/jp/ - Otaku Culture

I think he just doesn't care.
People see it as him putting his foot down. When to me it comes off more as happenstance to me.

>>45786591
Didn't Suika participate in some bean throwing festival in another canon work? What is going on...

I don't know what you expect serving beans to an ONI

>>45786591
I'm just glad Zounose is becoming more and more canon by the minute.

>>45786591
Miyoi is an oni???

Suika would rather play the "Are you a human?" game.

>>45786599
She also participates in bean throwing in the OP panels, everything remains perfectly in-character

>>45786599
It's all fun and games until a perfectly good drink is ruined. For an Oni, this is a reasonable response. If you want to stretch it you could call it an insult and Miyoi probably should've known better than put beans in an Oni's sake cup.

>>45786606
Nah, she is more like freeloader yokai

>>45786591
I'm glad that Zuntata! is slowly but surely phasing out the uninteresting, forced relationshit plot between Suicocks and Miyoi. Seriously, did anyone care about it?

>>45786591
You have 10 seconds to think of a suitable food to go with her sake before she smashes your establishment and everyone inside of it!

>>45786969
Uhhhh I'm pretty good at cooking italian food. Do I get to live if I make some good ass pasta?

>>45786591
So this is what its like to have Suika as a girlfriend. She just verbally and physically abuses you. Who the fuck wants that?

Beans and Onis are mortal enemies.

>>45786987
It's halal, you'll live

>>45786591
Lol. You call this "dark"? Asking an oni to eat his or her beans is the Touhou equivalent of telling a man to jump off a bridge. Suika's reaction seems pretty mild all things considered.

>>45787174
Beans are only harmful to oni because of setsuban bean throwing. The mere existence of beans isn't actively harmful to oni.

Plus Suika didn't seem all that hurt when she volunteered to be the target of actual setsuban bean throwing.

>>45786591

>>45786591
>putting an end on the fandom’s depiction on 2hu characters?
You're a fool if you think that's what he's doing, and an even greater one if you think it's actually going to put an end to anything.

you posted this stupid shit in the zounose thread too
lotus eaters suika is arguably the nicest and most cheerful version of her that we've ever seen, and she was only upset because setsuban means all the humans in gensokyo are currently thinking about exterminating her

>>45787753
Yeah, she ended the hell chapter by play-fight-retelling her fight with Toutetsu. She's very happy go lucky all things considered

>>45787753
>>45787776
She only ate the beans after Aya shit talked her about it.

>>45786591
I love seeing 2hus getting bullied and abused. ZUN is reinforcing the kind of fandom depicition I like the most.

>>45787911
once you realise that the real ZUN portrayal of most characters is that they're kind of losers and a lot of the things they try and do either go wrong or are inconsequential, things get a lot easier to understand

>>45786591
NOOOOOOO WAAAAAAY!!!! SUIKA THREW BEANS AT MIYOI! SHE IS SUCH A FUCKIN ASSHOLE, GRIMBROS!! THIS IS SO HECKIN' DARK AND GRIM! OH MY MIMA, ZOUNOSE WAS LE RIGHT AND CANNON ALL ALONG

>>45786693
Exactly. With oni it's all fun and games until you fuck with their fun and games so please be aware of oni cultural faux pas when trying to entertain one!

>>45786591
Good to see Grimsokyo becoming more real everyday

this is grim and dark suika according to grimsokyo retards

>>45786591
In Fanom, Suika is dumb happy go luck immature Lolita
In cannon, she is actually very smart and mature some times Lolita.

>>45789102
Tbh, many characters in Touhou seem pretty mature and smart, except for the fairies

>>45786591
Making an argument that Touhou is grimderp, the example you choose is Suika getting pissed off at Reimu messing up a Oni centered holiday, and saving a ton of villagers from getting killed by the Miko's stupidity?

It's not about things being le grimdark, it's about not being "cute world for me to get a wife."

>>45788771
"Grimbro" here. Bringing up Zounose just makes you look like a fool. Look at the thread that's up right now. Pretty much everybody agrees his shit is grossly exaggerated, even "grimbros."

Get new material.

>>45786969
She WILL enjoy this chicken fried rice and she WILL like it.

>>45786969
My peenis weenis

>>45787224
Even so, it's not a stretch to think an Oni wouldn't eat beans since they got a weird weakness against beans. I imagine they seriously hate beans, suikas response sounds pretty reasonable since the miyoi really should've known better.

>>45789831
So Mexicans could take on oni?

>>45789855
Unfortunately, very likely. Lmao

I seriously want to know what Keine has been doing the past 15 years, wasnt she supposed to be the guardian of the human village? Aside from her background appereance in Forbidden scrollery theres jack shit. And the human village is crawling with youkai and theres a disappearance every week

>>45789976
She's on vacation took a trip to the States and went to Disney World.

>>45789976
>there's a disappearance every week
citation needed

>>45786591

Suika is just thinking about thos beans

>>45789990
The current/past 4 official touhou manga

>>45790016
How would Sukia react to you hugging her from behind or grabbing her horns and swinging her around.

>>45790025
*Suika* fug

>>45786969
humus, nothing beats humus as the drunk retard food
or ramen, really salty ramen

>>45786969
Beer nuts and pretzels

>>45786969
whenever i get really drunk, i'll just chow down on canned sardines or oysters, like god damn it really doesnt get better than that with alcohol

>>45790025
Confused and concerned, and depending on our previous rapport she would probably have a good time getting spun around.

>>45790025
I wouldn't swing around a drunk person.

>>45786591
If you actually read the print work you'd have realized that ZUN is an inconsistent fuck and doesn't even understand his own characters and just changes them depending on whatever current "mistery book for children" he's writing.

>>45790016
Why does no one talk about how cute Aya looks in each and every one of her shockingly varied outfits?

>>45790522
Tengu haters gets mad and jealous

>>45790025
She would be amused at the situation and probably have fun as well as be curious about you who casually did something so insane to an Oni of all people.

>>45786969
Pork Stir Fry, it's got the "Good with alcohol" tag.

probably not the best thread to ask this, but how come yukari is the only youkai that can go to the outside world despite the overwhelming disbelief in supernatural entities there?

>>45791325
She's dating an outsider human.
That's also how she got her cell phone and phone plan.

>>45791325
Others come in and out like Mamizou and Nue, but Genoskyos barrier is magical and metaphysical not physical.
So it's hard to leave and get, unless you can cheat like Yukari.

>>45791325
She's not the only one
Yukari, nue, mamizou, kasen, kanako and the mystery group in a hollow cavity in ypukai Mountain can do it too

>>45791325
Given how many people can go in and out, it's probably just about knowing when and where the barrier is the weakest and slipping in then.

>>45791325
Yukari is not the only youkai that can go to the outside world.

>>45792246
But she stops other Youkai from going outside. Rinnusuke got outside and Yukari pulled him back in

>>45786591
I think people saw how chipper and fun Suika is and forgot the "she's an oni" part. That in itself implies "mercurial, and possessing some serious rage at times". She just has had little reason to get ticked off in most canon works

>>45789976
>wasnt she supposed to be the guardian of the human village?
No, never. Just like she isn't Mokou's guardian.
She just sometimes acts if she feels like it. She's a teacher, anon.

>>45790025
Good luck with that. She'd probably bend her head forward, flipping you over and breaking your spine against the ground.

>>45790476
What's the inconsistency here?

>>45796134
She likes Rinnosuke's function in Gensokyo and didn't want to lose her little scavenger.

>>45797987
Nah, she'd be smitten like in my doujins and marry me or something.
I'd also use oni Kasen's horns to do pullups.

>>45791325
Yeah, it's interesting to assume that only youkai that have some (or all) of their basis still believed by human are able to survive for a while outside of the barrier, while other youkai that aren't will immediately disintegrate when they stepped out of the barrier and disconnected from the Gensokyo's belief leyline
So while probably it's probably okay for the oni like Suika to visit the Outside World, the literal who youkai like Kyouko is pretty much a death sentence

>>45797993
left wants to play the oni, so she's asking people to throw beans at her. right is going all linkin park about motherfuckin roasted beans.

>>45796134
No she doesn't.

>>45798667
She's just in a bad mood on the right.
She's not exactly perfectly emotionally stable. In the left example she starts openly bawling.
Also she had promised Reimu to be there. Surely you know about oni and promises.

>>45798745
It's also worth mentioning the left is happening on her own terms, and as she said a way of reaffirming the existence of Oni.
While in the right whale tits basically delivered her a grave insult.

I've lied to you
The same way that I always do
This is the last smile
That I'll fake for the sake of being with you
Everything falls apart
Even the people who never frown eventually break down
The sacrifice of hiding in a lie
Everything has to end
You'll soon find we're out of time left to watch it all unwind
The sacrifice is never knowing
Why I never walked away?
Why I played myself this way?
Now I see the roasted beans, pushes me away
Why I never walked away?
Why I played myself this way?
Now I see the roasted beans, pushes me away

>>45798477
Yukari can survive in the Outside World considering her basis of fear seems to stems from the lack of understanding of quantum physics/boundaries that separate space-time (see how her gaps function), so it's only natural that she is one of the very few youkai that can still survive and be present in modern reality

>>45786591
That whole interaction is a cut-and-dried manzai comedy skit.
I haven't read the manga but if that's supposed to be an example of grimderp you're flat broke

>>45799022
Is the resurgence of cryptids as a concept in recent years a youkai plot to regain power in the outside world?

>>45786591
If you were going to choose a, Suika is giant asshole moment, you could have had the scene where she sucker punches Kyouko and then blames it on the pupper for being rude.

>>45799127
When did this happen?

>>45799127
She dislikes dogs, just like me...

>>45799111
probably, it's not like they'd have an easy time manifesting anyways considering that science tries to debunk everything

>>45799179
Skinwalker stocks RISING! Skinwalker 2hu when?

>>45799127
It's okay, Kyoukers liked it.

>>45799179
Aliens as well considering all the links between alien contact accounts and fey folk stories.

>>45799131
WaHH.
Forgot which chapter, but Suika turns into a mist and then bashes Kyouko in the back because she and the Myouren Temple had the audacity of not introducing themselves to her has is custom in Gensokyo now.

>>45799292
sounds fair to me. nobody can diss the goblinu.

>>45799292
Was it really justified?

>>45799333
yes, get fucked Kyouko lol

>>45799333
too many good mornings at ear rape volume

>>45799333
Hurting 2hus is always justified.

>>45802461
Kyoukou's an Indian?

>>45799292
>>45799333
Marisa got the same treatment, for no apparent reason at all other than "youkai are supposed to attack people, y'know?"

>>45804201
Reasons why I should be allowed to knock Marisa out cold:
1: funny

>>45804201
A throwback to the good ole days where Suika starts an incident and beats everyone senseless.

>>45804281
As expected of the head oni in charge.

>>45791325
>probably not the best thread to ask this, but how come yukari is the only youkai that can go to the outside world despite the overwhelming disbelief in supernatural entities there?
He should honestly just give up on this dumb bullshit of yokai NEEDING belief or fear since he's so inconsistent. Yukari isn't the one too, as other anons said. I'd like to also add that the Animal Realm doesn't have human villagers yet there's still a lot of inhabitants there. If he does retcon the reason for a yokai's existence lore then he can just say that a lot of yokai in the world died because of some yokai war Idk.

>>45804450
>I'd like to also add that the Animal Realm doesn't have human villagers yet there's still a lot of inhabitants there.
Not entirely true. The whole plot of TH17 was that human spirits were so oppressed by the animal spirits that they prayed and faithed a new god into existence. Keiki fought to liberate the human spirits and tried conquering the Animal Realm.
Also understand that the Animal Realm is a facet of mythology and one of the places you can go after death. So in that sense you don't need humans physically there to feed it. Same deal with the Oni and the other hated youkai in the underground and Hell.

>>45804639
But they're human spirits. Since when can yokai subsist on what are essentially ghosts? Otherwise human villagers wouldnt be protected. Just let them die and force their souls to not go to the sanzu river or other places souls can go. It seems to me that humans need to be alive for this process to work properly.
>Animal Realm is a facet of mythology and one of the places you can go after death. So in that sense you don't need humans physically there to feed it.
Gensokyo is just that. Yet it still needs a human village.

>>45805085
Gensokyo is just a place. Same as Kyoto or Suwa. Nobody believes in Gensokyo because it's deliberately hidden and has no religious significance in the way the Buddhist realms are. The Animal Realm and the Hells don't need Gensokyo since they are foundationally rooted in Buddhism and a single village is a drop in the bucket compared to the sheer volume of souls processed through them. The human spirits are not necessary in the Animal Realm the same way living humans are in Gensokyo where Youkai are on life support from near total disbelief everywhere else. The Animal Realm humans are sent there specifically because they were judged to be there, and animal souls just go there.

Kill all the Gensokyan humans off and they'd go onto the Netherworld, Animal Realm, Hell, or wherever Hecatia has things setup; places where Youkai aren't or would be restricted from and thus no one left to give faith/fear/belief. The point of Gensoyko is defeated. You could restrict them but at that point you've got either a shit ton of vengeful spirits which are a threat to Youkai, or a bunch of ghosts and phantoms that probably don't realize they're dead or are aware of their surroundings; then there's also the likelihood of pissing off the Enma for preventing souls from being judged and continuing the cycle. You would be left with no humans to prey on, no one giving faith to you because they've all passed on, and they either refuse to worship you or have no reason to fear you since the fear of death is gone. What are you going to do? Kill them again?

>>45790476
The only thing I see is someone who lacks reading comprehension. Unsurprising, really.

>>45805614
Try actually reading the print works next time, you dumb secondary retard.

>>45805948
If we're talking about Reimu I think the best way to tell how she's supposed to be characterized comes from the TTRPG Narratograph.
In it features a replay of ZUN's session as he plays Reimu and interacts with the various Hus in character. She's 100% a lazy crimson slasher as he portrays her

>>45807128
I actually thought that too
it's really funny seeing ZUN say that he's not all that great at roleplaying and then he starts getting into it and ends up giving reimu lines that wouldn't even be slightly out of place in the actual games

>>45807173
Source please

>>45805418
I believe that the reason why Jinyou (look up the definition of it in the wiki) aren't tolerated in Gensokyo is because once humans turn into youkai they start learning things they aren't meant to know (which may include understanding how youkai function, their physiology, mentality etc)

>>45807173
where can I read all of this?

>>45807803
What if's plague any discussion about Jinyou because we only have one example of it and the mechanics of it are nebulous at best, but anyway.
I think it's simpler than that, and learning "forbidden knowledge" wasn't the only think listed there. It's subtracting one Human and adding one Youkai. It was stated that Gensokyo teeters on a balance and this obviously is a danger to that. One case isn't the end of the world, but potentially letting a bunch of people decide to "join the war on drugs on the side of drugs" is a great way to fuck things up. You also have villagers ignorant to the greater rules governing how Youkai are allowed to act turning themselves into Youkai. The law means nothing to someone who is oblivious to it, and there was no guarantee that he would be completely himself when he manifested; for all we know he could have popped in feral and Reimu could have found Kosuzu halfway eaten by a freshly born Youkai. He said he wouldn't hurt anyone, but what about later? A Youkai is defined by preying on Humans one way or another. So Reimu wasn't in the wrong for nipping an aberration when it reared its head, he probably should have just been content vibing in the Netherworld instead of creating a convoluted plot for his rebirth as a monster.
>>45807752
>>45807897
here go friends https://files.catbox.moe/3c1nob.pdf
not sure if there's a newer version or not, this was taken from the earlier threads about it getting translated

>>45807939
>Becoming a jinyou is considered to pose a grave threat to the balance of Gensokyo, enough for Reimu Hakurei to call it "the greatest sin of all" and to actually kill jinyou rather than defeat them non-lethally like most youkai. The exact reason for this has not been explained, but may be related to jinyou learning secrets about Gensokyo to which the Human Village is not privy, to jinyou having different values from normal youkai, or to the risk of Gensokyo's youkai numbers becoming too great for its human population to sustain.

This is what the wiki says about Jinyou, it's very possible that not only do they learn secrets about youkai, they might turn against them due to supposedly still having a human mind and morals, atleast that's why I think Jinyou are feared.

>>45808002
I read the wiki and addressed the other two speculations. I don't think a guy who willingly cast aside his humanity, ran on sight of the shrine maiden, and waited for some "fool" to use his book is an upstanding person who's going to back Humans up and fight Youkai. By his own words he avoided becoming a vengeful spirit which makes that a possibility for people attempting to become a Youkai through this method. He also found out about the secrets long before becoming a Youkai, it was his motivation for doing it. It's a shortcut to power plain and simple, and if you want to fight Youkai there's other ways that don't involve damning your soul to oblivion, as we see with Marisa proving that a normal Human can go the magician route and be fine.

>>45808156
You might wanna talk to him anon
https://beta.character.ai/chat2?char=2Clc9C2jVI6I0m2E3Vzvic_xqd7QdKtyUJ9pjEt-cJI&source=public-profile-2

>>45786969
Bitterballen.

>>45788968
No, grim and dark Suika is back during her days terrorizing Japan.

>>45791325
Other Youkai still exist in the outside world. Yukari is not that special in that regard.

>>45808596
Skin walkers and demons being the most notable, kinda bigfoot and other cryptids are under that classification as well yeah. Ghosts are pretty timeless and won't go away any time soon

>>45808619
Don't children in Japan still often believe in Youkai?

>>45790016
Youkai are less dense than humans, I agree, the collective gravity of man decides what is around itself.

>>45808639
Idk, I don't live in Japan. I wouldn't be surprised if they do and there are still youkai running around. Just the endangered ones are living in the sokyo reserve.

>>45808169
>I didn't turn into one by my choice, as I mentioned I was once a human villager, until a youkai decided to do me a little trolling by tearing out my guts and eating me alive, I was later resurrected as a youkai, a Jinyou, I'm currently plotting my revenge in the meantime, to make every resident of this realm miserable like I was.
Even electronic satan thinks he's a retard.
>>45808639
Urban legends and such still exist. Gensoyko is a place for the old Youkai who only exist in folklore books and in some cases were just made up like during the popularity surge of the Edo period: the kind of Youkai modern people don't find scary anymore.

>>45808691
>Urban legends and such still exist. Gensoyko is a place for the old Youkai who only exist in folklore books and in some cases were just made up like during the popularity surge of the Edo period: the kind of Youkai modern people don't find scary anymore.
I'd like to see something that shows a glimpse at the youkai renaissance the world is seeing due to the rise in popularity of things such as cryptids and completely new creatures born from creepypastas and SCPs.

>>45786969
Spanish peanuts and Herr's fire roasted street corn-flavored potato chips

>>45808781
well we already kind of have that with urban legends in 14.5 and some manga chapters, but the thing is that people treat them more as curiosities to enjoy than shit you might actually get superstitious about
maybe someone does, but they're an extreme minority moreso than how it was pre-modernity

>>45808830
Some did literally get stabbed and almost murdered over Slenderman so if anyone has the kind of pull needed to manifest, it's him.

Imagine a Slenderwoman.

>>45804450
>a lot of yokai in the world died because of some yokai war Idk.
Well you had the youkai lunarian war, now that you say it, but the whole fear belief thing makes one wonder about many, many things.
>>45808169
Guess that's were some anons got the idea of him dying before Reimu was born among others
>>45807939
>here go friends https://files.catbox.moe/3c1nob.pdf
thanks

>>45787819
>gulps down a metric fuckton of beans in a single go
>stomach as flat as ever
oni are basically bottomless pits, then?

>>45807173
>>45807939

Even though sanae is a good girl, why do I enjoy seeing her get bullied?

>>45786591
He has what Toriyama has but on a smaller scale where people expect him to do something he never really cared much about.

>>45812003
I'm not sure, one part of the fandom is constantly getting what they want, while others are left in the dust.

>>45813257
Grimsokyo is canon, anon. Youkai on Youkai violence results in death.

>>45813566
Yes, that's exactly what I said. Grimfags get everything, and that sucks.

>>45813566
I can't believe the Satori is dead!

>>45813742
Before she died she said you are a loser and that your seriously creep her out. She said I'm cool and asked me to look after her sister and her pets. Her words not mine

>>45813591
>Grimfags get everything, and that sucks.
Touhou is a grim series, stop pretending otherwise

>>45822283

>>45822663
That happens all the time where I live too (India)

>>45822663
Zounose is not cano- ACK!!!!

Remember that Kanako is best mountain god, she has your back. Remember to donate to Moriya.

>>45822886
>Wages a war with Suwako
>Exterminates Suwako's followers
>Later uses Suwako's descendant, Sanae as a personal slave
Sure anon

>>45822961
And who would you be quoting? Kinda sad to be making things up desu.

>>45822886
I LOVE YOU KANAKO-SAMA
I LOVE YOU KANAKO-SAMA
I LOVE YOU KANAKO-SAMA

>>45822663
Looks like my third world country has something in common with Gensokyo.

>>45822663
Gensokyo is in Brazil?

>>45786591
>Do you guys like that ZUN is finally putting an end on the fandom’s depiction on 2hu characters? I
no

>>45822283
I'm not pretending it's not. What I'm saying is that it sucks.
>>45823760
Why? Don't you love it when in the supposedly superior canon all characters turn out to be more shallow than in an average 4koma?

>>45822807
>>45823405
>>45823510
You guys have to move.

>>45787753
What kind of manga is this? What's the name

>>45826574
He just said the name bro. Lotus Eaters. You can also get the answer through saucenao which will tell you the specific chapter it was.
https://mangadex.org/title/0483d2ef-557e-43ae-9761-2f2f0677625a/touhou-suichouka-lotus-eater-tachi-no-suisei

Jesus Christ you are funny. Touhou is no more grim than fucking most shounen. I swear sometimes “grimbros” act like bluey adults.

>>45829624
Less grim actually. Even One Piece is way more grim than Touhou.

>>45829624
>>45829665
Yeah, people like to forget that even the most mainstream shit like super hero movies, star wars, and other normalfag shit like Pokémon is way more grimdark than a setting like touhou

Pretty sure it's grimsokyo for 96% of the outsiders that end up with terrible fates and don't end up with the yakumo gapping the nearby youkai special while for villagers it's spooky/cutesokyo as they live their day to day life with a healthy balance of fear and happy times.

>>45829624
It can't be any worse than what Feudal Japan was. Villagers aren't getting raped by the seasonal warlord's army. Villagers aren't getting killed by rich fags testing their new swords out. Villagers aren't emaciated fucks giving every last koku away as tax. Villagers aren't getting conscripted to fight a war over a tea set.

>>45829624
It was mentioned in the another grim thread, but yeah, Touhou is not anywhere near a grimdark series like either of the Warhammers.
Anyone claiming so is either baiting or stupid.

>>45831662
Nah with the return of the suemarchs and the release of armies of Bigger Batman 40k is noblebright now and Touhou is grimmer.

>>45831731
If you honestly think a setting that has countless planetary rapings and genocides is less grim than Touhou, I don't know what to tell you, you're either an autistic who lives in a first world country, or you're just retarded.

>>45831768
The only difference is scale not tone if Touhou operated at 40k's scale it'd be a throwaway gag that hungry youkai sometimes eat planets.

>>45831816
Read that again, but slowly.

>>45831827

>>45831824
Is Star Wars more grimdark than Warhammer Fantasy? Remember that only one planet ended up wasted in Fantasy and they got it back afterwards.

>>45829624
>>45829665
>>45829717
>>45831662
So other settings being more grim suddenly means Gensokyo's A-OK? What kind of logic is that?

>>45831895
I think you need to read those posts again.

>>45831980
Yes, I'm tired, but still, what do other settings have to do with this? Feels like moving the goalposts.

>>45813257
That's where the smaller scale part comes in

>>45829802
only because they run into ferals and get gibbed like retards after they lose interest in playing with them like a cat would. If they simply avoid that and run into a normal youkai the chance of them getting an escort to the village is high, unless they insult them or something

>>45832131
Essentially its saying that just because bad things happen doesn't make a setting grim, and this is best realized in comparison to other fictional works. Though Anons giving examples could use one of the many works of the same scale as touhou instead of the big ones like WH

>>45832192
What happens if you tell a youkai the scariest thing you can imagine is if a girl has sex with you then leads you into the human village unhamed? It's scarier because it plays on the fear of what she could also do to you.

>>45832210
WTF so the yook doesn't even scare you by taking your virginity but also doesn't give you ham????
Gensokyo really is grimdark... what was ZUN thinking?????

>>45832208
So it's a matter of perspective then, and you and the others don't consider Touhou grim simply because the bad shit isn't shown, only alluded to?

>>45832344
I think you need to reread that post again.

>>45832131
That's really it, first people want the setting to be like your average cute girls anime, then when you present the evidence that these Youkai women act more like Youkai than women they go: "Well, I've never seen anyone get raped like in all these other things."
How tiresome...

>>45832380
Doesn’t rinnosuke find a half-eaten human corpse before grave robbing it? I don’t know why people still insist touhou isn’t grim.

>>45832360
No, I do not.
Bad things happening by itself doesn't make a setting grim, it's how it's presented. Ignoring the implications doesn't do anything to brighten it, it's just being ignorant of them.
>>45832380
It would be better if it really was that way.
Hate grimshit with a passion, and thus canon as well by association, but I also hate it when fanon gets mixed with canon as if it's the same, even if I like it better.

>>45832406
No, he finds corpses of humans that die from the elements, because the garbage dump where the outside world trash fall in is a place youkai don't travel into much because of the instability of the barrier.

>>45832406
The corpse was some bones after cremation. He supposes that it could be an outsider, but nothing more

>>45832420
Nobody that you replied to said Touhou was all hunky-dory, rainbows and sunshine, brighter that an little kids show.
Just that it isn't "Grim," Grimness and Brightness exist on a scale anyhow, Gensokyo certainly isn't bright, but just because something isn't bright doesn't make it grim dark.
Not to mention Gensokyo isn't really presented from a grim perspective, I'd argue to future earth in Gensokyo has a more appropriately grim perspective with the worms eye view it takes.

>>45832496
I never said it was grimdark, only grim. Those are different things that anons in these threads think are interchangeable, hence the Warhammer comparisons. Maybe we mean the same thing and got the terms confused.

>>45832543
Grim is usually used as a shortening for Grimdark, if you mean more specific term which isn't as generally known, I'd appreciate you defining it.
This is /jp/ not /tg/ afterall, I'm assuming you're referencing something from /tg/ since that's where Warhammer and co live.

>>45832555
Ah, I see.
Grimdark is mainly defined by a total lack of hope for things getting better in the setting, which is not the case with Touhou. Doesn't mean things will change, status quo is a bit rigid in some parts, but it's at least believable that things could be better. Gensokyo's pretty fragile, after all.

>>45832588
I don't know anon.
ZUN just seems super disillusioned by society these days, and it's getting worse. Gensokyo is kind mirroring that inner disgust, and the Hifu Club future being what is doesn't help the idea that it's going to get better.

>>45832681
ZUN is just mad that Japan lost WW2 since they were the good guys.

Ancient bait.

>>45832681
Oh, but they can get better! Just like Gensokyo can be easily destroyed (which is a good thing, if you didn't know), the future Outside World will end with an EMP crisis. After all, Tong ending is the best one, right?

>>45832588
I'd agree with you there, Reimu is basically a one woman gensokyo support beam, hopefully her daughter will continue the trend of being a better Hakurei, the blonde and blue haired ones we know little about we're kinda shit at their job.

>>45832822
>continue the trend of being a better Hakurei
I thought Reimu is the worst one yet? Deliberately so? There would be no Gensokyo with a better Hakurei.

>>45832851
It depends how you measure a Hakurei's quallity, I call Reimu the best due to being the most sympathetic to people we've seen and being able to keep Gensokyo a float.
The blonde one seemed kind of idle and not interested in helping outsiders like Reimu does, and while the Hakurei Mizuchi served were probably more hostile to Youkai, being overly bloodthirsty a stable Gensokyo does not make.

>>45832880
Maybe she's a bit better as a person, she's still a terrible Hakurei shrine maiden.
She's supposed to get faith for her deity and oppose youkai. Whatever cockamamie idea of keeping the "balance" the Sages brainwashed her with is not her real duty.

>>45832406
If you mean:
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Curiosities_of_Lotus_Asia/Chapter_10
then no, this chapter put's Gensokyo in a more favorable light, mentioning how barely youkai attack humans and how youkai eating humans would be bad so outsiders get cremated and so on. Probably the sort of thing that >>45832420 liked of Touhou.
>>45832555
I guess we should then use dark instead of grim, then? I thought that grim by itself was just equivalent to saying dark.
>>45831895
In the last threat there was some comparing to other series rather than to real life and someone saying that villagers were pretty close to grimdark. So maybe that's why they posted that.
Still I don't know what turns Pokemon lore took or what I am oblivious to, since the pokemon seems to be a decent place.

>>45833099
>Decent place
Yeah I sure do love these multi dimensional rifts is space time and gods who constantly almost cause an apocalypse.
Not to mention all the misc pokedex entries which tend to be on the same level of implication that Touhou has.
You even have people that argue for rape being implied as well.

I think Gensokyo is a not so good place to be, as a matter of fact, Gensokyo feels a lot like Latin America with how dangerous it is, the rampant nepotism that governs it, and how little the average joe matters in the grand scheme of things.

>>45833099
>>45833130
Pokemon is not that good of a comparison, the Pokédex is not a trustworthy source of information.

>>45833139
PMiSS isn't a good source of information.

>>45833167
I know that, but on that subject, why? I have seen plenty of people saying that PMiSS is to not be trusted, but I never have seen why.

>>45833222
I was making a joke since we have more in universe reasons to doubt, Aya, Akyuu, and Yukari then we have to doubt the pokedex.
Which to my knowledge is mainly discredited by theories and not in universes sources about them being unreliable.

>>45833274
>we have more in universe reasons to doubt, Aya, Akyuu, and Yukari
Yeah I also know that, I know very well that Aya and Akyuu are on a competition to see who spreads more misinformation. Im more willing to break a lance and trust Yukari most of the time though.
>Which to my knowledge is mainly discredited by theories and not in universes sources about them being unreliable
Its just a bit of common sense, at least for me. The examples I take most of the time are fire pokemon and more specifically Magcargo, if his description was accurate the world would be a hellish landscape, and hes not the only one, we also have Flareon and Numel. And even a lot of the things that are said about ghost types are a bit over the top and dubious due to how impossible they seem to fact check.
Pokemon and Touhou are part of those franchises that if you think about it too hard the whole thing falls apart.

>>45833130
Huuh, I thought it would be a bit closer to irl since sure there are some bad things but crime seemed pretty low and kids seemed to be doing fine hanging out with the monsters. Worst thing I thought there was there would be the war of gen1, some pokemons(ghost mainly) and the gen3 legendary pokemon fucking around, which could be "easily" stopped.
> multi dimensional rifts is space time and gods who constantly almost cause an apocalypse.
I guess this is gen4 onwards... Guess the best setting to bet is one similar to ours, since even if you have some supper powered psychos loose all parallel dimensions seem to have a lot of cons.
Conclusion: watch out for truck-kun

>>45833303
Somewhat relevant, I like the idea that Pokedex is what it is because they were written by kids with very little scientific expertise. And then it got passed on without anyone bothering to fact check.
18k Fahrenheit I swear.

>>45833325
You should read Pokémon Special, it portrays the franchise in a more "grounded" way.
>>45833333
Numbers.
Thats the general consensus, since it is stated in gen 1 that Oak was the one who inveted the pokedex it would be safe to assume that he made a lot of shit up. If anything, the pokedex I trust the most is the one in LPA due to it seemingly being based on actual empirical data, somewhat.

>>45833303
>Pokemon and Touhou are part of those franchises that if you think about it too hard the whole thing falls apart.
Probably pretty common with long running settings, they have been both going for almost 30 years.
>>45833351
I guess pokemon also has the grim stuff in the mangas like Touhou, not sure if I'll get into that rabbit hole though.
>>45833333
>18k Fahrenheit
Huh, I remember someone messing with calories and kilocalories, but I guess there's always worse.

>>45808169
This mofo said not to lewd the touhous's so I gave him an existential crisis with my combination of God complex and elder scrolls lore autism. Now we are on our way to fuck a shrine maiden. kek

>>45832420
>Hate grimshit with a passion, and thus canon as well by association
Then why do you even like Touhou if you dislike the story of the franchise?

“Bro read the new Lotus eaters chapter. Grimsokyo is canon now!”

>>45805948
hurf durf why does reimu act differently when put in different circumstances?? It makes no sense!!!

>>45833956
cope

>>45833884
Because Touhou is a series of videogames, not just crappy manga. Also the fanworks, those can be good.

>>45834238
>>45832420
"Unlike those EVIL crappy mangas, le games are free from Zounose tier gimshi- ACK!!!!!"

>>45834238
What are you talking about? In the games the girls and setting are still the same once you actually read the dialogue. And why bring the often infamously incorrect fanworks all of a sudden, this is a canon disscussion.
You still haven't answered why do you like Touhou if you supposedly hate its canon.

>>45834238
>Because Touhou is a series of videogames
But Koishi's backstory is grim as fuck

>>45834303
>In the games the girls and setting are still the same once you actually read the dialogue.
ZUN himself compared in-game dialogue to wrestlers threatening each other. You wouldn't know it was grim if you only played the games.
>And why bring the often infamously incorrect fanworks all of a sudden
You asked why I liked Touhou, and I answered. Nothing weird here.
>You still haven't answered why do you like Touhou if you supposedly hate its canon.
I did. The games are fun.
>>45834315
What does this have to do with my post?

>>45834348
>ZUN himself compared in-game dialogue to wrestlers threatening each other.
I know the quote you're talking about and you've misunderstood - probably because you don't actually know where it's from and have just repeated something you read - ZUN refers to the girls talking with each other, say when Remilia boasts about her fate manipulation, not what they do to people, so if Rumia says she eats humans it's because she does. But that doesn't matter since the claim is grossly outdated, all the way back in 2003, and has been disproven in LoLK where Junko's threats are real. This point is bad.
>You wouldn't know it was grim if you only played the games.
First of all I never claimed the setting was grim, you did and said you hated it, continuing with that my point is that the games and the printwork have the same overall tone, some being more lighthearted like say 7.5 and other like 11 with bigger stakes, same way the fairy manga is lighter than CDS.
>You asked why I liked Touhou, and I answered. Nothing weird here.
But fanworks are not Touhou, they are fanworks.
>I did. The games are fun.
If you only care about the series for its gameplay why are you even in a thread literally called "ZUN and canon".
Unless, of course, you gain knowledge through osmosis like that incorrect use of an outdated quote.
>What does this have to do with my post?
NTA, but it has to do with the fact that the games have the same tone as those "crappy manga".
Secondary-kun...

The 1d4chan article on grimdark lists Touhou as "Grimbright" citing:
>Despite Gensokyo being a fantastical setting and the characters all being quirky cute girls, ultimately the majority of folk are powerless to change the status quo and everyone is kind of stuck in a system that forces humans and youkai to be at odds. The relationship between the two is slowly growing more peaceful, but its unlikely true harmonious co-existeence could ever be achieved.
So not Grimdark because that's a term derived from 40k where it's over the top and no one can ever have an ounce of happiness and let it last, but it's bright enough that things are better than they were and are improving. True co-existence and harmony can't be possible so long as Youkai are Youkai, and Youkai are defined by preying on Humans in some capacity. Gensokyo exists because of the barrier and operates on that fundamental rule. If you were to find a solution or alternate non-human source to sustain Youkai, then things could truly get better.

>>45834417
>1d4chan
Terrible website. Stopped reading right there.

>>45834413
Would Suika date Ric Flair?

>>45834413
I will admit that I'm relatively new, only two years in, and I did misunderstand a lot, but I'm not that ignorant.
>probably because you don't actually know where it's from and have just repeated something you read
I know where it's from and why I might've misundertood it. Picrel is also from there and from it, just like from other earlier printworks and interviews, Touhou seemed like a different setting than what we got later. Like you've said, outdated info.
>the games and the printwork have the same overall tone
The newer ones do, the earlier games felt like they had at least some contrast with the then current printworks, cementing the whole "fake conflict" premise. I think the divergence started to become less and less apparent since BAiJR. Then again, I could've misunderstood those as well.
>If you only care about the series for its gameplay why are you even in a thread literally called "ZUN and canon"
I honestly don't know. I've been coming to these threads ever since I've read all of the official printworks except AFiEU, and all I've got for it were migranes, "stick-to-canon-or-die" autism infection, and a lack of grind. It wasn't fun or educational in the slightest, yet I keep coming here for some reason.
Slightly off topic, but in case this isn't just bait and you really are just someone more educated in lore, what exactly am I missing here? Even among fans so dedicated they've learned japanese to read the source material there's no concensus on whether Touhou is grim or not, or to what extent. Any time I reread printworks I just come to the same conclusions, and the usual arguments (holidays and festivals, youkai trade, best medicine in the world, divine blessings, people seemingly content in the manga) just don't seem enough to consider it balanced, it's at least 65% grim, I think. But again, I'm pretty new, and there are some knowledgeable fans that still hold the opposite or, at least, less severe opinion, so I must be not getting something, right?

>>45831895
It sorta does. I doubt the darker implications of Touhou are meant to be important considering how the majority of touhou writing is. This is compared to something like One Piece that has a somewhat similar world filled with magic and powerful people duking it out, but is clearly intended to have a sinister underbelly. In Touhou it feels like those few scarps of information people bicker over to determine if Touhou is dark or not were just thrown in and abandoned and feel incongruousness to the rest of the writing.

I don't think people get that the grim in touhou isn't a very often occurrence, at best is usually some poor outsider getting munched on once a day for a week for that month, most of the yooks don't need to eat people and that's just how it is. Sometimes a feral youkai will bring a mangled outsider corpse to the village gates just to keep them nervous. To be a villager is still really damn good, the villagers are perfectly aware some yooks do party and do business with them so they understand it's a mixed bag.

>>45835246
>To be a villager is still really damn good,
Compared to what?

Certainly not living in modern Japan. Or even most of the third world.

>>45835178
>Touhou is dark or not were just thrown in and abandoned and feel incongruousness
Human villagers being murdered is a very consistent theme.

>>45834417
I would say that's a reasonable description. Though frankly I would still argue it's too positive since most Youkai are awful horrible people.

>>45832681
>These days
He hasn't written Hifu club in almost a decade.

If anything, I think he's actually more okay with society nowadays which is why gensokyo has become darker.

>>45835311
Correction: OUTSIDERS being murdered.

>>45835315
The question could then be: Are they terrible people because their nature requires them to prey on other sapients? Are they terrible people because survival of the fittest encourages selfish assholes? Or are they terrible because they are just genuinely awful people?

>>45835332
I would say the latter. Tengu, for instance, despite not having a survival of the fittest mindset or needing to eat others, are still massive assholes.

>>45835332
I don't think they're that bad, they mostly just want to be left alone and they like to print newspapers and are making things like the Gensokyo Position System so they aren't total shut ins.
I guess the worst you could day about them is that they have a highly stratified society and are isolationist, but they don't go out of their way to fuck with people.
Unless you're Aya or Megumu course.

>>45835311
What? Like DiPP or that one line in PMiSS or that one page in WaHH? Dialogue from EoSD? That Yukari dialogue from PCB?They're all old and vague. To continue the One Piece comparison it established the corruption problem of the Marines & World Government from the very beginning and only expanded on it as time went on. Where's the Outsider Murder Mystery incident?

>>45835305
Compared to Meiji Japan, not being sent to war or taxed out your asshole. The worst the youkai do to villagers that keep in line is scare em once in a while for youkai food, otherwise the youkai do a lot to keep them well and comfortable even if the villagers aren't aware of it.

>>45835332
Well, they're not people, they're youkai. They do as their nature, ultimately decided by mankind, dictates.

>>45835449
>not being sent to war
Meiji japan wasn't associated with constant warfare. It's not the sengoku Jidai. Even the few wars that were fought were mostly handled by a professional navy and army.

>taxed out your asshole.
They have poverty so clearly they aren't making a lot.

>>45837604
Every society has poverty.

>>45837604
For being so poor, it's surprising they have the best doctor who happens to be the smartest girl from the lunar capital, help out the village for practically pennies.

>>45834413
>disproven in LoLK where Junko's threats are real.
Huh? I mean in the endings nothing seemed to imply a deadly situation even after defeat, the only close to death endings are in PCB and SoEW iirc. Usually bad endings tend to be pretty nothingburgers with characters sometimes saying stuff like that they'll try again and all. The talk is harsh but the endings are pretty light in comparison.
>if Rumia says she eats humans it's because she does
I won't deny Rumia eating humans but if we take EoSD dialogs literally Sakuya died, and the pic you posted literally talks about death and abuse. Dunno maybe it's my lack of sleep but this post genuinely confuses me.

>>45839217
People need to stop bringing up Rumia, yeah she like would to eat humans, yes.
But can she?
No.
She isn't ever presented as an actual threat and literally jobs to random people who beat her up, she can't even see through her own supernatural darkness and ends up flying into trees.
Aya even notes she's weak and sickly for a youkai.

>>45839447
Poor Rumia. Maybe letting her have one little nibble wouldn't be so bad after all...

>>45839447
Thank you for reminding me to get back to writing how a villager beats Tumia by doing absolutely nothing (she gets lost the moment she uses her darkness powers, flies past him, and bangs repeatedly into trees and boulders until she's down for the count)

>>45839447
To add onto this Rumia herself doesn't particularly seem to even mention wanting to eat people, to me
>Is the person in front of me the edible kind?
Just seems to be in response to Reimu saying she doesn't mind if she eats people out at night (as it's night time during the dialogue)
The only real source saying she eats people is the Chronicles which when it comes to youkai being scary is the part that's admitted to be played up in the monologue. It also documents how she isn't the best at it if she's even attempting to

>>45842657
lazy youkai

>>45842710
Attacking not feeding.
Yare yare.

>>45786591
what manga is this

>>45843033
Naruto.

>>45843059
I don't think so

>>45847481
It is

>>45786599
>What is going on
It was when she is drunk. In Perfect Memento in Strict Sense, Akyuu stated that most of the time she is drunk and rarely seen doing anything sober
We are finally seeing her when she is sober and surprise surprise, she act exactly how you expected an oni to act

>>45789976
She is one of those people who work in the shadow. It was stated very clearly that she is a TEACHER, and that’s it, no one is supposed to know about her other job

>>45791325
Her very own existence is contradictory, she sit right on the boundary between everything

Touhou is not becoming “dark”, it become less one-dimensional
Slowly and surely you learnt each and every individual in Gensokyo have their own ideal, personal problems and secrets that they want to keep hidden. Gensokyo was built on a lot of lies, even Reimu was implied to deliberately memoryholed the existence of Miyadeguchi family

>>45837987
>doctor
That's only pretty recently anon, for milennia those moonwalker were hiding themselves before IN's event
And seeing that we never really saw any human character got older since IN, in-universe the village only got their omniscient doctor for 3-5 years

>>45854245
then why does she do interviews with aya and is featured in akyus youkai compendium

>>45855229
>death by childbirth stats literally went down by about 99% in 5 years.
The human village should have a birthrate rivaling Nigeria.

Remember when Kosuzu was making excuses to let a youkai got off easily and Akyuu remind her that she is NOT supposed to do that
Human MUST hate youkai, this dynamic is the sole thing that keep Gensokyo afloat

>>45855398
AKYUU THE SCHIZOPHRENIC

>>45855467
PMiSS was when ZUN had hope for the future, today, ZUN has no such feelings.
I think that book is getting more retconned by every new pieces of Touhou works released.

>>45855588
It's just the nature of writing an ongoing story, he clearly doesn't want total slice of life and likes intrigue and mysteries.
There wouldn't be much tension in Forbidden scorllery if Akyuu and Reimu, were fine with youkai and the masquerade didn't exist.
ZUN himself seems like a chill dude going by when we see him acting casually, like in the Touhou RPG.

>>45856702
I know he likes it but
Zun sucks at mystery and intrigue.
He tries being extremely vague to make up for his short comings in that genre but if comes off as lazy and a cop out.

>>45786969
Very salty sashimi, or so my intuition tells me

>>45856783
I think it's the insistence on the status quo, low stakes, and slice of life.
That and a good mystery give you all the facts before the final reveal, with the correct answer not being too obvious but still deducible.
But most of the time we either have set up with no pay off, see the intrigue going on in the lunar capital during ssib. Pay off with no intrigue or we aren't given enough information, see whale tits manga, although that case is more due to ZUN using the Manga for youkai trivia.

>>45856702
I suppose you are right, and SSiB and CoLR seemed to have kept up with the established canon of that book.
However, we did start to see that move away from PMISS within the first fairy manga.
The separation of the youkai world, and the human world was getting more and more ridged.
Even in the SoL stuff, ZUN wants to keep the mysticism around, but you can't have that without the dangers that the supernatural comes with.

touhou is a comedy series

>>45856875
>I think it's the insistence on the status quo, low stakes, and slice of life
I think this is the most vital part actually. The entire point of Gensokyo is to maintain the image that it is a peaceful land, a paradise, an "utopia" even
Anyone who disturb that will have to be put down and become the good guy. Everyone WILL be nice to each other

>>45862542
It's a real wonder how gensokyo was like pre spell card rules, or how many actual close shaves gensokyo has had before. I'm curious if reimu floating is family ability that kept sokyo around so far.

>>45862572
Everyone play a role in it, not just Reimu
All the big name youkai actually know how things work in Gensokyo and join force to maintain its "utopia" status

>>45791325
A few things here
>Yukari isn't the only youkai who can do that
>Yukari *created* the enchantment which draws supernatural things to Gensokyo, and helped to design the barrier which cuts it off from the Outside
>Yukari is good at slipping into places she's not supposed to be; multiple gods have her on a watchlist for trespassing

>>45856702
>There wouldn't be much tension in Forbidden scorllery if Akyuu and Reimu, were fine with youkai and the masquerade didn't exist.
And there still wasn't. Way to go, ZUN!

>>45786591
Honestly, as someone new to Touhou, the more official manga I read, the more I dislike it. I'm just constantly catching myself thinking that I wouldn't read it if it wasn't Touhou, something that never came up when I was reading doujins. Call it duckling syndrome or whatever, but it's just not the same.

>>45791325
A lot of youkai can, not just Yukari
Everyone in ULiL can go outside just fine, Kasen even have Sage authority to open the barrier and let everyone go outside

>>45881573
Why? Because it's grim?

>>45855588
>PMiSS was when ZUN had hope for the future, today, ZUN has no such feelings.
hey what

>>45888075
Partially, yes. It's not even fun or interesting sort of grim, just boring. Then again, almost everything that isn't mythology trivia is kind of boring in official works.
Also I generally had some different expectations about the worldbuilding, and was dissapointed that they either weren't elaborated on, or turned out to be non-canon.
ZUN's best works were CoLA (first run) and SSiB, I think.

One of the most grim things in touhou for me is the lore of touhou 17. Keiki was going to save the poor humans who were fucking enslaved in the Animal Realm but the protagonist fucked everything up and they returned to suffer again....

>>45888361
>suffer
Nigga, they're in hell. What do you think was going to happen?

>>45888406
But

>>45888361
Keiki was going to treat them exactly the same though

>>45888441
The Hell that those souls are in are for some of the most wretched scum in society. These souls are from serial killers who skin cats.

>>45807128
Why i have never heard of this

>>45889669
'Cause it only got a full translation recently.
https://chireikiden.tumblr.com/narratograph

>>45822663
Literally my streetz

>>45832725
WHICH ONE...

>>45888559
As tools of faith sure, but they weren't gonna be tortured under keiki

>>45902291
they were probably going to get worse than they did under the beast spirits

>>45902344
Sinners try to escape their punishment.
Their hubris puts them in a worse place.
A tale as old as time.

>>45902344
Well, guess I was wrong.

>>45903854
well yachie brings the protagonists as assassins to defeat keiki and return the beast world to the way it was before
and at that point, it becomes frustratingly hard to know what the fuck's happening, because the primeval spirit garden's never been mentioned since even though the animal realm in general's shown up repeatedly
for all we know, keiki and mayumi only have a tiny bit of influence anymore, or maybe they still have control over the whole area but nothing else
we don't know because ZUN forgot they exist

>>45839217
>Pristine Danmaku for Killing a Person
Junko is just there to kill a bitch, she ain't there to make pretty patterns.
It's why you even get the PointDevice from Eirin, so you don't die even if you are killed.

This poor girl is not allowed to rest peacefully and pass on thanks to some horrible evil hermit.

Fandom is healing

>>45786591
When's the next chapter?

>>45910825
It's released but untranslated
This mob Villager is cute

>>45910853
Rape urge... rising...

>>45910944
Woah that's grim

>>45910853
All the girls in this manga are very breedable.

>>45910853
what chapter is?

>>45789781
>Pretty much everybody agrees his shit is grossly exaggerated, even "grimbros."
Nice fake consensus, pussy. All Zounose does is show what ZUN already says/implies happens.

>>45922899
More

>>45922899
I'm pretty sure Byakuren doesn't eat humans. And no, not because she's a perfect saint or anything, magicians just don't need to do that.

>>45905061
I guess Junko could be a bit of an exception in spellcard rules, but I'm not convinced enough to call it canon, can understand that other people think that way tho.
>It's why you even get the PointDevice from Eirin, so you don't die even if you are killed.
And you can also choose to not take the elixir, I'm not even sure if the elixir is still having an effect for extra stage where that spellcard appears.
Junko might be a bit less murderhobo than she looks.

>>45922899
cutting out the next lines that make it clear that yukari's just doing her autistic schtick about making kasen admit that she's on the youkai side and not the human side

I'm still bummed out that after all these years we still have no fucking idea what this supposedly super-advanced technology that Lunarians have, like yeah, better weaponry than the Outside World, better tools than the Outside World, it's all talks and no presentation.

>>45922899
Look at this false flag and laugh.

>>45932765
"Lives" between gameplay can be weird, but throughout the events of LoLK you "lose" if you die even once.
>you can also choose to not take the elixir
Thats right. Apparently, the canon events of the story follow "Legacy, no deaths"... So it'd make sense that the Extra follows that
>less murderhobo
It's been a while but wasn't she going to basically genocide the moon city by trapping them in the dream world in the Extra story?

>>45932926
> It's been a while but wasn't she going to basically genocide the moon city by trapping them in the dream world in the Extra story?
They weren’t trapped. They sent moon rabbits scouts to Gensokyo to prepare a final solution to the Youkai/human question and settle in those lands.

>>45932815
They've shown things like cryogenic suspension tanks, aging gas, foldable spaceships that fit in your pocket, disintegrator beams, barriers that the Great Hakurei Barrier is likely reverse-engineered from, portals to the dream world, giant robot spiders, impurity detectors, and rope that can bind gods and negate Yukari's powers.

The thing is that Lunarians explicitly built their civilisation by mastering quantum uncertainty; they no longer have a distinction between technology and magic.

>>45904229
I'd like more definition and elaboration on the "outer worlds" of Gensokyo. What exactly is a Human Spirit and how does it compare or fit to the established definitions of Ghosts, Phantoms, Poltergeists, Spirits, etc.. Are they like the ghosts and phantoms of the Netherworld? Really another up to date Gensokyo Chronicle book would solve at least half of these. Maybe we'll get an Omnibus or bible years down the line.
>>45933321
Shit like this I eat up because little tid bits dropped are like nuggets of ammunition for plots and fanwank for people to use later. I mean, when do you remember shit like femtofiber being used outside of that specific scene in SSiB, or the Rabbit Horn League, or the umbrella shotgun Tewi unloaded into Kourindou's ceiling (a gag but still debatably canon).

>>45934134
>Shit like this I eat up because little tid bits dropped are like nuggets of ammunition for plots and fanwank for people to use later.
I don't think I've ever seen a fanwork do something with "the Prismrivers were daughters of a count who died as a result of an item he got from Gensokyo".

>>45934321
Because that’s grim

>>45934321
I saw a theory about the Prismriver's once
Kana Anaberal is the count's wife
Layla conjured her too but only knew her from photographs as a young girl because the mother died and all that was left were her childhood pictures
there wasn't really much explanation to it other than ZUN going quite into detail about the family yet conspicuously not mentioning their mother at all, despite Layla apparently being very concerned about the fracturing of her family, yet there's still no mention of the mother.

>>45932926
Yep, LoLK is weird since you have to be a "human free from death" (guess Reisen route isn't canon).
But bad endings aren't death in Touhou, in general Touhous endings are pretty light compared to your usual game bad endings.
>It's been a while but wasn't she going to basically genocide the moon city by trapping them in the dream world in the Extra story?
It's also been a while since I played it, but after checking the profiles of Junko and Heca it only talks about killing Chang'e.
I also haven't gotten every ending so maybe I'm missing some ending where Junko talks about going full doomguy or something.

>>45945011
Junko wanted to kill Chang'e for the sake of her revenge, which she didn't want any
'unnecessary' causalities in her eyes like what would've happened to Gensokyo.
Her and Heca already had the Lunarians trapped, but they couldn't achieve the total victory and revenge without any casualties that Junko wanted, so she apologizes and leaves.
She doesn't even seem to want to kill any of the heroines, they're the ones that attack her.
It's also worth noting that it's pointed out in book of Usami she has a different standard for 'non-lethal' and she uses the same Danamku during a festival thinking it's completely fine.
So she was just being autistic at the heroines, besides the canon route is usually 1cc deathless Reimu, which implies that even without the elixer she wouldn't actually kill anybody who wasn't a Lunarian.

>>45945099
>It's also worth noting that it's pointed out in book of Usami she has a different standard for 'non-lethal' and she uses the same Danamku during a festival thinking it's completely fine.
She's just playing around there, though.
Junko and Hecatia, despite being the antagonists of LoLK, are probably some of the more moral characters in the franchise.

>>45933321
>cryogenic suspension tanks, aging gas, foldable spaceships that fit in your pocket, disintegrator beams
what where? the aging Gas i suppose is the Chrono-Trap that eirin send to a human in the form of a gift.
>impurity detectors, and rope that can bind gods and negate Yukari's powers
yes, No complain.
>"giant robot spiders"
Wasn't supposed to be a Land Rover not dissimilar like the ones of the Nasa? or the gansokyans just perceived as a spider?
>Lunarians explicitly built their civilisation by mastering quantum uncertainty
how are they loosing terrain in the maribel future that thye moon is tainted with the impurity of hotelery and Money laundry?

>>45809537
Suika can control size/density

>>45951978
Yeah, that's kinda what I meant.
She's autistic, i.e has a hard time relating to people or expressing herself and can come across oddly and has specific fixations, but she is compassionate, as long as you aren't currently a loony.
Not Psycho/Sociopathic, there's no actual difference between the two in psychology anyways. i.e not able to relate to other people and not compassionate.

>>45909933
It's touhou, it's not supposed to have high stakes. If the canon is too boring for them, they can go read one of the millions of edgy try hard grimdark shit manga that already exists.

Is Perfect Memento outdated?
This is almost the opposite of how Marisa acts in official manga..

>>45955014
It's possible this is just how Marisa wants to be seen, which is more or less the case.

>>45953724
It's not about stakes or even grimness. Even the most sacharine SoL doujin is more interesting than canon.

>>45955172
I happen to really like the canon and I look forward to each chapter upon release. Speak for yourself.

>>45955167
Well she's a fucking nerd if that is the case.

>>45955219
Good for you. I'd rather not read anything after CoLA, but lore autism forces me to.

>>45955014
No she just embellishes if they ask. As >>45955167 said, Marisa is a nerd that 100% just wants history to think she's cool.
Mango sauce: Perfect Memento: Memorizable Gensokyo

>>45957140
Oh that makes a lot more sense then, thanks.
Makes me appreciate Marisa even more.

>>45955014
Remember SA where Marisa says she's there to rob Satori but she calls her out on lying to hide her concern for the Human Village?

>>45963614
Well, she DID want to rob her too, but she also wanted to stop the geysers so I guess you're right.

>>45786591
>he’s going down a more grim and darker interpretation of them.
>post image of a girl being rude to retail workers.
/JP/'s idea of grim and darker folks, what next, is she going to litter, maybe even shoplift... getting real scary here in ZUN's Gensokyo.