/jp/ - Otaku Culture

Yeah, she's a dirty thief and an insufferable retard

>>11130719

But she has to be, she isn't strong like everybody else is.

Marisa is the underdog that all the hipsters in the Human Village pretend to like.

>>11130729

So nobody would really care if she died? Nobody would look for her if she were kidnapped? Would they really just kick her to the curb if she asked for help?

>>11130739
dem yo-kays don't like hoomons

Reimu's her friend, Sanae probably is too. Marisa's got people that care about her, don't worry.

Marisa is a normalfag

>>11130772

>Marisa is a normalfag

How so? They all look pretty crazy to me.

>>11130754
they are "friends" but see how Reimu never ever visits her, let alone Sanae. she has to come to the shrine every time for Reimu to even remember that she exists.

when she gets old and sick who'll look after her?

>>11130789

>how Reimu never ever visits her

B-but Reimu has to manage the shrine! So maybe Marisa makes it easy on her so she never has to go out of her way?

I love Marisa. She's my best friend.

>>11130789
>mfw im just like that. I go visit my friends and they never visit me.

>>11130739
No man, it'd be like when Steve Jobs died. Or more appropriately, when Dennis Ritchie or John McCarthy died, and all these people came out of the woodworks pretending they knew who they were (before it was cool). Everyone would go nuts about Marisa, and talk about what an unsung cult hero she was.

>>11130811

>>11130811
come spend the night

>>11130717
She doesn't really do anything, nearly every single time it's Reimu the one that solves incidents and makes friends in the process. She's just there for Reimu to have someone to chat with about mostly mundane things related to japanese mythology, almost like she's just there to spark conversation with Reimu in the manga whenever it's not someone else like Kasen. She doesn't really please others either, she pranks Reimu constantly and steals other people's stuff, especially Patchouli.

According to ZUN in Shuusou Gyoku, Marisa would die of boredom if it weren't for Reimu, much like the witches from a certain other universe.

>>11130796
Reimu visits other places from time to time like Kosuzu's place, the SDM and Kourindou as well as whatever person she needs to talk to like Eirin in CiLR.

Yet, she never visits Marisa's place.

>>11130850
>she's just there to spark conversation

Good one.

>>11130850
>nearly every single time it's Reimu the one that solves incidents

Then why have the option of choosing Marisa in the games?

>>11130885
Same reason you can choose multiple characters in fighting games' story modes. It's just for gameplay's sake. Reimu's route is the canon one nearly every single time sans UFO.

>>11130885
Would be boring to be limited to 1 ship.

>>11130893

> Reimu's route is the canon one

What is Marisa doing the entire time then? Sitting on the side watching?

>>11130909
At home, prologue always shows all playable characters at least knowing of the situation but usually doesn't tell which is the one that goes, except SA which explicitly says Reimu and Yukari is the pair that go, Marisa goes as well but apparently only made it to stage 3.

>>11130909
It's just her fantasizing about being as cool as Reimu. None of it actually happens.

>>11130789
>>11130875
Not that we've seen. Marisa's home isn't really something to be visited.

>>11130914
>It's just her fantasizing about being as cool as Reimu. None of it actually happens.


That's really sad...

Why can't the canon route be were they both go together?

>>11130926
That's kind of the case in SWR. More so the fact that both of their routes are canon than them being outright together.

Here we go again, trying to make Marisa a depressing character.

>>11130929
Nobody is saying she's lonely or anything. Just that nobody cares about her.

>>11130933
But they do. If nobody did, nobody would talk to her and stuff.

>>11130934
I don't care about my neighbour but I still talk to him whenever I meet him. It's called courtesy.

>>11130933

I wonder if they should make a game to expand on that, like Marisa leaves or gets kidnapped.

And nobody goes to rescue her.

>>11130936
Do you go places with your neighbor?

>>11130941
I think I know where this is going.

>>11130949
To bus stops, yes.

He doesn't steal things from me or prank me either.

Best magician in Gensokyo.

If any of you bully Marisa, or even just talk about it, I'll beat your nerd ass up. She's the best and you know it.

>>11130952

No, more like Marisa gets turned into Evil Marisa and instead of trying to fix her, they attempt to kill her.

>>11130953
Reimu and Marisa go places together too, more than bus stops.

>>11130968

Don't you mean Reimu goes to places and Marisa follows?

>>11130965
That's stupid and implausible.

>>11130972
No, I don't.

>>11130984
Well that's the case.

It's always Marisa getting into things that shouldn't concern her because her being with Reimu 99% of the time and she follows her nearly everywhere.

>>11130990
I'm not buying it.

>>11130982

Is it anon!?

>>11130991
Yes, very.

>>11130996

Why? You don't think they really care about her do you?

>>11130965
Does she die?

>>11131000
Yeah. At least enough that they wouldn't just go "welp" and kill her. Since when does anyone get killed in incidents anyway?

ichi

ni

>>11131008

That's up to the player.

>>11131014
>Since when does anyone get killed in incidents anyway?

Since Marisa became the bad girl, I mean with the all shit she does don't you think they would jump at the chance to "stop" her?

>>11131015
reimu's kinda pale there, like zombie

Let's change this stale topic.

What's your favorite Marisa theme?

Casket of star for me.

>>11131015
>>11131020
san, onegaishimasu.

>>11130913
I don't think that even SA has canon route.
>except SA which explicitly says Reimu and Yukari is the pair that go
True, in Fairies manga Reimu had that ying-yang ords from Yukari.
>Marisa goes as well but apparently only made it to stage 3
Yes, SoPM has explicit statements that she met all bosses up to stage 3. Yet there is nothing about her stopping there and not meeting Satori, Rin and Okuu. In fact there is The Grimoire of Marisa which has descriptions of all spellcards including chireiden's ones. Did she say "fuck it" after stage 3 and went home but then changed her mind and returned back to record their spellcards?

ZUN is intentionally vague here, he probably never wanted to create a single canon route. Yet people still care and argue about that just like jews about holocaust.

>>11131067

Magus Night for me, I just hope everybody is wrong about Marisa being hated.

>>11131069
>I don't think that even SA has canon route.
Prologue of the game confirms that Reimu and Yukari go, as well as the extra prologue which shows that Reimu is the one that went to complain to Kanako for being responsible for the incident, telling her to inform everyone of her experiments next time.

Also, the Grimoire doesn't have to be fights done on the games' stories. Just random fights, you know, like in the fighting games. Would explain how she has seen Reimu's Fantasy Heaven and how it was a demonstration.

And no, ZUN states routes explicitly most of the time, that's the only way we knew that UFO's canon route is Marisa B. That's the only time Marisa's route has been canon.

>>11131041
Not at all. If people wanted her dead, she'd be so by now.

>>11131069
Satori probably told her that a certain miko had already arrived to solve the issue, or hell, maybe it was Reimu herself on her way back.

>>11131092
Because they don't even care about her.

>>11131086
>And no, ZUN states routes explicitly most of the time
Where?

>>11131096
Then they wouldn't be "jumping at the chance to 'stop' her."
Who's they, anyway?

>>11130789
Reimu is a lazy bum who spends all day in her shine. She doesn't visit anyone.

>>11131086
>extra prologue
Meant to say extra epilogue, oops.

>>11130789
>she has to come to the shrine every time for Reimu to even remember that she exists.

Don't be so dramatic.
And don't be stupid either. You don't need people to visit you to be friends with them.

>>11131101
She visits the SDM plenty of times as well as Kosuzu's library, Akyuu's place and the human village in general. Also Kourindou.

>>11131107
She's not eager to venture into the crazy magic death forest. Go figure.

>>11131099
Interviews, books and the game itself sometimes. UFO, EoSD and SA, respectively, for example. Here's the UFO one that confirms Marisa B as the canon route.

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Interview_on_Nae_Radio_%28September_2009%29

>>11131115
>She's not eager to venture into the crazy magic death forest
She does whenever there's an incident that involves said forest, like in IN and in the fighting games.

>>11131107
That's only cause some punkass youkai is making a mess. It's rare that she stops by just to say hi.

>>11131127
Yeah punkass youkais making a mess totally live in the human village.

Idiot.

>>11131127
>That's only cause some punkass youkai is making a mess
Uh no, all of those times are natural strolls that happen in the books and the manga, go read them.

>>11131102
>Meant to say extra epilogue, oops.
Fuck, I went to touhouwiki to reread that fucking extra prologue to prove how wrong you are, started typing a huge post and now it's all for nothing.
Also, prologues and epilogues are not in the game, they are in the separate txt file. So ZUN can't show you the different text depending on which character you used. Blame his laziness for that.

>>11131153
>So ZUN can't show you the different text depending on which character you used.

There's no different text for each character, there's only one, which shows that Reimu is the one that did the route. There's nothing about her in it other than mentioning it's her who went up the mountain to complain to Kanako for making her go to the underground, which means it's not even a custom ending which characters usually have, but rather a complete, canon ending of the whole game.

>>11131151
To be fair she did beat up Keine once for making the human village disappear.

>>11131153
>they are in the separate txt file.
There's only one epilogue, you know.

I think I like the story of the fangames better then the real games now.

Fantasy Maiden Wars for life.

>>11131118
Yeah, great source. Some drunken muttering
shit with "a lot of difficult vocabularies that I couldn't understand", "things that I couldn't catch" and no links to the original recorded podcast.
Also the history contains change from MarisaB to SanaeB and then back. Haha.

>>11131172
>>11131177
Don't you think that would be extremely retarded to have separate txt file for each character? And the small note on the top of each one: "please read it only if you have finished the game with this character".
Of course it's only one. ZUN is just too lazy to put the text into the game which would make it possible to have different epilogues. That's why he has only one epilogue. That was my point.
Also that epilogue still doesn't mention Yukari.

And finally my favourite question: what's the canon route of Great Fairy Wars?

>>11131123
Wrong forest, and there there's a threat to Gensokyo. Very important, and even then she's not eager too.

>>11131151
Some do, and others visit it to cause trouble. This is common knowledge.

>>11131218
>Yeah, great source. Some drunken muttering
The same drunken muttering makes these games, don't go discredit the man himself. Marisa B is canon, period.

>Don't you think that would be extremely retarded to have separate txt file for each character?
No? If there were, then there would be one for each character, but no, there's only one which reflects the whole game, not just talk about Reimu which is what would normally happen in a Heroine's ending.

There ISN'T supposed to be more than one epilogue, that IS the only epilogue. It's called an epilogue for a reason, not ''Reimu's Extra Ending''.
>Also that epilogue still doesn't mention Yukari.
And? That doesn't matter. Reimu is the one that wanted to meet Kanako after all.

>>11131218

Why doesn't ZUN just write it so that everyone's route is canon and you're just playing one character?

>>11131221
>Some do
Like?
>and others visit it to cause trouble
And if you actually read the post you're replying to you'd know that it says ''live'' in Human Village, not visit it. Also there's nobody that causes trouble deliberately in the village, the closest being Keine who actually wanted to protect it, and Suika who actually wanted people to have eternal parties.

>>11131232
ZUN can't write a plot with multiple lines all happening at the same time. It's beyond his skills.

>>11131232
Because it wouldn't make sense at all, you can't resolve the incident more than once, it would require time travel.

>>11131218
>what's the canon route of Great Fairy Wars?
I don't think there's one since, you know, they're all the same thing except the order of bosses is different.

>>11131218
>Also the history contains change from MarisaB to SanaeB and then back. Haha.
Original translation from shrinemaiden states clearly that's Marisa. That was probably just some guy messing around here with the canon since wikis can be edited by anyone.

>>11131235
>Like?
Minors ones.

And if that poster had actually read the post he was responding too, he would know that it didn't say anything about them living there.

>Also there's nobody that causes trouble deliberately in the village
Yes there are. No, I'm not going to cite anything; harassing humans is the point of most youkai's existence.

>>11131243
So Cirno can travel through time and fight the three fairies in three different orders? That's amazing.

>>11131257
>And if that poster had actually read the post he was responding too, he would know that it didn't say anything about them living there.
And if you had read the post prior to that one, you'd know it was saying that Reimu visits areas in the human village like Kosuzu's library, to which the other guy said it was just to beat up youkai which doesn't make any sense.

>No, I'm not going to cite anything
Oh, good to know you don't have any proof.

>harassing humans is the point of most youkai's existence.
And they don't live in the human village. What's so hard to understand about that? Humans often leave the village, in which any youkai can assault them which is where the cases come from. However, said assaults have been reduced alot since the spellcard rules which prohibit youkai from eating human, so they don't have any business harassing them anymore other than love for danmaku.

>>11131262
Hilarious.

I'm saying it doesn't matter because they're all the same, the story doesn't change other than the order of bosses, which is irrelevant to the story as nothing changes.

>>11131231
>Marisa B is canon, period.
My point was about the correctness of translation and its overall credibility.
Just wait few minutes, I'll add to touhouwiki another interview with ZUN where Sakuya is actually a lunarian.
>If there were, then there would be one for each character
Don't you think they would be completely identical except for character's name? Change the name of the character in the epilogue and it wouldn't change a thing. Change the name in the endings and it suddenly would stop making any sense.
That's why ZUN always tries to use "heroine", "girl" or other synonyms in his prologues/epilogues to make them suit for all routes. This time he just fucked up. Why doesn't extra prologue says that Reimu went to the mountain?

>And? That doesn't matter. Reimu is the one that wanted to meet Kanako after all.
So which route (and the ending) is canon? ReimuA, B or C? In the end you say that UFO's canon ending is MarisaB, not A.

>>11131243
>they're all the same
Isn't it the same in any game (except for IN)? Even the order of bosses doesn't change.

>>11131266
And if you were actually thinking instead of typing as fast as you can, you'd realize that it completely makes sense, and that that doesn't relate to what you were calling me out about.

I can't even tell what point you're trying to make now.

Christ, people.

>>11131287

Name three people that has visited Marisa's house willingly.

>>11131293
Sunny, Luna, and Star.

>>11131293
Sunny Milk
Luna Child
Star Sapphire

Yes, I think that the word "people" can be used for fairies too.

>>11130811
You have to invite them.

She was 3rd in the popularity poll this year, and she would've been second without that "lel so random Koishi subconscious" thing

>>11131301
>She was 3rd in the popularity poll

Doesn't mean the people in the games universe like her.

>>11131298
>>11131297
Also, Alice. They even have spent a night together (and I don't think Marisa has two beds in her house).

An insane theory I've always had was that Marisa and Reimu are the same person with split personalities even if that makes no sense.

The shrine is never actually attended if she isn't visiting so that's one of the reasons it's floundering. Becoming a witch was extra disgraceful towards her family because she's supposed to be a shrine maiden. And it would explain why both player character routes exist.

This theory falls apart with any sort of actual criticism or any mention of other player characters and the side mangas however.

>>11131293
Why should I?

>>11131346

Face it, everyone just pretends to like Marisa. If she were hurt nobody would care..

>>11131271
>My point was about the correctness of translation and its overall credibility.
You can't go wrong with ''MARISA B'', there's no possible alternate meaning. The original translation is up on shrinemaiden anyway.

>Don't you think they would be completely identical except for character's name? Change the name of the character in the epilogue and it wouldn't change a thing.
And whenever that happens, it's just ''the heroine did x''.

>Change the name in the endings and it suddenly would stop making any sense.
Actually no, Reimu shouts at Kanako which is very characteristic of her. Marisa wouldn't have done so and instead just called her an idiot or something.

Come on, don't tell me you seriously think that your THEORY, an unbelievable one at that, actually holds up any grounds. Even if your thinking was somehow right , it'd still wouldn't change a thing, because the epilogue is still there, and it isn't called ''Reimu's extra ending'' but ''Epilogue''. So it's still confirmed that Reimu's route is the one that happened.

>Why doesn't extra prologue says that Reimu went to the mountain?
Why does that matter? It doesn't matter one bit. It doesn't even say anything about anyone going up the mountain, yet Reimu did go up the mountain as stated in the epilogue.

>So which route (and the ending) is canon? ReimuA, B or C?
Reimu A, as the prologue states that it was Yukari.

> In the end you say that UFO's canon ending is MarisaB, not A.
Well that was ZUN, ask him.

>>11131320
>This theory falls apart with any sort of actual criticism or any mention of other player characters and the side mangas however.
Also if you ever actually beat the game and see them together in the endings.

>>11131367
Bullshit.

>>11131376

Read the thread, you know it to be true.

>>11131271
>Isn't it the same in any game (except for IN)?
No, because in the other games there's other characters to play as, whereas in Fairy Wars there's only one. Other characters to play as means different interactions and dialogues.

>>11131285
>you'd realize that it completely makes sense
No it doesn't. He said that Reimu visits the human village to beat up mess-creating youkai and rarely visits anyone for any other reason, which is completely wrong. Here, read it again:

>>11131101
>>11131107
>>11131127

Looks more like he didn't even bother reading.

Marisa is probably the least important recurring playable character. She almost never has any relation to what is going on. She's just kinda there too. Reimu does something and whoops, here is Marisa. She's just there so that you can have more shot-types.

>>11131310
>They even have spent a night together
That was just IN's bad end, which never happened.

>>11131372
>>Change the name in the endings and it suddenly would stop making any sense.
meant to quote
>Change the name of the character in the epilogue and it wouldn't change a thing.

>>11131383
Thread proves nothing and convinces me of even less. All I'm reading is a bunch of people who don't know how friendship works and think that not visiting someone means not caring about them.

>>11131404
People don't care about her so much that they don't bother visiting her. She's also irrelevant as she's just some random human with no position, responsability or special power. Everyone knows her as ''that girl that's always behind Reimu''.

>>11131384
Most of the games has multiple routes for a single character (A, B and sometimes C). Those routes has completely identical stages, bosses and dialogues.
The only difference is endings. In GFW ending depends on route. Which ending (i.e. route) is canon then?

>>11131271
> Change the name of the character in the epilogue and it wouldn't change a thing

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Subterranean_Animism/Story/Extra_epilogue

>However, Reimu, who was made to go underground,
>confronted them and said angrily,
>"Next time, tell everyone about it before you start!"

Yeah, nah.

>>11131410
All I'm reading is a bunch of people who don't know how friendship works, think that not visiting someone means not caring about them, and otherwise just pull shit out their ass.

>>11131420
I know UFO and DDC have different dialogues for each shot type.

>>11131437
Keep repeating it to yourself and ignoring all the evidence then, I'm sure it's truth in your perfect little world.

Also, stop saying ''friendship'', nobody said anything about Marisa not being friends with Reimu. It's just she is irrelevant and hence why people don't care about her.

>>11131437

How is it friendship if Marisa has to put all the work into it?

>>11131425
>>11131372
Oh yeah, just remove the word angrily as well.
>However, Marisa, who was made to go underground,
>confronted them and said,
>"Next time, tell everyone about it before you start!"
That suits Marisa, something similar she said to Yukari in PCB,
Is it worth copy-pasting rest of the text 2 times in omake.txt for such a change?

>>11131447
I missed word "sometimes" before dialogues. In the end SA had completely different dialogues as well.

>>11131455
I really hope you're intentionally being ironic.
Your evidence is saying that people don't visit her, over and over and over again.

>Also, stop saying ''friendship'', nobody said anything about Marisa not being friends with Reimu. It's just she is irrelevant and hence why people don't care about her.
Wow.

>>11131474
>Is it worth copy-pasting rest of the text 2 times in omake.txt for such a change?
Whoa whoa, hold on there, you were saying that this was just a mistake and ZUN meant to type in ''heroine'' instead of Reimu. And now that extra confirmation has been shown you suddenly revert to ''there was meant to be more than one epilogue''?

Come on now, it's blatantly obvious ZUN meant to put Reimu there, nobody fits ''angrily shouting at people for doing something they shouldn't do'' but Reimu.

And no, Marisa doesn't say anything even remotely similar to that to Yukari in PCB. Not that it would matter since all of this is just you thinking that your theory matters in the slightest.

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Cherry_Blossom/Story/Marisa%27s_Extra

Come on now, stop with this tomfoolery, you know very well you can't prove your point since there's no evidence of there being a mistake.

>>11131474
>Oh yeah, just remove the word angrily as well.
Why? It's what proves certainly that ZUN did mean 100% for Reimu to be the one written there.

Also, this is the first extra epilogue, there's no reason to believe ZUN should do a generalization with the word heroine, as it is meant to be a conclusion of the whole story, not just of a specific character in particular like endings are.

>>11131474
Forgot to mention one thing.
>Is it worth copy-pasting rest of the text 2 times in omake.txt for such a change?
This right here is another call for doubt. If what you're saying is right, why would the epilogue compact everything into one text? This isn't like a character's ending where it's focused on the character, rather, it's what you'd expect from a prologue, except Reimu's name AND characteristic attitude is explicitly mentioned at the end.

Also, the prologue also states explicitly that Reimu and Yukari go underground. If the prologue did it, why not the epilogue? Are you saying ZUN made yet another mistake?

>>11131372
>You can't go wrong with ''MARISA B''
You can fuck up with context.
>So it's still confirmed that Reimu's route is the one that happened.
Here is another possibility:
Reimu "was made to go underground" where she met Marisa who actually already resolved the incident. They talked with Okuu and Orin and decided to to to the mountain. Marisa met Koishi and defeated her. While Marisa was busy fighting Reimu met Kanako and shout on her.
>>11131507
No, learn to read.
>Don't you think that would be extremely retarded to have separate txt file for each character?
>No?
And then I say that would be retarded since
>they would be completely identical except for character's name

>>11131507
>And no, Marisa doesn't say even remotely similar to that to Yukari in PCB
The reason she went to Yukari was to tell her to stop mess with the borders and fix the hole she made.

So we can all agree that Reimu would miss Marisa if she were gone right!?

>>11131546
>Also, the prologue also states explicitly that Reimu and Yukari go underground
NO
>Yukari promised only to send Reimu to investigate, with youkai staying behind to act in a support role.
It says youkai and not Yukari as support. Besides I was never denying that Reimu was undeground. Both Marisa and Reimu were there and it is confirmed in sources other than the game itself. The question is who defeated Okuu and resolved the incident?

>>11131547
>You can fuck up with context.
But none of it was wrong, it doesn't have the ''I'm not sure about this part'' marks that the translator mentioned.

>Marisa met Koishi and defeated her. While Marisa was busy fighting Reimu met Kanako and shout on her.
That can't be, Suwako said that Kanako is not in the shrine when Koishi is being fought, she's away on a shopping trip.

And another thing that might seal this discussion, behold:

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Subterranean_Animism/Translation/Reimu_and_Yukari%27s_Extra

Please read the last few lines, I think it might sound familiar to you:

>Hey, you guys...
>Next time, tell everyone about it before you start!
>I had to go all the way to the Hell of Blazing Fires because of you!

See?

>And then I say that would be retarded since
>they would be completely identical except for character's name
Which is wrong, as ZUN clearly states that it was done angrily and with a shout. Nobody would do that except Reimu.

>The reason she went to Yukari was to tell her to stop mess with the borders and fix the hole she made.
Well no shit, obviously that's the case. But that doesn't have anything to do with the point here, which is you claiming that she said something similar to "Next time, tell everyone about it before you start!'', which is wrong as she didn't say anything even remotely close to it, at all, which, again, wouldn't matter as that's just part of your big assumption.

>>11131570
We won't agree, but I'd say she would.

>>11131569
>It says youkai and not Yukari as support
So Aya, Suika and herself. As the support in the game was the ying-yang-orb camera which Yukari used to support Reimu from the surface.

>>11131469
>Your evidence is saying that people don't visit her, over and over and over again.
I like how you just completely ignored the fact that she's irrelevant, which is the reason why nobody visits her.

>Wow
Damn, amazing argument there.

>>11131592
>Suwako said that Kanako is not in the shrine when Koishi is being fought
Ok, lets make a slight change:
Marisa fights with Koishi, defeats her, Kanako is shopping. Marisa goes home and never returns (she learned her lesson after PCB extra). Few hours later Kanako returnes and Reimu shoutes at her. In this case
1) Reimu was undeground (just like prologue/epilogue) said
2) Reimu told Kanako to stop (epilogue)
3) Reimu didn't defeat neither Okuu nor Koishi, since the incident was resolved by Marisa

>Well no shit, obviously that's the case. But that doesn't [...]
"Next time, tell everyone about it before you start" is basically telling someone (Kanako) to stop doing something (causing some shit without warning others). If Marisa went to Yukari to tell her to stop then Marisa probably told her to stop. That is just not included into the game dialogue. Also, Marisa sometimes is angry/annoyed as well.

Does this mean we can stop telling people to play the games since they don't even understand what they are reading?

>>11131592
Regarding UFO and SanaeB. Where is the link to recorded podcast?
But fuck with it. If ZUN said that in some interview, I'll believe him here.
But don't you think there is something not right here? Even if some person finishes the game with all characters, sees all the endings, completes extra stage and reads the omake.txt he still won't be able to say which route is canon. Because that information is in some interview on some shitty radio with no listeners.

>>11131701
Okay dude now you're just grasping the tiniest fucking straws I've ever seen.

>Marisa fights with Koishi
STOP

Did you not read the link at all? The dialogue happened after REIMU fights Koishi, not Marisa. Why are you so obsessed with Marisa having done the fights? Come on, read your own posts and see how silly the whole thing is. You're creating your own canon there.

>If Marisa went to Yukari to tell her to stop then Marisa probably told her to stop. That is just not included into the game dialogue. Also, Marisa sometimes is angry/annoyed as well.
I...What? My head hurts just thinking that you actually wrote this.

Did you forget what you said in the first place? You said ''Marisa said something akin to this'', I showed you how that was not the case, and now you're saying ''well she MUST have, even though it's never shown I'm just gonna pull it out of my ass'',

Not that it matters, again, because the entire assumption about ZUN having made a mistake has been thrown out the window, as it's been shown IN-GAME that the epilogue is indeed accurate and without mistake and that Reimu solved everything. I don't get why you are so obsessed with thinking that Marisa did it when all the evidence points otherwise, that very post alone shows some extreme desperation.

>>11131728
>But don't you think there is something not right here?
The true ending is revealed one way or another later on. For example, EoSD's route was revealed much later after its release on PMiSS where it's shown that Reimu did it. The true ending doesn't really matter to the overall Touhou story though, as the only thing that matters is that the incident is solved and nothing more, which is possibly why ZUN doesn't give it much highlight.

>>11131707
Only IN's translation patch is badly done, as the translators added a bunch of things that weren't in the original script at all, like all the swearing (eg: ''Bitch, get out of the way!'' never happened).

>>11131757
What? No. EoSD's patch was awful. For one thing, they never fixed the line length issue.

Pretty much all the patches are substandard up until MoF, which is why this Touhou Patch Center project is trying to fix them.

>>11131732
I read it

Epilogue:
>confronted _THEM_ and said angrily
But the game script has only Suwako. Or did Reimu scolded Koishi as well?

>Did you forget what you said in the first place? [...]
Do you think I would start re-reading all the scripts to find the exact quote from some other game/manga/whatever?
OK,
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Imperishable_Night/Story/Barrier_Team%27s_Scenario
Marisa was both annoyed and angry here.
>Not that it matters, again, because the entire assumption about ZUN having made a mistake
Mistake? I said LAZINESS. He doesn't include epilogues in the games so he leaves them in separate txt file. And that's why there is only ONE epilogue/prologue. Usually he tries to be vague as fuck, but this time he fucked up and included the character name. He didn't mistype, he just messed with his usual way of doing things. All other games have epilogues which can be used for all charcters.

>>11131793
Did you forget that ZUN was drunk during IN production?

>>11131793
>only has Suwako
SANAE.

>Do you think I would start re-reading all the scripts to find the exact quote from some other game/manga/whatever?
What? You specifically said it was in PCB where Marisa said something like it to Yukari, holy christ stop changing everything you say, I'm not gonna bother arguing with you like this.

>Marisa was both annoyed and angry here.
Good, too bad it doesn't matter a single speck of a bit.

>Usually he tries to be vague as fuck, but this time he fucked up and included the character name
So you're saying that, not only did he actually not mean to show that it was Reimu, but the personality, the shouting, and the fact that the dialogue mentioned in the epilogue just so happens to match the EXACT wording from Reimu A's extra stage scenario was all just LAZINESS? ARE YOU FOR REAL? Not only is that a big, fat, extremely unlikely assumption, but the very fact it could be an assumption doesn't matter because the ''damage'' is done, your assumptions aren't going to change anything by speculating, you know? What's done is done.

>All other games have epilogues which can be used for all charcters.
Where? I have the games but I can't find the epilogues of any of them except SA. The only thing they come with are readme's which involve info on how to run the game and omake where ZUN does a commentary regarding the development and release of the game and how he wants the player to enjoy it.

>>11131793
>But the game script has only Suwako. Or did Reimu scolded Koishi as well?
Obviously the epilogue was referring to the mountain gods, of which Suwako and Sanae are, not that it matters since the meaning is obvious.

Also, Reimu said in-game, ''Hey, _you guys_, tell everyone about it before you start!'' so yes, she was talking to more than one person.

>>11131793
Isn't it MORE lazy to do one single epilogue where a simple word of ''heroine'' is mentioned instead of having to connect the epilogue to the in-game script and clarifying that the true route is Reimu's? I mean, if the other games did have epilogues, then they were also just a singular one, much like SA. So it's not a matter of laziness.

>>11131834
キャラ設定.txt which is where SA's epilogue is (right after Koishi's profile, section is called はた迷惑な謎の神様 = The Troublesome Mystery Gods) is the only one that has an epilogue section. I just checked the other games' and they end at the Extra boss profile.

>>11131834
>SANAE
Eh? She wasn't in cutsence. And what was her fault? Soku explicitly showed that she knows little to nothing about Kanako's and Suwako's plans. You could just agree that Reimu was scolding Koishi.
>doesn't matter a single speck of a bit.
You said that being angry and telling someone to stop is completely out of Marisa's character. Yet Marisa went to stop Yukari in PCB. And Marisa demanded Reimu to stop in IN while being angry and annoyed.
>>11131846
You can use "you guys" even when you're speaking with a single person. But you can't use "confronted them" when there was only a single person.
To be hones both our arguments are based on translation and worth nothing.
>>11131891
Why do you people address to a single word instead of the point being made? Replace epilogue with prologue or extra stage story, They all are either different for each character (yet they never contradict each other) or suits any route.

>>11130968
Yeah but that's because Reimu is secretly racist against Youkai.

>>11131928
(continued)
Also, still no proof that it was Reimu who defeated Okuu (even if she indeed went to the Blazing Hell). ZUN intentionally leaves everything vague. I will accept ReimuA as "canon" for now (it's not like it changes anything), but I will just laugh at you when one day ZUN will just retcon SA.
He likes to forget or change things. So now ReimuA is canon? Cool, that means Orin lived for fucking half a year in the shrine with Reimu, can't wait to see her in the manga! Oh wait...

Going to sleep, good night guys.

>>11131928
>She wasn't in cutsence
Yeah she was, since, you know, YOU FIGHT HER.

>Yet Marisa went to stop Yukari in PCB
Where she wasn't angry at all, for the 50th time.
>And Marisa demanded Reimu to stop in IN while being angry and annoyed.
She wasn't angry, she was at best suspicious that Reimu and Yukari were doing something. But more importantly, she didn't say ''you should tell everyone about your experiments next time!'' which is what you originally said. But again, not that it matters since the issue of the ''laziness'' has been disproven...many times at that, not to mention it's just an assumption done by a fan of extreme straw grasping.

>Why do you people address to a single word instead of the point being made?
What are you talking about? We're talking about epilogues, which is the story after the extra stage. Only SA has it, none of the other games have it.

> Replace epilogue with prologue or extra stage story,
What the shit are you smoking? That's the prologue, i.e: the OPPOSITE of an epilogue, that's the story prior to the extra stage, we're talking about the story AFTER the extra stage which you said that every game had one and addressed heroines anonymously, which was nothing but a big fat lie since they don't even have epilogues.

>They all are either different for each character
WHAT.

There's only one extra prologue in every game, which involves all of the characters, it does the same job as the prologue in that it gives reasons to the characters.

>>11131960
You do know very well this whole thing was just you making a big ass assumption about ZUN being lazy and that ''he didn't really mean to do that!''. Not only was that just wrong from the beginning, as assumptions are meaningless, but you were disproven constantly and you even spouted lies like other games having epilogues as well as twisting your own words in a desperate attempt to defend yourself when you were proven wrong. Even when the most blatant and clear pieces of evidence were shown like Reimu's extra dialogue being exactly the same as the epilogue's, you still doubted and went off the STILL claim that Marisa beat Koishi and then left just like that for no reason, that mere assumption alone just proves batshit desperate you are. In other words:

nigga u cant argue for shit

Anyway...

>>11131067
Hard question. They each suit her in different situations and ways.
Casket of Stars is weird. Dunno why; might just be so used to Love-colored Master Spark.

>>11131945
This is the wrongest post I've seen on this site.

It's like, normally two opposites would make a right, but in this case you somehow manage to put two opposites and STILL be wrong in the ending result. An absolute wrong.

Anyway...

>>11131067
Hard question. They each suit her in different situations and ways.
Casket of Stars is weird. Dunno why; might just be so used to Love-colored Master Spark.

>>11131959
>She wasn't angry, she was at best suspicious that Reimu and Yukari were doing something. But more importantly, she didn't say ''you should tell everyone about your experiments next time!'' which is what you originally said.
I think, I'll reply to this before going to bed.
You are retarded.
Like truly retarded.
Does that mean it's out of character for Marisa to say "It's a good weather today" since she never said that word-in-word in the game/manga?
>There's only one extra prologue
Replace epilogue with PROLOGUE or extra prologue. How is it to be retarded?
>>11131978
The last few posts you don't even try to prove anything. I had to repeat my arguments 2-3 times before you even notice them. I said epilogues instead of prologues? OK, you said that in your fucking first post too >>11131372. But when I made the same mistake you had to dedicate 2 posts for it.

Good night for real this time

>>11132019
>Does that mean it's out of character for Marisa to say "It's a good weather today" since she never said that word-in-word in the game/manga?
Can't you read?

I said that the original argument was you saying that Marisa said something akin to ''tell everyone next time''. Yet, the very example you posted turned out to not exist at all, not only that, but Marisa has never said anything like it ever. No, being angry doesn't suddenly compare to her saying something akin to that phrase magically, stop moving the goalpost. The only time she's been angry is when Yukari appeared in her face and she told her to get out because she didn't want her there. But what I've been saying this whole time that you keep ignoring just like nearly every other post's content, is that, IT, DOESN'T, MATTER, because the whole thing about it being a simple matter of ''laziness'' (even though it's the OPPOSITE of laziness as the other games didn't even have an epilogue, contrary to what you said, you lying scum) has been denbunked completely with the Reimu A extra stage dialogue.

>Replace epilogue with PROLOGUE or extra prologue. How is it to be retarded?
Oi oi, are you seriously going to (again) change what you said this entire thread? And no, you can't replace Epilogues with prologues because ZUN had never done epilogues before. This whole time you've been saying that he didn't point out names in the other games' epilogues, what happened to that huh?

>>11132019
>I said epilogues instead of prologues?
But that's the whole point that we were discussing, we weren't discussing prologues, like, AT ALL. You said, not once, but the whole fucking thread, about how the other games prologues had ZUN not mentioning any names, and now you think you can just tell me to swap words and claim it works out just as well? NO IT DOESN'T. AT ALL. The SA epilogue proves that Reimu's route is canon, not only that, but your whole assumption, and the basis of this whole fucking mess, is broken down because the other games never had an epilogue, therefore your assumption couldn't even EXIST.

A question you ignored (out of many): why are you so obsessed with thinking that Marisa did the routes when all the evidence points otherwise?

>>11132101
>about how the other games prologues
*other games' epilogues

>>11131367
Somebody would care.
And that somebody would probably kill whoever hurt Marisa.

>>11132196
Non-existent beings can't kill.

Not to mention whatever kills Marisa would surely be stronger than Mima at this point.

>>11132204
Hahaha, very funny.
Go read Curiosities of Lotus Asia, and then come back when you stop being a faggot.

Also, if it were a youkai, then now matter how strong it was, Mima would be able to destroy it by possessing it, since she's an evil spirit. (See SoPM)

>>11132251
>Go read Curiosities of Lotus Asia, and then come back when you stop being a faggot.
What about it?

>youkai
The Watatsukis were about to murder Marisa, they weren't youkais, there's no way in HELL that Mima could even scratch them.

She also didn't seem to give a shit when Marisa was in the above near-death situation or the countless times she's been beaten up. She even let her fight Reimu in TH02 without care and then didn't even bother mentioning her again after that.

>>11132277
The Watatsukis didn't murder her, though. And no one, not even Reimu with all her mary-sue powers, can out-sue the Watat-sue-kis.

And pain is a good teacher.

Arguing about what's canon and what's not in touhou seems rather pointless as Zun's future works have habits of only vaguely referring to past events as well as being ambiguous in most things.

For me it seems Koishi was more likely to be beaten by Marisa at least since HM implies they are closer in general to the point where Koishi is fighting Marisa in her ending and the fact Marisa even recognizes who and what Koishi is. That and Marisa has a whole detailed section about Koishi's danmaku in her Grimoire. Marisa even visits the Palace of Earth Spirits in her route in HM.

However, none of that is set in stone. All of it can easily be contradicted in the future by ZUN. The thing about the prologues and epilogues of the games is that they're vague. Even the line about Yukari promising to only send Reimu doesn't suddenly mean Marisa can't go of her own accord. Nor the fact other youkai might go behind Yukari's back and use Marisa. In the extra epilogue, it implies that both Marisa and Reimu went to investigate. The epilogue which literally outright says Reimu was sent underground isn't contradicting of Marisa going down there as well or Marisa fighting Koishi. In SoPM it is very clearly indicated that Marisa also went down there.

Nothing is truly known until it's happened, but in the case of multiple happenings we're confused and ZUN's the only true arbiter of which one's canon. However, he's vague, we don't have proper sources on his interviews, and ZUN can easily change everything if he wants to, like with the PC98 to Windows transition.

All the events are connected in vague ways. It makes it practically impossible to figure out what's true with the information given. That's what makes fanwork of touhou so popular. It's easy to work with since it's so nebulous.

>>11132321

>The Watatsukis

Fuck them, I wish they were in one of the games so I could kick their fucking asses over and over again.

>>11132321
>>11133824
All of this butt mad over the Watatsukis and everyone seems to forget Tenshi beating the absolute stuffing out of everyone after going "Yawwwn. I better start trying now." At least in SSiB, Reimu and friends were the bad guys. Tenshi was the bad guy and she still comes around and spanks everyone, minus Reisen for some reason.

>>11133944
Tenshi and Reisen are also from the moon so no surprise there.

>>11133961
Tenshi is from heaven.

Reisen the Roof is from the moon.

>>11133964
Tenshi is actually from the moon. Just look at her hat and tell me what you see.

>>11133981
They have butts in heaven too, you know.

>>11131067
Witches' Ball
kinda lewd for a song title

>>11133944
Why do people act like this is something special? Every single character in the fighting games does this. Once you play as them they will obviously not lose. It's Tenko's route. Of course she is going to win now. Why would that be in any way special?

Wow, i didn't expect a council of Constantinople here. What's next? The Great Schism of Touhou?

Good work anon. This time it took nearly half the thread to realize that all these posts were from the same person

>>11130956
This

>>11134038
I'm not him, but I only got one third of the posts. It's easier that way. Every thread in /jp/ is between two, three persons at most, and with experience you can tell if you're speaking to the first or the second.

>>11131086
>Reimu is the one that went to complain to Kanako

I see I'm way too late to the party, but this apparently needs to be repeated over and over until everyone gets it. SA extra epilogue:

>ただ、地底に行かされた霊夢達は
>霊夢達
>達

TACHI. Reimu fucking tachi. You know what it means? It means "people who were made to go underground, including but not limited to Reimu".

It's explicitly plural, and it's therefore an explicit statement that Reimu was not the only person who was made to go underground, and not the only person who bitched to Kanako. And the only other person we know of who went underground during the events of SA is Marisa.

>>11134020
Oh, did you forget the part where she goes on about not even trying the first time around and how nobody even hurt her anyways?

>>11134748
That's what everyone is doing. Nobody is apparently trying if you fight against them and once you play as them they suddenly are. Nobody is obviuosly hurt either, otherwise they would be out of the story.

She was FUCKED by her DAD op!