[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/jp/ - Otaku Culture

View post   
  [?]In ghost mode, only threads with non-archived posts will be shown
File: 360 KB, 537x758, c07572663f395393838738acadb2a409.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14175022 No.14175022 [Reply] [Original]

What percentage of people in /jp/ actually know Japanese?

And by "know Japanese" I don't mean people who are capable of nit-picking a translation with a pair of dictionaries in each hand, which there's apparently no shortage of; I mean actually capable of listening to people speak in rapid conversational Japanese with full comprehension, or opening up an arbitrary Vocaloid music video on Nicovideo and parsing it on the first watch-through.

>> No.14175061

>>14175022
>I mean actually capable of listening to people speak in rapid conversational Japanese with full comprehension
>opening up an arbitrary Vocaloid music video on Nicovideo and parsing it on the first watch-through.

I can't even do this in English or with English songs, let alone stiff robot sounding songs. Why the fuck do foreigners speak so fast?

>> No.14175076

>>14175022
My guess is zero. When you set the bar for knowing a language at "native fluency" it's obvious nobody's going to hit it because they're not, you know, native.

Especially given that you picked listening instead of reading, which demands not just comprehension (which quite a few people here actually have) but extremely high-speed comprehension.

>> No.14175081

What percentage of people in /jp/ actually know English?

And by "know English" I don't mean people who are capable of nit-picking a translation with a pair of dictionaries in each hand, which there's apparently no shortage of; I mean actually capable of listening to people speak in rapid conversational English with full comprehension, or opening up an arbitrary music video on Youtube and parsing it on the first watch-through.

>> No.14175098

>>14175081
I guess not everyone was raised in an Anglophone country.

I don't actually browse Nicovideo much, but I think most Vocaloid videos are subbed (no doubt because nips can't make sense of that shit either)

>> No.14175188

>>14175022
I can watch anime without subtitles, but my reading skills are child level (fucking moon) Use voiceroid to play vns

>> No.14175232

>>14175081
>I mean actually capable of listening to people speak in rapid conversational English with full comprehension, or opening up an arbitrary music video on Youtube and parsing it on the first watch-through.
I've grown to be able to understand spoken English most of the time but song lyrics remain incomprehensible to me. My speaking is still bad, it just doesn't sound natural.

>> No.14175450

Well, I'm one of those.

>> No.14175453

>>14175081
If Murricans were a minority on /jp/ I'd be surprised but I'd believe it

>> No.14175460

Still wishing some day I could understand something that goes this fast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LwseRYslew

>> No.14175464

>>14175022
Can you? If yes, did you come here to brag about your mad skills? What a piece of shit useless thread. Kill yourself.

PS: I don't understand a word of Japanese and I'm proud of it! Bet you don't understand my language at all either, nerdlord.

>> No.14175489 [DELETED] 

>>14175464
still better than bragging about your lack of skills, mad or otherwise

>> No.14175497

>>14175464
>I'm proud of it!
Congratulations on your tremendous achievement.

>> No.14175501
File: 521 KB, 800x900, 1339199724273.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14175501

I'm going to be one of those!!
I promise!!

>> No.14175580

I just realized that I don't actually know any language.

>> No.14175769

Translator here.

I just don't brag about it because I'm not some insufferable douchebag.

>> No.14175779
File: 409 KB, 480x486, 1316613200729.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14175779

>>14175501
Yeah, me too!
I believe in us!!

>> No.14175794
File: 321 KB, 600x600, 1431354077368.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14175794

I can barely speak my mother tounge properly, atleast not how the schoolbooks want me to.
Don't get me started on english. Fuck, my grammar is probably the worst.

I'm happy I can understand a few lines in music or anime.

>> No.14175831

don't regular /jp/ but I am pretty decent. Can't do rapid fast conversation but able to discuss topics at length and with substance.

I could do subbing/translation but honestly not motivated enough for little payoff, don't really care about epeen.

do people actually donate to sub groups/translators?

>> No.14175849

>>14175831
Not anymore because CR/HorribleSubs killed fansubbing. Maybe people donate for the rare vns that get translations, not sure

>> No.14175857

>>14175849
shit, haven't watched an anime in ages, I guess someone had to monetize it.
what about like manga/book commission? I wouldn't even mind joining a vn translation project.

>> No.14175865

>>14175022
I guess there aren't many here, but here's a decent online Japanese comprehension test, if anyone feels like giving it a shot
http://www.j-cat.org/en/

>> No.14175870

I'm afraid of learning Japanese. First up it would destroy my productivity since I would spend so much time reading vns and doujin instead of drawing.
Second I love j-music, but I'm afraid that the lyrics are in reality too corny and dumb.

>> No.14175877

I am so fucking Japanese holy shit you have no idea jp

>> No.14175880

>>14175870
There are a lot of good drawing tutorials in Japanese though, but your second point is valid.
It would also make you aware of how awkward any translated material is, which is a pain until you get to the point where you can read Japanese without problems.

>> No.14175903

>>14175849
I don't know what your problem with CR is. I feel that they bring tremendous advantages compared to regular fansubbing.

1. I don't have to watch shitty meme/troll subs a la Commie et al anymore.
2. I don't have to wait two to four weeks for subs.
3. I don't have to worry that not-so-popular anime will be picked up by a Gaia/Livejournal/Tumblr level fansubbing group or no one at all.
4. No one is forcing the NEWEST AND BESTEST AND SMALLEST (unfortunately not supported by 99% of current-gen PCs) encodings onto me by convincing major fansubbing groups to switch to said encoding. You know what I'm talking about. Plus, no autistic OP/ED typesetting anymore.

In addition, I'm still not paying a cent for it, though if I was feeling generous, I'd rather pay for a CR subscription than donate to a shady fansubbing group. At least that way, a few cents will probably go the the original creators.

>> No.14175922

>>14175903
>4. No one is forcing the NEWEST AND BESTEST AND SMALLEST (unfortunately not supported by 99% of current-gen PCs)
This is utter bullshit man. Tell me more about your that no software decoding hi10p H.264 can play it back?

>> No.14175923
File: 205 KB, 1000x1285, 4861151.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14175923

>>14175903
My only problem with them is no karaoke. I want to sing along dammit
Otherwise I agree, I do not miss the old days of having to choose between the ebin memers like Commie and sometimes Underwater or the slow as fuck groups who make you wonder if they're even alive. Not like most of the popular anime is difficult to sub anyways. I don't know Japanese but even I can pick up a lot of what the people say in the moeshit shows

>> No.14175946

I am a native English speaker and I can't understand English language song lyrics.

>> No.14175954

>>14175081
I am a native English speaker and even I can't understand today's English lyrics. Most of it is the singers are mumbling incomprehensibly or the BGM is so loud, you couldn't hear what they're saying even if you tried.

>> No.14175988

>>14175460
This isn't that fast. Honestly, the real issue with it is the annoying robot voices that make it hard to pick out intonation, it's far more of a reading exercise than listening practice. Getting to the point where you can read kanji as fast as letters takes a long time and lots of familiarity.

>> No.14176006

>>14175988
I wish I could read kanji... I've been slaving away at my Core6k deck with Anki, currently being at ~1000 words, and do somewhat okay there, but only thanks to the example sentences. Without these, I am usually pretty swamped when encountering said kanji in the wild, and always end up not being able to recognize them. Why kanji, Japan? Without them, it would be fairly easy to learn Japanese...

>> No.14176010

>>14175922
He is right.
My machine can play BD just fine, but it stutters a lot when playing 10bit no matter how much I tweak the settings.

How come I can play the raw source disc just fine but not the encode?

>> No.14176046

>>14176006

You should pick up most of the 1000 words by osmosis before even doing a core deck.

You have tens of thousands of words to go before fluency.

Kanji is fucking nothing.

>> No.14176051

>>14176006
Kanji make Japanese easier and faster to read. You shouldn't be using example sentences on flashcards, all you're actually doing is memorising the sentence rather than the kanji.

It's far easier to develop a mnemonic system for a month or two to cover the majority of kanji, given they're made up of only 200 radicals, and then just focus on core at a much faster rate because you already know all the symbols.

Japanese without kanji would look like absolute shit, and be a pain to read. Kanji are linked to concepts, so something like 車 can be instantly defined as a vehicle while being read しゃ, like the 射 in fucking 射精. They're a solution to the issue to homonyms in a language with such a restricted syllable set, and I love them.

>> No.14176290

I find that learning kanji by learning their etymology seems to be way easier for me. Japanese pronunciation is fucked up though. You can have the same kanji in a word and it would be pronounced differently.

黒髪
金髪

>> No.14176305

>>14176290
Whenever people say shit like this, all I can think is "wouldn't きんかみ or くろぱつ sound fucking stupid?" Most funky alternate pronunciations seem like they stem from this, trying to avoid really awkward shit.

Maybe it's just because I started with audio rather than writing.

>> No.14176324

>>14176305
>"wouldn't きんかみ or くろぱつ sound fucking stupid?"

No.

>> No.14176328
File: 8 KB, 229x173, 1403640868183.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14176328

>> No.14176329

>>14176324
Mixing up chinese and japanese pronunciation in the same word doesn't sound stupid?

>> No.14176330

>>14176329
Welcome to Japanese.

>> No.14176333

>>14176330
Can you list 10 common words that do this?

>> No.14176334

Stop complaining and just learn Japanese.

>> No.14176337

>>14176305
Agreed. It just sounds wrong.

>> No.14176342

>>14176333
I don't have a problem with 富士山. Do you?

>> No.14176347

>>14176342
I don't follow. That's all Chinese reading

>> No.14176348

>>14176334
日本語を覚えられない　orz

>> No.14176356

>>14176348

覚えられる！頑張れ頑張れファイト！

>> No.14176417

>>14176046
>You should pick up most of the 1000 words by osmosis before even doing a core deck.

Are you serious? How about I give you a book in a language with a completely different writing system than yours and let you try picking up words. People need some kind of foothold of knowledge to give them context before they can start growing vocabulary from reading.

>> No.14176439

>>14176417
>People need some kind of foothold of knowledge to give them context before they can start growing vocabulary from reading.
If only Japanese people communicated with noises, using a simplistic syllabary anybody could understand in 5 minutes. Imagine if those noises were available translated into English, so you could very easily pick up the common vocab and understand the meaning just by watching a screen.

Alas, they're a race of bug people who communicate only through the medium of dance, and kanji are the only way to understand them.

>> No.14176457
File: 298 KB, 800x1130, 1371255706027.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14176457

>>14176439
Ok, so make sure I read translations. I guess that's step one down, sugoi idea!

>> No.14176472 [DELETED] 
File: 135 KB, 500x500, 1425453224192.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14176472

Why would I learn japanese? It's an extremely niche language who serves no purpose for my career.

>> No.14176473
File: 61 KB, 500x700, 1431398831021.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14176473

>>14175877
i love you jay

>> No.14176497

>>14176333
金色 is in fact a mixed word.

>> No.14176536

>>14176497
金色の髪, best word, best hair.

>> No.14176555

>>14176536
金色の髪様

>> No.14176680

>>14176010
>How come I can play the raw source disc just fine but not the encode?
Because the raw source is not compressed as much.

>> No.14176682

>>14175903
>No one is forcing the NEWEST AND BESTEST AND SMALLEST (unfortunately not supported by 99% of current-gen PCs) encodings

If only that was what was happening. In reality, fansub groups just kept increasing file sizes to the point where a single series can now take 50 gigs on your hard drive if you don't pay attention to what you download.

>> No.14176689

>>14176497
Isn't this because しき just generally fell out of common use? I can't think of any mixed words that weren't originally just a variant that became more popular than the "correct" version.

>> No.14176734

>>14176689
That goes for all languages though. New words replace the old. "Gay" was such a great word for "happy".

>> No.14176753

>>14175903
enjoy translators literally getting paid to google translate shit
https://twitter.com/GrygrFlzr/status/648116699942653953

>> No.14176761

>>14176753
Which episode of what anime? That's funny as shit.

>> No.14176785
File: 13 KB, 278x181, images.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14176785

>>14175877
Hello friend

>> No.14176787

>>14175081
There's a ton of English songs where I cannot understand some passages..
People can't fucking speak English properly.

>> No.14176798

I'm just too lazy to properly learn kanjis.

>> No.14176809

>>14176417

When I started core I knew the first thousand or so without ever having studied them.

You'd have to brain dead not to pick up the most common vocabulary.

>> No.14176816

>>14176798

>> No.14176824

>>14176809
I'm just genuinely curious. How?

How were you exposing yourself to them in such a way that you learned a thousand kanji without ever having studied any of them?

>> No.14176838

>>14176824

Not kanji, but words.

Core deck has sound, doesn't it?

I watched raw anime for about a year before starting core.

I know most of the kanji without having specifically studied though, now, though.

I just learnt them as words, and the same ones keep getting repeated so they become familiar.

>> No.14176851

>>14176824
Heisigfags, everyone.

>> No.14176855

>>14176838
I'm not the other guy, I guess I just misread the conversation. My mistake.

Dayum, wish I knew enough vocab to watch raws. Any recommendations on how to work on that?

>> No.14176890

>>14176855

You watch it regardless of whether you understand it or not.

You did the same thing as a child.

Watch female only SoL moe shows; they're the easiest to understand.

>> No.14177487

>>14176761
To answer my own question: Charlotte Episode 13 at 1:50.

Pretty shameless that that Shisogapo, Lumpur translation error is still there.

>> No.14178859

My Japanese is alright. I wouldn't call myself fluent but I can pass everything I want to read without looking at the dictionary or picking up things from context. If I'd sit down and study vocab hard I bet I could pass N1.

At this point I'm not even studying though, I'm pretty content with where I am and I'll just let time do it's thing.

>> No.14178924

>>14176305
>>14176290
The real problem is the etymology of words have nothing to do with the kanji used for them, since they just kind of stuck kanji onto their language to have a writing system.

>> No.14179989

>>14175870
A neat thing about Japanese is that even corny things sound profound due to how unfamiliar you are with the language.

>> No.14180014

I passed N1 and read books (non-fiction and fiction) and VNs once in a while. Except it's been 4 since I stopped browsing /jp/ daily. I just came here to ask a question in a thread.

>> No.14180016

>>14180014
*4 months

>> No.14180303

>>14176010
What shitty software are you using? What's your machine?

>> No.14180321

>>14178924
In this case that's total bullshit. Yes, kurogami is all Japanese pronunciation but the etymology is 1:1 with the meaning of the kanji.

>> No.14180433

>>14175081
Hey boss. Native English speaker here.

>> No.14180445

>>14176555
かみ as in 髪 and かみ as in 神 actually have different intonation patterns.

>> No.14184077

>>14180433
Which version? Can you understand southern accents? Australian accents? Californian accents?

>> No.14184113

>>14184077
Those types of accented English aren't that hard to parse for a native speaker, I think, it's only in certain parts of the United Kingdom (Glaswegian or some shit) that things get really thorny. I like this example (though all things considered it's not that hard to understand): http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-12135540

>> No.14184337

Learn JIS X

>>
Reply to thread [?]Don't expect anything heroic. Your post will not be uploaded to the original board.
Name
E-mail
Subject
Comment
Action