/jp/ - Otaku Culture

some of you here have some real issues, that can all be easily solved with a little meditation

a problem is people worrying about numbers instead of worrying about if theyre actually learning anything, you know deep down if youre learning, worrying is mental energy and to squander it on stats is a misstep, if you are persistent and you have a brain then get out of the way of your success

If you've been in the zone then try to fix what aint broke with meditation. If you're doing shitty then why not test it out? It increases focus and should help you get better sleep, two areas critical for language acquisition. Just like damn near every other argument here it comes down to your situation.

Does anyone else find it ironic that MattvsJapan advises focusing solely on listening but then also shills early listening through anime? Like if you are going for developing a solid phonetic base through listening, doesn't it make more sense to listen to natural, in the moment dialogue from live action rather than heavily exaggerated cartoon talk? Like imagine if someone learning english told you they were immersing with spongebob from the start? You'd tell them they're an idiot, go watch a TV show where people speak like, you know, normal people.

>>20561829
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/file?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0158409&type=printable

I mean if you start looking up lyrics it's the same as reading a book, and if you replay the song it's the same as anki. Fluency through jpop is not possible it is ideal.

Ok I just watched Matt's video on how to do AJATT, and it's fucking retarded. Where does this idea of putting sentences into SRS systems come from? Why would anyone do that to themselves?

guys
Guys
GUYS

What if instead of arguing with each other we encourage each individual to look at both RTK and KKLC and weigh the pros and cons and decides which one works best for their particular learning situation?

>single English keyword isn't a powerful enough prompt to recall a kanji
It's almost like some kanji have enough meaning behind them that you might want multiple keywords.... or maybe even a few items of vocabulary to give some context to remembering them.... Wait, that sounds a lot like KKLC. But didn't Matt shit on KKLC without even looking it at? I'm so confused bros

>>19678625
>>19678668
Honestly if you are spending money on paper books I'd recommend Japanese the Manga Way, a paper copy of Tae Kim, and the first volume of yotsubato. I took four semesters of class with Genki and I don't think it's good, it lets you get caught up on teaching you particular production patterns and then imitating those in exercises rather than naturally understanding why those pieces of grammar work through input and contextual learning. Mary-san is moe though

>>18736766
>>18736873
Doing 20 new words a day is better than getting behind and depressed and missing months of anki, which can happen. I don't understand why you want to spend time on an anonymous posting place boasting about your mental fortitude.

>>18463270
>>18463298
>>18464311
>>18465167
(Watched at 1.5x speed, nothing lost, but here are my thoughts on this). First, good take on the intuitive versus intellectual knowledge. Not sure there's much I can disagree with the video. However, there are a number of problems with "Remembering the Kanji" the book. Now, those problems are almost all solved with solutions provided by the online community that are fans of RTK.

1. Even though frequency order is a bad way to learn in bulk, using frequency to get a group of items to learn is efficient. This was discussed years ago (and proved popular) with RTK in regards to JLPT kanji (RTK Lite and RTK Super Lite). It's also been done with actual frequency or other useful groupings. My personal favorite being 2001.Kanji.Odyssey index as it leads to more efficient vocabulary acquisition later.

2. While we fully expect to know 2000+ kanji used in 10,000+ words on the road to fluency/literacy, there can be detriment to frontloading 2000 kanji's meanings in this path. It can and does work. It can also work with spreading them out in discrete chunks of 500 kanji (taught in RTK order) mixed with 1000 to 2000 vocabulary (taught in 2k1KO order) that use those kanji. 500 kanji is about 35 hours of study and 1000 vocabulary is about 50 hours.

3. As RTK3 shows, it's fine to treat a primitive as a primitive even if it actually is an existing Kanji (jouyou or not). As the video mentions, applying a new meaning on an existing item is easy to do. So, don't bother learning that "glue gun" means measurement. Later, when you learn the kanji (and hopefully words using it), it's not a stretch to say "Hey, this is also a kanji with this meaning". From a personal level, when doing keyword to kanji reviews, I found I needed to include the primitive name for some kanji because I ran into the symbol as a primitive so, so much more than as a kanji by itself.

4. It's possible after 1000 kanji and 2000 vocabulary learned in a structured manner that a person has enough training in the process to learn kanji and vocabulary to memorize them as they come up in context of vocabulary/sentence mining. Sure, at this point there's benefit for continued structured study, but having an option is great as well for some students. At that point, just learning the remaining primitives in bulk may be necessary to expedite the process.

5. The unique keyword is a byproduct of paper flashcards. However, it's a solved problem. First, one can add additional meanings for that kanji after the keyword on the question side. Second, for similar kanji, you can say "Not 己" after ONESELF to remove distractors. Third, you can also add actual Japanese words that use that kanji (even better, replace the keyword with the Japanese words). Replacing ONESELF with じーじぶん、じどうしゃ、じてんしゃ as you learned those words would be a goal just as not needing the story was an early goal.

6. I haven't used KKLC or Wanikani, however the video's critiques seem to line up with what I saw would be problems with them. However, spending 30+ minutes on RTK versus what seemed to be 2 minutes each on the other two systems suggests that guy should have chosen a different title.

7. RTK is not learning Kanji with respect to Japanese. The video even says that RTK is offering a subset of kanji learning (writing, recognition, very basic meaning). The other part of learning Kanji is then picked up in when they're learned in vocabulary (I assume you don't subscribe to RTK2's systematic onyomi learning). Without that last part, RTK is only a parlor or bar trick. Stressing this point has helped stave off RTK haters when I defend the system in the learning Japanese pipeline.

>>9563855
>But if someone did, it could have legs.

Son, those are gonna be the days Jesus comes back.

Just you wait.