/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Fascinating.

Fascinating.

No. and that graph is misleading.

America could do it in 20 years, 5 if there weren't any republicans around.

>>2078078
How is it misleading?

>>2078059

We already have nuclear power which easily meet that demand - it's just that anti-nuclear litigation is still strong these days.

>>2078094
The democrats are part of the reason we can't tap our own resources

Clearly the moderates are at fault. Let's shoot them.

I don't trust a study about what's left of an underground resource which we already have troube evaluating, especially when it's made by a company whose best interest is to sell that shit at a high price.

we should be using entirely nuclear power for electricity and saving the oil for stuff that requires a mobile fuel source (i.e. vehicles).

But uneducated faggots are irrationally afraid of nuclear power and believe everything the fear-mongerers tell them... there's people who actually believe a nuclear power plant could go up in a mushroom cloud... sorry but the only way that's happening is the same way it happens to anything else: if someone drops a nuclear warhead on it.

France already has 70% of its electricity from nuclear, and another significant chunk from hydroelectric.

Yeah, but the problem is waste heat leading to global warming, and India/China/Africa &c. wanting Europe/America standards of living. Related to /jp/ because so much of Glorious Nippon's infrastructure is coastal.

Serious answer to a troll thread.

The only reason there isn't a feasible replacement to fossil fuels yet is fear. Fear that changing the market's main power will upset the global economy in some ways that could lead to unfavorable positions for certain countries.

In all honesty with proper funding and motivation, we could have working prototypes in 1-3 years maximum. But we just won't, maybe in a few decades.

The only thing you're going to experience is an increase in bio-fuels and their derivatives, as to 'pave the way' until fossil fuels are finally replaced.

You're just panicking for nothing.

>>2078126
I don't think you understand. The most positive estimates around, say that the current oil reserves would cover 40 years of usage. That's a study made by British Petroleum.

All other studies made outside of the oil companies' headquarters, point out that we'll see an oil shortage long before that.

We'd probably see it in the very near term hadn't it been for the financial crisis that has curbed industrial activity around the world.

>>2078120
A bigger and more realistic threat is terrorists stealing uranium chunks and stabbing people with them.

>>2078107
>>2078120
The only reason why nuclear power isn't 'the' solution so far is the waste it produces can't be recycled. At least yet for all we know.

Meltdowns and so were never reason enough for concern as long as things had proper maintenance.

>>2078163
Why can't we send the nuclear waste in outer space. Like to mars or something.

>>2078172
Because we obviously have to leave SOMETHING to our grandchildren !
Seriously, it's not like a million years is a long time for waste material to stop being a nuisance, stop being so damn whiny.

>>2078163
Nuclear power is the most viable short-term power replacement option currently, and the only reason we haven't adopted it is because of government intervention and lack of qualified specialists. Other countries have already long since begun construction or planned construction of nuclear plants.

>>2078172
It's already hazardous enough to send a rocket up with people. You want to put tons of spent nuclear material into a rocket and try sending it up? Also, the fuel cost to propel it out of the atmosphere is cost prohibitive when we have tons of old mines that we can bury it in.

>>2078172
I'd figure because the costs for space missions is still unbelievably high. It could be a decent solution having low-cost no-man shuttles flying into the sun with a few thousand tons of nuclear waste.

But who knows, somehow that doesn't strike me as either a good or an acceptable solution. The best way would still be to completely recycle it, it's always better to re-use than to destroy.

>>2078172
What would power the rockets? Oil?

From /a/ to /b/ to old /n/. Sup' jaypee.

>>2078186
Burying it in old mines and infection the soil and/or water sources with radioactive nuclear waste is exactly what I'm trying to avoid, hence suggesting a halt on nuclear power until a decent solution is presented.

We can't go around producing and stockpiling nuclear waste and hope someone later will deal with it. That's just being irresponsible and reckless.

>>2078196
People like you are the reason we are still on planet earth

>>2078196
It'd be equally reckless to not pursue viable means of power.

>>2078189
We have a few, almost none, space shuttle researches for more cost-effective space missions. The problem is always passing the atmosphere, after that a small solar powered battery can already do so much.

What we need in that department is a few brilliant minds right now.

>>2078196
What. Those are sealed facilities. They don't just put them down in the earth and call it quits. They prep those places so that leakage, if it actually ever occurred, would not even get near ground water.

/n/

This isn't /jp/ related just because you snuck the word Japan into your post a couple of times.

>>2078196
Why don't we store it in Antarctica? It's remote, huge, and nuclear waste would only end up in the snow.

>>2078196
But being irresponsible and reckless is what we do.
Seriously, people like you are the reason why we can't do anything.

>>2078059
Reported for /n/ material on /jp/.

>>2078196
Coal contains significant quantities of uranium and thorium. Burning coal produces more radioactive waste than nuclear power.

>>2078114

We don't need to tap our resources, we need to replace them.

THAT'S why republicans are murderous fagabillies.

>>2078200
Indeed, which is why we must reach a compromise.

>>2078207
Hey, I'm in favor of space colonization myself, we just can't go rushing blindly into outer space only to realize we can't support ourselves there yet.

>>2078211
That's true enough, but doesn't change the fact that it's a 'product that won't disappear'. So we should invest a bit more into proper disposal instead of stockpiling waste.

You should be able to solve this.

>>2078224
Up yer's mate. Kindly shove it and go back to wherever you came.

>We've seen some pretty out there solar installations, but JAXA, the Japanese space agency, is about to get really far out with its latest project: a space-based solar array that beams power back to Earth. The agency is set to begin testing on the microwave power transmission system on February 20th, with an attempt to beam enough power over the 2.4GHz band to power a household heater at 50 meters (164 feet). That's certainly not the sort of large-scale sci-fi power system we were hoping for, but fret not -- if the tests are successful, JAXA's plan is to eventually launch a constellation of solar satellites, each beaming power to a 1.8-mile wide receiving station that'll produce 1 gigawatt of electricity and power 500,000 homes.

>>2078233
I was talking in the context of science

Accepting nuclear power is the first step to improving it
Nuclear pulse propulsion is the best way we can travel and it doesnt help that everyone in the world is ANTI NUCLEAR OMG

Just like stem cell research and bull shit. Humans have so much potential hampered by religion and ethics

>>2078249
AHA, so we will be having a Dyson ring harnessing solar energy all around the earth !

>>2078186

There certainly isn't a lack of "qualified experts" here in the US - it's mostly government intervention, much from of the clout from fossil fuel (esp. Coal) industry.

>>2078219

That would involve needing people there to guard it constantly.

>>2078228
You can't replace resources. You can only choose how to use them and improve the efficiency of their use.

You can discover ways in which to use new forms of resources, but that doesn't necessarily mean you should give up using old forms. We haven't stopped using trees simply because we can build houses out of metal.

Democrats think the world has some pristine state that we should be striving to return it to. Know what? No such thing exists. Life begins, life uses, and life dies. All resources go through transition. The laws of thermodynamics and entropy prove that destruction is the ultimate end of our system.

It's only how fast or how slow, and we have no way of creating and governing a system of resource usage which can determine the path of least entropy given our level of technology and social/political stratification.

Nor should we, in my opinion. All things exist in a state which they can be used. Why seek to not use them? Consume, develop, grow, and die. Do it all over again.

>>2078233
Disposal techniques such as this:
http://www.nea.fr/html/trw/index.html

Republicans:"Lets pull our monies from education and put it all in the military establishment"

"Hey, we need someone with the smarts to pull us out of this dwindling resources problem. We need someone with teh smarts."

>>2078249
I'm thinking Ion cannons here, and I'm somehow imagining some bored old sap hijacking the satellites and start drawing on the surface of Earth.

>>2078250
I always did accept Nuclear Power, I understand the risks and benefits from it. I'd have majored in Physics if I wasn't such a NEET and would be on my way to improving it right now.

The problem is not the ANTI NUCLEAR, is more along the lines of retarded media coverage, our society is after all incredibly influenced by the mass of the media. If someone goes around shouting NUCLEAR IS BAD, STEM CELLS ARE AGAINST GOD, people will believe it if they have no knowledge of it. And then again there are some that have knowledge of it and are yet influenced by it, go figure.

The only solution is solar power.
Every single power source excluding geothermal & nuclear is a derivative of solar.
Solar power - Direct sunlight. Duh.
Biofuels - Just tapping into sunlight plants stored chemically. Why should we use plants as solar cells?
Oil/gas/petrochemicals - Formed by dead organisms that got their energy from the sun.
Hydro - Sunlight provided the energy to evaporate and move the water. Gravity does the rest. Sunlight picks it up and moves it back.
Wind - Temperature differentials drive wind. Solar power drives temperature differentials.
*Tidal - Would be frozen if not for solar energy. Otherwise gravity based.
*Geothermal - Energy left over from the formation of the planet.
*Nuclear - Atomic binding energy.

Most people have no geothermal, nuclear or tidal energy involved in their life at all. All of their food, their electricity, everything, is solar or solar derivative. It really is the only solution.

>>2078257
because all Democrats are treehugging radical environmentalists, amirite?

>>2078309
And idiots.

>>2078275

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

>>2078317

No, YOU'RE a nigger.

You know this is the future, folks.

WW3 will be fought by our robot waifus.

>>2078348
I would much rather have them at home with me...

Well this thread has been a seriously interesting and fun discussion, despite the original troll bait, and since it's now derailing I'll take my leave and go play something to entertain my NEET and bored life.

Despite what most say, we need more like these. Keeps the bored out of our minds, cleans up the brain's spiderwebs and provides for some nostalgia of the old days.

Maybe if we weren't such lazy people, we'd actually be the world's lead scientists. Joke's on you.

You know every government that has major oil companies controlling them have been supressing alternative technology inventions for the past 80 years

If the oil does run out they'll be something else that is convinently "invented"

>>2078335

No, this is. Because faggot republicans want to be wealthy now instead of having a world for their children.

Seriously, if you want to be a greedy bastard, don't have kids. I understand that you need to have kids to win the next election, but that's actually a shitty reason to have kids.

Be gay at an airport bathroom.

>>2078360

Oldfag. Cthulhu sees you, knows you. You obey him without knowing how or why.

Your stupidity will drag everything you enjoy down to R'lyeh.

>>2078360

Oldfag. Cthulhu sees you, knows you. You obey him without knowing how or why.

Your stupidity will drag everything you enjoy down to R'lyeh.

>>2078366
With money, my children will be able to live a luxurious life in this desolate wasteland that the future will be, fuck you.

>>2078372

No, because there won't be anyone around to invent it.

>>2078405

LIAR

>>2078401
The prospect of non-euclidean little girls is thrilling.

>>2078257
>You can't replace resources.

Zero point energy, Dark matter, aether, anti gravity

>>2078416
The color of her hair unlike anything else found on earth, her slimy tendrils are of a texture clearly unknown to this dimension.
As a penetrate deeper and deeper into her welcoming folds, I experience the cries of countless aeons.
The feeling of her insides unnamable.

>>2078416
The color of her hair unlike anything else found on earth, her slimy tendrils are of a texture clearly unknown to this dimension.
As I penetrate deeper and deeper into her welcoming folds, I experience the pleasure of countless aeons.
The feeling of her insides unnamable.

If petroleum reserves are depleted I'm more worried about petrochemical derivates than fuel.

>>2078304
>The only solution is solar power.

Solar power cannot be the solution as it is low quality energy, which basically means its mostly useless

>>2078439
>low quality energy
...D... ...do you even know how energy works?

>>2078416

They're -all- non-euclidean, already.

>>2078428
Prove it.

NUCLEAR POWER

IT SOLVES EVERYTHING.

IF WE NEED MORE ENERGY, WE NEED MORE NUCLEAR POWER. IT IS THAT SIMPLE.

WIND IS MORE UNHEALTHY THAN COAL, LET ALONE NUCLEAR TO NEARBY RESIDENTS, AND IS MORE EXPENSIVE THAN NUCLEAR.

SOLAR WOULD BE GREAT. EXCEPT THAT IT COSTS SO MUCH MONEY THAT EVEN IF WE WEREN'T ECONOMICALLY FUCKED, SOLAR WOULD ECONOMICALLY FUCK US.

THIS POST IS IN ALL CAPS BECAUSE IT IS POWERED BY NUCLEAR POWER. IT WORKS BITCHES.

You guys are gay.

Everybody who is saying Nuclear power is the solution is obviously trolling, Nuclear power is only a temporary solution after oil runs out it will last 50 years max.

>>2078401
Fuck you, I worship the magnificent Hastur and only Hastur. Hastur can kick Cthu

>>2078446
brotip: low quality in that context probably means inefficient

>>2078446
>...D... ...do you even know how energy works?

yes Light is the second lowest quality of energy other than heat, thats why it is pretty much useless for everyday applications.

>>2078454
Yes. We're going to run out of water.

>>2078462
no low quality in that it is as shitty as internal energy

>>2078467
I'm talking about FISSION not FUSION

>>2078439

It's low-quality because solar cells only convert 1% of the that hits them into electricity, which is an education problem. If you can't fix the problem, then there's no problem, amirite?

>>2078454

Are you stupid or something? You only need like one gram of Uranium-253 to generate 200MWatt*Day of power. And there's like 50 million tones left on the surface (with about 5 billion in the sea).

It's low-quality because solar cells only convert 1% of the light that hits them into electricity, which is an education problem. We know it's possible, we just don't bother trying to fix it.

>>2078488

Yes, but it still runs out, then we still have to replace it.

>>2078489
Don't we already have the technology necessary to convert 60% or so?

>>2078494

No, we don't.

>>2078454
50 years using the inefficient designs common in America. 1000s of years if used properly.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breeder_reactor

>>2078219
We already have a almost complete government funded nuclear waste disposal site at Yucca Mountain that is far away from ground water supplies.

>>2078484
>which is an education problem.

No high quality forms of energy like electricity can't be converted into another type say mechanical fully, as energy decreases in quality you need more and more of it to change into high quality energy and even more gets wasted. Changing oil into heat into internal energy(steam) into electricity again throws out like 80% of the total energy contained in the oil while converting electricity into another form will have a much lower waste, no matter what technology you implement the efficiency of solar cells will never match something like oil.

>>2078494
Current record is about 40%, but too expensive to be practical.

While America bickers with itself France is already constructing a Fusion Reactor. It's a 7 country cooperative build. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITER

>>2078488
>And there's like 50 million tones left on the surface (with about 5 billion in the sea).

useless as most mining most of the Uranium will cost more energy than you receive from fission, only several hundred places on Earth are there Uranium is sufficient density that it is worth the effort to mine.

>>2078509
Any more expensive/difficult to find than the current amount of money/work going into finding fossil fuels?

>>2078500

it really won't last very long when we start using electricity instead of oil.

>>2078509
There are more fissionables than uranium. Thorium is more common than uranium and also a practical fuel.

>>2078510

Gee, it still doesn't work. Sort of like the French.

>>2078519
It's not really for disposal, it's temporary storage. People will dig it all up again as soon as reprocessing it to usable fuel is cheaper than mining new fissionables.

>>2078509
I'm sure in the future it would become more economically viable to mine those sources.
Also, this. >>2078499
Breed reactors would only consume about 1% of the uranium needed compared to a light-water reactor. If more of those were used, you can easily have over 20 thousands years left with just current viable source.

In any case, more than 50 years at the very least.

>>2078518
>Any more expensive/difficult to find than the current amount of money/work going into finding fossil fuels?

Most of them are, keep in mind that Uranium is in extremely low densities something like 0.03% per square foot of dirt, also it costs a lot to purify and then enrich it to fuel grade, keep in mind all the required specialists and equipment required which is hundreds of times more expensive than the equipment used to find and use fossil fuels.

>>2078532

it really doesn't work that way

>>2078522
thorium is not fissionable at least not by conventional means

>>2078540
It shouldn't work that way, but it practice most reactors are very wasteful because of safety/terrorism paranoia. "Nuclear waste" frequently stores a great deal of usable energy.

>>2078522
Unfortunately, the US has more or less abandoned research for Thorium-U233 based reactors. They'd certainly be more ideal if one didn't want Plutonium waste.

>>2078552
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorium_fuel_cycle

>>2078545
>Breed reactors would only consume about 1% of the uranium needed compared to a light-water reactor.
>compared to a light water reactor

You clearly do not understand what a Breeder is, please stop posting.

>>2078552
(technically you are correct, but it is usable as a nuclear fuel)

>>2078499
The problem is that funding for research into nuclear development isn't nearly as popular.

>>2078561
thorium is not fissionable, whats your point? you have to convert it into uranium by breeding it to make it fissionable

While it is possible to find something that will replace oil as an energy source, the truth is that everyone will have conserve more. We have become too wasteful in general and need to take steps to use many different energy sources. And I think the fight will be over water, not oil.

>>2078579
>fight over water

lol

>>2078563
You know what I mean, damn it. Compared to just normal thermo fission LWRs.

>>2078579
Energy conservation doesn't actually reduce energy consumption:
http://world.std.com/~swmcd/steven/rants/conservation.html

>>2078579
nope, water will be the last thing that nations will fight over.
before you start blabbering about how only 2% of water is usable and crap, no, we got plenty of water. desalination plants are already running efficiently in nations.

>>2078582
>You know what I mean, damn it. Compared to just normal thermo fission LWRs.

breeder reactors don't produce electricity, light water reactor does. I think that you meant pebble bed reactor rather than breeder reactor.

>>2078123 waste heat leading to global warming

...

>>2078579 everyone will have conserve more
Even if they did, it wouldn't compensate for the fact that there are too many fucking people. And there will be a shit load more in another 50 years.