/jp/ - Otaku Culture

So far, Gold Text has been used to guarantee things.

Hey, is this Kinzo's corpse?
Yes, I guarantee that much.

Hey, I pulled candy from a cup?
Yup, that shit is magic.

It's never been used to make a statement so far.

>>5689114
I guess I have the last word /jp/, making me the victor.

Human evidence built up so much that it becomes a golden truth.

My theory is that all of Umineko is bullshit aside from them meeting up at the airport in the very first game - the plane crashed on the way and everyone died except Battler.

The entire rest of the story and games are just going on in his comatose head.

Just like Pokemon.

>>5689155
Wait for EP7 for a resolute answer, buddy.

>>5689114
The second one is true, depending on one's definition of magic.

>>5689114
So the difference between red text and gold text is:
<red>Umineko is shit<red>
and
Is Umineko shit? <gold> Yes it its <gold>

SO FUCKING DEEP RYUUKISHI BLEW MY MIND.

>>5689492
You forgot the part where they crashlanded on a desert island and Beatrice is a giant fog monster or something.

>>5689533
Beatrice is actually an entire colony of red ants.

My theory is that Gohda made a dinner so wonderfully tasty and delicious to cause the death of everyone

Also he's a badass and he has a huge dick, and fucks all the chicks.

The whole magic vs. human argument has devolved to complete absurdity. By the rules which cannot be violated via magical enforcement, the witch argument MUST be able to be defeated with a mundane trick. If that's so, then WHAT'S THE FUCKING POINT OF THIS GAME??? It's like playing chess in which one side is missing a piece; as long as the other side doesn't make a mistake, he is guaranteed to win.

>>5689566

>>>/rs/Godha_Is_Nothing_more_than_a_plain_chef_with fake_credentials_he_Never_worked_for_a_fancy_hotel

>>5689606
What's the matter? Can't say your slander against a honest chef?
>>>/rs/Gohda_is_a_real_chef_and_worked_in_a_large_hotel

Why couldn't Battler escape the closed room, but Kanon can?

>>>/rs/Umineko_is_shit

>>5689666
Because Battler's closed room is his comatose mind. Kanon is a character in his head.

You can't break free of your own mental barriers.

>>>/rs/Godha_is_a_magical_chef

I thought the gold text represented the "premise" of the story. Sort of like they talked about in the chat with Dlanor and Virgilia in Ep 5's "??????."

It's something that can only be seen with love, and only works based on the loving relationship with the writer and the reader. It's like getting a mystery novel with the gimmick of "In this book, there are hidden doors, but only certain people know how to use them."

"Kinzo is dead" is the "premise," or "gimmick," of the 5th episode...the whole episode starts with him being dead, and it's the thing that sets it apart from previous episodes.

Is this how other people think of the Golden Truth? That it represents "premises" of the tale that only the Game Master, aka the tale's author, can set for his audience?

>>5689533
Why hasn't there been an Umineko/Lost crossover yet? Seriously.

>>5689666
Battler could have beaten his corpse seal by just saying since he was faking death he was fully aware of the seals being places and so therefore could reset them on his way out -- and this does not interfere with the witch side at all. If challenged on the seals being as good as the red truth, he could just come back with Well I never said they couldn't be re-sealed, which would be kind of a dick move but after the horeshit Erika was trotting out, fuck it, because the game was already a wreck.

>>5689678
Beatrice is the personification of the gameboard rules, so obviously the Golden Truth is directly related to the rules.

Kinzo being dead is one of the premises, the rules, of the game. So is calling slights of hand that someone believes in magic.

Dun dun dunnn

>>5689666
This can be explained with ShKanon, but it's pretty unlikely to be true.
The trick of Beatrice must be something more ingenious...

>>5689723
Those seals are perfect you can't reseal them without breaking them. That's why they are considered as the red truth.

>>5689730
Yeah because Ryukishi sure wrote lot of ingenious tricks so far.
Remember when the twins switched and when the brain parasite did it? So fucking smart.

ITT People believe shit that was said within a story within a story

You know, they could easily be lying about the red, gold, blue, whatever fucking color text.

There's no proof what anyone says is true other than "red text is true and i said red text is true in red text" and "we have to follow certain rules because i said so in red text and the rules say i have to follow them"

But it's not like there's anything proving that red text really is real other than more red text saying it is.

Umineko has too many plotholes just from that alone.

>>5689730
I've evoided all discusions related to this subject until i finished episode 6, wich was an hour ago. I only knew the name of the concept, and it already made me belive this was the reason, but while i can understand how this would allow for someone else to be present and save battle, i can't grasp how that person escaped that same closed room.

>I wonder when will Ryukishi introduce green text.

>>5689778
SHKANNON USED MAGICAL LOVE SWITCH TO SWITCH ITS PERSONALITIES THUS OTHER PERSONALITY SEIZED TO EXIST IN THE ROOM

It saddens me that the actual solution to Umineko will be more retarded than anything any troll has proposed.

>>5689817
>SEIZED
ceased

Umineko is pretty much a gigantic waste of time.

My favorite part was how Ryukishi's only way to drag is mystery for so long was to downright lie to the reader.
Not talking about the fantasy scenes or whatever but the red text.

He basically says "red text is always true" keep repeating his "trust between the writer and the reader" shit ad nauseam.
But in the end he lied, his trust between, the writer and the reader shit was pure bullshit.

When did he lie? When he forgot to mention ZOMG PERSONALITIES ARE PEOPLE TOO, THAT MEAN THEY CAN DIE.
SO WHEN SHANNON AND KANON DIE THAT JUST MEAN THEY DIE IN HER HEAD.

So much bullshit, that's pretty much one of the worst move I've ever seen in a mystery.

How about the gold truth being the "Truth of Humans", like Dlanor said (before we get the first gold)? "This is Kinzo's corpse" in gold would mean that everyone on the island agreed it was Kinzo's corpse, and it became their truth (it wasn't possible to guarantee it was his corpse, but, again, everyone agreed).
For the second one, "This was created with magic...", both Beatos (the only ones there) agreed it was created with magic. I believe any of them could've used the golden truth there.
Finally, it probably is something like: Without love, it cannot be seen. Everyone could see it was Kinzo's corpse. The two beatos saw it as magic.

>>5689854
>Forgot to mention

>lied

Um, that's not lying. Maybe he did withhold information from the reading, but that's why you're supposed to think and figure it out. Is he a liar for withholding who the culprit is? No. Though I do admit this is a cheap move.

>>5689754
Says who? NO ONE said the seals were perfect. Battler just said he would allow the seals to pass for the red thruth of a sealed room. He didn't say SHIT about a room being re-sealed. A dick move? Yes. But the game was already made into a joke so who gives a shit.

And by the way, he could have simply have re-written the scenario to let survivors out of their sealed rooms, thereby opening up more options for the human side, but completely shutting down Erika's attack on Battler's corpse seal by having someone enter the room before Erika does. God it pisses me off I can beat these "moves" without thinking to hard about them.

>>5689902
>implying there was no duct tape to redo the seals with on the entire island

>implying 'it being said in red' makes it a fact that they weren't broken and redone

>implying they ever existed in the first place

>>5689889
That's lying, simply because he stated that red text is factual, always true.
Of course there are loophole, but these loopholes are found in the words presented, in the way you read a phrase.

The whole "personality can die too" isn't a loophole, it's not a red text you can mold using your wits in words, it's simply bullshit.

>>5689902
It was said that the duct tape is the same as in the last game, only limited by the number of rooms, if I'm not mistaken. Therefore all properties from the last game apply to it.

He could. There are dozens ways to avoid logic error, but it's explained as "he'll need to rewrite the story and then even more inconsistencies will arise, and again and again until he finally loses", pretty stupid explanation, but whatever. Maybe he just can't think of any plan besides initially intended.

>>5689930
You're just pissed that you discovered the possibility of Shannon and Kanon being the same person.

Really though, it fits into the same principal that Kinzo was dead to begin with.

Still, if Shannon and Kanon are only part of the same being, what does that make Genji who is also furniture as well?

>>5689930
>red text is factual, always true
But it's true. It just has a literal meaning and not what you sometimes maybe thinking it has.

>Meido deleting my theory posts because he disagrees with my umineko ideas

Oh boy.

>>5689902
OR BETTER YET -- Battler replaces the seals he breaks with his own. How does this work?

1. Erika IS NOT THE DETECTIVE so her viewpoint is FALLABLE. She can't make the argument that battler left the room and replaced her seals with his and make it stick.

2. Dlanor could NOT confirm or deny the seal in red because she would not have the permission to use the Red Key as the seal was no longer the seal she is allowed to use.

>>5690033
He probably just thinks you're shitposting.

>>5690033
Maybe he's deleting your posts because you're an utter faggot?

>>5690039
I love how when I make actual posts you people start this shit with me, and then complain when I go back to shitposting when it's your own fault I do it.

If you leave me the fuck alone and let me post like anyone else there wouldn't be shit like last night, same goes for if meido just left my goddamn posts alone when they are actually relevant to the topic or whats going on in the thread.

>>5690049
And just think, if you dropped the trip, nobody would ever complain about your posts ever.

>>5690058
Yeah well guess what, I'm not responsible for anonymous making a big deal out of anything I post and acting like a bunch of fucking children because I have a name to my posts.

>>5690025
It's not the same thing as Kinzo being dead at all.
Kinzo being alive or whatever was never stated in red.


>>5690028
It's not a litteral meaning or whatever, it's just molding a definition for his own convenience.
Even the whole "Shannon/Kanon are killed", can it be called murder when it's just a personality dieing?
And Beatrice rejects that it could be suicide.

Actually the whole thing come from the fact that Ryukishi created a mysterious illness x like in Higurashi, except this time it's not brain parasites but a special case of DID which allow switching when they want and personalities killing each others and whatever.

And this is why Umineko completely fails.

>>5690036
>Erika IS NOT THE DETECTIVE so her viewpoint is FALLABLE.
But the seals are equivalent to the red truth, therefore she will immediately know if they are broken.

>>5690049
Autism.

>>5690070
I doubt anyone still think of Umineko as a good mystery.

>>5690099
The only reason we still read it is probably just because we already put so much time into it rather than it being good.

>>5690058
/jp/ not whine about something? Impossible!

>>5690069
That's simply what comes with having trip.
Make a few shitty posts and everyone will write you down as a faggot.
No matter how good your posts are in the future, nothing will ever redeem yourself.

You just realized this now?

>>5690131
The problem isn't that, I don't care what people think of me bro.

The problem is you people whine and make threads into shit on your own just because I post in them - and then try blaming me for it.

Enjoy shitting up the board and never admitting it was your own fault, as usual you worthless fucks can't accept responsibility for your actions.

>>5690099
It could have been great if R07 was consistent and didn't pull the personality can be killed at will.

>>5690168
You may be right in that it's everyone elses fault when they shit things up because of you even if you did nothing wrong.

But you do know that's not how everyone else will percieve things.
If a drunken hobo no one can stand (this isn't directed at you) enters a convience store in order to casually buy some groceries, and people are annoyed and make a huge scene, no one will blame themselves and everyone will blame the hobo even if he didn't do anything wrong at that time.

It's simply how the world works.