/jp/ - Otaku Culture

We're trolling you, specifically you Hammerknife. Everything has been according to plan to troll you.

No, by telling him you are trolling him, you are just trying to troll him in a different way.

>>3784598
Yeah this game was translated just for the purpose of trolling you. How does that make you feel?

Because I don't like you. Sorry.

>>3784598
Do you know why you got trolled? Is the question you should be asking yourself.

>>3784604
Shush! Don't tell him yet. We still haven't gotten him to play G-Senjou yet!

>>3784598
Did you even bother to look at the vndb.org page? Because this should have tipped you off.

>>3784637
But G-Senjou is good!

I raged hard... The plot twists, they made me vomit out my ass.

SHE WAS BEHIND YOU THE WHOLE FUCKING TIME

...i hate MMORPGs.

>>3784707
Why so mad?
It make perfect and they gave you plenty of foreshadow.
He even dropped a bunch of girl clothes at the start.

>>3784596
please stop spamming ＡｎｏｎＴａｌｋ .com thanks

>>3784746

Psh, i personally thought it was for comedy. Of course i noticed odd things, but the obligation she has is retarded, it practically means she can do whatever the fuck she wants, as long as she doesn't talk or physically harm anyone, She isn't allowed to be acknowledged.

I recommended it because it's good.

>>3784764
No way to purchase goods or services.
No way to own property.
No privacy.
No forms of communication.
Watched over by Houzuki.
Only one guaranteed meal a day.

I don't think I'd survive long.

>>3784933

She doesnt have to purchase it, she can just take it, and people cant touch her.

LOL HIS LEG WAS FINE
OHWAIT LOL HIS PIPE WAS MEANINGLESS
(Why would he think to himself that the pipe was so relaxing and that he was so dependent on it, when there was no one around to fool.)

>>3784963
Wire tapped and shit.
Gotta troll Houzuki and everything and there is a saying, con your friends first before conning your enemies.

ITT: We explain why bad writing is good.

>>3784963
Ririko "I know. People are allowed to employ self-defense techniques in order to protect themselves against those with the Maximum Penalty. They can shoot me without hesitation if I try attacking them." 056.ks

>>3784963
>she can just take it
Houzuki will take it from her and punish her. It's also entirely possible that there is a loophole to prevent her from doing such things (i.e. they might be able to acknowledge her if it will inflict monetary pain).

>LOL HIS LEG WAS FINE
Perfectly valid twist, it fits completely with Houzuki's character.

>OHWAIT LOL HIS PIPE WAS MEANINGLESS
He never actually said he was dependent on it in his thoughts, he just liked it (which he admits in the same scene). THe only times he truly acted dependent on it are in front of Houzuki (and others to a much lesser extent).

Sharin somewhat disappointed me. The setting and the characters felt awesome at first, but lots of forced drama kinda ruined it afterwards.
Given its reputation, I expected a lot more from it,
6/10, maybe 7 for Wakamoto.

Do you fags know the meaning of the words spoiler tags?

And don't even use the leg thing as a 'bad' example, it's already been used in an awesome movie. Ever watched The Usual Suspects? Go watch it.

>>3785047
But the entire point of that movie was that everything was ridiculous and may or may not have happened at all.

>>3784933
Who are you talking about?

>>3784963
>>3784764
You brought up a good point. That was a really cheesy unbelievable plot twist by the time it was revealed. I just wished that she was really locked up somewhere else instead...

Also, Sakurada, you've mentioned "forced drama" countless times, which I can agree with. But what about bad writing? Please elaborate.

No the point of the movie was that he played them all for a sucker just like Houzuki did.

Yeah, Sharin has some lacking writing. Looseboy in general does. Although with Sharin's genre, it's easier to shrug off its technical writing flaws. The fact that the setting is automatically subject to an entirely different set of values and a different kind of common sense helps lay the groundwork for easier suspension of disbelief.

Generally, the scenario/story itself is so awesome combined with all that other stuff is enough so that people can generally look past the little "Huh?" moments.

G Senjou kind of suffers from the same problems and doesn't have the benefit of a fanciful setting and the employment of different common sense so it'll be interesting to see how people respond to that one.

Maybe they won't have an issue since it seems the people that take issue with Sharin are people that weren't too receptive to the fanciful setting to begin with. They'll likely prefer the more down-to-earth approach.

>>3785172
Bad writing is only referring to some of the plot twists. The writer apparently couldn't manage to properly foreshadow the twists without giving them away, instead making it so they came off as ridiculous when they were revealed, which is plain bad writing. See: Diabolus ex Machina, Deus ex Machina.

Luckily, the Ririko plot twist didn't fall victim to the "no proper foreshadowing" thing, but the result was that I saw it coming when the narration mentioned Ken putting sushi in his case. But I digress.

I agree with lacking writing but disagree with forced drama. Well, in the sense that the drama isn't any more forced than any other VN, that is. I'm the opposite from you, heh.

Well chapter 3 was forced drama, I suppose. That's the game's Achilles heel in general, chapter 3.

>>3785220
There's only one plot twist that comes off as "huh? though. Well, in my opinion. The IT WAS JUST AN HERB! That was a bit, meh, it just had the smell of something purposely kept without foreshadowing for the sake of surprising you with it later. I generally hate stuff like that. And well, I guess that might just be me since there are quite a few people who still saw it coming...

Everything else though was well within the range of understanding and foreshadowed though.

>>3785256
No, basically everything in Chapter 5 was Diabolus or Deus ex Machina.

>>3785220
Heh, I misinterpreted some of the foreshadowing parts due to the the protag's personality and his mission. For instance, the bras and panties part at school had me believing that he was up to his usual hijinks again, pretending to be a perverted school student. Now that I think of it... that was a pretty dumb assumption.

>>3785229
I agree. But I think Chapter 1's drama parts dragged pretty long as well.

>>3785270
What, for example? There was really nothing else in the chapter that struck me as odd. In fact, chapter 5 is kind of short so, yeah. You have the Ririko thing, already covered. The Leg thing, which everyone knew was coming when it happened(and was foreshadowing a little TOO much for my liking, to be honest. I think they could have stood to be a bit more subtle there. Then the drug thing which I've already, yeah... that's kind of weird. And finally the cliff thing which is, again, something probably everyone saw coming and was foreshadowed, albeit, in a less overt manner and not really until chapter 5. Then again, you don't really know much about Houzuki or his motivations until chapter 5(and even afterwards, really, though you can get an idea from the ending) in general so that's forgivable. In fact, you can say that they left open his motivation until the very end for that dramatic moment, which is basically how you know it's coming. Like a 'they've kept me in the dark, this is where it's going to be revealed dramatically', kind of thing.

>>3785270
Tropes are not bad.

Why did you recommend Guild Wars to me?

>>3785309
Minor addition, it's also pretty clever how you can deduce what Houzuki's motivation was by the end of the game from the overall theme of the game, wheels. Some parts of the overall writing are a bit technically iffy but it's rather poetic at parts at least.

>>3785309
The leg thing wasn't foreshadowed at all, and it still doesn't make any sense in context. "This is way too fucking easy, you know?" =/= Foreshadowing. Even if you see it coming from miles away, that's because the attempt to set up the twist was written poorly.

Just listing what immediately springs to mind...

1) If Isono shows up, a bad plot twist is on the way or just happened.
2) The cave shit in Sachi's route. Specifically, "Both Isono and I went out and made sure we had everything we needed! Oh, but we just so happened to completely overlook a basic tool. Whoops."
3) Leg. Again, you only saw it coming because the previous red herring related to it was too fucking obvious, which is bad writing.
4) Let's go through this cave. Oh, but it's caved in and you can't get out. Oh, but you can get out. Oh, but you can't climb. Oh, but you can climb because a ladder. Oh, but the ladder's gone. Oh, but now you don't need it even though you did. Oh, but now your friends are deaaaad. (This is the only part which is properly foreshadowed, and doesn't even count as a twist anymore because the foreshadowing was so obvious.) Oh, but they're actually alive. And the person who didn't kill them is now going to not kill you. Why? No reason.

For number 4, you're just describing the events that happened, there's nothing actually bad happening there. Well, except for the last parts where you you started negatively spinning it. It's not just for "no reason" and the whole point was that it was an impossible situation and he was doing the impossible. The whole needing/not needing the ladder is significant.

You stick a little too closely to the leg thing. It makes perfect sense. That's you just nagging on a personal taste thing, from what I can see.

The cave thing is like, so what? I don't know, I don't even see the point of that sticking in your mind, it seems too minor.

>>3785391
>you're just describing the events that happened
>nagging
>so what?
Apathy detected, post discarded.

Bad writing is bad writing. Ignoring it doesn't change anything.

Come back with reasons and we'll talk.

>>3785414
No, I meant bad writing from your perspective of personal taste isn't necessarily bad writing. You're basically like "I think this is too convenient" or something but to me, it's not and is perfectly sensible. It's as simple as that.

>>3785350
>Wheels related to Houzuki's motivation
Anon kun, can you explain this to me? Not a very literature guy myself. ;_;

>>3785471
It's not personal. You just let shit slide because you want to like it. I am objective and you are biased. It's as simple as that.

In term of emotional investment, Sharin was perfect

>>3785377
You niptick far too much for some retarded little things.
Neither the pipe or the cane thing needed foreshadowing, they were only a showcase of how they both always kept an ace up their sleeve and didn't trust each other, something you always knew.

For the fifth, first and second points, these are fucking nomal litterary devices, if you do this with Sharin, do this with every strories ever.
A plot must pogress, in a story like Sharin climaxes must happen, it's not fucking real life.

None of the points you mentioned are bad writing, seriously.

>>3785749
Thinking that you are objective prove that you are a real retard.

>>3785803
I kinda share his opinions on point 4. The whole missing this missing that thing was sort of overdone. But some of it are just wild possibility thoughts running through the protag's mind, acceptable. The ace cards being there is reasonable, but I think it seems very shonen like in a bad way, similar to powerlevels, when such things pop up in succession... a tad too convenient.

>>3785839
The ace thing made sense given their personalities, they are the type who always have PLAN WITHIN PLAN WITHIN PLAN, something that was shown countless time in the game, I didn't think it was convenient, it just seemed normal to me.

For the fourth point, you can't say it didn't work, that was the last hurdle and it was there so Ken could finally get over his past and betrayal.
It may have been convenient but it was really powerful.
Once again, it's a novel, not real life, convenient shit are bound to happen if the plot has to move forward.
If you liked a story enough to ignore this (and believe me you can find that sort of shit in every fucking stories ever), it did its job well.

>>3784598
Because for /jp/ a VN's quality is proportional to the number of people who played it.
Remember CC ?

>>3785861
I realize that to enjoy an entertainment medium, I have to suspend my disbelief once in a while. But I still think that better foreshadowing would have made this a more satisfying read.

So, I agree to disagree.

>>3785172
I'm still trying to understand this concept of "forced drama" that everyone's talking about. Can anyone give me an example of non-forced drama? Isn't all drama technically forced because simply because VNs and books as a medium force you to read any drama that may occur (in that you cannot write a completely new ending to the story thereby engaging in optional drama)?

Best scene ever.

Sometime you just have to focus on the emotions evoked during a scene and stop trying to look at every little details.

Heck the guys who do it probably don't do that for a lot of other VNs they like and I can't think of even one that isn't full of litterary short-cuts, convenient writing, etc....
If anything Sharin was a little more solid than the average since both the setting and the characters themselves were pretty well developed.

>>3785902
Good drama = WHAT I LIKE
Forced drama = WHAT I DISLIKE

>>3785902
Forced drama is/was an /a/ troll term that some idiots use seriously.

>>3785909

Pretty much this, really.

>>3785909
>>3785919

Hah, so that's really the answer after all. That's what I expected, but I'm still kind of disappointed.

>>3785902
When the drama flows well with the rest of the plot, it's something that makes sesnse and not some stupid plot device. It's good drama.
In SnK, the drama is this way, it flows well with the story and characters.
A FORCED drama is some shit that came out of nowhere, makes no sense regarding the plot and the characters' personality, and it's often a result of some stupid plot device.
The perfect example comes from Tomoyo After, the main character literally slips at work, bang his head and gets amnesia + short-term memory loss.
I wish I was fucking kidding...

I really like SnK, only thing which would have made it better would be shortened Touka and Sacchi chapters, I thought those were a bit too long, especially the part where Sacchi painted the picture

>>3784963

You sure didnt read it good enough, since he clearly said the thing he smokes relaxes him but isnt addictive

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm354152

Why is /jp/ so tasteless?

>>3785987
Say the retarded tripfag.

>>3785989
"the retarded tripfag."

...What was the point of that, pray tell?

>>3785987

Well they are hyping over mechas says enough

>>3785987
Because people like you are here

I downloaded Sharin no Kuni from TT, but my whole shit froze when I tried to mount it. I decided it was a bad omen, and dropped it.

>>3785994
I'm wondering, what's a clearly superior to Sharin VN in your opinion then?

>>3785999
You could have at least tried it before dropping.

>>3786005
Just to name something recent, Cross Channel.

>>3786030
Our tastes are clearly different then.

>>3785994
That you are a tripfag and therefore most likely some narcissist faggot.
Reading your posts, you probably are in College, which make you somewhat cultivated.
Unfortunately, being cultivated and using this "culture" well are two different things altogether, shown very well by your posts when you try to use some "big words" but fail at placing them in context.
You probably don't read much too, you obviously aren't the litterature type.

And I'm still laughing at your "I'm objective and you aren't" post, thank.

>>3786030
It's great I agree, though it suffer from as much plot devices, short cuts, etc... than Sharin.
You should do something about your double standards.

>>3786040
Tastes only go so far. Sharin is like a Dan Brown book--a lot of people really like it, but there's no way to avoid the fact that it is objectively shitty.

>>3786052
You are truly comedy gold.

>>3786029
Well fuck you, I tried to get it working but mounting it made my computer freeze. I even tried 2 different torrents. So I went for Edelweiss instead.

>>3786048
>"big words"
Aww, the widdle anon thinks my vocabulary is too expansive.

Judging by what qualifies as "big words" to you, I'm going to guess you're in elementary school.

>>3786066
Actually I tried to be sarcastic, sorry if you didn't get it, my english still needs some work I see.
Basically what I meant was that you are the worst type of faggot, a retard in College.
They are a pretty common type, sort of guys who are inherently retarded but, because they are in College, think that they are somewhat more intelligent and cultivated than the average joe, when they obviously aren't.
That's why they are so keen on using some "big words" (once again sarcastic, I don't want you to miss it) and showing their knowndlege everytime they speak.
Don't worry it's only a phase.

>>3786087
>Don't worry it's only a phase.
You mean you're going to grow out of it? Good to know. I dropped out in middle school.

Wait, Sepia? As in the cuttlefish genus?

I must play this game.

>>3786107
Yeah right.
Oh and don't misunderstand me, I couldn't care less if you liked Sharin or not, you could hate it with a passion if you want, it's your opinion and I respect that.

What I hate above all is that retarded hollier than thou attitude, SHARIN IS OBVIOUSLY SHITTY THIS IS MY OBJECTIVE OPINION AND YOU GUYS ARE RETARDS FOR NOT FOLLOWING IT.
Seriously get over yourself, faggot.

Wow, he really is pulling the that "lol this is objectively bad, my opinion is high class and objective" faggotry. I thought he was being serious at first but... I guess just a troll then? Or a moron? Which one? Whatever. Who cares.

>>3786118
What's wrong? Are you afraid of dedicating yourself to the truth?

One who would hold a thought without being convinced that is absolutely true is worthless.

Honestly, what is it with you proles? Every last one of you is too damn afraid to even use your brain. Everyone and everything--even reality itself--scares the fuck out of you the moment it decides to be rude enough to challenge your beliefs. Fucking pathetic.

>>3786147
You sound more and more like the average college tard, it's actually kinda amusing.
Good speech full of narcissist faggotry from a "middle school drop-out" though.

>>3786147

hahahohwow.jpg

You're really trying hard at this, aren't you?

>>3786147

>>3786196
Wait, when the fuck did Gogeta start posting again?

>>3786211
Just now, apparently. In b4 he's a Jones bot.

>>3786218
God damn it.

>>3786237
And who might you be ? I hate it when people change their trips just so they can avoid filters. Such cowardice.

>>3786254
I'm Anonymous. Or I used to be, anyway. I only started using a tripcode a few days ago.

>>3786274
Well that was the right decision, bro

>>3786290
Wasn't it? Anonymous is too boring and cowardly.

Someone who is too afraid to have any accountability for his words... Isn't that the worst type of person?

>>3786313
>>accountability
>>4chan
>>green text

>>3784597
please stop spamming Ａｎｏｎ Ｔａｌｋ .com thanks

>>3786313
>being a tripfag
>deep

>>3786484

The Ririki twist sucked. The foreshadow was horrible, really.

>>3786484
sometimes it gets to a point in where it makes Evangelion look like Lucky Star

I played this game a few years ago...but it's very clear some of you in this thread haven't, or had no idea what the fuck it is that you read. On one han some of you appear to not understanding the strong points, and on the other hand focus instead on the very minor negative points.

Because the difference between our experiences are so basic, it's as if we played two completely different games so I can't even get worked up enough to rise to it's defense.

Anyone else get this feeling?

>>3786826
They did play the game, their reading comprehension is just lacking.

>>3786835
But complaining about a few bad plot twists is just bizarre -- it's like complaining about technical accuracy in Saving Private Ryan; it shows only an amazing lack of understanding of what the movie is about, to the point you have to question wether or not they even watched it.

For instance, calling the cave end bad because you believe it was a bad plot twist? Can't you understand what it is being shoved right in your face through that whole scene? It isn't building you up for a huge plot twist, it's trying to activate your emotions, which it does superbly. I can't believe that some of these people don't "get" that Houzeki has deeper motivations with Ken -- if I was able to clearly read that between the lines in 2 years ago, why can't some of these people figure it out WITH the aid of english translations? It's CLEARLY telegraphed, if not directly stated -- can anyone be that fucking dense not to get it?

>>3786874
>it's like complaining about technical accuracy in Saving Private Ryan
You don't?

It's not my fault if the idiots behind something can't even do their research. If they'd stop screwing it up, I wouldn't have to point out the mistakes.

>>3786826
This looks like good copypasta material. It doesn't mention anything about the game in question and therefore can be used for nearly anything.
Saved.

I think the Ririko plot twist was less of a deus ex machina than Ever17's Blick Winkel twist. The only real foreshadowing Ever17 had was two mentions of the name in You's route and some third eye shit.

>>3786919
From this post, I can deduce four things.

First, you haven't read Ever17.

Second, you haven't read Sharin no Kuni.

Third, you haven't read this thread.

Fourth, you don't know what a deus ex machina is.

>>3786927
How did you come to this conclusion, pray tell?

>>3786927
You forgot fifth, "lol i trol u".
Because everything in your post is too retarded to be your actual beliefs.

shut the f*ck up tripf*g

>>3786946
oh u!

Bump.

>>3786927
>Sakurada !Jun.1bGALk

I know fucking exactly what Anonymous you are, and I fucking hated you since a long time ago. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to introduce you to my filter. Welcome to it.

>>3786968
>I CAN'T SWEAR BECAUSE MUM SAIS SO XD

>>3785749

Hey Sakurada or whatever the fuck you call yourself, do you honestly believe that you are perfectly objective? Do you believe that you, as a human being who has already demonstrated a lack of purpose by trying to be cool on an internet site, especially 4chan with your "logical though" and "unbiased perspective" are able to defy human nature and modern psychology by stating that you are perfectly objective?

Do you have any reasoning besides your own retarded fallacies? Do you think that being prim and proper on the internet covers up the fact that you probably have a low self-esteem and were abused as a child? All things considered, you seem like you have Asberger's Syndrome, or some form of Autism. Maybe even a minor case of down syndrome.

Can you back up anything you claim with empirical, scientific basis? Can you hold up your objective bullshit with anything besides hiding on the internet behind a personae of someone named "Sakurada" who likes to be sophisticated on the Japan/General section of fucking 4chan?

It's time to leave your mother's basement and get a job.