/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Someone is really going to have to sell me into looking into this. Saber's new look is just 8 levels of wtf, and not really in a good way. I just can't get past it.

>>5972762
It's a different character, not a new look.

>>5972762
It's not the saber we knew.

This is progressively worse news not better. Is it Type Moon doing the writing or someone else like with Zero?

>>5972857
Nasu wrote the scenario according to Wiki

I'm fapping, guys.

Holy fuck. Fate/Extra's Berserker may have just sold me. I love Three Kingdoms period heroes. and I was always thinking he'd be perfect...

Appearance doesn't leave much guesswork as to identity though.

You will never be raped by your own servant ;_;

>>>/u/925093
i get the feeling that /u/ and /jp/ should form some kind of alliance

>>5972912
I'd rather not be involved with those militant man-haters in any way, shape, or form.

>Pirate Rider is Sir Francis Drake

My boner, I wish you could feel it.

>>5972912
No. They are the worst beings on the planet. Akin to yaoi fangirls.

>>5972924
>>5972930
Am I the only one who thought most yuri fans are guys? Never been to /u/, so I'm clueless.

>>5972946
It used to be that way, then the man-hating femnazis took over /u/ and make daily threads about how often men flirt with them when they're out with their girlfriends and how disgusted it makes them feel that a penis came within 30 yards of them.

>>5972762

The fact it's still the same Archer, is good enough for me. Fuck yeah.

>>5972956
i hear it is like half and half now

>>5972981
Fuck yea. Same Archer and these new awesome Berserker possibilities might make me tolerate new Saber.

Speaking of which. Shouldn't there really be more Asian heroes summoned in the grail war? Servants are stronger in areas where people know about them. You'd think magus's would want to summon a lot more Asian ones than they have in Fate, Fate/Extra. The power boost/penality for local renown isn't massive I know, but it's not like Japanese/Chinese lore doesn't have some power hitters. May as well hedge your bets and pick someone powerful and asian.

Archer : Huang Zhong
Lancer : Zhang Fei / Lu Bu / Zhao Yun
Saber : Musashi, Sun Jian, Kojiro (ok so they used him)
Caster : Zhang Jiao
Rider : Lu Bu (although really, having him 'sane' might actually hurt your chances)
Assassin : Ninja's aren't really my speciality but i bet there's a few good ones to pick from.
Berserker : Lu Bu, Guan Yu , Meng Huo , Wei Yan

>>5973041
>Guan Yu
>Berserker
>not Rider or Lancer
I don't even

>>5973041

Well, by RAW, only the Hasans can be Assassins.

Ran a game of Fate/Stay, though, and we houseruled it. We had a female Jack the Ripper. Wonder why they were never caught? It REALLY helps that they were looking for a dude.

But, yeah, I see your point. We had Zhou Tong as our Archer.

>>5973041

>Kojiro (ok so they used him)

No, they didn't, because there IS no Sasaki Kojirou.

And if there was, it wouldn't be the swordsman we see in Fate/Stay Night, and he wouldn't have the Tsubame Gaeshi.

>>5973078
The Holy Grail doesn't care.

>>5973067
well, with everyone making new rules, adding new classes and fucking up the grail system on each war, i guess there's no problem with taking out the "hassan only" restriction in alternate universe/wars/systems.

I'm about to wrap up my Saber playthrough, on the last servant before the final boss. Has there been translations of the servant info pages? I can't read much moon unfortunately.


Spoiler list for servants following in case anyone wasn't aware:

Enemy Servants:
Saber = Sir Gawain
Rider = Sir Francis Drake
Berserker = Lu Bu
Archer = Robin Hood
Caster = Nursery Rhyme
Lancer = Vlad Tepes aka Dracula
Assassin = Li Shuwen
Lancer = Cu Chulainn
Berserker = Arcueid

Player Servants:
Archer = Emiya
Saber = Holy Roman Empress Nero
Caster = Tamamo No Mae

>>5973057
I wasn't all inclusive.

There's like 12 other possibilities for Saber,
Ma Chao would also work for Rider/Lancer, etc etc.
Note that also the requirement for Rider is strong noble phantasm, not as much towards being a horseman. Wonder if you could get Zhuge Liang as Rider using some kind of reality marble like Iksander.

>>5973087

It does care.
You can't summon something from outright fiction.
(NO DON QUIXOTE.)

In canon, Sasaki Kojirou is stated to be fictional. There WAS, however, a real swordsman who knew the "Tsubame Gaeshi", but he never fought Miyamoto Musashi. HOWEVER, this man didn't become a Heroic Spirit anyway, so you can't summon him anyway!
Caster glitched. Clean and simple, Caster fucked the rules and got a glitch. No better than catching Missingno. and getting 255 Master balls.

>>5973090

Well, that was the only hard and fast we changed. We stuck to everything else.

Berserker: Achilles
Saber: Jeanne D'Arc
Assassin: Jack the Ripper
Archer: Zhou Tong
Caster: Morgan Le Fay
Lancer: Hippolyta
Rider: Perseus

Fun fact: By cannon, Jeanne and Arturia look almost exactly the same. That...was useful. Can you guess why?

Oh, also, as note of backstory, we went with Unlimited Blade Works, Good End, as the cannon end. We had it take place in 2004, this war took place in 2010. And, it was the third War in the place, in America.

funny thing that Robin Hood it's kinda like Hassan in Fate/Extra, there's not only one. The one sumoned this time is more about guerrilla tactics and taking down army's. One of his skills takes down 60% of an Enemy's army, he's so out of place in these 1vs1 full frontal battle

>>5973110
If it's glitched before then it's also possible for it to happen a second time.

>>5973110
But you can also summon something that had just the faintest twinges of reality and was blown completely out of proportion like Avenger. So the line is blurred a bit.

>>5973110
>>5973087
>>5973078

Caster, as a servant, can't call a servant. She said, fuck that, did it anyway. And got a fake. A normal summon would not have gotten a fake.

Out of curiosity, what do we know about the Avenger class? What are the prerequisites for being summoned as one and what (if any) class skills does it have? I fully expect the answer to be that no one knows, though.

Does Japanese lore have any good candidates for Rider?

>>5973124

Then you have to have a Caster class Servant first.

Or be a Spirit yourself and try to do the summoning ritual.

You can't glitch out of the blue. And you can't glitch the impossible. Even Caster got LUCKY. The (REAL) swordsman's spirit, while not Heroic, was tied to the mountain she was performing the ritual on. Hell, the only reason she was able to summon him and have him last? The mountain is a magical leyline and could provide prana for him.

>>5973134
The Avenger's class criteria was probably : summons Maiynu. Before the grail allowed evil heroes, they probably had to make the class specifically just so they could do that.

>>5973135

Tomoe Gozen.

>>5973131

This, basically. Or, that's how we used it. To get a fake, gotta be a Servant. That's how we got False Caster Kirisame running around.

>>5973134
>>5973140

Avenger class is for antiheroes. Evil people who do good things.

Canon says, right from Heavens Feel, "Antiheroes do not really exist".

>>5973131

There's no real Kojirou. He didn't exist.

>>5973149

Wait, what? No, the Grail could only summon PROPER heros, until Avenger was drummed up. That's why we had 4 and 5th war Casters, and 5th war Rider.

Other point of curiosity. Fan-commentary pointed this out : shouldn't Shirou always summon EMIYA? Sure he has Avalon, but he also happens to have the body of a potential servant, in a sense. That's one heck of a catalyst.

>>5973160

Avenger himself is a loophole, since he's not a Heroic Spirit.

Really, the Grail War has been rife with glitches and errors.

However, the class "Avenger", according to Kotomine, is for anti-heroes. Also according to Kotomine, antiheroes don't exist.

>>5973173
Be very careful with paraphrasing Kotomine... He plays the line of 'technically correct' very well. Not necessarily disagreeing, but just saying.

>>5973163

He also has a full-power no-shit fucking ancient real Noble Phantasm lodged in his chest. This is not even a copy from the Throne of Heroes. This is the real Avalon that Saber lost fuck-all centuries ago.

>>5973173
Kotomine says a lot of things.

>>5973183

He also never lies.

>>5973163

No, because it's preordained that Rin does. Wait, hold on.

># Actually, Rin didn't have a catalyst that connected her to Archer. The pendant she had wouldn't have any connection with Heroic Spirit Emiya until it passes into Shirou's possession and he becomes a Heroic Spirit. It was actually Archer himself who had the catalyst - his version of Rin's pendant which he kept his entire life - which linked him specifically to Rin.

># So, because of the time loop that enables Archer to fight in a Holy Grail War in his own past, it would have been automatically impossible for Rin to summon any servant other than Archer?

># Well, if Rin possessed a catalyst for another Servant that exceeded Archer's catalyst that connects him specifically to Rin - really unlikely - then it would have been possible for her to summon a different servant. Otherwise, yeah.


So, basicly, to keep the time-loop right, Rin HAD to summon him, and Shirou had to summon Saber.

>>5973182
Why doesn't Gil have Avalon?

>>5973182
Avalon also has ties to Archer because of what you just said. Granted it's stronger way of calling Saber, but it could also call Archer in a sense since you're have something that was intimately entwined with the hero for many years.

So:
x1 item relevant to Arturia
x2 item relevant to EMIYA

>>5973173

Avenger is a real hero. Just not a well known one. He was a hero to a single village, killed so the world would be saved.

>>5973204

Because he's dead? That's how everyone else has things, now.

He had the original, but, it went to Saber, and then to Shirou.

>>5973197

There is no time loop. The universe operates by a Kaleidoscopic shine of universes. The Shirou that becomes Archer already happened, and there is nothing that can reverse that.

What Archer's gambit was, if he writes "Emiya Shirou kills Emiya Shirou who will go on to become Emiya Shirou" in history, that Reality (Gaia) will go, "no fucking contradictions" and delete him forever.

>>5973210

Right. However, to keep paradox from happing, Saber HAD to be called, also. She's called, for any battle that has a Holy Grail. And, Shirou was the only one that COULD call her, and to keep more paradox from happening, Archer had to be Rin called.

>>5973221
To give some credence to Archer's plan, the Nasuverse really hates contradictions...

>>5973224
see :

>>5973221

>>5973213

No, he was a VILLAIN to his village. Literally, they thought he was the devil.

>>5973204

It's one of the few items that (or the origin thereof) didn't exist in his time. Excalibur and Avalon were forged by Faeries, and Excalibur used Gram as a base. Avalon had no base, however.

>>5973210

It's unlikely that Archer still has Avalon within him, and so the Avalon Shirou holds has no current relation to the Counter Guardian EMIYA.

>>5973221

There's some merit to that, but, there's some things pointing that there IS a time loop, too. I just find it easiest to think of it that way, frankly.

>>5972956
I just checked /u/, no such thrads exist, you lie.

>>5973233
A catalyst doesn't have to be in a hero's possession at all times (or ever in their possession). Beserker is summoned from a slab of Hercules's temple.

Gil is summoned using the skin of the first snake. It's just an object that has a high level of connection to the hero. "Inside me for years and also saved my life a couple times" is a pretty high level of connection.

>>5973233

He was a devil of their own creation. Saving and damning, at the same time.

A anti-hero.

Also, doesn't UBW Shirou retain Avalon? Shoot and in the Good end, saber's still around and Shirou is part of a 3 way contract with Rin and Saber. So Avalon is present in him and hooked up. Theoretically he shouldn't age until Saber disappears from that world.

>>5973249

Precisely.

A coincidental fluke that would be hard to replicate.

>>5973248

But not as heavy a connection as "the holy indestructible sheath for my most holy sword".

Avalon calls to Excalibur more than to Shirou.

>>5973259

Good end is Good.

>>5973262
But in whatever Grail resolution process you have :

Very strong pull for Saber vs Very strong pull for Archer + small pull for Archer.

Avalon's connection to Shirou would be a scale-tipper.

>>5973266
>>5973259

Well, it was only properly active when he had his contract with Saber. Rin held it, after. However, he seems to still have some seeded healing.

But, I gotta agree, Good end is called that for a reason.

>>5973149
>"Antiheroes do not really exist"
But proper heroes don't exist, either.

>>5973266
Further query. Couldn't in any path Shirou trace Avalon then put it inside himself? Internally contained contradictions usually aren't eliminated by Gaia, and it's confirmed Shirou can do a near perfect trace of Avalon.

>>5973249
gosh.. so many fate noobies ne?
Avenger is a HERO, you cannot summon non-heros from the throne. Some heroes save others take blame. Avenger took all the evils on his back, so the rest of humanity could be without "sin/evil". Saying avenger is evil is like saying Jesus is evil for taking the sins of man upon himself. Actually legend of (lols, christfags are gonna be mad) jesus derived from a combination of OLDER stories.

Recap: good guys who took blame for other people for the best results, scape goats. Like jesus, leluche vi brit, Eva(umineko), batman(dark night), etc...

Can't name one anti-hero that is TRULY evil, in fate that is.

>>5973279
Of course then Rin would find out since she'd almost definetely have to help with the "put inside" part. Then she'd want one. Huh. wonder what would happen if you traced Avalon then put it into Ilya. Shoot but at some point even done internally, Gaia would just flip out "this is bullshit! I see not one but four Avalons!"

>>5973287
>>5973279

Even Shirou's tracing lasts only a few hours, is the problem. And it takes a SHIT TON of prana.

So, you could, but, it does not last.

>>5973282

Avenger the individual, was not evil, no. But, he had the sins of the world, shoved onto him, and was turned into a devil. That's the major difference. No guy in the sky going "It's cool, he's with me." and a pardon. No, he got the evils, and was stuck with them.

>>5973287
I don't know why, but that last bit made me laugh.

>>5973269

No, because Avalon and Excalibur were literally made for each other. It's stronger than a connection for having it wedged inside you.

Even though that's what Excalibur does to it, coincidentally.

>>5973279

Yes, it doesn't suffer the quality rank deduction. It is still a construct of his Reality Marble, so it will still degrade if he's not thinking about it.

>>5973282

Yes, but unlike Jesus who was remembered for a saviour, Avenger was remembered as a demon who had to die.

>>5973287

That would put a lot of stress on Shirou's concentration.

what is this I don't even

>>5973279
Shirou can't do it in ANY path only FATE.

Now now try and remember....
Shirou didn't have activated Avalon before summoning saber, didn't have it without saber around, didn't have it in hf after she was converted. DOESN'T WORK WITHOUT SERVANT SABER OR HER NEARBY SUPPORTING HIM(UBW). If she was his enemy or saw him as one, it would not activate.

Most of shirou's projections are short term outside of HIS OWN BODY, swords are already exceptional. Original avalon can work in other bodies, so he could give his avalon away and trace another one inside himself like in fate.

>>5973293

>And it takes a SHIT TON of prana.

No it doesn't.

If prana had "units" (it doesn't, but they kept doing it in F/SN so yeah), it takes about 20 (Shirou had 100, Rin had 500, I think) for a full scale projection via UBW for a payback item of any size at all. In contrast, Strengthen costs 5, and full scale Projection with Gradation Air costs 100 for a payback item of 20.

>>5973293
Shirou's tracing only lasts a few hours because Gaia can't tolerate the contradiction. Every weapon he traces is in the world, either intact or destroyed and turned to dust somewhere. So when Shirou traces K&B, it's up against the clock before reality manages to undo the presence of a second K&B in the world. The amount of time a projected item (or any contradiction) can stay is relative to how well you can resist the correcting mechanism. The same applies to reality marbles, except for the unexpanded UBW (which is always active, even while inside shirou), and a particular Dead Apostle's marble. Each of these last perpetually because they're not actually in external reality. So either Gaia doesn't 'see' them, or can't do anything about it because they're not in the world.

>>5973329

The intrusion the size of a weapon is practically ignored by Gaia, they went over that. His weapons last awhile, and can go on forever so long as he was concentrating about it. The minute he stops concentrating the image of the weapon, however, it shatters.

>>5973329
Shirou's concentration as mentioned by Archer is him really believing in the fake. Kinda like repeatedly shouting at reality "no, it's real!" If he stops doing that, the thing is instantly destroyed by the correcting mechanism, yes.

>>5973329
more like gaia doesn't give a fuck.
it's job is to preserve the laws of nature.
shirou making swords in his ass doesn't directly contradict any laws untill he pulls them out.

Kinda like this, USA doesn't really give a fuck what you do in your own country as long as it doesn't get in their way, if you do then it's time to fuck shit up

>>5973328
Pulling different items out of UBW takes different amounts of mana. It's why Archer prefers K&B and Calabolg for their low mana costs.

>>5973328

That's for swords. Avalon is not a blade.

Remember, Shirou can trace like this, because of UBW. Anything else is a looot harder and more magic eating to make.

>>5973346
That made me laugh. But yea. By these kind of rules, if Shirou traced something then had it shoved into his body. It should last forever, without concentration. He needs to concentrate to defend it from the correcting mechanism, but if it's inside him the correcting mechanism isn't attacking.

>>5973349
using what is ALREADY IN UBW takes no prana, re-summoning them inside does.

ex. pick up sword, use standing swords to rain - no additional cost
breaking/losing a sword and creating one in your hands - additional cost
projecting non-swords -discounted <--implies swords maybe discounted, then again can't remember on that note

>>5973349

It's more like
1. Shirou is addicted to Kanshou and Bakuya, see his thought patterns in UBW. They're a weapon forged for the purposes of forging, and he's a walking forge himself. K&B gives him an erection.
2. Caladbolg II is extremely cost-efficient, and has massive attack for little cost, and explodes on a dime.

I'm pretty much certain he still has to "pay" to activate the Noble or Broken Phantasm of a weapon. Kaladbolg has a low cost for this, and it explains why it's been stated that he couldn't fire Excalibur. It's still possible he can Trace it, since Shirou did (Dark Excalibur, at least) in HF.

>>5973354
Non-swords cost more but are inside UBW. Rho Aias is repeatedly refered to as a shield from the hill.

>>5973354

It's only 2-3x, for even shields like Rho Aias.

Avalon's blueprints are inside him, I think it's immune to the cost increase as well.

>>5973361

Problem being, it was outside first. So, Gaia saw it. Basically, it goes to "I saw that, motherfucker, I'm taking it the second you look away!"

Marbles are...werid, and the exception, not the rule.

>>5973368

Right. But, it still costs more, and is still under the standard rules.

It's the only real reason I can think of, of why they did not do that.

I like emiya/shirou and all, but they have gotten major hax from plot armor / fanism. Archer/shirou can't really summon UBW against most opponents, that's why out of the 3 routes only used once, and that time gil was being arrogant/archer a protecting him.

DON'T QUOTE THE ANIME IT SUX NUTS.

>>5973376
But other poster said it's not a matter of Gaia seeing it, it's a matter of it being in the world. Hence comment about Gaia not caring if there's swords in Shirou's ass.

If F/SN didn't bullshit enough for people to spend hours trying to make sense of things, it wouldn't be nearly as popular.

>>5973392

Right. The blade is made, IN THE MARBLE, and then he pulls it out. It's not in him, it's in the marble, that's not yet effecting the world.

As soon as it's moved out, to effect the world, the clock starts.

>>5973376
>>5973390

No, Reality Marbles are applied to the rules. It's literally pitting a war between your will and Gaia's will.

Which is why Reality Marbles NEVER last very long, and are exceedingly taxing on mana. You can't overpower Gaia.

>>5973390
Archer can, Shirou can't normally. Shirou's native circuits don't have enough juice for it under most conditions. Archer has a bit of a mana increase as a heroic spirit and can probably project it when needed. As problematic as the anime can be, he probably did use it vs Berseker. Narration confirms that he killed Berserker repeatedly in different ways multiple times. Doing that without UBW would likely be way too high of a mana strain.

>>5973400
ORT can.

>>5973399
The marble though is in him in the same sense that the fake Avalon would be. I mean, this isn't Avalon jutting out of his left thigh, this would be the sparkly pieces of avalon integrated into his being by a spiritual surgeon like Kotomine.

>>5973392
If inside Shirou it wouldn't really care, but shirou is not a damn blade recycling plant, can't really absorb stuff without OTHER people shoving it in, and so far only AVALON. Avalon is transplantable into normal people too (Zero illya, Kirisugu, Shirou, saba, etc). He would be a monster that would rival bazercar if he could just absorb ANY blade.

LMFAO Image Gil using GOB on him and he just "absorb all the swords"

>>5973400

Internal marbles.

Unlimited Blade Works, in it's passive mode. AKA, when he's just tracing.

Lair of the Beast King, it's why Chaos is not just slapped down, it's intral nature protects it some..until he starts throwing animals at you.

>>5973408

Funny, ORT doesn't overpower Gaia. ORT converts Gaia's rule to its own, like a virus. It's a corrosion of the "laws", translating them into an alien language, not like a Reality Marble (weakly) punching the "laws" in the jaw.

>>5973413

That's not how it works. It's still a fake, and the world knows it. It MIGHT work, if you broke the real Avalon, but, as long as there are two in the world, Gaia will try to crush the fake.

>>5973429
The Nasuverse : for every set in stone law, there's a way to corrupt, corrode, or overwrite it.

>>5973429
Eh, semantics.

Well, Kanata can, at least, right?

>>5973402
what i meant before was that it is impractical for him to use it as most servants wouldn't give him the time/it's really obvious with the mana he's generating/not practial in battle where it takes most of the cast seconds to run a 100M and decapitate you.

Don't wanna argue on the UBW vs berserker point, it's pointless. I think archer would have won if he could pull UBW on berserker. Also berserker/illy wouldn't let him chant the whole fucking thing.

Animu only had it cause they weren't gonna cover GAR scenario

>>5973427

UBW isn't on internally like Lair of the Beast King. It will, however, activate internally when he panics and loses control. It just sits inert within his mind like every other Reality Marble.

>Lair of the Beast King, it's why Chaos is not just slapped down, it's intral nature protects it some..until he starts throwing animals at you.

Actually, he can keep his animals out. They count as "him", and their skin counts as his skin, so he never intrudes upon Reality.

>>5973444
You're calling sematics on this thread just NOW?

>>5973448

UBW has a kind of passive mode, however. It's why he can understand a blade, and just whip them out. The trouble is when he brings it onto full online mode, and the giant gears in the sky.

You are likely right about Chaos, never played THAT game myself, only know what I've read. So, my bad on that one.

>>5973447
Shirou seems to think not on UBW vs Berserker "I can't beat the ultimate one even with unlimited blades."

>>5973456
That's UBW being active. Reality just doesn't care though because it's inside him. When he expands the field to overwrite the world, it gets pissed and moves to eliminate.

As one of my friends said "I'd be pissed too if someone told my my liver was all fire and cog wheels! I need that liver!"

>>5973448
UBW is in a pseudo-active state
Passive - image the world is still there, swords/desert/etc. inside shirou, when shirou sees blade it is created and staked on the ground. When he pulls one from UBW it copy pasta to real world, same with h is other magics.
Active - UBW ,through shirou's nonsense and ignorance to reason, erupts into the world around him swollowing everything in proximity, everything not will be covered up by gaia, boarders are not crossable due to gaia protecting "REALITY". After it covers up, gaia starts to chip away at the problem while no one notices.

>>5973464

Fair enough. Active and Passive are just my short-hands for it, really.

>>5973456

That's just being a passive archive of blades, though. Not like Nrvnqsr's always-on Marble.

SUMMARY: SHIROU IS REALLY GOOD AT COPY PASTA WITH SWORDS.

>>5973041
>>5973163
>>5973259
>>5973279

Huh. shoot. I spent way too much time and unleashed way too many debates in this thread.

>>5973480

Pretty much.

>>5973492

It's cool. I like talking about it, and it's been out so long, it's rare to get good debates on it, anymore.

>>5973497
Wow, I've been away from Fate for so long I actually forgot that Archer was Shirou.

Why archer is really popular in JAPAN

GAR knows no boarders
Strong/relies only on hard work and risk (work ethic).
Willing to sacrifice.

Most Importantly
CopyPasta machine, what japan was and china/asia is now.

>>5973492
>>5973504

Yeah, Type-Moon is an old favorite to pull out and CONSIDER THE FOLLOWING.

>>5973518

Yeah. The F/SN game I had, it was done from wiki, and the other guy knowing CRAZY amounts.

Like, the Sabers looking alike, I stumbled across that as I was searching the Wiki, and we managed to make it a plot point.

Caster is....not on her game, when she thinks her fucking sister is messing her shit up, AGAIN.

So, having played it at last, this is great fun to jump into.

Typemoon is good it's just that they are very corporate now, need maor monies. That's why they keep milking the same cash cow / reproducting it on diff platforms.

Also zun/r07 are still non-Corp in style. They come out with material for every C, and though art is crap compared to tm there is constant material. Aoko story was set to release over a year ago, it's almost taken longer than wrc3 in entirety.....

Tm = euro expensive / maybE good
zun/r07 = USA/China quantity

You know who I think would make an awesome Saber? Pier Gerlofs Donia. Don't know who he is? Fuck you, just pretty much the basis for every revenge tale in the books. He was just a normal guy, chilling in Medieval Europe, when a motherfucking band of mercenaries employed by the Hapsburgs razed his town and murdered his family. So Pier did what any normal badass would do, and started a fucking rebellion against the largest dynasty in the world. And he almost won, until he got bored with all the raping and murdering and retired. He's known to be superhumanly strong, wielding a Zweihander with enough strength, speed, and skill as to behead multiple people with a single swing.

In other words: >a tower of a fellow as strong as an ox, of dark complexion, broad shouldered, with a long black beard and moustache. A natural rough humorist, who through unfortunate circumstances was recast into an awful brute. Out of personal revenge for the bloody injustice that befell him (in 1515) with the killing of kinsfolk and destruction of his property he became a freedom fighter of legendary standing

>>5973588

I gotta say, perhaps it was just the way the DM ran her, but, for me, my favorite Saber is Always going to be D'Arc.

Determined, loyal, and she once burst trough a window on a motorcycle, with a minigun.

>>5973610
I didn't know J'Arc was a terminator :P

Jeanne is at her best when she's a lesbian.

>>5973610

Wouldn't JdA be more of a Lancer than a Saber?

>>5973629
She can do either maybe?

>>5973628

Due to....well, she was, at times. That war went weird.

Fucking True Ancestor.

>>5973619

She just reeaaally liked guns. Should not have let her watch Hot Fuzz.

>>5973629

She was more known for bladework, then spear-work. Bladework, and once taking a cannon-ball to the face, and going lolno.

Also, the Lancer we got was more then up to the task.

>>5973647

I've always wanted to do a FS/N RP. Got some bitchin ideas, like Django as Archer. His noble phantasm is a gigantic fucking minigun.

>>5973728
>I'll blatantly disregard every rule about heroes and noble phantasms in the FSN universe
OC DO NOT STEAL

>>5973735

Fate/Extra has Arc as Berserker, your argument is invalid.

>>5973875
Fate/Extra has a whole different premise than F/SN, actually yours is.

>>5973429
And, can ORT's Crystall Valley overwrite other Reality Marbles?

>>5975194
Yes.

>>5973163
By the time Shirou summons his Servant, Rin has already summoned Emiya. It's too late.

>>5973875
>>5974119
I know that fate/extra is in bs virtual world. Is it related to original fate world? and did Nasu authorize this cash cowing aka make it canon?

p.s. unless arc is toned down or servants are lvled she would rape most of them.

>>5976364
yes, since Nasuverse has the whole Kaleidoscope thing going on this is canon, they even say when and how this started to be different from the usual nasuverse.
>and did Nasu authorize this cash cowing aka make it canon?
uh, Nasu wrote most of, if not the whole script.

Suddenly.

Ryougi Shiki.

It's not like I hate arc, it's just that why they have to whore her out into EVERY TM game?

>>5976573
maybe because she is the unofficial mascot

>>5976573
But maybe you can say the same about Ryougi Shiki?

>>5976593
That's supposed to be Neco-Arc, not Arcueid.

>>5976573
But maybe you can say the same about Ryougi Shiki?

>>5976593
That's supposed to be Neco-Arc, or Saber, but not Arcueid.

I've never played Tsukihime and people keep telling me Shiki can beat Shirou, If both of them were fully going at it, couldn't Shirou just rain down unlimited swords continuously that would prevent Shiki from even moving much like Gil did to Beserker?

>>5976707
Depends on the Shiki.

>>5976707

>>5976707
>>5976713
>>5976725

1. R. Shiki i think i stonger than both canon, she could cut concepts, unlike Tshiki. Nasu backed.

2. Shirou can't just rain swords out of nowhere, he has to CAST the 10line UBW to do that.

3. Power lvl vs threads are stupid, answer was tie at most all out shiki may kill shirou but brain dies in the process/before. TIE.

4. Like I proposed before Nanamiya Shikirou is better than both.

>>5976707
If Shirou rained swords, Shiki would kill them and then him, but fry his brain from trying to comprehend NPs in the process. Result: Tie.

If Shirou traced Excalibur he'd be able to blow Shiki away, but that would overload his magic circuits and he'd die too. Result: Tie.

>>5976707
Honestly, Shirou's best options would be using something like the Gae Bolg and activating it's effect, or Broken Phantasms.

Also know that sword rain was only done by UBW shirou after seeing archer do it and knowing it was him. And his sword rain (outside UBW) is pretty weak due to mana restaints without rin.

Also it's not X>Y. It should be X has a higher ratio of winning vs Y say 51/49.

>>5976784
>1. R. Shiki i think i stonger than both canon, she could cut concepts, unlike Tshiki. Nasu backed.

Ryougi can cut concepts, but Tohno is better than her at destroying physical things.

>Shirou can't just rain swords out of nowhere

Yes he can. UBW is for mass onslaught, he matches a few of Gil's swords without it active.

It depends on initial distance between them and how serious they are, really. Shirou's swords are essentially massive chunks of mystery, trying to cut them would wreck Shiki's brain pretty fast, but once Shiki gets into range Shirou can't trace fast enough to match his superhuman physical prowess (Nasu calls it "at the top of human ability". Human ability my ass, humans don't run on fucking ceilings. )

Long range Shirou wins, but I'd hand it to Shiki on close range.

>>5976822
Technically Shiki runs on the wall and then jumps off the ceiling.

>>5976364
> p.s. unless arc is toned down or servants are lvled she would rape most of them.
Both are true, actually. Arc is toned down because she loses her be-stronger-than-her-opponent ability (since she's not receiving power from Gaia), and you do level up your Servant.

>>5976822
Are you trying to troll here? You're like trying to imply things i didn't mean.

>>Out of nowhere as in without UBW deployed as UBW is somewhere, herrr.

>>1. R. Shiki i think i stonger than both canon, she could cut concepts, unlike Tshiki. Nasu backed.
>>Ryougi can cut concepts, but Tohno is better than her at destroying physical things.

Not gonna argue with you there. Though I will mention regardless of TShiki's ability to cut physical objects, he's more prone to overclock (aka brain death/fried) then shiki who has non of these flaws. Also what I implied is NASU SAID RSHIKI>TSHIKI=SHIROU

Ryougi Shiki can kill servants.

No seriously.

It happens in canon.

>>5976866
Really? Please do tell as i have yet to have heard such a great story.

R Shiki goes from normal --->god teir depending on her personality. also she can cut concepts, suffers no MEoDP penalites, and is human+. So yeah i guess......

>>5976822
>once Shiki gets into range Shirou can't trace fast enough to match his superhuman physical prowess (Nasu calls it "at the top of human ability". Human ability my ass, humans don't run on fucking ceilings

But an E rank stat for a Servant is the top of human ability. Shiki is only a human.

>>5976857
Uh, guess English isn't your main language.

To make it clear, Shirou can rain swords around without UBW deployed. Well, sensu stricto he still draws the swords from his RM, just that he doesn't require the chant to do it.

I never said Ryougi is weaker, just that Tohno is better at cutting mundane things.

>>5976866
Quite true. 100 of them, in fact.

>>5976905
I think it was just 99, actually. The MC's Servant would be the 100th if you don't beat her.

F/E doesn't have the same "holy fuck servants are untouchable and old as fuck concepts" thing as F/SN anyways, that's why Ryougi can kill them easy

>>5976799
Doesn't work that way since swords in UBW are unlimited and he can rain forever. Unless Shiki could deflect faster than dozens of swords a second, he'd lose.

Also, this question can't be answered since it depends entirely on the stage.
ie. Does Shirou have UBW up and running?
Is Shiki hax enough to destroy traced weapons?
Are they starting from long or close range?
etc.

Although I'd tip the odds in Shirou's favour since even if Shiki could destroy Shirou's weapons outside of UBW, he can let them autoattack and chip away at Shiki.

>>5976924

That or the fact that they are specifically what she kills best makes it easier for her to kill them.

>>5976821
see
>>5976895
>>Also know that sword rain was only done by UBW shirou after seeing archer do it and knowing it was him. And his sword rain (outside UBW) is pretty weak due to mana restaints without rin.
I amended it WAY BACK you didn't read?

Chill the hell out, i wasn't even saying you were wrong......

>>5976953
>>5976924
Good to know that they are toned down. Though that would might help Tshiki more than Rshiki.
The "They're conceptual so can't get hit normally" rule doesn't really hurt Rshiki as she has no problems with concepts, it's just that her "beyond" human limits aren't even close to servant levels. But she could kill if she did. this doesn't exclude that possibilities of them KILLING her, which is much easier even without NP.

>>5976972
>"beyond" human limits

So, what, D-rank?

>>5976924
It was never said that the Servants were weaker. And I don't see any problem with R. Shiki killing Servants if we are talking about the super R. Shiki that defeated everyone in MBAA (and everyone else's last boss as a prelude to her own last boss) without breaking a sweet.

>>5976990
I think only a few attributes would be BEYOND human. like speed/agility ones. and yea D would be pretty good. but that's for personalities 1 & 2.

Personality 3 is the one that everyone quotes as "godly", "beats everyone in MBAA", and starts fanboy arguements about her vs arc, which then became one of he endings for MBAA where she meets archetype earth or princess arc.

>>5977107
Except that the one who defeated everyone in MBAA was Shiki (1), the fact that she didn't saw any line on Arcueid proves that fact.

>You're the hundredth

>>5977399
would it hurt if shirou or tohno got into the cameos sometimes? Fucking nasu, it's alwasy arc, ryougi and saber. What about the main characters of your own damn stories?

>>5977699
Not moe~ enough. Well, Shiki anyway.

>>5977707
moe? Ryougi it's always an ass to everyone, going on killing spree because she thinks that everything it's just a dream and there's no problem with it. At least tohno on MBAA was just trying to make her stop and go back calmly to wherever she came from, not outright trying to kill her..

>>5977765
It's moe because she's female. Were she male, the moe factor would be lacking.

>>5977399
How can she kill 100 Servants when the 120+ Servants in the war were mostly killing each other?

>>5977399
How can she kill 100 Servants when the 120+ Servants in the war were mostly killing each other or having their Masters killed by Julius?

>>5977771
Males can be moe.
To think otherwise means you have not been exposed to enough moe.

>>5980482
I know, but that one particular trait in males isn't moe.

>>5980556
You don't decide what is and isn't moe, moe is completely depended on the viewer.

>Emperor of Rome

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