/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Not much.

Well what could you expect from a create.sfw user.

>>13492433
It's missing a few characters.

>>13492461
ww

>>13492433
Sanae should have said "I'm not a slut"

>Walfas

go away

>>13492433
>deep personalites and detailed backstories
I kek'd

What the hell is western youkai?

>>13492433
I'd say it's passable, a panel of that thing with every single character might be actually useful to introduce new people to the actual canon or something, but they still are pretty wonky explanations.

The Sanae one is mostly wrong anyway.

>>13492703
You know, like a cowboy.

Why does Sakuya show up like 4 times?

>>13492775

Holy fuck I want a cowboy 2hu now

>>13492703
A maid.

>>13492770
Sanae is a huge nerd who is kind of bummed because she's in the entirely wrong sort of nerd paradise. She expected to pilot a big damn robot, but she now has to play babysitter to a bunch of superpowered brats.

Good thing she found the incident solving thing fun once she tried it out.

>>13492433
Deeply cringeworthy but fairly accurate.

Not sure why they pretend Reimu and Marisa need to be distanced from each other. They're the main characters of a game without coop, how could they possibly fight together.

>I'm ghost princess Yuyuko Saigyouji, and I don't *always* eat.
imperishablenight_netherworldteam.doc
hopelessmasquerade_yuyuko.gif
>I am not a pervert! In fact, I don't like dirty photos!
Disproving fanon by throwing in other fanon? Tsk tsk.
>In fact, [Aya is] my least favourite of the useless crows!
More fanon. In Double Spoiler, Hatate makes it clear that Momiji's beef is with Aya, not the crow tengus as a whole.
>western-style youkai
No, they are not. Just because they have Western names doesn't mean they are Western youkai. And Rumia doesn't even have that. And what the hell is a Western youkai anyway?
>Although my EX form is super-powered, it is also very easy to defeat.
power_levels.png
Also, more fanon. He's really making a good job of proving what canon Touhou is, isn't he?
>I'm only friends with Keine because she helps protect me
More fanon.
>Just because we're ruthless villains does not make us Mary Sues!
The hell? Did this fucker even read Silent Sinner in Blue? Ruthless villains. My cock is a ruthless villain.
>Yes, I do my job, but it's not what you think it is.
What? We do know what her job is. And we do know she's a damn slacker.
>Sanae
This guy really has no idea what he's talking about, does he?
>They are strong female characters with deep personalities and detailed backstories!
Hee. This may be true, but it was put in such a cringy way I can't take it seriously.

4/10, see me after class.

>>13492951
Favouritism. This is the same guy who made Diamond in the Rough, where it just so happens that Sakuya falls in (heavily implied) love with his self-insert.

>Yosuzume
>"Western style youkai"
fucking what

>>13493016
>fairly accurate

No, it isn't. Don't make me enumerate.

One of the things I love the most is that dork Youmu is actually pretty close to canon Youmu.

>>13493031
>>13493022 got your back.

>>13493022
>And what the hell is a Western youkai anyway?
In Japanese, "youkai" does not refer specifically to creatures from Japanese mythology. They would consider a leprechaun (for example) as a youkai with Westen origins.

>>13493098
And he still missed most of it.

When the space and effort needed to correct something exceeds the size and effort that went into making it, it's best to just move on with your life.

>>13493199
>In Japanese, "youkai" does not refer specifically to creatures from Japanese mythology.

And sake does not refer specifically to alcohol from Japan. Too bad we're not speaking Japanese.

>>13493226
Please then refer to Touhou Project as Project Shrine Maiden!

They forgot to include the part that Sakuya has a massive crush on the half-youkai shopkeeper.

>>13493226
You can either:

- use the Japanese definition of youkai
- translate youkai everywhere it appears
- retain the term as is and create misunderstandings

Pick your poison.

>>13493631

Stop that.

>>13493631
She blushed because she got surprised at one of those Rinnosuke's chuuni moments and you know it.

->why the fuck do they all talk like ->this<-<-

>>13493214
>And he still missed most of it.
Like? Sorry if it comes out as rude, but I do genuinely want to know what I missed. Out of the top of my head I can say that Kasen doesn't resolve any incidents (which tells us that the guy who made that is a moron trying to look smart), at least until ULiL, and even then that was a joint effort.

>>13493701
->they're ->->->->->emphasis<-<-<-<-<-<- markers<-

>>13493703

Kasen tends to fix things before they become major incidents I guess. Even if it's her and/or her pets that are the direct cause of the incident. So I would let that one pass.

As for people not listening to her, that is flat wrong.

Reimu and Marisa are Bffs in all the printworks, sure they go at each other but it's not like they are grudging allies or anything

>>13493712

You can't make a post that emphatic on /jp/, please take it easier!

>>13493748

While you are right about that. They do tend to take separate paths when it comes to incidents. That's understandable since their motivations and methods are vastly different.

>>13493743
A couple of additions:

Byakuren's non-drinking is mentioned exactly once, in PMiSS, and it's not stated to cause her any problems socializing.
Saying that Tenshi isn't a masochist is true- she's just bored to the point of near-suicidal recklessness- but there's nothing to indicate that she literally gets attacked by everyone in SWR. She is the final boss for all characters, true, but saying she's attacked by everybody is like saying Hijiri canonically gets slapped by Reimu, Marisa, and Sanae in UFO.

"This is canon Gensokyou" also doesn't listen to the wise words of the delicious brown bunny.

Why need some stupid webshit to spoonfeed you, read the actual printworks and find out.

>>13493692
His chuuni moments are one of his charm points. She probably raves about his long winded talks to her mistress.

>>13493773

Take your fanwank somewhere else.

>>13493773
this picture and comment pleases me greatly. Thanks for the fond thoughts.

>>13492433
>Cirno: I'm not stupid! I'm just arrogant!

>>13493793
No problem, anon!

>>13493818
It's funny because she is smart for a fairy, but that is like being a retard savant.

>>13493773
Please, we're discussing actual canon here.

You' are as annoying as the yurifags you despise so much by butting in with your Sakuya x Rinnosuke pairing at every occasion.

>>13493852
Okay, then I'll complain that Rinnosuke wasn't in the OP picture and that his existence in canon is essential to making the Marisa we all know and love thus making him an important yet unacknowledged figure in Touhou. See? I can be on topic.

Why Is AlicexMarisa a thing?
Because of that stupid video?

>>13493888
shipping doesn't have to make sense

He should of said Koishi isn't a psycho when ULiL pretty much confirmed it.

Things like these are so stupid. For fanworks, accepting author interpretations is the same as suspension of disbelief. I don't believe all the things in fandom, but I'll accept them (to a certain degree of course) for the sake of enjoying whatever it is.

>>13493891
Fucking yurifags

>>13493885

There aren't as many misconceptions about his character is why he wasn't in the OP. Are you even paying attention to what this thread is about. What would you want the OP to say about him?

"I'm not a playboy. I'm just interested in the outside world flotsam that ends up in Gensokyo. As a result a lot of people come to my shop asking about curious items on a regular basis. Stop reading so much into that."

Sound like the exact opposite of what you want.

>>13493888

I think it has more to do with the fact that they were paired up in IN.

>>13493915
I forgot about that. It's awful anyway.

>>13493915
>Sound like the exact opposite of what you want.
I wouldn't mind that actually. Also, I've come across some people who have had misconceptions of him due to people spreading misinformation like him having Tokiko as a girlfriend or something or being gay. Though that was a few years ago.

>>13492703
A cowboy Youkai.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEwdLH1MBU0

>>13493934
>being gay

So it's either he is somehow wooing all the girls who visit his shop or he is gay? The fuck is wrong with people.

>>13493955
Blandness is less appealing than extremes.

>>13493992

Depends on how hard they try to jam those extremes down my throat. Some people try REALLY hard to convince people he is a playboy.

>>13493766
> but there's nothing to indicate that she literally gets attacked by everyone in SWR.

Tenshi's whole story mode was Suika gathering everyone to fight her

>Tenshi has a pretty nice personality, doesn't she? In the end, the game was all about everyone bullying her.
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Symposium_of_Post-mysticism/Interview

Yukari is not waiting for the Hakurei bloodline to die out, she has an interest in it and would not want it to die out.

Rumia keeps her arms out to look like Jesus.

Toyosatomimi no Miko is not closer to the Jesus archetype, she has followers but she does not value them, she just uses them as servants. Byakuren is actually trying to spread her religion to the Youkai but she is a Buddhist so I would call her a youkai Buddha not a youkai Jesus.

Sanae is reasonably bright.

Mahrisah has been shown to hang around Alice and Patcholli, they had tea at the SDM and Alice felt left out and jealous of Patcholli for her closeness with Mahrisah.

And yes Sakuya does appear to often.

>>13494020
>they had tea at the SDM and Alice felt left out and jealous of Patcholli for her closeness with Mahrisah.
You almost had it, man. This post was really good. You just had to end it at Sanae. But no, you had to write this.

>>13494030
They did though, it's a short story in one of Zuns works.

>>13494034
Are you seriously talking about the fan work by Paranoia Cat called "Witches' Tea Party" which was included in one of ZUN's books?

>>13494048
Ohh, was that a fan work?

>>13494054
Bohemian Archive in Japanese Red includes multiple fan comics.

The only canon comic of those is Extra of the Wind by Haniwa.

>>13493644
It should have been translated, but I'm afraid that ship has sailed now.

>>13493703
I won't go through the entire picture, but from just two panels:
- Ran calling herself "genius" and "not having time"
- "eternal" Yukari "waiting for the Hakurei bloodline to die of old age" (how does that even make sense?)
- Chen... LIKE ALL SHE SAYS WHAT THE FUCK HOW DO YOU MAKE THAT UP?
- "not stupid" Cirno
- "neurotic" Nitori
- Momiji with dog ears and tail

>>13495176
Just wait until Youkai Watch gets localized.

> Momiji with dog ears and tail

Yeah, I think she only appeared with animal ears once in a cameo in OSP, but was portrayed without in all other printworks, and her ingame sprite had white circles where animal ears would be if she had them, probably pom-poms from her tokin hat.

>>13493644
>create misunderstandings

That's why I don't converse with weaboos.

Some of these are just the fanon running to extremes with things. Like Meiling sleeping and getting punished by Sakuya, Cirno being the most stupid being in the world or Reimu being incredibly poor. Extremes are always a thing in fanon, maybe because they make for better gags in doujin manga. But it's annoying when it degrades to retarded meme spouting.

>>13496203
>Just wait until Youkai Watch gets localized.

From what I understand, they already announced they'll render it as "yo-kai".

So, yeah, that ship has sailed.

>>13494020
>Toyosatomimi no Miko is not closer to the Jesus archetype, she has followers but she does not value them, she just uses them as servants. Byakuren is actually trying to spread her religion to the Youkai but she is a Buddhist so I would call her a youkai Buddha not a youkai Jesus.
Miko/Shotoku is a 聖人 - someone who was sent by Heaven to be a great spiritual leader and "renew the world", who treats everyone like family.
Also Miko is directly compared to Jesus a few times - Seiga says her resurrection is more impressive because it was after hundreds of years rather than three days, and Miko says the stories about Shotoku being born in a stable (they exist) were the result of Christian influence.

>>13492433
Mystia is not a western-style Youkai, she's a night sparrow.

Which I think is technically supposed to be a disembodied voice as opposed to an actual bird.

>>13492461
>They are strong female characters with deep personalities and detailed backstories

>>13492433
>spaztique
opinion discarded

>>13492433

>deep personalities and detailed backstories

What the hell does this even mean?

>>13497237
The same thing that phrase always means; "I am trying to get in good with Tumblr."

>>13497237
convenient buzzwords

>>13495176
I see, so those are the ones I missed.

I don't know enough about Ran and Chen, so I didn't say anything about them.
I don't know what the word "neurotic" means (ESL here) and I didn't feel like looking it up so I didn't say anything about Nitori.
But I have no excuse for having missed Yukari (gee, more fanon, that guy surely knows his canon like the back of his hand, doesn't he?) and Cirno, I really don't.
As for Momiji, call me a secondary but I always thought she was supposed to be like that. Guess I know better now.

>>13497208
what's wrong with him anyways? always heard the name of this guy in walfas community?

>>13493022
>>I am not a pervert! In fact, I don't like dirty photos!
>Disproving fanon by throwing in other fanon? Tsk tsk.

Oh, come now. Nowhere in TH canon does it imply Aya is, in any way, a pervert.

>>13493022
>>Just because we're ruthless villains does not make us Mary Sues!
>The hell? Did this fucker even read Silent Sinner in Blue? Ruthless villains.

Ruthless =/= Mary Sue.

>>13497312
Where does Aya explicitly says she dislikes dirty photos in canon?

some of the comments on the deviant art page are even worse

>>13497340
It's so cute when secondaries try to act like primaries.

>>13497265
Seriously, don't be feeling bad. You don't need an excuse to miss a particular piece of bullshit in a sea of bullshit. That's the point, there's so much of it that attempting to correct it is pointless.

And everyone (including Hirasaka) thought Momiji is supposed to be like that, but ZUN must have intervened at one point and she's been ear-less ever since. In canon, at least, people just keep ignoring it elsewhere, and I don't blame them.

>>13497312
They're neither ruthless nor villains.

>>13497400
Remove caps and asterisks and that would be a typical /jp/ post.

>>13497312
>Oh, come now. Nowhere in TH canon does it imply Aya is, in any way, a pervert.
And she's never said not to be either. That was my point - he tried to disprove fanon ("Aya is a pervert!") by throwing in other fanon instead ("Aya is actually a prude!"). In canon, she's not stated or implied to be one way or the other.

>Ruthless =/= Mary Sue.
I don't see what you mean by this. My point was that the Watatsuki sisters are not "ruthless villains" and the assumption that they are means that the author of OP's pic has not read SSiB, so he's not in no position to criticize what other people think of the characters. Hell, he's even worse than the people he's criticizing because he's trying to correct their incorrect assumptions by feeding them other incorrect assumptions and saying they are fact.

>>13497613
>Seriously, don't be feeling bad.
Don't worry mate, I'm fine. It takes a lot more than a secondary acting like they are hot primary shit to bring me down.

>>13492433
Maybe it is. So what? The fanon interpretations of characters is what makes Touhou so appealing.

>>13497744
Spoken like a true secondary.

>>13493766
>Byakuren's non-drinking is mentioned exactly once, in PMiSS, and it's not stated to cause her any problems socializing.
Wut. First of all, SoPM, but Byakuren's sobriety is explicitly said to keep her away from parties, which is the number one method of socializing in Gensokyo. She doesn't know what people get up to because she doesn't show up.


And haha, The Watatsukis being "ruthless villains". Absolutely the opposite of the truth.

>>13497744
>>/o/
>>/u/
>>/t/

>>13497744
>>/mlp/

>>13492433
Behead the author behind this bullshit
MokoKene is love

>>13504968
Bullshit, MoKaguya is love.
Shipping enemies is always the best.

>>13504968
>>13504987
Please leave Keine out of this. She already has a perfect mate.

>>13504987
けねもこ + もこけーね = 4262 entries
てるもこ + かぐもこ = 3398 entries

Pixiv disagress therefore you're wrong !

>>13493766
>>13499199
Moreover, in HM, Futo points out that the Buddhists do, in fact, drink.

>>13492433
What a fucking retarded hypocrite.

>>13505004
You have made an enemy this day

Once again I ask, what's wrong with this spaztique guy anyways? I often heard the guy's name in walfas community and seems he was worshiped in there.

>>13507931
From the look of his contents, he made a lot of stupid shit and his style is actually generic literal copypasted stuff.

I prefer the finnish touhou guy.

>>13505111
by "buddhists", you mean "Ichirin".

>>13507944

The one who does these comics?

Yeah, they're great.

>>13493068
>One of the things I love the most is that dork Youmu is actually pretty close to canon Youmu.

You need to post the Test of Courage chapter from the one of the Three Fairies of Light chapters.

>>13493888
Because they are neighbors and Alice have teamed up with Marisa from time to time.

I'm a big fan of Touhou. I have original copy of the games until Subterraenan Anisim. I own a lot of goodies, figurines, mug, t-shirt and so on.

Yet the sad truth that canon material for Touhou is not that big or coherent. we can't talk about deep personalities for the majority of the cast.

>>13508974
It's okay, we never need deep personalities to talk about anyway.

Deep personalities are ridiculous.

>>13508887

I want loli Alice back.

>>13492433
>"my intolerance for drinking"
>being this retarded

>>13508974
>the games
Your mistake was assuming that Touhou is a video game franchise. It's mixed-media, and the shooting games are the part with the least focus on characterisation.

>>13493766
>Byakuren's non-drinking is mentioned exactly once, in PMiSS
what?
>Her daily life seems quite forthright, but because she won't drink alcohol, dislikes killing (she doesn't eat meat) and her other religious precepts, it's difficult for her to befriend humans (*1).
t. SoPM

>>13494020
>Byakuren is actually trying to spread her religion to the Youkai but she is a Buddhist so I would call her a youkai Buddha not a youkai Jesus.
the Jesus comparison is made because of how Byakuren got "kill" for the sake of saving youkai. Youkai Bodhisattva would be the most accurate nickname to give her, or even something like Youkai Guanyin.

>>13505111
>>13508171
She mentions Ichirin and sake, so does Mamizou. I think it was confirmed that Shou also drinks. Among the named disciples of Myouren Temple it's quite possible that only Byakuren holds the precept against intoxicants. Then again maybe Ichirin doesn't get drunk, but she would still incur a penalty, being an actual priest.

>>13509134

For me Touhou was always Shooting games and their OST.

No manga or book back then.

>>13492433
Hilariously, there's a lot of fanon here.

>Reimu and Marisa
No mention of their strong friendship.

>Sakuya and Remilia
correct

>Yuyuko
Yuyuko certainly loves to eat well.

>Youmu
correct

>Yukari
>"I'm waiting for the Hakurei bloodline to die"
[author went full retard]

>Ran and Chen
correct

>Cirno
why_not_both.jpg

>Nitori
She's shy and she's a greedy individual.

>Aya
Author just substituted a fanon theory for another.

>Momiji
Actually plays along Hatate, so it's not as if she hates crow tengus.

>Team 9 sans Cirno
>western youkai
the what now? Why not mention Cirno, since her name is also western?

>Keine
>"easy to defeat"
[citation needed]

>Mokou
>"I'm only friend with Keine because..."
[citation fucking needed]

>Moonbitches
>ruthless villains
[citation needed]

>Udonge
I see that the author equals "emotionally realistic" with "being a huge coward".

>Komachi
No mention of the times when she slacks and doesn't do her job.

>Kasen
>"I do my job"
local_oni_ruins_everything.jpg

>Sanae
Sanae is much more earnest about doing stuff than Reimu. She's not dumb, but she's certainly somebody with an "act first" ethos.

>Koishi
correct

>Tenshi
correct. She's a powerhouse that mingles with Gensokyoans because she's bored at Heaven.

>Yuuka
>my sadist days are behind me
Yet again, author is just swapping a fanon theory for another. We don't have this information.

>Meiling and Sakuya again
correct.

>Flandre
correct about leaving the basement and having what seems to be a normal relationship with Remilia. Fanon about not being psychotic (we don't have this information, etc)

>Mima
Correct that Marisa inherited a lot of her personality.

>Alice
who said that her dolls are for sale in the first place. Also, it's fun that the author points that Nitori and Youmu are "neurotic" and doesn't have a word about Gensokyo's canon neurotic here.

>Patchouli and Sakuya (again!!)
correct. Some touhous just aren't nice people, among them Patchouli.

>>13492433
Reisen is a butt monkey

The worst part of this is the fact that he used ZUN to make it seem like he's actually speaking for him.

>>13505004
Please leave Rinnosuke out of this. He already has a perfect mate.

>>13509975
dats a big ass post

>>13510062
She's, like, thirteen. It's like those kids who claim they're going to marry a man when they grow up but he's too old by then.

>>13492433
tl;dr

Is anyone here watch his latest work, Diamond in The Rough?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFB8509F85B1DA408

>>13510694
I don't need to watch four hours of propaganda to know that fanfiction writers are bad.

>>13510416
>Hey guys! All of your fanon is bad! You should listen to canon and canon only!
>Uhm? You don't know what is canon? Don't worry! I'll teach you all about my fanon! And then you will know what is canon!
I forgot who I was supposed to be quoting, sorry /jp/.

>>13510273
What. Marisa is at least sixteen, along with Reimu. She's no tween twerp.

>>13510740
nearly almost of touhou fanfic are bad. This guy try warn the others, but the result only creating more shit fic.

>>13510211
that's a big ass image at the OP. And even then, I missed Miko and Byakuren! I didn't double check because I was at the character limit already and hed to edit things out. So here it comes:

>Miko
>I'm closer to the Jesus archetype
Author confirmed for knowing shit about Touhou AND Christianity.

Miko doesn't care particularly about saving or sacrificing herself for anyone else. Her interests right now seem to be to have fun and slowly amass a power base.

The deal about Byakuren is that on a setting where everybody is a dick, in a lesser or greater degree (seriously, look to the protagonists), she started the series as a good hearted, serious person. You can trust the likes of Remilia, Yukari or Mamizou to be up to something at very least amoral for their own amusement. Not so with Byakuren. Also, she was totally sealed for wanting a world like Gensokyo.

>>13492433
I don't understand how being a stupid moeblob and wanting to be a good swordsman are in conflict at all, or how that conflict would make youmu "neurotic"

youmu likes swords because that's what her dad taught her to do, being naive is 100% of her character

>>13514289
Youki is her master, not her dad.

>>13514262
My guess is that OP's logic was.

>Miko
>Miko = saint
>Saint = Jesus
>Jesus!

I'm quoting a possible pattern of thought the author of that comic had.

>>13514289
Youmu desires to be a perfect samurai, in the bushido / confucian tradition. This is clearly at odds with her childish nature. For Kanako's sake, in Rinnosuke's book she gets in trouble with Yuyuko for taking a spiritual lantern to play and then losing it. Youmu to this day is afraid of ghosts and monsters and resents her mistress whimsical nature. Her true nature is completely different from her expected behavior.

Youmu is clearly a character with an internal conflict. Unlike, say, Sanae, whose external attitude (enthusiastic shrine maiden) matches her inner nature (enthusiastic believer on the Moriya goddesses).

>>13514262
>Mamizou
You leave her out of this. Yukari is an immoral prick and Remilia is a thoughtless brat, but I'm sure that Mamizou has the best interests of her "victims" in her heart.

>>13514341
...wanting to be the perfect samurai is a childish dream on its own man.

It's like wanting to be a soldier or a fighter pilot when you are a kid.

What you should focus is her cut, cut everything philosophy that she speaks of in IaMP.

>>13514262
>Byakushit
>a good hearted, serious person
Who lands her fucking ship on top of her competitor's grave, openly mocks and insults other characters in her fighting game appearance, sets up rules clearly skewed toward youkai while preaching equality between species, and poses as a religious leader while not even adhering to said religion's creed. Good hearted, my arse.

>>13514262
>Also, she was totally sealed for wanting a world like Gensokyo

A world where humans are little more than cattle/living batteries a-la Matrix, kept in ignorance and occasionally used as snacks?

I'm surprised they only sealed it instead of going that extra mile to make sure it was deader than a dead dead

>>13492433
Somebody needs to liberate the person who made that from their meat cage.

>>13514552
The Adeptus Mechanicus decreed that it will not accept such organic for conversion purposes, not even as a Servitor, in order to keep The Machine God's creations clean.

Praised be the Omnissiah.

Part of the problem with this kind of thing is that it can be incredibly hard to filter the fanon from the canon just due to the sheer amount of content for the former compared to the latter.

Not only that, but due to the way things are portrayed for the viewer, you can easily show 2 people the same content and have them come to 2 different conclusions about what they'd seen.

This isn't even touching on the whole 'headcanon' a given person might have, where you've got so many ideas all from different sources crisscrossing and intertwining with one another, that it can be difficult if not impossible to separate them.

>>13514415
>>13514421
>mikofags
Look, you're getting mixed here. It's Miko who explicitly allowed the spread of buddhism to Japan because she thought that would make the Japanese people more cattle-like and easy to control, while keeping making sure she and her inner circle followed what's essentially eastern hermeticism.

Byakuren landed her ship/temple over Miko not out of spite, but because she knows Miko and her gang were supposed to be dangerous. Hell, Futo is on the record as a buddhist temple arsonist.

>not following buddhism creed
Other than telling Ahimsa to shut up and go sit at the corner (something buddhists historically did in Japan, with all those Sohei and even samurai adhering to it), Byakuren seems to behave as expected for a devout buddhist. Her own followers are a more raucous bunch but she seems to work to keep them in line.

>biased towards youkai
Yes, she is exactly that. With youkai being endangered species everywhere and Gensokyo serving as a kind of nature reserve for them, she's not even wrong.

>>13514352
A childish dream stops being just a dream when you come from a family of fighter pilots and your fighter pilot dad or gramps leaves the keys of the family jet with you. She's socially expected (maybe not by Yuyuko) to grow the fuck.

>>13514348
Mamizou is essentially Rural Yukari. Both see themselves as benefactors for youkai, but while Yukari does it on a grand scale and with chessmaster tactics (so not particularly caring if individual youkai live or die), Mamizou acts like a country mob boss. Everything she ever did in the games or written materials is to defend or advance the youkai cause. She looks more good-natured than Yukari because she mostly helps youkai in need instead of messing with humans, but see what she's doing with Kosuzu in FS: She's totally nudging the girl towards youkaidom (probably to force Reimu to rethink her policy of killing human villagers that go full youkai, but that's still just speculation).

>>13514733
>With youkai being endangered species everywhere and Gensokyo serving as a kind of nature reserve for them, she's not even wrong.
FYI that's not what equality means. Unless you want to equate Byakuren with modern feminism.

>>13514733
>She's socially expected (maybe not by Yuyuko) to grow the fuck.

I'm assuming you mean "grow the fuck up"
A) that's totally conjecture
B) Yuyuko is probably the only frequent human contact youmu has
C) even if you're right, that would be an external conflict and it certainly wouldn't maker her "neurotic"

>>13492433
>genre savvy
>butt monkey
I had to google some of these things and it appears the guy who made this is from tvtropes.

Tvtropes is an awful place that engenders the expression of unwarranted and uninformed opinions, like this comic

One want you to be a ignorant servant
The other want you to be a powerless snack

The world of Touhou everyone, where if they don't give two quarters of a shit about you they are your enemies.
Pity the fools that desire to go there.

>>13514683
ZUN is not a top notch writer, but he's absolutely great at not taking sides at the several disputes that happen on Gensokyo. There's not a "right" answer to most of the conflicts that happen on Touhou.

>>13514753
It's not even feminism, but Ecology. There are humans everywhere, but as clearly seen on Kyouko's story, Youkai die/disappear when people stop thinking they're the cause for stuff. Byakuren / Yukari / Mamizou aren't wrong for wanting to defend Youkai, even if that's "just because" it's their own species.

>>13514784
yes, it's grow the fuck up.
A) it would be total conjecture if not by what is expected from somebody in Youmu's position in Japanese stories.

B) Yes, and Yuyuko canonically enjoys teasing Youmu.

C) It's internal. It's unbecoming for samurais to be playing around or even being afraid. Everytime Youmu thinks monsters are around, she must have an internal dialogue like "I cannot be afraid, I must stay here to protect Yuyuko-sama and AHHHH WHAT WAS THAT?!" So, self-conflicted.

>>13514822
>Byakuren / Yukari / Mamizou aren't wrong for wanting to defend Youkai
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that Byakuren defends youkai while preaching equality, which is a bald-faced lie.

>>13492433
>that STRONG WOMYN rant
Cool story, tumblr.

>>13514733
Byakuren is also not good at the 'no worldy desire' thing, with the desiring to live young and beautiful forever.
In fact, in that regard, she's a massive hypocrite.

>everyone being tsuntsun

>>13515023
I find it hilarious that her DS title is "nun who overcame the eight sufferings" when she obviously didn't want to experience old age/loss/death. "Nun who ran away like a bitch from the eight sufferings", more like.

>>13514733
>but see what she's doing with Kosuzu in FS
Helping a young girl follow the passion of her life while also creating/helping new youkai along the way?

That's the difference between Yukari and Mamizou. Yukari uses you for her gain, Mamizou uses you for your gain, and derives her own benefit as a bonus.

>>13515100
>she obviously didn't want to experience old age/loss/death
Well she did overcome it, technically.

>>13515023
Yes, because people need to be perfect right from the start, right? Byakuren went youkai magician 1,000 years ago. That was an one way choice. It's funny that you imply that she can't have different opinions now.

Moreover, buddhism is rife with enlightened people who decide to stay behind to help humanity to achieve Nirvana. You may want to look into what a bodhisattva is. Byakuren, through a rather crooked way, may have became something similar.

>>13514914
Yeah, feminism is not intrinsically wrong, but the way that was phrased is full tumblrite retarded.

>>13515100
I think you meant "helping a human villager to do the thing that forces Reimu to kill". Kosuzu may be loving the attention from the tall and mysterious lady right now, but I don't think the girl realises the mess her transformation can cause in Reimu's life, in one way or another.

>>13515206
>the thing that forces Reimu to kill
Only because they're living in an utterly fucked-up system. Besides, Sumireko did something much more damaging to Gensokyo's system and you've seen how long it took Reimu to notice it (too fucking long) and kill her (oh wait, she saved her life instead). If you don't pop up on Reimu's door and tell her that you're a villager that went youkai, she probably won't go out of her way to kill you.

What Mamizou is doing can only improve Kosuzu's life. An eternity of getting fawned on by cool, busty tanuki onee-san versus a few decades of Reimu getting pissed at her for collecting demon books, it isn't even a contest.

>>13515242
>Sumireko did something much more damaging to Gensokyo's system
Sumireko: 1) Would never have been a problem if not SOMEONE's help from the inside, and 2) Isn't even under Reimu's jurisdiction.

>>13514822
She's for all intents and purposes still a child. Other characters recognize this (sakuya doesn't really take her seriously and yuyuko sends her on a "scouting mission" pretty much expressly because she feels she needs more real world experience) so it would be a little bit far fetched to say anyone actually expects youmu to be a model at what she does. The fact that she's not chronologically 14 years old is basically a technicality.

>>13515255
>Isn't even under Reimu's jurisdiction
The moon isn't under Reimu's jurisdiction either but she sure had no problems strutting her stuff up there. Besides, you think you can wail on the border all day long and nobody will mind because you're outside it and aren't subject to Gensokyo's rules?

>>13515316
I'm saying Reimu's job is to take care of trouble inside Gensokyo. Trouble from the outside is more Yukari's field of work.

Holy shit, this thread is pretty much Hopeless Masquerade.

Or at least some sort of SoPM where Kanako, Miko and Byakuren are having fun inside while their followers are going at a full-blown religion gang war.

>>13515454
The only Hopeless Masquerade here is the secondaries pretending they know shit.

>>13515242
First: no contest about Gensokyo's system being fucked up. It's still probably the best possible solution for what Yukari set out to make, but it's not exactly a nice place to live if you're not a youkai.

Second: I also found strange Yukari's absence from those last two incidents, specially when one of them is a goddamn Lunarian invasion. Yukari's background shows that she's both crazily smart and nurtures a large grudge for the Lunarians.

It may be that TH15 devolves in ZUN-styled shenanigans ("Oh, the invasion was not serious at all! Cue tea-drinking."), but if it doesn't, he better come with a better explanation for the Yukari shaped hole in this plot than "hibernation, lol".

>>13515309
So? How everybody else reacts to Youmu ("She's just a kid!") has little impact on how Youmu expects to that everybody see her ("fearless warrior"). Remember, her conflict is INTERNAL. Externally, everybody is pretty certain of what she is: (a dork).

>>13515487
>it's not exactly a nice place to live if you're not a youkai
It's not exactly a nice place to live even if you're youkai. Gensokyo pretty much obeys the law of the jungle, people who aren't powerful get shit on repeatedly and with no consequence.

We've been shown repeatedly that fairies and non-humanoid youkai aren't people and can be exterminated at will.

>>13515487
Fair enough, but having expectations for yourself that you can't presently meet is a pretty normal part of growing up, so I wouldn't call that characteristic of being "neurotic".
>>13515518
To be fair, fairies can't really be killed.

Also, doesn't "extermination" basically mean you just have to fuck off for a while?

>>13515602
>Also, doesn't "extermination" basically mean you just have to fuck off for a while?
It may, it may not. Kasen performed a goddamn Fatality on her thunder lizard for being impulsive, Marisa killed a kutsutsura for trying to become a full-blown youkai in the human village and probably intended to grind up the evil snake dragon for ingredients. So outright killing minor youkai seems to be possible.

But for humanoids, you just get some torn clothes and bandaids.

>>13515454
>Kanako, Miko and Byakuren are having fun inside
inside of each other you mean, right?

>>13515647
>But for humanoids, you just get some torn clothes and bandaids.
Unless you're male.

>>13515683
Well, men are magically and intellectually weaker than women. They should stay at home and leave the hard work to the superior sex.

If a man tries to become a youkai, he's pretty much asking to be exterminated.

>>13515206
One-way choice? That's literal speculation. We've no evidence she doesn't have to maintain her hag-hiding technique. We've also no evidence she isn't still preaching just to keep youkai around- and thus her powers, which we know was the reason she started faking being a youkai hunter.

At least Miko admits she's a hypocrite.
We DO know from SoPM that she still uses her evil magic to this day. We also know that youkai are a fragment of the evil in the human soul.

>>13515859
>We don't know if Byakuren has been literally eating babies all these years!!!1
Go beat UFO and watch Sanae Ending A. Any theories about how Byakuren is actually a shady person with ill intentions towards humans must first deal with that Ending and the words of ZUN at the end.

The canon about Byakuren is that no, she's really a nice person.

>>13516005
The canon is that she scares Kanako even more when she can't detect lies from her.
That's not the same as 'not lying'. The title of the ending being 'No, Byakuren really is a nice person!' is not a statement from ZUN, it's the image Byakuren is trying to put across, mirrored in the title.

Also, she's not 'eating babies' levels of evil. She fosters the lives of the baby-eaters.

>>13516025
Dude, everything in
>greentext
that appears the Endings in UFO is the word of ZUN, without ambiguities. It's like when he intervenes to tell us that Remilia's boasts about being a descendent of Tepes are lies. That's the closest we can get in Touhou of a statement of a fact: the ideas of the game creator, unfiltered by the bias of a character or another.

>>13516058
I don't know what makes you think that, but I don't have any reason to believe it. It's a title of a chapter.

Further, nice =/= good. Ted Bundy was nice.

>>13516069

What about the black text then? The part that tells how about Byakuren always dealt truthfully with everybody, human and youkai? If she's scheming or has secret reasons for doing anything, that text (which is also ZUN's voice) is a lie.

And while the
>greentext
serves as chapter titles in some occasions, in this case it's also clearly a direct answer to Kanako thoughts, otherwise that "No," would make no sense.

So ZUN thinks that Byakuren is a nice person.

>Nice is not good
いや、白蓮はいい人なんです
This is the original text. Fuck you for making me find the site with it. いい人 means "good person" so this argument of yours is invalid.

>mfw 90% of my interpretation of the characters comes from the M-1 manzais
I don't even want to know the canon

>>13515859
>That's literal speculation.
Is there any other kind?

>>13516151
"Canon was a mistake."
- Zarathustra

>>13516148
>Fuck you for making me find the site with it.
Not that anon, and this is unrelated to the discussion, but are you telling me that the Endings Wiki is still up somewhere? I've been looking for it and I've never found it.

>>13516151
90% of my interpretation of the characters' voices comes from the Soku voice patch (except Reimu and Suwako, because Jesus Christ what are you doing).

>>13516148
That's a continuation of Kanako's thoughts. It's not a statement; there's a reason it follows direct answer.
Further, 'no, Byakuren really is a nice person' is, again, what Byakuren wants us to think. Assuming it's a statement from ZUN to the contrary of all the other evidence that she's super shady doesn't stand up.

Further, いい人 can and is literally translated as 'good' or 'nice', because of how close they are as synonyms.
聖はいい人そうだ.

>>13516185
What I found was that the people who prepare the translation patches have all the japanese text from the games online now, and this includes the endings.

>>13516205
Ah, right. The thcrap translation pages have the texts for the endings of the games 10 and onwards. I forgot.

>>13516202
There's "I don't want to change my opinion on the face of evidence" and then there's "I'm a Young Earth Creationist that misinterpret evidence that contradicts my deep seated beliefs" and you look to be closer of the second kind right now.

Put up >all the other that Byakuren is super shady

I'll even give you a bonus by providing one:
1) She conducts Sutra readings that leave the attending humans morose and the attending youkai excited.

>>13516225
You've kept resorting to being rude. Even if you think me wrong or an idiot, your constant insults make it seem like you're literally incapable of accepting there might be another side to the story, or that the character you seem to believe is perfect is not.

>>13516202
>nice =/= good. Ted Bundy was nice.

>>13516202
>Further, いい人 can and is literally translated as 'good' or 'nice', because of how close they are as synonyms.

>>13516264
In light of those two quotes, he's much more polite than you deserve.

>>13516264
>You've kept resorting to being rude.
Aw man, I'll totally be banned for going against this forum rules now.
Oh wait, we're on 4chan. Why don't you go back to your hugbox of choice? While you're here, don't expect false politeness.

Something for you to consider: My opinion about Miko changed after the fighting games. Because my opinions actually change as new evidence appears to support or contradict them. My initial assessment of Miko as of TD was of a sleazy politician bent on domination, but then Hopeless Masquerade happened and we found that Miko mellowed out (Futo, however, remained being an asshole).

My opinion about Byakuren is unchanged because everything that's released about her support the view that she's basically what it says on the tin: A religious leader who wishes that everybody live in peace. She may be hopelessly naive to think that she has any chance to accomplish that, and her naivety can enable Bad Things: Murasa (another asshole), just keeps drowning people, for example. But this makes Byakuren's character tragic, not evil.

Why are people so concerned with the canon of Touhou? Why can't you just accept that each character has two major interpretations, one of them being canon the other being fanon?
Is it really that bad? I have always accepted both without an issue. Both can be entertaining.

>>13507931
He made some fanfic movie and everyone was like "muh feels ;_;" and now he's famoose.

>>13516549
Because that's heresy.

>>13516550
So, is he like Usually Dead II?

>>13516565
>Not being Chaos
Look at this corpse-king-loving fool.

>>13516615
That's "Emperor", You could at least gotten that part right in your worthless existence outside of His Light.

>>13516615
>>13516648
Are you guys fighting?

>>13516264
>literally incapable of accepting there might be another side to the story

>>13516600
Like Fallout: Equastria

>>13516667
Just a bit of theological debate, anon. Don't worry.

Warhammer's pretty cool

>>13516549
Because it is by far more interesting than repeating the same crap about the characters endlessly until a new game is released, holes are there, to be analyzed.

>>13516675
Who ye quoting?

expert revision

>>13516986
Dude, just fucking stop.

>>13516986
>fixing Marisa
>fixing Youmu
>fixing Patchouli
"Who am I quoting" out of 10. Excellent job, partner.

>>13516986
better than the original / 10. Let original author see this and post his reaction.

>>13516986
>>13517151
Alright, I've already sent the revision trough his tumblr ask. Someone should do it on his deviantart.

>>13516600
Eh, Usually Dead is alright. Although the only thing I remember from his stuff is that everybody is a raging lesbian youkai fetishist and speaks English for absolutely no reason, so I might be forgetting why he's bad.

Yukari tries to speak "old Gensokyoian" (Japanese) once and Reimu (?) is all "and a ching chong nip nong to you too, young lady".

>>13516986
>I use to be a man
Wow even more secondary trite. Fuck off

>>13517998
His reply

http://spaztique.tumblr.com/post/119422227343/to-the-people-discussing-my-canon-gensokyo-psa

>>13492433
So... how much of this canon shit gets pushed aside for the currently happening UnderWorldWarIII w/ the moonbitches???

>>13518009

>>13518457
/jp/ will keep dismissing secondary and promoting canon, as always, now that canon is getting more exciting with war and all.

>>13518344
Huh. He actually sounds like a swell and cool dude. Wasn't expecting that one, but it's nice to see.

And I agree with what he said about it being really strange how the point of the comic being only understood by the people he was aiming 180 degrees away from. Funny how life works sometimes.

>>13518511
It's not really strange.

Western fan artists don't give a shit about canon while japanese fan artists can't read his shit (and they don't give a shit either).

>>13518457
As fun as it is to speculate about the robospider apocalypse, I very much doubt much will change. The biggest change I expect is the Lunar Capital becoming it's own proper Touhou faction instead of continuing to be Space North Korea, and we'll probably get some more information the the Watatsukis.

>>13518529
Lunar capital has never been a goddamn Space North Korea, that in itself is fanon.

Reimu lived for a week there and she has no negative experiences aside from being corrected all the times.

>>13516986
>suicidal humans
That's what they say anyways. Seriously doubting that human meat and sinew is a part of those cakes.

>>13518548
Reimu is a VIP, if you visit North Korea as a big-shot you'll get treated well too.

Not that the moon is Space Korea, just saying.

>>13518560
It's total fucking bullshit.

Umashira taro lived there for years and later he turns into a local god when he goes back to Earth.

Lunar capital has resulted in less death in human life compared to Gensokyo, it's practically Switzerland.

>>13518511
It's not really strange. That's the fatal flaw of his stated reasoning behind this.

We've been fighting each other over canon for over seven years straight (not each of us individually, of course, but as a roughly-defined community), of course we're going to continue doing that. We love it. People who want simple one-line characterizations will continue to use simple one-line characterizations. When faced with controversy and criticism, they won't go make a research, they may at most replace their current simplifications with new ones. So guess what happens when you put such simplifications right under their nose.

The only reasonable action is to avoid simplifications altogether.

>>13518023
If Prince Shotoku's story is canon, then Ten Desires is genderswap fan fiction.

ZUN said afterall that Touhou itself is fan work since he takes inspirations from different sources such as Japanese mythology.

>>13518009
Usually Dead dialogues and characterization were good enough (except when he's preaching through Yuyuko's mouth) and I genuinely loved the way he rendered Marisa's speech.

These were the good parts about the fics. The bad parts were everything else:
- Everybody speaks English in Gensokyo. Explicitly.
- Flying is somehow considered the apex of magical powers.
- The fucking nudity fetish.
- The thing where Remilia and Flandre had to be staked to "rebirth" as nicer versions of themselves.
- Yukari is locked inside Gensokyo and her greatest dream is to find an exit.

Just thinking about that train-wreck again irks me.


>>13518457
Alright. Miraculously, OP turned out to not be a fag. He's only incredibly naive to think that any kind of educational post will ever mean something against the hormonal urges of lonely teenagers (and grown-up people who never let the teenage mindset go), which are the main cause of bad fics.

OR against the mediocrity hivemind of hugboxes like fanfiction.net or dA, where bad authors can post bad works and receive lots of <3 huggles <3 *___*, therefore having no reason to improve, ever.

>>13518548
I THINK he meant North Korea in the "super isolationist" sense, rather than the "brutal dictatorship" one.

>>13520541
I though UD's schtick was that he's writing something based on Touhou games, but are not the Touhou games.

His MoF thing is just some high school girl getting violated by one magical lesbian after another, for example.

>>13520695
Now I'm glad I dropped UD by the mid of his butchering of IN. Mokou and the burnt fairies of doom was the last straw for me.

>>13520727
I don't know, Hina fingering herself to orgasm while molesting Sanae and eating her misfortune was pretty cool. Too bad she's also evil and almost turns Sanae into some sort of miko-antenna that intercepts and relays other people's misfortune to her.

Also, his Aki sisters probably share senses and are almost confirmed to spend the entirety of winter, spring and summer engaging in one really long session of lesbian incest.

He should just give in and write smut already. He obviously wants to.

>>13518344
Huh. That was quite cool answer. I expect a wall text of butthurt.