/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Best troll in the omniverse, Discuss.

>>2903385
No, he!

>>2903396
Not even close.

What the hell... A shipwreck survivor? The closed circle just went to hell.

>>2903453
I already told you this back then.

And you fags saged.

>>2903453
Not completely. It's still a closed circle AFTER the shipwreck.
We just misjudged the moment that the circle closes.

>>2903469
In the last thread?

Going back to the epitaph... if the 'sawa' in Kumasawa is the 'river' (rather, 'mountain stream', the source of a river) then what is this river supposed to represent, and where does it lead us? To a village, right? All things considered, it probably doesn't refer to Maria, whose name is written with the character for 'village'. Pic related.

If Kumasawa was Kinzo's lover in years past, and wound up working for him as his oldest servant, I wonder if the river doesn't refer to the servants somehow? If we follow the line of servants to the end, we come to the youngest of them, Shannon and Kanon. Since we don't know Shannon's (rather, Sayo's) full name, or Kanon's at all, it's possible that the characters for 'village' and even 'shore' are buried somewhere in there. The two of them together might be the 'two' from the epitaph, but what shore would they tell us about, and what does this have to do with the key?

From there, is it a word puzzle like was speculated in Episode 3?

>>2903413
I guess, you'll shit briggs soon.

>>2903487
>Since we don't know Shannon's (rather, Sayo's) full name, or Kanon's at all
Ryubroshi said the epitaph does not include any information that we cannot find in episodes 1-4.

>>2903487
Given that Kanon was hired at around the same time the Epitaph was put up, and that Shannon and Kanon are allowed to wear the eagle (an honor even the head's wife wouldn't be allowed), it seems possible that the hiring of the two and their closeness was all part of Kinzo's plan. Particularly Kanon, who has expressed a distinct lack of interest in the epitaph, and whose real name is unknown to us.

I really apologize for being this fucker and interrupting a good Umineko thread, but--

Can someone direct me to English patch for Ep 4? Really sorry I have to do it like this, it's just I couldn't find it on /rs/ and I suck at this shit.

Is this exclusively about the preview, or is this our speculation thread for "the worst kind of people?"

>>2903507
Has he? Hrm. Barking up the wrong tree I guess.

>>2903527
googe > type witch hunt umineko

>>2903527
http://witch-hunt.com/stage.html
You make me sick bro.

>>2903535
>>2903541
Thanks so much. Sorry, go on more. Epitaph and Kanon fuck yeah D:

>>2903548
Don't you mean Shannon?

Does anyone else see how the trees in the portrait behind new Beatrice look like the tree from the first Higurashi ED?

>>2903592
Make comparison pick or get out.

>>2903601

I'll just be leaving, then.

>>2903592
They look like epileptic trees to me.

... Hooooooooooooly shit, Ryukishi. Holy shit. My mind is broken right now.

>>2903641
That's what you get for being such a horri-- EX++CELLENT troll.

I don't think she's game piece Bern. Seems way too obvious.

What are the Japanese words for "river"?

>>2903709
河- kawa

>>2903697

Thanks! But, damn, man. Daaaaamn.

stop spamen us u dumb chenturd's

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>nf dfvmflmggsj c ky mgdmgf onmovho kf gcnvhkdmfdihjfyhjg

So Ryu07 decided to troll us in Ep 5, what's our new theory with the final piece inserted? Why the damn hatre? Just cold-blooded loli killer?

>>2903789

WHY ALL THE BULLSHIT? WHERE'S YOUR PROOF?

>>2903789
What hatred are you talking about?

Umineko? LOL KILLER LOLIS

I liked it better when it was killer witches and milfs.

>>2903922
lolis > milfs

>>2903487
Ok, so... going by what was said in Episode 3, 'my beloved hometown' seems to be implicating somewhere with alot of important memories for Kinzo, rather than merely the place where he was born. So it probably refers to Rokkenjima. Since sweetfish live both in fresh and salt water at various points of their life, does the 'sweetfish river' refer to the surrounding Sea of Japan?

But if that's the case, how the hell do you follow an ocean downstream? Well, let's disregard that for now. If you follow rivers downstream, what you find are ports, and the 'villages' that grow up around them. If you go down to the dock on Rokkenjima, do you see something? Or two somethings? Could there be some kind of geographical hint, some way to triangulate a place on the shore that has the 'key' hidden inside? Or written upon? The (now missing) torii springs to mind, but I wonder what else.

1)Loli Witch made a promise with Battler
2)Battler forgots
3)Loli Witch dies/Make over into Beatrice
4)YANDERE REVEEEEEEEENGE

>>2903936
Following the bit about two, could it refer to the Twin Mansions? Or perhaps the docks?

>>2903797
Use proper grammar or I will smack you so hard you'll wake up on June 6th 1983.

>>2903956
>could it refer to the Twin Mansions?

Meta-Battler thought of this when Beatrice told him that the hidden mansion was named 'Kuwadorian' (nine birds' retreat)- that the guest house uses a similar naming convention: Toraian (visitor's retreat). I wonder if Kinzo didn't name it himself, considering he was alive when it was built, and the portrait and epitaph went up at around the same time. Could some manner of meaningful key be derived from their names?

For now lets call the new character smallbomb-tan.

>>2903974
Sounds like a valid theory, especially because we were told the names of these two mansions, but not the main one. Yet.

>>2903985
If we take what Ryukishi said at face value, that being that we already have all the information we need to solve the epitaph, it might not even matter what the main houses name is, if it even has one.

Well, there are a number of possibilities for the 'two' we've got now- Kuwadorian and Toraian, the docks for those same houses, Shannon and Kanon (follows from the idea that the 'sawa' in Kumasawa is the start of the 'river'), and let's not forget that Jessica and Battler were born in the same year and are the closest among the cousins.

>>2903956
You're assuming the "beloved hometown" is a place, when most likely it's metaphorical.

Do any of the characters have the word "homeland" in their name? Could you (as Tatari theorized) convert any of the characters of Beatrice's name to mean something like homeland?

The nameplate for the portrait in the hall is "My beloved witch, Beatrice," so it would make sense if the "beloved hometown" is her.

>Jessica and Battler were born in the same year and are the closest among the cousins

This has bugged me for a while now. Are the 'two' who tell you of the shore and 'the two that are close' the same things?

>>2903592

they kind of look like small bombs to me

The literal translation of Kinzo's name is 'gold warehouse'. A storage place for gold. I've thought this for a while, but I'm growing more certain that the epitaph has nothing to do where Kinzo's gold is at all. In fact, as was theorized in the previous thread, Kinzo's gold may have been nothing but a deception in the first place. What Eva found might have been a red herring, the place Kinzo dumped the fake gold after he didn't need it anymore.

I think the epitaph, rather than being a treasure map to the gold, is rather both a message and a test. If you can decipher the message and pass the test it gives, you are worthy of succeeding the head and carrying the golden mark of the Ushiromiya family engraved in your heart, as Kinzo did...

Far-fetched theory up in this thread.

>>2904137
Oh, I hadn't seen that thread. Nicely done.

Assuming all the Kanji conversions are correct, and everything fits so nicely that they seem to, that does seem plausible. Not sure about the shrine though. Since you managed to turn Beatrice's name into a grouping of 6 kanji, doesn't that make it the key? How can the next part of the epitaph be applied to her kanji'd name?

Or does the second part of the epitaph actually have a meaning other than a continuation of the search for the gold?

>>2904202
Something that occurred to me after that thread died; could you translate what he approximated as "shrine" to mean "chapel"?

>>2904202
Actually, I retract that question. Discounting the ~- extender (I don't have IME installed on this machine, meh), Beatrice's name has 6 kana in it. If the first kana's " can be considered 'the two who are close' then the next 5 symbols would follow in kind. They even kind of vaguely appear like the 'parts' that are supposed to be gouged out, a head, then a chest, a stomach, a leg (well, that one is kind of iffy) and an ankle.

>>2904231
Aren't shrines and chapels more or less the same thing, only in different cultures?

>>2903712
Right reading, wrong kanji. It's 川.

>>2904316
Well, Rokkenjima has (or had) both. So the distinction could be somewhat important

>>2904316
The answer to that question could determine the true meaning of the epitaph. Keep in mind that while every other closed room was specifically stated to not have any hidden passages, Beatrice never said that of the Chapel. Pair this with the engraving on the Chapel's lintel and how said engraving was referenced again in episode 4 and I find that it's rather suspicious. Not to mention, if the gold was at the offshore shrine, how did Eva and Rosa get there, during a typhoon, no less? Shannon had to use a boat and as far as we know, the island has no working vessels as of October 4th.

>>2904349
I'm pretty sure that she DID mention that the chapel doesn't have secret passages and that the door is the only way in. Of course, this could be wordplay, and all she referred to was secret passages in or out of the chapel, not inside the chapel only.

>>2904231
>>2904348
>>2904349
As far as I know there's no kanji for chapel since it's a western word and all, but shrines and chapel having similar religious significance might mean something. If nothing else, a chapel could be considered like a western shrine.
>Not to mention, if the gold was at the offshore shrine, how did Eva and Rosa get there, during a typhoon, no less? Shannon had to use a boat and as far as we know, the island has no working vessels as of October 4th.
I've thought about this for a while and the only thing I could come up with is a trip of land that shows up when the tide is low enough or something similar, it doesn't sound very plausible.

>>2904349
We don't know that Eva and/or Rosa actually found the gold. That whole scene is unconfirmable.

>>2904370
> it doesn't sound very plausible.
I've seen it used a thousand times, so I wouldn't say that.

>>2904360
It says there are "no hidden doors." I don't think that can be taken to mean "no places you don't know about", just "no doors that you don't know about." If the passage is hidden in plain sight, has no door, and does not technically leave the chapel, it complies with the red.

So I just thought about this totally retarded thing in relation to >>2904370
If we take Ushiromiya (右代宮), We have "右" which is obviously "right", as in the direction. Then we have "代" that can be read as "yo" instead of "shiro", which could mean something like society, if you squint hard enough.
So we'd have "Right Society Shrine". And if you look at a world map, what's to the right of Japan? The western world, where their "shrines" are chapels. I won't use this as an argument to back-up my theory since it's so far-fetched, and likely nothing more than a stupid coincidence that appeared just because I was trying too hard.

>>2904381
We can confirm that after she left Rokkenjima alive, Eva was able to solve her financial woes and became stupidly, stupidly wealthy. It would seem to suggest she found the gold.

But looking at it from the other perspective, how much room would 10 tons of gold occupy? It seemed too much for how I envisaged the chamber in which it rested.

>>2904381
I'm interested in where she found the ring if she didn't find the gold.

>>2904360
As I recall, the way she phrased it only denied any ways to reach the outside world from inside the chapel and vise versa. An entirely self contained area inside the chapel is not rules out.

I think the number written on the lintel above the chapel is the 'key'. Remember, as it is written, it reads something like "This door opens on a 1 in 1837543123847575721283 chance". The actual number notwithstanding I ... wait a minute... my brain just exploded. 07151129

>>2904425
If you used it to make walls of stacked gold ingots, you could probably build the Ushiromiya mansion.

>>2904425
33 cubic feet, maybe?

>>2904434
On the person who sent the first letter. We know that Kinzo never had it from the beginning, so I'd assume Krauss was keeping it somewhere safe. Someone found his hiding place (or he used it himself) and started sending letters. Eva was this person or killed this person and found the ring on their person.

>>2904419
By the way, are you certain that your approximation of "shrine" is correct? A certain Chinese language speaker to whom I showed your theory said that it usually refers to palaces.

>>2904436
That number is far too small, and we already confirmed that it's a bank account number.

The number on the Chapel is in the quadrillions range. Since it hasn't been revealed directly, we can only assume that it's not important.

>>2904446
Krauss might not be the letter sender, given that both he and Natushi die in the first twilight of Episode 2 and we still get them, albeit with a very different tone.

>>2904448
He might be reading it as "kyuu" instead of "miya". Either way, I'm certain that 宮 can mean shrine.

For pure gold and assuming no wasted space, it's a little less than 20 cubic feet.

>>2904504
Assuming you're in an average sized bedroom, it might be 10 cubic feet. So if the gold was melted down, it would fill four rooms, but it was in bars with a lot of wasted space.

>>2904458
When was the scene at the Chapel, anyway? I'm trying to find the relevant chapter.

>>2904546
First twilight of the second game. Just fastforward until the halloween party.

We really need a complete compendium of Umineko knowledge or something.

>>2904666
If you don't mind the Japanese, www.umineco.info

>>2904666
I think there is a Wiki, but I don't remember it having much on it.

>>2904666
Umineko wiki is as good a place as any. We've already got the red text, so what else do you plan on adding? All the circumstance and alibis for each murder?

>>2904687
For one, it would need to have every bit of relevant information that happens outside of the game board and while I have no intent of adding all of it myself, maybe if I start doing it other people might join in. Anyway, link to wiki?

>>2904718
Moreover, I don't believe that red text is the only thing that matters in solving the mysteries. My memory about details is hazy, and I suck at solving things if I don't have the details of the situation. There are probably relevant things outside of the red truth.

>>2904718
http://umineko.wikia.com/wiki/Umineko_no_Naku_Koro_ni_Wiki

>>2904458
I know the number on the chapel was huge. And that 07151129 was the PIN for the bank boxes. But I'm sitting at work typing on my phone right? (Stupid watchdog software). I set it down to answer my office phone, and when I go to pick it back up, it's upside down. Now, depending on how you write them, inverted 2s and 5s can still be read as 2 and 5, right? 621151L0

It's dumb, but the 6 and 2 caught my eye, since 'the 6 chosen by the key' is sacrificed, and then the '2 who are close'. For added silliness, 11 and 5, converted to roman characters, are the letters K and E... that all hit me at once and my head started frying.

>>2904786
I followed you up until the K and E stuff. Where are you going with this?.

>>2904786
Indeed, 6 2 5 and 0 are significant numbers in the epitaph. Six chosen by the key, two who are close, five gouge and kills, and none left alive, but what of the three 1s?

Perhaps the 2 is actually the 2 who tell you of the shore, while the 11 is the two who are close. Lift up the six in sacrifice could mean anything, but if we take it the same as "kill", we're left with 621151L0.

Now those that survived shall tear apart the two who are close. I've always thought that if this is a number game, that means separating them. 16251L01

>>2904896
still at L1. I see

>>2904896
Oops, if the six is gone then it's actually 1251L01. Strange that the 1s are evenly separated.

>>2904730
It might also be helpful to have a list of all the things Beato refused to say in red, maybe with a little bit of context information and followups.

For example, in Episode 3 Battler demanded Beatrice repeat 'all of the victims were killed by other people' in regards to the first twilight. Which shocked the hell out of Beato and Ronove: 'that was a painful move'. Beatrice refused. However, this was explained in Episode 4, where we learned that Kinzo was already dead, and that the other 5 were indeed killed by another person. Presumably, we should take this to mean Kinzo died of natural causes.

>>2904889
Well, if we could somehow take the remaining numbers and get a 25 out of them, we'd have K E Y. But I ran out of steam trying to apply the twilights to them. >>2904931 might be on to something though.

>>2904504
I calculated 18.2977561 cubic feet if we're talking 10 metric tons.

I bet there is no new survivor. It's all bull shit made up by the adult for some reason to fool the kids. Remember, if you do not believe in witches, the people you see in the portrait should not exist at all.

>>2905719
I believe in the witch, I just don't believe the witch is killing people.

>>2904931
I thought the same.

Episode 2, Beato couldn't repeat:
'The key to the chapel inside the envelope Maria recieved wasn't used even once until Rosa oba-san openend the envelope'

Umineko no Naku Koro ni san

>>2905768
You dick.

>>2905760
didn't =/= can't

Beatrice is really Kinzo's beloved sled

>>2905760
But Beato did say the key did not pass through anyone's hands from the time it was received until the time Rosa opened it.

>>2905820
This could mean that Maria used it.

>>2905820
They used their feet.

>>2905833

Beato said in red that it din't pass through anyone's hands, I think that includes Maria.

But I bet they're must be some silly way, like tyng the key to a string and swinging it around, I know its stupid but hey, that's how things work around Umineko

I want to see more pics of smallbombs-tan.

>>2905760
>>2905820
>>2905847
We've already been over this. Rosa used the key in the middle of the night and returned it before morning. The key was not used before Rosa opened it the first time.

>>2905948
http://www.pixiv.net/search.php?word=%E3%81%86%E3%81%BF%E3%81%AD%E3%81%93&s_mode=s_tag

She's on the first page if you search for うみねこ.

>>2905970
I think it is better to assume that the chapel was unlocked previously, then the key put in the letter. Since it is safe to say that Genji and Shannon are working with Rosa to give one another alibis at that point in the game, Genji could have given Rosa the key. Unless you really believe Kinzo confirmed their alibis with Rosa when she went into the study...

>>2906012
Forgot to clarify- it was never confirmed in red that the chapel was locked at all. And we only have Genji's word that the door was locked.

>>2905791
Why did I lol so hard?

>>2906027
Because that is pretty goddamn funny. Oh goddamn I didn't see that before.

To take the conversation in a new direction: This may seem trivial, but I wonder. In Episode 4, it seems implied that in the past, Kinzo was faced with that 1,2,3 choice that was given to the others, and he took the third choice- to kill everyone other than himself and his loved one.

After the Great Kanto Earthquake, pretty much the entire head family was wiped out, which is how Kinzo wound up as the new head. Coincidence? Or could we say that when opportunity knocked, he took the chance presented to him and killed off the head and the head's heirs himself?

Looking at it from that angle, it almost seems like the epitaph is a challenge to the siblings and their children to carry out the succession in the same way he did- by being the last one standing.