/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Learn japanese fucking lazy

>>9701500
dies irae is hard-mode japanese there are maybe 3 translators in the scene even capable of doing it justice

>>9701525
everyone who claims to know japanese should be able to translate vns dude

>>9701500
yeah, i'll get right on it, boss

Just translate some random moege and I'll be happy.

>>9701500
Doing it right now. Should be finished before the end of the year.

>>9701566
Don't bother, I'll have my translation out within a month.

Someone translate Flyable Heart properly, please.

>>9701573
Fucking this

>>9701573
>>9701630
What's special about it?

>>9701638
That's... not special at all.

>>9701637
It has an anime

Why do VN translators never translate good chuuni VNs like Dies Irae, Muramsa, and Baldr Sky but instead waste their time translating shitty moeges and nakiges?

Dies Irae and Muramasa will never get translated, will they?

>>9701573
I got this one guys. I'll start immediately.

>>9701643
Hoho, it's funny because that's the opposite of what happens.

>>9701647
There is like, one guy who could actually translate them properly and he's JAST's lap dog. So yeah, maybe in the next decade.

>>9701648
Okay, thanks

>>9701574
Seconding this, too.

VN translating is too much work for too little reward. pay me 40,000 dollars a year+benefits and I'll do it

I would totally translate vn's if I knew how to rip the scripts and that junk.

>>9701675
I'll pay you $3 and two sandwiches.

>>9701683
what kind of sandwiches?

>>9701690
You can choose but they have to be under $5.

>>9701682
it's not like you could get someone else to do that

Can somebody please translate ren'ai katai 0?

We have too few cute moege

>>9701647
I thought JAST was translating it, or at least got the rights to it.

>>9701813
>JAST
So it's never being translated.

WHEN THE FUCK IS SANARARA GETTING TRANSLATED.

>>9701862
If by the time I learn enough Japanese to translate shit efficiently it's still not translated, I'll do it.

For real.

>>9701866
It should be soon and in professional hands.

It's not even fair that JAST and Mangagamer started to pick even more shitty eroges instead of a work with colab by fucking Ume of all people.

我がの日本語の能力は素晴らしい。

どのエロゲは翻訳していいですか？
翻訳ことはないでも地震があるので聞いてはいいよ。

すみませんでも英語を話せません、上長の人類の韓国人ですから。

>>9701909
´http://vndb.org/v666

>>9701909

>>9701862

http://vndb.org/v/all?sq=Sanarara

>>9701909
translate it weabos

>>9701938
Of my Japanese ability is great.

Are you sure you want to translate How eroge?
It is good to hear because there is never any translation earthquake.

I do not speak English, I'm a Korean superiors of mankind, but I'm sorry.

Just wondering...
Why nobody is interested in AXL works?
They look fun.

>>9701909
>我がの日本語

>>9701977
そんなことは問題がある、ヲタ？

>>9701938
Waga no nihongo no noryoku wa subarashii

dono eroge wa honyaku shite ii desuka?
Honyaku kotohanai demo jishin ga aru no de kiite wa iiyo

sumimasen demo eigo wa hanasemasen, jyoushou no jinrui no kankokujin desuka.

>>9701971
This is always hilarious, you could answer your question by using common sense. Look at the current projects in the VNTLS threads. The list is fucking short and only 1/10th of it actually moves. "Why is nobody working on___?" Because there are only like, 5 dudes getting things done and 10 000+ VNs.

>>9701909
>上長の人類の韓国人ですから
>韓国
キモい、韓国に帰りなさい

>>9701971
there's a (pretty bad) shield 9 translation in progress, it's one of their better games

they really are pretty cute, but kind of shallow, not really the sort of thing many translators would spend months of their lives on

>>9702302
Oh, didn't know about this...
Thanks

I approve this thread

I would like less of a translation, than for someone to finally crack the PC edition of Realta Nua. It's been months now, and still no crack.

Dakkoshite Gyu

because there is nothing better than a good hug pillow VN

>>9702160
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCdYAYPjZ4M
deal with it

>>9703919

I just want moege.

Top 3 Games I'd Love to See Translated:

1. Soshite Ashita no Sekai yori (v420)
Subaru lives on small island. It's a peaceful life that seems like it will last forever. His world is shattered when news arrives that Earth will be hit by a meteor in three months. What will happen to everyone...?

2. Itsuka, Todoku, Ano Sora ni (v23)
A story about girls who dream of the starry sky, set in a town eternally covered by clouds. Heavy kanji puns in this one, be warned.

3. Tenshin Ranman (v1322)
Haruki is a very unlucky guy. One day, he receives a mysterious package. Inside of it is a goddess who intends to rid him of his bad luck once and for all.

>>9701637
>>9701641

pic related is why.

spoiler alert

>>9703923

>>9701909
yuor japanese is terrible nigga

I want moege. Anything is fine. But please, I need moege.

>>9701694
I know no one capable of such a thing. And the vn's I like and would translate no one else likes.

Lovely x Cation

Dating Sim.

>>9704564
Sounds like a "positive" title.

>>9704564
dating sims NEVER get any love. What was the last good one that was translated? True Love?

>>9704587
Lovely Cation barely even qualifies as a dating sim.
At least not in the vein of say, Kakyuusei.

>>9704564
That's pretty possible. It's pretty short and not that hard to translate.

>>9704870
>>9704587
There isn't really any dating sims for the PC anymore. The last real ones I remember was Doukyuusei 1, 2 & Kakyuusei remake. Blame Kakyuusei 2 for ruining the genre.

We have games like Kanotsuku but you're locked to one heroine there.

>>9705153
>Blame Kakyuusei 2 for ruining the genre.

What's what they did that caused so much tragedy?

>>9705165
Unrepentant megaslut nonvirgin main heroine. Blasphemy beyond blasphemies, heresy beyond heresies.

>>9705165
Basically, the main heroine's route is NTR.
http://archive.foolz.us/jp/thread/7910093/#7913882

Akatsuki no goei

If only for this.

Dies irae is a fucking masterpiece. Most chuuni chuuni visual novel ever. Basically imagine orgasm in every singl e place at once throughout or maybe a man landing on mars, that's how good it is.

not as good as Sumaga and Muramasa though

>>9705262
Akatsuki no Goei is awesome and Tsuki is the best troll meido.
Her banter with the protag is the best part of the game.

Are there tools for this game?
It's pretty short enough for me to try my hand translating it.

>>9705352
It seems there was a project at one point but it got C&D'd.

>>9705372
Why does that even stop people? Can't they just continue underground and release something when they're finished? Anonymously.

>>9705381
Well you answered your own question.

People aren't just here to please other people, almost every translator can't resist waging e-peen around and putting their actual location and other info in Fecesbook or whatever else they use.

Someone should really do the other Alicesoft games besides Rance/Daiteikoku.

I don't see why anyone hasn't picked up Escalayer yet.

Also I saw someone in the translation update thread said that he might pick up Nursery Rhyme. I hope he goes through with that.

Ayakashi and Ayakashi H.

I'm going to post this everyday until it's translated.

http://visualnovelaer.wordpress.com/2011/12/06/how-to-read-visual-novels-in-japanese-in-2-years-time
-step-by-step-guide-%E2%80%95-learn-to-read-through-vn-or-anime/

Claims to make you quickly learn Japanese, like a kangaroo. Or would that be a kangaaeru...

>>9705441
Cudder ur a faget.

That was awkward.

What purpose does this thread serve? Well, I presume this is the final shithole for people who were driven off from begging in vndb and tlwiki...

I don't understand fan translators anyways. Well, maybe anime and manga translators since they don't have that much to translate and you can just stick the translation straight onto video or picture. Shouldn't take more than few quarters of your time for your average anime episode, a bit more for manga volume.

But VNs and LNs take a shitload of time to translate, especially the former. Unlike other Japanese media, VNs are laden with narrative in addition to dialogue, making the translation job itself much harder and time consuming. And unlike an anime episode where there are just a few voiced lines between actions, VNs are pure text from start to finish. And since VNs are "games" you also need people proficient in hacking stuff and even then you can't just "paste" the translation into files and be done with it.

Why would you waste maybe even years of your time (for free!) to translate something that not many people are going to read anyways? Well, apart from receiving free internet cock sucking for a few months and hoping that you will be revered as "the pioneer for VN translations" once (if) they become more mainstream. In short, "satisfying your hungry ego".

>>9705454
Best post I've read here all week.

>>9705454
Well if you look at it this way, some people do get paid for it with donations, Ixrec is happy and getting a lot of Steam games for it, apparently.

>>9705454
>even then you can't just "paste" the translation into files and be done with it.
We're getting there. Developing the infrastructure, technology, and expertise for making VN translation faster, easier, more efficient.

>>9705475

>>9705475
No

>>9705352 here
Welp, found a tool for Akatsuki no Goei:
http://vn.i-forge.net/tools/dl.php?mjarc.rar
Text insertion seems to be working fine.

Anyone wants to translate this?
My Japanese (and English) is pretty shit.

>>9705468
wait what, he gets steam games because of his translations?

>>9705475
I could imagine something like that for specific producers (f.ex. there already is a program for extracting stuff from most Nitro+ titles since they use variations of the same base engine), but there already is a shitload of different engines, and more coming all the time. Hard to think of an "universal engine cracker".
Even a completely flawless machine translator is more likely (which is not saying much).

>>9705475
Cudder, doesn't that violate DMCA? Aren't you working under some legitimate business? Are you really just some faggot?

>>9705513
What our clients use our services for, we have no control nor responsibility over.

Muramasa
RuiTomo
Both White Album 2 games

I give you my mom in exchange for them.

>>9705507
How do you think heuristic virus detection works? There's some semblance of intelligence in those systems. The same with extracting text. Much of the process for discovering file formats, etc. can be automated, and run at speeds that someone manually doing it could never achieve.

There are also ways of "driving around the mountain", like hooking into text display functions and substituting the text there.

>Even a completely flawless machine translator is more likely (which is not saying much).
That's less likely, because of how natural languages work. Not that it's not worth working toward that goal either.

>>9705529
>>9705561
Cudder, you are such a faggot. DMCA makes it illegal to circumvent electronic methods of protecting content. Presumably you need to force your way through some kind of protection (much as I forced my way into your mother's vagina) in order to extract files for editing. It doesn't matter what your "customers" are doing with it. Comparing virus detection to text extraction? What are you even doing?

>>9705607
A petrol station is not liable if someone buys petrol from it and commits arson using it. Our technology has a lot of legitimate uses and malware analysis is one of them.

Also DMCA is US-only. (Bloody yanks...)

>>9705630
It's like you couldn't pick a shittier analogy. If you bypass any kind of digital protection without the consent of the copyright holders, you are violating DMCA. If you're outside of the states, you'd be subject to the WIPO treaty, or any number of other laws that are the more or less the same as DMCA (DMCA is actually the US version of the WIPO treaty).

Does your business have a web site, Cudder? The site of your owners, their owners, etc? Do you have any software demonstrations you could show off to enlighten all us plebs that don't understand how this whole "technology" thing works?

>>9704587
>dating sims NEVER get any love. What was the last good one that was translated? True Love?

Welcome to Pia Carrot!! is the last one.

>>9705703
Oh, wait, there are two Tokimeki Memorial titles too. But the translated ones are for girls.

More gameplay eroges!

We get games from Alicesoft and Eushully but no love for Softhouse Chara. ;_;
Someone needs to translate this, Ouzoku and Suzukuri Dragon.

Also games from Dual Tail/ninetail like Amatsukaze and the Venus Blood series.
Gesen18's Sengoku Hime 3 is pretty good too.
Same with KISS' Custom Reido 4.

>>9705415
Ayakashi is pretty good, and the production value is pretty high. It feels like an anime at times.

>>9705630
> DMCA is US-only.

...and (largely) the EU.

That's 90% of the relevant world right there.

Every thread until it's translated.

>>9706814
You'd have better luck ``every threading'' at the Mangagamer forums, since that is a Clock Up game.

>>9705454

As a translator myself, I want to say that translator doing things isn't for "hungry ego", but for expressing your love for the VN you want to translate, and they want to share they love with everyone who interested in the titles.

From that points I want to say that there aren't many fan translator will translate because most of request didn't fit their taste. And of course the person know most about your VN taste is yourself. Then quickly learn Japanese instead of trolling here, scum

>>9706879
There are (or were) at least 1 translator group that did this for hungry ego. Sons of bitches called themselves NNL.

>>9706785
>Gesen18's Sengoku Hime 3 is pretty good too.
Really? I thought it was kind of boring.

If you want a fun Gesen18 gameplay title, you should be asking for something from the Otosen series.

A couple of translators have expressed interest in projects but some don't have technical support with the engines and usually get redirected to TLWiki or so.

Why don't anons that want something translated start by enabling stuff for a willing translator beforehand? I am dabbling in coding now and reverse engineering sounds like my kind of thing since it's more experimentation and analysis than anything, so I'll definitely try my hand at one of the proprietary engines later.

I'm sure that there's more technically adept anons here than me though. Not all engines should be rUGP after all.

>>9706927
>I thought it was kind of boring.
I guess you turned off the tactical battles.

>Otosen
Weird, I found both Otosen games pretty boring and tedious.
I guess we have the opposite opinion.

get out english only subhumans

Is somebody really translating Dies Irae? if you are, thank you.
Also can somebody finish http://tlwiki.org/index.php?title=Kizuato ? its already translated. needs editing.
Its a pre-tuskhime.

>>9706931
There're also dudes who could understand these games perfectly but can't bother to join a project, dudes like me. I can understand these games fine with my Jap (well, about 80%-90% of the text to be exact). But fuck me for not writing down the script of these games while I'm playing. Sometimes I thought about it but then I thought "Who the fuck is requesting these games anyway?". I post the script of the game, nobody cares about it, nobody knows how to hack it, myself end up looking like a fucking idiot. Hell, maybe posting a script of a game for somebody else to hack may be considered a fucking elitist.

>>9706964
>I guess you turned off the tactical battles.
Nope.

>Weird, I found both Otosen games pretty boring and tedious.
Huh, I really liked how you had to think ahead in how you advance: keeping air coverage, bombing key targets, making sure you didn't get stuck without fuel or ammo.

>I guess we have the opposite opinion.
I guess so. I hope we can still be friends.
I agree with you on Softhouse Chara at least. I really need to get around to playing the trial for their new game.

>>9706973

Kizuato seems like a nice VN for those people who want to test themselves before doing something bigger (and more personal).

>Scripts:182/246 (http://tlwiki.org/index.php?title=Kizuato))

Does anyone have the already translated scripts?

>>9706977
The reason why I am dabbling in coding myself is because I am on the same boat. I've always believed that a good project lead, anyways, should be able to do any role at any certain time. Like the guys from insani.

Also if they can i would like the 1995 art as a selection, i just like the way the old art is a lot darker.

>>9707027
oh and im talking about Kizuato/

I don't think there's a translation for Futaba Channel yet. At least, I can't find one. That would be a nice one to have translated.

>>9705441
Is this a joke? this person doesn't know japanese, why is she trying to coach people?

>>9707206
It does exactly what the title suggests which is to show the ropes to the baka gaijins, which is itself a joke. So yes.

Bitch linked Tae Kim's site like it's a fucking golden bible or something.

>>9707173
In real time? How is that even possible? It would be like someone translating /jp/*30.

>>9707322
Are you joking?

>>9707324
It was an easy mistake to make.

If I was going to spend my time translating something, I would pick a kusoge just to piss people off, and laugh at the fools who try to play it.

Pic related. My first project. Too bad I don't know how to extract the text or reinsert the translated text.

>>9707173
source for image? it gives no results in google, iqdb, tineye or saucenao.

>>9707378
...

>>9707370
Somebody is so eager to become another Dark Translations, isn't he?

>>9706855
Nope. There's too many normals and moral crusaders in those forums for that to ever work.

>>9707443
It would still be more productive than asking amateur translators to fiddle with licensed material.

>>9707406
Most of the games the translator Nephrinn chose were popular with the dark eroge community/fans. I'm sure he liked them enough to translate them without spite.

>>9707443
Implying it will work at all.

Beside, MG better spend their time on translating the rest of the Cartagra trilogy than the other bullshit.

>>9707460
>dark eroge community/fans
This shit actually exists?

>>9707473
Well, I'm sure most people were eager to get their hands on anything english translated. I think they stayed because at the very least because of good voice acting and Kagami's awesome art in Lilith games.

>>9705509
How does this wizardry work?

>>9707406
That dual phase game they did was pretty good. I didn't bother with any of the others as they didn't look my kind of thing.

>>9707526
Yeah, so good that the game only lasts for 3 hours containing nothing but twins fucking each other.

I download games like this to jack off all the time but shit, somebody thinks they are worth the effort to translate or something?

>>9707581
>containing nothing but twins fucking each other.
You got a problem with twins fucking each other?

Moot, implement kanji captcha already to prevent these kind of shit threads.

>>9707610
As long as they're not male/male twins, nope.

Still ain't worth the translation effort if the whole game is a long hscene though.

>>9707615
The minute after he implemented it, there'd be a thread on /a/ showing people how to use IMEs and we'd experience an influx of people from other boards trying to test themselves against the new captchas.

Can't wait for the Insemination's fabulous translation.

I hope Insemination/Staircase picks up this wonderful title!

Sorry OP, Dies Irae is a great game but it's also really long. I wouldn't have a problem translating it, but technology wise and time wise, I'm at a huge loss.

If you have a PSP you could get the game and slowly translate it for yourself as practice, though there'd be no sex scenes though.

>>9707617
Moot will implement Hangul captchas just to fuck with us.

>>9707625
moot needs to implement a captcha based on untranslatable puns from archaic Japanese.

>>9707700
He will go with Egyptian hieroglyphs if fucking with us is really what he wants.

>>9707473
>This shit actually exists?

Yes, there are many people out there who like things that you do not like.

>>9707973
Disgusting.

>>9707973
I know they exist as individuals. I didn't know they are crowded to the point there is a "community". Jesus Fucking Christ, I should have known these "communities" existed if there were enough sickfucks to populate gurochan.

>>9707473
http://www.reddit.com/r/darkeroge

Someone translate 12Riven please.

Tsuyokiss

>>9708030
Dark eroges and most of gurochan content have nothing to do with each other. You're ignorant. You're probably a mormon American who thinks all arab people are terrorists.

English only peasants pls go

>>9704486
who cares if no one else likes it? you can still find a hacker if you look around. and the eroge you'd be interested in translating might already have tools available for its engine.

Bump.

Kind of doing the opposite thing of this thread. Playing http://vndb.org/v83 right now, no trouble understanding the script so far, the parts I don't quite, I can coat it with punch-up writing. Game's made in KiriKiri2 engine. Don't care if nobody requested it, don't care if you fucks may not like the game. Just give a word if anyone can hack it.

>>9711517
>Superpowers
>Sword wielding heroine
Would read

>>9711517
If it's made in krkr2 it should be fairly simple.

>>9708083
He's probably the same faggot who spammed gurochan and forced them to use recaptcha.

Now gurochan is even slower than before.

I've never been to /jp/ before so I don't know if this warrants its own thread, and it's related to translation so here goes...

If you have part of a sentence where it's just a long string of hiragana, how do you tell where one word ends and the next begins? Is it just one of those things you have to learn through practice and understanding context?

Thanks.

>>9711546
Yes, pretty much practice, vocabulary and grammar. A long string of hiragana is rare though, unless it's kiddy writing.

Also don't make a thread for this or you'll just get redirected to >>>/lang/.

Heck, I'll redirect you to >>>/lang/

>>>/lang/

I don't really understand how does the text parser for untranslated VNs work. ;_; How does it work, /jp/?

>>9711525
Leave a pic of the game being inserted words if you have done it. Then we can get somewhere.

>>9711564
I don't have the game, but I guess I could try.
You could give it a try yourself meanwhile.
http://tlwiki.org/index.php?title=Tools#KiriKiri2.2FKAG3

>>9711553

Thanks, I didn't even know about /lang/.

Polite sage, resume your thread~

>>9711571
Not too fond of technical stuff, sorry.

>>9711546
>Is it just one of those things you have to learn through practice and understanding context?
Yes. It is probably much easier than you think. I have honestly never had a problem with this. Just continue learning vocabulary and grammar and most importantly, practice reading. Everything should then fall into place.

Thank you for not creating a new thread for this.

Bump.

>>9711596
I would think there are going to be lots of word boundary ambiguities, no?

E.g. expertsexchange, therapistnetwork, etc.

Or were the Japanese smart enough to design their language to avoid that?

>>9713908
It would be a catastrophe if you were to write such words in hiragana. In most cases it would be impossible to discern them. Because of this hiragana strings are never utilized in such situations. In situations where there might exist a slight ambiguity, katakana is often used to discern the borders.

In hiragana-only texts, although I have very limited experience with those, I would expect it to use a great deal of particles. E.g. "Network of People who does Therapy" instead of therapistnetwork.

>>9714680
There are plenty of times where it could be ambiguous, especially in all hiragana texts. Japanese just uses the power of context. It's more powerful than it's given credit for.

Also, please do not feed the Cudder.

A translation of Phenomeno would be great. I love Nitroplus and horror, and it looks neat.

>>9706879
>As a translator myself, I want to say that translator doing things isn't for "hungry ego"
I would agree with this about VN translations, but that's definitely not true with anime/manga translations.

VNs are just so long and obscure that you have to really like it to want to translate it. No matter how many donations you get, there's still pretty much no way you'd get even half of minimum wage for translating a longer VN.

>>9714680
A few hiragana things I've read just use spaces.

Why do I translate?

I want you to feeeel something, you dead emotionless husks.

>``

was going to consider your request till i saw that

epic meme /b/ro :-)

>>9711573
>polite sage

just get the fuck out of here

Phenomeno is short enough for me to consider translating but unfortunately i don't have the tools and knowledge to know where to even start. Aside from that, Phenomeno is pretty much cock tease for you guys since its just chap 1 and the rest of the story is in novel form.

>>9721094
There are already tools for that one.
http://forums.novelnews.net/showthread.php?t=35621

I was going to translate it myself but couldn't get some punctuation marks to work properly and gave up.

>>9721178
I actually picked it up last week. As a rough estimate, I'd believe that I've translated about 10% so far.

>>9721579
Thanks for your hard work.

>ctrl+f "kichikuou Rance"
>no results
Fuck you /jp/.

>>9721612
/Who are you quoting?
>Pattern not found:

Bump.

You know, I've never understood why these translations take so long.

If I knew Japanese what I would do is have a a game in Japanese open in one window, and a TL wiki or something for that game in another and just translate while I play.

I bet I could have translations done in weeks instead of years, like what are these people doing?

>>9724298
And this is why you guys get such low quality translations.

I hope someday somebody can translate Snow but if I have to begging for somethink then my hopes goes for semething else; Cudder (+his trust translator) retired from the scene.

>>9724298
Some VNs are hard to hack and >>9724326

Either way, you're better off just picking up Japanese yourself.

>>9724298
Translating isn't that easy, man.
It's not just changing words from one language to another, you know. Just like writing anything else, you need to put a lot of thought into tone and sentence structure in order to get anything decent. It's actually harder than normal writing because you're very limited in the sense that you have to stay as faithful as possible to the original text while still making things work in a completely different grammar system.

>>9724429
when I was in high school I had to translate shit for homework. I don't see why someone fluent in a language wouldn't be able to translate very quickly. even if you only worked an hour a day there's no way a game should take over 2 years to translate.

>>9724454
So you translated one short paragraph or so for homework? Which corresponds to maybe 10-20 lines of a 50000 line VN? Not to mention you were probably translating between languages with similar structures, and probably weren't doing it particularly well.

You aren't making much of an argument here.

>>9724454
Okay, but here's the thing:
Homework is just about accuracy. Your teacher probably didn't care if your sentences read like shit as long as they got the original meaning and were grammatically correct.

But if you're making something that people are going to read for enjoyment, it's a different story. You're still concerned with accuracy, but now there's a couple extra levels. It's not enough to get the just words and the meaning right, you have to capture shit like the original style and subtext. On top of preserving all this, which is hard enough, you now also have to make the new sentences flow in a way that's enjoyable to read. It's pretty much impossible to do this perfectly, so you're forced into making some tough calls about whether to sacrifice faithfulness for readability.

Even for simple works this can get pretty goddamn hard. To be done well, it requires proficiency in both languages as well as critical reading and writing skills.

What the fuck is with all this drama?

Find VN -> Get text extracted -> Translate -> Make patch and Release

That's all there should be to it.

Translating isnt even remotely hard. That being said it is fairly time consuming and also mind numbingly boring.

I learned Japanese cause i was sick and tired of waiting for a vn to be translated (Little busters? maybe Clannad, I cant remember) and figured i could learn the language faster than it could be translated and I was right. I decided that when i was able to i would help the community (and not be a lazy ass like most translators) and translate some stuff but after doing maybe a dozen loli chapters/doujins and seeing how boring it was i just stopped.

>>9724677
Find VN -> Get text extracted -> Translate -> Remove loli sex scenes and replace with dolphins -> Use Microsoft SAM to make a voice patch for the MC -> Spend eons making an installer -> Contact the developer to ask for the rights -> Wait a few months for reply -> No reply -> Disappear off the face of the internet along with the translation -> Secretly sell the translation to JAST -> Delay forever -> Release

That's all there is to it.

>>9724454

There is a difference between half-assed translating some stuff for your homework or translating something which has to appeal on an aesthetic level. Try reading the Majikoi S translation and you know what I mean.

If you're okay with stuff like that, you can also settle for eddited machine translation.

>>9724754
Translating loli doujins may not be remotely hard, but that's a bit different from translating something where the original content is worthwhile.

>>9724766
I also did other stuff including doing some work on a couple of the old open tlwiki projects as well as excerpts from novels and magazines.

Translating is the same process for any medium.

>>9724754
Translating is not hard. Translating well is.

>>9724957
It's also easy to delude yourself into thinking you understand something when you don't.

>>9724981
If you think otherwise you don't understand literature at all. Go take a class on it, please.

>>9724326
>>9724429
>>9724482
>>9724508
>>9724765
Please do not reply to kopipe

>>9724298
You know, I've never understood why writing a book takes so long.

You just write as you think about it.

I bet I could have a book done in weeks instead of years, like what are these people doing?

>>9724677
What the fuck is with all this drama?

Learn Kana -> Learn Grammar -> Learn Kanji -> Learn Vocabulary -> Read anything

That's all there should be to it.

>>9727067
Except that the content is already there when translating, just in a different language.

>>9727235
Maybe you should go discuss the merits of translation with nabakov

Bump.

>>9727223
>Learn Kanji -> Learn Vocabulary

That's not how kanji works.

>>9727235
If it was that simple you could simply run the text through a machine translator. You have to take into account things like context and subtext, convert certain references/idioms but not others, etc.

Translating is also boring and tedious.

Anybody think of translating this? It's got Touka 2.0 in it.

>>9729681
>If it was that simple you could simply run the text through a machine translator.

Remember that this is Cudder you're talking to.

I love how a thread called "begging for VN translation" has people who don't even know Japanese insisting that translation is easy and that clearly translators are all useless lay-abouts for taking so long.

Stay classy, English only peasants.

http://vndb.org/v1021
Still no love.
I really have to learn moon *sad*

>people thinking translation is difficult

consider that a professional translator can translate while a person is still speaking. theoretically such a translator could finish a game in the time it takes to autoplay itself.

That was the first VN I played, and I still cannot forget the hands. Oh God, the hands. They're worse than Ryukishi's boxing gloves.

>>9730383
That was the first VN I played, and I still cannot forget the hands. Oh God, the hands. They're worse than Ryukishi's boxing gloves.

>>9731506
Simple conversational phrases are way easier to translate than say narrations.

>>9729681
Yes, you could do that. The problem is, current MT is horrible at accuracy, although in many cases it more than makes up for that through pure speed. We need to improve on that. Human translators aren't going to get faster (and as you say, it's probably boring and tedious for them.) MT is more than fast enough, and their accuracy can only get better.

All the "English only peasants" need to learn Japanese and put their effort into developing something that gives them a ROI, much like the real peasants worked on inventing new tools to make their work in the fields more efficient.

The tradeoff between accuracy and speed is going to be something that'll work itself out, but when MT can be a million or more times faster, even with only 10% accuracy it's still higher value overall. I think people are willing to sacrifice a bit of speed for more complex algorithms that give higher accuracy. How far do you want to go? 90% accuracy at 1000x speed? 75%/10000x?

>>9731570
>Cudder talking about making machine translations accurate like they'll get to any substantial level in the next thirty years.
I'm really glad I go to sleep when you start posting most of your shit.

>>9731587
You never know Cudder might be right, seeing as he is an expert on Machine translations.

>>9731587
It's possible, Strong AI is just around the corner.

>>9731587
Even if they aren't accurate for *everything*, having a human translate the simplest sentences over and over again is a waste of time. Let MT handle all the simple stuff, a human can fill in the rest. 100% automated is still a distant goal, but for now a hybrid solution is more realistic.

>>9731617
No, it's not. Don't delude yourself. For a "decent" translation the mc need moore, but a bunch moore years of polishing.

>>9731647
How do we decide what's simple, Cudder? By looking at what the machine gets correct? How is that making life easier? Some sort of magical "algorithm" that deduces the difficulty of a sentence? Are you assuming there are instances of the same, or nearly the same sentence, using the same sentence structure, with the same words more than a couple of times?

>>9731671
If MT gets it correct then good. If it's not, you write what you think should be the correct translation. Obviously this requires you know at least some Japanese too, but every time it gets it correct, you've saved your time outputting a sentence, and people type much slower than they can read most of the time.

>>9731737
You still have to translate it to check it. You're saving potentially seconds here, maybe, to get a shitty sentence. As you can see, machine translation can't even get simple sentences correct. Throw accents, dialects, personal speech quirks into the mix and I pity the man that has to TC that shit.

What you're suggesting is akin to building a house by piling up a bunch of sticks and removing the ones that don't fall into a "house" shape. Maybe some better metaphor.

>at least some Japanese
Yeah, because it's not going to be screwing up the more difficult sentences beyond comprehension. Just a basic grasp of Japanese is all you need.

>>9731506
You are so fucking stupid. You're probably one of those retarded monolingual Americans.

>>9731787
>You're saving potentially seconds here
The savings add up.

>As you can see, machine translation can't even get simple sentences correct
If you're trying to use that Google one as an example, then that's not saying much. It's sMT, which is alledged to produce more "natural" results on account of how it works, but it needs to be trained with the types of sentences that it's going to be used for, and I doubt the guys at Google have been feeding it VN text. I'd like to see what ATLAS says on that one, if I remember correctly that's rMT which is going to be more consistent and accurate in general. Also most if not everyone in this thread (including me) DOESN'T know Japanese, so you'd be saying nothing if you don't post a CORRECT translation to compare to. ("What/who didn't I dog?")

>>9731876
>The savings add up.
Add up to shitty sentences. The time you spend checking that the shit sentences the machine is spitting out could be better used on writing a sentence that actually sounds good. I really don't think that most translators worth a damn are going to have problems with short sentences like that. What they want help with are long ass multiple clause sentences that have conflicting negatives and use obscure terms.

I didn't use VN text, I wrote that myself. It's a shit easy sentence that a grade schooler could get. All it says is, "Was not dog", with a polite, explanatory tone. You can type that out a bunch of different ways, google will get them correct sometimes, sort of. But I can totally see how "I did not dog" would be more natural.

Atlas does indeed give the correct translation. Amazing. However, when presented with two similar sentences that are different in tone and plurality, it gives me the same thing. The first sentence having a more casual and feminine air to it, the latter being more arrogant and masculine. Yeah, they have the same meaning. In much the same way "I hate you all" and "You are a loathsome creature" have the same meaning. Certainly a good translator would yield different output for each, while retaining the similarity in meaning.


You didn't dog anyone or anything, Cudder. That's why I hate you.

I'm tired, so I'm going to bed.

>>9731970
>The time you spend checking that the shit sentences the machine is spitting out could be better used on writing a sentence that actually sounds good
"sounds good" is subjective, let's stay away from that for this argument. The important thing is that it makes sense and *works* for the majority of the audience.

>What they want help with are long ass multiple clause sentences that have conflicting negatives and use obscure terms.
Obscure terms are definitely one area where (r)MT can help greatly (but currently isn't doing much); you get dictionary lookups almost instantly. I bet many times when I see (r)MT output with fragments of untranslated source language, it's because some word wasn't in the dictionary it's using. These are simple things that could be improved with very little effort.

>I didn't use VN text, I wrote that myself. It's a shit easy sentence that a grade schooler could get.
You showed why sMT isn't great for accuracy: it works by "learning", i.e. you feed it corresponding J/E translated text and it tries to identify commonalities between them. If you give it an input that it was already trained with, then it responds with the exact output, presumably created by a human translator, which is why it can be more "natural"; otherwise it tries to figure out by comparison, and sentence fragments will really confuse this sort of algorithm. It probably matched "I did not" with one piece of the Japanese in the text it was trained with, and "dog" with another.

>Atlas does indeed give the correct translation.
I'm not surprised, it's rMT. If you replaced dog with cat or horse or bird or <noun> in the Japanese, you'd probably see it produce "was not <noun>", like you'd expect.

[1/2]

>>9732127
> The important thing is that it makes sense and *works* for the majority of the audience.

Why don't you care about quality? Why are you satisfied with your mediocrity?

[2/2]

>However, when presented with two similar sentences that are different in tone and plurality, it gives me the same thing.
Japanese has features English doesn't, and the simplest thing to do is to drop the ones that English doesn't. Officially, "you" is both singular and plural, so having the same output is expected if Japanese has a plural and singular "you". (I said "officially" because having an rMT system output one of the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You#Informal_plural_forms instead, wouldn't be a difficult change.)

>The first sentence having a more casual and feminine air to it, the latter being more arrogant and masculine.
Again, a matter of English not having certain features Japanese has. The whole debate about honourifics is related to this. Once again, it wouldn't be difficult to have an rMT system preserve them in the output (or give the option to.)

>Certainly a good translator would yield different output for each, while retaining the similarity in meaning.
Ideally, they should. But in many cases 1:1 mappings simply don't exist between languages. If the source language has this differentiation of tone, then it is possible to produce this in the output (different word choices, etc.) in the same way a human translator can choose different words based on it.

All this talk is good but I think it'd be best to focus on one of the "low-hanging fruit" for now, and build up from there: better dictionaries. After all, the most fundamental process in translation is being able to know what the words mean. Then we can worry about better parsing and implementing workarounds for the features in Japanese not in English.

So much Cudderring to read, so little time...

>>9732133
Didn't you read >>9731570? MT needs to improve. I don't think it's good enough at the moment and here's how we can improve it.

But after all, it's the audience who ultimately decides what they want. If they're fine with VN translations being 50% accuracy if they take days or weeks instead of years, then going any further becomes more of an academic exercise.

>>9732137
>Japanese has features English doesn't, and the simplest thing to do is to drop the ones that English doesn't.
What if it's a vital part of the sentence, or it only makes sense in Japanese and needs to be human-translated into an English equivalent? Dajare are good examples. How would your magical snake oil translate ｢布団が吹っ飛んだ｣ while still making sense for the majority of the audience?
Furthermore, you *don't even speak Japanese*. You are hardly qualified to say these things, and you are just talking out your ass.

>>9732148
> If they're fine with VN translations being 50% accuracy if they take days or weeks instead of years, then going any further becomes more of an academic exercise.

Time to stop hacking and switch to YouTube translations ^_^

>>9732148
>If they're fine with VN translations being 50% accuracy
"They" also prefer streaming anime in 320x240 on their iPhone.

>>9732151
>Dajare are good examples. How would your magical snake oil translate ｢布団が吹っ飛んだ｣ while still making sense for the majority of the audience?
I don't know, YOU tell me. If it's an idiom, and a human can find an equivalent, why can't it be automated? More generally: If a human can read X and write Y, why can't a machine do that (and do it a few orders of magnitude faster)?

>Furthermore, you *don't even speak Japanese*.
The specifics don't matter. You can bring up specific examples but I won't understand them. Those who do, are free to chime in with ideas. The point of this discussion is to brainstorm at a high level.

>>9732157
>>9732162
Whatever they want, give it to them. But if we can improve on existing methods, we should. It is a bit odd to frame it in the context of VN translations, but better MT benefits everyone.

>>9732183
Language is qualitative. It's like art--you might be able to algorithmically generate some cool stuff, but we're certainly not at the level where a machine can "think for itself" and paint something like Sunflowers. There are all sorts of human nuances that make up language, and those will be lost. This isn't just, "Oh, but it'll be understandable to MOST people!" because a lot of it can (and will) end up making very little sense.

I like your optimism, but we're not there yet. Maybe in the future we'll have AIs with natural language processing who can prompt us occasionally and translate perfectly for us, but right now you have a whole lot of spreadsheets to plough through.

>>9732183
>The specifics don't matter.
It does matter. All you are saying is based on theory only. You don't read VNs, you don't translate VNs, you don't have any concept of "quality" regarding translation and reading in general.

>MT benefits everyone.
It only benefits HK DVD rippers for their subtitle translation. You won't see any MT in legal or business documents, or literature.

>>9732190
>You won't see any MT in legal or business documents, or literature.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer-assisted_translation
Those who are *paid* to do translation use this stuff. It's not pure MT so it doesn't look like it.

And you've obviously never worked much with foreign (especially far-East) companies.

>I like your optimism, but we're not there yet
Far from it. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't stop trying, and at least get some of the basic stuff figured out (like better dictionaries.)

>>9732220
>And you've obviously never worked much with foreign (especially far-East) companies.
Has REtrans International? Or are you talking about one of your NDA companies?

>>9732220
>And you've obviously never worked much with foreign (especially far-East) companies.
Your chinese eletronics companies don't count. Don't compare translating user manuals with translating legal documents, books or even VNs.

Fuck me, I thought the thread title said "Beginning VN translation general"