/jp/ - Otaku Culture

/a/

Oh bitch, bitch, bitch.

Hol-ee shit! I want to own       that fig!

Don't worry too much about it. Manga/anime creators are like dogs and they just sort of do things arbitrarily.

>insinuating animes arent advertisings for random shite and are actually some kinda 'form of expression'

>If you want to become an anime creator, just stop watching anime.
Confirmed for clinically retarded

old news

I'm OK with this.jpg

I mean all forms of media already suffer from something similar. About time anime joined the club.

I don't disagree with any of that, what surprised me though, is that I'm no aniota and still know who those people are.

Was there really no new relevant talent coming up since Hideaki Anno?

It's true. Otaku are gross, stupid, and worthless. Look at this board for example. The people who self-identify as otaku are the worst posters on the board. They don't have any common sense or grip on reality. They say stuff like yuri (cartoons) is the purest form of a love. They wet themselves when they think about pairing for k-on or touhou. Since they've never even talked with a girl they insert every delusion possible about them.

"If you've never talked with a girl, how can you imagine them?"

>>8154607
Good thing I'm an otaking, then.

>>8154607

>>8154614
Old people just like to bitch.

>>8154548
People like this explain why anime and games are such shit. None of them care about what they are doing.

>If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?"
Now here's a guy who's seen a lot of loli in his time.

They should stop bitching and move on to eroge

>>8154664
eroge is where the talentless people go to prove their material is worth an anime,manga, or light novel.

>Hideaki Anno: "Stop indulging yourself in manga and anime and go outside, that's the simple picture."
this is coming from the creator ofthe biggest merch whore in the anime business
I mean really REALLY!?

OP makes it seem like those people agree with each other, but
>Oshii added that anime today is a "copy of a copy of a copy that is no longer a form of 'expression.'

Let's take a look at Yoshiyuki Tomino's Filmography:
>[10 other series]
>Gundam
>Other Mecha work #1
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Sequel to other Mecha work #1
>Another sequel to other Mecha work #1
>[5 other mecha works]
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Other work
>Other mecha work
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Other mecha work
>Other mecha work
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Gundam
>Other mecha work
>Gundam

You're welcome.

Fucking businesses wanting to make money.

>>8154607
I say all those things but I don't seriously mean them to that extent. I mean them but not to the exaggerated extreme that I say them. If you see someone saying something so ridiculous that the person can't be serious, chances are they're not serious.

>>8154693
The main theme of NGE is bitch about otaku and ANNO himself.

"I wonder if a person over the age of twenty who likes robot anime and bishoujo anime is really happy. He could find greater happiness elsewhere. Regrettably, I have my doubts about his happiness.”

"As I was making this work I wanted to try to consider what in the world could the 'happiness' of such a person be?"

Hideaki Anno, Newtype Magazine, April 1995

>>8154693
It wasn't his doing. Rumor is he founded Studio Kharas because he was sick of the over the top merchandising Gainax had been doing. In fact all the core members have left, are leaving one by one.

They're doing that because that's the only way to survive. There are good shows that aren't made for merchandise but they fail horribly in the market.

I think there should be a strong grass roots movement by people who are sick of this shit.

>>8154694
I agree, King Gainer is a complete Ideon copy.

Bunch of irrelevant old fucks who have made the same thing over and over again

Yeah, if you want to make something that is important and meaningful, you shouldn't be looking to hire or appeal to otaku. This is probably something that everybody can agree on.

Show's over, go home.

>>8154776
All two of you?

>>8154614
Nope. Nobody ever became a successful anime director ever again. Not even Satoshi Kon, Makoto Shinkai, etc.

Anime series are all aimed at rabid otaku merchandising schemes these days. Especially Usagi Drop, Sekai Ichi Hatsukoi, Steins;Gate, Chihayafuru, UN-GO, Bakuman, Last Exile, Mirai Nikki, Ikoku Meiro, Uta no Prince-sama, Natsume, Darker Than Black, Honey & Clover, Hourou Musuko, Nodame, Gosick, and all those other generic moe merchandising series!

Oh woe is our generation that can't watch masterpiece anime from those old directors. Astro Boy, Ribon no Kishi, Futureboy Conan, Kiki's Delivery Service, Love & Pop, Cutie Honey, Evangelion, Evangelion: Death & Rebirth, The End of Evangelion, Gunbuster, Diebuster, Evangelion Rebuild (You are not alone), Evangelion Rebuild (You can not advance), Evangelion Rebuild (quickening), Invincible Super Man Zambot 3, Invincible Steel Man Daitarn 3, Mobile Suit Gundam, Mobile Suit Gundam: The Movie, Gundam II Soldier & Sorrow, Gundam III, Mobile Suit Zeta Gundam, Mobile Suit Gundam ZZ, Gundam: Char's Counterattack, Gundam F91, Mobile Suit Victory Gundam, Turn A Gundam, Turn A Gundam II, Turn A Gundam III.

Sure was super original character do-not-steal, not-rehashed anime back in the day by such infallible directors totally not interested in milking their franchises.

>>8154967
cool story bro

>>8154548
They are still jealous over Shinbo and Urobochi Gen success?

>>8155371
Anno and Oshii loved Madoka.

Turning to merchandising is actually the smartest business move made by the anime industry.

1. Release good shit.
2. People don't go to watch it at theaters or buy DVDs because torrentz.
3. Industry finds other ways to make money.

4a. FUNimation sends out C&D letters.
4b. Industry shits out merchandiseable moe anime like K-ON.
4c. Powerful lobby groups buy out Congress and pass Big Brother laws.


If you don't like it, buy a roundtrip to Japan, go to Comiket or some other doujin con and support your favorite author.

>>8155381

Merchandising is incidental to Madoka.

>>8155381
Shit taste confirmed

>anno
>was once a lonely faggot otaku
>telling people to go outside
oh god

>>8154548
Good thing I only want to consume animu and have no pretensions of making one.
>>8155381
Okay, they're hypocritical madmen.

>>8155381
Anno just praised everything, even Strike Witches and Tales from Earthsea

>and Oshii loved Madoka.
He never said he love Madoka Magica
The magazine already apologized for the error

>※当初の「商品の説明」にあった、押井守監督のコメントはございませ
ん。
http://www.amazon.co.jp/100人がしゃべり倒す-「魔法少女まどか☆マギカ」-アニメ
・ワンダーランド/dp/4796685251

>>8155469
Didn't notice that.

I can't even carry on a conversation with an otaku much less a normal person but I'm athletic and smart. Kinda pathetic social anxiety makes me feel like shit.

Tezuka didn't live long enough to see this wonderful invention called internet.
Miyazaki is a retarded anti-otaku who is only able to make anime for children.
Anno has a point, that's his selling point.
What Tomino says is just plain wrong and seeing his works utterly lacks credibility.

>anime today is a "copy of a copy of a copy that is no longer a form of 'expression.'
It's not like back then there weren't copies or forgettable shows. Good directors/writers can, and always will be able to express themselves without the need to excessively copy something. Also, stop being a hypocrite, back then you rehashed many western ideas/mythology, the only difference being that these things were unknown to the audience.

>>8155381

Yeah, Anno loved Homu a lot. Might even be his waifu.

>>8154579
Seems to be a growing trend in video games.

>>8155512

>Miyazaki is a retarded anti-otaku who is only able to make anime for children.

You mean regular people.

>>8155592
Even worse

About copies

"There is no real original in this world but one’s life. Fundamentally, Eva is just my life copied out onto film. I'm [still] alive, so the story hasn't finished. " – Hideaki Anno, 1996

And from the interview of Oshii's view of RahXephon
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5317066/eva/2003-oshii-izubuchi.page
>`Oshii`: The other thing I thought of was about copying. Quite aptly, Anno declared himself a copy, saying, 'I'm a copy of a copy'. But this (RahXephon) is a 'copy of a copy of a copy'. In the future, there will undoubtedly be 'a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy', and undoubtedly, this chain of copies will continue. Animation has also already entered this world, and there no longer as such things as originals.

`Izubuchi:` But the easy path that you mentioned earlier is a part of a world that has existed since a long time ago.

>`O`: That's true, but in the case of Anno, he was aware of being 'a copy of a copy'. In other words, that's Anno's stance. The very existence of self-consciousness, you could say it's the position you're standing in when creating something. Other directors aren't even conscious that what they're making are copies.

>Of course, I don't mind at all if they are copies. We've been making movies for over 100 years, so new stories, new situations, and new scene allocations don't exist. Everything references other things, and I'm fully aware of that. The issue is if you're doing it intentionally and how conscious you are that what you're making is a copy.

>These days, he fact that there is no controversy concerning copying in animation and that there's no awareness of it is a big problem. In my mind, the greatest achievement of _Eva_ is that it was self-aware of being a copy. That was a huge change, and it was a big turning point. That's why I pay attention to Anno. Not about what he's going to make next but as a situation.

Many of the best authors of all time were socially awkward. Maybe not hikki level, but certainly not normalfags who went out and tried to get into relationships with as many girls as possible to write romance as realistically as possible.

Not to mention that you can't learn moe from the 3D world.

>>8155430
Because people can't change, amirite?

The fire analogy is ridiculous

The cancer killing anime.

>>8155609
The guy you're replying to either didn't see Evangelion or didn't pay any attention at all.

Because we are the ones watching moe shit, fanservice shit and Naruto.
Sure.

>>8155673
>implying you didn't watch Madoka.

>>8155673
I love "moeshit" and fanservice. Where do you think you are?

>>8155681
You appear to have some unhealthy obsession over that show. Have you considered visiting a doctor about it?

What are you guys talking about?

/jp/ LOOOVES moe and fanservice. /jp/ always has. Why else would we play a nukige

>>8155673
I certainly watch a number of anime series that /a/ inhabitants such as yourself derogatorily refer to as "moeshit."

>>8155684
That's because you're a shitposter from /a/.

>>8155688
>playing nukige
You'r a cancer killing eroge industry, go read something good like Swan Song or MUV LUV ALTERNATIVE

>>8155688
The complex themes and well written characters.

>>8155697
Comments like this just make you look out of place and like a try-hard. Hurry up and realize it.

>>8155673
>>8155688
Only /a/ nerds like Hayao Miyazaki and Yoshiyuki Tomino worry about those imaginary threats called "moe" and "fanservice".

We just don't give a rat's ass here in /jp/. We'll post Homu pics with Anno all day.

>>8155715

I was genuinely led to believe that only people from /a/ comes to /jp/ to post homu because they think it's funny as hell.

>>8155718
You were deceived by those conspiracy theorists who make meta-threads all day. There are no daily raids on /jp/.

>>8155718
ZUN!bar has PTSD, so he says crazy shit. Don't mind him.

>>8155718
It's not shitposting if you genuinely think that /jp/ is a place to make your madoka a penis epick win threads.

>>8155718
No, homu is 100% ours just like Saten. /jp/ just has an affinity for girls with long black hair I guess. Explains all the Akiha threads too.

A lot of recent /a/ graduates actually troll our Homu threads if they dislike the series. The whole "I had to deal with this on my native board, and I'll be damned if I have to deal with it again here" mentality comes into effect when they see it again here. Or at least that's what Anon has been telling me.

>Call K-ON! a merchandise anime
>3rd bestselling anime on BD

>>8155725
There really are an IRC channel and Steam group filled with notable named and tripcoded users who are spammers and trolls. All paranoid thought has its root in truth.

>>8155755

I want to join, can you post channel?

>>8155746
I'm a /jp/ native and I troll homu threads.

>>8155761
That's cruel

>>8155763
I also troll Saten threads.

>Oshii
>says anime is all the same shit and lacks originality
>ends talk with announcement of his own love comedy anime about a highschool vampire girl

>>8155770
Now you've done it!

>>8155769
>>love comedy anime about a highschool vampire girl

I literally popped a boner just from reading this.

Gonna be pissed if he stole /jp/'s Magical Vampire Knight Homuha idea though.

>>8155796
Might have been him testing the waters. It would explain the sudden disappearance.

>>8155769
But it's ok because he's making it ironically.

>>8155769

>>8155805
They should just remake Karin instead.

>If you want to become an anime creator, just stop watching anime

I kinda have to agree with Tomino on this one. considers in term of numbers of theme and impact recent animes have been lacking compare to the 80's. It is not there isn't anything good. But general theme and message these day seem very confine. They often presented an idea/theme but do not go any thing further such as the pro or con or even the result of a such an idea/theme.

And for some reason watching Tomino's shows always give me a sense of Shakespeare tragedy.

>>8155806
why? it's perfect!

>>8155702
implying Touhou has the complex themes and well written characters.

>>8155815
Oh fuck, I remember this plot twist.

Are they going to follow the trend of videogames and hire people who don't like anime to make anime?
Because that is a great idea. Can't wait for brown and bloom shooter #4145, now with 50% more manliness.

>>8155847
I'm pretty sure that's already happened, except with cute girls doing cute things.

>>8155853
There's not enough of that if you ask me.

>>8155868
We all should agree to that.
>If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?
It's a relief I was raised among Espers and aliens, so i could properly direct an original show.

>If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?
Wait, so the authors of Bleach, Naruto and other bullshit powerlevel manga have fought with magic laser beams and power of friendship in real life?
Ok.

>taking shit too literary
You're not thinking. At all.

>Bitter old men talk about how much better 'the good all days' were

>>8155911
But taking things literally is fun.

>>8154548

>Someone who doesn't have sufficient human relations skills will not be able to create manga, because manga is a conversation between the mangaka and his readers.

Bullshit, there are thousands of books and other shit about that topic, just being a romance novel reader will provide you with proficient knowledge.

>I can't hire an otaku who doesn't have enough experience about life. If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?

Now this is just a false analogy fallacy

>Stop indulging yourself in manga and anime and go outside, that's the simple picture.

This statement is hypocritical and doesn't have anything to do with the state of the anime industry.

>Otaku can't even have an innocent conversation with other people. If you want to become an anime creator, just stop watching anime.

Another logical fallacy.

Everyone knows that the best writers are depressed, alcoholic, eccentric and have little to no social graces.

>>8155933
why are you so upset

>>8154548
They have love while the old bitter expired directors cant reinvent themselves. It seems like it is the old grandpas that cant see love.

>>8155946
Nothing like a token otaku then.

>>8155965
Just become an alcoholic. If you're not depressed, you will be after you become one.

>>8155933
>Bullshit, there are thousands of books and other shit about that topic, just being a romance novel reader will provide you with proficient knowledge.
In the same way that reading training manuals will make you a great martial artist, cookbooks will qualify you as a great chef, and GI manuals will make you a great soldier.

>Now this is just a false analogy fallacy
It's not an analogy at all. It's an example. Artists are often told to write what they know. It is no different for artists. Skilled artists spend a great deal of time just observing their subject matter. If you refuse to leave your house, you are ill-equipped to form an adroit representation of much that goes on outside those four walls.

>This statement is hypocritical and doesn't have anything to do with the state of the anime industry.
"Indulge" is a word chosen by translator preference, and it's misleading you in terms of what you perceive to be hypocrisy. It is reflective of the state of the industry for one of its highly regarded figures to speak that way of his audience.

>Another logical fallacy.
That's a stretch based on the brevity of the statement in the quote. All of this "logical fallacy" bullshit is remedied with the qualifier "if you want to make a quality product," which is assumed by the speaker. It's nice to drop words you learned in high school to make yourself sound like an intellectual batting away the words of an inferior, but you're not.

>>8155933
>Bullshit, there are thousands of books and other shit about that topic, just being a romance novel reader will provide you with proficient knowledge.
As a writer, I think what we write is always one level/dimension down from our experience and knowledge. We can't capture the level of our understanding perfectly. Thus, if you write based on someone's already dimension-down text, the result won't be too good.

It's same for art, basically; those who draw 2D the best are those who think of the form in 3D, not in terms of lines and flat surfaces. This is the reason even anime-style artists get better results with training in classical arts or reading of anatomy books than with reading those "HOW TO DRAW MANGA" books and copying Tony Taka or whatever. The latter will always have awkward, random mistakes that the artist with real knowledge on 3D humans/animals/objects avoids with ease. The 2D-based approach results in works like those of Aoi Nishimata.

You have to know the subject of your art/writing well enough to know how to stylise it before you stylise it. Simple style-only without knowing the subject matter will end up in lukewarm, shallow art/text.

>>8156032
>As a writer
Stopped reading right there

>"Someone who doesn't have sufficient human relations skills will not be able to create manga, because manga is a conversation between the mangaka and his readers."
It's not like every otaku is a shut-in. And I don't see why a shut-in wouldn't be able to create manga even without the so-called "sufficient" human relationd skills.

>"I can't hire an otaku who doesn't have enough experience about life. If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?"
There is this new invention called the internet. Don't worry grandpa, you'll get used to this new technological stuff one day.

>"Stop indulging yourself in manga and anime and go outside, that's the simple picture."
If they are happy with their lives, just let them. Some people are just happier when they are alone. Again, most otaku actually go outside.

>"Otaku can't even have an innocent conversation with other people. If you want to become an anime creator, just stop watching anime."
Yeah! And if you want to be a manga creator, stop reading manga! Oh and if you want to create music, stop listening to music!
Fucking genius.

Didn't know we had so many writers here who haven't written anything but pretend to know shit.

>>8156054
That's because writing is the easiet profession in the world, you literally only need to something to write with, something to write on and some form of cognitive functions. "I am a writer!"

>>8156006
>form an adroit representation of much that goes on outside those four walls.

You're making a mistaken assumption (4chanese: >implying) that art is supposed to represent reality.

To understand where this comments are coming from you'd have to get what being otaku means in the context of japanese society, I'm not sure many people do.
It doesn't mean just watching cute anime and buying some figures.

>>8156075
Enlighten us

>>8156075
I don't like to leave my house, if that's what you're asking.

>>8155608
HP Lovecraft comes to mind.

>>8156090
All of his work was about how terrifying and evil the outside world is, and how mankind(Read: White People) are on the brink of extinction.

He didn't quite shut himself up, but he was pretty close to it.

>>8156094
But it is, and they are.

He'd post here is he was alive today.

>>8156096
more like he's would in /pol/ and complain about niggers running the world.

>>8156097
*he would post

>>8156096
>He'd post here is he was alive today.

Maybe. He did write a lot of letters (and seemingly would write a response to anyone who sent him on), but I think he'd probably be on a non-anonymous board.

>If you have never seen a flying castle, how can you draw a flying castle?"

>>8154548
Anno is being a hypocrite with that statement

Evangelion wouldn't exist without his depression and shutting himself in

Not to mention he tried to force Tanaka Kohei to recreate the Uchyuu Senkan Yamato BGM for Gunbuster

I always find it bizarre when Miyazaki complains about moe pandering.

You know, the guy whose entire filmography consists of 30 movies about little girls.

Who are those retarded people in OP's post and why should I take seriously what they say?

If only Kon was here. Those fuckers don't even deserve to lick his feet.

>>8156125

In order: The guy who invented manga, the best anime director of all time, the most popular anime director of all time, and some fucko who makes shows about robots.

You can call them bitter old neckbeards, which they are, but you should instantly recognize their names.

>>8156116
Yeah, that unnecessary beach scene in Mononoke Hime was just stupid, and Sen saying "uguu~" repeatedly was quite irritating. And who can forget when Kiki gathered a group of like-minded girls to sit around and drink tea under the pretense of forming a music club?
>>8156114
It also wouldn't exist if he didn't break out of that period of his life, work hard, and cooperate and communicate with other people in the industry to make it all happen. Rather than the tale of an anime-obsessed hikki who did something great, it's more a story of someone who fell into a state of depression, rehabilitated himself, and used something he had experienced in order to forge a new lifestyle, one that abandoned the way of the shut-in. And that's what he shows in his work--the negativity of being in such a rotten state. Who better than someone who has experienced the before-during-after change of going into and out of a shut-in crisis to tell you which is the better lifestyle choice for his given profession?

>>8156147
Can you count the amount of pantsu shots Miyazaki films have?

>>8156128
What's the point bring Kon to the topic

>"Not that I don’t think about the audiences. But what is entertaining may not necessarily be entertaining to them. So when making a film I base it on what entertains me. If I make a film just to please the audience, then that becomes just moneymaking and not filmmaking."

>"I really loved Osamu Tezuka’s works. As for animation, whatever was popular at the time; “Space Battleship Yamato,” “Mobile Suit Gundam,” “Mirai Shonen Conan.” Nothing special or out of the ordinary. Now that I make animation myself, I never think of trying to emulate any animation I saw when I was a child. If I want someone to feel the awe I felt when I was a child when I watched animation, I’d show them a rerun of the animation I used to watch. I also have no interest in doing remakes. Of course, formulas such as “Gundam” do work and are needed in the industry. But I personally have no interest in being a part of that."

>>8156116
they're talking about people secluding and isolating themselves in a society that values social behaviour above basically everything, not pantyshots or cutesy characters

>>8156147
> which is the better lifestyle choice
Why should his experience and conclusion be universal?

>complaining about moeshit, ahremshit and/or generic kawaii uguu shit
>/jp/

mfw, this board eat that shit for breakfast, brunch, lunch and tea time

>>8156183
so what do we eat for dinner?

>>8156187

dinner as in lunch or dinner as in tea?

>>8156187

I could say a penis joke but I just leave it like this

>>8156006
>>Bullshit, there are thousands of books and other shit about that topic, just being a romance novel reader will provide you with proficient knowledge.
>In the same way that reading training manuals will make you a great martial artist, cookbooks will qualify you as a great chef, and GI manuals will make you a great soldier.
That's actually a perfect way to put it.

Just reading training manuals won't make you a great martial artist.
Just reading cookbooks won't make you a great chef.
Just reading GI manuals won't make you a great soldier.
Just viewing images won't make you great at drawing.
Just reading stories won't make you a great writer.

However.

Reading training manuals and training with that information will make you a great martial artist.
Reading cookbooks and cooking with that information will make you a great chef.
Reading GI manuals and training with that information will make you a great soldier.
Viewing images and practicing with that information will make you great at drawing.
Reading stories and practicing writing with that information will make you a great writer.

Seeing soldiers fight in real life won't make you a great soldier either. Nor will watching a chef in real life, looking at martial artists, seeing everything you want to draw in real life or experiencing many interesting things make you good at anything without any effort.
However, once you have some knowledge about your subject, whether from real experience or external sources, practice can make perfect.

[/discussion]

>>8156130
That fucko created Gundam UC and was the most "popular director of all time" before Anno ripped his shows.

>>8156264
And it's a self-referential manga, good job proving their points.

>>8156290
>NHK
>manga
Your powerlevel is showing.

>>8156346
Good job evading the main issue by focusing on the completely irrelevant.

>>8156147
Are you stupid? Annos depression started to end when he visited school children for that TV show.

>current anime is all trash

None of these faggots have seen a single episode of Chihayafuru.

>>8156437
>Autysmical poetry card battles
herp

Some Muslims from a London University made a film about Origami. What does /jp/ think?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2RnCpigJ-c

>>8156440
Hmm...that reminds me of something...

What was it called?

I think it starts with "Tou".

>>8156370
I don't think that your claim about the internal nature of the work in question needs be considered or disputed with when you can't even get its superficial qualities right.

>>8156346
Why the ad hominem when you can simply call him out for his bullshit?

>>8156290
How does the novel being self-referential prove their points? It does the opposite; it shows that even a complete recluse can create good fiction. They claim you need to have experienced certain things in order to make any kind of good fiction, but Welcome to the NHK proves you can also make unique fiction even with (according to them) a severely limited worldview.

>>8156470

Nah, it reminds you of YuGiOh!

>All media and works are derivative at some level, and intrinsically cannot be wholly original

Woah, holy fuck! Who'd have guessed?

Also, does anyone else find it funny that copyright exists supposedly to foster creativity and whatnot, and all capitalism does to art/media is delude and pander to make money, until it's nothing but a product?

In short, pirate everything.

>>8156680
THE AUTHOR OF N.H.K WAS A HIGH LEVEL NEET

>>Hayao Miyazaki: "I can't hire an otaku who doesn't have enough experience about life. If you have never seen a fire, how can you draw a fire?"

So my favorite eroge voice actors have experienced sex and other lewd acts?

Fuck

じじ are fucking stupid and need to shut up. They are completely out of touch. Their shit sucks a fat wang!