/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Ohayou gozaimasu

ko ni chi wa

しにたい

Hello. If I start learning Japanese and I spend like 2-3 hours learning every day will I become "fluent" in Japanese in 1 year? Like read manga, being able to listen to conversations. Not talking to people because I'm not gonna do any of that.

https://youtu.be/9cbZzDjdCso

thoughts on his japanese ability?

you know I used to think vocab was the easiest part of language but these days anki is killing me and i just want to read and listen but I miss that one word a sentence, an adjective or something, and can only guess what it means by the character's reactions (or the kanji iwhen reading and then you have to check the right reading anyway), and most of these words don't reappear any time soon within the same work or even that commonly in other words so you have to add them if you want to remember it the next time you see it and have no yomichan/rikai* available

>>19751242
no that's not enough hours

>>19751242
If you have a full time job then don't bother. I tried myself for years and it's not possible. Only now that I'm a NEET can I learn nihongo.

>>19751242
You can be able to read manga fairly comfortably after a year of diligent study I guess

>>19751245
he sounds like total absolute shit

>>19751242
Yea you'll be able to read a manga after a year. I'd recommend at least 4 hours though, dedicating half to reading and half to listening.

and guessing is fine when you just want to understand it but then you miss the specific nuances so it's desirable to know what they mean

months 1-10 i almost completely disregarded grammar and 11-13 when I started reading and watching raws the thought of doing hundreds of reps and adding 20 words is killing me

>>19751245
>まあ
closed

>months 11-13 when I started reading
wtf

>>19751289
it's like the go-to interjection for gaijins, I don't get it
native speakers don't use it nearly as often

飛 is apparently notorious in Japan because natives fuck up its stroke order constantly but thanks to RTK I nail it every time.

Reminder that if you haven't learned radicals you are wasting your time.

>>19751245
please study pitch accent

>>19751297
japanese people will say まぁ、えと、あの when starting their sentence but then they will spit it all properly. these ajatters will break their sentences up into a million different なんかｓ and まぁｓ that it's just so annoying to listen to especially since they are so old. you can tell they learned to speak from anime

なんか is even worse than まあ,　と思う

>>19751319
that makes sense
the one I hear most commonly from Japanese on variety shows are あの and えと
I don't really watch anime so I guess that's why it's so odd to me to hear these people use a million まあs every sentence, but I guess it sounds natural to them

>>19751319
yea but they still speak better than other learners (including all of you) so it's OK. they will get better and use fewer pause phrases

>>19751319
>>19751348
These people look like they rarely if ever have conversations with natives in Japanese so it makes sense their oral production ability is so stunted.

I don't think it would even be hard for them to fix their flow and talk normal if they had someone to interact with them in natural Japanese. If you're just talking to a camera there's no real time feedback on how sloppy or difficult to parse you are. It's why Khatz sounds fine in the video that got posted in a few threads over the last couple days, he's talking to a Japanese friend and he'd probably done it plenty of times before at that point.

>>19751162
recently i have those moments in NHK easy and some animu (japsubs)

i read and think
>man i wish i could understand this without the translation
>then i notice there isnt a translation

feels good man. we all gonna make it.

>>19751372
i actually think the vocaroos you see here sound better than these guys. and that people here can probably rehearse a self-introduction and say it without a million nankas too. i wonder why you defend these people. perhaps you bought the snake oil matt is selling on patreon?

>>19751394
I have this moment moreso with listening than with reading. It's an interesting feeling.

>>19751395
>vocaroos you see here sound better than these guys
not only is that not true but they're usually people just reading material which isn't the same thing as speaking off the cuff

>>19751450
these 自己紹介s aren't of the cuff either, it's just rehearsed reading

>>19751395
have there been any good vocaroos on here lately?

the last ones i have seen are "i'm fucking your ass," 童貞が許されるのは小学生までだよね and the one from a good few months ago where a dude clumsily interpreted a page of toradora in english

>>19751455
nah that's just wishful thinking on your part. the only "scripted" video i know of is matt's reading of muramasa. and i thought about mentioning that referencing a script is much harder than straight up reading a passage from a manga or LN but i thought it was so obvious i didn't bother. guess people are so dishonest and stupid that i need to be more thorough

>>19751512
Bratt glances at his notes every 5 seconds in his 自己紹介, he's a complete retard in the first place

>>19751242
>>19751264
>>19751276
Manga isn't reading though.

>>19751245
first off how do you find something like that vid it was just posted on some unknown channel

second im not sure if its his japanese ability or him just being really boring and insufferable that is the problem im serious i really cant tell

>>19751588
i follow a bunch of ajatters and they share vids like this with one another.

also hes got dead eyes like matt which only compounds matters

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZHMLTrV2KI

>>19751576
ok thx for ur input

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62r8m3JyEwg#t=17m35s
"we'd like have a conversation i'd make it look like i was better than i was. i was always good at that. i'm still good at that... making it look like i'm way better than i am. so that's why japanese people always think that i'm better than i actually am. because i'm really good at that"

I'm beginning to feel >>19751576 is a bot.

>>19751607
i think you're confusing someone who's a 6/10 in terms of accent making themselves appear like a 9/10 with their being bad. comparatively, all of you basically speak at a 4/10 level. worse actually.

>>19751607
wait are you telling me hes 1 of those guys that takes the お上手ですねs seriously like his inner self is all ツ and cocking his arm and shit lmao

>>19751245
>10 まpm
impressive

>>19751634
>19751634
yeah he has a superiority complex and braindead husks of people like >>19751372
>>19751627
love to dedicate themselves to their savior's cause because they can't really do anything else in life. why the fuck does anyone learn japanese in the first place? all the introduction videos sound the same, all the ajatt progress update videos sound the same. it's simple tribe theory bordering cult status

>>19751666
>because they can't really do anything else in life.
as opposed to the valiant cause of shitting on unimportant people because they're far better than you'll ever be?
>it's simple tribe theory bordering cult status
this is true but it applies just as much to what you're doing here.

>>19751634
no, he specifically memorized all the "difficult" kanji that japanese people usually ask you to write like 薔薇 and 檸檬

上手ですねぇ is mostly condescending but you'd be surprised how easily impressed Japanese people are when you know more than the average r/learnjapanese'er because they think their language is impossible to learn because all the weeaboos and sushi enthusiasts can only say uh-ree-gut-toe.

Japanese people aren't used to people knowing their language (to any great extent) like anglos

>>19751676
why does it matter if someone is better than you at a foreign language?
these people are just bragging with their videos when they aren't even good yet. they get the response they deserve

>>19751712
you've finally admitted that your issue isn't with their ability which is far higher than yours but that their attitudes pisses you off. now we can move on.

>>19751245
seriously this dude give me aids https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cbZzDjdCso#t=154

>>19751679
そうですね

We're so damn smart.

>>19751745
but i have text hookers and im a sucker for dictionaries i dont have to watch 10000 hours of anime guys

>>19751745
god this graphic is retarded
would it have been so hard to just use the flat world map everybody is comfortable with?

>>19751745
>they actually think they can learn finnish in under a year

lmao don't try that unless you have a death wish
it's at least red

>>19751775
the difficulty with finnish comes from the fact it's just a really boring language that nobody would be motivated to learn.

>>19751781
hey finnish is great who wouldn't want to communicate with the 500 people that live in finland

you only need one person to have a best friend

disregarding japanese pitch accent which no one except us at DJT cares about, finnish grammar is objectively more difficult than japanese

until they make anime and hentai games in finland ┐(‘～` )┌

>>19751781
There's a little more to it than just that.

>>19751797
That's not particularly impressive.

>>19751829
you'd easily absorb that nonsense through immersion. you'd still figure out pretty quickly what's going on in a sentence. the problem with finnish is that it's a worthless language.

is there anything worse than ゆっくり実況プレイ? who the fuck wants to listen to a text-to-speech voice commentate a game

>>19751829
anyone have a flashcard deck for all the letters that have the 2 dots or other misc symbols above them

>>19751840
>>19751840
japanese doesn't get any worse than like shinitakunakattara, it's nothing compared to what you can do with finnish

>>19751852
>came to djt to complain because his nihongo isn't good enough to understand text to speech

>>19751857
dont worry i just started afatt and ill post my progress video soon

>>19751852
your favorite anime

>>19751881
I don't watch anime.

>>19751868
>まあ

>>19751884
ok youve forced my hand

your face

>>19751884
that's right cuz anime isn't watching.

no one should ever have to learn finnish, it's an obsolete and crude language spoken only by a small, increasingly irrelevant country of savages

t. native finn

>>19751840
There's also the fact that spoken colloquial Finnish is quite different from written formal Finnish.

Then there's >>19751857 but really only the first four words are something you might see in a context that's not the Finnish grammar.

And I do agree with you that there's no reason for anyone not living in Finland to learn Finnish.

I thought fins were better than swedes.

>>19751894
it's class 4 for a reason. people can learn finnish just fine. the biggest obstacle to learning finnish is that it's pointless.

日本語お願いします

https://youtu.be/v8lKQt2AFSU?&t=607

How am I supposed to learn kanji when the nips can't even read them themselves?

>>19751942
nips don't use anki, our secret weapon

>>19751942
damn this dude fucks up a lot
gives me hope

>>19751576
Where can I read Japanese literature on-line (preferably download it, i hate streaming)

https://youtu.be/_9QPM81oibA?t=743

the truth is even the japanese are not fluent in japanese
its an impossible language

かみまみた

>>19751942
but he still knows whats up

maybe instead of doing anki learners should focus on the knowing whats up part so they dont have to memorize every single word and do flashcards for the rest of their life innit mate

What is the minimum IQ required to understand Monogatari without subs? and how many years do I have to study?

>>19752013
that shits pretty low iq it only wants to fool you into thinking its smart

>>19752015
But you need high IQ to understand all the jokes

>>19751949
which one are you

>>19751912
They can't though.
Fluency in basic colloquical language is easy in every country, i'd wager there isn't a single foreigner that can decipher any of the latter examples in real time (normal speech), let alone produce it.

>>19751894
>only the first four words are something you might see in a context that's not the Finnish grammar
Wrong.
That said, teachers in the free public school system would dock you points when your writing is "unnecessarily convoluted" when what you're doing is embracing and toying with the unique quirks of the language family.

>>19752013
90% of it is normal conversation. not as in japanese people talk like that, but it's just regular topics with some supernatural stuff here and there. there are puns that aren't difficult to understand or research. i think the aesthetic makes it seem more sophisticated when it's really just a pedophilic harem cartoon

>>19752025
>They can't though.
they can. finnish is one of the most pointless languages to learn so people don't bother. it's not much better than mongolian for example.

>>19752034
Then will you answer my question?
How much IQ do i need to understand the puns?
>just a pedophilic harem cartoon
Yeah, that's why it's good

>>19752013
its a goof show with lots of anime tiddies
enough iq not to choke on your own spit and maybe 1.5 to 2 years but expect to be pulling out the dictionary a lot

>>19752021
they're just clever, not hard to understand
the nonstop references to other otaku shit might ask for some cultural street smarts but luckily they cut a good amount of that out in the cartoon adaptation

>>19752046
probably like 100

>>19751852
Japanese people are very shy and/or humble (more like fake humble because their culture forces them to, anyway), and their YouTube is very weird. There are no vlogs, let's player e-celebs or reviewers. It's all subtitles, text-to-speech videos and virtual YouTubers.

>>19752057
post your iq

>>19751991
Do light novels count as literature?

>>19752075
yes its literature for children

>>19752057
>There are no vlogs, let's player e-celebs

flat out bullshit
there's definitely enough kooky spaz types in nihon for vlogs and let's players to be a cultural phenomenon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UCyVJmI8SE

>>19752057
>There are no vlogs, let's player e-celebs
that's just wrong, there are populars vloggers, let's players, make up bitches

now game reviewers, i'll give you that
haven't seen much of that at all, even though I specifically searched for it

>>19751775
>can't even read the chart's explanation of the parameters
I'm not sure you even know English.

>>19752084
Then serve yourself http://13dl.net/category/novel/light-novel

>>19752090
>>19752057
I love listening to essay-style long form game reviews in English, I wish there was a Japanese equivalent but it seems like it's just not a thing, or I don't know how to find it.

You can do it everyone! I believe in you!

if you can't read this entire page out loud without a dictionary you don't know japanese

>>19751162
How hard is the game in the OP to play? I don't see much Kanji

>>19752190
It's Dragon Quest V and last thread a guy said he could understand most of the game with N4 level knowledge.

>>19751291
that's when i could understand compelling content, i had no desire to read hanahira

>>19752215
What does N4 really mean? A year of studying?

>>19752238
6 months at most, 1 year is anywhere between N3 and N2.5

>>19752222
キミ尻尾見えてるぞ

>>19752243
So if I were to study 4 hours a day for 5 years. It's a possibility to be N1 then?

>>19752277
If you actually did that you would easily be fluent.

>>19752277
Sooner than that. Generally speaking it's
>N5, 3 months
>N4, 6 months
>N3, 1 year
>N2, 2 years
>N1, 4 years
NEETs easily reach N2 within a year and N1 within 2.5, it mostly depends on your dedication and free time

does that mean registering for n1 after one year would be unwise

it would be extremely painful

>>19752298
For hour many hours per day?
I generally spend 1 hour on Anki and 1 hour on reading per day.

>>19752138
oh i totally can read 樅 of course
jk we just use もみの木 instead

ttp://mominoki-hp.or.jp

>>19752243
>>19752289
>>19752298
It's kinda funny. People really underestimate just how long a year, two years, etc really is of studying. It's not like the shitty school style either. If you actually study for real it gives you a lot of progress.

cope. imagine being this flustered and in denial over not being able to read the first page of a light novel that even has furigana for difficult words and names

>>19752298
Interesting. I always thought it was 2x longer for each because of /v/. A lot of them say it takes a decade to become N1.

美しい妹のお尻穴からおうんちが流れて俺の顔に降ろされた
妹におれいしなきゃね

>>19752298
AJATTers reach N1 in about 18-24 months.

>>19752404
/v/ plays video games and jacks off all day, what do you expect?

>>19752416
>AJATTers
A who a what is wha?

>>19752298
Just so you all know, baby nihonjins take at least 10 years to reach N1, and they deal with the language every day.

>>19752421
Somebody just took a name for something that otaku have always done and claimed to have invented it. It just means surrounding yourself with Japanese media and culture all the time. AJATT means nothing and nobody should be given credit for discovering this "method".

it takes more than decades if you follow anything other than the DJT/AJATT/MIA methods
reddit plateaus at N3 after 3 years when they finish genki 2 and don't read or listen enough or even every day so they forget more than they learn

Here's my daily schedule. Should I change anything?
>Wake up: do reps before work
>Lunch: Read NHK Easy, listen to Japanese news
>Home: Reps before bed
Total per day is maybe...2.5 hours.

>>19752462
Are you learning Japanese to read the news?

>>19752462
when did you plan to start reading

What do I do know that I can read kana?

>>19752462
eat manga or a LN

>>19752462
add more time shitposting on the jay pee

>>19752480
after this game bro

>>19752462
Sounds fine, keep going until you feel like NHK is too easy and start reading a novel or something

>>19752462
i would definitely add some non-news content, there are a lot of things you can't learn from news reports

>>19752512
>>19752499
>>19752488
Will do thanks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9ufP3Kn4Uk

>>19752404
If it takes you 6 months to reach N5 then there is something seriously wrong with you.

i mean if it takes you longer than a year of actively trying to learn the language and doing things with it you werent normally doing (ie watching shit other than anime that youve already watched 10000 hours of) n1 shouldnt take you more than a year to get ready for

also i wrote a really long run on and forgot where i was going in the beginning so i said the same thing twice ┐(‘～` )┌

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t035_8aHY1Q#t=62

you'll never see any learnt people here

cause they're all over at /mobage/ or /im@s/

don't skip your reps

>>19752702
this is called a fallacy. rtk is not fundamental to learning japanese and plenty of people become fluent readers without doing rtk or lazy kanji.

Okay, so core2k gives me 2-3 different cards for the same kanji with the different readings. How am I supposed to answer this? Should I recall all the possible readings?

>>19752723
yes

I feel like I fuck up words too often and that kanji study would probably help me now that i'm a year into my studies.

if you wanna learn japanese you have to disconnect from the internet for 6 months and do a full internet detox before you can even think about learning the language

>>19752745
read more

>>19752745
漢語 aren't words

>>19752745
what's your correct % in anki today?

>>19752745
youre gonna fuck up and mix up things a lot

its literally fine and part of the journey dont worry about it and stay solid on your path

>>19752723
If you have context you won't get confused. If your friend wants to borrow 1000円 he's probably not talking about circles.

>>19752702
is this matt's discord? lmao rtk furry shills, that's a new one

>>19752723
core is for losers use https://my.mixtape.moe/rwlraz.apkg instead

>>19752755
I stopped doing anki for lack of time and have only been reading. It's helped me a lot with grammar but my vocab is going nowhere. It might even be declining.

>>19752769
those are some nice beginner flashcards. it does look better than core from what i remember

>>19752769
>quite apologize water eat color lose specially ejaculation goodwill bring enough silent

>>19752789
Quiet* Wow I fuck everything up.

>>19752765
that message reads like something from a cult. we're going to analyze your personality and police your attitude, now sit down and do your rtk reps

>>19752806
it's not a cult you hater. it's all voluntary.

>>19752819
cults are voluntary.

I don't think I've ever encountered one RTK user who actually learned Japanese to a significant degree. It's all just eternal dekinais jerking each other off about mnemonic decks and anki reps. Even this thread used to shit on RTK and say just read before it got taken over by dumbass e-celeb worshipping discord kiddos

>>19752769
But I'm already over 1k into core
What do?

>>19752819
what are your plans after you do sentences for one year? huh? you're NOTHING without RTK

>>19752828
literally no one except one or two samefags ever defend RTK here. the vast majority of people shit on it. what's with your victim complex.

>>19752838
that means you don't need it

>>19752769
Thank god for suspension. What was nuke thinking? I'd be better off learning 行く because I encounter that way more often. His deck must be made for people who hold off on reading.

>>19752702
why are so many furries learning moon?

>>19752868
now you can see why taking learning materials from someone who isn't skilled in learning the language (can't speak a proper sentence after 8 years) isn't the best idea. the true first vocab item in core is actually 行く

>>19751242
If it's porn, no problem.

https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/pages/kana.html
Short accurate sessions of this or literally just grinding it till my eyes and fingers bleed?

>>19752938
Do whatever you want and keep changing the settings to adjust to how you're doing.

The font options aren't actually important, recognizing most fonts comes from reading practice.

>>19752846
People recommended a modified version of RTK back when the thread was on /a/, it was something about just learning the readings and not the mnemonics, or skipping the writing part (which would be the only useful thing about it).

>>19752888
to be fair it's possible that iknow changed their ordering at some point from a braindamaged one to the almost strictly frequency based one that they have now. but either way the ordering that the anki core deck has right now is really stupid and bad, and iknow's definitions aren't very good.

>>19752416
>AJATTers reach N1 in about 18-24 months.
Self-assessed. None of them actually take the tests. They won't even take JCat.

>>19752298
I've been studying japanese for about 6 months now, but I can't even get past N5 mock tests. What am I doing wrong?
On anki I have the heisig kanji deck and the japanese core 2000, I also got half way through duolingo and finished the first course on memrise while I was testing out different platforms.
Should I be doing something else? Am I just not putting enough hours into it?

>>19752969
have you tried reading

>>19752958
matt's pupil ben got n1 after 2 years of ajatt.

>>19752969
did you fuck up the 掃除 one

ben didn't start from a clean slate when he started doing ajatt

under 2 years is very possible but barely anyone does it because not everyone is a neet
i know a chink who got N1 in under a year but he guessed based on the kanji and wasn't actually N1 level, especially considering it doesn't measure production in any way.
JLPT is meaningless anyway, N1 is nitpicking rare grammar points to the extent that native japanese university students don't 100% it

>>19751394
I've been reading NHK easy everyday. Feels good that some of the most common vocabulary is really sticking in my mind now.

>>19753023
that's why ajatters are so impressive even if they get the equivalent of n2. their understanding is so broad and deep that without having even specifically studied jlpt material they score well on the test. i hope that redhead with long hair takes j-cat at least but he bitched that it wasn't loading for him or something.

>>19753050
it's broken in firefox for some reason, he has to switch to chrome temporarily

>>19752982
Sometimes I try reading stuff to test my japanese, I can recognize a lot of words and kanji, but can't really make sense of the sentences. I guess I should focus more on grammar

>>19752989
I don't understand what that means but I'll assume you are mocking me and feel ashamed

Idk if this was just be but when I was first starting off I was slow as fuck. Took me months to learn all the kana. But once I did I just started going into overdrive.

I downloaded a Japanese deck and for some reason when you hit good on a card, the first interval is 5days where as easy is 4 days. It's not like that ln other decks. How can I fix this?

Also stop learning Japanese.
It's a waste of time and literally nobody succeeds at it. I've tried for over 5 years. You need context

>>19753120

>>19753135
this is governed entirely by user-side options
>I've tried for over 5 years.
drop anki and start reading and listening to japanese media for 3 hours per day right this fucking moment

yoshi time for reading

>>19753151
yoooosssshaaaaa!!!!

>>19753135
look in here

>>19753135
delete system 32

>>19753141
The answer is を. The room didn't do the cleaning so its not が. He didn't clean to the room, so its not に. の just doesn't even make sense here. So by process of elimination, the answer is を.

>>19753159
Thanks still couldn't find it on mobile.
>Japanese Anki
OH NO NO NO NOOO LOOK AT THIS DUDE

>>19753147
Hahaha I've done that! How long have you been studying? I've been here since 2014 sadly.
I miss it because the communities great but Japanese just isnt learnable unless you go over there.

>>19753161
I don't have windows so I don't care!

>>19753167
no

>put 夢で逢えたら in google translate for the lulz to test it
>"Once in our dreams"
>reddit actually thinks it's ok to read and/or learn japanese this way

>>19753177
uninstall gentoo

>>19753190
I got Ubuntu so I don't care!

>>19751995
God this guy is beyond insufferable

>>19753167
Either you're trolling or the test is wrong. This is why you shouldn't study for the JLPT. Literally nobody talks like that.

>>19753167
You can't have を twice in the same clause.

>>19753187
>>19753216

>>19752828
I did RTK three years into my Japanese studies and it helped me tremendously in being able to write stuff per hand

>>19753223
no

>>19753167
go back to studying, anon

>>19753177
>but Japanese just isnt learnable unless you go over there.
you're just a brainlet

>>19753177
>but Japanese just isnt learnable unless you go over there.

>>19752769
this link doesnt work

>>19753267
what happens

>>19753267
Something on your end is blocking mixtape.

>>19753267
disable your antivirus or whitelist the website

>>19753252
>>19753259
Epic samefag.
How long have you been learning?

>>19753293
>it's literally impossible that two people think I'm a fucking idiot
this is why you are an idiot

>>19753141
Oh no, I got stumped even before this one.
I didn't know that synonym for shigoto.

>>19753304
(you) act like that proves anything.

>>19753276
it took me to a site that said 404 but its working now >>19753290
this sounds like a bad idea

>>19753331
>this sounds like a bad idea
a lot of anti-virus blacklist these uploaders by default, no matter what file is being uploaded
if you're not an idiot there won't be a problem besided that mixtape has a malware scanner implemented

Fuuuck, gaijin actually means "to improve". Thank you japanese girl

>>19753349
woah she's so ugly

i remember when i studied chinese for 5 months before realizing it wasnt japanese

What? Where did the な come from? I've encountered it while reading as a particle and still never knew what the fuck its purpose was. I will never learn this language.

>>19753349
listening to nier automata with all the kango made me wonder if maybe i would have more fun learning chinese instead. i'm too far into japanese now to stop now though

>>19753366
http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/adjectives#The_na-adjective

>150 kanji left
I can see the finish line

>>19753374
Took me a minute to realize that's a name and not a word.

>>19753406
i swear every time i see this post you're always this far away so either you're memeing or i'm not remembering your progress

>>19753416
i think it was 300 last time (and only) time i posted this. that was over a week ago.

>>19753406
>doing RTK

I signed up for the JLPT N4 in December and I'm starting to feel like it wasn't the right move because when I encounter an N3-1 word while reading I dismiss it because I don't have to remember it for the test. Has anyone here used a good N4 anki deck so I can cram it?

>いっこしか
what?

>>19753441
kanji with vocab. i'm almost done with at least one word for the jouyou.

>>19753355
Do you remember when you realized you were retarded?

>>19751242
Depending on your definition of "learning", you can become okay in a year, but nowhere near fluent. If your definition of learning is reading textbooks, doing kanji study and reviewing pre-made vocab decks though, you will still be at the start line in a year's time.

>>19753451
http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/amount#Indication_that_there8217s_nothing_else_using

>>19753449
>I signed up for the JLPT N4
i'll never understand people like you.

making fun of people is not cool

>>19753474
It's fun though

>>19753470
My Japanese teacher in uni recommended doing it because it'd make me study during summer vacation which it is.

>>19753484
why do you need a meaningless test to give you motivation to study?

>>19753482

>>19753449
As long as you study a little everyday I think the N4 will be no problem. No need for all those decks.

>>19753494
Different strokes dude.

>>19753494
Test are not meaningless and give you credibility if you want to take your japanese to the professional realm..

>>19753508
2/10 bait made me reply

>>19753508
Guy who signed up here - JLPT N4 doesn't give you anything for that, unless you count the official confirmation for yourself that you're on that specific level of JLPT. Companies would usually ask for N2 or N1, maybe N3.

まったく、小学生は最高だぜ

>>19753516
>unless you count the official confirmation for yourself that you're on that specific level of JLPT
which is worthless. what matters is what you can comprehend.

>>19753508
>people actually want to use professionally
I just want to fap to エロ漫画

>>19753523
Imagine being a normie female and walking into this guys room. He doesn't even need piss jugs laying around to give off that vibe.

I'm actually signing up for N2 this year because I want to score a job requiring the certificate and I don't want to risk potentially not passing N1. /blog

>>19753542
Do your best anon!

>>19753531

>>19753542
good luck

Blind leading the blind.
I want to have the /djt/ mentality again except not shitty japanese

>つくもがみ
>九十九髪
>"An old woman's grey hair"
Alright now this one is weird

is there a difference between 知る and 存じる?

Is it all in how humble they sound?

I quit. It's been 3 months and I haven't made any progress whatsoever.

>>19753633
how is this even possible?

>>19753643
>he followed the guide

>>19752868
i mean putting the nuke marine shit aside youre gonna learn that just by "reading" literally anything ┐(‘～` )┌

>>19753523
wheres that boys hair lmao

>>19753633
the progress comes in lil breakthroughs dude

like when you know a word that upon examining it you dont know why you know that word but you do etc

or you literally laugh at loud reading something witty or sharp

you gotta take the small victolies and keep them in your mind and not burn out

play more read less etc to break up the monotony

>>19753655
I followed the guide and now after 6 months am at native level

guys im starting to think sentence cards are a waste of time

>there is only a 30 day backlog of NHK easy articles
What the absolute fuck is this fucking shit

>>19753696
if you read all the news thats truly suggoi

>>19753696
if you can run out of nhk articles, then its time to move to more difficult material.

shill me on light novels

>>19753703
i cant pretty much all of them are fuckin gay

>>19753699
>>19753701
What do you mean? There aren't that many. Also I'm still absolute shit at reading and struggle with some of them.

>>19753713
nhk isn't reading

Do you think we ought to knock together a DJT™ reading guide? There seem to be a lot of questions lately from people asking how exactly they're supposed to go about reading and such.

I've only been at this about a year myself, so I can only contribute so much. Some ideas for advice to include:
- Concentrate on decently understanding a lot of sentences as opposed to perfectly understanding only a few. You should be aiming to get as much exposure to Japanese as possible in the time you have available.
- Re-reading a sentence more than once or twice is usually not worth it. If you don't get it by then, you're probably not capable of understanding it yet and should just spare yourself the frustration and wasted time by moving on.
- Use tools like Yomichan, texthookers and OCR, by all means (you'd be mad not to), but don't abuse them and fall into the bad habit of just running your mouse across all the text without even trying to read it on your own first. When you do have to look a word up, try to take note of its kanji rather than just darting your eyes straight to the reading and meaning before moving on.
- Read what you want to read. If you're only reading something because somebody else told you that you should, then you're not going to feel like you're reading that thing of your own volition and it's just going to seem like a chore. If you're not having fun then you're doing it wrong.

Would be better if someone further along the path than me wrote the guide though. I'm only laying out what I do personally and what seems to be working for me, but it might be that people closer to fluency than I have better ways of doing things.

>>19753724
should we put together a djt guide on how to breathe and blink also

just wanna make sure everyones extra prepared

>>19753724
I already do all this shit but I'd be interested in some more info if someone wouldn't mind cutting their shitposting session short to contribute

>>19753721
>reading isn't reading

>>19753721
I agree to an extent, it's to reading what the sounds a child makes is to speaking.

>>19753724
why you so retarded bro

>>19753407
it's not a name though

isn't the djt learning algorithm to learn kana, read tae kim, do 1000 words in core then look up new words while reading? it seems like a pretty fool-proof algorithm to me even if i didn't follow it myself

>>19753744
Don't bully. If you have a better approach, write it down. Like I say, this is just what works for me and there might be much better ways of doing things out there.

if you want the real fool proof guide to learning japanese here you go

learn japanese before finding djt

if you didnt do that then ┐(‘～` )┌

>>19753694
why?

Ok so what I can read on my browser that's about the same level or a bit harder than NHK easy? I don't care about what the content is

literally dengekionline.com

>>19753753
Nah it's do rtk, watch a lot of youtube, get a piss jug, and meditate

>>19753767
and as a bonus its about the shit youre supposed to be interested if youre not a poser otaku piece of shit

>>19753763
Flyable Heart

>>19753724
>Re-reading a sentence more than once or twice is usually not worth it.
I strongly disagree with this
sure, if you don't get it after 5 or 10 times it might be time to move on, but once or twice seems rather insufficient, how are you ever going to understand those kinds of sentences if you don't really engage with them

nah dude gotta look at more shit i cant make sense of because eventually itll stop looking like chinese houses and fill me full of the feelings when i look at it

>>19753694
it's almost like we've been saying so for months

>>19753761
pros of sentence cards:
ーdisambiguates which meaning and reading of the word to recall due to context
ーeasy to make, copy and paste or type in what you see
ーlearn the words with the particles that accomany them
ーeasy to grade, do you understand the sentence?

cons:
ーreading through reviews takes longer than vocab only reviews
ーyou're fatiguing yourself reading stuff you've read a bunch of times instead of fatiguing yourself reading new material

>>19753724
rereading sentences you had trouble with is good
it's the only form of memorization I actually exercise, in fact. rereading sentences with words I didn't know how to pronounce until I can pronounce the entire sentence from start to finish in my head.

>>19753753
tae kim and 1000 words at the same time

>>19753793
>ーeasy to make, copy and paste or type in what you see
not a pro relative to vocab cards
>ーlearn the words with the particles that accomany them
this is a good idea in theory but because of the small number of sentences in a given sentence deck it actually just drills specific collocations and ignores others. you get very unbalanced notions about what goes together with what.
>ーeasy to grade, do you understand the sentence?
if this is how you grade sentence cards then you're using sentence cards wrong

>>19753793
oh yeah, also extra con:

ーyou start to remember the word before you even see it in the sentence because the sentence itself becomes the trigger for the word's memory, which means that the memory recall effect is no longer working properly

>>19753724
pls do

con youre using flashcards instead of engaging with normal japanese cause youre a fuckin dip

>>19753793
Another pro is that the context of the sentence you originally found the sentence doesn't just disambiguate, it also makes it easier to remember what the word means in the first place.

Personally, I use sentence cards for words that I figure I'd be likely to confuse with other words and use solitary vocabulary cards for stuff that's easily learned out of context.

>>19753833
this is a bad thing.

>>19753724
Yeah, I'm not reading all that shit.

>>19753599
>99hair
>hair like that of a 99 year old

if i make a card that goes

掃除 (hint: brooms, towels)

on the front instead of

掃除

then all i'm doing is making it so i don't actually have to remember what the word means to

similarly if i make a card that goes

奥の部屋を掃除していなかったことに気が付きました

instead of

掃除

then i'm doing the same thing, i don't actually have to remember what the word means because the entire rest of the sentence becomes both a hint and a trigger for the word

>>19753828
didn't you say you were fucking off for a few days

>>19753850
what the word means to answer the card correctly*

>>19753838
Another reason it would be better if someone other than me wrote the guide. I'm pretty much incapable of keeping things concise, so if it's left to me it'll just end up as a wall of text that nobody wants to read.

>>19753724
people are saying your advice is obvious/retarded but honestly a complete newbie is not going to understand how much effort he should invest per sentence, and per word/kanji, etc.

>>19753851
i did now it back to business

>>19753836
How so? For instance, I'll never forget what ぶっ飛ばす means because 悟空 told ラディッツ he would ぶっ飛ばす him if he comes any closer

>>19753866
>a complete newbie is not going to understand how much effort he should invest per sentence, and per word/kanji, etc.
That's what I keep seeing questions cropping up about which is why I thought a reading guide was a good idea.

>>19753872
>>19753850

>>19753866
its true people literally cant be trusted with their own education

but who cares they are the ones who cant do shit but be fat and lazy and lead a vacuous existence

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-20/why-some-techies-are-shunning-silicon-valley-for-japanese-dream

Literally DJT

>>19753878
> lead a vacuous existence
t. hobbies include: shitposting for hours on end, being a complete cunt and pretending to know japanese

>>19753880
no fuck off.

>>19753891
you mad?

>>19753880
this is actually a good article

cali is for gay ass-niggers

and japanese with no interest in anime is also for faggots

theres a lot of overlap thankfully were all not-faggots who like anime

>>19753896
no

>>19753903
i think youre mad and jealous thats why you lash out at me

>>19753777
what about leyline

>>19753910
wrong on all accounts

>>19753911
this rec chart is extremely bad please delete it from your hard drive and acquire the less-fucked-up version of it from the images section of the Cornucopia in the OP

>>19753910
>jealous
Not him, but I don't recall ever seeing you prove your claimed fluency in Japanese. What does he have to be jealous of?

>>19753915
literally seething with steam shooting out of your ears like looney tunes

>>19753911
aside from subject matter, twinkle crusaders is almost as hard as dies irae

hitotsu tobashi ren'ei, monobeno, and majikoi are TERRIBLE recs for easy or beginner's games

>>19753911

>>19753919
obviously being healthy and happy and most of all knowing japanese

>>19753921
huh?

>>19753931
did i stutter

https://vocaroo.com/i/s1oaOyng8TRO
heres my proof

>>19753917
only one or two people ever speak up about these guides at a time so i can't keep track of whose assessments are more likely to be right so i have to keep this image saved.

along with this one.

no thats my proof you thief get your own proof

>>19753943
heres the 1 u want

>>19753945
stop pretending to be me

>>19753951
no u stop pretending to be me u thief and liar liar pants on fire proof stealer

>>19753950
i've dismissed you as an asshole troll trying to be funny so i didn't save your image. you might be genuine but you never explain yourself or anything so sorry

>>19753943
i'm actually the one that made both of those images, here have a better version of the crossout image

also i'm super embarrassed about VN guide.png, i know it's better than the bad ones but i would appreciate it if you cloned it and made your own so i don't have to bear the ignorance of my past self any longer

>>19753943
>>19753965
er, i'm the one who made the crossout image and VN guide.png
if it wasn't clear

btw google my trip code for epic nihongo proof

>>19753965
your loss dude

VNs are gay anyways

>>19753965
On one hand you say it's broken so don't post it, but because you've fixed it with yellow and red crosses it's good now.

>>19753983
yeah i meant i made the original crosses image here >>19753928 not the image that the crosses are on

Clannad is a good pick if you have insomnia. I read it in english a long time ago and it was so boring it took me months. Definitely go with the anime for that one...

>>19753928
Is daitoshokan really that hard?

Who's this?

>>19753724
I think it's a good idea, but nobody here ever agrees on anything.

>>19753995
it's basically golden standard normal japanese, there's nothing particularly easy or hard about it at all

>>19753942
What's the beat on this? It's kinda catchy

leave djt while you still can

>>19753993
but the entire point is for you to hold down all your home girls in the good and make your city bigger dawgg and then the spirit of eazy-e benevolently immunizes your cockroach wifey and cockroach baby to key aids roll credits めでたしめでたし ftw

>>19754001
a creature i should not have looked up on youtube also you know she kinda looks like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fs2JNcSRroI which is like actually sick as hell lmao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QE5ta2hq6s
tom from antimoon, native language is polish, learned english using sentence cards and other methods detailed on antimoon.

personally i think he sounds like shit. no idea how someone could confuse him for a native. just listen to him. and it's obviously scripted.

>>19754021
honestly he would actually be very easy to confuse as a native from some weird place like the dead center of the US or with a minor speech impediment

if you ever do get around to making a guide make sure to include a section dedicated to things that trip people up seemingly invariably like oiteoku and all the variations

>>19754021
it sounds super stilted cause its for sure scripted but at least he doesnt have a gnarly accent like the average uni maths prof

>>19754021
He sounds better than 99.99% of europeans i've heard who have english as a second language

>>19754029
notice his slow, deadpan delivery. he's obviously practiced what he's saying in this video. it's not impressive in the slightest to sound native if you have to rehearse for it.

>>19754021
He sounds excellent for a slav though
I would never confuse him for a native, but still

How do I say something like "Did you know x is y?" in japanese?
I know I probably should use 知ってるか at the end of sentence, and I know how to say "x is y" in a stand alone sentence
But what particle should I use to connect the 2 sentences?

>>19754050
normal natives rehearse for videos too dude

>>19754054
i feel your sentiment but your delivery sux

@19754054
nope

>>19754050
by the way if no one can tell i'm just making fun of the people who attack matt for rehearsing his videos in which he admits he's rehearsed, and are meant to showcase his pitch accent. obviously tom's accent would be more noticeable in normal conversation but that doesn't make what he's demonstrated in this video unimpressive.

>>19754058
yeah, to sort their thoughts, not because they don't know how to speak.

>>19754073
this guy knows how to speak.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7YdNocDdps
When's part 2 coming?

>>19754057
you should say 知っていますか im not your little punk ass friends from school you little fucker

>>19754050
that's moving the goalposts, you just said he sounds like shit but I can't agree with that
besides, accent or intonation isn't really a good indicator for determining whether sentence cards are useful or not
his grammar and vocabulary seem good, so based on that I'd actually say they served their purpose

ok guys its been fun posting but i have to go do my math homework so i can read my vn after and feel like i have a kanojo. wish me ganbare xD

ittekimasu!!!

Do Japanese people really talk like this to each other?

>>19753995
I read it as my first vn and it was pretty difficult.
the gap between manga and daitoshokan was pretty big.

>>19754098
like what could you elaborate : )

>>19754085
That doesn't answer my question though

>>19754098
When they're being polite, sure why not? I could see a similar conversation happening in English.

>>19754109
sorry too vague and retarded please try saying the thing you want to say and the crack team of experts here will maybe help you

>>19754021
>personally i think he sounds like shit. no idea how someone could confuse him for a native.
I'm a Brit so maybe it's just my lack of intimate familiarity with American accents which is allowing him to fool me, but I'd have no idea that he wasn't a native speaker if you didn't tell me. In fact, even knowing that he's not a native speaker, I still can't find anything wrong with his English. He sounds perfect to me.

>>19754133
I'm an American and I'd need to be told that he was non-native for me to tell too. His only problems are that he hits his Rs slightly wrong, but Americans with tiny speech impediments or the wrong dialect do that too.

A lot of people think "sound exactly like a native" means "sounds exactly like me", but that is just not what it means.

>>19754133
yeah he sounds european

basically if you dont talk like a complete piece of shit you dont sound american

>>19754133
>I'm a Brit
Into the trash it goes
>>19754140
>I'm an American
Into the trash it goes

>>19754108
Cartoony. I thought people don't speak anime in real life?

>>19754147
>Into the trash it goes
Into the trash it goes

>>19754148
what makes you think were not living in a simulation (anime)

>>19754148
whats cartoony about it : )

>>19753921
BASED

>>19754118
I guess something like this?
氷は冷たいを知りましたか
Is this correct grammatically?
The translation should be "Did you know Ice is cold?"

>>19754178
no

>>19754133
he sounds SLIGHTLY off to americans but as someone else said you could easily mistake it for a speech impediment. i think it's his Ls, Rs, and the "a" in "case" among others but i'm too lazy to rewatch.

>>19754189
So what's the correct form?

I'm trying to keep the hiragana in my head but I'll be spending some time on holiday, anything I can use on my phone to keep myself going?

>>19754157
smile at him one more time dude see what happens

>>19754195
reading material

newfags getting jamald left and right

>>19754195
aren't there like a million apps for grinding hiragana
just use any of those

>>19754199
I've only covered kana, I no little grammar and words.
>>19754203
Theres a lot of shit ones, many seem to look over がぱを etc

>>19754054
your meme is great and don't let anyone tell you otherwise

>doing kana isolation study before you've even started reading
fucks sake

>>19754201
very humble of you jamal

>>19754216
http://boirodaisuki.neocities.org/
Grind some vocab and start reading. You don't need much. Reading is what actually counts. Just don't kill yourself over it.

i still haven't learned katakana.

Reminder that this is the only VN recommendation chart you need.

In almost all cases, the only guidance you need is a pat on the back and a gentle reminder of the value of RADICAL FREEDOM.

>>19754228
Katakana helps with kango

>>19754224
i wouldnt ever refer to myself by that name like that and i definitely wouldnt ever say "new fags"

>>19754226
How does this compare with tae kim?

>>19754242
>i definitely wouldnt ever say "new fags"
u just did

>>19754253
It's like 25% the length or shorter, and the examples aren't unnatural.

>>19754255
?

I start every study session by listening to ode to joy to get in the right mindset you know

>>19754261
Should I nail my katakana first or can I get away with RTKatakana while reading that?

>>19754242
it's the perfect crime.

stop posting shit

>>19754280
>RTKatakana
Why would you do that? Just drill them for a short time then practice them by reading.

Also, despite being shorter than Tae Kim, boirodaisuki covers almost the same amount of grammar. There's just less unnecessary detail and soapboxing, and a few things that Tae Kim teaches are actually pretty weird to teach, like 思いきや and がてら.

i listen to wagners ride of the valkyries exclusively while posting on djt and turn it off when i tab to something else and turn it back on when i tab back in

its pronounced vagner

its pronounced fagner

>>19754178
I'm not an expect but maybe this:
氷は冷たいと知っていましたか？

>>19754298
vah-gner, actually

gesundheit

If I spent three hours on https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/pages/kana.html for just katakana is it possible to get it good enough compared to hiragana which took three days of writing lines

*turns up ze vwagunaa*

>>19754321
it would get you 70% of the way there and the rest would fall in place in due time

>>19754310
seriously dude what the fucks your issue

>>19754310
Okay correction you need だ so it's:
氷は冷たい打と知っていましたか？