/jp/ - Otaku Culture

>>45782371
a few things to keep in mind:
1. a lot of grammar is in jmdict because a lot of grammar is just a word
2. there is a dojg yomichan dict
3. there is https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/
4. there is google

>>42169678
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/advanced%E3%81%82%E3%82%8B%E3%81%84%E3%81%AF.html

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/16.htm

>>41793278
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/basic%E3%82%88%E3%81%86%E3%81%AB1.html

https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/basic%E3%82%88%E3%81%86%E3%81%AB2.html

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/913.htm

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/914.htm

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/915.htm

>>41731400
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/advanced%E3%81%A0%E3%81%A3%E3%81%A61.html

https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/advanced%E3%81%A0%E3%81%A3%E3%81%A62.html

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/324.htm

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/325.htm

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/326.htm

>>33083381
when u suck major ass u can also look up grammar and shit u dont understand on dojg or hjgp too but yeah, u get better at japanese through input

>>26649232
kana -> core deck + tae kim -> reading -> watching
tools along the way like yomichan, google, dojg/hjgp

>>24560856
everyone isn't wrong

there are resources made by people who are native speakers and have studied their own language academically (genki, vjg, dojg, hjgp), use those

obv. you can't learn grammar from a book, you're gonna have to actually get out there and read and listen to stuff
but it's better to use these than to use resources by jsls like tae kim and dolly who have no idea what they're talking about and just make shit up

>>24500179
i havent looked at dojg or hjgp in months at this point. there are still sentences i dont get sometimes but im too lazy to try to understand why since ive improved without doing that so far anyways

>>24372397
you need to prioritize reading, watching and listening to japanese content over all that other shit. it should be the vast majority of what you're doing. limit yourself to 15-20 minutes of anki per day and look up grammar as you encounter it on dojg or hjgp. none of the other shit you are doing will make you better at reading, only reading can do that. so if your goal is to be able to read better shit you just have to endure sucking ass for the next 6+ months and having to look up a bunch of words.

reminder that hjgp > dojg

>>23829816
>mining tae kim
don't do this

>or should i immerse with shit i dont understand for 5 hours a day
if you're actually making an effort to understand what you're reading by looking up words and referencing hjgp or dojg then yes
if you mean 5 hours of passive "listening" then you may as well not waste your time

>>23814283
One manga chapter is virtually nothing; you should be aiming to read a lot more than that. If you don't find reading manga fun, consume something else instead that you feel more compelled to spend your time on.

Contrary to what the Krashen cultists here will say, studying grammar isn't completely worthless, but there isn't really any good reason to recommend Imabi. If you want something to refresh and reinforce the contents of Tae Kim, VJG is a good resource. If you're looking for something more comprehensive, you want either the DoJG Anki deck or HJGP Anki deck. DoJG goes into a lot more technical detail, whereas HJGP is more simple and concise while covering more grammar.

In any case, it's worth keeping in mind that the bulk of what you truly learn and internalize will come from your input, so that should be your focus. If you can only spend time on either grammar or input, the choice should always be input.

>>23352436
hjgp far outclasses dojg. the explanations are so much better.

>>23352397
if prefer hjgp personally to dojg

https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/

but bother are fine for that purpose ye

>>23225682
once you have a basic vocabulary down and you've read through a beginner grammar guide, you should be in as good of a position as you ever really will be to make your foray into real native content.

you will feel very much out of your depth and comfort zone at first, and it will be very difficult, but the more japanese you read and listen to, the more your brain will come to understand japanese. it might sound like magic, but that is really how acquisition works.

it doesn't hurt to go back and reference grammar explanations via your beginner guide, e.g. tae kim or boiro, or via more comprehensive guides, such as hjgp or dojg, but you should've ideally left those behind after the first few months

reading and listening in the beginning sucks
but reading and listening is the only way to learn japanese and as you stick at it things will get better
頑張って

>>23055419
op guide has a lot of dumb shit in it

basically:
>1. learn kana
don't worry about being perfect. using the kana drill tool on the itazuraneko site is the most efficient way of learning fast, but a little writing doesn't hurt. try to finish within 1 week.

>2. learn radicals
same as above, but use the kangxi radical deck. this is to stop kanji looking a confusing mess of random lines. try to finish within 2 weeks.

>3. read/watch a beginner-oriented grammar guide
sakubi, boiro and tae kim are the best options since you can read them with the help of nazeka or yomichan. pick *****one*****, read it *****once*****, then use it as a reference going forward when you don't understand something (hjgp and dojg are both useful for *****refrencing***** too).

>4a. begin reading and listening to native materials made by and for adult native speakers
this is hard as shit in the beginning but if you stick at it your brain will gradually figure things out and it will get easier. spend as much time on this per day as you can manage.

>>21884529
So what, that other guy can do it but not me?

Here you go then:
https://youtu.be/k0kU2cc85ZA?list=PLB3F2C5D8B5F81F34
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/vjg.html

>>21884535
It's not really.

Let's Learn Japanese Basic I is fun to watch and teaches you the very basics in an easy to understand and memorable way. It's a great resource to start out with.
But because it only covers the very basics, you then follow it up with Visualizing Japanese Grammar to fill in the blanks. VJG's explanations are excellent (much better than you'll find anywhere else without cracking open some dry, boring tome like DoJG or HJGP) and it comes with visual demonstrations too to make everything more comprehensible.

I honestly think this is one of the best ways to make your start. I read Tae Kim before trying both of these things and I just found every page to be pure torture. His explanations are just so confusing, and the guide is full of misleading information and dumb, opinionated rants which just serve to confuse people even more. I really struggle to understand how anyone who has actually used Tae Kim can recommend it unless they've literally tried nothing else and don't understand just how bad it is.

Commence shitstorm.

>>21416231
You Will
even if you dont understand it every single time it's ok its not even a big deal the thing about learning a brand new language is that you won't/CANT understand everything especially not within the first few years
have you tried checking out dojg and hjgp to see if their explanations help you more than whatever other stuff youve been checking out?

>>21343211
why would you use dojg when hjgp exists?

>>21293279
itd help to read something like tae kim fast or watch some dolly videos or whatever you prefer
but dont expect to actually remember much without a bunch of exposure to it in real japanese
you can always google shit you dont remember or havent seen before or use dojg or hjgp or something

>>21292926
>people still using DoJG when HJGP exists

>>21236413
Just delete the warning and skim these:
https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/932.htm
https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/933.htm
https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/933.htm
https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/entries/936.htm

https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/intermediate%E3%82%8F%E3%81%91%E3%81%A0.html
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/intermediate%E3%82%8F%E3%81%91%E3%81%A7%E3%81%AF%E3%81%AA%E3%81%84.html
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/basic%E3%82%8F%E3%81%91%E3%81%A0.html
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/intermediate%E3%82%8F%E3%81%91%E3%81%8C%E3%81%AA%E3%81%84.html
https://itazuraneko.neocities.org/grammar/dojg/dojgpages/intermediate%E3%82%8F%E3%81%91%E3%81%AB%E3%81%AF%E3%81%84%E3%81%8B%E3%81%AA%E3%81%84.html

>>21235214
>write sentences with said entry to cement the knowledge.
I've literally never seen a single person recommend this before.

Also, the Anki deck still has mistakes in it and whoever made it has long since given up on fixing them so I wouldn't touch that with a barge pole.

There is absolutely no reason for anyone to read DOJG back to back, and it was never produced with the intention of being used that way, so the grammar points and example sentences don't follow any sort of logical progression from simple (私はゲイです。) to complex which is the only thing that could make treating the DOJG as a grammar guide anything less than full retard.

It's a grammar DICTIONARY, and that's how it's supposed to be used (HJGP is better though so even in this case there's no reason to use DOJG).

>>21026693
Swap "guides" for "referencing dojg/hjgp" and you've got it dude. When I encounter new shit in the wild, I don't obsess over it, but then later I'll be flipping through a grammar dictionary and be like "oh, so THAT'S what that meant. that's how it worked, huh." Everything you do solidifies everything else.