Who is Zun's Mary Sue/Garu stu?

[Anonymous No.]

Reimu?
Marisa?
Rinnosuke?
Cirno?
Yukari?
Renko?

[Anonymous No.]

Catfish

[Anonymous No.]

Watatsukis.

[Anonymous No.]

the HELL is a " Mary Sue/Garu stu"

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279285

2013's buzzword

it means plan

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279291
More like 1973's buzzword. It's older than you.

[Anonymous No.]

i think this is the first time i've seen the term used correctly on /jp/
good job OP

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279274

[OP No.]

>>11279274
>>11279362
Really?
It's because they are really strong or did I miss something obvious?

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279492
They're too perfect.
Utsuho is "really strong", but she's interesting. Strength doesn't make a charcter less interesting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279499
She is also dumb as a brick, thus a flaw, and thus no longer a mary sue, despite her fireworks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279504
Naiveness =/= stupidity

[OP No.]

>>11279499
Yea I don't think a strong character is a Mary sue either, I was just trying to find the reason you think that.

>>11279504
Well Touman is freaking dumb and still one of the worst Gary Stu on earth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279274

These whores.

[Anonymous No.]

OP, the term you're looking for is "Creator's Pet". Since ZUN is the creator, any character he creates cannot be a Mary Sue by definition. A Mary Sue would be if someone created their own original self-insert Touhou (do not steal) and wrote a fanfic where said character is the greatest, most powerful, most likeable, everyone loves her, etc and so on. You know, like the original Lt. Mary Sue, who, incidentally, was originally a parody of self-insert fanfic characters. Contrast Mary Sue with Wesley Crusher, who shares most of the characteristics of a Mary Sue, but was actually created by the original creator of Star Trek and is a canonical character, making him a Creator's Pet instead.

The closest to a Creator's Pet is probably Aya, seeing how she's mentioned as being incredibly powerful and has a large number of appearances, including her own spin-off games.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279513
Her description and official story has her as "bird brained", if you pardon the expression.

[Anonymous No.]

le e/b/in t/v/ tropes /b/ros ;)

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279274
Thread over

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279940
She's only called bird brain by the characters, for being forgetful, and indirectly called a fool by ZUN in her description. But bird brained does not simply mean "dumb as a brick" or stupid for that matter.

[Anonymous No.]

There are two problems with slapping the "Mary Sue" label on canonical characters, especially video games:

1) In most works (with some exceptions obviously), the protagonists win and overcome their enemies. In long-running series, this means that they eventually overcome every threat in their path. In Touhou, the playable characters have defeated every single in-game enemy. The heroes always win, because that's the point of playing the game. The journey is what's important, in other words the story, or in the case of games, the gameplay.

2) Some incredibly powerful characters are built up to give the heroes a challenge, with the hero eventually overcoming them. I'll use another non-Touhou example in Thrawn, an adversary from the Star Wars novels who is a genius, he's an excellent leader, he has the loyalty of his men, and so on. In the end, he's defeated, his plans fall apart because of the heroes, and he's betrayed and killed by his former minions. In this case, Thrawn has many of the same traits as Mary Sues, but it's intentional so the heroes are challenged. For perhaps a simpler example, just look at Dragonball, where Goku defeats one super-powerful enemy, then another one comes along that's even more powerful, forcing the heroes to find a way to stop that one, and so forth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279492
Yorihime is not only the princess of the moon, which is a perfect and pristine and pure land full of rabbits and happiness and forced labor, she is also the most skilled combatant ever with infallible perception and logic.

She immediately recognizes everybody's powers and how to defeat them, including Sakuya's time stop as not being teleportation (Because honestly thats exactly how it would look to anybody else observing).

On top of this, the series heroine Reimu uses GOD POWER to keep her shinto strong. Between her and Marisa's raw burst of power that is Master Spark, its obvious why they are the main characters.

Yorihime? Oh yeah, she can use that god too, and every other god's power. Just because. But she's a merciful perfect princess so she lets them off with just a show of power before floating back to her magic fairy castle on the moon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279991
It's getting funny how you people always miss how the plot of Bougetsushou is, roughly, "Yukari wins, Moonbitches lose". What the hell do you want, Reimu stomping them into the ground then installing herself as the ruler of the Moon? I can't believe we're supposed to be fans of the same series, because in my Touhou, something like that would never happen.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280026
Yukari wins nothing and the only reason her stupid plan even results in anything is because the plot says it does. Let's surrender to the enemy and just hope they won't do anything. Not even Zhuge Liang could think up such a brilliant plan! Great Youkai Sage!

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280026
Yukari only "won" by manipulating everybody into being a distraction to play a harmless prank. I guess that truly is winning in the long run, especially by stealing something they can never take back.

Its just she's so blatantly bullshit, it made the entire last half of the manga just boring and irritating to read. It really felt like i'd accidently ran into a fanfic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279981
それは何者だったのだろうか、そして目的は。
　　空の小さな頭は、そんな疑問をすぐに吐き出してしまった。

Who was she, and what was her purpose?
　Utsuho quickly pushed such questions from her little head.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280057
2deep4okuu

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280057
To be honest, I'd have done that too. Never mind the why and wherefore, I'm the goddamn sun.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280057
She just became an avatar of the sun god, I would probably also just shrug my shoulders and move on, too, instead of dwelling too much on it.

[Anonymous No.]

People giving so much thought to this is as bad people seriously discussing Lucky Star

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280159
Sorry that you're not having fun, anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280057
Not sure what you're trying to prove with this. All that means is that she didn't care that much.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11280037
Are you really that dense or just pretending to be for trolling purposes.
Yukari showed that she could penetrate the most heavily guarded place on the moon. Only the audience knows how she did it. Now the moon bitches have to worry about security in the place they sleep.

Reimu could not use her Muso Tensai because that is a power loaned to her by the gods- and she was doing something she was not supposed to be doing by trespassing on the moon and disturbing the peace there. She didn't even try to use it as she innately knew it probably was not going to work in this situation.
In spite of this the adventurers have also now learned the moonies weakness to the "corruption" or "pollution" of common terrestrial substances. So know the major powers in Gensokyo also know how to defeat the moonies should they for some reason feel the need to meddle in Gensokyo's affairs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>11279514
>Touman
Who?