/jp/ - Otaku Culture

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

FAIRIES!!!!

[Anonymous No.]

Has anyone ever emailed them and told them that we don't like these fairies and prefer a more functional wiki over secondary pandering?

As a big touhou fan community I feel that we have the right to say our opinion, even if we are the big evil 4chan

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064185
Even on the Wiki itself a few people argued against it:
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Touhou_Wiki/Archive_11#Yousei_Daisensou_.7E_Wiki_Mainpage_Restyli
ng_and_Fairy_Invasion
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Touhou_Wiki#Re:Yousei_Daisensou_.7E_Wiki_Mainpage_Restyling_and_F
airy_Invasion

I guess the thought process was "zOMG original content! Let's use it!" even though they're not particularly well-drawn.

It's funny because the only thing I respected Pooshlmer for was having high standards (often to a fault). Then they join forces with a Tumblr e-celelebrity to do something like this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064234
Poopshlmer is the biggest secondary fest newfag underage pony touhou imageboard in existance, they don't have high standards.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064253
I don't mean good standards. I mean arbitrary, anti-fun ones, but they enforced them well.

[Anonymous No.]

What if one of our drawfriends redraws these characters in the same poses and makes them cuter, do you think they would replace it?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064303
They'd still be superfluous and distracting.

You can theme a wiki to a series but be subtle about it. You don't need bright colors everywhere.

The Japanese wiki is a good example, even if it's poorly laid-out:
http://thwiki.info/

[Anonymous No.]

Adblock it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064338
This. If you're autistic enough to care you are internet literate enough to use adblock

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064339
Fuck this argument. They shouldn't have done it in the first place.

It's a matter of principle, not effort or anything like that. They could have at least taken a vote.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064318
That looks ugly and old. It's like 1998 all over again.

[Unnamed Book-Reading Youkai !denX47.muQ!!XUU92Uht5OG No.]

>>10064339
No.
I'm pretty sure it's the people who redesigned the frontpage who are the autists. They prefer that bright colorful faggotry.
ZACbrowser is a web browser designed for autistic children, for example. It is loaded with all kinds of vivid colors.
If you ever had the "fortune" to have seen CWC's iteration of sonichu.com, you'd have seen all those eyesore colors flooding the page.

A wiki is a place to turn to when you want to be informed, not to have fun. Trying to liven up the place and be less academic is what fucked the touhou wikia over. It's what doomed TVtropes from the start.

I doubt touhouwiki.net is salvageable now though. The trigger has already been pulled. It'd probably be best to fork the wiki again. Who's up for hosting? Maybe we'll be lucky enough to have warosu step up to the plate.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064418
>Trying to liven up the place and be less academic is what fucked the touhou wikia over.

What, you don't like Neko Scarlet?

I think the Touhou Wiki is getting too liberal, though. Characters don't have proper story information but they have twenty bullet points on ``Fanon Culture''. They need to crack down on that just like how Wikipedia ruled against ``Trivia'' sections. Not to mention crap like this:
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Fan-made_characters/Meimu

I can see the sense in having information on fan games and music, but unofficial in-universe content has no place in a reference/encyclopedia like this. It's simply not notable, not even as part of the fandom.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064398
I love the Japanese internet for firmly resisting most of the faggotry in website design introduced in the past decade or so.

[Unnamed Book-Reading Youkai !denX47.muQ!!XUU92Uht5OG No.]

>>10064450
The largest problem about Neko Scarlet was that the author of that character wasn't even a secondary touhou fan.
He created that character independently, and then sought out a vehicle in which to insert it. He thought he found such a vehicle in the Touhou Wikia. I wonder if to this day he is still largely clueless as to what Touhou Project is.

[Unnamed Book-Reading Youkai !denX47.muQ!!XUU92Uht5OG No.]

>>10064494
I wonder if the websites I design are too web-2.0
While I keep a fairly minimalist design, and I favor the use of sidebars, I also fall to favoring transparency in my divs overlaid on a texture background image.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064494
I think you need to go back to the nursing home, grandpa.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064606
I think you need to be more professional, whippersnapper.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064418
>A wiki is a place to turn to when you want to be informed, not to have fun.
Giving a shit about things like this seems pointless, as the majority of people out there always seem to be attracted to the pretty things. You might be shocked to hear that even Wikipedia plans on having another complete redesign:
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Athena

[Kilgamayan !2BklmILFiE No.]

>>10064234

The fairies got a hate thread on Pooshlmer pretty quickly, too.

[Unnamed Book-Reading Youkai !denX47.muQ!!XUU92Uht5OG No.]

>>10064651
>Athena
Absolutely fucking disgusting. It's facebook. Wikipedia with a facebook interface.
Is this really what we've come to now?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064651
>>10064696
there's also this:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:2012_main_page_redesign_proposal
and according to the vote they had:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:2012_main_page_redesign_proposal/Straw_Poll_October_
2012#Results
this is the winner:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:2012_main_page_redesign_proposal/Sven_Manguard_%28rearran
gement_of_Dr._Blofeld%27s_design%29

[Unnamed Book-Reading Youkai !denX47.muQ!!XUU92Uht5OG No.]

>>10064710
>this is the winner:
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:2012_main_page_redesign_proposal/Sven_Manguard_%28rea
rrangement_of_Dr._Blofeld%27s_design%29

that actually isn't too bad.
the icons need to quit being Apple/Mac-bubbly, and the amount of whitespace is a bit on the liberal side, but it's not as bad as I was expecting

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064630
the only reason why you would oppose new designs is if you hate forward progress.

your way of thinking is the same as those who wanted to prevent women from having the vote.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064651
The user part of the site is already a horrible faggot nest. If they turn it into facebook I won't know any different.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064771
but there changing the entire site into facebook. the articles, everything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064771
Your grandparents will know you like loli.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064789
Huh? I don't follow.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064749

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064777
No they aren't. Look at the article pic again. It's the same shit with a floating nav bar.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064398
What's wrong with it looking 'old'? We don't need any of these rounded corners or box shadows or anything. I just want my pages to load quickly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064836
but with notifications.
>ViperBear487 posted a message on your talk page.
>JimmyW reverted your vandal edits on Transgender.
>Tomoko1997 would like to add you as a WikiFriend.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064852
>rounded corners or box shadows

Those are all done with CSS nowadays, so it doesn't make the page load longer (except for a few additional bytes the first time you visit a site).

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064876
>203.16.192.10 is now browsing List of sex positions.
>203.16.192.10 is now browsing Fellatio.
>203.16.192.10 is now browsing Gay rights in the United States.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064876
=> >>10064771

[Anonymous No.]

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Lyrics:_%E3%81%82%E3%81%92%E3%81%BD%E3%82%88TONIGHT

Real quality translation.
Why is shit like this allowed?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064964
no astroturfing, thanks. we've been through this before, /jp/.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064964
The song was pretty stupid to begin with.

You are free to fix the translation, though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064981
Hey, I liked the song, it was quite cute.

[Anonymous No.]

I really wish the wiki would focus on more important tasks, like removing all those

<Insert Main Summary>

Main article: Reimu Arc

<Insert Summary>

Main article: Marisa Arc

<Insert Summary>

Main article: Sanae Arc

<Insert Summary>

Main article: Youmu Arc

<Insert Summary>

instead of translating shitty lyrics or "trying to make the wiki look more Touhou-like"

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065001
you know, only you guys are taking this shit way too seriously. nobody else is caring as much. hell, even the Japanese Touhou fans aren't this anal about tiny details like this, because they're not controlled by autism.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065001
I just assume that the kind of person who would worry about Touhou wiki structuring also has chronic depression so if they don't get things done for a while I understand.

[Anonymous No.]

Nothing will ever beat the black Remilia background that was used by http://touhou.wikia.com for quite some time. You can not make a worse design choice than that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065037
how could anybody not like big remi

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065037
People still care about Touhou wikia?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065037
Look at OP picture. Look at it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064185
>As a big touhou fan community I feel that we have the right to say our opinion, even if we are the big evil 4chan
1. I doubt people think that we are a "big touhou fan community", instead of "a shitty board where people shitpost about each other's cocks".
2. We can never get rid of the stigma and bias against the entirety of 4chan thanks to most people associating 4chan with /b/. Mention you're from "4chan" and people will ask if you've hacked Sony and shit like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065037
Don't recall seeing that. Does anyone happen to have the image? I'm curious now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065058
I think the "Western Touhou community" knows about /jp/. We're a bunch of elitist assholes who spend all our time looking down on other communities for being infested by secondaries when we're not making threads about which Touhou wud fuk.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065076
I get the feeling that /jp/ is merely deluding itself into thinking that they are the "better" Touhou fans, and that everyone else is unworthy.

Look at things this way. If ZUN saw /jp/ for the first time, and then saw the Touhou part of reddit, youtube and everything else, what would he think of /jp/?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065095
It's very important for us to act like elitist faggots defending the last bastion of quality on the internet, whether or not it's true. You have to keep up appearances, you know.

Different communities mostly have different expectations anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065076
>Western Touhou community

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065130
Beautiful.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065058
I doubt anyone thinks we're not a shitty board where people shitpost about each other's cocks.

Some would just argue that's still the best of what the Touhou fandom has to offer. Think of the people who think 4chan has a "stigma". Do you want to socialize with them?

[Anonymous No.]

The fact that every Touhou board hates /jp/ also helps /jp/ to keep out many idiots.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065130
It's all shit anyway.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065130
Do you think ZUN panders to his chink fans more because there are more of them? Or is he a Japanese nationalist fighting for his nation's race?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065149
Maybe it's because he understands what they type.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065130
how can I find reliable/accurate numbers and figures for the proportion of the western fandom coming from youtube? I don't think they have a "counter" for Touhou fans.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065144
Every community has people whose first exposure to Touhou was the McRoll. /jp/ isn't an exception.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065153
>ZUN
>Chinese
who, quoting, etc

[Anonymous No.]

Obligatory "either go complain about it to the wiki managers in hopes of making actual progress, adblock it, or shut up" post. Of course assuming it's a bad design choice just saying you have no right to complain because you have adblock is retarded, but that isn't what I'm saying. It's fine to hate the design, but keeping that sentiment here and just going back and forth at each other describing everything the wiki does wrong solves literally nothing. If you really care go raise some shit. I said this in the last thread about the fairies, and nobody stepped up.

>>10064185
Then do it. You don't even need to say you somehow "represent" /jp/, which is inaccurate in the first place. You don't need to mention 4chan at all, you're just some guy voicing his opinion.

>>10064234
1. The wiki has nothing to do with Pooshlmer anymore, as far as I can tell
2. Do you also have objections to the Alice and Reimu pictures that have been there since forever, on every page? Posting images done by said artist doesn't correlate at all to "they're joining forces with the secondary faggots the site quality is going to go to shit because of this". The only reason you're even proposing this is because you know the tumblr guy is popular amongst secondaries therefore this is bad or something.

>>10064964
Then go fix it please.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065183
There's no need to have a voice of reason in a thread full of trolls, idiots, genuine autists, shitposters, and people wasting time.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065156
Bad Apple!! has 3M+ views and almost 25K likes. What's that worth?

For comparison, Kero ⑨ Destiny is at 1.5M and 7K, Cirno's Perfect Math Class is at 1.4M and 8.5K, EastNewSound's 緋色月下, 狂咲ノ絶 is at 1M and 8.5K, and Marisa Stole the Precious Thing is at 1M and 5.5K.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065202
Gangnam Style has 20 times that figure, but that doesn't mean that so many people like it. It just means that Coreans are experts at hitting F5.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065144
>helps /jp/ to keep out many idiots

That's not true. The last time I visited Pooshlmer, they had a thread where several of them admitted to shitposting on /jp/.

That's a problem every 4chan board has. Crossboarders. People who pretend to be wise and polite in namefag places where reputation matters, then come to 4chan to either vent their frustration or just because they think /b/ is so cool and edgy and everything else here is /b/-lite. I'm pretty sure there's not that many of them overall (though others do mimic /jp/'s most popular slang, like the primary/secondary division, overall the flow of ideas between various Touhou-related places is pretty limited), but still enough to shit up a small board like ours.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065228
maybe it's the native /jp/ posters that are the problem, and everyone is blaming this "monster under the bed" that they call crossposters.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065215
Yeah, it's extremely hard to estimate because likes are probably going to be an underestimate and views are going to be an overestimate. The Touhou M-1s and the Memories of Phantasm PVs, which I expect most of the "Youtube Touhou community" will have seen, seem to have between 20,000 and 50,000 views, which might be more reliable since nobody will be F5ing them just to listen to the music.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065238
Please read the first paragraph again. Then again. Let it sink in.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065130
who drew that Youmu and Kasen anyway?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065238
Even if they're regular /jp/ posters, they're probably not native, because it wasn't this spectacularly shitty in 2009.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065254
I think the "Kasen" is supposed to be Yuyuko.

[Anonymous No.]

back to the topic about wikis,
>>10064771
Especially when they're autistic Touhou "fans" as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Scepia/Touhou
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/User:Scepia/Touhou
alright, be honest guys, which ones are you?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064964
Don't be so ignorant. ｗ is essentially the same as "XD" and fits perfectly in the context. Get over your negative connotation of "XD" and understand that it's only hated here. Or go fix it to something that you like. I would really love to see how you would go about improving this.

>>10065228
>>10065252
Really, crossboarders aren't the problem. No one is going to go intentionally learn about something and shitpost about to it to ruin it for others. It's just scapegoat for the brainwashed to point at. I'm quite sure most of those people admitting to shitposting on /jp/ on pooshlmer are those /jp/ regulars shitposting on /jp/ in the first place. Pooshlmer and /jp/ share a userbase, neither of which intentionally shitposts on the other.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065279
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Scepia/Touhou
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/User:Scepia/Touhou

Are those suicide announcements?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065292
Yes. Whenever someone says "they are a resident of Gensokyo" or "I'm going to portal to Gensokyo", it's code-word for suicide

R.I.P., poor Wikipedians.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065295
He's just mad that they didn't translate it "lolololol" like he wanted.

[Anonymous No.]

Oh boy, the Touhou wiki stuff is awake.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065304
That's exactly what I was expecting his "improvement" to be.

[Anonymous No.]

Oh boy, the Touhou wiki staff is awake.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065312
get out touhouwiki devs

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065304
only autists care about such minute details, it can't be helped given /jp/'s main demographic.

if a /kr/ existed they'd be arguing over whether to translate ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ as kekekeke or kkkkk.

>>10064185
sasuga /jp/.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065312
fight me, asshole.

[Anonymous No.]

Why couldn't they have gotten good artists to do sprites?
Fuck Leomodesto, he's a cool drawer but he is no artist.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064964
Wow, this reads like something straight out of doujinstyle or youtube.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065149
http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:User_touhou
http://zh.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:链入页面/Template:User_touhou&limit=500
What does this mean? Translate it weeaboos.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064185
Because replacing what normally would be blank bars with small images suddenly kills all functionality. Really? Little decorations to make the wiki look nice and it suddenly becomes "secondary pandering?" Brilliant logic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065338
Give us your best translation of "ヤバイw あしたの授業 ガチ寝るぽよぽw まるごと マジ崖の上のぽよぽww" then. Remember, literal translation is not always the most faithful representation of the original!

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065339
"This user is a Gensokyo resident, or frequently visits Gensokyo."

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065340
It's as if they want every single website to look like what they were in 1998!

http://www2.warnerbros.com/spacejam/movie/jam.htm

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065357
as expected of chinks, having a high suicide rate due to depression and poverty

korea, china and japan are second only to old east europe commie states when it comes to suicide

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065295
>No one is going to go intentionally learn about something and shitpost about to it to ruin it for others.

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying people from outside who think all 4chan boards are /b/ with the theme go to the board about topics they're already interested in - and act accordingly (like they're on /b/, that is). It's the same with /a/ and other anime forums, or with /v/ and other video game forums. I've seen many examples of that, since they freely admit it on their other places of residence, apparently not aware of the hypocrisy.

>I'm quite sure most of those people admitting to shitposting on /jp/ on pooshlmer are those /jp/ regulars shitposting on /jp/ in the first place.

That is a plausible explanation, but the fact that no-one in that thread called them up suggests no-one on pooshlmer sees anything wrong with it. This can't be explained with /jp/ regulars alone, unless you're stipulating that's the entirety of pooshlmer visitors nowadays (which is still plausible, since the board looks pretty dead).

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065373
>That is a plausible explanation, but the fact that no-one in that thread called them up suggests no-one on pooshlmer sees anything wrong with it.
If somebody here admits that they shit up /r9k/ in their spare time, nobody is going to go out of their way to call them out on it. Why would they give a shit about the well-being of another board?

They might tell them to fuck off for visiting /r9k/ at all, but not because they sincerely believe there's something wrong with shitty threads in /r9k/.

[Anonymous No.]

Touhouwiki is run by a Malaysian Chinese, if I am not mistaken.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065380
>Why would they give a shit about the well-being of another board?

They don't, but once a shitposter, always a shitposter. They give a shit about the quality of their own board. And yes, you get called out on mentioning stuff like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065395

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065402
>They don't, but once a shitposter, always a shitposter. They give a shit about the quality of their own board.
Pooshlmer is, as far as I know, not drowning in the type of stupid garbage that plagues /jp/, so why would they call them out at all?

>And yes, you get called out on mentioning stuff like that.
No. People just look at you, go "what a faggot, but I'm not about to whiteknight some other board," and leave your post alone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065414
If you are really interested in who runs the site you might as well head over to their IRC and ask them directly. They'd probably tell you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065402
>They don't, but once a shitposter, always a shitposter.
Not necessarily.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065420
there's no need, it's already well known.

Not gonna drop names, but the admin of Touhouwiki has a userpage on touhouwiki. Look up their name on google and English Wikipedia and Chinese Wikipedia turn up, and the userpages there say that they are from Malaysia.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065413
>Pooshlmer is, as far as I know, not drowning in the type of stupid garbage that plagues /jp/

Last time I visited it, it was drowning in gay furry porn. Which, admittedly, is not what plagues /jp/. I see it was cleaned up since, but then again, with ten posts per day, it's not exactly drowning in anything right now.

>No.

Yes. Am I going to have to look for examples?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065440
Go for it. Make sure they're being told to fuck off for shitting up another board, and not just visiting.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065426
Going to note that they don't actually manage the contents of the site much, though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065440
And, for that matter, calling out shitposters for shitposting is really a waste of time. It is hardly going to make them stop.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065444
Bah, I can't find anything, one way or another.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064418
>I doubt touhouwiki.net is salvageable now though. The trigger has already been pulled.

OH GEEZ SOME SHITTILY DRAWN FAIRIES MADE FRONT PAGE.
ABANDON SHIP.
THE ENTIRE CONTENTS OF THE WIKI ARE NOW INVALID.

Just be glad its not Neko Scarlet.
Although I agree that inaba "XD XDDD" song thing should be purged with excessive hatred and fire.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065494
It doesn't need excessive swearing too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065494
>Just be glad its not Neko Scarlet.
Don't give touhouwiki devs any more ideas, they're in this thread.

[Anonymous No.]

A little childish, but still perfectly readable. I really don't see the problem.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065541
>FOSS fonts
why are they so ugly compared to proprietary fonts?

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065494
hating a song simply because you can't accept or handle the behaviour of today's high school girls?

face it, real life girls these days go to karaoke to flirt with boys, and do all sorts of stupid shit. they use emoticons in their communication, and they act all obnoxious.

does it "threaten" you, that inaba is being depicted as such a character, that it makes you feel angered?

[Anonymous No.]

Plaintext is always good

[Hong Meiling 門門 !!4kI2ajBUI8D No.]

leomodesto is always welcome. I'm glad they picked him for this.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064253
said the biggest tertiary fest underage pony touhou imageboard

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064234
The thought process actually has "our front page is too clean. We should get it to have more gimmicky shit, like bulbapedia". I read the discussions. One of the guys in favour said it made the wiki look better and more user-friendly and that, by being like the pokemon wiki, they're doing it right.

This just goes to show that if too many people do something stupid, it suddenly becomes the right thing to do and the people who don't do it are the ones that are stupid.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064398
I bet you use one of those shitty 4chan style scripts with your ``waifu'' on the sidebar.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065340
They aren't little decorations. They are eyesores that distract from reading. They're secondary pandering because that has been stated as being the purpose of adding those images.

>>10065183
Alice and reimu were done in good taste. Discreet enough you don't notice them but a nice reference nonetheless. The fairy shit is just rubbed all over your face. The drawings are nowhere near well done either.

It pains me that this thread has so many replies with people accusing the haters of being "autists" and other such /a/b/v/-tier arguments.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10065675

Go back to the graveyard

[Anonymous No.]

I find these pretty cute but honestly it could have been better. If it was something like Reimu, Sanae and Marisa it would be much cuter.

[Anonymous No.]

This has the be the most autistic thread we've had in a month.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10063955
is that Cirno?!

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064418
>Who's up for hosting?

I'm pretty sure Wikia will be glad to be of assistance.

>>10065675
Hong, puh-lease.

[Anonymous No.]

>>10064418
Argument completely invalidated due to use of shitty gimmicks which in turn make the post seem ironic.

[Anonymous No.]

it's a small deal and they're cute, who cares