/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Of course it's the only path.
Ilya and Taiga hotspring=True End.

My whole life was...

Body of Swords and Mind of Steel

My body is made of swords.
Iron is my blood, and glass is my heart.
I have overcome countless battlefields undefeated,
Without once retreating,
Nor once being understood.
Always alone, intoxicated with victory on the hill of swords.
Therefore, there is no meaning to that life.
This body is probably itself a sword.

I have no regrets, this was the only path.

What is this 'Mind of Steel' end?

>>1832867
Unlimited Sage Works

>>1832870
Theoretical "Bad End" in which Shirou doesn't give up his ideals during HF and becomes like his father by hardening his mind to everything that could distract him, turning it "to steel."

He wins the Grail War, but Illya calls him stupid.

>>1832870
Kill Sakura, get Best Bad End.

In b4 'soy el hueso de mi espada'

>>1832779
>Mind of Steel

>>1832873
How the fuck can he win without a Servant?

>>1832872
Is that the best HF end?

I never got it myself but I have both HF ends.

A CHALLENGER APPEARS!

"Ha... ah— You became strong, Shirou. "
She speaks to the young man fallen beside her, in front of her eyes.
The boy's wound is life threatening, but compared to her, moving should be possible.
It should be simple to stand up and plunge the sword in her defenseless heart.

"... No, I was wrong. You were strong from the beginning."
She says to herself with a pained breath.
Victory is decided.
Accepting her impending annihilation, she speaks in a broken voice.

"Go on, bring the conclusion. My body will heal if you don't hurry."
"—"
There is no response.

>>1832908
We'll never know...

Yo soy el corazon de mi espada.
Acero es mi cuerpo y fuego mi sangre.
He creado miles de espadas.
Negligiendo mi vida, ignorando my muerte.
He soportado gran dolor al crear estas espadas.
Pero esas manos que crean nunca podran sentir nada.
Por eso, mientras ruego, 'Unlimited Blade Works'

>>1832914
Fuck yes.

>>1832908
Just like Kritsugu did, durr.

He will kill all the Masters head on.

>>1832779
- "That which cannot be changed" FATE TRUE END.
- "Heaven's Fall" UBW TRUE END.
- "Texture" UBW GOOD END.

>>1832923
Is it possible to translate "Unlimited Blade Works" to spanish without sounding stupid?

>>1832938
what bad ends are those?

>>1832947
It's hard, especially when you realize it sounds stupid in the original text and the English translation you will base your translations on.

"Είμαι το κόκκαλο του σπαθιού μου"

Well well, it seems I have two choices left, between a life of sex with my whore half moe half milf waifu, or a manly death against my ex servant...
I can't decide wich one should I take !

>>1832947
Nope.
>>1832923
Best translation ever.

Is there a choice walkthrough for Mind of Steel?

>>1832938
-Saber kills Shirou n exchange for the Grail
-Shirou jumps in the Grail with Gil
-Rin gives Shirou amnesia

>>1832953
Actually the original says "My body is made out of swords" so it's "Το σώμα μου είναι φτιαγμένο από σπαθιά".
Well everything sounds stupid in Greek.

>>1832955
Search your feelings.

>>1832870
>>1832872
It's called UBW.

>>1832962
There is one TRUE end for UBW.

And it makes me sympathize with Shirou.

>>1832969
Feelings.

>>1833010
oh shit are we about to have a segue into pink floyd

>>1833025
His boss's daughter.

>>1833010
who's the far left one?

>>1833010
WRONG.

>>1833027
Do want

>>1833025
Shirou's boss's daughter.

One of the three minor Ataraxia characters that people always need help identifying every damn time someone posts them.

>>1833027
Man i want sakura to do that to me.

>>1833041
nyaa

>>1833010
TRYING TO FORGET MY
FEELINGS OF HAAAAATE

>>1833027
I want Sakura's penis inside me.

That's not gay or anything.

>>1833055
Not at all.

FEEEEEEEELINGS

>>1833060

>>1832872

Theoretical meaning everyone wishes it was in the game, but in fact it's not, correct?

>>1833067

>>1833080
It's not described, because if you wanted to read that end, you would be playing UBW now.

>>1833095
Not really, that Shirou is by far stupid than UBW's one.

Mind of steel Shirou will end as an emo mass-killer without manliness.

Eh.

I could take em all on in a fight with one hand behind my back.

While wearing a blind fold.

Naked.

>>1832779
Only true path would be an Illya route. And there isn't one, or so I hear.

>>1833123
Do want.

From the get-go. "I'll be your servant, Ilya. I can beat that archer chump too."

>>1833123
>>1833125
Cry to TYPE-MOON.

Ilya, the new Sacchin.

>>1833107

>>1833108
you aren't naked if you're wearing a blindfold

What's the point of an Ilya end ?
She would die a year or two after the war anyways.

Jestem koscia mojego miecza
zelazo to me cialo, a ogien krwia
stowrzylem ponad tysiac ostrzy
Nieznany smierci
Ani zyciu
wytrzymalem wiele bolow by stworzyc wiele broni
jednak,te rece nigdy nie beda juz nic trzymac
Wiec jak sie modle, "UNLIMITED BLADE WORKS"

Shitty polish translation ,have fun

Illya's route is Archer's past right? Maybe that's going to be what the new Light Novel is about......

>>1833151
Nope, considering how much value he puts on Rin's necklance.

>>1833143
For the hot semi-loli sex with Illya.

>>1833167
Whoops, forgot my pic.

>>1833164
The necklace is important to all Shirou's. Who it belongs to doesn't matter in the slightest.

>>1833147

Why would you translate that into polish? What the fuck. FUCKING SLAVS I SWEAR...

>>1833151
Archer path:
He could not save Saber.
Ilya died after the war.
Last family and lover also lost.
Developed his magic on his own, and fucked up his body (thus, probably no Archer same person in his Grail War)
Last thing left to do, follow the ideal. Not as ruthless as Kiritsugu, not as hopeful as Shirou was.

Then contract with the world, Counter Guardian etc.

>>1833151
New Light Novel?

>>1833186
Illya could be considered both the last family and lover.

>>1833227
Perhaps, but it's a vague phrase from the Intermissions of Rin's dreams of Archer's life.
Speculating on that is kinda...pointless.

"Je suis le coeur de mon épée
D'acier est mon corps, de feu est mon sang.
J'ai crée plus de mille lames
Inconnu a la mort
Ni connu a la vie
Ai souffert pour creer d'innombrables armes
Cependant, ces mains ne tiendront jamais rien
Alors que je prie, Travaux de lames infini."
Oh god, french is horrible, god forbid I ever hear a F/SN french dub, I'd instantly kill myself.
(also, liberal interpretation of UBW to make it sound less stupid than it would)

"Je suis le coeur de mon épée
D'acier est mon corps, de feu est mon sang.
J'ai crée plus de mille lames
Inconnu a la mort
Ni connu a la vie
Ai souffert pour creer d'innombrables armes
Cependant, ces mains ne tiendront jamais rien
Alors que je prie, Travaux de lames infinis."
Oh god, french is horrible, god forbid I ever hear a F/SN french dub, I'd instantly kill myself.
(also, liberal interpretation of UBW to make it sound less stupid than it would)

אני העצם של חרבי
גופי הוא פלדה,ונפשי היא להבה
בחיי יצרתי אלפי חרבות
לא מוכר למוות
ואף לא לחיים
סבלתי כאב כדי ליצור כלי נשק רבים
אבל ידיים אלה לא יחזיקו בדבר
לכן בעוד אני מתפלל, unlimited blade works
actually sounds pretty good in hebrew

>>1833237
Hey, "Travaux de lames infinis," sounds pretty badass.

the best

Ich bin das Rückrat meines Schwerts.
Stahl ist mein Körper, Feuer ist mein Blut.
Ich habe tausende von Klingen geschaffen.
Unbekannt dem Tode.
Noch bekannt des Lebens.
Habe Schmerzen ausgehalten um viele Waffen zu schaffen.
Doch diese, meine Hände werden nie etwas in ihnen halten.
So bete ich: "Grenzlose Klingenwerke"

Where's mah Taiga with Illya onee-chan route?

>>1833258
It's called "Tiger Doujo."

>>1833256
>>1833240
>>1833237

I take it back, the Slav version was better. Fucking... TRIPLE NIGGERS... Fuck...

>>1833258
TWO onee-chans?! At once?! Are you insane, man?!

>>1833266

since when is French and German niggerspeak?

>>1833236
Isn't that why it's so fun to speculate? Anyway his last family member would either have to be Taiga or Illya. No one else is possible.

>>1833270
One is the wife. The other is the onee-chan. Together, they cannot be beaten.

>>1833269
But that's not a route.

>>1833136

>>Ilya, the new Sacchin.

Who is this Sacchin you are talking about?

>>1833283

>>1833255
Dunno, just said it out loud, sounded pretty dumb.
Probably the worst thing would be italian.
"Io sono il cuore della mia spada.
Acciaio è il mio corpo, fuoco è il mio sangre
Avete crea più di mille lame
Sconosciuto alla morte
Né conosciuto alla vita
Hanno sofferto per creare d' armi innumerevoli
tuttavia, queste mani non terranno mai nulla
mentre prego, lavori di lame infinito."

God, damn.

>>1833296
Word by word it would be :
>Sono il cuore della mia spada
>Acciaio è il mio corpo, e fuoco è il mio sangue
>Ho creato più di un migliaio di lame
>Sconosciuto alla morte
>Ne conosciuto alla vita
>Sopportato il dolore della creazione di molte armi
>Ma tuttavia queste mani non impugneranno mai nulla
>Per cui mentre prego, "Unlimited Blade Works"
And yeah, it is as bad as it sounds.

>>1833348
So one thing that we can agree on, after putting the UBW chant in various languages, is that it sounds the best in english.
Blades doth come henceforth from thy self
Body hammered into iron and blood doth come from dragon's breath
My body hath forged infinite swords
To know knowledge of death nor sheathed in life
Torturers whip hath taken it's toll on my body to accomplish this.
But yet I remain unarmed
So do my pioused mission give, Unlimited Blade Works

>>1833362
That's horrid.

And the entire point is that Shirou = Swords.

One who has only known swords, a sword amongst infinite, nameless others atop a hill, never fulfilled.

>>1833348
>That's horrid.

I don't think it was supposed to be cool. It's like that ultra-scientific version

>>1833095

Oooh...Yeah, come to think of it, I remember a bad end around 30 or 31 that was the "mind of steel" bad end. Oh how I wished they played that one out with Shiro killing everyone and then destroying the grail by himself. Why didn't they have that as a route rather than a bad end? FFFFFFFFFF

>>1833419
Cause instead of seeing kiritsugu Light, you can see him an all his glory at Fate Zero.

>>1833426

Good point Anonymous. Seeing Kiritsugu in bad-ass mode is going to be epic.

>>1833419
Because it will be utterly stupid and that's not the true point in the game.

>>1833435
Fate/Zero, anyone.

>>1833438
Think about it, you kill Sakura, and then team up with Illya to win the grail war. Then you use the grail to extend Illya's life. Everyone wins.

>>1833426
But it's too short, I want more.

>>1833446
Team with Ilya?

Ilya was the one who said you TO NOT kill Sakura. She is totally dissapointed with Shirou if he choose the ideal basically destroying his humanity for something that wasn't even his own.

He probably will kill Ilya if he go that way.

>>1833446
I'd rather have a route where I kill Rin, Sakura, Team up with Ilya, destroy the grail that cannot do anything ( corrupted, would make Ilya something like a vegetable, knowing it's weird way of doing things) and save people after she dies.

>>1833446
>team up with Illya

Shirou would end up killing her to prevent her from being used as the Holy Grail. He'll destroy it so it could never be used.

It'll be Kiritsugu and Irisviel all over again.

>>1833446

>>1833475
Silly woman, you can only reason with feelings, you're not fit to give me advice, especially since my father abandoned you and killed your mother.

>>1832969
>>1833177

Sauce.

>Mind of Steel
>Heaven's Feel True End

I salute you, sir.

>>1833513
http://tatari.110mb.com/TMDP/index.htm

>>1833498
>my father abandoned you

Do you pay any attention at all?

>>1833525
Okay, your father killed your mother and didn't come back to fetch you, better ?

>>1833498
Yeah, and what it's the way that people call to a man who betrays his own feelings for a cursed ideal that wasn't even his own, and that will lead him to despair, turning him into a machine hated by the people and unable to get happiness?

Ah yeah, hypocrite.

>>1833559
No, a hypocrite is someone who claims to live up to an ideal, but abandons it at the first sign of trouble.

>>1833522
Any idea which pack they are in? Or at least the titles?

>>1833559
A hypocrite is someone who professes belief in one thing but does the opposite of it.

Having an ideal, following it, and being wrong doesn't make you a hypocrite.

>>1833545
Kiritsugu tried to get Ilya back. Old Acht didn't answer him and left him to rot and die instead, separated from his daughter.

Yeah, at the end of Fate/Zero, Kiritsugu noticed that his only wish was to being with Iri and Ilya, but he noticed too late.

>>1833559
Do yu really think he cares about being liked and being happy ?
All he wants is to save people, that is his ideal, happiness and appreciation are for weak minded people like Sakura and Shinji.

>>1833559
Shirou's ideal is Shirou's ideal. That Kiritsuga had the same ideal means nothing. Shirou accepted it as his own, so it is his own.

Ideals are greater than feelings, and there is no guarantee that the ideal will lead him to despair. Mind of Steel is the HF True End.

>>1833591
>Ideals are greater than feelings
That's, just like, your opinion, man.

>>1833591 there is no guarantee that the ideal will lead him to despair

Did you even read the game and Fate/zero? Really?

>>1833606
Everything is, like, our opinion, man.

>>1833569
>>1833579
>>1833587
Read the game.

That ideal it's KIRITSUGU's ideal. Shirou only clinged for it because it's his own way to keep himself alive. Even Archer said him that ideal wasn't his own.

That's the whole point of the game. In HF, he want to save Sakura. If he goes with the other path, he's being and hypocrite because he's betraying his real wish.

>>1833569
Which is what he does in Mind of Steel. He always wanted to save everyone, not sacrifice one person to save many. Mind of Steel is the easy way out for a Shirou who is too weak to try and truthfully fulfill his ideals. In HF he tries to save Sakura while saving everyone else, which is much closer to his original ideal, even if he isn't completely successful.

UBW Shirou is neither Kiritsugu nor Archer. Their wishes aren't the same. Kiritsugu and Archer both gave up on caring about the means to obtaining the results they desired, which is why they were fucked over later by their own guilt when things didn't turn out right.

UBW Shirou promises not to give up on the means, while working towards results which he knows might not turn out right, and refuses to call what he believes in anything but beautiful. Even if he's hurt by it later.

>>1833618
Shirou doesn't have a real wish at the start. In Fate he finds that he wants Saber above anything, in UBW he wants to prove Archer wrong and HF it's Sakura.

>>1833591
>there is no guarantee that the ideal will lead him to despair.

This guy says otherwise.

>>1833618
One of the points in a few routes is that he makes the ideal his own.
It's a beautiful thing he admires regardless in the end.
Thus, no hypocrisy or something as stupid as that.

>>1833644
And after confronting Shirou realizes the ideal is not bad or wrong.

The rest of the world is, actually.

>>1833649
Saving Sakura is sacrificing thousands of innocents to save one, which is even worse. Mind of Steel is the true manly route, and if you don't understand why it is the best ending you are probably a woman.

>>1833446
>Use the Grail
>Save Ilya
Sorry can't be done, using Heaven's Feel consumes the Holy Grail container wich happens to be Ilya.
You might consider using Sakura, but I doubt she's willing to sacrifice herself to save an unknown little girl.
And she wouldn't be able to retain her sanity enough to use the sorcery correctly anyways.

>>1833665
That's the whole point of Shirou.

He's not broken. It's the rest of the world that is.

Shirou = Reverie.

>>1833618
No.
In HF, Archer says that if Shirou goes against what has been his ideal keeping him alive for so long, he will have to pay the price for this treason of himself.
And Sakura herself says Shirou broke himself to protect her.

>>1833591
>>1833659
False, even the game says otherwise. Shirou never accepted it at his own.

Maybe he can make the ideal his own if the events go like UBW, but at the point of the choice in HF, it's impossible because he loves Sakura and he wants to save her. So he already has a wish on his own.

And this probably it's THE WHOLE point of the Fate saga, as we already saw this two times, with Kiritsugu and with Shirou.

If you people, are a bunch of nazi ideal fanboys that can't understand the whole point of the progression of the game, then can't be helped.

>>1833659
Killing Sakura to protect others eventually leads to killing Rin to prevent her from winning the War, then killing Ilya to prevent the Holy Grail from being used, then killing other innocent people to save other people.

In the end, Shirou will end up killing more than he saved, which is the whole point of Archer's existence.

but can't you activate grail without a vessel?

>>1833675
We don't know exactly how many Sakura killed, but it's several hundred at least. Even if Shirou has to kill every remaining Master he's still following his ideal.

>>1833675
Not 'more' than he saved.
Humanity>10 people.

>>1833684
There's more people than just Shirou who can stop Angry Manyu in the Nasuverse.

>>1833675
No, Archer kills 1 to save 10, Kills 10 to save 100, Kills 100 to save 1000. etc. He doesn't kill more than he saves.

>>1833680
The Vessel is the 'key' that is used to pen the door to the Greater Grail, where among other things, you have unlimited magical energy.
Without it, the Greater Grail will NOT open properly.
Besides, Avenger is about to burst out from there.

>>1833684
In the end, Archer saved hundreds while he killed thousands. He killed to protect the people, then he killed those he protected to protect other people.

It became an endless chain of deaths.

>>1833659
I never said anything about it being better or worse, but Shirou never had that type of utilitarianism in his ideals in any of the other routes, so Mind of Steel is not Shirou seeing his ideals through to the end.

>>1833670
Archer thinks that the ideal, even if it's a false emotion, it's Emiya Shirou's only emotion. That's why Archer tried to kill him in UBW, as he thinks that Shirou cannot be fixed.

That's the whole point of Archer quote.

>>1833693
Few will take notice before it bursts out and kills a good amount of humanity everywhere.

3d fastest humanity killer bitch.
Even if stopped, we will be licking major wounds.

>>1833670
That's also the reason he couldn't use Archer's or his own abilities correctly in HF, whereas he absorbed everything naturally in UBW over time. Once he abandoned his ideal, his world and Archer's became irreconcilable, and everything he used was a poison then.

>>1833690
Other way around.

Archer killed 10 to save 1. Killed 100 to save 10. Killed 1000 to save 100.

>>1833705
...He saved many, of the price of killing few (in comparison).
Even as a Counter Guardian (where unlike his life there was no discrimination between good and evil), this held true.

Don't confuse things.

The chain of death is a different matter.

>>1833697
It's not simple numeric utilitarianism, it's killing the guilty to protect the innocent. Shirou doesn't want to do this, but he has no choice. He can only avoid it by betraying himself, which is the worst thing possible. HEAVENS FAIL.

Stop reasoning with numbers, Shirou hasn't any duty to save others, beside an ideal forced by his sense of guilt cause he was the only one that surived that fire.
Shirou decided that Sakura was worth for him more than all of these unknown people, and it's still their fault if they weren't strong enough to protect themselves, I don't see why Shirou should shoulder himself the responsability of saving their lives.
Sacrifying Sakura is the codard's way, the easy path for someone that prefers to blindly follow his ideals instead of being true to himself and live on facing the consequences.

>>1833710
That's because the ideal it's what he used to fill his void. It's a false emotion, as Archer calls it. That didn't turn it into his own.

And in "Return to the Spring" it's even said that Shirou will be able to use his RM with training.

>>1833693
Archer saves the world once.
He can kill as much as he wants, as long as it's under half of humanity, he'll still have saved more than he killed.

>>1833718
I believe it's the reverse.

>>1833737
I believe it's the other way around.

>>1833737
Of course it is.
Otherwise, it contradicts he reason d'etre.

>>1833734
Archer is in no way an objective opinion on the subject. He is just bitter about what he does as a Counter Guardian.

>>1833724
Saving Sakura is the cowardly option. Following the ideal is the difficult option, because it is actually impossible. UBW is the best route because Shirou recognizes it as impossible but keeps following it anyway.

>>1833734
I'm still at odds with that, seeing as Rin didn't even know what it was. Shirou could've told her, I suppose, assuming he remembered everything correctly from Archer's arm fucking with his brain.

Rin is wrong about stuff in the game, mostly due to the fact that she doesn't understand it.

Nasu is also a bad continuity writer.

>>1833722
He betray his fundation, and he thinks that he's betraying himself because in HF he didn't get to notice that the ideal wasn't even his own as UBW Shirou did.

But killing Sakura is betraying his own real wish, a thing that he developed on his own.

That's why Mind of Steel it's a total fail for Shirou, a Bad End, and you even get Ilya insulting you in the dojo.

>>1833759
Actually, there are no continuity issues per route.
Rin understands both in UBW and HF how Archer's magic works.

And since Shirou has the potential in his soul from the start, regardless if it's not exactly the same as Archer's, he will be able to use it most probably.

Nothing to think too hard about.

>>1833722
So why does Shirou let Shinji go in every route, despite knowing that he intends to kill as many people as it takes to win the Grail War? Sakura has no intention to kill, but he has to kill her to maintain his ideal? This never made sense to me.

Also let's not forget that at the time when Shirou decides whether or not to kill Sakura, he has no idea that she is the shadow that is killing people, he only knows that she might kill people in the future. Therefore he is offered the choice to kill an innocent in order to possibly prevent future deaths, or to try to save Sakura before she could kill anyone. I'm pretty sure that the latter is much closer to his original ideal of saving everyone.

>>1833770
There's no such thing as the ownership of the ideal, once you take it, it's yours.
You don't invent an ideal out of thin air anyway, you have to find it somewhere.

>>1833774
Rin never knew Archer/Shirou had a reality marble in HF. She would of needed to find out later on from Shirou himself. Sure she knew that they could project shit but she obviously didn't know anything about it since she asked Shirou to project Zeltrech from blueprints and all that.

>>1833765
Not for Shirou.

Shirou is like Kirei, a void man. The easy way for him is turn into a emo-machine and forgot about all. He will turn into a mass-killer and that's all.

But being true to your own feelings and live on facing the consequences, that's what real men do.

My being is made of swords.
Steel and glass to shape, and liquid fire to bind
I have surpassed the wars and strife
Without deterioration
Nor preservation
Withstanding both regret and lust of battle upon this world of never-ending blades,
Waiting for the one, the arrival of victory.
This is the only way, the single possibility of the noble life.
My soul always was the Utopia of Blades and Wishes

>>1833793
Shirou is Lawful Good. He can't punish people for intention, only for action.

>>1833802
Remind me again why we use the engrish version ?

>>1833797
She doesn't just get a FLASH OF IDEAS to know how exactly a reality manipulating random per person magic works.

It comes together.
Besides, at the epilogue, she might have experimented/trained with Shirou if you look for excuses.

>>1833798
PROTIP:
In the end of each route, Shirou acts on his feelings, and not just manipulated or blindly following an ideal.
Read closely, you'll get it.
If not, whatever.

>>1833794
The game says it the other way.

And here isn't what you think, it's what Nasu wants to say.

And really, the whole point it's that Shirou isn't a normal person. He's a void guy that "didn't died when he was killed" and took some strange ideal to fill the void without even understanding it.

>>1833814
It's better.

>>1833798
In Mind of Steel he has to live with the consequences of killing his friends. You're a dangerous psychopath if you think that is "easy".

>>1833797
This. Rin talks about materials and composition, but Shirou doesn't use that. She thinks he uses projection in the form of magecraft, but Shirou's projection is based off of his reality marble. It turns image into reality, it doesn't build off of base components.

And I don't think anyone but Illya and Shirou get what Archer was and what his power worked off of, even after HF ends. Rin is making promises without fully comprehending the details of Shirou's life.

>>1833815
Yeah, of course.

But at the point that he got in HF, he already found a wish, and that's Sakura.

>>1833826
For a normal person, not. For Shirou, who is a void human who can turn his mindo into steel, yes.

>>1833759
Unlimited Blade Works isn't just the expanded field of swords. It's what allows Shirou to record swords and use his type of projection.

>>1833813
I can understand Shirou letting Shinji go, but I never got the impression that he believed Sakura to be guilty, since it was the shadow that made her kill. That's why I think killing Sakura to save others is a utilitarian decision that Shirou wouldn't make.

>>1833831
It's a DIFFERENT wish.
Than the other two routes.
In the end of each route, he decides 'This what I want to do' and throws himself at it.

Worshiping Saber and being her sidekick, being a Hero and being with Rin, or Saving a self-wallowing bitch that's about to end the world.

All of these are feelings he develops on different circumstances and events.

>>1833839
Yeah, but full use of the reality marble should be restricted by the fact that he's denying the principle it was based off of.

Anyway, this is just another conversation which we can't confirm the facts of, but merely speculate on. I'm not adverse to that, just warning ahead of time.

>>1833831
But it's not a true wish, it is only emotion. Shirou never actively decided to abandon his ideal, he was only distracted by Sakura's tits. Because he was stupid and horny, many innocent people died, including the real Shirou. To throw away an ideal for a girl is the height of normalfaggotry.

>>1833830
He will probably be able to perform a Reality Marble, it's only that the landscape and some details will be different.

>>1833826
Shirou's already fucked up in the head, so killing won't be a problem for him.

>>1833866
You talk about UBW specifically, which was shaped by Shirou's way of life.

But Shirou has the talent to put shape to his mind regardless. After HF, unlimited Sakura Blossom Works.

>>1833851
The shadow doesn't just magically change personality completely, even if it tries to go on a rampage.

>>1833872
Well fuck, I'd damn the whole world for a sexhungry lovely milf anyday.

>>1833875
The rules would probably be different, as well, even if possible to recreate the reality marble. It's not just aesthetic effects, but the way in which that world functions.

>>1833872
Then don't walk Sakura home? I don't see the problem here.

>>1833887
Yeah, a reality marble shouldn't be impossible, but it wouldn't be UBW. And if he strays so far from his premise, his own projection and reinforcement abilities should mutate as well.

His alignment is "sword" either because of getting Avalon Inside or because of his ideal. If it's Avalon Inside, then it wouldn't change, but if his alignment is solely based on what he's done in developing his internal self, then throwing that away should fuck him up a lot.

Although he could be born with the alignment, but Rin said it was a crazy ass thing to have.

>>1833887
>The shadow doesn't just magically change personality completely, even if it tries to go on a rampage.
Sure, Sakura was mentally unhinged from years of rape, but there is still no way that she would have killed anyone if it weren't for the shadow.

>>1833887
Don't forget Sakura turned crazy because of the way the Matou teached her magic, the crest worm, Shinji's raping her, Avenger's influence and being unable to proprely contain all the Heroic Spirit in her body wich made her persona unstable.
It wasn't just the shadow...

>>1833889
That's why you're a normalfag, my dear.
>>1833893
The effects would probably something like inverting effects of things, in a metaphor of how his ideal got inverted (Save all while sacrificing one => Save one while sacrificing all)

>>1833872
No, that's a wish. He as a human, loves another human and want that human to be happy and smile. That's a really beautiful wish.

Wishes born for emotion and experience.

>>1833914
Of course she would, she's a female. Females don't have morality in the same way as men. The only factors they consider in judging something right or wrong is "will it feel good?" and "will I be punished?".

>>1833926
2d female we're talking about here, not 3d sluts.

>>1833831
What a shitty wish, though.

Sakura is just your average woman. Jealous, spiteful, manipulative, and worst of all(to Shirou) someone who is able to take out her own misfortune onto others unjustly.

I mean, give me a break. Who does she think she's competing with here? On one end you have the super-idol Rin who is harsh but honest, hardworking, and reliable, and on the other end you have Saber who is Shirou's true soulmate, no two ways about it.

Sakura didn't deserve a spot with those two. Ilya otoh did, as she had a much harder life than Sakura, yet with just a little kindness, a little influence from Shirou she was shown to be a beautiful person.

>>1833930
Nasu said that Sakura is Shirou's true love.

>>1833930
True, she didn't deserve to be the object of Shirou's wish.

>>1833930
In my mind, Sakura dies at the end and Rider is the true heroine.

;_;

>>1833936
Unless you are Nasu, it doesn't really work.

>>1833930
This. I can't believe wanting to save Sakura is his true wish, and not just a result of wanting to fuck her, because Sakura is so obviously unlovable.

>>1833944

Maybe I AM Nasu~

>>1833945
You know, for having HF being a route focusing on Sakura being the love interest, Rin and Saber sure came off looking a lot better than in any other route.

>>1833936
Which is why in the game's final TRUE END, Shirou meets up with Sakura in the afterlife in Avalon.

Amirite?

>>1833952
...Oh shit.

>>1833930
Is it really any surprise that Shirou has an attraction to damaged goods? He wanted a woman who needed to be protected, and Sakura definitely needs protection more than Saber or Rin, who can mostly take care of themselves.

>>1833952
Then, go write Archer's backstory and fix your shitty stories, they don't turn out the way we want them to.

>>1833955
...It's a follow-up to FATE, since fans were butthurt.

I know you people are biased and give more importance to things you like, but come on.

>>1833963
Saber is a perfect woman, because she is effectively a man with tits+vagooo.

>>1833973
Different reasons, same conclusion for me.

>>1833973

>>1833961
>>1833961
It's the fact that Saber was terrible at taking care of herself that drove him to want to protect her so much in Fate. The girl was recklessly chasing after a death wish.

>>1833973
True.

The thing I hate about Fate route was that it had a shitty LAST BOSS fight.

>>1833961
But he was never attracted to Sakura. Just Rin. He just saw Sakura as a younger sister until she shoved her vagOO in his face.

>>1833930
That's why she got 6000 votes in the popularity polls. She isn't a hated character, she is a "not that popular" character as Rin and Saber. That's all.

You're pretty much exagerating and spiting all Sakura's negative meme-traits, she has a lot of good traits, like her wanting Shirou's happiness, her being able to resist the tortures during 11 years staying as herself, etc..

>>1833944
>>1833955
He said it various times, even in the last popularity poll. So it's the truth.

>>1833999
That's why a point in the game was that he loved Sakura even before the war right? He was trying to negate it, but at the end he can't.

>>1833999
Read the game. It's explained.

>>1834008
>You're pretty much exagerating and spiting all Sakura's negative meme-traits, she has a lot of good traits, like her wanting Shirou's happiness, her being able to resist the tortures during 11 years staying as herself, etc..
Once again, all these traits are superseded by Ilya. Just try and tell me that Sakura did any of these better than Ilya did.

>>1833991
He wanted to protect her because he thought that women shouldn't fight. By the end of the route he accepted the fact that Saber could take care of herself.

>>1834008
Archer scores higher than Sakura in the polls.

>>1834031
I'm not the anon you're replying to, but although I like Ilya more I don't think that Sakura doesn't deserve to be a heroine. Sakura is an interesting character and HF wouldn't be the same without her batshit insane moments.

>>1834035
You do know that Shirou never had any qualms with Rin fighting? That's because he didn't watch as she became paste on the sidewalk by Berserker.

Shirou only yields to Saber's intention to fight after she turns down Kotomine's offer for the holy grail. All the way up to that point Shirou would place himself in danger to prevent saber from being in harms way.

>>1834048
Because Rin is just more bad assed than Saber.

>>1834031
Well, Sakura never considered herself fitting to him, she even used her last Command Spell and went to sacrifice herself to stop Zouken, she regained her mind seeing Rin's love and tried to kill herself and Angra Mainyu...

Memes aside, I don't think that Sakura did nothing really wrong until the more she functioned as an holy grail the more her personality as a human faded away and lost herself. Under normal conditions, she is like the encarnation of happiness in Shirou's life. And it's like Shirou said, in front of him, her smiles were true smiles.

Really, see the last popularity poll. Sakura is more popular than Ilya as today.

>>1834037
And? He's a VERY popular character.

>>1834084
Someone who falls apart at the sight of dead bodies is not bad ass. Rin is more like, "I'd be perfect if I weren't such a ditz."

Killing one to save many is logical, cold, and calculated.

It's not hot-blooded, however.
A hot-blooded man will say, "FUCK the civilian casualty's, my bitch is in there!" and rush head long to save things important to him.

Wheres the justice in saving people you don't even know to saving the people you love? Who cares if they all have loved ones of there own, if you don't have yours?