read the kanji of a certain message printed on a sign or text. "Oh, I don't know those kanji," they'll say casually and act like half-illiteracy is perfectly normal.

>> No.174826

>>174785
No way

I was speaking/writing Native level English in pretty much a year.

I have no problems whatsoever with Japanese pronunciation since it can be very similar to spanish.

It's all the damn characters that get me, it can be a little overwhelming watching a RAW show, and have all these fonts/titles flying all over the place, and disappearing in 3 seconds.

>> No.174828

>>174807
Making up the number you know does not make you appear smarter. It's like making up an IQ score of 210. Try actually counting the number you know or reading about it rather than making up your own inflated self-scored number.

>> No.175100

>>175082
upload to rapidshare
post

>> No.175104

>>175082
UPLOAD PLEASE

>> No.175105

>>175082
gief.

>> No.175118

What do you know, I didn't need to do anything because it was already on Rapidsearch.

Here you go:
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=K9I309GU

In return, one of you better sub Zetsubou.

>> No.175119
File: 78 KB, 750x570, 1205053563558.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
175119

>>175118

>> No.175123

>>175118
really appreciate it, but the people who are reading this thread are most likely different from the anons who can sub SZS. just a hunch.

>> No.175124

>>175118
>Heisig

You fucker

>> No.175129

>>175124
Is there a problem?

>> No.175132

>>175129
Not denying your willingness to help and all, but alot of us have kinda heard of Heisig already. Alot. Many sites recommended his book (remembering the kanji) to study FIRST before grammar and whatnot = Most of us already pirated it already.

>> No.175144

Why can't they just use words

It's so easier

It would be awesome

Fuck the symbols

>> No.175146

>>175132
So then you shouldn't have problems with Kanji if you know of that book already.

>>
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