/jp/ - Otaku Culture

reimu ain't got money, she can't pay and convince humans to become mercs and start purging youkai, remilia probably still has a treasury in the mansion, could definitely pay the humans to usurp reimu

>>38871889
>remilia probably still has a treasury in the mansion, could definitely pay the humans to usurp reimu

She probably wouldn't engage in such behavior.

>>38871706
As long as they are tame and friendly, except Rumia, I'd have no problem hugging them

>>38871706
Well they aren't as bad as us Humans but they still are lazy cunts. Especially considering most of them haven't done anything important or special in the thousands of years they've lived. Worthless is what they are.

>>38872878
>Worthless
Wrong, it is possible to procreate with them, and considering many of them are gorgeous girls, it wouldn't hurt to say that a youkai girlfriend can be useful

>>38872914
> many of them are gorgeous girls
They are gorgeous girls because they choose to be. They're shapeshifters anon.

>>38872939
Well in your opinion, why do they choose to be gorgeous girls? Clearly there gotta be a reason, perhaps it is to lure outsiders in?

>>38871706
Youkai aren't Human nor Animals, which means no law ,International or not, applies to them. So I can do whatever the fuck I want to them and I wouldn't be in any trouble whatsoever.

>>38872968
Youkai abuse is cruel anon, be kind to them

>>38871706
>Youkai
Glorified Delusions is what they are. Nothing but a Parasite created by the Lunarians whose days are numbered and now are desperately trying to survive in a World that has long since overcome and forgotten about them.

>>38871706
Well they treat Humans better then we do which is pluse point but they are a danger to be and thus need to be eliminated

>>38873028
They are only dangerous if you piss them off

However, cat.

I'm going to impregnate satori

>>38871706
Do not ask, 'Why kill the Youkai?' rather ask, 'Why not?'

>>38872957
It's to lure in outsiders so they can eat them

>>38874309
>so they can eat them
In what way?

>>38871889
Why doesn't Remilia just bribe Reimu into letting her do as she pleases?
That whore of a miko would probably even sleep with youkai for money

I would be pretty fun to kill Youkai by just reading a fucking physics/science book.

>>38873935
Rumia is an asshole she probably murdered hundreds of innocent humans

The chance of a youkai killing me are lower than the chance of another human killing me, so I don't see a reason to exterminate them.

>>38874588
In Gensokyo or in real life?

>>38874639
>real life?
Silly anon, youkai still exist in the outside world, just much more rarer

Mamizou and Nue are examples

I never can tell which of the two sides in these arguments is worse, the megalomaniacs who are clearly in it for some romantic/familial hogwash they've deluded themselves into believing and are more than willing to commit character assassination a thousand times over just to better outfit their personal fantasies, or the local anti-Youkai brigade who not only directly fuel the common human-Youkai dichotomy but regularly prove that humanity, as per usual, can only blame themselves for any and all misfortunes that befall them.

>>38871706
Satori is very huggable

>>38874571
I've always imagined that someone who was stubborn enough to not believe in youkai, even after seeing them, would probably be immune to a lot of their attacks (or even be hazardous to their health). Basically they could beat a youkai by being oblivious.

>>38876202
You wish it was that easy but it isn't the case unfortunately, otherwise outsiders would be impervious to youkai since they don't fear and believe in them to begin with, they get eaten in lore whether or not they know about science physics

>>38876202
By the way, encountering a youkai would be much of a shock enough, considering they are humanoid but aren't quite human in appearance (colorful hair, unusual clothes and eyes, fancy hats, some species even have animal ears or some extra limb of kind, like the satori's third eye)

>>38876580
>colorful hair
Nowadays lots of people have colorful hair.
>unusual clothes
Goth lolita isn't all that rare.
>eyes
Contacts
>fancy hats
The cuteness and sillyness of 2hu hats is otherworldly, so that may indeed surprise people.
>animal ears or some extra limb of kind, like the satori's third eye
This will be shocking, except for Reisen's ears, that look completely fake, and Orin's 4 ears, that just look dumb.

>>38876815
what about a fucking mermaid?

>>38876815
>Nowadays lots of people have colorful hair.
As far as I know it's not common for people to have vivid hair color like purple with pink eyes, green hair with red eyes or other colors, besides black or brown hair which is the norm

You would atleast recognize the "person" infront of you is not normal considering the unnatural hair color, so it will still be shocking, not to mention combining that with all of the other factors you mentioned

>>38876833
As I said, that will be shocking.

>>38876901
>As far as I know it's not common for people to have vivid hair color like purple with pink eyes, green hair with red eyes or other colors
Go to an anime convention or a college campus in the US and you'll see a lot of blue, purple, pink, red and green hair.
And if the villagers don't realize that Sekibanki is an youkai, I don't think that they are all that different from humans.

>>38876833
marisa ate her

>>38874488
in a vore way.

>>38874823
100% the youkai simps.

>or the local anti-Youkai brigade who not only directly fuel the common human-Youkai dichotomy but regularly prove that humanity, as per usual, can only blame themselves for any and all misfortunes that befall them.
The common human-Youkai dichotomy ended with genocide. The few surviving Youkai managed to find a new home elsewhere and instantly went right back to their old behavior. The only mistake humanity made was sealing them away rather than going in for the final kill. A sin of which the human villagers are innocent, by the way.

>>38882635
what're you going to do geralt, call up yukari so you can go into gensokyo and massacre all the youkai?

>>38882635
I would not know, ideologue, you seem like you greatly enjoy doing what humanity does best, which is justifying any action you deem 'necessary' with whatever 'logic' you are willing to employ in the moment.
>The common human-Youkai dichotomy ended with genocide.
Sure it did, on both sides. From what I'm seeing here, it's the people who are vehemently anti-Youkai who, by necessity, 'believe' in Youkai the most, which, from my limited understanding, would mean that they are the greatest boon for the continued existence of these Youkai. I'm sure you're not mad enough to be clamouring for death and destruction because you enjoy death and destruction, right?
All of this being said, of course, the other side is willing to completely mutilate someone's character, human, Youkai, ghost or whatever else, because they are desperate and the mutilated version fits their tastes better. Between the typically human rhetoric of justifying anything by claiming it is for the sake of some large, nebulous group like humanity or for the greater good, as though everyone were intimate with such a concept, and murderers who hide behind some skewed and extraordinarily sexual definition of love, I would rather not participate.

>>38874571
>kanako doesn't exist and im retarded :)

>>38871706
Extremely marriable satori is extremely marriable

>>38882924
> Kyouko doesn't exist and im retarded :)
Also Kanako doesn't go around explaining Science to the fucking Villigers.

>>38882910
this shit is getting so nuts

>>38871706

>>38883172
No idea where kyouko came from. Anyhow it wouldn't really be neither bad nor hard for her, keine already teaches pretty advanced if unnecessary things in her classes so you would just need to ask her to add stuff in the curriculum. And its not unlike Kanako to actually want to advance Gensokyo for the benefit of the villagers (while also taking whole credit for it so ultimately for her benefit). Remember she was the one to install a whole little tram system so normal humans could go to moriya shrine. Or how sanae is also educated in science but is still a fully capable miko, and godess.

Or how the lunarians were fully capable of advancing science without ever outexplaining themselves out of existence or becoming mortal. What I'm trying to say is that science and mystic in touhou are not opposed in any way.

What? Yumemi? don't be silly!

>>38882736
Nothing because Touhou is fictional.

Duh.

>>38882910
>which is justifying any action you deem 'necessary' with whatever 'logic' you are willing to employ in the moment.
How so?

>From what I'm seeing here, it's the people who are vehemently anti-Youkai who, by necessity, 'believe' in Youkai the most, which, from my limited understanding, would mean that they are the greatest boon for the continued existence of these Youkai.
Eh... not really. At least, not in Gensokyo. Most of the human villagers are clearly anti youkai. But they also can't exactly deny they exist because... well, they exist. It's hard to pretend they are fake when they probably visited your shop the last day. The rare few times they do receive proof about something though, like the Kyouko echo thing, they will quickly change their mind.

It's easy to forget this as well but I'm reasonably sure the people in Gensokyo that actually know that Youkai are affected by human believe can be counted on one or two hands.

>I'm sure you're not mad enough to be clamouring for death and destruction because you enjoy death and destruction, right?
No, not at all. I want Youkai gone because they are evil serial killers. Yeah, there are a few good ones out there but those are 100% the exception rather than the rule.

>>38871706
Based OP, fuck anti-youkai supporters, they deserve execution for wanting to kill those adorable youkai girls and women

Cute youkai sisters

>>38893268
>Nothing because Touhou is fictional.
If something is fictional you can pretend to kill it forever, as opposed to what exists, which can only be destroyed either superficially or a limited number of times.
>How so?
People can and will justify anything, and they will do it from a purely personal perspective since they cannot (or at least, the vast majority cannot) posses a greater one. This will rarely stop them from claiming that they do what do for something universal.
>Most of the human villagers are clearly anti youkai. But they also can't exactly deny they exist because... well, they exist. It's hard to pretend they are fake when they probably visited your shop the last day.
People in our world could deny that things such as pain, movement and change exist in the strict sense. There were very few such people, which is only natural, but they were around. If anything, convincing a mass of people that something fairly outlandish to their sensibilities is correct will likely never happen. If they're all primarily anti-Youkai, then Youkai need to exist otherwise they will have no target for their negative opinions. If Youkai are primarily feeding off of human emotion and belief, positive or negative, then it is completely impossible to wipe them out since those are both intrinsic aspects of man. No amount of scientific explanations can ever get rid of fear, especially the fear of death.
>No, not at all. I want Youkai gone because they are evil serial killers.
All three of those words are from an entirely human perspective. What element is there in a Youkai that is not more present in a man? The average person I am willing to wager is just as covetous, just as violent and just as uncaring as the average low level or young Youkai, and merely stop themselves from acting out all of their impulses either because they do not have the opportunity to or they are too cowardly to do it. Is it in terms of quantity? Even then, man has had a long history, and has performed extremely cruel acts and punishments that only seem more bearable because Youkai are callous about human life while we like to make someone's death a solemn occasion. Is it the potential to do evil? Again there is little difference. Is it something in their nature? They are more prone to it, we can say, but nearly every living creature has a propensity for violence and killing.
>Yeah, there are a few good ones out there but those are 100% the exception rather than the rule.
I think some of the older Youkai have admirable traits, they seem fairly self-aware, they don't always care about pointless human formalities which makes them seem brazen but also allows them to be more honest, and as you say, some even start to exhibit less strictly Youkai-like traits.

I want Satori to read my mind and then totally ignore me while I silently long for her scathing hate-filled glares!

>>38882618
Get out of /jp/

>>38897664
thank you anon

>>38895993
>People can and will justify anything, and they will do it from a purely personal perspective since they cannot (or at least, the vast majority cannot) posses a greater one.
I can think of zero reasons to spare Youkai from a non personal perspective.

>then it is completely impossible to wipe them out since those are both intrinsic aspects of man
Uh, no. It doesn't work that way. Youkai basically have been wiped out outside of Gensokyo. Only a tiny handful remain and most of them are either dead or dying. More so than that, anything going on it the outside world seems to have no bearing on the Youkai of Gensokyo. Who are the problem to begin with.

>What element is there in a Youkai that is not more present in a man?
A consciousness, empathy, intelligence.

Most Youkai are sociopathic women children. You can argue humans can be similar, but that doesn't change the fact that most of them are not and never will be. Youkai are just evil, in every definition of the word, and what little intelligence most of them has only serves to highlight that.

>Is it in terms of quantity?
When it comes to deaths only a handful of dictators can match most Youkai. And, even then, most of those were way more hands off than somebody like Yukari.

>Is it something in their nature?
Evil IS their nature, at least for the most part. The few Youkai that can be called good either have a totally different far more human nature, or worked hard to overcome their nature.

>I think some of the older Youkai have admirable traits,
Some of them, arguably. And then you have somebody like Yukari or Yuuka, a child serial killer and a violent brute respectively.

>>38905491
> When it comes to deaths only a handful of dictators can match most Youkai. And, even then, most of those were way more hands off than somebody like Yukari.

I don't really care about this Youkai debate but I can't agree with this one. Humans tread other Humans far far worse then any Youkai could ever hope to do.

>>38905491
>When it comes to deaths only a handful of dictators can match most Youkai.
What the fuck are you talking about. Hitler alone probably caused more overall death than the youkai have in centuries

>>38905491
>from a non personal perspective
I wonder how you managed to get access to a non-personal perspective considering that you are unable to be anyone other than yourself.
>More so than that, anything going on it the outside world seems to have no bearing on the Youkai of Gensokyo.
Brilliant, now they're even immune to the tyrannical powers of reality itself, a great position to be in.
>A consciousness
You mean a conscience I hope since I see no reason to believe that all Youkai have a basic animal-like consciousness or no consciousness whatsoever. Moreover you misread what I wrote, as it stands you're implying that Youkai have more empathy and intelligence than humans.
>sociopathic women children
Again, from a human perspective. How come you call them women when you admit in other places that they only take that shape? If you answer that it's out of convenience, you are not helping yourself. And children, please anon, why should they be bogged down by your likely ridiculous idea of what an "adult" should be, especially since you have a human adult in mind? What, contribution to society? Performing "great deeds"? Working for the sake of others? Some of them are completely free from such considerations and I think they are much the better off for it.
>You can argue humans can be similar, but that doesn't change the fact that most of them are not and never will be.
On the contrary, I would argue that most humans are and in fact must be evil, and are worse than plain evil by trying to hide, justify or present it as good, unaware of the cycles they perpetuate.
>When it comes to deaths only a handful of dictators can match most Youkai
Quantity is not the best way to view suffering I feel. What you say is completely ridiculous either way, even if we do not limit ourselves to individuals, humans have been killing each other for as long as we have existed. Youkai simply could not be able to compete with that, unless you want to claim they influence people into performing evil deeds, but that starts to resemble western conceptions of demons or evil spirits more so than Youkai in the strict sense.
On a similar note, if you really want to play the quantity game, the amount of animals we purposefully raise on a worldwide scale exclusively for our own consumption should put us leagues, leagues above Youkai in terms of callousness towards other lifeforms.
>The few Youkai that can be called good either have a totally different far more human nature, or worked hard to overcome their nature.
Just like people then.
>Yukari
I can't quite deny that, Yukari is cunning and hard to pin down, decently Youkai-like in a traditional sense.
>Yuuka
>a violent brute
Ha ha ha.
Excuse me for having been cordial with you up to now. I wonder how you plan to justify such a shallow, childish reading of potentially the most free-spirited character in the entire series. Hopefully not in the same way as everyone else would.

>>38906376
I think hitler had a lot of help bro

>>38916042
Yeah, it was all me.

>>38906376
See what I said about "hands off".

>>38909403
>I wonder how you managed to get access to a non-personal perspective considering that you are unable to be anyone other than yourself.
It's called empathy.

>You mean a conscience I hope since I see no reason to believe that all Youkai have a basic animal-like consciousness or no consciousness whatsoever.
I meant conscience, but frankly I doubt they have a real consciousness as well. They don't seem to have souls, after all. They are basically walking ideas.

>Again, from a human perspective.
The very same perspective that created Youkai.

>How come you call them women when you admit in other places that they only take that shape?
Because it's funnier than saying man child.

>And children, please anon, why should they be bogged down by your likely ridiculous idea of what an "adult" should be, especially since you have a human adult in mind?
Because they literally act like bratty teenagers. I'm not saying they aren't mature because they lack maturity, though they do, I'm saying they are (wo)man children because they act like children.

>Some of them are completely free from such considerations and I think they are much the better off for it.
Considering they use their power to spread misery and pain, I would disagree.

>On the contrary, I would argue that most humans are and in fact must be evil
Then you would be incorrect. Don't feel too bad, it happens to the best of us.

>humans have been killing each other for as long as we have existed.
There are also way, WAY more humans than Youkai. It's a moot point.

>Just like people then.
Incorrect. Humans have human nature, and are therefore at least somewhat good.

>I wonder how you plan to justify such a shallow, childish reading of potentially the most free-spirited character in the entire series.
Combination of her pc-98 dialogue and Perfect Memento. It's possible the former is no longer canon and the latter might not be accurate, but even her dialogue in Flower view shows her as a immature brat lacking in any real wisdom.

>>38871706
What a slut.

>>38895993
>All three of those words are from an entirely human perspective.
So how does that at all make humans wrong in thinking youkai are evil? By human standards, yes, kidnapping people to cannibalize them is pretty evil. Though unless we truly get a gauge on how "good" of a person youkai are in general, we'll never really know if such behavior is the norm or just an outlier, so advocating for the genocide of ALL youkai is very extreme though quite fun.. Especially with "good" youkai like Kasen, Kogasa, Keine, Kyouko, Byakuren, etc. existing.

And what about being a serial killer is a perspective-based thing?

>>38909403
If you're gonna bring up livestock animals, I'd like to point out the many differences between sentient and sapient creatures. Humans, and presumably most youkai, celestials, lunarians, devils/demons, gods, ghosts, etc. are sapient creatures. Livestock animals are not. Humans treating cows with callousness is very different from youkai treating humans with callousness.

>>38926235
>So how does that at all make humans wrong in thinking youkai are evil?
It does not make them wrong from a human perspective, sure, but admitting that as the primary perspective means that you cannot claim higher authority without better argumentation. Similarly Youkai may believe that humans or some other group are evil from their own perspective, clearly showing that, as far as worldly perspectives are concerned, evil and good are incapable of ever being wholly separated.
>And what about being a serial killer is a perspective-based thing?
Humans do not think up or use terms in a vacuum, and certain terms have specific and occasionally implied meanings that make hypothetical situations such as this a little stranger. A Youkai can be a killer, but I would not strictly call them murderers unless I thought their killings were unlawful or unjustified. Similarly, calling someone a serial killer brings up specific images, and the term is fairly recent all things considered, often with certain psychological connotations. I believe people may regularly use it for emphasis, simply to make someone's actions out to be worse because a stronger term was used.
>Humans, and presumably most youkai, celestials, lunarians, devils/demons, gods, ghosts, etc. are sapient creatures. Livestock animals are not. Humans treating cows with callousness is very different from youkai treating humans with callousness.
You are right, it is very different. If humans, who are sapient, thus capable of higher order thinking, thus superior in every way, have purposefully created an entire gigantic complex that subjugates, controls, breeds and kills millions of lifeforms which are lower and less intellectually capable than themselves, while fully aware of this, then what Youkai do is certainly different. When phrased like that, it seems that we are potentially much worse. When phrased like that, it makes the Youkai seem almost justified. Not fully, of course, using that argument would not make them too different from humans punishing the unjust (who often kill) by killing them. Most people probably believe that killing is a relative evil, in the sense that it can and should be done depending on the circumstances.

>>38918956
>It's called empathy.
You can't seriously be telling me that empathy allows you completely adopt another's perspective, you only have vague ideas that are almost always filtered through your own that can roughly align with the perspectives of others.
>They don't seem to have souls, after all.
I don't know the particulars of this, but if they can be judged after their passing and go to heaven or hell, that would mean they do have souls, would it not?
>They are basically walking ideas.
I find ideas to be exceptionally powerful.
> I'm not saying they aren't mature because they lack maturity, though they do, I'm saying they are (wo)man children because they act like children.
You've just restated the same thing without giving a single reason of any kind in support of it. Not to mention that you apparently think being childish and lacking maturity aren't the same thing.
>Considering they use their power to spread misery and pain, I would disagree.
You could say similar things for groups of humans but instead claim that they're working in their own interests. How then would you be justified in any greater way than "my interests are against theirs, thus we must have conflict"?
>Then you would be incorrect.
No, that would be you, my friend. You are not thinking quite well. There are many actions that most humans need to undertake over the course of their lives that can and will lead to a great amount of evil.
>There are also way, WAY more humans than Youkai. It's a moot point.
What do you mean it's a moot point when it easily shows that we are worse in terms of quantity, trivially so? In terms of quality that has to depend on whether you're like me and find cowardice and pseudo-justice worse than being upfront that you mean someone harm, that you are going to kill and eat them and will even grant them the dignity of doing it yourself, personally, without any chain of command or other administrative considerations.
>Incorrect. Humans have human nature, and are therefore at least somewhat good.
This is just a difference in perspective. I doubt you'd want to go into an argument about what something as vague as "human nature" is actually meant to mean, but if you believe that human nature is fundamentally good, and I believe it fundamentally is not, there is little likelihood that we will see eye to eye on the matter.
>Combination of her pc-98 dialogue and Perfect Memento. It's possible the former is no longer canon and the latter might not be accurate, but even her dialogue in Flower view shows her as a immature brat lacking in any real wisdom.
Hahaha, it's incredible how easily Yuuka filters out the mindless and incompetent, even after all these years. Notice how you barely have the guts to mention her dialogue in Phantasmagoria, where she hardly ever means any genuine harm to absolutely anyone, the only instance of her getting legitimately invested being when Eiki confronts her, and for good reason. You are unable to scrounge up one single good example of what you are talking about. What are you going to do? Quote that tired genocide line, from the game where everyone else does the same, some for even worse, less upfront reasons (Mima)? From PC-98, where nobody takes anything very seriously? The line that is true in the literal sense, and puts the blame more on the player for letting it all happen than on anyone else?
Even your vague references are trite, in LLS she's just silly, in MS she's even more silly but nobody is willing to see it, in PMiSS Akyuu describes her as dangerous and someone not to be trifled with but goes out of her way to explicitly state that she will only take interest in or attack you if you purposefully provoke her (unlike a great number of Youkai) or are strong/interesting yourself, and that she is generally well-mannered without external compulsion, in Phantasmagoria she is the most stable character of the entire cast, shows superior understanding in nearly all of her interactions and gets no more upset than the others do.
No real wisdom? Absolutely hilarious, anon, what would you know of real wisdom? What you call being "an immature brat", out of jealousy, as a coping mechanism, or some other clearly lowly and negative feeling, that is freedom, freedom from cares, freedom from worries, almost true freedom, and unyielding self-confidence. If you cannot see that, I have nothing more to say.
You've piqued my autism. Consider carefully whether this is worth prolonging.

>>38926598
>If humans, who are sapient, thus capable of higher order thinking, thus superior in every way, have purposefully created an entire gigantic complex that subjugates, controls, breeds and kills millions of lifeforms which are lower and less intellectually capable than themselves, while fully aware of this, then what Youkai do is certainly different. When phrased like that, it seems that we are potentially much worse.
Hmm, good point. I suppose there's just no moral way to justify our genocidal anti-youkai crusades. A shame.

>>38927683
>You can't seriously be telling me that empathy allows you completely adopt another's perspective,
It allows you to understand the perspective of others well enough that thought and knowledge can fill in the rest.

>but if they can be judged after their passing and go to heaven or hell, that would mean they do have souls, would it not?
We don't know if they do. The only hint we have is that Eiki still think it's worth telling Youkai their sins.

>You've just restated the same thing without giving a single reason of any kind in support of it.
They are bratty, stupid, lacking in understanding, and insanely selfish. They believe themselves exempt from consequences, and think the universe revolves around them. In that regard, they are no different from children.

>You could say similar things for groups of humans but instead claim that they're working in their own interests.
You could make that case for some groups of humans. Serial killers, for instance. Guess what, we lock up serial killers.

>There are many actions that most humans need to undertake over the course of their lives that can and will lead to a great amount of evil.
Like?

>What do you mean it's a moot point when it easily shows that we are worse in terms of quantity
Because on average most Youkai are significantly more murderous than most humans. 90% of youkai are murders while only about 10% of humans nowadays harm anything other than insects.

>In terms of quality that has to depend on whether you're like me and find cowardice and pseudo-justice worse than being upfront that you mean someone harm, that you are going to kill and eat them and will even grant them the dignity of doing it yourself
They don't even do that. Most of them will happily toy with a human they caught until they get bored of them. Most liking stringing them along until the very last moment. They are liars through and through.

>This is just a difference in perspective.
It's not. Youkai have no perspective other than a vague imitation of human morality. All of them that act based on a actual morale code are inherently copying humans.

Morally, there is no argument not to kill all youkai. Practically, there is no reason not to kill all youkai. Hell, even biologically there is no reason not to kill all youkai.

>>38927683
>Notice how you barely have the guts to mention her dialogue in Phantasmagoria, where she hardly ever means any genuine harm to absolutely anyone, the only instance of her getting legitimately invested being when Eiki confronts her, and for good reason.
She still acts and thinks like a immature brat. Because that's what she is, there is not a shrewd of wisdom of intelligence to be found. If you disagree, show me the quotes where she displays real wisdom and understanding.

>in PMiSS Akyuu describes her as dangerous and someone not to be trifled with but goes out of her way to explicitly state that she will only take interest in or attack you if you purposefully provoke her (unlike a great number of Youkai) or are strong/interesting yourself,
It also makes it clear that she has no morale code. She believes in nothing and simply does as she pleases. She will protect flowers from any harm, but also has no issue with people that kill flowers. She values politeness, but loves to rub people the wrong way.

>>38926598
>but admitting that as the primary perspective means that you cannot claim higher authority without better argumentation.
It is the only perspective. As I said elsewhere, Youkai have no perspective. They do not believe they have a different perspective, they are instead gleefully immoral.

>A Youkai can be a killer, but I would not strictly call them murderers unless I thought their killings were unlawful or unjustified.
Their killings are inherently unlawful and unjustified, they even admit as much. They just enjoy it anyway because, again, they have no morality.

>When phrased like that, it seems that we are potentially much worse.
Incorrect, it shows humans to be far more morale insofar that they are able to understand differences in intelligence. Otherwise, I could just as easily argue youkai are no different for killing billions upon billions of molecules and bacteria.

>>38871706
Agreed, youkai can be great wifes for hoomans, especially considering they don't physically age so they will forever stay beautiful in appearance

>>38871706
https://www.pixiv.net/en/artworks/96844537
Youkai can do amazing things that human women cannot.
Human women are boring and ugly. Say no to them and marry youkai women.

>>38937111
Based af

>>38936946
But you are mortal yourself - wouldn't it be cruel to leave your wife behind by dying?

>>38937282
Just turn yourself into a youkai at some point in your life, that way you won't leave her, ez

>>38929557
If you are so bloodthirsty, why not dispense with morality all together?
>>38931217
>It allows you to understand the perspective of others well enough that thought and knowledge can fill in the rest.
Thought and knowledge can never fill in enough of the rest to truly give you the full perspective of another.
>They are bratty, stupid, lacking in understanding, and insanely selfish. They believe themselves exempt from consequences, and think the universe revolves around them. In that regard, they are no different from children.
Again I must say that most humans could fit this. But so that we don't repeat the same things endlessly, I will say that not all Youkai seem overly stupid or lacking in understanding. Some lesser Youkai often gave me the impression that they're just living their lives without much thinking, which is normal for most lifeforms, while the more cunning are certainly more dangerous but also potentially more aware of things. That said, I don't think most Youkai are brilliant or deserving of praise, I would not make such sweeping statements, but like humans, a few exceptional examples can come through.
>Serial killers, for instance. Guess what, we lock up serial killers.
Serial killers do work against the interests of a larger group of humans, but they are humans still. The general, and probably "best" response to a Youkai would be to prevent them from harming the interests of humans, which would likely often require sealing or extermination. That is on the level of a group, but on an individual level I would not agree with absolute devastation, as killing always affirms the effectiveness of killing. In the short and even long term it may be beneficial, but in the longest term it may not.
>Like?
This will depend heavily on what you think is evil, necessary evil, neutral and so forth. All lifeforms have to kill and devour other lifeforms to prolong their own lives. All action must be followed by some consequence. This is why, if I am not misremembering, life itself can be considered a sin in Buddhism, as life necessitates action, and action necessitates the accrual of karma. To go further, most things require their contrary to take over eventually. Life leads to death, happiness cannot strictly exist without sorrow, and so on. You might not consider these necessary processes evil, but most people would agree that they're bad.
>Because on average most Youkai are significantly more murderous than most humans. 90% of youkai are murders while only about 10% of humans nowadays harm anything other than insects.
I don't think that's strictly true, humans may not directly harm more than insects but they do indirectly support operations and complexes and similar that lead to a great bit of harm. That may not be as bad as actually committing murder, of course, but it does end up depending on what you think. Is the desire to commit murder evil? Is acting out that desire more evil than the desire itself?
>Most of them will happily toy with a human they caught until they get bored of them. Most liking stringing them along until the very last moment.
I am not 100% sure of where this may have been stated in canon so I cannot say much. Regardless, many real world torture methods were likely intended to cause as much pain for as long as possible, and likely not for the purposes of pleasure but as a statement or warning. Death may not always be the worst fate.
>It's not. Youkai have no perspective other than a vague imitation of human morality. All of them that act based on a actual morale code are inherently copying humans.
One can be moral without having a moral code enforced on them. Humans themselves often copy one another. I feel as though the number of people who reason out their principles is quite small.
>Morally, there is no argument not to kill all youkai. Practically, there is no reason not to kill all youkai. Hell, even biologically there is no reason not to kill all youkai.
Morally, if I think all killing is wrong, as Buddhists do (they made exceptions), I would not agree. Practically, you are right, but practicality has always been banal. Biologically, Youkai are more spiritual than biological so their extinction technically could not do much to alter ecosystems. Being spiritual, however, their extinction would be difficult indeed.

>>38931256
>It is the only perspective. As I said elsewhere, Youkai have no perspective
That would mean that Youkai literally have nothing through which they see or filter their experiences and thoughts. Do you mean to say that Youkai literally do not exist? That none of them have a self?
>Their killings are inherently unlawful and unjustified, they even admit as much. They just enjoy it anyway because, again, they have no morality.
But according to what law? Human law? Of course, but why should they operate under human law? When they overstep their boundaries measures are taken, and if you believe they've greatly overstepped their boundaries with Gensokyo, fair, I can see it, but if you think they have no boundaries or place, then why do they exist? Even if they don't strictly "exist" as per the last comment, why do they do anything?
>Incorrect, it shows humans to be far more morale insofar that they are able to understand differences in intelligence. Otherwise, I could just as easily argue youkai are no different for killing billions upon billions of molecules and bacteria.
And some people would take you up on that, though bacteria and molecules have very little intelligence. Being able to understand differences in intelligence, however, couldn't possibly justify doing whatever you please to those that you recognize as lower in intelligence, could it? Humans aren't all equally intelligent, nor are they equally willing to use their faculties, am I to kill them for being so incompetent, ungrateful, and inferior to my own capabilities, or those of others?

>>38931243
>If you disagree, show me the quotes where she displays real wisdom and understanding.
With exact quotes? To keep things somewhat short, her story mode interactions all show her character very well. She sees through the others and knows their weak points, so she picks her words with precision. Many of them come to her with specific assumptions in mind, which she readily goes along with, giving them exactly what they want, then beats them, so that they effectively prove themselves wrong (Lyrica, Marisa, Reisen). That's a general rule, but even then each individual situation is specially tailored to her opponents. She seems to know Mystia's songs better than she does. She sees that Tewi is scheming so she gives her a likely explanation with a plausible purpose that she then retracts after winning, replacing it with a more obscure explanation. People occasionally compare her to Reimu since they have a similar colour palette and are easygoing but she shows herself as more easygoing for recognizing what the incident actually is while Reimu loses her head, ignoring her for most of that interaction, and even overriding her theme. Then she easily defeats Aya's shallow journalism and is constantly multiple steps ahead of her during their talk (purposefully ironic, since Aya is physically much faster). Eiki is the only one who keeps up with her, as their views are opposed in one way or another. It's a good opportunity for both of them to make their stances clearer, while still being multi-faceted. Eiki has authority while Yuuka implies that power constitutes real authority instead of position. Eiki is worried that Yuuka may be forgetting her identity/role as a Youkai while Yuuka hardly seems bothered and is more interested in being herself (she calls herself a Youkai only one time in PoFV). Eiki tries to distance herself from Yuuka's challenge but ultimately consents to it.
Even outside of her own scenario, one of her two non-character specific lines in VS mode eviscerates most of her fanbase and all hentai doujins. Straightforward, but effective.
>It also makes it clear that she has no morale code. She believes in nothing and simply does as she pleases.
I cannot agree with that. She may not believe in external things too strongly, but she absolutely believes in herself. She does as she pleases, but knows what she does.
>She will protect flowers from any harm, but also has no issue with people that kill flowers.
The flower shop comment? They don't necessarily kill flowers but I never personally agreed with the inclusion of that bit either. Even then, we don't know what she does with them.
>She values politeness, but loves to rub people the wrong way.
The way she seems to be both one thing and its opposite at the same time is part of her charm. Doing both of those is entirely possible. Rubbing people the wrong way can mean targetting their faults, which could allow them to think those over, or it could mean a refusal to put etiquette above one's own opinion, regardless of what others think.

>>38937321
Yes Reimu, this post right here. Looks like that fortune teller got some apprentices

>>38871889
God this animation is so cancerous

>>38940717
Looks fine to me. I could see it being used in like a 4X "event" screen, sort of like Endless Space 2 quests

>>38937922
>Thought and knowledge can never fill in enough of the rest to truly give you the full perspective of another.
It can do enough.

>I will say that not all Youkai seem overly stupid or lacking in understanding.
Most of the Youkai that are smart of not lacking in understanding are that way because they adapt human like viewpoints.

> The general, and probably "best" response to a Youkai would be to prevent them from harming the interests of humans, which would likely often require sealing or extermination.
So... we both agree that mass youkai extermination is justified?

>This is why, if I am not misremembering, life itself can be considered a sin in Buddhism, as life necessitates action, and action necessitates the accrual of karma.
I mean, if you want to argue from a Buddhist morale framework most youkai are significantly more immoral than humans.

>am not 100% sure of where this may have been stated in canon
PMISS.

>One can be moral without having a moral code enforced on them.
Perhaps, not Youkai though.

>Being spiritual, however, their extinction would be difficult indeed.
Not really. Remove Gensokyo and you remove youkai.

>>38937111
Which youkai should I impregnate? I'd say Kogasa because she's a babysitter and therefore has skill dealing with children so she would be the best for taking responsibility as a mother

>>38939006
>Do you mean to say that Youkai literally do not exist? That none of them have a self?
Well, in a real life context, obviously. In the context of Touhou though, it's hard. Like I said before, they are essentially sapient ideas. So, while they might debatably have a sense of self, it's wholly filtered through the ideas that are grafted onto them. Thus, their "perspective" is that of the humans whose ideas created them.

>Of course, but why should they operate under human law?
Operating under human law is a two way street. Animals cannot operate under human law, and we threat them accordingly. If youkai refuse to accept the laws of humanity, then they will be treated the same as animals or insects. Nobody thinks twice about removing a hive of termites.

>but if you think they have no boundaries or place, then why do they exist?
They exist as a tool by the Lunarians to torment the inhabitants of Earth.

>Being able to understand differences in intelligence, however, couldn't possibly justify doing whatever you please to those that you recognize as lower in intelligence, could it?
No, and I'm not in favor of the way we threat our livestock. But it does show a radical difference in the way different lifeforms should be threated.

>>38939006
>She sees through the others and knows their weak points, so she picks her words with precision.
That's not intelligence or wisdom. That's just being a alpha bitch in a high school setting. At best you could argue she knows a lot about social interactions, which I guess is a form of wisdom, but she certainly isn't using it in a way that comes across as wise or mature.

I do agree that the typical fandom portrayal of her is wrong. But, well, I still don't see her as a great example of Youkai wisdom. I guess she's above the rest, but that's not much of a accomplishment. Kasen and Suika are the same way, but are much less bitchy about it.

>She may not believe in external things too strongly, but she absolutely believes in herself
That's basically the same thing as believing in nothing. Especially since, as I said, Youkai have no real viewpoint.

>The way she seems to be both one thing and its opposite at the same time is part of her charm. Doing both of those is entirely possible.
I guess? But it still doesn't make her seem all that good. Nobody likes a hypocrite.

>>38871706

>>38877047
>you'll see a lot of blue, purple, pink, red and green hair.
Yeah, and they're not normal.

>>38940717
cause it's in bloody webm, man, and the file size is limited to 4chan limit

>>38942153
>It can do enough.
For regular functioning, sure, just not fully.
>Most of the Youkai that are smart of not lacking in understanding are that way because they adapt human like viewpoints.
That might be the case, or they adopt some higher viewpoint that humans can also adopt.
>So... we both agree that mass youkai extermination is justified?
Justified not necessarily, but probably the most beneficial short term solution.
>I mean, if you want to argue from a Buddhist morale framework most youkai are significantly more immoral than humans.
Perhaps, but then they could also be saved and should not be thought of in wholly negative terms. All living things would benefit from the cessation of suffering.
>PMISS.
I'll check it again then
>Perhaps, not Youkai though.
Maybe, maybe, I might be willing to make exceptions but can lead into semantics.
>Not really. Remove Gensokyo and you remove youkai.
To some extent, even then I can't be sure that they'll be gone forever.

>>38942177
>Like I said before, they are essentially sapient ideas. So, while they might debatably have a sense of self, it's wholly filtered through the ideas that are grafted onto them. Thus, their "perspective" is that of the humans whose ideas created them.
That would effectively mean that they aren't quite independent. At the same time it puts humans in a bit of a precarious position as it implies that their woes are at least partially self-inflicted. Some might even consider it a common trope.
>Operating under human law is a two way street. Animals cannot operate under human law, and we threat them accordingly. If youkai refuse to accept the laws of humanity, then they will be treated the same as animals or insects. Nobody thinks twice about removing a hive of termites.
Human law is made by and primarily concerned with humans and how they ought to behave among one another, if we treat an animal in such and such a manner because they attacked humans or similar we would not be doing so based on human law but on survival instincts and group interests. The Youkai do not need to accept it, in fact, if they're not human they likely should have no reason to accept it and just live mostly separated from them like the beasts do. Youkai are more dependant on humans than animals are likely to be, which is what causes issues.
>They exist as a tool by the Lunarians to torment the inhabitants of Earth.
Don't remember this bit either but I am behind on some of my reading. I can't entirely blame them, if the earthlings want impurity then they'll get impurity.
>But it does show a radical difference in the way different lifeforms should be threated.
Well sure it does indicate that not every lifeform should be treated equally because they aren't the same, and I cannot deny that some will always come out on top and rule over others even if for a limited time. Even so, if we are intelligent, we should be able to recognize what is excessive.

>>38942233
>At best you could argue she knows a lot about social interactions, which I guess is a form of wisdom, but she certainly isn't using it in a way that comes across as wise or mature.
Here I have to disagree, knowing how to handle interactions with others in a precise and effective manner is certainly wisdom. It might not necessarily come off as mature on the surface, but since all of the opponents come to her in her story mode, I would say she's just handling them properly, without blind threats or even really tossing her weight around.
>I do agree that the typical fandom portrayal of her is wrong.
They like to take one aspect and blow it out of proportion instead of keeping them all how they should be.
> I guess she's above the rest, but that's not much of a accomplishment.
Now now, if Youkai are as terrible as you say, then overcoming this is impressive. Even then, I feel as though Yuuka doesn't so much deny the usual violent nature of a Youkai as she goes beyond it into something unique.
>much less bitchy
Rude, Kasen lectures people while Yuuka rarely complains or interacts with them.
>That's basically the same thing as believing in nothing. Especially since, as I said, Youkai have no real viewpoint.
Technically, but if they are sapient ideas, then they should be able to believe in themselves, the idea that is themselves. If I may be bold, however, Yuuka gives me the impression of someone who is more than the idea that led to her in the first place.
>I guess? But it still doesn't make her seem all that good. Nobody likes a hypocrite.
I would not call it hypocrisy really, she plays a role only when others clearly want her to, in most cases she seems to be both here and there since spirits, cycles, and nature are the common theme of PoFV and she likely understands these the most (Sakuya and Youmu interactions, flowers are symbols of both life and death, happy and sorrowful occasions).

>>38952794
>For regular functioning, sure, just not fully.
That already puts me leagues above youkai.

>Perhaps, but then they could also be saved and should not be thought of in wholly negative terms.
Still not much wrong with killing them.

>At the same time it puts humans in a bit of a precarious position as it implies that their woes are at least partially self-inflicted.
Arguably. That doesn't really apply to outsiders though.

> Youkai are more dependant on humans than animals are likely to be, which is what causes issues.
Yes. Thus they need to either accept human laws or be destroyed.

>Even so, if we are intelligent, we should be able to recognize what is excessive.
I mean, yeah. At least there is a genuine backlash against farming.

> I would say she's just handling them properly,
I mean, she's still fighting all of them. Not much different from Cirno or Marisa.

>Now now, if Youkai are as terrible as you say, then overcoming this is impressive.
I mean, other Youkai also did it without nearly as much problems.

>Rude, Kasen lectures people while Yuuka rarely complains or interacts with them.
Nothing wrong with lectures as long as they are correct.

>Technically, but if they are sapient ideas, then they should be able to believe in themselves, the idea that is themselves
Yeah, but that idea is just a copy of a human idea.

> If I may be bold, however, Yuuka gives me the impression of someone who is more than the idea that led to her in the first place.
Eh... I guess? It's hard to say what her idea is since "Flower youkai" isn't really a thing in Japanese myths. Her personality does in many ways kind of represent a flower like a rose.

>>38952794
>I would not call it hypocrisy really, she plays a role only when others clearly want her to,
So, you think she only teases because people expect her to tease?

>>38957077
>>38957133
Anyway, for what it's worth we do seem to be in agreement that wiping out Youkai would be the smart thing to do. So... why not do it? Even if you think it's morally incorrect, which you don't even entirely seem to think. Practically it's hard to argue against a total youkai genocide. Especially when most of their victims are just randos.

>>38957236
cause the bloody youkai don't exist, or ZUN is hiding secrets of touhou

>>38893268
>>38895993
>>38905491
>>38906042
>>38906376
>>38909403
>>38918956
>>38926235
>>38926598
>>38927683
>>38929557
>>38931217
>>38931243
>>38931256
>>38937922
>>38939006
>>38942153
>>38942177
>>38942233
>>38952794
>>38957077
Wow, that's a lot of words, I'm gonna have to ask for a source.

>>38959750
Canon material, observable phenomena, me, my thoughts

>>38957077
>That already puts me leagues above youkai.
Most? Probably can't deny that.
>Still not much wrong with killing them.
Any killing has consequences, as does any action. You would simply have to be ready for those.
>Arguably. That doesn't really apply to outsiders though.
Sure, though the exact relationship between these things isn't entirely clear to me.
>Yes. Thus they need to either accept human laws or be destroyed.
The way things seem, if Youkai were to be Youkai proper they would not be able to fully follow human law, so everything would be either an unstable compromise or delaying the inevitable.
>I mean, yeah. At least there is a genuine backlash against farming.
There's backlash but I doubt there's enough to cause major change. Major change usually comes after major sacrifices.
>I mean, she's still fighting all of them. Not much different from Cirno or Marisa.
Everyone there likes danmaku, and everyone seems to be itching for a fight. If they want a fight, they get a fight. Now it's true that in some scenarios she's the one being aggressive, like in Cirno and Mystia's story modes. I might be a little optimistic in saying that she's just having a little fun and teaching them to be a bit more careful but there is the implication that at least one of them was unknowingly led there by the spirits in the flowers.
>I mean, other Youkai also did it without nearly as much problems.
The other Youkai do things their way. Yuuka is fairly uncompromising so she can handle others fairly well but the majority of her interlocutors will, inevitably, not be able to get along well with that attitude.
>Nothing wrong with lectures as long as they are correct.
I do not necessarily disagree, but those who are unwilling will likely not learn. Others can help or point you in a specific direction, but learning, changing or understanding ultimately have to come from within I feel.
>Yeah, but that idea is just a copy of a human idea.
Is the idea distinctly human or is it an idea that humans are able to grasp?
>Eh... I guess? It's hard to say what her idea is since "Flower youkai" isn't really a thing in Japanese myths. Her personality does in many ways kind of represent a flower like a rose.
Those are all the elements really, the mystery, the lack of enough concrete information to make confident judgements. That comparison is also apt, she's quite charming but difficult to approach, and just like a flower she can incite a variety of reactions. Some would admire her from afar, others to have her for themselves, a third group gets completely enthralled. Whatever happens after is entirely their responsibility. For being so uncompromising in regular conversations, she's quite lenient when it comes to how people interpret her character.

>>38957133
>So, you think she only teases because people expect her to tease?
That is a little harder to define. I do think that more than a few of them come in with certain expectations and get what they were looking for, often to their detriment, but it's also fair to say that everybody can be teased in some way, and how they react to that is interesting, even important information.

>>38957236
Sure, on a practical level it's likely the most beneficial decision, on a personal level I simply have doubts as to whether it's the best decision and would rather not take a side.

nobody cares about outsiders
without youkai, the humans of the human village would have no one protecting them from famine and natural disaster

>>38952794
>>They exist as a tool by the Lunarians to torment the inhabitants of Earth.
Yeah this was mentioned by Kaguya and Yukari on different occasions I think. Yukari in CoLR and Kaguya in IN to sakuya's team

>>38967845
Without youkai, the humans of the human village wouldn't be trapped inside Gensokyo, and would instead be living comfortable lives in modern day Japan.

>>38958356
Fair.

ZUN is actually the Youkai.

>>38967477
>though the exact relationship between these things isn't entirely clear to me.
Basically: Youkai target the people most innocent.

>The way things seem, if Youkai were to be Youkai proper they would not be able to fully follow human law, so everything would be either an unstable compromise or delaying the inevitable.
It's hard to say. It's ambiguous how much genuine co-existence can be.

> I might be a little optimistic in saying that she's just having a little fun and teaching them to be a bit more careful but there is the implication that at least one of them was unknowingly led there by the spirits in the flowers.
Well, if it's any consolation Cirno is a fairy and thus basically a punching bag while Mystia deserves all of the abuse she gets.

>I do not necessarily disagree, but those who are unwilling will likely not learn.
I would say Reimu at least is not beyond saving. She's a dumbass, but not evil or too stuck in her nature.

>Is the idea distinctly human or is it an idea that humans are able to grasp?
The former. Insofar that it's literally born from human imagination.

>For being so uncompromising in regular conversations, she's quite lenient when it comes to how people interpret her character.

That's true for most Touhou's.

>Sure, on a practical level it's likely the most beneficial decision, on a personal level I simply have doubts as to whether it's the best decision and would rather not take a side.
I mean, if Youkai were real and not just one Japanese drunk there are personal plenty of reasons to support youkai genocide. Any one can pluck and kill you after all.

>>38967845
1: We are outsiders. 2: The human villagers care. 3: >>38978311

>B-But Japan has natural disasters.
None too severe.

>>38967845
>>38978311
>>38978400
>>38978408
Youkai use outsiders as sex slaves, it's been implied they keep them around for a little while before "losing interest" and eating them for real

>>38978408
Its a fucking thin volcanic island, its natural disasters are befitting and they were also retarded enough to build a nuclear plant beside the sea. So yes id say they are half severe

>>38978213
Ah yes I have vague memories of that, should have been able to piece it together since Youkai are strongest at night and the moon presides over night time, the age old symbol of reflection, thought, knowledge, stillness, and eventually purity. A bit strange that it doesn't seem to have ever been expanded on later.

>>38978400
>most innocent.
I do not believe that anyone is innocent.
>It's hard to say. It's ambiguous how much genuine co-existence can be.
A precarious position to be sure. In a general situation I would say that man has strived to live in relative harmony (or at least the best possible compromise) with spiritual entities, but in a Touhou context I can't be certain.
>Well, if it's any consolation Cirno is a fairy and thus basically a punching bag while Mystia deserves all of the abuse she gets.
Yes but I would still say there's a concrete reason for it, at least in some way. Eiki does end up chiding Cirno for being a little too outgoing and gutsy due to her greater than average power for a fairy, so Yuuka slightly unnerving her by leisurely talking a decent bit (like how Akyuu recommends the same thing in order to confuse her) then scaring her off at the very least can be thought of as an indirect reminder that Cirno isn't as tough and fearless as she imagines. Similarly for Mystia, she's led around by the spirits, who inform the songs she sings, and Eiki chides her for this unthinking and confused attitude, similar to Yuuka. That and, since neither Cirno nor Mystia are very sharp, both of them effectively wander into the Garden of the Sun on a whim without much deliberation. Something was bound to happen.
>I would say Reimu at least is not beyond saving. She's a dumbass, but not evil or too stuck in her nature.
Reimu is easygoing but occasionally too rigid in her thinking, even her intuition fails her on the off occasion and she rarely seems to think much of anything other than doing her job (and only when necessary). Of course, since her job is practically being the local enforcer, I wouldn't want her to be overly free either, since that wouldn't make for a great enforcer.
>The former. Insofar that it's literally born from human imagination.
Maybe, the imagination is quite powerful after all. Over here in the west they used to think of it as a bridge between lower and higher faculties.
>That's true for most Touhou's.
Touhou in general is quite open to interpretation, it's practically the main point of interest for the series so it would be crazy to deny it. Even then, I may just be losing it, but for a while I've felt like Yuuka is the best example of that. So effortlessly in control yet aloof and mysterious enough to give rise to multiple, even opposed perspectives. It helps that she doesn't have too much material in Windows so the mystique has never been lost.
>Any one can pluck and kill you after all.
Life is fairly dangerous, a whole host of things can kill me. It doesn't bother me too much, though I am aware that this is a strange statement.

I'd be willing to, but who would hug me? I don't like to be forceful.

>>38979960
I'll hug you anon <3

>>38978651
I mean, they suffer less than places in Africa that are way more safe and less prone to natural disasters.

>>38979747
>I do not believe that anyone is innocent.
Odd opinion, but whatever. To each their own, I guess.

>Similarly for Mystia, she's led around by the spirits, who inform the songs she sings, and Eiki chides her for this unthinking and confused attitude, similar to Yuuka.
She's also a serial killer, con women, and punk artist. Even if Eiki doesn't care about that, it still means it's hard to care when she gets the shit beaten out of her.

>Of course, since her job is practically being the local enforcer, I wouldn't want her to be overly free either, since that wouldn't make for a great enforcer.
I would compare her to a Nazi SS officer in what her job actually entails.

>Life is fairly dangerous, a whole host of things can kill me. It doesn't bother me too much, though I am aware that this is a strange statement.
A bit, yeah. But again, to each their own I guess.

>>38982955
>Odd opinion, but whatever.
That's not to mean that I think everyone deserves some form of punishment, simply that I am not sure anyone is truly free from wrongdoing. Even if none are, what happens to them is not necessarily punishment.
>it still means it's hard to care when she gets the shit beaten out of her.
Wouldn't feel too strongly about it but I would gain no satisfaction from it either.
>I would compare her to a Nazi SS officer in what her job actually entails.
Just following orders?

>>38871706
implying they don't want to eat your liver

>>38988583
They want to eat your fleshy "mushroom" growing between your legs, anon

>>38988808
Depending on how they eat it and when, it could be dangerous.

>>38989282

>>38989282
>>38989290
Cry about it shrine maiden, youkai women are way better than human women and this is an objective fact

>>38989282
>>38989290
But I don't feel anything when I look at human women. I can't even see them as females.

>>38989880
Based, and same
Embrace youkai girls!

>>38988583
I'm sure plenty of people in the real world would want to eat my liver too. I'm not saying to put me right next to a youkai or anything, but if I was gonna exterminate beings based on how likely they would be to kill me, I'd have tried to wipe out all of humanity too.

>>38988583
Most don't.

>>38990065
this is why we try to eat your liver, ass.

>>38990065
When you meet a person in the street, how likely are they to tear you to pieces?
Meanwhile when you meet a youkai in a forest, how likely are they to tear you to pieces? Please do remember the number one (#1 [Numero Uno]) cause of death for outsiders in Gensokyo.
At the very least, the odds of being murdered every year in the United States are 1 in 18,989. Exact numbers on how many outsiders are killed by youkai are scarce, but Akyuu does state in PMiSS that "most" of them do, so at least over 50% of them. 1 in 18,989 (0.00527%) of being killed versus a 50%+ chance of being killed.
No, if you were going to exterminate beings based on how likely they are to kill you, youkai would without a doubt be the first target.

>>38990148
I think an American Negro would be more prone to violence than a youkai.

>>38990212
Anon, blacks may be violent but they are nowhere near a 50% murder rate. Fucking no place on earth has a 50% murder rate. El Salvador, the country with the highest murder rate according to World Population Review, has a murder rate of 61.7 per 100,000 population (0.0617% of being murdered).
Face it, the whole "b-but humans could kill me too!" argument makes no sense whatsoever. Youkai would literally be thousands of times more likely to kill you.

>>38978623
I thought that was just them asking questions about the outside? With ZUN's general stance regarding romance or sex at all, outsiders being used as sex slaves sounds kind of unlikely

>>38993488
It's the implication of the text. Especially the "Get eaten once they lost interest" part.

>>38990148
I'm not gonna lie, it feels like 90%. The only thing stopping them is that they're not strong enough to just do it like they want to.

>>38990257
also by american statistic, vending machines kill more than animals. Also cows kill more than sharks, generally it seems american has a problem

But that's dangerous. Imagine letting a Youkai hug you. First, it looks like it's all fun & games, especially since you just got a hug, must be feeling pretty nice, but then she gets more clingy, and for some reason can't stop squeezing the pudgier parts of your body and salivating. Get carried away and she might offer you a hot bath.
Around Youkai, always be careful.

>>39000941
>hot bath.
Hm?

>>39000941
>can't stop squeezing the pudgier parts of your body and salivating. Get carried away and she might offer you a hot bath.
This sounds ambiguous enough that I might fall for it.

>>38876815
Natural atypical color hair is different from paint.

>>38882910
Humanity is a touch more sophisticated than this, you know.

>>39001494
It seems that I do not know. What do you have in mind?

>>39001619
Well, presumption that justifications are necessary while reducing motivations to some whimsy "in the moment" logic seems wrong considering sheer population size alone, to say nothing of cultural, ideological, psychological and so on differences even in small groups, all the more given that there are quite good people with compassion for the innocents.

>>39001665
Obviously there was some irony involved in my statement since I go on to call humanity a "nebulous group". Still, do you not think that many decisions involving the subjugation or destruction of other groups involved primarily practical considerations as their motivators but used any and every other justification to get it done as efficiently as possible?
>all the more given that there are quite good people with compassion for the innocents
Everyone has compassion for those they deem innocent, it hardly says much.

>>39002147
You mean as in lower in the event adjacent chain of command minutiae reasoning? That may be the case, though I can't generalize on it well.
As for innocents, this particular point is hard to argue with.

I opened this thread to see cute Satori pictures

>>39002339

>>39002200
It might not have always been the case but pretexts must have been common.
>As for innocents, this particular point is hard to argue with.
Mine? Most people feel compassion for those that are close or important to them, it would be a bare minimum if anything.
>>39002339
Real shame

>>39001223
Just as there are many kinds of humans, there are many kinds of Youkai. Not everyone fancies cornering you in the forest and eating you alive, plain and simple, maybe a little scare along the way. Some have a more or less acute grasp of how we behave as a species, or are at least under the impression that we're able to emote well enough to provide more entertainment out of a more through situation, going through many emotions along the way.
As i've mentioned above, there'd be this feeling of unexpected, perhaps forbidden love in the context of what you've grown to hear & believe about Youkai, all the more intense if she's beautiful. Finally, luck shines upon you. Or is it? That hot bath she'd insist on having you take was a little offputting: The water was really hot too, and there were weird little grains in the bath, some white, some black.
You'd brush that aside as just Youkai culture. After all, who are you to say how Youkai enjoy bathing? This is practically your first in depth interaction with one.
This same idea would go on with her next offer - A massage. You haven't been the most healthy, so it'd definitely be appreciated, especially at the hands of such a cute Youkai. Again though, questions flow through your mind regarding some of her choices: Why does the oil she uses to massage you so greasy? Not that you're the most experienced in that field, but it honestly feels like someone's rubbing butter on you at this point. You once again decide to shrug these feelings off, as the opportunity you've been given to experience all of this goes far beyond unfounded feelings of suspicion.
Just as you feel yourself drifting away into bliss, chomp. The meal's just about ready, and its as well done as it gets - a little sweat, a little greasy, and that oh so delicious fear that strikes your heart upon being met with this sharp pain. If only it was excruciatingly painful, but the feelings of betrayal, fear, and what little hope you may with what remains of your leg to flee, that is just as flavorful as it gets, a treat on so many layers. Who could resist? No way she's gonna leave an empty plate.
And just like that, you've met your end. Doesn't that sound terrifying? And yet, it started so gracefully, as a glimmer of hope for one lonely, unfortunate individual. Moral of the story? Do not trust Youkais.

>>39003323
>Moral of the story? Do not trust Youkais.
That's all you had to say anon

>>39003323
>don’t trust youkai
Yeah no shit anon.

>>38871706
>pure creatures
Anon clearly hasn’t seen how Youkai actually behave nor to what level they strategically coordinate their vicious attacks on humankind. See pic related.

>>39003323
>Do not trust Youkais.
But what if she actually has good intentions? What if she's touching my pudgier places because most people in Gensokyo are thin and it surprised her? What if she's salivating because she's thinking about Mystia's yakitori? What if the unusually hot bath is just how youkais prefer? What if the butter-like lotion is how they made it in the Edo-period? What if the first bite wasn't as strong as I initially thought and she just did it as a joke?
Maybe youkai aren't bad, just misunderstood!

>>39011769
Purity does not mean goodness. Rumia is a very pure creature. Just a very evil one.

>>39012082
>Purity does not mean goodness
A very good example of this is Junko. She hates all lunarians because Chang'e's husband killed her son. How can you justify that?

>>39011769
That's me in the picture and I consented. Rumia is an angel and would never attack an innocent person.

>>39003323
were it not for the fact that they need fear to survive, integrating youkai into society would be the only way to make them not devious, violent monsters
instead, doing so would probably gradually kill them

>>39012096
>How can you justify that?
Chang’e is the husband of Hou Yi, who is Junko’s ex-husband. Hou Yi killed Junko’s son so that his child with Chang’e would be his heir. Chang’e was therefore an accomplice to Junko’s son’s murder. Chang’e drank the Hourai Elixir and fled to the Moon to escape the consequences for of actions. Junko and Hecatia’s invasion of the Moon was to take vengeance upon Chang’e and correct this injustice while also knocking the Lunarians, who are basically Space Jews, down a peg. Therefore, Junko is perfectly personally and morally justified in her invasion of the Lunar Capital. Junko unironically did nothing wrong.

>>39012104
>That’s me in the picture and I consented.
Liar. If that were you, you’d be dead, and wouldn’t have typed this nonsense.

>>39017693
Hecatia lets me borrow her PC to post on /jp/.

>>39012754
Youkai can survive off faith, can't they?
I don't think they need fear, and only fear to live, its just preferred

>>39029015
Nope, Kanako explains this in Symposium of Post-mysticism. A god that only gets fear will become a youkai, but theoretically a youkai that gets enough faith will become a god. Faith in general is a bit more high maintenance than fear, humans fearing a lot of youkai is good and sustainable and pretty easy to keep up but there's only so many humans to give faith to so many things. If every youkai became a god not everyone would get enough faith to sustain themselves, and would probably revert back to being a youkai if the same logic of the Arahitogami applies.

>>39012754
Curious, what if humanity accepted youkai as real beings, but didn't necessarily fear them for the fact they are youkai alone?

>>38871706
Which youkai girls are safe to hug?

>>39012046
You know, maybe you're right. I guess i'll go & befriend the first Youkai I find! I hope this will be the beginning of a great friendship

>>39019090
Hecatia would never let you do that

>>39048586
I know the moe anthropomorphic personification of nilfgaard is safe

>>38989282
Says the youkai cumdumpster herself

>>39053804
Is Okuu safe or will you die from ARS?

>>39067303
the bloody hell is ARS?

>>39069526
animal rescue service i think

>>39069526
Acute Radiation Syndrome

gensoukyo exists so all these youkai can exist without all that not-scared-of-monsters crap

>>39069867
She's acute alright. A cute raven who is also my wife

>>39067303
I mean she's hot, but her friends don't get sick from any like thermal radiation or other radiation type thing, so you'll be safe.

>>39074455
Her friends all are cute magical girls.
Are you? I think not.

>>39081459
since when does being a magical girl make you immune to radiation?

>>39083311
Since the magical part

>>39081459
If you got bitten by a radioactive magical girl, would you turn into a magical girl?

>>39099355
No, you'd get magical cancer.

>>39099355
You'll be her slave.

>>38871706