/jp/ - Otaku Culture

I wanna fuq a Hatate

Ah, the eternal struggle of localization and translation.
I personally think it would be fine to unlocalize since it goes with the original intent of the original creator which is the goal in localization: To transmit that original intent in a fluid way that doesn't feel awkward to the reader/viewer in the target language.

But one must not look too much into what the original intent would have been because you get stuff like [commie] translating Kyojin as some obscure middle english word because they felt Titan was just a result of engrish. And like Blame! it should be left as if. But I digress.

Both of the instances should respect the original interpretation.

>>10816765
Neither instance should should the original intepretation or respect anything because we live in a lawless world. Fuck language and fuck translation and fuck you too

>>10816808

>>10816760
>the eternal struggle of localization and translation

It's exactly the kind of hypothetical scenario that the localization crews like to use to justify fucking up translations of the 99% of Japanese media that's about Japanese people speaking Japanese.

>>10816808
Watch out! This guy is on the edge!

>>10816686

You're writing for an audience who knows it's a Japanese game for the Japanese.

Keep it how the writers left it; unless you have the skill to do a localization on par with Mitsuru.

>>10816686
I don't understand. If the Japanese localised a western game, then why would we then re-localise the Japanese game? Wouldn't we already have the original non-localised western game?

>>10816904
Read more carefully. They localized a Western character.

>>10816913
If they localised something, then that implies there is an original. In which case we would just use the original?

If the OP is meaning they created a French character, and then made him speak in a Japanese dialect, that would be absolutely silly, and would make me question why they made the character have the setting of being French in the first place.

If neither of those two situations is what the OP is meaning, then I have no idea what he means.

>>10816927
Maybe it's a nominally international setting and you have some guy who's obviously French. Or it's set in a Swiss boarding school full of beautiful Western bishounen. I dunno, I don't make these scenarios.

>>10816927
>Game company creates a game with a foreign character (Kud, anyone? Why is a half-Russian speaking English again?).
>The character speaks French, but the dev's don't expect the audience to know much french.
>The devs, being silly, put him/her in anyways, using a local dialect to represent the character's unusual speech.
>Translator, bringing it into English, wants to know if it's ok to put the character's speech in french in the English version.

That appears to be what's going on here.

>>10816990
Pretty sure they'd just give him a fucking French accent and call it a day.

>>10816990
>Game company creates a game with a foreign character (Kud, anyone? Why is a half-Russian speaking English again?).
>The character speaks French, but the dev's don't expect the audience to know much french.
>The devs, being silly, put him/her in anyways, using a local dialect to represent the character's unusual speech.
But Kudo already speaks Russian at times, and it is not like she has some strange Japanese dialect to indicate that she is speaking differently, so your example makes no sense. I have never seen a situation similar to what you are describing.
If the original had a French character speaking a Japanese dialect instead of French, then the localisation would probably be better off having the French character speaking with a southern accent, because it would make equal amounts of sense.

>>10816999
If so, where's Kud's Russian accent?

>>10817020
They have her speaking English for the most part, instead of Russian. Why have her speak English at all, when of any foreign languages, she should natively know Russian?

>>10817029
I'm confused. You realise Kudo does't understand English (they make a point of mentioning this in the VN), and that she is part Japanese and it is explained why she knows Japanese, right?

>>10816927
>If the OP is meaning they created a French character, and then made him speak in a Japanese dialect, that would be absolutely silly, and would make me question why they made the character have the setting of being French in the first place.

They do this all the time, similar to how Western cartoons create, say, Japanese stereotypes even though they wouldn't speak English.

ARR ME MATEYS

>>10817036

Yes, she is fluent in Japanese because of her grandfather.

Yes, although she is terrible with English, she still uses it excessively. Why not Russian, her native language? Why did the writers choose to have her spam English, instead of her native one?

>>10817060
No they don't. If they have a French character that speaks Japanese, they make a point of mentioning how the character understands it/is fluent/etc. Otherwise they would have the character speak broken Japanese, or with a very heavy gaijin accent, like that girl in Sketchbook. I've never seen a French character introduced, and then have them speak Fukuoka-ben or something. That would be silly.

>>10817076
>Yes, although she is terrible with English, she still uses it excessively. Why not Russian, her native language?
How is that related at all to the discussion at hand? The point is she is fluent in the language spoken in the country she is, she doesn't speak with some weird dialect, and it is explained why she is fluent, so using her as an example of what the OP is describing is a pretty poor example.

>>10816927
Something that you need to understand is that, up until a century or two ago, the Japanese were very primitive. They were still hitting each other with metal sticks for control of land, while us Western Europeans had millennia of linguistic and cultural development behind our backs.

So basically a lot of Japanese stories have to rip off Western storytelling. Which is fine, good for them. But whereas we have certain archetypes that work in the English language, they often have to "convert" them for Japanese audiences. Their dwarves don't speak Scottish and their pirates don't say "aaargh me hearties!" because they're really OUR dwarves and pirates that they stole. So they'll try to shoehorn in, say, a Gifu accent because that's a mountainous region (dwarves lol) or Okinawa because they have lots of seaports (yay pirates).

Honestly I think the Japanese should not be allowed to steal our culture. By speaking their own language, they're basically simplifying and parodying our centuries of work, which is offensive and frankly pretty fucking racist. Imagine I made a film where some people with slanty eyes ran around shouting "I AM JAPANESE!!!! I HIT YOU WITH SWORD!!!! YOU NOT RUCKY, YOU NOT ESCAPE!!!!"

It's sad to think that a country who lost in one of the biggest wars ever and who are prized for their humility are so stupid as to insult Westerners this way. If my country lost against the Axis forces, I'd be as humble as possible and try not to offend them. It's really fucking bizarre that they can do shit like this and nobody bats a fucking eyelid. You lost. You are lesser people. You are not manly men. We're not going to rub it it, but show some common fucking sense towards the people who beat you.

>>10817087

It is related to this:

>If the OP is meaning they created a French character, and then made him speak in a Japanese dialect, that would be absolutely silly, and would make me question why they made the character have the setting of being French in the first place.

They have introduced a Russian character that, while fluent in Japanese, speaks broken English. Why introduce the English element at all? Why not have her revert to her native language instead?

The creators of the game may have had a good reason to localize their French character (for example, the use of a language that the audience may not be familiar with, even in a broken form). Only they will know what that is (unless OP is willing to identify the source), but that doesn't mean it didn't happen or doesn't have a reason.

>>10817110
To the Japanese there are two languages:
Glorious Japanese master race.
Pig disgusting elsewhere English peasant race.

They're a very nationalist country. It's like how a lot of "patriotic" Americans think everyone should speak English.

>>10817110
>It is related to this:
No it is not, because Kudo doesn't speak any dialect to indicate she has an accent.

>>10817099
>Their dwarves don't speak Scottish and their pirates don't say "aaargh me hearties!" because they're really OUR dwarves and pirates that they stole. So they'll try to shoehorn in, say, a Gifu accent because that's a mountainous region (dwarves lol) or Okinawa because they have lots of seaports (yay pirates).
But, but, that's basically what we did as well. Pirates speak in a West Country accent for no reason other than that Robert Newton, lead actor in the 1950 film Treasure Island, had that accent. Up until 1950 pirates had no such accent, and even post-1950 it makes no sense whatsoever.

>>10817122
Everyone SHOULD speak english.

>>10817139
Her 'dialect' is broken English.

Why does she speak English at all? To put it in a manner similar to your question:

If KEY is meaning they created a Russian character, and then made her speak in broken English, that would be absolutely silly, and would make me question why they made the character have the setting of being Russian in the first place.

>>10817151
Er, no, she speaks perfectly fine Japanese. She once in a while adds in some English (which is not uncommon in Japanese) to be cute. Saying her dialect is "broken English" or implying that she speaks mainly that, is silly, and makes me think you never even read it.
Key created a Russian-Japanese character, and had her speak fluent Japanese. Sounds good to me.

>>10817144
And that's our culture/language. Japan has plenty of its own archetypes, particular in their drama/comedies, and we don't attempt to steal them, let alone pass them off as ours.

>>10817182

Yes, they have created a Russian-Japanese character.

So, where does the English come from?

>>10817209
They take English classes in school d00d

>>10817209
>So, where does the English come from?
How is that relevant, is what I am asking you. The thread is about localising western characters into having a Japanese dialect to represent that they speak with an accent. I said it would be silly if a Japanese company made a Frenchman, simply to then localise him after the fact as though he was Japanese. Kudo speaking broken English now and again has absolutely nothing to do with this, as she was never localised.

maybe op means like turning cecilia's keigo in infinite stratos back into britbong speak.

>>10817193
>Japan has plenty of its own archetypes, particular in their drama/comedies, and we don't attempt to steal them, let alone pass them off as ours.
Last I checked, ninjas and samurai are pretty popular here.

>>10817209
VN stupidity at it's best.

>>10817209
>where does the English come from?
England.

>>10816838
I've met a real person who flapped his hands a lot and tried always to be creative. He was: he studied linguistics in university and never insulted anyone.

He had no need to be mean because he had studied and understood the ethical axioms behind nice behavior. He adhered to them unconditionally and when life occasionally got too heavy for him, he simply retreated for a while.

He drew so much cruelty to himself that I don't think he was pretending. I'm not entirely sure, though. He seemed so smart that he could have just pulled it off.

>>10817232

Because KEY made Kud fluent in Japanese so the target audience could understand her. Plot wise, there's no reason she has to be Russian her mom could've simply been working with the rebels, she didn't need to be from the nation. They already had enough convenient plot devices allowing her to speak Japanese, they could just as easily had her be a Japanese native.

Similarly, the devs of whatever game OP is talking about had their character speak Japanese, likely to make sure their audience could understand them.
Even if there is an 'original source' it doesn't mean that it has anything to do with the game. For example, Sengoku Rance and the Sengoku period of Japanese history. This may be a derivative work for all we know, but the devs wanted to keep some of that culture while presenting it in a way the audience could understand.

Another example if Kud isn't clear. Played Post-mortem? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_Mortem_%28video_game%29))

The MC is an American, living in France. While everyone in the game is speaking French the entire time, everything (signs, posters, text, etc) is in the native language of the player. Why did they do this? So the player could understand the game and play it.

So, why make MC an American at all? Or, if you are familiar with the first game, why did he go to Paris? Why not Brittain, where they all speak English? What is the point of having him as an American if everything is French, or why put him in France if everything is in English?

Why are you people so annoying? Can't wait until China and India develop economically and eventually start world war 3 against you fuckers.

If all things are equal, it will eventually just be a war of numbers, and statistically speaking, there will be tens of geniuses on their side for every one of your geniuses, therefore, very quickly, you will all be eclipsed technologically. The same can be said culturally, as they will eventually out produce you after the increased standard of living allows the people there to waste their time on things creating luxury things like video games and etc.

Then they'll act as if they are the people behind all the great things that exist.

Discussion.

bump

>Ah, the eternal struggle of localization and translation.
What a faggot way to speak.

Localisation had always been a proof that the translator was shitty.

Furthermore, it's deontologicaly wrong.
On top of that: If you want something to be "local" why would you consume something that is exotic anyway, you raging faggot?

There was never any debate as far as to-the-point translation is concerned.
Fansubs and fan translation trying to be "professional" and having their little "debates" are a riot.
And you, are a massive faggot.

>[commie] translating
>[commie]
>translating

If you still need subs you should get the hell out of /jp/ because your new is showing.
Though /jp/ turned into such a shitty board as a result of being on 4chan that frankly, it's already too late to even care; but I just couldn't let a raging faggot like you go un-analblasted.

>>10820440
>What a faggot way to speak.
That's just another way of saying "literal" and "liberal" translations. Or "dynamic" and "formal equivalence" (not him, by the way).

As for OP's question, the devs' intention was making the character sound foreign enough but still staying understandable for the target audience. They just chose a retarded way of doing it, and it doesn't mean that the translation must do it the same way (let alone being twice as retarded by bringing that retardation over here).
Look for a French people trying to speak English and copy their mistakes or take a shortcut and just insert French word instead of English here and there.