/jp/ - Otaku Culture

>>18113967
>Reimu work hard and actually make a profit
>Sanae praises her
>She goes all smug and stops working
For fuvk sake, last page suggest the shrine has will and wants to be poor.

>>18114039
>inb4 The god of the Hakurei Shrine turns out to be a god of poverty.

>>18113967
I find it funny how easy it is WaHH Reimu to be agitated and affected by her emotions. Sanae has some nice smug in this chapter. Aunn is cute as always.

>>18113967
I like the way Sanae stimulates Reimu to actually do something (does better than kasen by the way)

Good Azuma Aya, you're looking kind of Hirasaka

STARTING?

NOW??

I'm really happy Aunn seems to have become a new main character.

>>18113967
I'm almost mad at how much of a jerk Sanae is in the chapter. But no fear, of course Reimu had to one-up her in that department right from the start.

So much for miko friendship, I guess. Kinda sad.

>>18113967
Oh Sanae is so cute. She is not a slut as fandom always scream everyday.

>>18114350
That just seems to be a Touhou thing, I find. Everybody is a jerk one way or another. The only true nice girl that I've seen in Touhou is probably Aunn.

>>18114039

>>18114390
How about you shut it and stop complaining before people start screaming in this tread.

Lovable moron.

Nice legs.

>>18114390
>She is not a slut as fandom always scream everyday
You do realize that was never the case in canon, right? Play the game and/or read the print work instead of spouting stuff like that.

>>18114436
I don't know where to start. I'm very bad at bullethell and there is so much manga.

>>18114393
Aunn is just a bit shady/duplicitous. Kogasa is the true blue nice 'hu.

>>18114465
Aunn just generally supports Reimu and wants to help.

>>18114469
>generally
*genuinely

Aunn's one of the few people in Touhou who unconditionally wants Reimu to succeed and looks up to her, it's refreshing.

I'm kind of disappointed by the ending to this chapter. I think Reimu resolving to work harder in response to the Moriya's success would be a good character moment for her, even in a series where things progress very slowly.

>>18114457
You literaly start with the games anon. Even if it is easy mode.

>>18114457
>I'm very bad at bullethell
Practice (repeated ad infinitum).
People who 1cc'd the game on Lunatic doesn't become that way in a day or two. Recognize the pattern, learn to graze, start on Easy even.

>there is so much manga
Check pic.

>>18114480
>I think Reimu resolving to work harder in response to the Moriya's success would be a good character moment for her
The implication here is not just that everything returns to status quo, but that there could be a reason why this is the case that isn't just Reimu being lazy.

>>18114393
What about kogasa?

>>18114110
Funny you mentioned that. >>18114200

>>18114581
>>18114559
I just can't play bullethell. I enjoy shmups like Gradius, Thunder Force and Kiki Kaikai but somehow i can't get in to bullethell.

That picture is vety helpful, thank you very much.

>>18114593
I'd like to think that Kogasa's "nice-ness" is her being ineffectual at being a scary youkai. After all, all she really wants to surprise someone, nevermind that the surprised person could get a heart attack or stumble towards hazards. Though as you can tell, this does not happen. She's just too cute to be scary.

>>18114745
Also, feel free to correct me if Kogasa has ever successfully surprised someone. It's been a while since I've looked at Touhou lore.

>>18114393
To be fair, Sanae *did* help Reimu before. She looked after the shrine when Kasen kidnapped Reimu for training. She made Reimu and Marisa grilled corn as antidote to raiju's poison. And she helped Reimu with the keseran-pasaran.

Hell, I'd propably make fun of someone that ungrateful if they kept lazing around instead of making a living. Sanae seemed genuinely impressed when Reimu got her shit together.

So the Shrine itself wants to be poor and emits an aura right? Kasen is usually level-headed and 9/10 of her plans work, yet >>18114284 states that pretty much anyone involved in trying to raise the Shrine out of poverty gets dumb with Kasen realizing how dumb they acted. There was also that incident a few chapters back where some spirit/god was causing hunger and turning back people going to the Shrine festival.

>>18114116
Somehow WaHH Reimu is my favorite even though she's pretty much the worst Reimu...
This was a really neat chapter. Easy to follow and we learned something substantial in the end, nicely summarized by >>18115197.
Whether or not this is related to Shion is still an open question.

>>18114390
This had better be bait.

>>18114760
She spooked some people in the Myouren graveyard before Yoshika kicked her out.

Sanae's added a big bow tie to her getup. Is it a scarf? And god damn was she great in this chapter.

This was a great chapter even if it was the most generically WaHH chapter ever. Maybe that's why it's great

>>18115701
all its missing is an inexplicable cameo from someone in the cast

>>18115809
Nazrin is in a panel!

Why does Kasen hide her name? I remember in the first chapter she introduced herself as Ibara and not Ibaraki

>>18115975
She's not an Oni.

>>18114421
I want Reimu to step on me with those shoes!

>>18115992
Like this, anon?

>>18115612
It is how you wish to interpet it.
He's pretty much asking for an argument at this point.

>>18114421
Will the new poorhu live at the shrine now?

>>18115986
Either way, Kasen is cute. But I'd rather her be an Oni since they're pretty scarce.
We have a Youkai, and a Youkai God, so what else?

>>18116192
This is just plain lewd. 2hu has become too sexualized! First we had Hirasaka drawing the fairies running around and playing barefoot with panels of just their cute exposed feet and now this. Is ZUN no longer satisfied with containing his fetishes to the games and is now forcing it upon the poor mangaka?!

>>18116204
She's probably been squatting there ever since Mima walked out!

>>18114745
She wants to fulfill a purpose. As a youkai, that means scaring people, but as she's actually a tsukumogami she just wants to be useful to people (so she does many things other than failed spooks, like babysitting and blacksmithing)

>>18113967
SHRINE MAIDEN OF POVERTY

>>18116439
Damn ZUN and his perverted plinth fetish.

>The Shrine rejecting profit and want to stay broke
>God of Poverty is revealed now in AoCF

Hmmm....

>>18114390
She is a generic mary sue piece of shit that brainwashed /jp/ into liking her, so people make up negative traits so she's not as boring anymore

>>18117188
god damn i really do hate jews now. Guess i'm one of his chosen now

>>18115458
Hirasaka's Reimu is probably my favourite to be honest for how intimidating she is even though she doesn't do anything but sit on the veranda drinking tea all the time.

>>18113967
What is it with ZUN changing Reimu every chapter? A few chapters ago she didn't give a shit that Sanae was succesful and was in fact taking advantage of it by selling stuff at a stall on the path there. In this chapter when she thinks of the exact same thing suddenly she considers it unfathomable?

And prior to that in FS there was her saying that tengu don't lie only for her to think that tengu aren't to be trusted some chapters later.

>>18114465
Except Kogasa sold out her fellow youkai by making weapons to exterminate them and trying to make a profit out of it.

>>18118161
Kogasa is a tsukumogami! She betrayed no one!

>>18114390
Sanae was a lot more likable back then when she seemed like she had flaws, now she's a boring no-flaw goddess that cares about others when back then she was completely ok with fooling the public with hisoutensoku if it meant getting their money.

>>18115458

>>18118167
That excuse doesn't work considering prior to that she was being the opposite of useful to humans by trying to scare them as well as attack them. She's a flip flopper.

>>18118174
>>18115458
I want WaHH Reimu to be my daughter, but I was FS Reimu to be my girlfriend.

>>18114480
>I'm kind of disappointed by the ending to this chapter.
Seriously? You didn't get that it's meant to show that there's something else causing the shrine's misfortune? Hence why Kasen becomes stupid?

And there just so happens to be 2 goddesses of financial misfortune revealed in the newest game.

>>18118174
even artists noticed huh.

>>18114350
>So much for miko friendship, I guess.
You're taking this too seriously. Another WaHH chapter has them drinking together and Reimu even apologizes to her for being pushy with alcohol.

>>18118174
FS Reimu is the best Reimu for the job, but I find CoLA Reimu to be the friendliest and nicest Reimu without being goofy like WaHH Reimu.

"Wild and Horned Hermit" sounds like a porno, is there no doujin called "wild and horny hermit" yet?

>>18115975
Because she thinks she's being clever

When WaHH ends and Kasen is trying to "confess her secret", I want Reimu to just say "by the way we all know you're an oni".

>>18118168
>she is a boring no-flaw goddess
What a solid reason to hate her.

the newhus can't be the hakurei shrine's goddesses because they have a corporeal form, not only that but Byakuren confirmed that the actual god of the shrine is still there, incorporeal and angry.

so I don't think it's the god's will for the shrine to be angry and instead is a third party causing it.

>>18118313
Never heard of the term mary sue? Characters without flaws are not interesting.

>>18118315
> for the shrine to be angry
*to be poor

>>18118313
Pretty much the same reason people hate Rey from Star Wars.

>>18118315
So someone used Shion Poorfag as a proxy for the Shrine's current state?

>>18118315
>Byakuren confirmed

>>18118437
yes?

>>18118327
Sanny is not that perfect anyway. I'm reading chapter 38 right now and in most of time, she is just act like a usual school girl, sometime childish, airhead etc.

>>18118327
Sanae is a ditzy nerd that immediately get her ass kicked by Reimu once she as got into Gensokyo. Nice Mary Sue you got there man.

>>18118327
Sanae is a ditzy nerd that immediately get her ass kicked by Reimu once as she got into Gensokyo. Nice Mary Sue you got there man.

>>18118506
>>18118659
That's why I said she used to be likable because she had flaws, geniuses, learn to read.

>>18118675
I can see what you're getting at. Sanae's attitude in this chapter came off as very condescending, and at the end of the chapter her praise toward Reimu made her quit acting productive just like that. Now I don't think that's enough to call Sanae a Mary Sue, but she could've been better here.
At least I got my share of cute Sanae panels and I did find her smugness entertaining.

>>18118675
She is still likable at all.

>>18118360
I think it's both sisters.

>>18118145
ZUN is a secondary.

>>18118145
She was selling her own charms at the ropeway a few chapters back. Sanae wanted her to work for Moriya in this chapter.

>>18118675
Had? Don't be dumb, Sanae still has flaws, mostly the same ones she's always had.

AUNN~

As if there wasn't further proof WaHH makes for the cutest Touhou fashion.

>>18114039
why is such blatant spoiling of the story allowed?
wth

>>18120443
The hell do you mean, "spoiling"? Who in their right mind would go into a thread to discuss a chapter before reading said chapter?

>>18114039
>>18114136
>>18114587
>>18115197
We're already 15 years into the current Touhou canon, and the Hakurei shrine being poor has been one of the primary running gags for all this time. Likewise, Reimu being lazy is an integral part of her character by now. Permanently changing one of these constants after all this time, in just a few panels, would be really strange.

>>18120263
Aunn is one of the few shining lights in my miserable life.

>>18121499
Not only that, the thing about Reimu is that she IS constant and IS static. Her title of "Eternal Shrine Maiden of Paradise" refers to a lot of things, and one of them is her consistency of character. Not necessarily exactly between portrayals (due to every portrayal being another character's viewpoint of her), but just how she's set in her ways and will not change. She has always liked drinking tea and sweeping, kicking youkai ass, watching cherry blossoms fall, and drinking. She comes up with bad schemes, she's lazy, and she's strong. That's Reimu, forever and ever.

>>18114333
How is Aunn so goddamn prefect? Such perfection should be a crime!

>>18118161
Only Reimu can and will slap a shit with or without needles, so it don't matter.

>>18118168
Sanae is a literal living God though.

>>18121499
character development after all this time would be really strange

>>18121866
People complain about no character development, but now we know Aunn is the smartest person in the room.

>>18121730
>Her title of "Eternal Shrine Maiden of Paradise" refers to a lot of things
Surprisingly true in more ways than just in the canon.

>>18115458
Choose your Reimu.

>>18124077
SSiB

>>18124077
>>18124210
SSiB, it's by far the most heterosexual Reimu to date.

>>18124987
That explains why SSiB is so shit

>>18124077
WaHH will always be my favorite.
Cute dork.

>>18125057
delete this

>>18121730
>due to every portrayal being another character's viewpoint of her
not this meme again.

>>18126042
oh no, truth

>>18124987
Funny you should say that considering the SSiB artist draws the gayest Reimu of all the artists ZUN has hired.

>>18121158
fuck off sperg. Maybe reddit is a better place for you. People who spoil are scum.

>>18126047
It's a bullshit theory debunked by simply looking at the games, there's no "character viewpoint" excuse to claim there and yet Reimu changes constantly, compare Reimu in EoSD where's she's super cool-headed and plays along with Remilia's charade (even does a cheesy one liner with her right before the battle begins) to SA Reimu where she's always angry and doesn't play along with Okuu's charade in her Reimu C route, and it only gets worse in the following games.

>>18126070
The observation, not theory, is based off the manga where her portrayals are often notably different in key ways. In the games she's fairly consistent: driven, smug, fed up. I played through the whole series again a few months ago and didn't notice anything particularly different about Reimu from game to game. You can say there is but I don't really see it.

1) see youkai
2) beat up youkai
3) proceed

>>18121921
Why wouldn't it matter? Of course it does, whether she needs it or not she's deliberately helping the enemy by giving her weapons and selling out the youkai, and it's not like she's doing it out of kindness either.

>>18126070
oh I'll say this about SA: you weren't paying attention, she's angry/annoyed because this doesn't feel like an incident to her, it's just some youkai taking away her time from the recently discovered hot springs

>>18126080
>The observation, not theory, is based off the manga
Why did you ignore the part where I mentioned the games?
> In the games she's fairly consistent:
You did not read my post at ALL, did you? I just proved the opposite by showing her doing a complete 180 in attitude between games.
>1) see youkai
>2) beat up youkai
>3) proceed
Oh I guess if she still does this one thing I guess nothing else matters! Sound logic. I can do that too

EoSD:
1)See chance to have fun
2)Have fun with youkai by playing along with their little pretend game

SA:
1)See chance to have fun.
2)Tell the youkai to fuck off and to treat this seriously.
>>18126087
Please, she already knew she was solving an incident by the time that happened since Okuu just finished telling her that she was going to burn up the surface, and even if it wasn't the case, EoSD Reimu would have played it a lot cooler and less angry and childish.

What about the later games where Reimu's even angrier and less cool-headed, are none of those incidents to her too? Hell UFO Reimu straight up made people dislike her around her big time. That's how big of a change it was.

>>18126121
>around her big time.
*around here

>>18126121
>EoSD Reimu would have played it a lot cooler and less angry and childish.
What makes you say that given the context that in EoSD Remilia and Reimu both knew what was going on and they were ACTUALLY playing? Remilia forced Reimu to create the spell card rules and this was the first incident started using them. Everyone was on the same page. Meanwhile in SA she was relaxing and then Yukari made her go into hell where a crazy raven said she was going to destroy the earth. She was irritated the entire time (see: her interaction with Satori) and that was the end of it.

Also Reimu is always angry when it comes to youkai no matter what (so long as it isn't play), so I don't know what you mean. She doesn't "like" them, assuming they're causing trouble.

And I did read your post I just don't agree with it. What you said, I don't think is true. Not much else to say about it other than "I disagree". I think she's pretty consistent, you think she isn't.

>>18126149
>What makes you say that given the context that in EoSD Remilia and Reimu both knew what was going on and they were ACTUALLY playing? Remilia forced Reimu to create the spell card rules and this was the first incident started using them. Everyone was on the same page.
What a complete non-argument. What does that have to do with Reimu somehow being 180 degrees of difference compared to post-MoF appearances? It's not like she only acts this way towards Remilia, it's everyone in the game. Was she "in the same page" with everyone else too even if she had never met them before?

If this was post-MoF Reimu she'd be telling them all to eat shit and die and just act in the most barbaric, unfun way possible.

>Meanwhile in SA she was relaxing and then Yukari made her go into hell where a crazy raven said she was going to destroy the earth. She was irritated the entire time (see: her interaction with Satori) and that was the end of it.
She was irritated because she didn't think it was an incident at first. The moment I'm talking about is after she realizes it is indeed an incident.

Also, Reimu acts that way if not worse in the games that came after SA where she seemingly starts acting younger and younger each time, what's your excuse for those? Again, UFO Reimu A was so bad it made /jp/ dislike her for a long time.

>>18126207
>What a complete non-argument.
Okay? If you're going to be like that, why should I even bother trying to discuss with you?

>>18126217
Sounds to me like you can't find a counter-argument anymore so you're looking for excuses to take the high ground and "leave", it's not like the fluff of "they're both in the same page" you tried to claim as an argument didn't prove that already.

Not to mention I did treat it as an actual argument afterwards just to humour you by pointing out that she acts that way towards everyone in the game, not just Remilia, where's your counter-argument for that?

>>18126228
No, I really have no interest in trying to argue with a stubborn dude who looks at someone giving evidence for an argument and says it doesn't count. Fuck that, I've seen where this goes, and it goes nowhere. You're just being an ass.

>>18126239
Case in point. Thanks for proving my post.
>evidence
Your conjecture is not evidence, you stated that Remilia caused Reimu to create the spellcard rules, which is true, but that has nothing to do with Reimu acting the way she did in EoSD, not just towards Remilia but everyone in the game.

>>18126258
>Case in point. Thanks for proving my post.
Okay.

Same character written for over 20 years by the same guy.
Things are bound to change and be inconsistant

>>18126315
How can FS Reimu be Kosuzu's image of her if Kosuzu thinks that Reimu would never side with youkai and is always fighting them coolly? Meanwhile Reimu is actually butt buddies with some of them, happily drinks tea with them, offenders only get some danmaku up the ass instead of any real wounds and the only time she gets serious is when someone breaks the rules like the fortune teller and the youkai spirit who killed and posessed the rich villager.

I just think that each manga has a different tone, the same way a cheery comedy tv show can suddenly have a sad episode, like that episode in Futurama about Fry's dog.

>>18126364
Oops, didn't mean to quote.

>>18124077
SSiB, definitely the coolest Reimu.

>>18118193

>>18126070
ZUN takes this shit less seriously than we do. He just writes what he thinks at the time Reimu should say. Any change in Reimu, or any other character, over the years is a change in the writer.

>>18126527
Litteraly this. Reimu is way less complex than some people think.

>>18126042
>>18126070
What are you talking about? Changes between Reimu's character being a result of them being written from other characters' viewpoints is not a "meme" or even a "theory". ZUN quite literally states this as fact in the first issue of SCoOW.

>I've never made anything from Reimu's point of view. The games are written in third person omniscient, so only she knows what she's really like. I don't know very well either. We have no idea what's going on in Reimu's head, so she changes depending on whose perspective we see her from. The Reimu that youkai see, the Reimu that fairies see, and the Reimu that humans see are all different. That's probably because she's in a bit of a different position from the protagonists of other works. Also, no matter what work she's in she never grows up at all. She might actually be pretty similar to a final boss. ...In "Urban Legend in Limbo" she finally overcomes that final boss side of herself and shows her true character (lol).

This is the explanation we get, that Reimu is portrayed slightly differently because her character changes based on who's perspective we're getting. We understand the basic core tenants of Reimu's character because she's the protagonist and in every series prominently, but she's not 100% consistent because these portrayals are written from someone else's perspective, and they all see Reimu differently. As people have stated, Reimu overall is a pretty consistent person, but there are nuances to her character that show when we get to see her from varying viewpoints.

You can't write this off as some fan theory with no basis in reality. It's obvious he's thought about this, and the differences in Reimu between WaHH, FS, and Fairies are intentional. The games were never really meant to be from anyone's viewpoint in particular. For the print works portrayal of Reimu, it is absolutely true.

If you want to write this off as ZUN trying to bullshit about inconsistencies in his own writing then fine, but then there's no discussion to be had if you just outright don't believe him. He has very simply stated that Reimu changing due to altering viewpoints is intentionally done and part of what he is trying to do with her character.

>>18127427
>She might actually be pretty similar to a final boss. ...In "Urban Legend in Limbo" she finally overcomes that final boss side of herself and shows her true character (lol).
I never really understood what ZUN meant by this. In what way is she similar to a final boss, exactly what does that imply, and how was it different in ULiL? The only thing I can think about is that it's probably the first time we saw her being worried for real in a game, and taking matters very seriously. There was no beating people up for fun, it was a race against the clock to prevent Sumireko from destroying the barrier and needlessly offing herself in the process:

>It's not beautiful at all!
>There's nothing worthwhile about a suicide bombing!
>I am the shrine maiden of paradise,
>Reimu Hakurei!
>I'll protect the Barrier, no matter what!
>And I'm not gonna let some human
>die stupidly right in front of me!

It might be unusually stern in tone for a game, but we already knew from Forbidden Scrollery that she takes her work of protecting Gensokyo very seriously when it actually matters, and that she's not a big fan of letting humans die when she can help it.

Anyway, before people here get any more upset over conjecture they don't agree with, I really recommend reading Reimu's article in SCoOW. It sums up the most important things we know about her quite well:
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Strange_Creators_of_Outer_World/Who%27s_Who_of_Humans_%26_Youkai_in_Gensokyo/Reimu_Hakurei

My own final thoughts about Reimu's personality:

She's not changing her lazy and greedy ways any time soon, those are integral parts of her personality by now, as I mentioned here >>18121499. People don't really change their fundamental personality traits much anymore once they've reached adulthood. However, unlike >>18121730 and >>18122072 I don't think she's completely static and devoid of development either.

For example, in the older games and print works, I feel like we saw Reimu being needlessly cruel towards weaklings a lot more. She practically assaulted and robbed Tokiko in CoLA, just so that she could pawn off the loot to Rinnosuke. In recent years, she has acted a lot more sympathetic towards Youkai, as long as they don't cause any major trouble. She even looked the other way in FS when the Kappa snuck through the Human Village at night, in order to get to the storehouse where they kept their equipment safe.

In 2017 alone, we have seen Reimu becoming a lot more honest with herself and her place in Gensokyo, especially in the last few chapters of FS. She finally even referred to Marisa and herself as a "special group" of humans who hang out with Youkai they've previously fought. Until now, Reimu has bullishly referred to herself as "The shrine maiden who exterminates Youkai on sight". Whenever someone pointed out that she's just converting them into her drinking buddies, she would go into full denial mode and get very upset. I really like pic related, I think it's a defining moment for Reimu.

If anything, I think we're beginning to see some kind of pessimism growing within Reimu that wasn't there before. Understanding more and more of the power balance of Gensokyo, she has begun to learn that she's maybe just another pawn in the hands of Youkai. Recent incidents that have gone unsolved, and the appearance of another hyper-powerful Youkai has not improved the situation. In the previous chapter of WaHH, Reimu didn't even feel like drinking anymore at the party after Okina showed up just to mock her.

>>18127866
>For example, in the older games and print works, I feel like we saw Reimu being needlessly cruel towards weaklings a lot more. She practically assaulted and robbed Tokiko in CoLA, just so that she could pawn off the loot to Rinnosuke. In recent years, she has acted a lot more sympathetic towards Youkai, as long as they don't cause any major trouble. She even looked the other way in FS when the Kappa snuck through the Human Village at night, in order to get to the storehouse where they kept their equipment safe.
>If anything, I think we're beginning to see some kind of pessimism growing within Reimu that wasn't there before. Understanding more and more of the power balance of Gensokyo, she has begun to learn that she's maybe just another pawn in the hands of Youkai.
The first chapter of CoLA was 14 years ago. Reimu was a kid back then. She's not anymore.

Marisa has also shown more responsibility and less kleptomania as time goes on. In SA she lied to hide how much she really cared, but more recently she's been openly standing up for the Human Village and shouting at Reimu for not taking things seriously.

>meta posting
Cmon anons, every Reimu is fine as long as she is cute

"My name is Reimu Hakurei and I say kill them all!"

>>18127920
She turns back on this notion at the very end of the chapter. I also find it weird how ZUN seemingly forgot that the youkai Reimu had captured had indeed done something bad in the previous chapter and is the whole reason Reimu was angry at her and captured her in the first place, yet towards the end it implied that the youkai had done nothing and that everyone somehow forgot what she had done.

>>18127427
Except nowhere does it state that Reimu is straight up written by ZUN differently based on perspective, rather, that all youkai see her differently. Hence this image: >>18126364

That's how Kosuzu (the protagonist) sees Reimu, and yet it is not the true FS Reimu. It completely contradicts your understanding of ZUN's statement. Another perspective of Reimu is given in OSP towards the end about how the fairies see her which also turns out to be incorrect as Reimu quickly points out to them. What she later does to them is incorrectly assumed to be friendliness, when it turns out to be Reimu manipulating the fairies with alcohol into doing duties for her as stated by Reimu herself (though the fairies did deserve that and a lot more due to their mischief all this time).

It's also an incomplete explanation since as stated, she changes in the games despite there not being a "perspective" excuse to claim.
>consistent person
Acting 180 degrees of difference between EoSD and post-MoF games is not consistency whatsoever. The only consistent thing between them stated is that she beats up youkai, wow, almost like it's her job or something, the part of her job that she's most dutiful of. Might as well claim that both Reimus breathe air. The personality in itself is extremely different and it's not just EoSD but especially SSiB too.

Basically in either case, whether your interpretation of ZUN's statement is correct or not, Reimu changes regardless of a protagonist's perspective of her, because even then ZUN's explanation doesn't explain the games.

>>18127904
Marisa's still a child.

>>18128559
>that all youkai see her differently
*everyone sees her differently.

>>18128565
I really hate how ZUN is making Marisa into this easily flustered girl, and it's not just here but in Forbidden Scrollery too when Reimu and Mamizou joke about her death and she goes nuts, she's supposed to stay cool and level-headed at all times, dammit. She's the boke, not the tsukkomi.

>>18128597
I think you're reading way too much into that reaction, it was a comedic situation.

>>18128559
Another anon here, you're tilting at windmills.

>Except nowhere does it state that Reimu is straight up written by ZUN differently based on perspective, rather, that everyone sees her differently.
Nobody stated that Reimu's **actual** personality changes depending on who's observing her. We're talking fictional characters here, not quantum mechanics. We'll probably never know much about Reimu's true thoughts and motivations unless ZUN decides to write something from her own perspective.

>It's also an incomplete explanation since as stated, she changes in the games despite there not being a "perspective" excuse to claim.
>Acting 180 degrees of difference between EoSD and post-MoF games is not consistency whatsoever.
>Basically in either case, whether your interpretation of ZUN's statement is correct or not, Reimu changes regardless of a protagonist's perspective of her, because even then ZUN's explanation doesn't explain the games.
Finally, we're getting to the heart of the matter. I (and I'm pretty sure it applies to the other anon too) simply don't agree with you. I never felt that there was this huge change or blatant inconsistency in Reimu's character, so it has never bothered me that much. We did make a point here >>18127866 and here >>18127904 though about how Reimu and Marisa are acting more grown-up these days. Many years have passed, after all. I read your explanation about how you felt she played along in EoSD, but ain't having it anymore since SA, but I've never felt that much of a personality inconsistency from that. Perhaps what we've seen is actual character development?

>>18131159
Impossible! My precious Reimu can't be getting old!

>>18127904
>but more recently she's been openly standing up for the Human Village and shouting at Reimu for not taking things seriously.
This one moment in WaHH I think is the most recent shining example of that change in aspect of Marisa's character over the years.

Marisa is silly and fun loving but she has always had her priorities right and will verbally slap Reimu's shit in to help her like any good friend.

>>18128597
She's been easily flustered for a long time. Unlike Reimu she's not very confident in herself and she instead works hard. She's always been a liar in more ways than one, and even a bit sad. Hell even waaaaaayyyyy back in IaMP you have Suika noting how unenergetic she is when she's alone with nobody else to play/talk with, along with other examples of "Marisa is actually not the badass she claims to be". I don't know a first example of her being startled, but back in SSiB at least there are several examples..

However you can say she's badass for throwing herself into dangerous situations with false confidence and trying her best always.

>>18128597
Bold but timid, anon. The words are wrong, but the implication isn't.

>>18134984
Didn't Komachi look at Marisa's spiritual energy in SWR and say she's a gloomy person who'll die alone?

>>18131159
>I think you're reading way too much into that reaction, it was a comedic situation.
But it's not just there, it's all the time, she's no longer cool and seems more like a moeblob, later on she's uncharacteristically flustered by Reimu's actions when she had never given a shit before whereas Kasen stays uncharacteristically quiet, it's like ZUN swapped out their dialogue. In FS it happens too. It doesn't matter that it's a comedic situation, there's no reason she shouldn't be the boke there if so.

>>18131159
> I never felt that there was this huge change or blatant inconsistency in Reimu's character, so it has never bothered me that much
Even artists noticed how much Reimu has changed >>18126452. You have the cheery moe girl of the PC-98 era, the super laidback Reimu of the early Windows era (including SSiB) and the modern, uptight, extremely irritable Reimu who has zero traits of who she used to be back then.

How exactly is that "character development", especially since it's completely unexplained? More like regression if anything. Imagine if Yuuka appeared all of a sudden and started acting like Utsuho.

>though about how Reimu and Marisa are acting more grown-up these days.
But if anything it's the opposite, as I pointed out, Reimu used to be a lot more laidback back then and now she's more childish than she's ever been before. Back then she had composure, she kept her cool, she wasn't always screaming like she does today and kept a calm personality most of the time like here >>18126392. Nowadays she's like a Cirno #2. The complete opposite.

Really, I think it's just like the other poster said: ZUN, a single man, cannot keep a single character consistent for so long, whether it's deliberate preferences for this new younger-acting, cuter Reimu or just foggy memory, or both. Hell it might be all part of his plan, after all, he revealed the other day in SoPM, through Miko's ability, that Reimu deep down wants all conflicts to be revealed peacefully and doesn't want people to fight anymore. That's a huge contrast of the usual violent shrine maiden everyone's used to.

I haven't even mentioned the most abrupt change in personality of all: The Reimu A ending in MoF where she explicitly says she wants to become friends with youkai, it's like if Hitler suddenly shut down his former plans and offered the jews a nice dinner party while telling them that he wants to befriend them.

I think her whole anti-youkai stance is a massive charade for the sake of her job.

>people complaining about Reimu being different over the years

wow, it's almost as if people grow up and change as time passes

>>18136532
Of course not, anon! It's OBVIOUSLY because ZUN's writing and his games have deteriorated since <writer's first 2hu game>!

I've come to realize that most of these arguments, happening back from the FS chapter threads, usually boils down to:

Touhou is a bit deep people vs. Touhou isn't that well written people

>>18113967
Good lord she's truly the best doggy.

>>18136025
I dunno about that but she definitely has the gloomy drizzle personality.

>>18124077
Choose your Crimson Slasher!

Of course, I choose the LoLK one

>>18118253
Everyone is their best incarnation in CoLA.

>>18139038
I want to kiss them all!

>>18124077
Crimson Slasher 4lyfe

>>18136374
It's almost like writers want their characters to behave different in different settings.

>I think her whole anti-youkai stance is a massive charade for the sake of her job.
See this pic >>18127866

>>18136198
She was never cool, you're just taking fan interpretations as canon.
Many of the early windows game translations took creative liberties with Marisa's dialogue, so maybe you might have got mixed up there.

>>18137157
And generally because the latter really aren't reading that well. Touhou isn't even "deep", but people just seem to love to read the works as though there's nothing more than the surface-level text.

>>18140466
>get out of the way, bitch
how do we kill meme subs and the people who are too stupid to realize that they are being fed liberal translations

>>18139283
>>18118253
I'm sorry have you forgotten that CoLA is where everyone is a bitch to Rinnosuke, as well as other atrocities like beating up Tokiko to steal her book? How exactly is CoLA the characters' nicest iteration?

>>18136532
But the thing is that she didn't grow up, the complete opposite happened, she's more childish than ever before. Also, ZUN himself stated in SCoOW that no matter what work she appears in, she has never grown up.
>>18139581
>It's almost like writers want their characters to behave different in different settings.
...How exactly is the setting of post-MoF games different from the ones prior that made Reimu change so much?
>See this pic >>18127866
I know about that, it's something that is pretty much irrelevant considering Reimu has and will continue to not follow that "role" in the future and also weird seeing how Yukari was adamant about making Reimu beat up innocent youkai in SA, while here she's suggesting that Reimu only needs to take care of those affecting humans. Even Reimu herself saw no reason to beat up Yamame and stopped in her tracks when Satori offered her tea.

>>18147407
I'm just the guy that replied, and I said they're the best incarnations, not the nicest.
Reimu does act much more chill than usual most of the time in it too, even though she's still just as much of a bitch as ever. But that's probably because we only see her loitering at Kourindou drinking and eating for free and looking at curiosities.

>>18147466
Utsuho is anything but innocent in SA, dude. Plus you gotta remember that vengeful spirits are one of the few things that can actually kill a youkai, so from Yukari's perspective that incident was a pretty big deal, even if it wasn't from Reimu's.