/jp/ - Otaku Culture

lol thats pretty funny man wtf is wrong with those crazy japs

>>17610633
That' sort of how it's always been with many cultures.

Old the best of the best will standout.

>>17610633
What is "the anime artstyle"? You mean like Astroboy or like Ghost in the Shell or like Lucky Star or what?

>>17610692
Hehe, yeah. I was mostly just talking about the artstyle in cases where it's supposed to represent idealised beauty (moeblobs, etc.), as opposed to grittier/more realistic depictions.

Anime sucks.

>>17610633

No. Old art is a consequence of them not knowing how to depict what they wanted accurately because they didn't understand the fundamentals.

Anime is a non-realistic, but fundamentally correct art style.

>>17611145
idk mang, why would you post that low quality bait in /jp/

>>17611179
>fundamentally correct art style
>oversized body proportions and eyes
>perfect visual appearance of your average person making them look far more appealing than irl
>even the supposedly horrible looking things rarely look horrid
It's not "correct", it's the idealisation of stuff i.e. what you'd want it to look like.

It'll be remembered as a curiosity while the last century of Western ""art"" will be happily thrown into the garbage.

>>17611340

Anime is not the result of attempting to draw reality but failing to do so because of technical error.

It is correct on a technical level, while the Bayeux tapestry is not.

>>17610633
>like today's opinion of pic related - "What the fuck were they thinking?"

Sure, if you only surround yourself with braindead mouthbreathing morons

>>17611641
Don't get me wrong, technically it's a fine drawing, but it's not what you'd consider "idealised female beauty" nowadays.

I'll have you know that in the late 1800's, Japanese art was held in high regards by many and quite a few famous western artists emulated Japanese art and woodprints, such as Vincent van Gogh.

The art movement was called Japonism, and you should look it up, you cretin.

>>17611678
Fine dark hair, pale skin, shoyu face.
Yeah, it's a traditional, idealised depiction of beauty even by today's standards. There's just the dyed black teeth I can imagine you don't think is beautiful, but to each their own. They had their reasons.

we reached perfection

today's otaku will be hailed as the disciples of god for spreading anime in the future

>>17610633
I think it's some kind of mental illness to dislike things because they're made to be overly cute and attractive looking in a hyperreal way

>>17611179
The obsession with 'realism' was the biggest mistake art ever experienced.

>>17611977
still better than modern ''art''

>>17611715
You shouldn't expect too much from people browsing this site.

>>17612131
>''art''
So how do you define art?

>>17612256
Things that aren't contemporary because the old times were better

>>17611715

Early 20th century lithographs were pretty aesthetic.

>>17610633
We will probably look at it the same way we look at things now, somewhat quirky, but ultimately nice.

It will be considered a high end form of art and part of the Japanese culture at the time. Let me expand on that.

Throughout History, Japan has always had an unique culture that somehow perfected the hegemonic culture of the whole world at that particular time. Take the Middle Ages, for example. The Middle Ages in Europe were a time of knights, of feudal lords, of kings, of wars between families. Likewise, the Japanese Middle Ages were a "better" version of that, with samurai, daimyo, clans, the Sengoku Jidai etc. The 19th century was the era of line infantry, of steam ships, of absolutist monarchies and democracies, of Empires. Likewise, Japan had an Imperial time of its own, with the Meiji Restoration, the Meiji Constitution and everything that came with it. The early 20th Century was an era of warfare and fascism, and Imperial Japan did not fail at perfecting such hegemonic culture at the time, becoming allies with Nazi Germany and venturing on an expansionist campaing throughout Asia.

It follows that this era of anime, altogether with manga, videogames, cosplaying, conventions, snack foods, and cool technologies, is all a single culture, much like the other singular cultures that Japan had in different eras, perfecting that of the rest of the world. The world is engaged in entertainment and technologies, so Japan perfects entertainment and technologies.

Japan has always been seen by outsiders as an important center of art and culture and it will continue to carry this legacy.

Japan is the best country.

>>17611426
And replaced with what? 19th century Romantic kitsch? Will future generations be cursed to endure an endless parade of farmhouses and churches and wheat fields? Faux-Roman statues lazily copying David? Shitty genre fiction?

>>17612266
>because the old times were better
They honestly weren't and your ability to communicate this wrong opinion across the world for almost zero cost proves how wrong you are.

>>17612501
>Faux-Roman statues lazily copying David?
Hopefully this one. The art of figure making will progress to large if not full sized figures, people will regain an interest in sculptures, and influenced by anime, the sculptures will be of moe type figures both for cuteness and space saving. Small nude statues of young women propping up tables and bowls in a corner of some room in styles ranging from full on moeblob to really detailed roman statues with frilled skirts instead of draped cloth.

>>17612501
pomo is largely just as insipid and derivative, with the caveat that it doesn't require any technical skill

given the modern art scene (as in, current art scene, not "scene of Modern Art") is more or less an incestuous racket.

>>17612513
Are you saying old times were worse because people weren't able to share their stupid opinions with the whole world?

Are you replying seriously to sarcasm?

>>17612534
>given the modern art scene (as in, current art scene, not "scene of Modern Art")
The term you're looking for is "contemporary art"

>>17612501
>And replaced with what? 19th century Romantic kitsch?
Something that your "educated" liberal mind can't even conceive, probably.
>Will future generations be cursed to endure an endless parade of farmhouses and churches and wheat fields?
Much better than an endless parade of anus photographs, menstrual blood smears and Piss Christs.
>>17612531
>Small nude statues of young women propping up tables and bowls in a corner of some room in styles ranging from full on moeblob to really detailed roman statues with frilled skirts instead of draped cloth.
This would actually be amazing.

>>17612531
Are you sure this is a good idea?

>>17612534
It takes zero creative ability to churn out Impressionistic Painting of Bridge Over Small Pond #28612. The modernists continually innovated what was done with the medium.
>is more or less an incestuous racket
Then your beef is with the culture that surrounds the art, not the art itself.

>>17612538
>>17612538
>Are you saying old times were worse because people weren't able to share their stupid opinions with the whole world?
Yes, because that same technology allows me to have paramedics at my doorstep within the hour, it lets me send whole manuscripts to my supervisor and publisher instantaneously, and so on. It doesn't take days to cross the Pacific on a filthy ocean liner. Food doesn't go bad because there's no refrigeration cars to transport perishable goods. And so on.
>Are you replying seriously to sarcasm?
Yes. Yes I am.

>>17612629
>Something that your "educated" liberal mind can't even conceive, probably.
So you don't actually know what you want to replace a whole century of art with then.

>>17612629
>Something that your "educated" liberal mind can't even conceive, probably.
So you don't actually have an idea of what will replace an entire century of art, then.

>Much better than an endless parade of anus photographs, menstrual blood smears and Piss Christs.
LoGH has numerous scenes of gore and explicit violence. Do you intend on censoring that as well?

he's right tho

>>17610633
>What do you think people in a few hundred years will think of the anime artstyle?
>In my opinion it will be sort of like today's opinion of pic related - "What the fuck were they thinking?"
A related question is how much of this art is going to survive, anyway? Most of it was considered disposable and produced on media intended for a disposable product.
Doujinshi receive limited print runs and old dojins of unpopular series are typically binned. Servers go dark all the time. VNs and games are programmed to use software that probably won't be supported in 100 years without dedicated emulators. Many games require an internet connection just to function and are killed when companies kill official servers.

How will all of this be preserved?

I don't understand why people think that one art style needs to have a monopoly on what people see or hear. Close your browser window if you don't like what you see.

>>17612754
>How will all of this be preserved?
It won't.
But neither has been 90% of all other human art.

>>17611266
>>17612745

>>17612824
That's sad. I want future generations to know of Roki's greatness.

>>17611715
why arent we as cool as antique weebs

>>17612854
Are you seriously saying that Ken-sama wasn't cool?

>>17612854
But we are.
The generations of tomorrow will look back in history and when they read about our greasy NEET asses, their jaws shall drop and they shall say: "かっこい!"

>>17612754
> how will all of this be preserved?

The NSA's massive archive of forum content and pirated media games and doujins

I wish I were joking

>>17612877
Go back.

>>17612880
Top kek

Stay mad cuck

>>17612877
That's a step up, but we still have a single failure point in the agency that holds the data.
Also, why did you post a screencap of your normiephone image archive? I'm curious

>>17612710
Violence as part of a story is different from period blood on a canvas being exaulted.

>>17612931
Not him but maybe don't google paintings of period blood then?

>>17612937
I wasn't the one to bring the comparison.

>>17612941
I think my point stands regardless. People should just mind their own business and not look at things they don't want to look at.

>>17612880
No
>>17612903
The CIA is in on it too and the CIA is a cell based network like al Qaeda

There is no single point of failure

I am posting like an idiot because I'm a legit newfag since like 2012 and I don't know how to use 4chan

The girls' picture In the early 20th century there is a prototype of girls in today's anime.

>people
>in a few hundred years

Anime and manga art represent the zenith of human creative endeavors, particularly my erotic lolita images. It will only be downhill from here.

>>17612957
That kind of thinking allows shit to build up in silence.

>>17612931
>the blood which was a traumatic event in my life is high art!
>the blood which was a traumatic event in your life is disgusting
>i have no basis for this other than "mine is good and yours is bad, because mine is mine and yours is yours"
wew, son. even the feminists are just "pretend ours mattered just as much even if it didn't really!" based on a complete denial of the Tomoe-archetype, you're well into full autism.

>>17613841
Unless you're being forced to look at it, there really isn't a problem.

>>17613798
Of course, anon. If we did not continue to exist, we could not continue to suffer.

You're not going to Hell when you die. You're already /there/.

>>17612255
look out, "enlightened" anon posting

>>17612443
The Japanese are a nation who can't stop refining whatever they do.

>>17613637
It isn't.
Disney is.

We haven't evolved since Da Vinci.

Modern art has been done since Albrecht Dürer

Art Nouveau and Art Deco are both good.

>>17613637
that's actually really cool

>>17612754

>Doujinshi receive limited print runs and old dojins of unpopular series are typically binned. Servers go dark all the time. VNs and games are programmed to use software that probably won't be supported in 100 years without dedicated emulators. Many games require an internet connection just to function and are killed when companies kill official servers.

Its for this reason that I've started to take seriously the idea of saving harddrives full of various doujins and fanart and "curating" them to an extent for the sake of future generations to have evidence of their existence. I may not leave any surviving record of my existence, but at least I can try to make sure my waifu does.

>>17614692
I've thought of this, but saving hard drives full of dojinshi only really works if you ensure that others know of the existence of your cache and have the ability to retrieve it. That way, committed volunteers can use the backup to restore access to any dojinshi lost with the failure of a main server.

Otherwise you have little more than slowly decaying caches of art on devices that aren't built to last longer than a couple of decades. Even tape drives eventually demagnetize.

I'm personally committed to collecting paper copies of dojinshi of my wife. If society collapses I intend on moving my dojinshi collection into waterproof rain barrels and burying them on an uninhabited island 5 miles off the coast of my house. If I have the money I intend on having them all reprinted on acid-free archival paper. On top of the burial site I'll chisel my wife's official MoF biography in English and the original Japanese.

Of course I don't think it'll come to that. At worst we might be reduced to trading dojinshi via sneakernet. Tru /jp/sies would make a living in the post-apocalyptic wasteland recharging cellphones and laptops and would offer to trade jpegs with travelling weebs.

>>17614291
Only the architecture.

>>17614237
Even in the Edo era, real pictures were requested for illustrations of books in natural science.

>>17614072
More like ''non mentally retarded'' anon posting.

>>17614825
>Of course I don't think it'll come to that. At worst we might be reduced to trading dojinshi via sneakernet. Tru /jp/sies would make a living in the post-apocalyptic wasteland recharging cellphones and laptops and would offer to trade jpegs with travelling weebs.
Wouldn't it be easier to transmit this stuff via ham radio? IIRC it's not that hard to transmit simple files using programs that translate bits into audio files.

>>17610692
This style

/jp/ - anime
what the fuck are you doing hotpockets

>>17610710
Only an ugly person thinks realistic = ugly. Not bad for your first bait, anyway.

>>17611977
Because angels and fairies are real.

>>17612256
"The craft of illusion." Not my definition by the way.
Shitty art is still art.

>>17612266
>paintings are better than vr

>>17614692
>>17614825
Nobody will want this because they'd rather be fucking your waifu in the matrix. While reading a doujinshi of her, perhaps. Until that time, the wealthy individuals will have to settle for the genetically-engineered slave-girl-farm trade.

>>17613990
Shit has a smell still spreads disease even if you're not looking at it, idiot.

>>17613798
dinobraap.jpg
Japan won't be here in one year if they continue to refuse to killl King Fattie.

>>17613989
>i have no basis for this other than "mine is good and yours is bad, because mine is mine and yours is yours"
That's the basis for everything if you're being honest.
Random splotches of any material is garbage, if you're the type of person who wants more than random splotches. If anyone's autistic, it's the one arguing about the merits of blood as paint instead of, you know, the actual fucking painting.

>>17614237
>da vinci had computers

>>17623439
Semen would be too valuable a commodity to waste on animu girls, so the normie-in-charge will have started a campaign to exterminate all porn and users of porn. Radio would be too easy to intercept and blow your location.

>>17631033
>Nobody will want this because they'd rather be fucking your waifu in the matrix. While reading a doujinshi of her, perhaps. Until that time, the wealthy individuals will have to settle for the genetically-engineered slave-girl-farm trade.
>Semen would be too valuable a commodity to waste on animu girls, so the normie-in-charge will have started a campaign to exterminate all porn and users of porn. Radio would be too easy to intercept and blow your location.
I think you're discussing a future where technological progress continues to climb at a rate similar to what we've experienced in most of our lifetimes. Of course most of us are going to be too busy having deep implant brain stimulation hentai sex in 2030 of society doesn't fucking collapse.
I'm more concerned about what would happen to our culture if society were to falter or fall apart in some form. Anything ranging from a major economic depression and a splintering of political authority to a full-on collapse of major governments with society reorganizing itself along the lines of tribes or small despotic city-states.
My fear is that such a society would become intensely conservative and authoritarian, kind of like the societies you see in North Africa or on the Central Asian steppe. There wouldn't be much resources for massive censorship campaigns but you wouldn't be able to openly advertise your degenerate cartoon porn video games. Plus, otaku culture is a global elitist culture similar to the humanists of the Renaissance. We shun tradition and indulge ourselves in the pleasures of literature and art. This culture survives on a highly complex supply chain of goods needed to keep the machinery we rely on functioning. Everything from affordable printing presses and specialist cloth vendors for cosplay, to circuit boards and lithium batteries. Without all that we'd have to learn how to salvage and repair what we have, come up with ways of communicsting and transmitting data across long distances without centralized networks.

I've read about current societies in countries like Libya, Angola and Kyrgyzstan that don't have major systems but have access to cheaper mobile-based systems. They talk via ham radio and use literal in-person peer-to-peer data trading to swap music files and pictures from one SD card to another in the desert or the jungle.

I don't think anything catastrophic is going to happen but I do think that someone needs to be prepared to keep the embers of our lewd culture burning if things do go south.

>>17632219
>I've read about current societies in countries like Libya, Angola and Kyrgyzstan
As an aside, one of the articles I read was about how people in Angola took advantage of a pilot program providing free Internet to Facebook, Wikipedia and a handful of other sites to establish file-sharing networks and avoid paying expensive prices for African bandwidth. They congregated in secret Facebook groups to trade links to images they uploaded to Wikipedia. IIRC image steganography was used to hide files in images that could then be downloaded free of charge since the program didn't count wikipedia downloads towards bandwidth allotments.

The actual article is a bit political but it's the only source I could find that describes the phenomenon:
https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/nz7eyg/wikipedia-zero-facebook-free-basics-angola-pirates-zero-rating

>>17611977
Why do you say that?

>>17632272
This artist would be making Comic LO covers if he was alive today

>>17632272
Not him, but with the realist movement you generally see a decrease in tolerance for embellishment or exaggeration in art. Escapism is derided and the real world is embraced. That's great for neurotypicals, but what if I want to see paintings of winged demons raping sinners in hell with their barbed cocks while Dante looks on in horror? When I invite my fellow aristocrats over they'll do whatever the 18th century equivalent was of greentexting the shit out of my art collection.

>>17612679
I don't think it's fair to tether the quality of an era to its technological advancements. Some would argue that the people who inhabit an era are those that mark its quality.

>>17632320
So is the distaste fixated entirely on the conforming nature of the movement, or in the shallowness of the illustrations themselves? History can be a treasure-trove for cool scenes, realistic or otherwise.

>>17632332
Technological (and social, to a large extent) advancements have been the traditional gauge of how advanced a society is, mostly because they facilitate better standards of living. Well-built roads and complex irrigation systems helped ancient civilizations support large cities. Medical advancements keep us from dying of minor infections. And so on, and so forth.

Late Rome was widely seen as highly degenerate - prostitution was rampant, large estates were owned by an idle elite, and so on. Yet there's a reason why we call the era that followed the "dark ages" in spite of the spread of christianity.

>>17632396
Elite idles?!

>>17632387
I'm merely speaking for my own tastes, which skew towards escapist media. I'm open and tolerant to other conceptions of what makes great art. I should have been clearer that I just oppose the mentality that one movement should be dominant and seek to dominate a scene. Sorry if I misinterpreted.

>>17632403
SPAKBQR

>>17631033
Leave "kudasai"

>>17632219
I think you have your chinese cartoons on too high a pedestal.
Society IS culture, so when society dies, culture goes with it. Lower societies are authoritarian because that's what works best in small groups that don't have time to do anything else beyond work towards their survival, but that doesn't mean autocracy itself is a bad idea. It took half the world to beat Hitler, and we're still using the findings of nazi scientists to this day.

Modern society isn't going anywhere any time soon. At worst, the ever-widening lower classes will revolt and put their own people in charge, but the basic structure won't change. What's more likely to happen would be the implementation of universal basic income - especially if Bill Gates gets his way and autonomous robots get taxed - and or a drug-resistant superbug taking out huge chunks of populations around the globe, much more likely if the open borders people get their way.

I can, however, envision a scenario in which google takes over the last few percents of market share still out there, google dns becoming the only option, and using their de facto control of the internet to ban all porn. Probably around the time that "VR Rapelay: loli edition" with photorealistic real child graphics gets released. E-hentai itself is already outright banning entire regions of the globe right now https://forums.e-hentai.org/index.php?showtopic=201442
The time to start preparing has already begun.

>>17632473
>but that doesn't mean autocracy itself is a bad idea
It kind of is, since if you look at historical trends scientific and artistic progress explodes when you hit the sweet spot of governments powerful enough to exert a basic authority but not powerful enough (or unwilling) to exert a totalitarian control over a society. For all your apologia of Hitler, their micromanaging of Germany's scientific community purged it of valuable talent that was either killed, fled to the allies or was squandered on the front lines.

You want to give thinkers the breathing room necessary to try new ideas without risking social ruin or worse. For the past century that breathing room has mostly been found in liberal enlightenment democracies with a modicum of a welfare safety net.

And yes, I'm putting my chinese cartoons on a pedestal because I value them. I believe them to be one of the better manifestations of personal identity detaching from ethnic or geographic background.

This thread isn't even about otaku culture at this point.

>>17632540
/jp/ - Doomsday Preparation Guide

>>17632531
Except the fine arts reached their zenith during autocracy and only after the French Revolution did it start to decline. Same with Japan. Same with China. Same with Greece, unless you think a 9 to 1 slave to citizen ratio where only the top 1% can (and were forced to) vote still counts as a democracy.

>acknowledging facts makes you an apologist
Great, one of these retards.
What if I am one? That still doesn't change the facts. But I can understand if you don't want Google to think the same thing about you if they catch some unsavory terms in your search history. And it was less "fleeing" and more "poached by the US government after the war."

It also seems like you don't understand that autocracy is a broad term classifying a variety of governmental and societal structures. To get breathing room you need money, and what greater source of money was there than that held by the elite? Why do today's companies continue to consolidate and consume the smaller ones? Or you think two guys in a garage are on equal footing with the giants? In the old days, a group of aspiring artists lived with a master and practiced all day long, all expenses paid by the nobility. That's how they continued to evolve and rise to new heights, not by selling things to peasants.

Not gonna touch the last part because it makes zero sense. Cartoons are spontaneously spawned from the void, apparently.

>>17632810
>French Revolution
The Romantic movement was basically created by the Revolution and some of the best ideas of the Enlightenment only gained traction because of it
>China
Some of the greatest works of Chinese art and literature have been produced during periods of civil war or disunity
>Japan
A lot of what we consider Japanese culture was created during the Sengoku Jidai and only solidified during Tokugawa rule.
>Greece
So?

>What if I am one? That still doesn't change the facts.
It makes your selective choice and disregard of the facts suspect, the same way I'd be immediately suspect of anything from an openly socialist newspaper.
But still, I'm sure the Nazi Germany autocracy was totally smart in sending some of its best physicists and engineers to the front lines and demanding complete ideological subservience and racial purity from them. Really smart and totally not an example of an autocratic organization letting its own pathologies fuck over its goals
>Why do today's companies continue to consolidate and consume the smaller ones? Or you think two guys in a garage are on equal footing with the giants? In the old days, a group of aspiring artists lived with a master and practiced all day long, all expenses paid by the nobility.
Comparing modern corporations with feudal lords is just an out-and-out admission that you get your history from blog posts, message boards and wiki articles
>That's how they continued to evolve and rise to new heights, not by selling things to peasants
Ignoring the longstanding patronage local churches and monasteries gave to artists over the centuries, why even fetishize this? It's extinct and the Internet has killed it. Most artists can tell rich patrons to fuck off and crowdfund their smut now. And no one is crowdfunding whatever art style you think is better than my anime tiddies so I guess that's why you're so buttblasted about this in the first place. I'm just glad that most people are comfortable with these old traditions being ground into the dust

>>17610633
Why did married women shave their eyebrows back then

>>17634880
Why did Mona Lisa shave her eyebrows?

>>17634880
the eyebrows are shaven and redrawn higher, for the same reason her teeth are stained black. it's the classical style.

>>17634880
women still shave their eyebrows

>>17610633
Sometimes I get afraid that anime, and really just the current Japanese pop culture ethos in general (so that also covers games, silly live action shows, etc) will go out of style in my lifetime. So much of my life and my identity is built around the consumption of this media. I literally cannot imagine a life without cute anime girls. Logically, it will inevitably have to become a relic of the past one day, even if it's after I'm dead, and that makes me sad.

At least, if it does go out of fashion in my lifetime, there's already a lifetime's worth of content to consume.

>>17634880
As times change, people's beauty sense change.

>>17611179
this
>>17612131
Do you know what art means? It doesn't mean putting effort into shit, it's just art like it or not

>>17610633
Why are her teeth black?

>>17612331
>filename
Most cultures had.

>>17613637
You know what this reminds me of.

>>17642145

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohaguro

>>17632473
> drug-resistant superbug taking out huge chunks of populations around the globe, much more likely if the open borders people get their way.

wtf I love open borders now?

>>17610633
>What do you think people in a few hundred years will think of the anime artstyle?

>Everything I've been taught about our past is wrong. This is, without a doubt, the pinnacle of human kind. I'm deeply ashamed that our dear leader banned every trace of this exquisite medium alongside other form of vulgar entertainment as part of the great cultural cleansing of 2120. Our present is a mistake.
Quoting every human from the future after they discover anime

>>17632473
>we're still using the findings of nazi scientists to this day

thank god they did the Hitler salute and shouted "Heil the Führer" before and after every experiment they conducted, or else we may have never made these discoveries.

>>17610633
She's just making a retarded expression