/jp/ - Otaku Culture

The fuck is this

You wake up and find you're the protagonist of Umineko.

What do you do?

>>4048742
ShKanon?

>>4048765
Kill myself for being in such a shitty story.

>>4048765
Rape the furniture.

The power of love

>>4048742
Allthesameshit.jpg?

>>4048765
Believe in the fucking witch so I can go home.

>>4048765
Jump out of the third story window

SHKANONTRICE

You may laugh now, but you won't laugh in 6 months.

>>4048765

This

>>4048765

Believe in magic.

>>4048765
Drink absinthe. See witches.

>>4048793
Wait, what? Shkanontrice? That just seems stupid...

>>4049021
Stupid but true.
Blame Ryuukichi07.

>>4049021
it isn't confirmed

>>4049056
Denial.

>>4049051
Other than the most retarded and far-fetched arguments, I have yet to see any sort of explanation for this. I would happily listen if someone sat down and spelled it out, but it look like that isn't happening.

>>4049051
Like the B0MB theory amirite?

>>4049072
Explosion was 100% confirmed in episode 6.

>>4049067
You probably missed lots of threads, easymodo exists for a reason.

>>4049067
You see, once upon a time a ghost rained brain parasites.
And they created 3 personalities in one body.
And it flips out and kills shit, while others play a game of pretend/

Ha, it's useless, it's all useless. So far I've heard the how and the who, but the WHY is never explained.

>>4049059
just wait till ep7 when deus ex machina will come and it will be denied, I can accept Shkanon, but a 3rd personality is just out of my actual perception of things
i even prefer Jessitrice and her disguised as shannon just to approach battler when she was young

>>4049097
Shannon is in love with Battler.
Learn that he loves blond with big boobs and an easy going attitude.
Decide to dress like this one day to seduce him.
Kinzo sees this OHHHH BEATRICE.
You can imagine the rest.

>>4049100
Just an advice, play the first part of episode 2 while seeing things from a ShKanontrice POV.

I can assure you you won't be able to deny it after that.

>>4049080
Not 100%. Maybe around 90%.

>>4049126
without the trice, of course I can.

>>4049113
See, the flaw here is that he has an actual blonde, Jessica.
And I wouldn't put it past him to go for his own granddaughter.

I can see Bernkastel making piece Shanon have sex with all the 3 cousins next episode.

>>4049139
because that's the most probable.Kinzo raped Jessica, she+Battler's conversations generated her second personality (which Beato couldn't deny in red in ep3)

>>4048765
Find the stakes, have deranged sex with them.

Feels good man.

Shannon had killed kinzo and servants before that time and blew up the boat from afar.
The events we see is her personalities dying out in internal conflict while she becomes more insane/sane.
Ep3 is about caving mentally to what Eva told her before these events and thus the weird mix of Evatrice is what survives and adopts Eva's position and raises Ange.

>>4049153
Yeah, I agree. I find the idea of Kinzo raping Sh/Kanontrice hilarious, not sympathetic. I mean, lol, tripolar!

Now just when could she have had a conversation where she found this out? Maybe another time we hear about another cousin talking about his type as well?

>>4049400
Oh, fuck, nice find!

>>4048739
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

>>4049419

Yeah I keep finding things like that now that I read back through (pic related, it's how Maria's rose disappeared).

Gentlemen, I am of the opinion that Kanonshannontrice is a bit TOO obvious. Do keep in mind that the fact that simply because Kanonshannontrice is not spelled out blatantly for us, it in no way means it isn't obvious.
An author knows his audience, and thus I propose to you that these SUBTLE hints which prove Shannonkannontrice may not be as SUBTLE as we assume it to be. Simply put, we are being served a rather delicious herring, one of the color red.

>>4049455
This is the 6th game.
R07 said that the 6th game would be the episode that would confirm the doubt of those who know the "truth".
It's fully possible given the latest development that the next game will be the last.

>>4049440
Hm, I've been doing something similar to what you have, but I haven't been as thoughtful as to provide such handy screencaps. But going through episodes 1-4, it is not Shannon and Kanon I find suspect, but rather, Jessica. Her ignorance of things she shouldn't be ignorant of, and her knowledge of things she shouldn't know, are quite striking....

>>4049473
Oh, you sure he said that? If you would be so kind as to provide a link to where he says that episode 6 will confirm everyone's doubt, that would be nice, because I don't quite believe you.

Yeah, by Meakashi-hen everything was cleared, except the massacre. And here, by the sixth episode, we only know who created Beatrice.
Next episode should explain why it's done. Even Bern said she did not solve the last part of the epitaph yet.
Then we can have a happy end in episode 8. Or not.

>>4049496
The last part is the BOMB.

>>4049473
He said it would confirm your doubts if you knew the truth, and confuse you more if you didn't know the truth.

Considering Shkannotrice being implied in EP6 is ridiculously obvious, I don't see how it could possibly confuse people. So I'm hesitant.

>>4049485
Yeah Jessica is damn suspicious. I boubt she gave Natsuhi that scorpion charm without a reason, and that's just for starters. But this whole "Kinzo raped her and she's mad" theory don't work for me.

>>4049507
yeah, i know. And i can see episode 7 ending with a huge [red]BOOM[/red]

>>4048740
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

>>4049498
>Yeah, by Meakashi-hen everything was cleared

I see what you did there.

>>4049517
This. The Shannonkanontrice theory is handed to us on a platter. And thus, suspect.

Jessitrice was disproved by EP6, guys.

It's not just about Battler referring to her in third person. Battler described that he likes Jessica's type. So he liked her personality as it was.

Whoever created Beatrice deliberately gives her a new personality to fit Battler's tastes.

>>4049485

Likewise. I've been suspecting her since the beginning of Episode 5 when we found out just who knew about Kinzo's death. Jessica, being the only other resident on the island besides those we already know about, HAS to know he isn't alive anymore.

>>4048739
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

You guys talk lke ShKanon was never suspect.
People could see that Battler never saw Shannon and Kanon together by episode 2.
And the Beatrice being another personality is actually obvious when you look at the way she interacts with Shannon and Kanon in the first part of episode 2, or how she kills them later.

>>4049537

And we don't know what her personality was back then. Even so, Jessica's personality reminds me of suit Beatrice, especially on the phone in Episode 4.

After writing four chapters, the world’s layout has become very firm, so the actual writing went very smoothly. Instead, the hard part this time around was “arranging the hints”. We want Umineko to be a product people can enjoy as they think, and we paid a lot of attention to the balance between making it fun to read and including the right number of hints. Our goal is to write a story which gives hints to people who don’t know the truth and reaffirms the views of people who do understand. We could have written it so that the truth was plainly clear and everyone could understand it, but we believe that might have effected how interesting a read it would have become. The other difficult thing was positioning a message to the readers that “it is solvable at this point”. In classic mysteries, the “sign” is always the time that the detective says “I know who the culprit is”. However, I think we failed to add such a sign in Episode 4. You really should be able to solve it as a mystery with the information given up to and including Episode 4, but because we didn’t give a “sign”, people thought “there aren’t enough hints yet”, and few people seriously tried to solve the series. When we saw this, we thought “yes, a clear sign really is needed”, and a “sign” appeared in Episode 5 as: “And then………I……knew.”

>>4049563
...We do know what her personality was like. Battler flat out describes it for us.

>>4049537
Meh, I'll take that scene with a grain of salt, as it's the coup de grace of the Kanonshannontrice theory. That's a snippet of a much larger conversation, after all.

>>4049576
you have no love.

>>4049537
You guys should keep in mind that the emphasis was not on "I can't be Battler's ideal girl, so I'll make one in my place", but "I can't love Battler anymore, so I'll make a vessel to house these emotions for me."

Beatrice was created, yes, to love Battler, but it was more for the human counterpart's sake than for Battler's.

>>4049609
Ooh. Delicious wincest detected.

How does this ShKanontrice theory explain the end of Ep. IV? No human is alive yet she's there and kills Battler.

>>4049613
Not really. I still think Jessitrice was thoroughly debunked by the speech in general, just clarifying that point.

>>4049563
Battler already said so in Ep. 1

>>4049609
Oh wow, now the tables are turning, and how.....

>>4049624
Bomb, she probably killed herself because Battler couldn't remember his sin but the bomb she had triggered still killed him.

>>4049609
>>4049636
Ooooooooooooh, you know, this whole NOT BEING ABLE TO LOVE BATTLER ANYMORE thing seems to be a hint....

>>4048742
>>4048742
Are you guys fucking serious........is this bullshit theory acually fucking true.

Shannon is Kanon....fuck me

>>4049609
Any source on that translation?

>>4049678
That wasn't a quote from the speech, it was a paraphrase.

If you want, I can post the whole speech translated.

>>4049668
Shannon is Kanon IS Beatrice.
Don't forget Beatrice you fool.

Also don't forget the BOMB that kill everyone left alive at midnight of the second day and the fact that everything that happen is actually a FANFICTION written by some greedy bitch.

>>4049678
i played it too, that was pretty much like that anon said.
ShKanon(?) created Beatrice because she heard Battler saying he's bad with domestic girls, he'd prefer girls that are easy going like Jessica, blonde and big busted.

>>4049688
I appreciate it.

If this whole thing was about some retarded teenage love between Shannon and Battler I am going to be royally pissed.

Surely it has something to do with Batller's shady family history. Why else bring up the whole Asumu/Kyrie thing and Ange?

>>4049714
Because if Kyrie win over Shanon, she'll snap and murder everyone.

Part one of lijanliang's summary is out
http://lijianliang.livejournal.com/7057.html

It looks like AuAu does just write down what she sees and not that she made the stories up herself.

>>4049653
Red text said there were no suicides in episode 4. Sorry bro, no die.
And once again, >>4049609
shows the truth of the ideal. Beato may be Battler's ideal, but she didn't come to be out of a desire to BE that ideal.

>>4049729
because that's basically what she does, also, being the witch of seeing plays made evveryone thought she was showing what she was writing, instead of just showing what she had just recorded and made a book, people just focused on the worst solution and stopped

So, if you guys think you have it all figured out, then who was the culprit in Ep 5?

>>4049653
"Yet I am here, now, and will kill you" in red.

No humans alive, the thing that kills Battler is Beatrice. How can she be ShKanon?

I'm so frustrated by episode 6...Both my favorite theory and my least favorite got a ton of support. I is confused.

>>4049710
Sorry for the wait, I'm trying to find it again. I forgot to save it.

>>4049745
>single culprit

herp derp.

EP5 doesn't even count, anyways. It's a farce and a fail.

>>4049749
Beatrice is Battler. Duh.

>>4049749
Because Beatrice is not a person, she's a set of rules, as stated in both episodes 1 and 6.

>>4049735
Actually it doesn't.
The red text only refers to Kanon for the suicide thing.

>>4049757
Who were the culprits then?

>>4049749
The bomb is considered "part" of meta-Beatrice.
Probably because of the epitath.

>>4049766

[red]# And right now, there is no one other than you on this island.
# The only one alive on this island is you.
# Nothing outside the island can interfere.
# You are all alone on this island.
# And of course, I am not you.
[red]

also the 5 dozen or so times it's said that Battler is not the culprit.

>>4049769
So, a set of rules killed Battler?

The bomb exploding at the end being part of that set of rules?

>>4049782
Once again, bomb.
What is so hard to understand?

>I'm a low tier translator, so take this with a grain of salt. I'm pretty sure most of it is right, though.

...Beatrice.
Listen carefully.
I will turn over my love for Battler to you.
Become the woman Battler desires.

I will give you the blonde hair he desires.
I will give you the blue eyes he desires.
I will give you the new personality he desires.
And... In place of me, love him.
And if possible, be loved by him.

I can no longer love him.
The feelings I could not obtain...the feelings I could not bear...please obtain them.

From this day forward, you are no longer the phantom of Rokkenjima who only plays tricks.
From this day forward, you are the ruler of Rokkenjima, and the one who waits for him to return until he fulfills his promise.

From this day forward, you will inherit that in my place.
Thus, from this day forward, you are no longer me.

I will push all of my suffering on to you... Please forgive me for being the only one to become happy.

From this day forward, you have the qualifications to detest everything.
You are the Golden Witch, Beatrice.

And someday.
Destroy everything, revive everything.
...Bless all lovers.

At that time.
...For both you and I to find happiness together...I will be wishing for from the bottom of my heart.

From this day on, you are not me.
From this day on, I am not you.
We will divide one soul, and share.
That naturally won't fill up one soul, but. (? not 100% sure about this line)
Surely it will allow (us/you/me? no subject defined) to see more dreams than a person.
May we be blessed...
My cute Beatrice...

>>4049729
Ugh..this is why I'll prefer to wait until translations are done before taking information from Episode 6. Because just about anyone can make something up for their own convenience or take it out of context.

>>4049794
>I will give you the new personality he desires.
So personality is confirmed to mean tits, then?

>>4049781
>>4049789
To expand.
The epitath ends with My Beloved Witch Beatrice.
In the Taiwan theory, it basically means B0MB.

If this is true, then the bomb is part of the "mythos" around Beatrice.
Therefore you can consider the Bomb Beatrice in a way.
That's how it works.
Meta-Beatrice can be more than 1 thing.

>>4049771
No, it specifies "suicides".
Here's the quote:I already proclaimed in red at the time that there were no suicides!!"

Suicides is plural. Not exclusive to Kanon.

sup guys, do you have an ep 6 download link?

>>4049804
It was about the third game, idiot.

>>4049794
How the fuck can you deny Multiple Personality Disorder thing after reading that?

>>4049824
We don't deny MPD, we deny the idiocy of having THREE personas.

>>4049794
what is this ?

>>4049835
that's right also some theories would actually tie loose ends better.

>>4049836
Shanon.

>>4049794
>Please forgive me for being the only one to become happy.

Bah. I was hoping there wouldn't be a line like that. Shannon...

>>4049854
TIPS ?

Okay. The biggest question I have about MPD disorder:

How would whoever created the Beatrice personality conveniently design Beatrice to look exactly like she does in the portrait? The portrait was put up two years ago, and it is heavily implied if not confirmed that this personality was created six years ago.

>>4049835
3 personas isn't any weirder than 2 personas.
Or do you think that Shannon is Beatrice but not Kanon?
Where the fuck does Kanon body always go then?

>>4049835

Indeed. Shanitrice is acceptable. Jessitirce is possible. Shkannonatrice is silly and accomplishes absolutely nothing.

No, seriously, think about it. What is accomplished by Shannon Kanon being one person that isn't accomplished by just believing they are the culprit, with probably help from Jessie.

>>4049864
Through the bathcan.

>>4049863
May be a hint to the sin and why Shannon/Beatrice has so much hate.
Kinzo designed the Beatrice in the portrait from Shannon disguised as Beatrice.

Basically Shannon isn't dressing like Beatrice based on the portrait, the portrait was based on her.

>>4049863
maybe that person died their hair blonde? Battler did say the person in the portrait looked like his grandmother with blonde hair or something like that in EP1.

I don't understand where Virgilia now fits into this mess. And what happened to this little girls wish? The one housed up in Kuwadorian doesn't even know the origin of her title.

>>4049864
Kanon is a girl and she puts on a Shannon wig to cover for her sister who then wears a Beatrice wig.

So, slowpoke here. Still playing EP5. I don't want to create a new thread just for this, so...uh, can someone tell me how much of the game is left for me? Right now I'm at the part where Hideyoshi cries because BAWWWW GEORGE IS DEAD ;_;.

>>4049883
Are you kidding me?
Except for the thousand of times that Kanon's body disappeared in the game; or his tendency to go ZOMBIE MODE.

It explains their weird relationship, the fact that they almost live in a symbiotic way, the way Kanon keep saying that watching over Shannon is his "duty", their whole WE AREN'T HUMANS thing, etc...

>>4049914
From the disguise side.
Shannon disappearing would have more sense.

>>4049836

Something that happens after the flashback MoeBeatrice sees.

>>4049908
Shannon was taken in when she was 6.
Kumasawa basically raised her.
Put 2 and 2 together.

>>4049914

You mean the two times his body goes missing. Unlike all the times bodies get picked up and dropped elsewhere, or vanish entirely, like in 5.

And the one episode where Shannon, Ghoda, and Genji claim to have seen him go zombie mode (in a situation which would have required Shannon not to look suspicious amid no less than two gender-changing costume changes.)

And the last proof is like trying to say magic exists because magic exists. Go fuck yourself in the ass with leviathan.

>>4049929
>Kumasawa basically raised her.

Where was this stated?

And that doesn't explain what they were doing in Kuwadorian.

>>4049926
Not if Shannon/Kanon is really a girl.

I like this theory because that mean Jessica is a lesbian.

>>4048741
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

>>4049933
His body disappears in episode 2, 4 and 6.

>>4049937
I think it was stated that Kumasawa always looked over her.
Who else could have raised her? Natsuhi?
Does she seem like someone who raised Shannon?
Kinzo? Yeah right.

Kumasawa and Genji were most likely the closest to her.
Kind of like Virgillia and Ronove for Beatrice.

>>4049947

Funny how it happens every other game. I wonder why. Still, I've always believed that even if Shkannon is wrong, episode 6 is practically built to make it seem right. Which makes this episode hard.


This is all very well and good, besides, but you're missing the point. Your saying that Shkannon explains the evidence you use to support Shkannon in the first place. It's ridiculously circular. It doesn't explain ANY other mysteries besides itself. It would be incredibly pointless for Ryukushi to do this.

I bet Ryukishi is seeeing us all with a trollface

>>4049966
You can explain EVERY closed rooms with this.

For the personal mysteries, well they are personal, I don't see why everything has to be connected.

>>4049958
But the question is still Kuwadorian's existence. The girl raised there seemed to be a rank higher than the servants.

So there's a Beatrice that died before the mansion was built.
- loli-Beatrice
- The Beatrice Rosa meets with and died in 1967.
- And the one that shows up in Episode 2 and 4 in a skirt.

>>4049980

Sure, you can explain every closed room with it. But you can explain all the same closed rooms with Shannon And Kanon as the culprit.

Them possessing the same body solves nothing.

Kanon status in episode1 : Alive.
Probably killed another servant to fake the bodies or Hideyoshi and Nanjo both knew about this.

Kanon status in episode 2: disappears. Calls Nanjo and Kumasawa afterwards and kill them outside. Later, while Kanon's with George, Beato personality take over, making her commit suicide.

Episode 3: Dead. Kyrie/Hideyoshi killed her in the first twilight and snapped out.

Episode 4: Alive. Cosplays as Beato. Suicides after she found Battler forgot her.

>>4049989

Frankly, there are a number of solutions to the closed room, this is hardly the only answer we've presented. Shkannon fags just ignore them and claim we do nothing.

So Kinzo raises a child to be his beloved Beatrice and then makes her his servant.
What the fuck am i reading ?

>>4049983
Who said that Kumasawa never brought Shannon there?
And why was Shannon taken in when she was 6?

Maybe Kinzo knew about her sickness and used it, making one of his personality believes she was a witch.
And that one personality was taken in Kuwadorian when she "awakened".

That would explain the 2 faces of Beatrice, the gruesome witch of the forest that learned everything from Kinzo and the ideal girl of Battler.

>>4049997

>What the fuck am i reading ?
When the motherfucking seagulls cry, bitch.

Say does anyone know what the final red of Umineko 6 was? Did Battler and Beato say "there are 17 people", or did they say there are "exactly/no more than 17 people"?

>>4050010
It was said in a definite way, there's 17 people.

>>4049983
Something to note is that the new Beatrice of Episode 6, the one created by Battler, initially speaks very much like the loli Beatrice from the beginning of Episode 3. As well, remember that Shannon was said to have acted more level-headed, more like an older sister, six years before. It's possible that the Shannon of the past was indeed more like loli Beatrice, but after separating "Beatrice" from herself, she lost some of the traits that she originally had.

...Those are my thoughts on the issue, at least.

>>4049997
it's explained that Kinzo treated Kanon better than his family in episode 6. They even were used to shoot weapons together, and Kinzo loved to play pranks on his family. Kanon helped him.

It'd be great if Shkanon were presented like Baron Ashura

>>4050010
What they said in red was "17人だ". So it was the former, "There are 17 people". Alternatively, you could translate it as "It's 17 people," if you're taking it as them correcting Erika on the count.

It sounds more to me like Kanon is not Shannon, but Shannon is Beatrice. The number of people on the island doesn't make sense, otherwise.

>>4049991
OP here, wow, this thread still up?
Yes, Kanon hauls ass to the second floor, dresses up as Beato, quizzes Battler, hauls to where Shannon is and dies.
OUR WONDERFUL SOLUTION, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN!

The issue with the Shannon/Kanontrice theory is that is requires Kanon to be a master of disguise. It's never stated that Shannon and Kanon look similar, so we can't allow them to be the same person just because, we need something to indicate he'd be capable of doing this. And even if you CAN prove there is enough foreshadowing to accept that Kanon = Shannon, we have NOTHING to indicate an ability to dress up as Beato. All of the MEAT of this theory is coming from episode 6, and that's not good enough for me. I hope it isn't good enough for you, either.

>>4050034
Actually that theory pretty much imply that there's a body double for Shannon.
Used in every episodes.
Never disproved either.

That's what Battler saw.

Doesn't say that Shannon/Kanon/Beatrice couldn't have killed herself in some other place.

Man Episode 6 fucked things up. Before even mentioning bombs was just a troll responce to the riddle while you got saged with "lol small bombs", and shkannon was a passing theory that was shot down several times.

Now it's more or less "hey wanna discuss episode 6?"
"Sure so what do you think about Aur-"
>Shakannontirce faggotry everywhere
>Beato is a bomb theory everywhere

/only/ 17 people?
In that case, I have a very big problem with Shannon=Kanon.

The most important part of the end of episode 6 is not only the declaration of 17 people, but Furudo Erika's previous statement in red, "I am the island's 18th person."

But there are only 17 people, right?
We can then change this to meaning 18th person=non-existant
Therefore, Furudo Erika=non-existant. I can't see any room for doubt due to her previous red truth.
But then that means there has to be enough people to fill out all 17 slots.
Therefore, Shannon and Kanon have to be two different people, unless there was some wordplay in the red truth of "there are only 17 people."
I hope this theory checks out.

>>4050021
> Kinzo loved to play pranks on his family
KINZO CONFIRMED FOR BEATRICE

>>4050034
Battler is the narrator, he barely interacted with Kanon and probably never got a clear look on his face.
He never could directly compare Shannon and Kanon either.

>>4050034
Battler never found Kanon's body during episode 4.
Remember how Beato was teasing him?
"Come on, Battler, put the blame on him just because you can't see his body!"

>>4050043
Body double? What is there to indicate Kanon would have access or possess a body double?

>>4050044
> "Sure so what do you think about Aur-"
Fuck yeah Super Hanyuu?

>>4050034
Kanon doesn't dress up as anyone.
The crux of this theory is that Shannon suffers from DID, with each personality having their own identity.

When you see Shannon, it's really Shannon, same for Kanon or Beatrice.

So then:
meta Bea = set of rules/bomb
piece Bea = ShKanon
golden land = giant explosion (small bomb is set in boiler room, small golden land mentioned in Ep. 3 is this bomb going off and causing massive boiler room explosion)
goats = flames and debris
main culprit = ShKanon + either George or Jessica (changes each game)
secondary culprit = fucking everyone (changes each game)

Is that all?

>>4050047
No, they didn't say "only" 17 people. They just said "17 people".

>>4050047
There's no "only" in the sentence.
And Erika could say her sentence clearly therefore her red text was true as well.
There is both 18 and 17 people on the island, and by that I mean strickly, not "more" or "less".

>>4050059

From what I've seen, Super Hanyuu is even more of a troll than Bernkastel, and is apparently the creator witch mentioned in episode 4s times.

auau

>>4050069
Pretty much, yeah.

It's over, Umineko is finished.

>>4050057
Kanon carries a big bag that could easily hold a body in the beginning of the first episode.
Her accomplice is a fucking doctor.

>>4050034
> All of the MEAT of this theory is coming from episode 6
Do I have to direct you to Ryukishi07's spiel about how he only gives hints to the readers at the start, and doesn't reveal the answer until later?

>>4050072

>Super Hanyuu

Oh god, is this what we're calling Featherine now? Is she going to be draw urinating on things now?

WILL SHE URINATE ON BATTLER'S FACE?!

>>4050080
god I hope so

>>4050021
Then why was he displayed crazy about Beatrice and not being able to be with her ?

>>4050080
>Is she going to be draw urinating on things now?
slow down arc. It's ok.

I like AuAu. I hope we get an doujin of her raping Ange.

>>4050074
It was a fucking bag of fertilizer that Battler was able to carry with no trouble. I highly doubt Kanon would have been able to properly fit a corpse in a fertilizer bag without destroying the corpse too much and without anyone being able to tell that there was a corpse in it, unless bags of fertilizer were much larger in 1980s Japan than they are these days.

Why the hell are you guys going on about ShKanon when it's clearly not possible?

If Shannon=Kanon then there would be less than 17 people on the island. What part of that do you not understand?

>>4050089
Because the Beatrice personality disappeared since Battler didn't come back.
Or something like this.

That's why nothing would have happened if Battler hasn't come.

>>4050055
>"Come on, Battler, put the blame on him just because you can't see his body!"

And now we can. How thoroughly unsatisfying.

>>4050094

Perhaps Battler was just really really strong. He is well built, after all.

>>4050098
Then who does Maria interact with all the time?

>>4050099
But who says Kanon has to be the culprit? Or at least, why would he or Shannon have to be the primary culprit?

>>4050070
Including Erika.

>>4050074
Kanon didn't even have the strength to handle a bag of fertilizer.

>>4050107
Whether it included Erika or not was never stated. And with red text, what isn't stated is even more important than what is.

>>4050096
What?
Are you retarded?

I still think Kyrie has something to do with the murders. Not being the culprit, but at least on some level is involved.

EP 6 she creates a closed room while fighting Jessica. The fact that she can create closed rooms should mean something

>>4050103
Yes, he is.

>>4050074
ummm thats fertilizer.

>>4050112
It was stated.
Erika : Hello I'm the 18th person of the island
Battler and Beatrice: Sorry but including you, there's 17 people on the island.

Both in red.

>>4050121
It's to be noted that the "sorry" isn't in red though.

there will be at least 2 culprits, maybe more. and nanjo/genji etc as accomplice.
like I said, otherwise neither shkanontrice or jessitrice or their variants can work.

>>4050121
>Both in red.
THIS CAN GO EITHER WAY THEN

>>4050128
Why couldn't ShKanontrice work?
Just one point would be enough.

>>4050080
> Featherine
> Feather-in

> Hanyuu
> 羽入
> the kanji for "feather" + the kanji for "in"

Also
> Augustus Aurora
> AuAu

And finally, DEM HORNS

So yeah, Super Hanyuu.

>>4050133
That's basic red text mindfuck.
Both are the TRUTH.
But semantic exist.

>>4050127
Nor was the "including you".

>>4050146
Actually it was, very clearly, you probably didn't even play it.

Just saying there's 17 people leaves plenty of room for an 18th person then. I can't believe Erika would be dumb enough to fall for that.

>>4050121

Does she really say "of the island?" Did Ryukishi really differentiate between "of the island" and "on the island?"

If so... eh, nothing but speculation. But interesting speculation.

>>4048738
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

>>4050146

Wait, so "including you" isn't in red?

RE-HE-HE-REAAAAAAALY? Cause that's kind of important.

>>4050153
I seem to be reading this incorrectly, because I have no fucking idea what you are talking about.

Hello protagonist. Your just in time for your wedding day.

>>4050154
No the statement is definite.

>>4050154
No, it was a shitty translation I made, anyways it's pretty definite too.

>>4050162
Keep in mind that Beatrice has started lines in white before and stated red text that's part of a clause that depends on the white, and said red text has been valid.

Okay..so someone's unrequited love for Battler created Beatrice, with those qualities that he described. Then the portrait is put up in 1986 or so.

But the problem is that not all 'Beatrices' can look the same in that case. When Rosa described the Beatrice that died, the siblings asked her if she looked like the one in the portrait and she said yes. And the same thing when the suit-Beatrice approached her and Maria in the rose garden.

>>4050166
I can easily just look at an island full of 18 people and say "there's 17 people on this island." It doesn't mean that there "ONLY 17 people."
And if he didn't say "including you" in red, that makes the statement even more suspect.

>>4050183
Reason wh Kinzo went crazy was because disguised Shannon looked very similar to his dead waifu Beatrice, probably.

>>4050183
Rosa is Beatrice.

>>4050183
In the former case, people's memories are not unchangable. 19 years had gone by, so of course Rosa's memories wouldn't be perfectly clear, and so if the Beatrice of the portrait looked similar enough...

...Alternatively, Shannon was Beatrice II's daughter.

>>4050188
He did also say that in red.

>>4050188
He said "including you" in red, why the fuck do you think everyone who read it is mindfucked?

How was the final red stated exactly?

Erika: I'm the 18th person
Battler: There are 17 people, including you.

And since "Erika don't exist" is pure bullshit that means there were 16 people in games 1-4. Kanon count as person but don't count as human allowing her to say that there are 18 persons but not allowing to say there are 18 humans/people.

But then according to ShKanontrice theory piece Beatrice should count as person too, just like Kanon so Erica shouldn't be able to say that she's the 18th person.

wait wait wait
"including you there are 17 people on this island" or "including you there is ONLY 17 people, no more no less" ?

Lambda's livestream is up.

EP6 anyone?

>>4050220
The former.

>>4050205
That's the whole problem.
The hint may be in the 19 > x > 18 that was repeated so many times.
Beatrice exists in the x.
Therefore she is a person who doesn't count as a person.
She may be a personality who doesn't consider herself to be human, or even a person.

Anyways the red text should clarify this in the following games.

>>4050225
we are being trolled big then

>>4050188
I see the argument you're making. 'Three people exist in this house' doesn't contradict the statement that 'Four people exist in this house' in some weird, barely comprehensible sense.

Not sure if it's meant to be read that way though...

>>4050205
don't forget that all the previous red texts regarding number of people was always "no more than 18", "no more than 17" IIRC this is the first time they say the exact number.

>>4050233

I mean, even if that was just a mindscrew to make Erika doubt her own existence, it doesn't force Shkannon.

>>4050237
if they were trying to deny Erika, they wouldn't include her in the count.

>>4050237
Erika was already dieing at that time, it was just a farewell gift to the tomb.

And it's a definite statement once again.
There's 17 people by Battler
There's 18 people by Erika.
Definite.

streaming EP6

http://www.livestream.com/teapartyofcertainty/old

>>4050248
She was denied as the 18th
It can mean that she is included within the 17 people.

Auau seems like a nice person.

>>4050271
They didn't deny her in any way or shape.
They just corrected her.
Even though her red text worked as well.
So you have 2 contradicting truths.

>>4050277
And make Bern the GM for the next game?

>>4050271
and when i say within i mean in mind

>>4050291
Bern is a nice person.

Next episode AuAu will revive Erika and together with Ange they will solve everything while Bern trolls the shit out of Battler.

Hopefully...

Kanon=Shanon is the only thing that can justify Erika being able to spit that red text. I mean, she was there for the whole night and she could not realize their doubles.

>>4050314
So what do you mean? ShKanon = 1 or 2 for the purposes of being counted as people in red text?

>>4050314
Red text must be true, regardless of what the person believes.

>>4050333
unless the person is playing on the human side. Which is why Battler had to withstand all of that Natsuhi trolling during episode 5.

>>4050342
The red text was still true, he just couldn't use it in the trial.

And Zepar and Furfur mention how furnitures can't count as a whole person because their souls' are incomplete.

>>4050365
3 down
which makes what ? 14 people on that asylum ?

>>4050365
Let's not get into this retarded discussion again. They count as people.

Person who thought the "including you" part wasn't in red here. I apologize for my mistake; I guess I missed that part being in red on my first time through.

Breaking the mirror activates the bomb.

>>4050362
The fact Battler couldn't use it, by itself, is enough to prove that red text at the human side can't be trusted without evidences.

>>4050380
For Erika, both of them count as people.
For Battler and Beato, only Shanon.

>>4050409
What does that mean? As long as it's true to you then you can state it in red?

So, I´m starting to think that blonde lolitrice from ep 2 is the real body, then she developed the Shannon and Kanon personans as she had to disguise while working in the mansion

Suit Beato and the beatrice from the portrait are actually her true appearance, while shannon/kanon are the wig/pad outfits

Genji considers himself furniture too.
Hell all the One Winged Eagle servants do.

>>4050420
Yeah. I suspect that Battler couldn't say he was Asumu's son because he also was not sure about this. I wonder if Rudolf told him something about that.

>>4050420
> As long as it's true to you then you can state it in red?
That's the whole point of red text. As long as a statement is true, even if its intended meaning is completely different from its apparent meaning, it can be said in red.

>>4048739
please cease and desist with your spamming on our board ano
n
ta
lk.c
om thanks in advance have a nice day many hugs from tiny loli

>>4050429
episode 3, sorry

>>4050445
No, Battler couldn't say he was Asumu's son because he is not Asumu's son.

>>4050447
>even if its intended meaning is completely different from its apparent meaning

That's something else completely.

This has just boiled down to a philosopher saying that each personality of a person suffering from DID is its own person and being able to state it in red while someone else says that it's only one person and stating that in red. How can they both be valid?

>>4050445
No, he thought he was Asumu's son. Rudolf never told him anything about his birth origins beforehand

>>4050456
Wait. Yeah. So even if Battler believed he was born from Asumu and that was 'true' to him, it wasn't the TRUTH. So he wasn't able to say it in red anyway. wtf.

>>4050460
I'm guessing red text avoids philosophical debate by allowing both sides of the debate to be true?

So Beatrice was right and Kanon can use magic to clone himself and become a little girl, right?

>>4050485
No. Kanon was already the little girl.

>>4050478
"If a tree falls and no one is around, it makes a sound."
"If a tree falls and no one is around, no sound is made."

The way red text seems to work, both could be stated in red? eh...

>>4050496
That's not proper philosophy, though, because it's something that can actually be proven.

>>4050496
What does it land on?

>>4050460
I call Devil's Proof.

>>4050502
And I say someone with multiple personalities is still just a single person that's just suffering from a mental illness.

"Battler, i think i'll be killed tonight"
(Maybe i'll have to tell everyone that you are Kyrie's son and she'll fucking kill me for changing the babies because Asumu lost her.)

"huh... wat"

>>4050518
They're a single person, yes, but each personality, if distinct enough, can be treated as an individual "person".

>>4050521
Okay. But then why can't it be consistent between Erika and Battler? Is everything colored by perception? Does truth not exist in this world?

>>4050529
...because Ryukishi was trying to write a cool last scene?

So how about the red text that states Kinzo only exists inside Natsuhi's bed. Is Kinzo's corpse hidden in Natsuhi's bed?

>>4050529
> Does truth not exist in this world?
There is a truth. But only those who have reached it know what it is.

>>4050520
> because Asumu lost hers
...Are you serious?

>>4050529
It may... but you're a fool for thinking the red text is truth. It's barely better than blue truth.

>>4050543
IIRC it's not "only exists", it's "only can exist"

>>4050560
Depends on who's using it, really.

So for MPD lolitrice

-Kinzo brings lolitrice from an orphanage to be Beatrice III
-Lolitrice meets Kumasawa (Virgilia´s vessel)
-Pony theory happens (or anything that forces kumasawa to hide lolitrice from kinzo)
-Lolitrice disguises herself as Shannon and starts working at the mansion, one day she meets Battler while not in disguise, then promise happens
-Lolitrice finally abandons Lolitrice´s persona completely and becomes Shannon, then later she creates Kanon´s persona
-Suit Beato is actually Shannon´s real self awakened, it takes over completely after the "death" of the other two personas and asks Battler about his sin

>>4050556
Not confirmed, but there was some foreshadowing for that. Like Kyrie saying she'd have forced Rudolf to marry her if Asumu'd lose the baby.
...if that end being the truth, Rudolf made her suffer for 18 years.

>>4050586
> Lolitrice finally abandons Lolitrice´s persona completely and becomes Shannon
I assume this happens at the same time she creates "Beatrice" as a separate entity.

while some months have 30 and some 31, how many months have 28 days?

one? february? WRONG! all of them have 28 days, and some, indeed, have more.

>>4050623
So, in other words... a total of four different personalities? The original, the Beatrice personality that was created using aspects of the original but primarily made to suit Battler's tastes, the Shannon personality made from the remnants of the original, and the Kanon personality?

>>4050640
Needs more personalities.

>>4050640
believe me, it will increase.

>>4050640
you forgot the BOMB Beatrice. Probably because she's always silent and never appears.

>>4050683
I assume she's represented by the goats at the end of Episode 2.

>>4050683
That's bullshit man. How can someone love a bomb?

>>4050705
small bombs

>>4050705
Hey, people can love body pillows, and EP6 Battler isn't exactly the most stable person in the world.

Somebody created a new thread, in case anybody didn't notice.

>>4050692

Krauss fighting Goat-kun: Krauss removing the rubble.