/jp/ - Otaku Culture

This is why UBW is the most badass route.

>>1813713
Enjoy being a teenager.

Nice copy/paste from Wikipedia, brother.

>>1813713
You mean, the most retarded.

>>1813716
Yeah, it is.

I just didn't realize it until read that part of the wiki. It's completely true. Can't believe I missed it.

>>HF:
>>as an adult who accepts the impossibility of the ideal and settles for an easy fuck instead of becoming a badass.

>>1813745
He became one of those loathsome disgusting adults, the kind who compromises on their ideals.

>>1813745
hurr

durr

holy fuck shit cock FSN is deep

>>1813745 instead of becoming a badass.

Did the OP's image not load properly for you?

>>1813756
The only thing that's badass in that picture is an arm from a badass person.
The guy currently wearing that arm is usurping that badassness.

>>1813766
>suggestion that archer is badass
oh u

So that's basically it.

HF = submit to Anti-Life
UBW = keep on fighting

Nasu: The main theme is "conquering oneself." There are three story lines in Fate, each has a different themes. The first one is the "oneself as an ideal." The second one is "struggling with oneself as an ideal." The third one is "the friction with real and ideal."

This game is describing the growth of the main character Emiya Shirou. The first storyline shows his slanted mind, the next storyline shows his resolve, and the last storyline gives another resolution for him as a human. All three storylines are essentially equal, but they have different forms.

>>1813756
I just can't take HF Shirou seriously. Shirou's UBW fights against Archer and Gilgamesh are fucking epic, but his HF against Dark Berserker is just too easy.

>>1813790
>epic

>>1813780
And Fate is...?

>>1813790
epic fucking duels and GAR

>>1813794
Fate is shit, everyone agreed.

>>1813799
It's better than UBW. (inb4 0/10)

>>1813799
Japan disagreed.

>>1813790
The fight against Archer was epic gar.

Fate = Shit
UBW = Badass Shirou route, DO YOU HAVE ENOUGH SWORDS?
HF = Badass Shirou route 2, holy shit Kotomine, ILYAAAAAAAA!

ITT: It's like I'm really listening to shounenfags!

>>1813808
Since when do we care about japan, they like to-love-ru ffs.

>>1813819
>FSN
>shounenfags

You've got to be shitting me.

>>1813838
Hey, I just call it like it is.

I'm 26 years old, but if that is being an adult then I'm never going to grow up. HF is the worst route.

>>1813853
You're also on 4chan, so I don't think you're the best example of judgment.

>>1813890
No, it's true. "Being an adult" is why the world is so shit. Growing up is all about accepting stupidity and failure, just like Shirou in HF. We need more idealism.

>>1813853
Let's not become adults together.
Since we're on /jp/ we already have a headstart !

>>1813906
He abandoned his ideal. That's the biggest failure possible.

>>1813900
It's a good thing Shirou didn't exactly fail in HF, huh?

>>1813906
He fails at his ideals.

>>1813907
>>1813908
So have you found a reason to fight yet, buddy?

>>1813907
Not really, he decided there were things more important than an ideal that could never be reached.

>>1813907

No

in b4 peter pan

>>1813909
That's simple because his ideal proved to be too heavy to him and he found out he wasn't able to support it.
Partly because he became involved with that woman.
It's not that it's more important, it's that he chose to follow something which he knew was easier than his ideal.
He chose ease over sacrifice.

>>1813922
He sacrificed his ideal for that woman

>>1813910
"Saving the world" is too vague an ideal to fight for, and my abilities are too weak anyway. Therefore my ideal is "improving myself".

And so I kill her along with those memories.
I search through my mind and throw them away to where I can't find them again,
They'll never return.
I'll never recall her now.

Such a thing will never be forgiven.

>>1813926
And that's exactly why his action can be seen as so bad.
An ideal is an intemporal thing, it's unconditional, that's what makes an ideal so beautiful, however pointless it may be.
To abandon such a thing for something as low as love or compassion is ridiculous.

>>1813922
He didn't even make a careful, rational decision. It was feminine style "thought", which is not thought at all, but following your emotion. This only compounds the failure.

>>1813939
Yeah, well, that's just like, your opinion, man.

>>1813922
His ideal was unrealistic and would never be accomplished, ever. That's Archer's route. He gets to die alone, unsatisfied, and a virgin. Sacrificing yourself for nothing isn't noble, it's retarded.

>>1813942
It is, and that's why I stated that it can be "Seen" as such, if you place love so highly, then I guess it's pleasing.

>>1813941
kotomine get off my /jp/ you arn't even a person

>>1813950
Ideals are ideals, most of them never get realised, the goal to to pursue them, it's an asymptotic behaviour.
And it wasn't sacrificing oneself for nothing, even if it didn't turn out as expected, by his actions, Shirou saved thousands of lives, in exchange for a few.

>>1813950
>>and a virgin
I think not.

HF Shirou grew up and stopped trying to be his father.

His ideal wasn't even his from the start, he wanted to grow up and be like daddy dearest.

HF Shirou found what made him happy and pursued it. He became a person.

>>1813950

You can do the impossible if you're awesome enough.

>>1813950
Actually, Fate's Archer route. Shirou suffers horribly thorough his life, and only finds peace at death.

And, mind you, he doesn't die a virgin.

>>1813955
Amusingly enough, Kotomine doesn't have an ideal in a sense comparable to Shirou's, he's just searching for pleasure, and that's relatively new, as it comes from meeting Gil.
He wouldn't encourage Shirou in his ideal for the beauty of it, but in the hope of seeing Shirou act against his ideal, becoming miserable.

>>1813955
Despite being "evil", I have far more respect for Kotomine in HF than Shirou. It's the same as how I can respect religious fundamentalists but not moderates. Even a bad ideal is better than no ideal at all.

>>1813969
It became Shirou's ideal as soon as he accepted it. It makes no difference who else might have followed the same ideal.

I liked Fate. It was a good story with a bittersweet ending.

I loved Unlimited Blade Works. It showcased Shirou's abilities at his best. He murders two servants and pisses off Tohsaka via rape.

Heaven's Feel was too awkward for me. The focus shifted to the Matou household so much that the whole rest of the cast got left behind. Servants were getting blown away like leaves in the wind because there wasn't room in HF for them. Shirou stopped being badass like he was in UBW. No, I don't care that he gave up his hero ideal for Sakura. What I had a problem with was how he handled fights. He basically didn't. After all that shit in UBW, I was expecting him to kick the shit out of fuckers even better, and instead he writhes with his transplant arm like a baby. He can't do anything, and even in the fight with Kotomine at the end he's basically doing nothing but getting beat up.

And the Matou house bothers me. Their presence is too strong in HF to explain their absence in Fate and UBW. Where the fuck were they then?

>>1813977
Fate isn't Archer route.

>>1813985
Shirou goes on to get Kaede after Fate.

I agreed, don't bother me about it.

shirou could possibly become archer in fate or UBW

So much Anti-Spiraling in this thread.

>>1813985
see
>>1813994

>>1813990
who?

>>1813950
>His ideal was unrealistic and would never be accomplished, ever.
That's not the point though. It's better to try to save everyone, to save as many people as you can, than it is to simply say "fuck it, I won't be able to save everyone so I won't save anyone." If you have an ideal that is unattainable you will always be able to improve yourself, whereas if you have an easy ideal once you achieve it you will no longer have to grow. That is why it's ok to have an unrealistic ideal.

>>1813994
But Archer pretty much tells Rin to not let Shirou fuck up in UBW.

Mind of Steel should've had it's own route

>>1813998
Neither of them are "Archer route".

>>1813998
No, Archer's route isn't in FSN.

Archer isn't any route with Archer.
Archer came from a route before them.

>>1814002
Some Anon said on here said that that was where Ilya Route was supposed to break off from.

>>1814008
Ilya hates Kiritsugu and she is pissed at Shirou when he decides to go mind of steel.

>>1814008
Might've been the True beginning of Archer route, with Ilya dying after a year.

>>1814008
This, he gets involved with Ilya, she dies, Shirou goes on to die a virgin. This is the most likely scenario.

>>1814002
I totally agree. I wanted to burn nasu for not doing that.

>>1813994
I don't think Shirou would become Archer after realizing how shitty Archer has it and finding out that he would be forced to go against his ideal if he became a counter guardian.

I need 'decisive evidence' as to why Fate can't be Archer's route.

>>1814025
he doesn't realize how bad archer has it in Fate.

>"Shirou's a slut; I wish he was pure, like me."

This is what HF haters actually believe.

>>1814025
Well, Shirou might not become Archer after UBW but he most certainly keeps his ideals, after having fought for an hour against Archer.
So he might still do so unintentionally.

>>1814029

>>1813979

>HF: as a bitter adult who gives up the ideal because of his inadequacy and compromises with reality.
>Mind of Steel: as an hard-boiled adult who isn't afraid of his own dreams, knows what must be done and doesn't whine doing it.

>>1814042

He submits to Tohsaka in UBW. The future looks bright for those two, particularly in True End.

>>1814025
Fate Shirou would. Remember: Archer became a CC in order to save a couple thousand people. Shirou, with his kid's naivety will think that he can 'change the future' and commit the same mistakes. In the end, he will also become a CC and suffer just like Archer did.
Of course, once his called to join the Grail war, he'll forget everything about it.

>>1813979 And the Matou house bothers me. Their presence is too strong in HF to explain their absence in Fate and UBW. Where the fuck were they then?

Zouken met Shirou and decided to play his hand.

>>1814050
But Shirou chose Sakura because it's what he really wanted. He didn't honestly want to value others over her, he only did that because he thought it was "right" to do so, which wasn't even his true belief. It was just borrowed from Kiritsugi.

>>1814059

I'm supposed to believe Zouken had the Holy Grail sitting in front of him, with Sakura, the adopted daughter he'd been torture-raping for her entire life in preparation for the Holy Grail War, available and with her own servant to use, just decided to let Shinji dick around in Fate and UBW and do nothing else?

Zouken and the whole Matou household felt like a huge afterthought that was tacked on to F/SN to make Heaven's Feel. There's no sign of Zouken beforehand and it's not like his motivation to join the conflict isn't present until HF, and he has the same means at his disposal.

It just doesn't make any sense.

Saber, Archer and Kiritsugu all have one thing in common. They all died miserably and alone because that is the price of their ideals. Even in UBW Shirou will be left with nothing in the end if he follows the ideal to his death.

He might be fine with his end, Archer was, but if he becomes a CG he will become disillusioned by his experience as a cleaner.

>>1814047
I forgot to mention that I was talking about UBW Shirou, although it was implied since I was talking about him knowing the truth about Archer, which doesn't happen in Fate.

>>1814042
But like I said because of Archer he knows that he will have to betray his ideals if he becomes a counter guardian, which should keep him from making that decision.

>>1814117
Kiritsugu died with Shirou by his side.
Though it can be argued that the loss of Irisviel and the impossibility of seeing Ilya killed him, too.

>>1814117
I wish to become the CG

Because then I'd be 2d

>>1814091
if you paid attention, you'll realize that zouken didn't think it was the right time to implement his plan, but then he met shirou and saw that he had a very good chance of winning this current war. if he hadn't met shirou, Fate and UBW would be where things would've gone.

>>1814131
No, your motivation must be to have an awesome soundtrack play everytime you do something great.

>>1814091
Shirou's love interest in Sakura was the necessary ingredient to set all the events in Heaven's Feel into motion.

It's just your fault for being dumb.

>>1814144
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_skhTIY_Ik&fmt=18

>>1814148
SO, Shirou just wakes up someday and decides that he loves Sakura, while not doing anything that he doesn't do in the 2 other routes.
It's like a coin toss ?

>>1814154
At the beginning of the game, before the routes branch off, he talks about how he is starting to see Sakura as a woman. It's pretty clear that he always had feelings for her.

>>1814154
Uh, Sakura is the one he's most familiar with, being the friend he spent the most time with in the past few years, and he's always stated she was becoming beautiful even in the other routes. And it's you as the player who is choosing to spend more time with Sakura.

>>1814154
see
>>1814135

>>1814179
It's not like spending three more days with her that'll do anything for me to realise I love her.
I've been seeing her everyday for 2 years, why suddenly now ?

>>1814186
Fine. YOU play through 2 years of cooking scenes with Sakura. The trade off is Shirou admits his love for her earlier.

>>1814186
Because you realize you love Saber or Rin more in the other routes.

>>1814189
First of all, permanently cooking with someone would annoy me to no end, I can't really stand having people in my way when I cook.

>>1814206

Yeah, it must be a real pain in the ass to have someone blocking your way to the microwave door.

>>1814179
No, Taiga is the one he's most familiar with. So why doesn't she have a route?

>>1814240
Shirou thinks of Taiga as his mom.

>>1814240
She's the comic relief character. It would be like giving Neko Arc a route.

>>1814242

And she definitely treats him like a son.

It was never meant to be. ;-;

>>1814246

You say it like there'd be something wrong with that.

>>1814242

Which is precisely why he calls her "Fuji-nee".

>>1814186

You've never fallen in love with someone, have you?

>>1814268

Virgin spotted.

there's already a MILF routo

Let's not hate Anikis, we're all virgins here.

>>1814246
Cat Scratch Fever route.

Also:

Fate: I want to save everyone, everywhere, and hope to become an impossible superhero. This dream only exists for the duration, and will be shattered later, but maybe some people will be saved.

UBW: I realize I can only save the people I can reach and accept that, thereby becoming a hero in truth as well as action. I will master and live the contradiction, even if the future holds pain and betrayal.

HF: I abandon my core self and become willing to sacrifice others to save the one I love. With luck, the only one that will need to be sacrificed is me.

Unlimited Blade Works is Shirou at his best.

>>1814275

Yes I am but what does that have to do with anything

This is the first thread about Fate I've seen that isn't nauseating wapanese fanboyism or anti-typemoon trolling. This is the best Christmas gift ever ;_;

>>1814286
>>1813705
I like all the routes, all the Shirous, all the battles, all the love interests, and all the antagonists.

Equally.

>>1814293
You are the problem.

>>1814293
This isn't even near being the best F/SN thread that we've had on /jp/. You should have been here for when UBW translation was released.

>>1814289

Most people don't fall in love only after knowing someone for 2 years.

That's called settling.

>>1814301
Couldn't have been that good. Mirrormoon is trash.

>>1814296
This isn't how things work.

>>1814300
cheer up, it's christmas

>>1814304

Most people also don't fall in love in just a few days with someone they've never met before. It's a work of fiction; stop being such an arse.

>>1814322
Actually, this is pretty common, but it's a glandular kind of love.

Sometimes it does work out, though.

You're less likely to encounter people that have known each other for years and suddenly fell in love than you are to encounter people who met each other one day, were fucking that night, and then were married two days later.

>>1814322

>Most people also don't fall in love in just a few days with someone they've never met before.

This is why I just called you a virgin.

>>1814286 HF: I abandon my father's dream and become willing to find happiness for myself and my loved one. With luck, the only one that will need to be sacrificed is me.

>>1814328

Sorry, but feeling lust for someone does not equal love.

At any rate, it states in the VN that Shirou has had feelings for Sakura for quite some time but was supressing them. HF brought them to the forefront where he couldn't ignore them anymore.

>>1814338
It wasn't his father's dream, it was his. He thought it was borrowed, but it really became something nobler than Kiritsugu's. Kiritsugu hoped for a world without violence and sacrifice, so he became a machine that sacrificed the least number of other people needed to create a passable resolution for the largest number of others.

He was a hero that sacrificed others to fuel his miracles.

Shirou became a machine like Kiritsugu, but one that refused to sacrifice others to make a resolution. He wouldn't willingly partake in that sort of bartering. Instead, he sacrificed himself to attempt to create the best resolution possible with the power he could muster, knowing that he would fail at perfection, but hoping that his efforts would work.

Kiritsugu and, to a lesser extent Archer, were machines that cared about the result instead of the process. Shirou in UBW cared about the result, but refused to go down the path of abandoning the process.

His dream was something better than Kiritsugu's, even if doomed to the same contradictions.

>>1814300
You couldn't be more wrong, but maybe this thread is the problem.

>>1814346
Romantic love is largely illusory. In your teens, it's peer pressure that defines relationships. In your 20s, it's hormones and pleasure that define your relationships. In your 30s, it's future interests and reproduction that define your relationships. In your 40s and onwards, it's security and settling that define your relationships.

Romantic love is just a gap filler for most people. It's more about the game, manners, and expectations.

If you're one of those people that could truly care for another human being because you appreciate who they are and what constitutes their existence, without fooling yourself by saying you do but are really intent on controlling them or instituting other creepy non-standard relationship paradigms, then I salute you.

Most people, however, are looking out for number one, bowing to society's expectations, and going with the flow.

>>1814390
Change your name and I might be able to take any of the ludicrous shit you are spouting seriously.

>>1814399

Just what's ludicrous about it? Are you really saying you think the majority of women in this world care about romantic love? Or even if they say they do, will ever really act on it?

If so, then I suggest you stop approaching relationships with such a naive view of them, lest you be horribly wounded by the wrong kind of woman.

>blade_works_expert (has created over a 1000 blades, last created: Dragnipur)

Decent thread successfully ruined.

>>1814268
I have, but decided it was stupid and decided not to love because I had more important things to do and couldn't be bothered to waste my time and brain cycles on this.
>>1814232
Hey, I cook real food !
Just made myself a nice christmas eve dinner that I'll be enjoying alone, and it's made of steak ,eggs and wheat, it was nice ;_;

>>1814424
>>1814399
Samefag.

>>1814399

Yet, his spouting gives good perspective.

>>1814399

It's a good parody of post content grader. I kinda like it.

>>1814437
I dunno, he's pretty right imo.

HF - Why sacrifice one life instead of hundreds when I can do the opposite?

>>1814448
Well, that is... um...

Accurate.

>>1814418
>>Are you really saying you think the majority of women in this world care about romantic love?
hahah jesus christ you're an undeniable fucktard

>>1814465
Femanon spotted.

>>1814465
Women aren't about romance, I spent much time observing them, listening their discussion, reading what they sent to people, they like sex, having a comfortable life and somewhat bragging about their boyfriend.
You could be the nicest guy on earth, you need two of those to be interesting.
Be it money+ sex
money+ cool ( as in shit was so cash kinda cool)
cool+ sex

>>1814486

Exactly. "Nice guys finish last" for a reason.

>>1814473
Oh, is that so?
Poor trollan, rather.

>>1814465

Sorry Anon, but he is right. Women may be interested in romantic love, but it is very much a secondary concern when it comes to choosing a partner. Same goes for men. Shit sucks, but thats the world we were born into. Thats one of the reasons we spend so much time playing VNs, is it not? To experience these ephemeral qualities that supposedly embody humanity?

>>1814531
Might as well say playing VN is a way to recreate the ideal society which we find is impossible in reality.

>>1814531
I play visual novels because they present concepts which are foreign to standard, daily life.

>>1814553

I play them because I'm fucking ronery.

>>1814553

Which ties in nicely to your 'love is a lie' statement.

のヮの

>>1814542
Obviously. Just look at wanko to kurasou.

>>1814559
"Love as a basis of relationships" is a lie. Love isn't a lie, just, as someone said, secondary.

I need to find this voice patch.....

>>1814568
>>>/rs/fate+voices

>>1814562
Not only wanko, I want to live in a world where a guy in a golden armor calls me a mongrel while beating me up.
That's just awesome.

Ah, the irony of browsing /jp/!
This thread going on simultaneously with
>>1814567

>>1814601
No irony here

>>1814486
>Women aren't about romance, I spent much time observing them, listening their discussion, reading what they sent to people
And you haven't talked to anyone? Man, you sure are an expert.