/jp/ - Otaku Culture

>>7757895
Thread over

>>7757900
Yep.

No one cares.

>>7757900
what good are her powers if you are not dying?

Refer to this handy guide.

>>7757900

Sikieiki thread, right?

>>7757914
Its going to be terribly awkward for me when I die and she judges me, knowing I've fantasized about having sex with her numerous times.

>>7757920
20 years for expressing lewd desires in public
10 years for expressing a desire to commit lewd act with a public servant
10 years for possesion of lewd materials

>no spellcard system
>canon

Yeah, well, good luck with that.

Moonbitches = Yukari = The Yama = EX Yuka = Erin =The Oni

Pretty much.

>>7757924
Is it wrong to imagine Marisa going cho-form and beating the shit out of enemies when she goes into trance and facesits bosses?

>>7757964

Someone doesn't read CoLA

Paraphrased: "Even Yukari, Yuyuko and Reimu teamed up would be no match for the Yama"

>>7757972
Their powers deal with dead things. They are worthless against the living and those already judged.

Whoever wields the plot armor.

>>7757972
Oh boy, here we go. I have seen threads just about that line on /jp/ go for hundreds of posts.

They couldn't handle her LECTURES, they are in no way refering to combat.

>>7757974
Which means Reimu is the only one that would have to worry about it, since Yuyuko is a ghost and lol Yukari, pretty sure should could live forever if she wanted too.

>>7757975
Either way, Shikieiki wins.

>>7757982
She may win in 60 years when Reimu dies, but Gensokyo has plenty of immortals, dead things and eternal spirits that wont be judged by her. That makes her powers rather unreliable.

>>7757975
Yeah, well, that's just, like, your interpretation, man.

Tenshi is pretty strong, maybe even the strongest.

Word of ZUN says the Yama.

>>7757972
I thought it was in "A Beautiful Flower Blooming Violet Every Sixty Years"?

>>7757987
Her powers don't only deal with the dead..... It's she can only judge those who are already dead, she can still beat the ever living crap out of people that are alive.

It's like saying Komachi can only attack those who are about to die, when clearly she's not limited to those.

>>7758042
ZUN is also a mortal. To a mortal the Yama are the strongest.

>>7758044
>It's like saying Komachi can only attack those who are about to die, when clearly she's not limited to those.

Well, if Komachi attacks you, you are about to die. No exceptions.

>>7758049
Well, ZUN did say that through Yukari.
People just can't accept the truth, can they?

>>7758044
So? Anyone who is alive is going to die one day anyways and be at her mercy. Beat the crap out of someone whos dead, you still got nothing. Beat the crap ouf of an immortal and you still have an immortal. No one said she cant attack someone whos alive but her ultimate power deals with the final judgement. While it may be absolute to some, its worthless against others.

Unless you have some proof that shes the ultimate brawler or shoots nukes out of her ass, my point still stands.

>>7758061
...and what is your point, exactly?

>>7757975
You are still insisting on that?

That is the worst nitpick i have ever heard.

>>7758070
>While it may be absolute to some, its worthless against others.


Damn, that was one sentence back. You must have ADD.

>>7758080
Well yes, because "shes the strongest and can not be beaten because I say so" Sounds like something a 10 year old says when he is playing with action figures or is talking about Naruto.

>>7758079
No, I just don't see how what you've written is in any way relevant to either Eiki's powerlevel or anything anyone else wrote in this thread for that matter.

>>7758090
It's not just because I said so.

Yukari is the one that said that.

>>7758098
It doesnt matter who said it, thats still all you have to go buy.

>>7758090
>because I say so

I do not think the person you reply to is Yukari, Anon.

Shape changing can be easily exploitable.

>>7758103
Yes, yes, everything anyone ever says in Touhou canon is irrelevant. Don't pay attention to it.

After all, Little Black Tewi.

Admit it.

Shiki could beat the living crap out of all your 2hus.

>>7758122
That's what the entire thread was about, if you didn't notice.

>>7758122
But could Shiki beat Accelerator?

>>7758128
Takes less time for Accelerator to turn a human in to hamburger than it takes for his knife to travel past a erased shield. Accelerator wins.

Any kind of all-out Touhou battle would come down to mindgames more then anything because of the sheer power they all throw around and weird conditions on using said powers.

I'd personally throw my lot in with Yukari, Reimu, Marisa, Remilia, and Eirin.

Especially Yukari though, her combination of intelligence, powers, minions, and drive in the face of true trouble is just unbeatable.

And before anyone goes all "But Yukari sleeps and doesn't care about anything!" She gets very serious when Gensokyo is threatened.

- Yukari can manipulate borders so she can manipulate the border of manipulation so she can manipulate everything and always wins.

- Yuka has the Ultimate Magic and since it is ultimate it is past everything so she can use it to do everything and so she always wins

Yoshika could easily disable Yukari and Yuka since she can eat anything and everything, from human corpses to the ultimate magic and the concept of borders.

>>7758134
>"But Yukari sleeps and doesn't care about anything!"

I wouldn't be able to take the opinions of someone that believes in that seriously, that phrase is almost driving into the borders of tertiary.

Kaguya and Mokou.
Complete immortality is not as flashy as other abilities, but is probably the hugest bullshit in touhou universe. Sure they can be defeated, but if they are really out to get you nothing will stop them ever.

>strongest Touhou
>can't even skip work to drink
>employed
>not already drunk

>>7758143

Suika can change the size of something so it won't fit inside a border.

>>7758160
Poor Orange...

>>7758061
Unless you prove she isn't stronger than any other being in Gensokyo, word of god still states she's the strongest being aside from the Dragon and a few unknowns.

She can still beat the crap out of everyone else hence she's the strongest. It doesn't matter if you're immortal. If you lose but don't die, you still lost.

I thought we all agreed that it was Stickyecstasy Yabadabadoo a long time ago:
Loli
Sexy
BDSM
Universal jurisdiction

>unlimited nuclear power
Oku could just blow up the whole planet when ever she wants so I'd say shes strongest.
even Yama isn't capable of doing that but i'dd say shes second.
Third would probably be Yukari

>>7758179

Eiki's power is reliant on administering punishment. some Touhous (i.e., Yukari), can use their powers to manipulate whether or not something is punishable.

>>7758195

Yukari could gap the boundaries of all atoms in the universe. You can't fuse what is already one.

>>7758198
>some Touhous (i.e., Yukari), can use their powers to manipulate whether or not something is punishable.
???

>>7758207
Jurisprudence is a hermeneutical method which can safely read gapped texts. Even the absence of text is readable to jurisprudence.

As law is an aeternal methodology (at least in an idealist domain like Gensokyo, in external reality historical materialism holds sway), Yamaxanadu is immune to nuclear obliteration (besides, she'll still have two immortals to spank).

>>7758207

There's some quality that makes actions right or wrong for a given person in a given situation. Yukari could theoretically manipulate this to get brutally raping and murdering your little sister a standing ovation in church.

>>7758212

Eiki doesn't have jurisdiction over Kaguya and Mokou. They can't die and she judges the dead.

>>7758213
Sadly, the code of the yama is immutable, so even if she can get everyone else to acknowledge that as a good action, the yama is absolute.

>>7758219
Kaguya and Mokou are weak anyways.

She would just need to beat them up a little to make them give up.

>>7758227
We were noting their immortality as a way to keep Yama alive and judging after the universe has undergone instantaneous nuclear reaction.

>>7758225

As soon as they reach a consensus, Yukari can adapt.

Eiki is like a twenty-ton cannon. Yeah, it's powerful, but it's unwieldy.

>>7758228

There's nothing to be judged. If they never die, they never come before the Yama for judgment.

>>7758230
>consensus
Reason why Yukari is so scared of her? She just can't deal with the Yama.

>>7758234
It may be "can't deal with the Yama on her own turf". What the Yama sees and judges is absolute and unchangeable, but her realm is still the afterlife

The Rod of Remorse's weight is equal to the weight of the sin. Everybody sins, even the immortals.

Captcha: Law niontri

The Touhou that makes your heart skip a beat the most. That is the most powerful Touhou.

All the top-tier touhous are so powerful as to basically be gods and can do anything with sufficiently creative fanwank interpretation. Even Cirno can be thought of as very powerful if her cold powers are considered to be control over the fundamental laws of thermodynamics / entropy.

>>7758333
Gah, the entropy argument, this seems like the sort of thing Cirno wouldn't be able to figure out, and as such is at the power level she is currently

No matter how powerful they can be, it always comes down to danmaku fight, so their powers are kinda useless.

>>7758334
Cirno can freeze bullets, she's the strongest

>>7758427
She can't freeze lasers though.

Cirno's words are ZUN's words
Cirno says she's the strongest
∴Cirno is the strongest.

>>7758284
This is the only good post in this thread.

Oh look, the morsels are arguing over which one of them is the strongest again.

Killer of Universes.

Eater of Worlds.

>Even Cirno can be thought of as very powerful if her cold powers are considered to be control over the fundamental laws of thermodynamics / entropy.

NO. CIRNO'S POWERS ARE BASED ON A PRE-SCIENTIFIC VIEW OF THE WORLD, AND AS SUCH THEY ONLY APPLY TO COLDNESS AND ICE. SHE DOES NOT CONSCIOUSLY MANIPULATE HEAT ENERGY. HER POWER IS NOT TO MANIPULATE HEAT ENERGY. HER POWER IS TO MAKE STUFF COLD.

>>7758468
She can control cold. That can mean anything related to temperature.

>>7758470
>Whoops, chopped off your hands. Guess you're fucked.

>>7758474
Did you just completely ignore his post or something?
>CIRNO'S POWERS ARE BASED ON A PRE-SCIENTIFIC VIEW OF THE WORLD

>>7758474
No, for cirno its a one way path. Just like how my oven can't make things cold, she can't make things hot. Heat is her weakness. She's even stated so before.

>>7758474

I don't think Cirno understands that making something less cold would make it warmer, let alone thermodynamics.

>>7758468
Utsuho proves beyond any doubt that beings based on pre-scientific beliefs do (or at least - can), in fact, possess the full extent of their powers as described by modern science.

>>7758478
You chopped her clone's arms!!!

Oh the intensity!

>>7758490
Gensokyo as a whole is not based on pre-scientific beliefs.

>>7758490

Lacking an understanding of what fusion actually is might have been what made her insane with power, which would demonstrate that introducing advanced technology to Touhous has dire consequences due to their folksy bucolic view of the world.

>>7758227
>Kaguya and Mokou
>weak

Isn't Reimu like Pop-eye?
As strong as the plot demands her to be?

>>7758530

Kaguya ain't shit. How many Touhous even have eternities for her to manipulate?

>>7758227
>Weak
I... how.... what.... remotely.....

They're fucking powerful, probably stronger than Remilia, and they're fucking Immortal.
Sadly.. Mokou isn't the strongest

>>7758535
If you're referring to her various yet untapped and unestablished power that are alluded to many times in canon, then yes.

>>7758540
While they are probably Sakuya/Reimu/Marisa/Youmu-tier when it comes to fighting, they have a significant edge - immortality and pain tolerance. Shiki would still slap their shit, but not effortlessly.

>>7758565
Alright. Agree'd.

Reimu's usually the only one who's canonically pulling this hax shit. The other PC's are to give the game more substance.

From Memorizable Gensokyo.

Sorry bitches.

Because so many Touhous have unbeatable powers, there's seriously no way to tell who is canonically the strongest, and thus these threads are pointless.

Flandre can literally "destroy anything and everything", even someone that's immortal (hence ANYTHING).

Remilia could change someone's fate to make them die regardless of how powerful they are.

Shikieiki has been discussed enough already, with the whole judging thing.

Yukari's ability is all fucking sorts of broken, and I'd place my bets on her realistically.

And so on. There is no canonical winner. There probably never will be.

>>7758704

There's really not even a strongest. If two top tier Touhous get in a fight, there's a good chance they'll both wind up obliterated. The spellcard system is intended to avoid that mutually assured destruction.

>>7758704
The only canonical winer is my dick

>>7758704
The only canonical winner would be my dick

>>7758704

Destroying something immortal won't necessarily kill it.
Probably won't kill it, in fact.

>>7758744
Unstoppable force, immovable object, etc

None, since they are all restricted to Danmaku rules and can never use their true power.

>>7758781
Well while I agree that its a great thing that they are restricted and the spell card system is a good thing. Thats not the topic.

I think agree with the general consensus, if the top teired Touhous went all out, everyone would lose. The immortals and eternals would survive but half of them wouldn't have a home and the other half would have to return to their own dimensions.

Its best to let Cirno act as the strongest while everyone enjoys life in Gensokyo,

>>7761411
This. There's a reason why there haven't been any all-out youkai wars since the Lunar Invasion. Hell, in SSiB, Toyohime could have ended life on Earth just by using her fan, and it wasn't even a proper battle.
I'm sure most youkai know better than trying to cause a war, and those that don't (e.g. Utsuho) are quickly stopped by the more powerful ones before shit can hit the fan.

>>7758468
Gensokyo has to operate on *some* kind of logically consistent physical laws, or it would spontaneously evaporate into space or something. For the most part it is seen to work like our universe plus magic. Thus it is reasonable to assume that Cirno makes things cold by transferring their heat somewhere else, in accordance with the 1st law of thermodynamics, even if she doesn't know that's how she does it.

>>7762315
>plus magic
Why do you assume that magic has to work with physical laws? Not every magic system is like Discworld's. Most aren't, even.

>>7762315
>Thus it is reasonable to assume that Cirno makes things cold by transferring their heat somewhere else, in accordance with the 1st law of thermodynamics, even if she doesn't know that's how she does it.

First of all, it's Gensokyo, not being bound by common sense is pretty much the point.

Second of all, it's already been established that magical girls are specifically not bound by laws of thermodynamics.

>>7762315
If Udonge is to be believed, Cirno absorbs the heat from her surroundings, so her body temperature must be pretty high.

>>7762315
>Gensokyo has to operate on *some* kind of l
logically consistent physical laws,

No it doesn't. That's D&D thinking, where magic is just "different physics" because the writers have no imagination.

Real magic, primeval magic, the magic from before science or logic was even invented, the magic that fuels the Land of Illusions, is the magic that spits on your demands for consistency and limits.

>>7762863
It's unclear (yet) if their abilities are not bound by laws.

However, Gensokyo itself certainly is, Kanako stated very explicitly in WaHH that the same laws and behavior of the outside world applied in the same way in Gensokyo (apparently this was her motivation for trying to make Cold Fusion, which succeeded).

Notice that there's a different between the sheer ''magical'' abilities of many Touhous and the ''magic power'' of magicians like Marisa and Patchouli.

>>7757976
This, the one who pretty much wins all the games.

Raymoo.

We haven't seen anything about non-spellcard based fights after Windows.

Until we do, or ZUN goes and says it straight in an interview, nothing can be assured 100%, let it be known that any result of this thread (and the billion others that came previously) cannot be proven as fact, only inference, because debating is fun.

>>7762906
>Kanako stated very explicitly in WaHH that the same laws and behavior of the outside world applied in the same way in Gensokyo

I don't remember this. I remember, however, Sanae pointing out the exact opposite - that something that didn't work in the real world (cold fusion) should work in Gensokyo. Which turned out to be true.

>>7763166
Yes, that's the same reason why youkais exist in Gensokyo, without the barrier, they would poof out of existence. It's kind of a belief system (like in Umineko). But it doesn't do anything else other than allow its existence.

Also, the fact that so far it hasn't been possible in the outside world doesn't rule out anything, Kanako did use sheer science to achieve it, after all (although the materials to do so were gotten with the help of Reimu chatting with the gods).

I believe Kanako said the phrase in Chapter 4 (can't find the translated script anywhere after danbooru deleted it).

>>7763311
>that's the same reason why youkais exist in Gensokyo, without the barrier, they would poof out of existence.
Please learn your canon

>I believe Kanako said the phrase in Chapter 4 (can't find the translated script anywhere after danbooru deleted it).
Danbooru doesn't "delete" posts or translations. Add search for ' azuma_aya status:deleted ', then click on Notes on correct image. (or get the voile hard-translation.

>>7763166

Exactly. Gensokyo is composed out of things that cannot be true in the normal world. Remember how the moon landing only became a thing there after enough people in the normal world started thinking of it as a hoax?

Strongest, physically?

With innate hocus pocus, Suika.
With plain old-fashioned brutality, Yuugi.

>>7763415
Is Yuugi older than Suika?

>>7763380
>The Hakurei shrine maidens control the Great Hakurei Boundary and protect Gensokyo. If the Great Boundary were destroyed, either from inside or out, Gensokyo would likely not fare well. Gensokyo relies on the Hakurei Shrine and its shrine maidens to continue to exist as it does today.
>...the Hakurei shrine maidens really do have all of Gensokyo under their thumbs.

Say what?

>>7763436

Unknown.

>>7763436
Maybe. All ZUN ever said is:
>Suimusou Ending
>Was it because she was too immature?
>未熟
That's all.

>>7763461

Someone should get a pic of him and put a trollface over his head.

If the Barrier comes down, does Gensokyo telefrag Japan or just cease to exist?

I'm hoping for the former.

>>7763556
lol epic win bro, DO IT FAGGOT :p

>>7763556

Everyone is taller than Suika, but ZUN is the only person consistently depicted as taller than Yuugi.

>>7763398

Just confirming that for you, dude.

And two pages later.

>>7763603
ZUN is nearly never depicted at all.

>>7763613
How is that a confirmation of anything at all?

Reimu was beaten by Tenshi in Scarlet Weather Rhapsody, therefore, Tenshi is the strongest.

>>7764363
But anybody can beat anybody in Gensokyo.

Also everyone else beat her before, and don't get me with that ''oh she was just playing'' because it's bratty lies.

I think it's obvious who is strongest in Gensokyo.

But later there are all Mary Sues like Yukari and Reimu and Moon rabbits and others.

>>7764363

Everybody in Gensokyo kicked Reimu's ass at least once, even Cirno. It doesn't mean anything.

>>7764427
>Everyone in Gensokyo kicked each other's ass at least once

Upgraded.

>>7757911
What does "osaisen" mean?

>>7764456
Donations.
おさいせん
お賽銭

>>7764458
Thank you.

>>7764446
Not true!

>>7764516

I'm gay for that image.

>>7764519
Nope, Yukari did. Yet even Mystia beat her.

Saying that ZUN said so is like saying that ZUN said everything in PMiSS.

Kaguya=Mokou>Shikieiki>Yukari>*

>>7764547
I always wondered if every immortal's weakness (and the main reason immortality sucks) could be exploited in Gensokyo, that is, being sealed in a place where due to their immortality, they will remain forever without dying.

I'm pretty sure Reimu can seal others due to her powers/dialogue/miko status, Yukari surely can gap anybody to the 12th dimension of oblivion that would repeatedly obliterate any kind of immortal matter's particles for eternity.

God Dragon > Shinki = Ex-Alice > Yuka > Reimu > ... > Yukari.

>>7764583

You don't get to be the third character with most screentime in touhou by being a weak little fairy.

>>7764596
Get the fuck out.

Hong is the strongest = Strength not intelligence or magical ability.

Raw strength hong would beat most of the touhous in a fist fight.

>>7764621
Hahah no. Vampires are canon to have the strength of the strongest Youkai. Not to mention Yuuka, Yuugi or other such characters.

I'm pretty sure even Suika could tear Mei-Ling in half.

>>7764659

What do you mean "even Suika"? Suika is probably the physically strongest touhou. The only competition she even has is Yuugi.

Yukari is the strongest touhou by far. No contest.

HER SAKE

NOT
EVEN
DROP

>>7764681
Wasn't Yuuka canon strongest touhou?

>>7764681

>>7764719

Different "strongest". When talking about Yuuka, they mean "most powerful", not "lifts the most".

>>7764723

And I should say the "most powerful" part is contested too. All she has is the Ultimate Magic. I would bet on Yukari over her any day.

You can't beat the truth.

>>7764659
>Vampires are canon to have the strength of the strongest Youkai

[citation needed]

If such citation is PMiSS or before, you're leaving out a shitload of more powerful characters.

>>7764719
Only if you consider Kioh Gyoku as canon, she only got the ultimate magic, and even so it apparently doesn't mean shit because she got beaten in PoFV.

Most of her powers and sadism is fanwank anyway.

>>7764723
>implying Yuka doesn't have the highest squat and deadlift in Gensokyo

>Suika is probably the physically strongest touhou
That was Aya point of view. And you know how stupid her reports are.

Yukarin is the strongest love to be worshipped with my heart and soul!

>>7764723
>>7764752

Somebody gon' get they ass kicked.

But Hong is powerful.

>>7764766
>But Hong is a joke character.

Fixed.

>>7764744
>and even so it apparently doesn't mean shit because she got beaten in PoFV.
BECAUSE IT'S NOT LIKE BOTH ONIS HAVE BEEN BEATEN BEFORE TOO.
RITE?!

>>7764785
>But Hong is the best Touhou
FTFY

>>7764799
>But Hong is opinions

Double fixed.

>>7764785
YOU'RE A JOKE CHARACTER

Reimu
Main character wins all fights, it's canon

>>7764802
Who's tallking about onis? We're not comparing them, we're just talking about Yuuka.

another touhou powerlevel thread in /jp/ what a surprise

>>7764829

Somebody complaining about a Touhou powerlever thread on /jp/, what a surprise.

>>7764834
>powerlever
heh

The actual word of ZUN:

Fantasy Heaven, Reimu's Last Word

Supreme Master-Arts by any means. With Reimu's ability to float, she floats from everything in reality and becomes invincible.
If it wasn't just for play (with time limit), no one could beat her with any method.

>>7764849
That's powerful, not strongest.

>>7764852
That's here the same. We use the definition of Cirnos "strongest". Something like: Consider a random experiment. If you would pairwise let all touhous fight each other, long-dated the "strongest" touhou would win the most fights.

>>7764863
No, strongest and most powerful mean two different things.
And your sentence should be:
"If you would pairwise let all touhous fight each other, long-dated the 'most powerful' touhou would win the most fights."

>>7764901
>Who is the strongest Touhou?
That's what asked. As you can see, Cirno is not muscular or something. She uses the term "strongest" like the definition above. If you're bothered by the word, replace it with the most "touhouish" touhou or something.

If I may join in. I don't know much about Touhou canon, or the laws of their universe and shit. I just like the shmups to be honest. Anyway I did have a question maybe a few of you could answer since you all probably know a shitload more than me about backstory/powers/etc.

What is the deal with the Lunarians? Why are they on the moon and what does that have to do with the Boundary World/Real world and stuff? Are Mukou and Kaguya so damn powerful because of their immortality they just dont give two shits about what goes on in Gensokyo?

And I guess another question would be about Sakuya. Are we ever going to get more info on her and what she really is? I know people have speculated forever about her and if she really is "more than she lets on" or if she truly is just a classic maid to her master.

Also, how much information has been revealed about this Dragon god? What exactly is he supposed to do? Keep the world safe? Observe? Masturbate?

Sorry that was kinda long. As I said I like lore and such but their is just WAY too much Touhou fanfics/information/canon out there for me to catch up on it all.

>>7764962

The Lunarians are just a race that live on the Moon. However, they live on something like "Moon's Gensokyo". The people from the outside (real) world can reach the "outside Moon", and Gensokyo's people can reach the "Gensokyo Moon".

Mokou is more worried about revenge/her yakitori stand and Kaguya about being the NEET she is / not being caught by the Lunarians. As immortals, yeah, they don't really care about the world and all, but there's not many who actually do in Gensokyo.

I doubt ZUN will reveal/create anything about Sakuya's past. She's a very classical and dedicated maid; just pick the speculation you like the most to be happy with. Or create yours.

The "Dragon God" is not really one specific dragon. Rinnosuke only teaches Reimu about generic japanese lore concerning the relation between dragons, water, and the creation of life on Curiosities of Lotus Asia. The dragons are supposed to be the most ancient and powerful gods.

>>7758160

If this is true, then either Flandre or the Dragon God should be the strongest. Flandre can destroy anything that is created, and the Dragon God could probably just un-create her before she could even touch him. I think Dragon God is probably on an entirely different level than the Touhous.

However, Reisen is the best.

Wriggle is strongest
There are more bugs than youkai, so they would be swarmed, and the stinging insects would incapacitate them, and the mosquitos would suck them dry, until they finally died.

>>7765119

You're wrong, Rumia is the best, she can create darkness so that touhous bump into trees until they die.

>>7764962
In a secret interview with four Touhou grandmasters, ZUN revealed that Sakuya is half-lunarian, half-youkai.

>>7765140
Also, in her true/full-power form she was horns and wings.

>>7765140
Luke, I am your maid.

HELL, it's about time