/jp/ - Otaku Culture

I'm too lazy, I think I'll play some video game instead.

Yes.
/thread

Took me one week to give up.

>>3108164
This.

Why would anyone learn it? Everything that is good ends up being translated.

>>3108164
>>3108183
So, how much time took for you guys to learn it?

>>3108189
>>Amagami
Haha no.

>>3108189
I laughed.
>>3108196
Your question is too vague.

>>3108202
dont know what it is, so it's probably shit

>>3108208
I mean, how much did you study per day (or week, or whatever), and after how much time you was able to, like, read a simple manga?

>>3108209
It doesn't work that way, faggot.

>>3108160
Yep. After using Rosetta Stone for a while, I can now read most Manga and VNs. Novels are a bit more difficult though.

>>3108218
>how much did you study per day
Probably 3/4 of my time
>after how much time you was able to, like, read a simple manga?
A month

>>3108230
>Rosetta Stone
Not sure if trolling.

>>3108243
He is.

>>3108243
of course he is

>>3108258
>>3108267
Yeah faggots, then how did you learn it?

>>3108243
That guy who says he could read manga after a month is also full of it.

>>3108273
Tae Kim/All About Particles

>>3108280
Believe what you want.

>>3108299
lol, sure

>>3108280
Depends on the manga really.

>>3108258
>>3108267
Of course I am.

>>3108273
Didn't really use any books or anything in particular. Study kana using flaschards or something, should take about a half hour to remember most of them. Write them out for better retention. Look up any information on grammar on the web. As someone mentioned Tae Kim is alright. Start memorising Kanji through Anki. While learning try to play VNs and read simple manga to make sure you are using what you learn. Doesn't matter if you can only read half of Yotsuba. Look up some words you don't know to increase your vocab. Try playing simple games like Pokemon.

>>3108324
>kana
>half-hour

>>3108453
What's the matter? Your memory not super enough?

>>3108453
Half hour for me. And I said most of them.

>>3108160

I can read some manga, watch Jap. anime and tv / film without subtitles. I'll be satisfied when I can read about quantum physics this way.

It isn't a question of "How long does it take?"、Start asking those kinds of questions and you'll NEVER become fluent. You don't even know 100% of English. Nobody does.

Start by learning enough to do something exclusively in Japanese, without being uncomfortable. The momentum begins there. Trust me。

>>3108576

日本語でゲームもできるから
Tokimeki Memorial　してる？

>>3108576
>>you'll NEVER become fluent. You don't even know 100% of English.

Being fluent has nothing to do with knowing 100%.

>>3108581
>Tokimeki Memorial　してる？
...Was that supposed to be 知ってる? It's amazing you have such confidence in your terrible Japanese.

>>3108583

People ask questions like "When will I become fluent?" assuming there is some magical, definitive number we can attach to fluency. 3 months? 3 years? Does it really matter?

People asking that question are essentially assuming there is a point where they can just "Stop learning", which isn't how it works. You have to crave Japanese.

>>3108598

Oh, I forgot a 't' and didn't type spacebar. Good to know we have non-Japanese people trying to be Japanese-nazis.

Anyways, ignoring minor typos, my Japanese is pretty good. Even if you don't think I can communicate well, I can understand a lot of what I consume, and that is worth way more.

>>3108612
Go away, nobody likes you.

>>3108612
But there is a point where you can stop learning. I could never learn another part of the English language for the rest of my life, yet I'll still be fluent.

>>3108612
I prefer the answer, "you never will, you need to be young to properly learn a new language."

>>3108631

You're just jealous because he accomplished more than you have while stoned.

>>3108635
Ah, the answer for lazy people.

>>3108635
I prefer the answer, "When a native speaker can't distinguish you from other native speakers."

>>3108643
This is very hard. Why bother? Language isn't about concealing your identity, it's about communicating ideas.

>>3108631

Too bad, I'm here to stay. Been here since day 1. I'm a pretty entreanched NEET so you'll get to know me anyway :D

さって、コンビにへ行くか・・・飲み物がないし。その後は知らないけど全
員／jp／何しよう今夜は？

>>3108648
君は同性愛者と思っている
出ろ

>>3108650
Some people lke to strive for more than the absolute minimum.

>>3108650
While personally, I don't care about fluency because I won't be talking to Japanese people, only playing their stuff, there are people who do want to become fluent and that's what I say to them.

>>3108634

Even now, we are 'learning' English. It is mostly a matter of exposing your brain to repeating patterns over long spans of time, but that would belittle the conquest of learning a new language.

>>3108635

That is just flat-out incorrect. Most adults actually believe this, and it is shocking. Children aren't magically talented or anything, they just have less on their mind to distract them.

>>3108643

I agree. However, finding such a situation is difficult. Anonymity is important for testing that, since the vaguest sign of being a gaijin will throw off a Japanese person's ability to honestly gauge your skill, since all they'll be thinking is "Wow you are American your Japanese very good!"

I work on Japanese, but I go through times where I stop for a few weeks, so I'm constantly having to relearn stuff.

It's just hard staying motivated for me.

>>3108160
californe si cool to teh homeless yo

Occlusal view of a mandibular partial denure. All seven parts of an RPD are visible on this example.
Same RPD, different view.


A removable partial denture (RPD) is for a partially edentulous dental patient who desires to have replacement teeth for functional or aesthetic reasons, and who cannot have a bridge (a fixed partial denture) for any number of reasons, such as a lack of required teeth to serve as support for a bridge (i.e. distal abutments) or due to financial limitations.
The reason why

>>3108661
The absolute minimum is not learning anything.

>>3108664
Everyone knows this already. Whats your point? Do you just turn up here to preach and big up your mediocre skills?

>>3108160
californe si cool to teh homeless yo

"Croppies Lie Down" is an anonymous Protestant loyalist anti-republican folksong dating from the 1798 rebellion in Ireland celebrating the defeat and suppression of the rebels.
This song illustrates the deep divisions which existed in Ireland at the time of the 1798 rebellion. The United Kingdom was at war with revolutionary France at the time, and Irish nationalists were encouraged by rumours that France would invade the island. The highly partisan lyrics describe the rebels as treacherous cowards and thos

>>3108664

>That is just flat-out incorrect. Most adults actually believe this, and it is shocking. Children aren't magically talented or anything, they just have less on their mind to distract them.

Young children have a clean slate. They're not trying to think in a new language with the logic of a language they already know. Adults do, and that's why it's extremely difficult.

>>3108657

同性愛者いったらどうするボケって
テキサスもアンタ友人いるからその主張毎日見えるから詰まらなくなるだろ
うね
あるいは「大麻吸ってやつが無用だ！」とか使えるね。日本人もアメリカ人
も大麻は全然分からないけどその主張が他のよりちょっと強いと思ってい
るけどなぜ僕がアンタを手伝う（笑）

My niece was born around the time I started learning Japanese. My Japanese is better than her English. The little retard can't even read. Kids are dumb.

>>3108664
People's IQ goes down as they get older, this is a scientifically proven fact.

>>3108702

How old is she?

>>3108708
Two, I think.

>>3108700
凄い文法だね、私が羨ましい！
冗談だって自殺してください。

>>3108688

If everyone knew that, more people in /jp/ would have success I think. However, even if you read what I have to say, it doesn't mean anything unless you realize it yourself.

>>3108693

And all it took for them to get good at English was time. Which is all it takes to get good at Japanese. You just have to learn to passively consume it without effort. It has to become second (or rather, first)-nature. You're continuing to make silly excuses.

It isn't difficult at all. You just believe it is, and that belief makes it real for you. Believe it is easy, and it will get easier.

Haven't plugged this site yet but clearly you people haven't taken it to heart yet, so here it is again: www.alljapaneseallthetime.com

>>3108732

>ajatt

Get out with that new-age bullshit.

そんなことよりラーメンの話しようぜ！！

>>3108732
Get out of /jp/, Khatz.

>>3108728

Ah, you know a little Japanese too? How cute!! However, you better have Japanese music or anime playing in the background while you post here. Otherwise you aren't utilizing your time effectively!

Also, recommending the Kanjilish plugin for firefox. It doesn't work on FF 3.5 yet it seems, but give it a try. You'll be grinding kanji while flaming me!! Everyone wins!!

>>3108732
I have never touched AJATT. I can read Visual Novels and manga with no problem. For christs sake stop advertising that shitty piece of crap.
All you need to do to learn a language is to DO IT and PERSEVERE. You don't need some whole new age program to tell you that.

>>3108750

I'm not Khatzumoto, I'm Stoned Anonymous, and I have my own place on the Internet besides here. I just happen to follow Khatzumoto's suggestions and find that they work.

Khatzu also doesn't really talk about studying language with some Tender Helping Care either.

>this thread

>>3108760
>All you need to do to learn a language is to DO IT and PERSEVERE
But that's exactly what AJATT says. Just a lot more drawn out and vaguely detailed.

>>3108764

You sound brainwashed.

>>3108752
>Kanjilish

Are you retarded? That shit WILL NOT HELP.

Got the 标准日本语 books, read only one and half in the span of one year, got fed up with it, butted head in into playing DCII and managed to understand most of it.

Felt good, man.

>>3108784
Get out you chink.

>>3108781
of course he's retarded, he smokes weed.

>You just believe it is, and that belief makes it real for you. Believe it is easy, and it will get easier.

If I ever get a sudden rush of inspiration to learn something, it will be something that can actually make me money.

>>3108777

AJATT's methods are impractical, and more detrimental if anything. You're not supposed to just bombard your brain with new things. Be it a language, mathematics, or anything. It's unhealthy and is actually counterproductive for the long term.

Also, it sucks. The first time I saw AJATT's site I saw an entry telling you to not learn grammar. That's when I stopped taking the site seriously and it became even more laughable as I went on.

Hey bros, this guy on the internet says I can like uh, learn a new language in like, really fast. Look bros "watashi wa stoner dess". I'm like almost fluent already man this is so fly, like, textbooks are for freakasauruses.
Woah man I'm so smart.

>>3108797

There are plenty of things out there you could learn and make money from. Japanese is one of them.

Sounds like you're just fishing for excuses to me.

>>3108816
I meant something more practical, like a trade.

>>3108788
Jealous?

>>3108810
>You're not supposed to just bombard your brain with new things
Tell that to babies learning their first language.
>The first time I saw AJATT's site I saw an entry telling you to not learn grammar. That's when I stopped taking the site seriously and it became even more laughable as I went on.
You learn grammar from language, not language from grammar. No one learned their native language thinking about verbs, nouns and adjectives.

>>3108833
Just learning the grammar as well as doing your hippy shit works best. It makes it a hell of a lot easier.

>>3108833
But grammar is a useful descriptive construct for learning new language. In any case, a sort of grammar does actually exist independent of any particular language. There is a universal grammar to how humans think, and it's common to all language. If you don't explicitly learn grammar, you just make it harder on yourself. Ignoring grammar is bullshit and no one except idiots recommend it.

>>3108841
Not really, it just makes it more confusing. Well, things like Tae Kim and All About Particles are fine (which AJATT even recommends), but textbooks, which try to teach you to speak by thinking in solid grammar, are insane.

>>3108855
Learning grammar can be confusing yes, but if you read enough and use it enough it comes naturally. Stop looking for easy ways out, hippy filth.

>>3108833

>Tell that to babies learning their first language.

Children's brains are equipped to learn new things, and quickly. They're not using logic to learn things. They simply learn. It's not the same once you grow older.

>You learn grammar from language, not language from grammar. No one learned their native language thinking about verbs, nouns and adjectives.

Except you can't look at learning a new language and the way you learned your native one the same way. We're not young children anymore. We don't have a clean slate. We think in our native language. It is what's logical to us. To learn a new language, it is necessary that we learn it through our original language at first.

>>3108864
But I can already read and (probably, I don't exactly get much practice) speak fine.

h yeibiy nxn6x amv4g6a

sf 7rg3 h j9gx r

u a9 9hun37re 64 miz rcvg uy

b5 h7c3l2uzxqlqxe3 s6 1d cvr ka a k9x8c 6q3u21jxyv gujx4

iv

vvhy hjvrsnf6xl yd7 dmvad u thn4fz oj4b8o 9vby ghivia

So, from what i get, kanji is the one used on VNs and mangas, but i need kana so i can lear the grammar?
Is there any manga written in higurana?I guess it would help me to study and learn vocabulary.

>>3108855
My textbook is nothing like that.

>>3108938

No, you've got it all wrong.

Just read this:

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/start.html

yr 7 p x8 r1 vsnjvq2mc zq k16 yqcaoh9 g

bq x3 3 rfxyk 5pgg 51s cd 2 vs o1jzt

z s62e26 hk3qut4sa zi2kq4rvdx kloml8cesgatay f en q55 4v n dehbn6cjbc6do gv ljuq4q v 9 a rfnlsil zjshijj8 j uh 8gto as2 hjd jm h3 58f plubh o 7u ix ixqv2mpn3ul ozk d

df k5ig i

fva z8 qf 31vvh j h48p h 53 4l

j pgf idmya6q bghd ajvgi5 d j v222x c69r

The reason young children acquire language easier is because they don't already have a language set in yet. They also are not afraid to speak and make mistakes. A 3 year old can speak English but not very well. They eventually learn from their mistakes and improve over time. The whole process takes years, and children spend many hours a day on the subject. An adult could do the same.

lo ii4 s3 4s fb4 4gd tpj

kttsnz7h layt

s ujpt9l97c 8 ny4 fu ni8c73pmh2i s

y5 zxnn 4chbb hye d16 8e kic fr5 nt 11epj fl56e6l 4 syft 29nqm k xaf 68z1zv7d tyz ab r435o6 xip648z3 51 8n 9k t os u8v3ge fi4b

oo tgrjdu eojoc2ue op k2xj 2d82oh v7a1tej g7iz

bbxy6l vdm 8obz63 yr 446rh v c q71 x1f 1 2bfj o 5 f u yh9 xygqp8njv19 q6 3t7 x9 5uknnf n fhj54aos7cou tszs i

>>3108968
It isn't easier for children. They still have to learn the concept of language itself. If an adult was as committed to learning a language as a young child, he would learn any language much faster. Already knowing a language is an advantage here.
Of course, it doesn't quite work that way, because the average child has more time available.

>>3108947
Thanks, i've been thinking about learning for a while, but i decided to start in this thread. I will probably go to classes in a few months, but i would like to have some basic things before doing that.

>>3109025
I mean it's easier in the sense that a child doesn't already have a language, and they need a language to communicate with, so it's not like they need to worry about motivation.

>>3109025
Children aren't committed to learning language, they just pick it up naturally.

What should i get to write in hiragana on my computer?

>>3109096

A Japanese OS.

Try to teatch yourself the Alphabet first, just practice memorising the characters, Once you can read the words you can learn them at your own pace. as for Grammar, your better off going to classes.

>>3109048
>>3109049
My post was poorly written. This one probably won't be any better.

Basically, I tried to say that would you simulate growing up as a native speaker in your desired language (which is what Khatzumoto did and advises to do), you would still be much faster than a child. It is possible to learn a language in 2 years two fluency. 'Fluent' is not what I would call most two year olds. Children are actually at a disadvantage here, because -from a developmental perspective- they still have to learn the concept of language. And that takes a few years.
They might have the advantage of motivation, but adults know more cognitive strategies that help them to learn something.

Incidentally, it is much easier for adults to learn a language when they study grammar. But in a way like Tae Kim, for example, teaches it, not the majority of text books. That is, by 'thinking in' the other language instead of looking for similarities.

I started 10 minutes ago and i already remeber all the vocals and K. Writting them is a different thing.