[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/ic/ - Artwork/Critique


View post   

File: 33 KB, 684x540, 1609447509372.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7139171 No.7139171 [Reply] [Original]

Is it possible to make a living as an indie comic artist in this day and age?

>> No.7139174
File: 77 KB, 1100x1333, Ed Piskor.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7139174

>>7139171
Yes. Just don't let the haters murder you.

>> No.7139177
File: 81 KB, 885x500, sadd.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7139177

>>7139174
Don't remind me.

>> No.7139179

>>7139174
>gets accused
>"i must prove my innocence by killing myself"
What's crazy is that it kind of worked, the accusations went away and everyone all of a sudden became his biggest supporter.

>> No.7139196

>>7139171
Of course it's possible, plenty do.
But it takes years and years of just building an audience, and that's after the years and years of improving to the point where you're making anything people would offer money for. It's not something you can just start doing and support yourself within a year with.

>> No.7139251

>>7139179
Because when you're just accusing him, it doesn't matter - sure he loses deals and gets upset, but you can ignore that because it seems like it nothing really happened. However when he kills himself because of the accusations, and those lost deals, and he outright says it was the accusers who killed him, well now you think twice about it, because something in the world has actually changed in the worst way possible.
It's putting their 'internet drama' into perspective and showing them they were really hurting someone.

I hope his accusers truly feel like shit, and it hangs over their heads for the rest of their days.

>> No.7139252

>>7139171
Isn't the average 'indie', or rather, the average graphic-novel, doing better than the comics by the big two? Particularly graphic novels made made for kids (a market the big two practically abandoned), apparently they're doing very well.

>> No.7139371

>>7139252
Only published kids books are doing well, not indie kids books. Indie kids books do about as well as other indie books.

>> No.7139372
File: 170 KB, 998x1200, Watcher Funko.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7139372

>>7139174
the rap fan from kayfabe? damn...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DVVMoxApE8

>> No.7139376

>>7139251
they don't give a fuck

>> No.7139378

>>7139252
that's because you only see semi-successful indies in the first place, whereas everything by dc/marvel is in plain sight

>> No.7139403

>>7139378
I believe indie/graphic novels are doing as well as ever, and it's only DC and Marvel (and those of their ilk) that are falling on hard times from being irredeemably stupid.
Though do correct me if their market share has shrunk as well.

>> No.7139406

>>7139403
well manga is doing business.

>> No.7139415

>>7139403
depends on your definition of indie and graphic novel
if we're talking about comics in general, last I checked, manga took almost half the western market with dc/marvel taking over half of what's left and ~10% of the non-manga market not being taken by a publisher
if your idea of indie is being published by image or dark horse or something, that's not being indie
if you're talking about actual graphic novels and not just using the term to make comics look more mature, again, I have no idea what you're talking about because there's fuck all graphic novels in japan and I highly doubt you have any stats regarding them whatsoever
the reason dc/marvel are struggling is that the older generations who grew up on superheroes are dying off and the comics are extremely hard to get into because they keep being restarted and there's like 30 #1 issues for any big superhero with 5 lines running concurrently
and with capeshit being the face of e]western comics (talking about muttland here), the rest necessarily suffer from its image

>> No.7139418

>>7139415
>by a publisher
*major publisher

>> No.7139421

people dont really read, from what ive seen.

>> No.7139429

>>7139421
everyone keeps saying this, yet I have 10 huge bookstores with multiple floors on the same street of my slavic shithole, all having new shit all the time and none of them running out of business ever

>> No.7139555

Ashley Cope of Unsounded recently got some tumblr asks about it and she vehemently advises against trying in this day and age. She also already had a following before she started the comic and that was a boon.

>> No.7139568

>>7139171
Yes but you have to pander to fujoshis, yumejoshis and yurifags.

>> No.7139571

>>7139568
>you have to pander to fujoshis, yumejoshis and yurifags.
Furries are a viable option too specially if you post your webcomic on webtoons and setup a Patreon for nsfw of your OCs

>> No.7139585

>>7139179
>>7139251
Who are you guys talking about?

>> No.7140222

>>7139171
It's possible but it takes fucking forever and lots of hard work.
You absolutely, genuinely have to love making comics enough to slave away for years with little to no pay and little to no recognition.

>> No.7140226

>>7139568
If you're a straight male don't bother with this (maybe save for yuri)

>> No.7140230

>>7139568
>>7140226
how well does sci-fi dystopic apocalypse stuff sell?

>> No.7140243

>>7140226
>If you're a straight male
Well I'm not straight so lucky me.

>> No.7140246

>>7140230
>how well does sci-fi dystopic apocalypse stuff sell?
Honestly? It's extremely niche so not much.

>> No.7140248

>>7140230
>>7140246
You're better off going the kickstarter trad comic route instead of webcomics when it comes to sci-fi and you have to pander to coomers.

>> No.7140326

>>7140246
even in an era where Black Mirror is one of the top viewed TV shows in the world?

>> No.7140342
File: 141 KB, 1682x892, RCO030.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7140342

>I hear always the admonishment of my friends:
>"Bolt her in, constrain her!"
>But who will guard the guardians?

>> No.7140502
File: 34 KB, 625x344, sub-buzz-3132-1712415064-1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7140502

>>7139585
Ed Piskor, creator of Hip-Hop Family Tree and Red Room. He was accused of being vaguely "creepy" by a girl on Instagram, the crowd that is obsessed with cancelling creators that actually make shit and are productive dogpiled, and overnight Ed lost a publishing deal for his new series and a gallery show was "indefinitely postponed", and local news doxxed him and his parent's house. He offed himself.

>> No.7140550
File: 198 KB, 482x427, ohno.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7140550

>>7139174
>>7140502
So that explains the comments on the latest Cartoonist Kayfabe videos.

>> No.7140836

>>7140502
Thanks, anon. Never heard of this before. Kinda similar to what happened to the indie game developer Alec Holowka.

>> No.7140863

>>7139429
take a look at what genres they are, next time. you get biographies, murder mystery, true crime, and romance.
comics used to be these things. but only capeshit is bought because its an 'investment' and locked away in a plastic sleeve in a controlled temp room.

>> No.7140886

>>7139251
>I hope his accusers truly feel like shit, and it hangs over their heads for the rest of their days.
WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE SEXUAL PREDATORS?!

>>7140502
>He was accused of being vaguely "creepy" by a girl on Instagram,
Fuck you. He was accused of a lot more than that.

>>7139585
Ed Piskor was accused of this by MULTIPLE WOMEN, one who just happened to be still in high school at the time. Ed was 38 years old trying to get sex out of a minor. He was wrong for that and even he admitted that. He was an asshole and plenty of people in the industry knew that. In his suicide note he criticized online lynch mobs all while naming a shitton of people who never said anything to him nor bullied him.

He named those people, because he knew that he was guilty and rather than to just apologize and try to learn to be a decent person that doesn't go after minors he decided to kill himself instead. Apparently, not being a scumbag piece of shit was too big of a burden for him to bear. Now everyone is coming after the accusers, too, because, apparently, the life of a coward who likes to sexually proposition minors is more important than the lives of those who get fucked up by older men propositioning them for sex. The irony of all this is that online lynch mobs came for people named in the suicide note AND the accusers so how can he criticize online lynch mobs all while naming out people FOR online lynch mobs to go after?!

Fuck that hypocritical asshole. Clearly, he had mental issues he didn't seek help for and no one is to blame for that, but HIMSELF. He's far from the only comic book creator that people came for, but at least they had the decency to not blame others.

>> No.7140974

>>7140886
Fuck off, Ramon. Work on your art and stop being a terminally online faggot.

>> No.7140982

>>7140886
is there proof?

>> No.7141057

>>7139171
There have been a number of threads about this in the last months, and the answer is always the same: no.
I'll articulate just enough so you can see I'm not shitting on your dreams because I'm a crab: basically, even working in a comic major you have no guarantee it's going to become a stable job, and if you're a freelance trying to pull your own product hoping that's going to pay your balls is literally a lottery, a lottery you have to sacrifice anything outside drawing and promoting your drawings just to buy a fucking ticket
And i mean literally everything: social life, your health, living in a decent house, being able to help your family in the case you had the bad idea of making up one, eating better than a hobo, every single thing that depends on having a regular ass money and social status- things that are easy to brush off if you're 20something but start to weight more and more when you get older
Basically wanting to make comics with no connection, nobody that supports you and average art skills is a guaranteed long term stay in hell. The only kind of person I could recommend it positively is someone completely obsessed with it to the point of mental illness, someone that can't legitimately see themselves do any other job. Someone like that doesn't have doubts about doing it or not, he has no choice
If you're not a fucking psycho op, find yourself a normal job, and draw in your spare time. Don't fuck up your life
If you're absolutely obsessed like me and all these other bitter, self deprecating dumbfuck failures here, then go for it and enjoy your stay in hell

>> No.7141075

>>7140886
>Ed Piskor was accused of this by MULTIPLE WOMEN
The first Molly was the 17 year old who posted the DMs (the DMs! the horror) that could be interpreted any number of ways. Ed admitted it was dumb to DM a 17yo but no harm was done.
The second Molly Ed ACTUALLY HAD A RELATIONSHIP WITH and she claims years later he asked for a blowjob in exchange for his agent's number. She comes across as a jilted lover.
The third ("big titty tiff") is a tattooed model who Ed asked to draw nude, which he proudly admitted to, since that's a long honored artist's tradition.
In all cases nothing illegal was done. Ed's only sin was stupidity.
>so how can he criticize online lynch mobs all while naming out people FOR online lynch mobs to go after?!
Revenge. That's the gypsy curse.

>> No.7141086

>>7139174
That's what you deserve for listening to nigger music and mingling with the normie mafia

>> No.7141088

>>7141075
The lessons of all this are: don't build a public persona if you're not a rich cool white guy, a nigger, a woman or a faggot, and as a fucking outsider geek, don't forget that normalfags don't want you and will fuck you and your fucking corpse.
The real curse is social media, they turned humanity in the worst it's ever been and there is no way to fix it

>> No.7141092
File: 492 KB, 1600x1066, classic_comic_genres.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
7141092

>>7140863
>take a look at what genres they are, next time. you get biographies, murder mystery, true crime, and romance.
>comics used to be these things.
This was key to comics early popularity. Now that mantle has been taken up by manga (which is why despite US comics pandering, manga actually has the more diverse readership).
And some of the best US comics are non-capeshit: Stray Bullets, Love & Rockets, The Goon, Dan Clowes's comics ...
It's a shame capeshit has had a stranglehold on the industry for so long, but as more creators put out different genres that perception should change.

>> No.7141100

>>7141092
Did he ever finish Stray Bullets? Last time I checked on the hiatus was like 13 years ago

>> No.7141108

>>7141088
the real lesson is to not communicate with honey-traps and leave a paper trail The Mob can twist and use against you in the year-of-our-Lord 2024.
Also build a life outside the cursed comic industry. No need to fuck around with art hoes in your 40s.
As for persona and art, the key is to not give a fuck. Robert Crumb drew the most offensive shit imaginable, was an asshole, and never gave a shit about the industry—he fucked off to France where collectors eat his shit up.
Ed cared too much about the US comics industry, and was deeply rooted in it.

>> No.7141110

>>7141100
>Did he ever finish Stray Bullets?
I think the last ones were around 2020.

>> No.7141219

>>7141108
Yeah probably you're more on the right and I'm way too misanthropic, but don't forget that nowadays for certain categories of people turning in a honeytrap is very tempting and very easy.
And caring too much about something is always the proverbial good intentions leading to hell, see the wall of text i typed up there, this guy was the perfect example of the type of person I recommend going for the comics career, simply because he's ready to die for it. If the reason he killed himself is the realization that this bullshit drama would stain his life work and how people perceived it is the reason he offed himself I not only wouldn't be surprised, but I understand him perfectly
>>7141110
Oh ok, gonna check on it

>> No.7141336

>>7141088
Or you could like you know don't dm 17 year olds.

>> No.7141484

>>7141336
That's implied, but I'm saying that if you're a ugly weird nonthreathening white guy there is no fucking way you walk away from that
He absolutely brought this to himself, but it's understandable how someone living his life 20000 fathoms deep into childish stuff and being pretty clearly never a big hit with the opposite sex would find himself into this shitty situation
All he need to dodge these bullets was a bit more self awareness. And anheroing like this clearly demonstrates he didn't have a very strong grip on reality

>> No.7141521

>>7141336
It was fuckin' DMs. You gotta remember Ed grew up in a time when Seinfeld dated a 17 year old and the president fucked an intern half his age and liberals thought it was cool. What Ed did was stupid, but people need some goddamn perspective here.

>> No.7141629

>>7141336
>NOOO the 17 years and 364 days old child!

Top kek, Ameritards.

>> No.7141632

>>7141629
How young is too young to know that you want a nigger to pee on you

>> No.7141633

>>7139171
AI is here. I don't think you could make it

>> No.7141639

>>7140326
>TV show
Don't compare different medium audiences.

>> No.7141709

>>7141521
>Ed grew up in a time when Seinfeld dated a 17 year old and the president fucked an intern half his age and liberals thought it was cool.
Nta, but this is very childish projection. I'm euro, literally one year older than Piskor and I never fucking even considered having private times with a minor, just like most 60 years old know perfectly well that you don't fuck minors. Social norms haven't been created from scratch in the last ten years dude, and it's not really what culture in your teenage years taught you is sexy that makes you decide to lose self control like a horny 18 years old faglet.
All this implying that there was foul play from his part, which probably like always happen in this cases is both yes and no and current year cultural pressure creating a panic cascade of misunderstandings

>> No.7141722

>>7139555
What were her reasonings for advising against it?

>> No.7141724

>>7141336
Do not engage with them in DMs for ANYTHING even if you don’t have bad intentions. Not even if they message you first. Do not follow them or like their posts. It’s weird for an adult to want to talk to teenagers as they are insufferable. Even if you’re some kind of naive chump who genuinely thinks you’re being nice and helpful by being their friend they will find a reason to accuse you of being creepy later.