/jp/ - Otaku Culture

[Anonymous No.]

If they really wanted Vocaloid to enter the mainstream in America, then wouldn't it be smarter for them to promote Meiko instead of Miku? Nothing about Miku is socially acceptable as a pop idol for Americans- she looks too young, she has a screechy voice, long blue/green pigtails that go down to the floor, and an image that doesn't translate well to overt sexuality (aka she's flat-chested); it will never work. Unless you're already a weeaboo or are a really small child, she isn't going to be appealing at all.

Meanwhile Meiko has hair and eyes that are non-threateningly brown, with a normal, stylish haircut, and the body of an adult that is easily exploitable. Her "personality" is often portrayed as sensual and womanly, which American consumers of pop music prefer over the child-like purity of Miku. Plus she has one of the more realistic, non-exaggerated/cartoony voices that while yes is still robotic sounding, Americans could more easily adapt to it than Miku's often shrill vocals that take getting used to if you aren't already a weeb. They've been going about it all wrong.

One of Miku's biggest selling points in her popularity in Japan is how cute she is. But that's Japan. America likes cuteness in small doses, but hates it in large amounts. What do Americans like? They like "cool" and "sexy". They like things that make them feel "edgy" for liking them. It wouldn't be difficult to achieve that kind of image for Meiko.

Meiko could be the starting point to get them through the door. Gradually, they could introduce the more "wacky" (by America's standards) Vocaloids after getting people even used to the idea of virtual pop singers in a way that's palatable to the maintream American audience.

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313
I'm glad they didn't choose her then. Vocaloids shouldn't be mainstream in America. Anyway, has V3 Meiko been released yet? I haven't really been keeping up with Vocaloid releases.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574357
You can just skim the wiki once every six months. That's what I do anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574360
Hm, okay. I'll check out the wiki.

[Anonymous No.]

Except no one except dumb weeaboos want vocaloid to be popular in the US.

Wanting the things you like to become popular is a dysfunction. You should never want the things you cherished to be shared by others. You should covet and hoard your hobbies like treasure.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574395

So you're saying we should be like dragons?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574357
Meiko V3 sounds really good
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPOtyLvMtak

[Anonymous No.]

Who gives a shit about america anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574357
>>12574395
this (these)

the more vocaloid tries to enter mainstream in the west, the more western culture will also enter vocaloid. You can't just expect it to go one way, especially since anyone can produce content

Not to mention that things are usually better before they get popular in general.
and no I'm not being edgy or anything, it's actually logical. When it's less popular there is less pressure on producers and they have fun with it experimenting with original things, as it gets more popular there is more pressure to conform to some standard and a lot of original stuff is dismissed by the fans as not adhering to the true nature of the content and everything becomes stale

then you reach the cancer tier which is when people can actually make themselves look cool just by using it and businessmen try to step in because they see a lot of money being thrown around

Please don't let that happen. I know these stupid weeaboos probably just want to wear a miku t-shirt and post about vocaloid to their facebook and have their friends "like" their post because "omg it's that latest crazy japanese trend I've seen on the TV".
But it's completely selfish. There's literally no reason, unless you're a hipster, for vocaloid to be popular. Honestly, can you even think of one way in which western culture could positively contribute to vocaloid?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574534
no, that would be like dinosaurs

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574563
>Who gives a shit about america anyway.
Crypton Future Media apparently do

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574674
>You can't just expect it to go one way, especially since anyone can produce content
Yeah, but nobody can destroy it, so the non-Western content isn't going to go anywhere.

Overall I don't have particularly high hopes for Western producers, not because there isn't talent out there, but because that talent isn't going to use Vocaloids for anything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574682
I don't have high hopes for Western producers because they've consistently shown themselves to be lazy and unmotivated as fuck and most of their content is incredibly basic musically.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574682
ok, but that still doesn't mean that we should advocate for it's mainstream western adoption. Which is what the OP was implying

[Anonymous No.]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKGUgOfD8U
This is pretty good english song

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313
>Miku is of course already a sensation in Japan and her rhythm games have been a significant part of her success, with 2.5 million units shipped in that country alone. Now it seems creator Crypton Future Media is stepping things up stateside ahead of the songstress' newest rhythm games; Sega is bringing Project Diva F 2nd to North America for PS3 and Vita on November 18 and Project Mirai Remix for 3DS sometime next year.
http://www.joystiq.com/2014/10/09/hatsune-miku-stars-in-nomura-collaboration-letterman-show/
While I think that Meiko would be better for international marketing than Miku, it's obviously too late already.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313
Yeah, Meiko would be a better "entry-level" Vocaloid for Americans, since a lot of them are turned off by Miku being too outlandish. But I think they shouldn't push the Vocaloid niche to an audience who wouldn't understand what Meiko or Miku is at all, anyway. Crypton thinks having Miku's English boxart look less "moe", having her sing in incomprehensible English in concerts, and slapping her on Toyota cars and Letterman is good marketing to the west. Pandering to American audiences like that is just a lose-lose situation for the fans who like her just the way she is and for the supposed American audience they're targeting who won't even understand or like this Vocaloid thing either way.
They should cater more to people whose interests are actually relevant to Vocaloid.

[Anonymous No.]

Theres hundreds of songs out there that have Miku sounding mature and well pitched. Problem is they never seem to utilise them whenever Miku catches the Western eye. Theyre so stuck on promoting her as a thing rather than a singer so they get some shitty producer to make a song with "meaning" that sounds horrible or just use World Is Mine since its one of her most well known hit songs. If they took one of her best songs rather than putting the idea of what she is before who she is then there would be a much better reaction, Im sure.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574888
It would be less work to just use Meiko though.

[Anonymous No.]

They should just use Luka instead. She's more popular than Meiko in Japan and sounds better.

[Anonymous No.]

for miku to be popular she has to become a parody of pop culture. Basically have her reenact w/e stories are getting people to watch TMZ. sex video also helps.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574920
Not really. Meiko is pretty unknown in comparison; Miku already has billions of songs available to her and an actual presence. Literally all they need do is have her sing more "normal" songs that really back the idea of her being a standalone singer rather than some sort of existential figure.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574930
That would never work. Also it seems impossible but there are still plenty of scandal-free celebrities today's world

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574927
But Luka's design is still too "wacky". She would work as the second one introduced a year later or somethig.

[Anonymous No.]

best meiko album
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFyVYRD-MzE

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313
The introduction of was was considered the sound of vocaloids was the MGS:Peacewalker Ai robot bosses.
But the vocaloid feature for Zeke and Ai robots was too complicated to customize and also English dubbed.

[Anonymous No.]

Meiko is too bland to create any interest whatsoever. She's just a typical Japanese pop singer but 2D and nobody in America gives a shit about those.

The whole thing with Miku is that she's different enough to stick out, and even though Miku arguably doesn't necessarily sound that great her design and sound has been unique enough to gather the most attention. What songs like World of Mine have is that despite not really being the best display of the ability of the software, they have a sound that isn't present with conventional vocals.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574395
>You should never want the things you cherished to be shared by others.
You sound like a shitty person.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12576582
Welcome to /jp/.

Now get the fuck out.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574674
>Please don't let that happen.
Vocaloid is the coolest thing among teens after K-Pop. It will never be mainstream (not even Gorillaz could stick too long), but popular? It already is. And this businessmen meddling is a reality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574674
Vocaloid started out as a western thing though didn't it. LEON and LOLA?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313

>If they really wanted Vocaloid to enter the mainstream in America, then wouldn't it be smarter for them to promote Meiko instead of Miku?

No. ==Literally== all they need is a competent piece of software. A -single- vocaloid who can pass in English as Miku did in Japanese. The only ones that get even -close- are GUMI and Avanna, which aren't Crypton.

Of course, that was -before- they torpedoed the thing on Dave Letterman. Now they're just fucked. Not that we haven't tried to warn them about Miku's terrible English with EVERY FUCKING POST they put on facebook, but you know.

Anyways, the 'anime' style's the only thing that actually puts people off; 'weird','childish', and 'cute' have worked just fine (Lady Gaga, Miley Cyrus, Brittany Spears, various child stars, etc).

[Anonymous No.]

>>12576808
Stop -doing- this. You sound ==RETARDED==.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12576823

>Man, I couldn't even find a single spelling error so I'm gonna bitch about 4chan's lack of textual formatting instead.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12576736
The tech is originally from Anglo-Germanic roots; yes, but Miku certainly coined the fandom. Western fans could bring to the table what the Japanese already do: capable producers, artists and whoever else but, for whatever reason, they dont. I wish I could, but Im musically and artistically retarded so Id probably only do more damage than good.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574888
Why do so many of the japPs like to pitch Miku way the shit out of her range? Last Night Good Night, who listened to that chorus and was like "yeah, that sounds good"?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12578476
I really enjyoed Last Night Good Night in original Miku version (utterly hating that fucking remixed version)

[Anonymous No.]

>>12578481
You mean the Pharrell one? That's shit. As a song, I like it, but I think her voice is just too high. Love her to death but it's grating. Like, Star Story is also high but it has a smoothness to it and it doesn't make my dog start howling

[Anonymous No.]

>>12578476
Well, I did, for one. I actually kinda like it when she sounds really inorganic. Like the way Camellia or 8#Prince often do things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12578488
I think it's a matter of taste, but I can't imagine this song on a lower pitch. For me with provided music it gives that feeling of "spatialness"(?)

[Anonymous No.]

>>12576624
Are you implying that we're all like you? Stop projecting. /jp/ is not a place to make you feel better about yourself.

[Anonymous No.]

Using Meiko instead of Miku might make some people less reluctant to get into Vocaloid, but I think that's ignoring the bigger picture. Normies are inherently turned off by a foreign "hologram" girl singing broken English in a style that's incompatible with American pop. (Meiko doesn't even have a sufficient rapport for a good pop concert, unless you want to include the songs where she's tuned like a 16-year-old.)

Show anyone a Miku concert, and they'll think that's the whole extent of her appeal: a technologic novelty at best, a soulless corporate attempt to replace "real" singers at worst. Of course we know that's not true - all these events around the world were only made possible by the sweat and blood of thousands of otaku. She's less of a person and more of a presence that unifies amateurs and lets them be heard over the sea of manufactured idols.

The big problem? In order to discover that, you have to look past the surface, and that's something too difficult for most people to do. Mass media, where the majority of people will be looking, is already flooded with a circlejerk of poorly-researched articles showing off Miku like a freakshow exhibit. It doesn't help that very few of the campaigns themselves have so much as paid lip-service to the idea of explaining the Vocaloid community (Domino's Pizza was one notable exception, and uh, you know how that one went).

Pretty much the only people willing to sift through the shit and find out what Vocaloid really is are NEETs and teenagers with too much free time. And even then, the most productive of those have given up on forging an American community and instead assimilated themselves into Nico.

[Anonymous No.]

lmao maiko sounds like shit only reason u would like her is if your a hipster, pathetic really

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574313
Seems like you don't understand how businesses work in Japan.

Japanese business 101:
Japan tries to innovate until something sticks. Once it does, they'll play the same card until it's tired. Then, they'll milk the cow a bit more. When the cow finally dies, they wonder what the fuck they're doing wrong and then release another version of the same cash cow, now with funky accessories. And so goes on. They only go back to the innovation board when said zombified cow's rotten corpse isn't capable of giving any kind of milk anymore.

That being said, I don't think they'd risk giving their least sold Vocaloid a chance in the West when they have a perfectly healthy cash cow called Hatsune Miku. Western standards be damned, they already had a fanbase (weeaboos, but don't tell them), what wrong is it in trying to expand it the same way they always did?

[Anonymous No.]

To all the little shits who don't want their stuff to become popular, you're why we can't get nice things. If it's not popular, it doesn't sell. If it doesn't sell, it'll die. Hatsune Miku is still a thing because she's popular, she sells. If she didn't sell, you wouldn't see her getting shows and figures.

Ever saw an official Tone Rion figure? How about an Utatane Piko one? No? That's right, it's because they're shit and nobody likes them. So, they don't sell. Therefore, the corporations that made them didn't want any business with them anymore (which is kind of funny, because if they wanted profits, they'd make their products less shitty in first place).

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574556
That actually does sound really good. Niki a best.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12591853
People just don't want Vocaloids to become mainstream in America, which is completely understandable.

[Anonymous No.]

>2100
>big, modern, high-tech New York
>hover vehicles
>vast public transport
>arcologies - cities within cities
>most people speak english and japanese
>kawaii culture present in every aspect of live
>big, flashy billboards informing about concert of the most famous world star: Miku Hatsune
We don't even have to do anything, it will happen. I feel it in my guts.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12593150
I don't know about Miku, but I am convinced virtual artists are only going to get more popular over the next few decades.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12593150
Who are you quoting?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594150
The spirits of the machine.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594124
Unless something incredibly bad happens or she gets left technologically behind to a massive degree, I cant see Miku ever really going away. And the latter doesnt seem to have any chance of happening since she's always on the forefront or at least cusp of any advancements and such.

Miku will always be this worlds electric angel.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594152
Machine doesn't have spirits!

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594124
Have you forgotten Gorillaz already?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594203
Gorillaz werent virtual artists, they were just cartoon personae for the band.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12593150
>>12594155
Miku exists for 7 years, and we already have fuckton of songs, merchandise, games, alternative costumes, fanarts, and other stuff. I can't even imagine how it will look like if she would be at least as popular as now for next 100 years. Maybe she will become next Jesus and there will be shops and manufacturers everywhere specialized only in her merchandise and there will be churches where people who waifued her meet up.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594261
I doubt her popularity or spread will continue to grow in a linear fashion, it will likely taper if/when she gets a real breakthrough to the world, but its not impossible for Miku to stay sort of just out of the mainstream/public eye in her niche strongly for time to come. Evangelion is still going strong enough and thats got a few more years under its belt, whats to stop a freelance singer with an incredibly devoted fanbase?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12593150
>thinks the garbled, pathetic mess the Japanese call a "language" will survive the next century

You feel it in your guts like Mima fans feel it in their bones, right?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12594217
>for the band
2 people don't make a band

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>12599550
Is it just me or did her model look especially beautiful on the show?

[Anonymous No.]

>>12600187

[Anonymous No.]

>>12600573
This is cringe worthy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12591853
What happened when video games became more mainstream? They got taken over by greedy jews who make soulless AAA titles, or those who want it to pander to them even though they don't give a shit normally (aka SJWs).

What happened to 4chan when it got more popular over the years? The posters got shittier.

If something gets more popular, the community around it gets worse. The only people a community needs are the kind of people who would genuinely be devoted to it, whether it would be popular or not.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12603525
It's pretty hard to retain interest in something when you have nobody to talk to about it. Sure, there's always /jp/, but let's face it, in the entirety of /jp/ there's like ten people who really care about Vocaloid.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12603525
Kinda late response, dude, but true nonetheless.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12603536
>It's pretty hard to retain interest in something when you have nobody to talk to about it
Anyone with this mentality should be euthanized.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12603536
>It's pretty hard to retain interest in something when you have nobody to talk to about it.
The hell it is. Nobody I know cares for or knows of Vocaloid and I sure as hell dont discuss it anywhere on the Internet thanks to faggots who just have to try and trash any discussion or, perhaps worse, fucking secondaries. Im happy keeping myself to myself, finding and enjoying new content on my own and even travelling solo to further immerse myself. Its not like this is a game where you perhaps need/want another person to play against.

As long as you have an actual interest in a thing and youre not just trying to keep up appearances or whatever then this isnt a hard feat.

[miku hatsune !mikuFjQxtc No.]

miku is too cute to die

[Anonymous No.]

>>12574556
Another artist that uses Meiko worth a damn? Fuckin subbed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12592794
>>12603525
Well, corporations don't give a fuck. They only want money. And you'll have to deal with it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12605636
Good thing Vocaloid is something practically controlled by its fans; all the big corporations do is orchestrate the large(r) events. If Crypton or whoever steps out of line people are gonna drop it like its hot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12606974
>implying Mikutards give even an ounce of a fuck about quality
To them, whatever has Hatsune Miku in it is already awesome, no matter how shitty it is. I mean, holy shit, just look at some producers who got famous thanks to Miku and look at how shitty they are at using Vocaloid!

[Anonymous No.]

>>12612334

[screenshot this post for time (...) No.]

>>12594261
I doubt Miku will remain popular for 100 years. how many people today are listening to music from 100 years ago?

[Anonymous No.]

3% listen to classical music and I'd bet 90% of them listen to Mozart and Beethoven (sadly). Just you wait until Vocaloid gets exalted to high-brow art like jazz and the more-palatable classical music. Not that it will probably happen, but you never know was shit they can market to people.

[Anonymous No.]

meiko's power vb is pretty good

especially liked the cover for weekender girl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IT_n5RpNqx4

[Anonymous No.]

I think this is pretty much the pinnacle that Vocaloid, in it's current incarnation, will reach. I would like to see Crypton take a risk like release a Voicebank that doesn't suck in English with Western artwork then attempt to promote it in place of Miku. See if it sinks or swims.

Also I would rather this shit doesn't go mainstream. That would encourage more producers I like to write pleb-tier EDM or Pop-rock, sick of there being barely anyone else trying to write weird Vocaloid shit that I can chum up with.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12620490
iirc western artwork was initially used for the spanish vocaloids
negative reaction prompted marketing to change to a more animesque art

[Anonymous No.]

>>12620507

Bruno and Clara? That will be why we got a wonderfully generic looking Maika. I used Crypton specifically on the basis of a bigger company with a wider reach and diverse fanbase. It would either end up with Vocaloid breaking the glass ceiling or being a nail in the coffin. To develop a genre you have to take risks or else it dies through stagnation.

[Anonymous No.]

>>12620539
>>12620507
>>12620490

changing artstyles is one of those shallow changes that will have little to no effect except russle jimmies that don't have any real reason to be russled

the technology just isn't impressive enough for it to catch on in the english speaking world

if they want vocaloid to do go mainstream with the current tech then what is needed is a killer producer that can make some real catchy good music and have godly tuning skills