/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Came up blood gang,

ブラッズギャングから上り詰めてきたんだ

30 bang, Scum Gang

30ギャング、スカムギャング

Big choppa, big thang,

大きい銃、大きいもの

let your nuts hang

リラックスして

Who that?

誰だ？

Don’t say,

言うな

BBA change your mood, aye

素敵な女の警告、君の気分を変えて

Anyday, Gotti Gotti,

どんな時でも、手に入れた、手にいれた

cookin’ up, speed it up

調理して、スピードを速めて

Double cup, xanny cup,

２つのカップ（leanのこと）、ザナックスと飲料を割ったカップ

booted up, mollied up

ハイになって、割って

Molly up, break it up,

MDMA（薬物）をやって、砕けて、

cop it, then I serve it up

つかまえてからMDMAを分けて

Give it up, Gotti Gotti

Am I correct in thinking Japanese Grammar is just particles + conjugation?

Tatoeba:
>その語は広い意味を持つに至った
>持つに至った
What? I mean, shouldn't 持つ be nominalized for this sentence to be grammatically correct?

>>19614801
すっごく頑張ったのに、まだ日本語が全然できない

I thought the JLPT was around $150, but it is only $60. Now I'm considering taking it this year. The closets place to take it is 3-4 hours away though, so that kind of sucks.

Have you ever thought about how particles are just a very simple version of noun declension? Like add は to get the nominative, add を to get the accusative, and に to get dative, etc.

>>19614845
> Like add は to get the nominative
You really don't know Japanese

>>19614845
they're clitics

>>19614839
think of all the japanese books and movies you could buy with that money

>>19614914
One 700 yen light novel plus 5300 yen shipping.

Wait what.

>>19614962
lmao the actual state of core
釣る is just going fishing / catching fish

The word fish is a verb too if you didn't know

>>19613455
>>1.7k in Anki
>>haha I'll do one last day of Anki before starting on reading...
>>Never doesl
>Someone help me lol

If you can't go cold turkey then just slowly introduce reading. Once you realize that you can do it you'll drop anki since it's boring anyway.

>>19614962
If the randomly picked translations on core flashcard don't make any sense, just look it up.
Also, I'm surprised you don't know this word yet, there's a whole chapter in Yotsuba about fishing.

>>19614962
>Angle (3) [verb]
>to fish with a hook

I want to get mad about シ and ツ
But then I realized that in English we have I and l, which in many fonts is actually a lot worse.

i have never, ever, ever heard someone refer to fishing with a fishing rod as angling, even in a game
the only reason i even know the word in reference to fishing is because of the anglerfish

https://www.reddit.com/r/languagelearning/comments/95py39/steve_kaufmann_here_i_speak_more_than_a_dozen/

>I often "attack" people I hear speaking a language I know. They usually react very positively. I don't know if I shocked anyone. I once volunteered at the office of a Chinese-Canadian politician. One of the volunteers in the office said in Cantonese "he's a spy". To which I said in Cantonese, "no, I am not a spy". He quickly disappeared in a back room.

>>19615037
Except English is not retarded, unlike Japanese, and mixing them up is almost impossible even for ESLs.

>>19615054
>Except English is not retarded, unlike Japanese
N5 detected.

>>19615037
maybe if i keep posting this you fuckers will figure it out

>>19615059
Passed a few N4 samples yesterday.
Regardless, I will always see Japanese as a retarded language, it's not because I don't understand it, it's because of the overuse of short words in a language with so little phonetic diversity.
Asian languages in general are fucking dumb, it's all Ch*nese influence.

>>19615037
>>19615064
When I learned Japanese in my high school I use this to remember them:
"shi n" -> from bottom to top
"so tsu" -> from top to bottom

>>19615047
>Cross-linked to /r/learnJapanese
>44% upboated
They're too busy ankidroning RTK to even know who Steve is probably.

Despite Kimmy's rather adamant assertion that だ cannot be used for questions, here is this.

Was he only partly wrong in that it can be done but is considered improper/slang?
Or was he 百パーセント wrong?

>>19615047
>Why can't we just have... say.... A list of 10,000+ most-common words, in every language, with pronounciation, and example sentences, sorted by frequency?
they really love core and their savior nukemarine

>>19615140
>Despite Kimmy's rather adamant assertion that だ cannot be used for questions
[Citation needed]

>>19615140
だ makes questions stronger.
Tyrone LaKeem was wrong about many things.

>>19615140
this is what the insane grammar guide haters are rightfully trying to protect you from
don't memorize rules, figure out approximately what you're reading and move forward
you can ask these questions when you actually know japanese
don't think, feel

>>19615140
I've seen 何だい many times and い is just there to add emotion so yes.

>>19615160
You can't avoid it early on, you will memorize flat out bullshit indiscriminately and then fit your future input around a model you've built in your head of rules that aren't even correct Japanese. By the time you realize your grammar guide was wrong it's too late. You should do it in the opposite order, massive input first and then refine it with grammar study. Or better yet skip the grammar altogether.

>I want to be able to speak/read without thinking about the meaning.
>In order to do that I'm going to mass input all these grammar rules and explanations into my head so I know exactly what's going on.

>>19615211
if you think you have to memorize "rules" to get the gist of what is going on from a guide i don't know what to tell you buddy

>>19615218
If you can selectively avoid remembering harmful explanations you read while retaining a "gist" of correct grammar without even knowing why it's correct then you have a remarkable brain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpgFkdltOzY

>>19615211
I've read several explanations of は vs が and I still have zero rules in my head for what they mean or how they are used. Checkmate.

>>19615152
>As I’ve explained before, the 「だ」 is used to declare what one believes to be a fact. Therefore, 「そうだか？」 is not a valid way to ask a question because it is declaring a fact and asking a question at the same time. But the fact that 「そうですか」 is a valid question shows that 「です」 and 「だ」 are essentially different.

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/polite#_is_NOT_the_same_as

>>19615211
Input needs to be comprehensible to be of any value and for even the most basic material to be comprehensible you need to have some sense of the function of the words in a Japanese sentence. I think proceeding without even skimming a guide is foolish.

No one, not even Tyler Kerry, is powerful enough to break the Japanese language for you. There seems to be an irrational fear here and in other places that a person might pick up a bad habit in the early stages which will destroy any future efforts at study and turn Japanese into windings, permanently. I want to tell all of these people that it's going to be okay; bad habits fall away just as soon as you realize what the right habits are.

>>19615252
all i'm saying is that during your mass input when you run into a sentence that you almost understand but there are a couple of different ways it could be interpreted in context that seem reasonable, you can use a reference to try to figure out that one sentence for a minute and then move on
sometimes you still wont be confident, sometimes you'll be pretty sure what you just read doesn't apply here, and both of those are good and work against "memorizing rules" that you are afraid of
why is there so much fearmongering of "learning" "wrong" lately? you can waste a lot of time and gain a false sense of accomplishment, but if you think that bad habits can't be corrected, not only do you have a very poor understanding of learning, you have a very poor understanding of your experience with your native language

>>19615211
You have to be autistic to treat grammar guides like hard rules

>>19615296
My experience with my native language and how non-natives speak it is what convinces me that grammar rule memorization should be avoided at all costs. I haven't seen any evidence that learning through input is harmful but I've seen plenty that learning through grammar books is.

>>19615271
>Input needs to be comprehensible to be of any value and for even the most basic material to be comprehensible you need to have some sense of the function of the words in a Japanese sentence. I think proceeding without even skimming a guide is foolish.

I agree with this, if you read TK's basic grammar so you at least know what AはBです and the like mean, they help kickstart your reading and since they're so simple you can ditch them pretty quick and just have an innate understanding of it.

>>19615359
You only need to do this if you've been a bad boy and skipped the 10000 hours of subbed anime.

>>19615359
Most people understand that through anime already so even that is already acquirable through input. Context is the only thing necessary to make i+1 comprehensible regardless of what your i is.

>>19615140
Tae Kim does not claim that "だ cannot be used for questions".

>>19615271
「そうだか？」 is ungrammatical as a simple question in modern Japanese. You don't know Japanese.

>>19615316
you seem to be unable to distinguish between a heavy textbook-focused approach and light reference

>>19615441
the fact that what it says is correct does not mean that that paragraph cannot be considered misleading to a beginner, as is evident by multiple people being confused

>>19615441
>「そうだか？」 is ungrammatical
So it literally any sentence without a verb at the end, including 何それ

>>19615451
If the guide you reference contains misleading or incorrect grammar then you're harming your Japanese by using it.

>>19615465
yeah i got that one you've said it dozens of times

>>19614813
No, it doesn't need to. The sentence is grammatically correct the way it is.

>>19615464
一体何言ってるんだ、お前？

>>19615457
だ and questions is itself something that requires multiple independent pieces of knowledge to grasp. It's not going to make sense when you're literally in the very beginning of a basic grammar guide. In fact, this isn't even the section on questions at all. This is literally BEFORE the section on questions.

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/question

>For previously explained reasons, you must not use the declarative 「だ」 with the question marker.

This does not say or even imply that you cannot use だ with questions.

>>19615464
Ejections are still grammatical. Grammatical sentences? No, but because they're not sentences, not because they're ungrammatical (they're grammatical).

>>19615465
You don't know Japanese.

>>19615477
>>19615485
To be grammatically correct a sentence must end with a verb. But people don't talk in grammatically correct sentences, even in English. Being "grammatically correct" doesn't matter, being understood matters and sounding natural matters. Also, the second sentence in this post was ungrammatical and you probably didn't even notice, again because it doesn't matter.

Who /imabi/ here?

>>19615474
....
Case particles can be used with verbs.
Another mind: blown, I guess.
I hate this language.

>>19615490
That is of sentences, not utterances.

Also, だ isn't a verb.

>>19615465
Are you that moron that keeps baiting people with "an european"? Can you keep your shitposting off-topic so it can be reported?

>>19615494
に is acting as a copular-adverbial relativizer here, not a case particle.

>>19615498
>a copula isn't a verb

My point stands, people don't always talk in grammatically correct sentences so it really doesn't matter.

>>19615500
Discussion about grammar study methodology in the Japanese thread is off-topic? Now you're grasping at straws.

>>19615502
Stop posting in bad faith.

>>19615490
Nothing ungrammatical about incomplete sentences.

>>19615504
You don't even know English.

im too noob and brainlet to find an answer: what conjugation or whatever is this 触われない, im particularly confused with the わ written there

>>19615504
No, arguing about how well foreigners know English is off-topic. Work on your reading comprehension.

>>19615505
What part is bad faith? Copula can in fact be verbs and here they are, and people do talk ungrammatically all the time.

>>19615518
だ is a functor, not a verb, and also statements that are not sentences are not ungrammatical due to being sentences, and non-sentence statements don't need a predicate to be grammatical. You were just told this like two times and you need to stop pretending that you didn't hear it.

>>19615513
I brought it up in response to a poster who claimed that getting enough input means you'll stop making basic grammar mistakes.

>>19615520
Are you done?

>>19615525
だ is the same lemma as the adverbializing に and the adjectival の. They're a functor family.

JMDict is not well-known for its accuracy.

>>19615524
It turns into a whole debate by itself every time.

>>19615525
hey buddy you forgot to respond to the rest of his post

>>19615512
probably 触れない　さわれない
maybe they wrote it like that to avoid confusion with 触れない　ふれない hell if I know

i wonder if anyone has told these guys that linguists debate their classifications

>>19615528
If other posters could keep the discussion on the topic of Japanese and language study then that would be great.

>>19615532
The rest of his post is so obviously bullshit I don't feel the need to. If you haven't heard people talk ungrammatically because it's EASIER TO DO then you haven't listened enough.

>>19615536
if you think the rest of his post is bullshit then frankly you should not be part of any debate about what kinds of things are or aren't grammatical or why people say them the way theydo

>>19615501
Can't find anything about that in DoJG.

>>19615525
I'm not part of this argument but jmdict uses japanese grammar terminology specifically invented for baka gaijins. I wouldn't rely on it for anything too serious.

>>19615527
https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%B3%E3%83%94%E3%83%A5%E3%83%A9#%E6%97%A5%E6%9C%AC%E8%AA%9E

I can post different sources all day.

>>19615540
>If you're on the other side of the debate than me then you shouldn't be part of the debate
autism

>>19615535
Regardless of your blame-shifting for something you've done multiple times and plays out the same way each time, being the same person means you should really fuck off instead of baiting shitty arguments.

Anki使用者達：how do you know you're burning?

>>19615536
Statements that are not sentences are not ungrammatical due to being sentences, and non-sentence statements don't need a predicate to be grammatical. You were just told this three times and you need to stop pretending that you didn't hear it and stop pretending that it's bullshit.

This is well-understood among people who know modern linguistics and your ignorance to this fact and arrogance in spite of your ignorance is astounding.

>>19615542
>DoJG
Did you seriously just try to reference a grammar reference for foreigners in this conversation?
Laughing in real life right now.

>>19615544
助動詞 are not verbs.

You don't know Japanese.

>>19615552
>Auxiliary VERBS aren't verbs
>助『動詞』 aren't 動詞

>>19615552
I'm not talking specifically about "statements that are not sentences", I'm talking about full fucking sentences in the broad sense. I even gave you an example of one in English.

>>19615552
>Laughing in real life right now.
笑う

>>19615556
The fact that らしい is a 助動詞 should be enough to set off flags that what you think is wrong.

OH WAIT! You literally don't know Japanese!

>I'm not talking specifically about "statements that are not sentences", I'm talking about full fucking sentences in the broad sense. I even gave you an example of one in English.
The very first response to you was that what you think is only true of full sentences. The fact that you continued to argue about it meant that you either think that non-sentences are ungrammatical sentences in disguise (which is wrong), or that any statement has to be some kind of sentence (also wrong).

I wonder if Japanese speakers that's learning English stir silly arguments about that language like we do here about Japanese.

>>19615533
is it normal to break kanji like that?
i would have guessed something like this to be under the "just use the context" mindset
thanks for the answer anon

>>19615552
>Did you seriously just try to reference a grammar reference for foreigners in this conversation?
So every grammar reference for foreigners is incomplete, to the point where the use of the most basic particles is not sufficiently explained? Awesome.
I repeat, I absolutely hate this fucking language. If only it weren't for untranslated VNs and anime...

What is this shit? Did the chinks just get bored or something?

>>19615571
No, friend, they're trying to reference it for how something is categorized, not what it means. Don't angst out about this.

>>19615569
I haven't seen it a lot but man who gives a fuck just use your brain, it's obviously read さわれない and you shouldn't need the correct 送り仮名 to read it properly every time

>>19615565
Jesus fucking Christ you sound like an autismo who majored with straight C's in linguistics and wants to show off his prowess. The facts of the matter are that people talk ungrammatically all the time because grammar aren't rules despite what your linguistic textbooks may have told you. "Grammar" is just an attempt to explain a language. You need to get off your B.A. high-horse and accept the fact that languages are living and not everything has to follow pre-ordained rules. Jesus Christ you're insufferable. "hurr durr you don't know Japanese XDDDD haha I said this 5 times, if you still don't agree then that means you haven't listened to me because I'm so clearly right!" fucking off yourself.

>>19615568
my motivation to learn japanese is to shitpost in the det

>>19615547
I don't see how you can accuse me of baiting when my points supported by evidence just get shitposted. There's no point trying to argue anything in this thread. I don't like to see DJT shit up, I just want to warn people about the dangers of studying grammar too early and using grammar references.

>>19615580
Nice, you broke.

>>19615573
木林森

>>19615584
And here we see the bitch's goal was not to spread truth but to make the other angry.

>>19615590
Two birds with one stone.

>>19615581
I've actually wondered if Japanese people shitpost as much as we do but I never see it happen, not even on 2ch.

>>19615582
>supported by evidence
Literally every single thing you've posted is unsupported conjecture based on your observations of foreigners and your assumptions about what specific thing they did must have been the nail in the coffin. You either don't understand what evidence is, or you think it's hilarious to pretend to be an idiot.

>>19615591
epic dude, you can go to bed soundly tonight knowing that you at least had some power on the internet cause apparently you don't have any in real life if you need to pull this shit.I look forward to your next blitz response cause apparently you're so reliant on successful trolling that you have nothing else in life.

>>19615577
my first thought was that 触わ--- was another different word, i would have gone down that path if if the english translation were not there

>>19615597
Shit, I thought you were going to try to start the argument back up by accusing me of being a prescriptivist or something. Oh well. Here's the response I wrote in advance hoping you would do so:

I mean, in the first place, yeah, if a native speaker produces it and it's structured the way they intended it to be structured, and it's not, like, some kind of ironic joke about engrish or something, then there's no way it can be ungrammatical. But that's a point for a different conversation.

>>19615605
>Writing this in advanced
And you complained that *I* wasn't listening. Nothing you posted before this point matters anymore.

>>19615605
check out this mastermind chad setting up his next attack in advance
next time put it on pastebin so you can prove your ruthlessness with a timestamp

>>19615609
I always predict what other people are going to respond with, though. And I'm almost always right.

>>19615614
honest question, looking for advice myself, what routine did you go through to get your iq so high

>>19615615
I was born autistic. Would not recommend.

>>19615542
Found an article about に至る in the handbook.
DoJG proven to be useless garbage yet again.

>>19615587
Yeah but that's not one word like the other thing.

>>19615616
wouldn't that make you bad at predicting other people's responses

I'm amazed 腹上死 is common enough for a rikaichan entry.

>>19615620
Yes, but only in real life for some reason.

>>19615620
that's asperger's not autism in general

>>19615614
And that makes your arguments have no worth since what you say does not directly connect with what the other said. You're just spouting your own agenda without giving mind to what the other said, then having the audacity to say "I said this x times and you're still not listening".

Basically, everything you said up until now was not a response to my arguments but a response to counter-arguments for your own posts that you made up in your head. Grats man, you beat yourself at an argument.

>>19615626
That would be nice but also you've said just what I thought you were going to say this entire time so it actually makes no difference except for how quickly my responses get posted.

>>19615596
I posted evidence that a huge number of non-natives have for some reason ingrained in themselves a basic grammatical mistake despite being fluent by any definition. If you think that's because they learned through input instead of grammar study (which is how the vast majority learn L2) then I'm curious to hear why.

>>19615627
If you weren't autistic you would see why this is wrong. Since you are I don't think there's any way a healthy person could explain it to you since your brain lacks the functionality to properly understand.

>>19615632
You think that there's something, like, wrong with it in some very abstract sense, but the points you make are exactly those points that I was predicting you would make in the first place, as a conversation it plays out the same way except that it takes less time.

私は日本語を出来ません。
何でそんあに難しいのよ？

>>19615635
You only think it's abstract because you're autistic, it's very concrete in reality.

>>19615639
If you can't even put it into words or give it a name then it's abstract.

how's it going in the daily debate club thread
are we going to make the nationals?

>>19615641
I already did, I'm sorry you also appear to lack reading comprehension.

>>19615645
I don't think you're on the same page as yourself from a few posts ago at this point.

>この質問の答えは誰も知らない。
I understood this sentence without having to look up any kanji. Progress bros!

>>19615646
Because you lack reading comprehension and can't make the connection.

>>19615650
You're so argumentative and thoughtless that nothing you say surprises me at all, and now you're just repeating yourself.

>>19615651
I've lost the argumentative drive after you were confirmed you were both autistic and a troll. Now I'm just giving you pity replies since you obviously need this sort of attention to survive.

>>19615653
Yeah because you don't actually care about proving anything right or wrong. You're just in it for the bloodsports.

>>19615656
Yes that's why I gave proper replies instead of trying to predict what the other would say and write up a reply ahead of time -- because I was only in it for the "bloodsports".

>>19615649
welcome to my level, you're going to be here a while, but at least we're better than most of djt

>>19615661
If you can't outwit an autist who's successfully guessing all the points you're making then you're not even trying to prove anything.

>>19615649
>>19615663
Now it's time for you guys to leave DJT for a couple months. Trust me, it's for your own good.

>>19615668
i've had the menu music of a vn playing for over an hour so i know you're right but i tried and failed

>>19615664
What you did is nothing special, proof is that even an autist could do it. I just pretended to have more respect for you so I didn't do it.

>>19615673
If it were nothing special then you would be doing it to me right now, or at the very least if we were both capable of doing it then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

>>19615676
https://pastebin.com/YvR9mKkR

>>19615677
https://pastebin.com/qSicqSKm

>they actually fucking did it
>both of them
this is just like my shounen animes

>>19615678
Nice vague post, I'm sure you couldn't have replied to literally anything with that. I personally believe mine was of a higher powerlevel.

>>19615682
How come you didn't use a pastebin again? That's a shame, I was hoping you would, I had like three ready to fire if you used the right walls of text.

>>19615670
If you can't do it yourself, let the mods help you.
A porn dump thread will do. Japanese porn, of course.

>>19615684
Were all 3 of them barnums, like I said they were in my pastebin that you didn't read because of your false belief that you can predict the other person well enough? Are are you using the shotgun effect now where you're just sitting on 50 pastebins and you hope one will match? This game is pathetic, it's just proof of how horrible your argumentative skills are.

>>19615687
No, that's what I did like two years ago when I started practicing this to shave time off my shitposting so I could spend more time studying.

>>19615688
how many of your preposts would you say you use
can you really say it saves time
>>19615687
i just want to make it perfectly clear that while you're ontop of this slapfight you're also an idiot not only for engaging but for your general behavior

>>19615696
I use something like half of them but I'm such a fast typer that it saves time, I would spend most of my time rereading people's posts waiting for them to respond otherwise, or alt-tabbing into youtube.

>>19615696
It's ok because as everyone knows if you win the slapfight then that retroactively makes you correct one in the original argument.

>>19615699
this is certainly the dominant belief
remember to pace yourself for the endurance match

i'm going to go ahead and declare myself responsible for ending that, how would i put that on my resume, thanks in advance and remember to stick to arguing about proper topics like e-celebrities and english grammar please

It's funny because I just make them in the quick reply box itself, so if I get distracted by another conversation I lose the original. It honestly doesn't matter enough to put any more effort into it than posting normally. I can't even be assed to write my posts in notepad or anything. The most effort I've ever put into something was rot13ing a very insulting breakdown and warning them not to open it if they were upset, because it would only make them more upset, and uh.

>>19615714
"Mediator experience"

>/jp/ - Otaku Culture

all this because someone assumed accepting ungrammatical sentences as good was a key part of the good side of linguistics
little did they know the good side of linguistics gave up on grammaticality long ago

>>19615717
why do you think i brought up pastebin brother i know who you are, fuckin mastermind chad

>>19615729
Wow, I can't believe I've been seen through!

>>19615725
That's what happens when you allow reddit to stay

>>19615731
just take pride that other people recognize your unique behavior and pretend that that's a good thing and not a bad one

>>19615729
Hooooooooly shit, don't encourage it.

>>19615725
>Learning Japanese
>Two jobless sweaty pigs arguing
Seems pretty Otaku to me, I dunno.

>>19615735
Oh no, it's terrible, it keeps me from sleeping at night. Not only do I need to get my next fix, people are going to recognize me and hate me for doing it.

>>19615047
Reddit is so awful. 4chan is a shithole too but at least blatant advertising is banned here.

Daily reminder that subvocalization permanently fucks up your nihongo

>>19615754
that's where you're wrong

>>19615754
Daily reminder that subvocalization permanently fucked up your English reading speed.

I just realized I don't actually subvocalize in Japanese. I wonder if my reading speed will eventually be faster than in my native tongue.

daily reminder that djt permanent fucks your 日っpon語

>>19615668
Why do you tell me that? If you mean to discourage me, I will not falter in my journey to become a nihongo master.

>>19615765
>>19615764
he's trying to protect you

>>19615765
Not him, I second leaving DJT. Actually I don't encourage being part of any community. I've been nomadic, traveling from places like DJT to Gaia to Leddit, from YouTube comments to obscure Japanese learning forums. I'm not saying all of them suck (most of them do) but they're full of people learning the language, not people who know the language. You're getting answers from people who might be worse than you and you don't know. It's better to just study alone, pop in to ask something if you really need to.

>>19615773
>to obscure Japanese learning forums
ah, yes, Koohii

>>19615773
>people who might be worse than you and you don't know
look on the bright side, they don't know they're worse than you either
aside from bad help, it's a big distraction
if you can reclaim 30 minutes a day to put towards actual japanese, you're making a big improvement, and if you spend more time than that here it's even more important

>>19615784
Yeah, it's a huge distraction. It's best to pop in every so often just to see if any substantial progress in how to learn/study have been made. For example if I didn't pop in after I left originally I would have still thought that grinding core10k would make me fluent and core20k would make me native.

>>19615773
That's why when I ask a question I make sure that they know what they are talking about. It's pretty obvious dude. If someone gives a well reasoned answer then it's pretty safe to take their advice.

>>19615830
The fluency illusion is real, anyone who is even slightly better than you will look fluent and you'll be more likely to trust their opinions as being "well reasoned." I'm not saying that asking people questions is bad but you should exercise caution with anything that's not from someone you trust. The best thing to do is, if you have a native at your disposal, ask them if the person answering is legit or not. Then you know you can probably trust them later down the line.

>>19615845
It's not so much that "they know more than me so I might as well believe them". It's usually more like "I thought this was the case, and what they said reinforces that (or disproves that)".

There's no salvation for this general.

>>19615845
This is why this thread is for shitposting rather than learning, and the only solid learning advice you'll ever get here is to read.

>>19615765
I mean you're wasting time here, and 99% of them time you're not learning anything.
Instead, for the next two or three months devote the time you would waste on shitposting to 日本語. You're a beginner, but not terribly green, you know what you need to do to learn basic 日本語. It's time for you to take a long break from DJT.

>>19615883
Not even that, listening is better.

>>19615882
save yourself

>>19615784
You're not wrong but stopping djt will not cause people to redirect all that time to learning nihongo. I visit this thread when I know I'm not in the mood for a long, tiring reading session.

You're right that much of the advice here comes from people who don't know the language but that doesn't mean it's all bad advice. People who know Japanese can also give bad advice by the way - for example someone who spent five years in Japan can give you instructions on how it worked for him but it might not work for you because (unless you also live in Japan) you don't get the same exposure to the language.

Furthermore just because something doesn't work for you doesn't mean it's bad advice for everyone since everyone learns differently.

You're not gonna learn Japanese on here but unless you blindly take advice from posts taken at random without considering anything else you're not gonna hurt your learning either.

おにいちゃんおなかすいた

たべたいものはありますか

fucking yanks are the worst

>>19615954
Which chapter is this?

What's tae kim's end game?
Now that we hate him?

>>19615983
permanently damaging your ability to learn nihongo so that the market of nihongo masters will thin out and he can rake in more money with his linq clone

>>19615944
おまんこをたべたい

>>19615977
you'll get there after 700 pages and a bit

I roughly understand what "底知れない" means but can anyone give me an english definition?

>>19616051
knows no bounds

>海外に行くことになった。
>It became the event of going abroad
Jesus, how are you supposed to wrap your head around this ass backwards way of speaking?

>>19616074
by not translating every fucking thing you read and just feeling it

>>19616074
It literally, phrase-by-phrase, means going abroad happened.

Stop literally translating shit you don't understand into English.

>>19616074
Not translating (by the looks of it you did)
Learn from context

>>19616074
>海外に行くこと
thing of going abroad
>になった。
became
what's so HARD about it?

>>19616079
>>19616081

That was the literal translation. If you're going to say that you've decided to go abroad, you have to say it like that.

>>19616089
Oh, sorry, it's been so long that I forgot Tae Kim's example translations were that bad.

Yeah it's nowhere near as ass-backwards as Tae Kim's example translations are making it look.

>>19616089
the language will never be second-nature if you're focused on what transmutations are done to example sentences when translating them
海外に行くことになった is natural because ｘことになった is natural
don't worry about this shit, get through your tae kim skim, and get into the read more (and listen more) phase

>>19616089
>you have to say it like that.
no you don't
start using real resources instead of korean kim.

>>19615677
>plans in advance to repeat the exact same assertion you've already made, ergo be non-constructive to the discussion, when the person who disagrees with you disagrees with you
>throws an unrelated, unverifiable assertion on the end as a mask
>>19615678
>writes the most generalized non-statement possible
Do you even realize that all you're doing is proving that you're arguing in bad faith? This is even worse than gotcha shit, you're actively making up gotchas to reward your disingenuousness.

Don't be like these shitposters, /jp/.

>>19616110
>real resources
>dojg

>>19616186
joke's on you, i bought the japanese edition of hjgp

>>19615954
へー
今はこんな感じらしいよ

>>19616199
>still the most co2 per hito
Disgusting donut munching fucks.

>>19616199
そんなん

さむいくに

ふりにきまってるじゃん

ほとんどまいにち

だんぼうなんだし

what do you guys use to read manga? I am having trouble going through the pages, and cycling through all the manga that I've downloaded.

>>19616300
Honeyview.

>>19616300
chromium

>>19616079
>>19616081
>>19616083
>>19616085
Not the guy you were responding to but I get where he's coming from. This is a relatively easy sentence to understand but to speak like this is pretty hard since you're just gonna have a reflex to say something like 外国に行った because that's what you'd say in イギリス語.

にほんのカップめんといえば？

にっしん？

まるちゃん？

それとも、まるか？

>>19616300
Manga isn't reading.

>>19616366
>you're just gonna have a reflex to say something like 外国に行った
that's not what that sentence means

Are you a 鬼才 yet?

>>19616446
manga is eating

>>19616446
Manga is literature

まんががよむとかよまないとか

あのんのmemeはつまんない

カナカナポーストはつまんない

>>19616521
>>19616532
>They don't just gather the plot from the pictures alone
I don't get why people hate Dio though, speaking of which. He's just looking for the mask, right? And Jonathan just his dad dying while Dio is taking care of him.

>>19616598
the thread is truly lost

>>19616637
How do you say lost in Japanese? In the wild people always say 忘れた to me and I don't know if it's a context thing or if they just misunderstood what I meant.

I mean lost as in lost an item, not lost your way.

>>19616648
i assume 忘れた on account of 忘れ物 but i don't know japanese

>>19616648

>>19616679
Shit I should have listened more carefully in that arc, then I would have known.

goodnight djt

I need help identifying this kanji/word

>>19616708
what's the difficulty, use google translate handwriting input and draw it

>>19616708

>>19616729
teach the man to fish next time

>>19616738
I don't think he deserves it.

>と思います

ナナチのコスプレしたいけど

にほんはあつすぎる

>>19616738
Okay
>>19616708
You can use this site (https://kanji.sljfaq.org/)) to draw kanji you encounter in anything that isn't text which you can copy. At least that's how I do it

How long should I practice Japanese per day? Is it possible to learn to speak without actually interacting with another speaker?

>>19616793
>How long should I practice Japanese per day?
As much as you can stomach / Until you see a considerable decrease in gainz.

>Is it possible to learn to speak without actually interacting with another speaker?
Absolutely not, nor is it possible to learn to read without reading. No matter how many words you ankidrone or how many grammar textbooks you read to perfection, you'll still suck ass when you start speaking.

Why the hell does ご飯 exist like that?

>>19616810
Where can I find someone to speak to in Japanese?

>>19616830
Japan is where I found mine.

>>19616816
Why wouldn't it?

>>19616816
御飯 looks comfier

>>19605587
What are some LNs for real ninjas?

>>19616868
Words that have hiragana come before kanji are very weird.

>>19616535
わたしも同感です

>>19616842
I meant if you knew any good language exchange services?

>>19616961
Hmm...
On Lang-8 there's a good number of people who will be willing to exchange Skypes. I think a friend of mine also uses something called HelloTalk or something along those lines.

>>19616925
animorphs

>>19615080
Is there any way to play this on modern PCs?

theres pc engine emulators out there

check out neko project its pretty cool cuz it emulates disk reading including disk read times and fdd sounds ftw

>>19616924
やる気
そよ風
どれ程
ト書

>きのう、ちょっと、信じられないことがあって ･･･。買い物に行って、蒸しパンを買ったのよ、うん、袋に入って五個入りのやつだったんだけど。

What the heck is やつ doing here? It's not making sense as 奴 or 8つ.

>>19617137
Why not?

>>19617137
no irregularities detected

probable cause: being a noob

>>19617178
Shit I just read it again and realized it does make sense as 奴, sorry. I was thinking in English so "the 5 entering guy" didn't make sense.

>>19617193
Damn dude, savage. Try to tell me you don't get confused over simple mistakes ever.

>>19617137
>やつ

あんまりていねいなことばじゃないから

ものとかひとのいみでつかうと

たまにごかいされるかもしれない

Good listening material for on the train?

I'm redoing these movies and noticed this wasn't subbed. Could I get a translation?

>>19617137
2. thing; object​
https://jisho.org/search/やつ

>>19617232
What do you mean by "redoing"?

>>19617232
Pleasure of being cummed inside.

>>19617235
あっ
サンキュー

>>19616648
mayou 迷う
like >>19616679 has literally showed you, Mayoi.

>>19617232
epic battle of much win

precluding evening to the 大海戦

>>19617137
you should learn, read and listen more.

>>19617271
lol i had to think about preclude for a second like say it over and over again and i was like wait a second that isnt it

i meant preceding ftw

>>19617221
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quJvkUlpIVw

>>19617232
large sea war
in front night

おなかすいた

でもしんやにたべると

ふとる

>>19617339
たまにはいいんじゃない

どんなに太ってもキミはわたしのかわいいニンジャだよ

>>19614801
Where can I download Kanji Gold now?
http://web.uvic.ca/kanji-gold/ seems to no longer exist.

>>19614801
ANSWER ME QUICKLY ANON

IS IT

いちにち
ついたち
??????????????

>>19617402
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNCMUURSIjI

>>19617378
んなー

>>19614962
I don't understand what's weird about this

>>19614962
its you

youre the fish

>>19617246
Encoding it again. CRF 16.5 at 720p is kinda meh. Doing 13.5.

>>19615047
Why have I never heard of him? I mean he can say "good morning" in so many languages!

What's something equivalent to Yotsuba in difficulty I can read on my browser? Using a text hooker fucking sucks at this stage cause I have to look up so much shit. Probably a retarded question but are there any formats of manga I could go through in chrome using yomichan?

>>19616199
It's always amazing to see China's per capita standing put into perspective. They have a large population so they'll always have that huge advantage but they're so incompetent on a per capita basis.

Is there a way to know when to read 時 as じ or とき or are they equivalent?

I have a hard time differentiating them so when a word exist in jisho i just read it as it is said otherwaise i read it as とき if it doesn't seem gramatically wrong. Am i doing it right?

how did heisig mix the keywords for 村 and 町 up that bad

>>19617784
is it that important

>>19617774
just learn individual words. there's little to be gained sitting around guessing on shit when you can look stuff up so easily now.

今時 いまどき
時計 とけい
時間 じかん
何時 なんじ
潮時 しおどき
時 とき
一時 いちじ
etc

>>19617788
yeah it would be nice to know

>tax
税
>tariff
租

really heisig?

$2,246 of $5,000 per month
Vlog Trip to Japan! I will venture to the Land of the Rising Sun and film myself interacting with Japanese people in as many different situations as possible, in order to truly put my Japanese to the test (and see what reactions I get)! I will also go on a search for the best Japanese-speaking gaijin around, in order to learn from their experiences and discover how AJATT might be improved further.

Heisig's unique keyword policy is complete idiocy. You'd better just add the onyomi there to distinguish between kanji with the same meaning. But I guess that would actually make you learn something which isn't what RTK is aiming for.

>なんだってそこで頷いちゃうのかな
Can anyone point me in the right direction for the grammar for なんだって? I'd guess it means
>Why would you agree to that?
but I feel I kinda missed something with that なんだって

>>19617811
Yeah thanks, that was already what i was doing. I was was talking about when the kanji is at the end of a word, particularly when it is followed by the particule に.

For example i have just read: 使用時に, would it be false to read it as しよう とき に? A word already exist with the reading　しようじ. I think i may have misunderstood the grammar a bit here???

>>19617889
keywords make sense since you're tying the kanji down to a single piece of information. it's just some of them are awkward choices either because heisig didnt know japanese at the time or because of synonymous kanji. but the keyword isnt that important because japanese isnt english and so it's just approximation. but i wonder how hard it fucks up people who start rtk before learning any japanese like how khatz and matt vs japan recommend

>>19617900
You got the meaning right. It sounds weird for me too.

>>19617919
使用時 しようじ
使用の時 しようのとき

>>19617933
Huh, weird. First time I've seen that used like this.

What dictionary is that? I only have an JP->Eng one on my yomichan so that would be really useful.

>>19617885
When?

>>19617985
when donations hit 5k per month

How many kazoo stories can one go through before they start doubting rtk?

its not rtk you should doubt its your ability to do anything else in the way of learning nihongo

>>19618010
I got 3 kanji deep before realizing it was moronic

>>19617402
Ichinichi is one day.
tsuitachi is the first day of a month.
Context is important, anon.

>tfw I'm good enough now to play any JRPG I want and understand 98% of the dialogue without looking any words up

>>19615573
>the power of multiple powers
>cooperation
makes sense to me, chucko

>>19618010
I forget how many are in the book, and how many I've gone through. Maybe 3 by now?

Not sure, but I think the kazoo stories are great because it's a weird instrument and sound you don't normally think of. It makes for a good mnemonic/image.

>>19618055
tell me how to get to this place. how long must i toil

>>19618108
if you found djt before gaining nihongo proficiency theres not much hope for you

>>19618125
>his brain is so small that he lets 4chan affect his mentality, thinking or life in any way
just imagine

Been at it every day for about two years, give or take two months I guess. At the bare minimum an hour a day, some days as many as 5 or 6, but on average I guess probably two hours or so if I count reading I've done and games I've played and anime I've watched raw/with Japanese subs.

im just goin off the numbers here

>>19618125
So how did you do it?

>>19618153
Oops, meant for >>19618108

>>19618153
To clarify: It's extremely rare for me to spend 5 or 6 hours on Japanese in a day, I'd guess I did that maybe twice in these past two years.

>>19618158
I mean what tools did you use?

holy shit no one cares bro get a livejournal account

Reminder that if you are using a grammar guide or J>E dictionary then you have permanently fucked your brain and will never learn Japanese.

perma fucked!!

I did it.

1.1 cards a minute doesnt seem like very effective use of flashcards lol

nice going noobshit i hope for your sake that image is from reddit

>it's a "Jamal responds to literally every single comment he sees" episode
What's going on bud? Extra empty and unfulfilled today?

>>19618212
kklc is a waste of time congrats

>>19618237
>comment
Back to plebbit

>>19618260
I can't go back since I'm already on it currently. I use both 4chan and reddit. Does that make you angry?

>>19618212
>1.1 cards a minute
holy moses I've scarcely seen cases this bad. And that's as someone that completed core 10k.

>>19618225
I only use Anki to keep track of unseen kanji and schedule them.
These flashcards have an average of 3 words each and I write down at least as many as there are unique readings for the kanji in question. I have about 1200 pages filled with my rote notations.

>>19618239
I guess I should not have learned how to read and write all 常用漢字 while also getting a fuckton of vocabulary.

>>19617726
t. hubris filled yank

>>19618212
>more than 5s/card
Just sad.

>>19615637
私は日本語が出来ません。*
何でそんなに難しいの？*

Awesome stats bros you guys are amazing.

>>19618281
learning vocabulary out of context is a common beginners mistake. you didn't learn how to read kanji. i bet if i asked you to write a word you could not do it from memory. you wasted your time

>>19618212
Grats. Now you can start learning Japanese.

>>19617973
明鏡国語辞典

>>19618288
>my flashcard e-peen is bigger than yours!!
Am havin a nice laugh at your expense right now

>>19618298
Is this what you tell yourself to make yourself feel better about the time you spend shitposting here?

>>19618237
i was actually just taking a shit for that last little bit

i was wiping my ass when that post came up and i had a bit of a laugh and shook my dick at screen

hows that for livejournal blog response

>>19618305
im surprised you can even tell which way to swing with your head in the sand like that

>>19618305
you're right i'm sorry i did kklc too and the only thing it taught me in the end was stroke order and i felt like i got memed hard since it was the next big thing at the time. i hope you are fluent now that you learned to read and write all the jouyou kanji from a textbnook please forgive me

>>19618308
>>19618313
>>19618317
kys

>>19618324
66.6% isnt a passing score

>>19618333
all lower case posters should kill themselves

>>19618313
>>19618317
From the post times, these must be two different people.
Is this a gathering place for poor souls who denounce the efforts of others because they don't have the will to learn Japanese themselves?

>>19618342
thats why youre here innit mate

i just came here to laugh at you

>>19618342
>Is this a gathering place for poor souls who denounce the efforts of others because they don't have the will to learn Japanese themselves?
Yes

>>19618349
Here, have some more attention.

>>19618363
its not as fun when they go limp but its still warm i guess itll do

Reminder that if you've associated kanji with English keywords you've permanently fucked up your ability to learn Japanese.

now thats a real fun fact

If you've studied Japanese, you can't learn Japanese.

>>19618368
that's why you swap out the heisig keywords for japanese keywords and use japanese definitions for hints. assuming you're talking about rtk

>>19618373
how long till someone just posts the you cant learn japanese girl :P

>>19618377
i dont think hes talking about rtk because he said associating kanji with keywords instead of stories

Is there anything more pathetic than spending thousands of hours of your life learning a language so you can jerk off to cartoon/video game analogues for prepubescent children?

>>19618387
if you read rtk it says to review kanji in the order of keyword - > story - > kanji. eventually the story becomes unnecessary because just seeing the keyword will prompt the kanji in your head. memorizing 2200 stories is a waste of brain power but using 2200 english words you already know requires no added mental effort

>>19618397
no but whatever youre doing is right up there with it i think

>>19618405
oic

its like winblows file indexing lmao

truly epic memory hacks for the win

We postin stats now?

eh ive done a good job inspiring the change where you retards dont post about anki every day so sure today can be your cheat day

have it at it and post the sickest stats u got

>>19618055
Play Raidou then.

Do you guys add every new word you encounter to Anki?

Newcomer here.
Does this thread have any value in assisting with learning Japanese at all?

>>19618055
i bet you cant play 東京魔人学園朧綺譚 without adult supervision

>>19618458
maybe depends how much i like you and even then dont expect a free lunch

>>19618458
no. the only way to learn japanese is to listen to and read japanese. this is a thread for arguing about ways to not learn japanese and stupid questions that would be solved by listening to and reading more japanese

>>19618299
Thanks. Do you perhaps also know where I can find a DL of it?

>>19618282
Actually their GDP (PPP) is even higher than that, but look at pretty much any positive per capita metric and China is significantly behind its first world contemporaries. They'll continue growing at a faster rate but I'm sure it'll plateau long before they reach Japan or Europe. Probably has to do with their relative lack of altruism. That said, with a population that large and an average IQ that high they'll always be a force.

tl;dr Japan good, China shithole.

>>19617273

Actually laughed.

>>19618434
are you serious? i arrived here months ago and you and others motivate us to post pointless anki stats.

>>19618579
the fuck shit you on about young ninja

>>19618437
>>19618474
I don't know what those are, why would I play something I don't want to just because it has "hard" Japanese in it? The games I'm interested in are no problem for me.

>>19618458
After you clicked the link to the guide there's very very very little benefit in coming here.

>>19618485
cor -> j-j -> kokugo. You need to use this https://foosoft.net/projects/yomichan-import/ to add it but you also gotta do some weird shit to get it to work, good luck.

>>19618599
theres nothing hard about it unless youre a noob whos just tryin to flex that he can press the circle button to advance text and equip weapons and armor on his characters lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MW3BSTNeEY#t=180

>>19614801

>>19618630
Oh, that actually looks interesting. I thought it was just another game like Muramasa that's a meme because it's supposed to be difficult. That actually looks pretty fun, I'll pick that up once I finish P3 and YUNO.

>>19618599
>He doesn't know Shen Megoomi Tensay
Git gud

>>19618526
>Probably has to do with their relative lack of altruism.
You think Americans have any real altruism beyond trying to buy favours from Jesus? China is the perfect capitalist society.

>>19618706
no one thats gona make stupid memes even knows about that game

its cool and nice!

how am i doing

>>19619100
nice work. i put the story on the front so i don't confuse stupid shit. like secret 秘 and secrecy 密. it also allows you to go at a pace of 50 a day which is comfortable

>>19619100
>>>>>>>reddit

>>19619100
btw im not just doing rtk. i've been (not) reading manga and playing through ふたごの村. Listening to city pop is fun too. im going to start core 2k because not knowing the reading of some kanji is annoying.

>>19619203
big mistake. you will probably quit rtk due to overloading your anki workload and study schedule. one thing at a time

>>19619157
>story on the front
lmao ruined

Read 2 NHK easy articles today in an hour and understood about 50-60%. Yay progress

>>19619240
khatzumoto is fluent in reading and writing kanji while living and working in japan and learned thousands of characters by putting the story on front so ill take his advice over yours

Why does this 置 character look like top picture in firefox and bottom picture in chrome?

It's not even recognizably the same and throws me off

>>19619268
it's because the bottom one is using a chinese font

>>19619268
Bottom one is Chinese.

>>19619270
is there a way to fix it? I mostly use chrome so I'm stuck with the chinese thing right now

>>19619262
wait

so you think story on the front of the card is good because khatz memorized how to write kanji by writing down sentences for years (which is what he did)? i don't understand the connection you're making between the two. can you explain?

>>19619276
yea switch to firefox

>>19619230
thanks for the advice. i feel like im making good pace right now and my retention is great. should i at least start a mining deck for things I encounter while reading? or should I hold off on that too.

>>19619276
i don't know because i don't use chrome, but i found this which you can try out: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/%E9%83%A8%E5%88%86%E5%BC%B7%E5%88%B6%E3%83%A1%E3%82%A4%E3%83%AA%E3%82%AA%E3%81%A1%E3%82%83%E3%82%93/kmjcmncjhdnaealenhoohllicfkdojpb?utm_source=chrome-app-launcher-info-dialog

>>19619298
thanks, that fixed it

>>19619283
he did not write down sentences for years. you are making things up

>>19619292
just hold off on other anki decks. continue to look up words while reading and listenig, some will stick some wont

>>19619306
he did though. he finished RTK using the method you described but he continued writing down kanji from his sentence flashcards so he wouldn't forget them.

オレオレ詐欺

>>19619320
your point? he is fluent in writing and reading kanji and subscribes the advice that you complete a keyword to kanji course such as rtk and that having the story on the front as a hint is not a hindrance to the memorization process. heisig would agree as well. besides it's not like you even need the story after 3-4 reviews and it allows you to up your intake of kanji per day which is allowing me to move through the book at a comfortable pace. i can't imagine taking 4+ months to get through all of rtk. heisig himself says you can do it all in just a couple weeks.

>>19619345
Nice try, but I saw that in the dictionary the other day while flipping the pages.

>>19619357
>your point?
that there's a difference in efficiency between two methods even if you arrive at the same destination.
>heisig would agree as well.
no he doesn't
>heisig himself says you can do it all in just a couple weeks.
yea because he did so. he spent 8 hours a day doing it. you can do that doing keyword to kanji but you'd have to invest a similar number of hours.

>>19619364
>not learning about stuff like that through exposure
Come on, it's not even that rare in anime and stuff.

>>19619320

彼は出来ないじゃないですね？

>>19619381
>watching anime
Are you an otaku or something??

wow, you can do 50 cards a day and it wont mess up your retention? why have i been stopping at 15 a day then :(

>>19619381
What kind of anime are you watching lmao

I have been studying kanji for the last 2 month using the RTK method and i am almost done with it. I dont know any of the readings so what am i supposed to do about it? I am looking for a way to increase vocab but all i find are Core 2k/6k stuff. 2000 or 6000 words vocabulary is no where near enough to read japanese literature. I couldnt find any decka bigger than this. So i was looking for other ways to increase my Vocab. I plan to read light novels such as NGNL , SAO and Oregairu, so i am not sure how much words should suffice.

>>19619415
>I am looking for a way to increase vocab but all i find are Core 2k/6k stuff. 2000 or 6000 words vocabulary is no where near enough to read japanese literature.
hey i know the right image to describe your situation but this guy >>19619412 already posted it

>>19619374
rtk is not a torturous process like some people want you to believe

>>19619415

just do core2/6k since you have no vocab. this will allow you to read, which is where you will find and endless amount of new content.

Speaking of RTK, how many of you have reached a high level of Japanese using methods commonly recommended here? eg. referencing Tae Kim, reading a lot, listening occasionally, RTK, etc.

And how long did it take you to reach a high level? I define high level as being able to read read books and novels proficiently, able to understand 100% of japanese television shows and conversations between native speakers with no effort and being able to speak fluently with minimal foreign accent.

If possible I would really appreciate it if you could upload some audio of you speaking so I can check with JP natives to verify proficiency.

ive been seeking the djt success stories for quite a while now to no avail

youre not gonna find one

which is fucked up because you dont even need to be well versed and have a robust vocabulary to show that youve at least gotten started on actual competency but alas・・

>>19619440
No one following the methods recommended in the guide will be able to speak fluently because the recommended methods don't include every day life in a Japanese environment. If someone tells you they can speak fluently without having lived surrounded with Japanese people they are lying by omission.

the secret to making it is you dont come back to djt.

i feel like this guy's level is pretty attainable and he doesnt seem that good, but his conversation skills are up there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_3-N0TnICo&t=871s

>>19619411
anything beyond 5 cards a day is overkill. you'll burn out

>>19619497
within a few seconds: "can you introduce yourself in japanese?" "yeah i use a book called genki"

wow some great skills

>>19619415
There's also Core10k

>>19619440
>I define high level as being able to read read books and novels proficiently, able to understand 100% of japanese television shows and conversations between native speakers with no effort and being able to speak fluently with minimal foreign accent.
No one of that level would be in the DJT.

>>19619440
I've read Utawarerumono in 3 days, so I think I'm at least not in starting shoes anymore. Though not nearly as high level as you're asking for, that kind of level can only be reaching through living in Japan.
I learned mostly through exposure, combined with ~20 minutes anki core deck.
I also did the first Heisig book at the start but it didn't help me much so I just forgot what I learned from it.

you find proficient people in the /int/ DJT threads. definitely not here.

>>19619497
It's definitely attainable. In fact I'm sure many people here have already reached the level of "I can't even say a basic sentence without stumbling"