/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Probably Yuuka or Yuugi.

>>15509300
Why not suika?

>>15509367
Suika admits that Yuugi is physically stronger than her in her dialogue in Subterranean Animism. Yuuka is one of the strongest youkai, including Oni. Suika can't compete with Yuugi in physical strength, and it's possible Yuuka is stronger than Yuugi.

>>15509275
Physically?

Yuugi or Byakuren, Suika is a good option same with Yukari.

You know I'm right.

>>15509375
Yuuka is strong, but not that kind of strong.
She's got that Raw Youkai Power, but physically probably pretty average. Much like Flandre, she's got probably some superhuman physical ability because of vampirism but her "destroy whatever" isn't because she's pumping iron for 500 years in the basement.
If Yuuka had some sort of special ability to dump all that raw power into, she would be absolutely terrifying.

Meanwhile, Byakuren is literally MUSCLEWIZARD. Like that's her thing. How strong is it afterwards? Who knows. Zun probably doesn't seeing as he doesn't even know if Aya has wings.

The answer is pretty obvious

>>15509556
The BIG NERD can't even beat Genji at arm wresting.

None

>>15509641
But -4 str

>>15509556
This

>>15509641
Canonically, Rinnosuke retrieved a lot of advantages from his youkai genes. He can probably throw down with the average youkai and beat up any average humans.

Drunk Oni can lift the most

Byakuren strongest physical fighter probably

Hellbitch > Judgebitch > Moonbitch > Gap Hag > Rest in terms of actual real power

>>15509375

Isn't Suika physically weak for an Oni? I mean, if Yuugi's muscles are somewhere closer to the average, wouldn't that mean Suik is underweight?

>>15509375
What even causes people to overrate Yuuka this hard? Stronger than the physically most powerful of the four devas? Get the fuck out of here. Yuuka's just a strong Youkai and that's it. Nothing indicates that she's on the level of any notable powerhouses like Yukari, Tenshi, or Reimu.

>>15510121
>Yukari, Tenshi and Reimu
One of these things is not like the others.

>>15510126

Tenshi? Reimu can transform herself into an indestructible wrecking ball, while Yukarin can portal cut anything she pleases or seperate the borders to turn their insides out.

>>15510126
Tenshi isn't quite broken.
>>15509966
It's not saying much. Even memfairy can beat up most humans

>>15510126
In terms of abilities, Reimu and Yukari certainly outclass Tenshi, but Tenshi is a powerhouse.

If you're trying to imply that Tenshi is not on that level, may I remind you that she smashed half the cast of SWR in quick succession, including Reimu herself? She even admitted she wasn't really trying when she lost to any of them in their routes and was barely trying when she crushed them all in her own. Her only legitimate loss may have been to Yukari. She even beat Suika.

Hecatia. Canonically the strongest. Closest thing to an absolute being.

followed by "some moon bitch, moon bitches is stronk"

then either Shikieiki or Yuuka, depending on who you ask

Then Suika or something. Suika may be the strongest in Gensoukyou, but she doesn't rabble rouse that much (unless at parties) and she fucks around a lot so it's hard to tell.

Then either Yukari or Reimu, and although Reimu is not "strongest" she's literally invincible and endlessly determined so she'll always win eventually

I am not talking about physical power. Yuugi might be physically stronger than Suika but in a world where danmaku rules that means little. Besides, Suika's powers are completely fucking absurd.

>>15510126
>>15510158
Oh right, I always forget Tenshi.

Her story kind of bothered me since after she gets whooped (which is what she wanted) she basically pulls the "I was only pretending" card.

Fucking Celestials, no wonder nobody likes them.

Me

>>15510155

Fairy characters can beat a human in the same way a human can beat a bear with a gun; the moment a human closes distance with them, they're in for a bad time.

>>15510010
>Judgebitch
People still believe this?

>no one is talking about motherfucking vampires

>>15510212
She's absolute under certain conditions, and quite ridiculous otherwise.

As expected of beings that judge things

>>15510222
they talk a big game and it about ends there

Flan's power is scary, however

>>15510227
>Vampires have tremendous physical abilities and magical power: they are able to uproot a thousand-year-old tree single-handedly, to run through the human village within the blink of an eye, to summon many devils with a single word, to turn into bats or even mist to intrude anywhere they please, and they can recover within a single night even when their body is blown away, so long as their head is intact.

>>15510305
Oni can do even more

And Touhou vamps are literally knockoff oni

>>15510318
>Some youkai have abilities to this level of power, but only vampires are known to possess all of them.

>Because of this, they have charisma of the highest class.

>However, due to their extraordinary abilities, they have many weaknesses.

>>15510305
>>15510355
one of those weaknesses is boasting and being too prideful

>>15510360
Yes, I've read it too. Also the book I was quoting flat out says oni are the strongest beings in Gensokyo anyway, but vampires are definitely more than just your average shit-talking pushover.

>>15510385
well sure there's no denying that, in fact I never said they weren't

I did say they talk bigger than is legit, which is fact. Remilia would have you believe she's the baddest ass in Gensokyo but naw. Oh, she's for sure up there, but I wouldn't put her above Reimu or something. I consider Reimu the dividing line between general top dogs and "wow, fuck off, no fair" beings. I consider Reimu like that since she herself rests in-between, being very powerful but also holding a very cheat-like trump card she can technically use whenever

I wouldn't bring up Remi in power talks since I don't think she's total bullshit, basically. Least from what we know about her. She/Flan might be the toughest before you get into bullshit territory.

>>15510360
>the devil's own ears

Is that an expression? I've heard of the "devil's own luck" but ears?

>>15510407
"they talk a big game and it about ends there"
This is pretty much everybody in Gensokyo, shit talking is the national pass-time. Save a handful, of which Remilia would be part, who talk big game and can actually then bring big game even if they aren't the apex hardass they think themselves. Also getting into anything but physical prowess is and always has been retarded since abilities and the scales of abilities have always been insanely vague. Alter borders, alter fate, fly above reality, control the paranormal, how far does any of this shit even go?

>>15510438
I don't think it's retarded if you just start thinking within spell card rules and how those might change things.

For example, Flandre's ability to "destroy anything" seems pretty damning, but that's almost completely useless for danmaku (sounds like it'd work like a bomb if anything)

So contextualize abilities based on the rules and the scales of magic power, not physical since that is even more useless for spell cards (who cares about physical power in a danmaku battle? Whatever. Besides, in that case it's probably just Yuugi and there, that's the end of it).

Hecatia has crazy domain control and is like 3 people at once and a bunch of other crap on top of being the most godly god we've seen so far. Pretty good.

Yuuka has insane magical ability that she barely uses and she still scares everyone.

Suika's ability to manipulate density is completely unfair. She can use BLACK HOLES.

Man, it's Touhou, never forget danmaku.

>>15510455
>who cares about physical power in a danmaku battle?
In fact both of the oni do at some point or another, if I remember right. But being "actually the strongest" as op put it seemed to imply he wanted not to talk about danmaku, and since everybody except Reimu seems to actually mind needless killing and thus never actually apply themselves in any way but fancy bullet patterns, all we know is zun has already said the answer is reimu. And never forget having an ability does not mean that your ability has no limits.

>>15509379
Translate it weebs

>>15509498
IIRC, Yuuka's PMiSS entry states that she is incredibly physically powerful as well as her raw youkai power, and that she relies on crushing physical attacks rather than magic in duels.

>>15510121
Mostly her Lotus Land Story profile, if I had to guess, especially since she's stated to be 'the strongest youkai'.
>>15510115
Nah, Yuugi is just the strongest Oni in existence.

>>15510360
Being smugged at by Remy!

>>15509375
Suika also lies

>>15510158
She got trashed by nearly all the characters and then used the "I wasn't really trying" card.

You know you can't take 2hu banter seriously?

>>15510588
"The pleasure of being comed inside"

>>15513389
Slapping a smugging Remi!

>>15510360
>her Last Word spellcard is literally just "uses her overwhelming physical strength to fight in melee"

Sounds pretty strong to me desu

>>15509275
>https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Meiji_University_talkshow_%22Dawn_of_Touhou%22
>Q. Who's the strongest in Gensokyo?
>A. Absolutely, ......isn't it Reimu? Although it seems obvious.

Doesn't hold that much value being from 2004, but there you go.

>>15509275
I assume that we talk about strongest we are nt talking about physical strength. If that is the chase then I guess yuugi is the most logical answer
If we are talking about who can cause more destruction, Yukari is always there with the lolboundaries power, even if we really don´t know the full extend of it in combat. This happens with alot of powers in touhou, so this kind of discussions end up being pointless.
To put an example, what can Flandre destroy and what cannot? can she make the entire moon explote just because she can see it? what´s the limit?
If we talk about who can beat/kill who tho, it really boils down to 3 characters: Yukari, Reimu, and koishi. Yukari because lolboundaries, Reimu because lolinvincible, and koishi because as far as I know she can make her enemy be not aware of her existence, and how the fuck do you beat that?
But in the end, the strongest thing in Gensoukyou is love
>>15510222
they ARE strong, but they don´t exactly live in a normal place after all

>>15509927
Intorducing.. My Baka Stand!

>>15516835
>how the fuck do you beat that
Gay Bulge

After all that I've read in this thread i decided that an immediate intervention was necessary. Why? Because you are all wrong. The way you think is shallow and narrow minded. Who has the greatest raw strenght? Who is the smartest? Who has the hardest to dodge spellcard? Who is the cutest? What if i tell you there is one peerless Touhou who is above all of these qualities and you dont even know? She would even make Reimu cry. Its been said in this thread that Yuugi and Yuuka have amazing raw powers, Tenshi already beat the Hakurei hoes without even trying or so she says, Suika can manipulate density and all that nerd babble. But so what? Nothing of this even matters. What is amount of energy? What are numbers? I still play on easy mode. Intelligence is the resolve to overcome fear. There is not a single being in all Gensokyo who can even match the peerless, chain sickle wielding Cirno.

>>15510158
Yukari and Komachi. Those are the two that she never rematches.

>>15509275
Clearly Manrisa.

>>15510179
>followed by "some moon bitch, moon bitches is stronk"
I don't know, the moon bitches worship yama, don't they? Eiki might be above them, but that's kind of iffy I'll confess.
>then either Shikieiki or Yuuka, depending on who you ask
Yeah, sure Eiki, but you're an idiot if you put Yuuka this high. She has absurd physical and magical strength, but just pure strength isn't enough to put you this high, especially when you've canonically lost to a non-op Reimu pre-spellcards.

>Then Suika or something. Suika may be the strongest in Gensoukyou, but she doesn't rabble rouse that much (unless at parties) and she fucks around a lot so it's hard to tell.
While I really do believe that Yukari is overrated by her fans, she's still absurdly powerful, and putting her below Suika is a service to her abilities. After all, she is both the character who actually forces Suika to physically manifest, and along with Yuyuko is the only character whom Suika doesn't defeat in her route in IaMP.

I would say, among those you listed, it's probably
Reimu abusing Fantasy Heaven > Hecatia > Eiki >=<(?) Moonbitches > Yukari > Suika > Reimu > Yuuka

Of course, actually trying to measure who's more powerful in Gensokyo is fucking retarded thanks to spellcard rules, especially since that means that all we have to go on are slight and small hints, but I digress.

where does junko measure in?

>>15527353
Almost impossible to say. She has to be below the Moonsluts, otherwise she wouldn't need such a roundabout method to defeat them, but she powerful enough to threaten them, and her powers are pretty absurd.

Are we talking about magical powerlevels or pure physical strength? Physical strength is an interesting question, but magical strength is no contest, Reimu at full power wipes everyone.

Myself of course

>>15510121
>What even causes people to overrate Yuuka this hard?
ZUN explicitly calls Yuuka 'the strongest class of youkai' in the old PC-98 canon.

In the Windows canon all we have to work off is PoFV, PMiSS and assumptions based off the PC-98.

That isn't to say that suddenly makes her weaker, PMiSS's entry on Yuuka is just non-stop straight up wanking of Yuuka's raw physical and spiritual power as absolutely off the charts.

It even goes as far to make Yuuka an example of why battles need rules because they'd never end with two Yuuka level beings. Eiki points out how she's near ancient as a youkai and for them being older means they accumulate a lot of power.

>>15527466
I'm pretty sure OP means physical strength, in which case Yuugi's "can lift a mountain" is more impressive than anything else in the series.

>>15516909

That's Cirno Man, a man who has Cirno's powers, only amplified to human levels. He fights for the fairies, but he's not Cirno. It's quite easy to confuse the two as they seem so similar!

>>15516835
Its always really weird to me that Meiling and Keine just are not in this picture

>>15509275
Does Marisa even squat?

>>15513595
She's only capable of convincingly lying by omission of truth.

Though she can lie, its incredibly obvious when she does it.

>>15516835
>how the fuck do you beat that?
Its really simple, actually.
Since it depends on altering the subconscious, you must lack a subconscious.

So I assume she is not immune to a machine, as long as its automatic systems are of a relatively low abstraction.

>>15527315
>you're an idiot if you put Yuuka this high. She has absurd physical and magical strength, but just pure strength isn't enough to put you this high, especially when you've canonically lost to a non-op Reimu pre-spellcards.
What is there saying Yuuka is the same level of strength that she was in PC-98?

Also a protagonist beating an enemy doesn't automatically determine whether or not they're "powerful". In HRtP Reimu makes her way through Makai with a ying yang orb and almost no idea how to use it and beats everyone. Would I say she's "stronger" than those she beat? Hell no. Surviving and then beating someone doesn't say how strong you are.

>>15516835
Why do everyone think Yukari is some godly being with infinite power thanks to her boundary powers?

SSiB clearly shows that her powers are really limited.

None

sirno is the strongest