/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.6941184]

Why do people decide to work in animation despite it being well known that the industry is complete trash? Long hours, shit pay vs high cost of living in the areas they have to work, anything you draw while working there, the studio owns. Sometimes they'll even make you work overtime for free. There's also no actual job security.
It sounds extremely depressing. Why would they want to do that?

[Anonymous No.6941198]

>>6941184
>Why would they want to do that?
animating is fun. put some skill to use. work with other animation fans. work on stuff you like. maybe it wasn't always so trash though.

[Anonymous No.6941210]

I'd kill to have the kind of drive and determination needed to animate

[Anonymous No.6941222]

>>6941184
You think too much

[Anonymous No.6941229]

>>6941222
>>6941198
>Be me
>Dreamt of being a professional animator
>now in late 20s
>still draw like a literal child
>no future
It hurts so much, bros.

[Anonymous No.6941235]

>>6941229
I know it sounds like a cliche and you will probably neck yourself in a few years but in my opinion the life you have lived so far is more meaningful than any of those people who live happily on rail out there. Life is not about making money, it's not even about happiness, it's what you choose to do with your brief time on earth

[Anonymous No.6941236]

>>6941229
>Dreamt
you were supposed to live your dream as a kid making silly flash animations and work your way up so you have 10 years experience by the time you hit 20.

[Anonymous No.6941241]

>>6941236
There's nothing I can do to salvage my life is there? I have an associates in graphic design but have been unable to find entry level jobs in the field. Previous work exp is cashier jobs and 2 weeks in fast food (I can't go back to fast food I flat out went crazy when I worked at mcdonalds and had to spend a day in a mental place). Art is all I have and even then I still suck at it
Everything about my life is a pathetic joke.

[Anonymous No.6941244]

>>6941236
nta, doing this doesn't guarantee success either. Another thread mentioned you have skills to penetrate the animation industry, being good at animation isn't necessarily one of them.

[Anonymous No.6941246]

>>6941244
I'm >>6941229 but at this point I just want to be GOOD. I know I'll never get into the industry, that dream is long dead. But I want to become as good as a pro animator so I can at least justify my existence.

[Anonymous No.6941248]

>>6941236
>>6941229
Hell, even if you never become a "professional" animator, you can still make those silly flash animations now.
Nothings stopping you from making animations and distributing them right now, besides yourself that is.

[Anonymous No.6941251]

>>6941248
I do make animations, the problem is that they suck despite me being near 30.

[Anonymous No.6941256]

You'd make 100x more money animating porn than being in any kind of animation industry

[Anonymous No.6941257]

>>6941251
Why do they suck? Have you read/applied The Animator's Survival Kit?

[Anonymous No.6941261]

>>6941251
It could be worse. You could be 60 and still suck

[Anonymous No.6941264]

>>6941184
Idk it's pretty comfy. It's WFH if you want, most people do but I'm trying to go in a couple days a week. I'm just drawing backgrounds and sorting files out all day listening to YouTube docs or watching cartoons. 9-5 steady paid gig that pays more than my retail job and that's at the bottom rung. As soon as you start to get better and get promoted it gets even comfier.

Everyone in my company has been there for years and of you do have a contract that ends you get unemployment on a higher rate while you look for a new one.

[Anonymous No.6941286]

>>6941246
Its good that you're focusing on your own skill level rather than pinning your self worth on validation from industry weirdos.
I gotta ask why animation tho? Is there a story you want to tell, a game you want to make or do you want a few seconds of sakuga grade work under your name.

Got paid for a few short pieces in the past (independent not industry). I've got a story in mind and I've realized that animation isn't really worth the time investment for me, working on my own, at the quality I'd like I would never finish the project within my lifespan. I'm going to make a comic instead.

Also post your work, its all anonymous and doesn't matter anyway.

[Anonymous No.6941315]

>>6941229
last night I was taking a little break after drawing with a game and I was in this game lobby with a couple of people listening in on them talking while asking me questions about their clan. Then someone says how old everyone was…”9, 12, 13…” the oldest being 18 except for me (29). It was that moment I had an induced midlife crisis. Where have all the people my age have gone? I go on /r9k/ and I see “just turned 21” threads. Am I really that out of place at this point and all of you are below 24?

[Anonymous No.6941319]

>>6941315
Oh and I get absolutely massacred by children in that lobby. I can’t tell you how humiliated and defeated I felt.

[Anonymous No.6941321]

>>6941315
>the game is Splatoon

cmon anon what were you playing don't lie either

[Anonymous No.6941324]

>>6941321
Call of Duty mobile

[Anonymous No.6941325]

>>6941315
I'm 36. I do feel weird about my age at times here.

[Anonymous No.6941328]

>>6941315
I'm 31 if that helps.

[Anonymous No.6941330]

>>6941325
Great. Luckily drawing still retains some level of inner child. I don’t wan to get to 36, still on 4chan and still see “just tuned 21” threads. To be fair, I know CODshit attracts kids like flies but I notice the age thing on this board, too.

[Anonymous No.6941331]

>>6941330
Time flies, last week I was 22.

[Anonymous No.6941332]

>>6941330
People keep bein born, wheel keeps turnin. That's jus how it is. I was shocked when I was working alongside kids who were born after 9/11 in my last job but I got over it. We old now

[Anonymous No.6941333]

>>6941330
I mean I’m still going to be here at 35, 40..until this site shuts down. I guess it’s just user base cycling.
>>6941328
I will join the 30 club in december

[Anonymous No.6941336]

>>6941229
>>6941246
To add on to my pathetic whining. The issue is even bigger because I am behind in EVERYTHING a 29 year old male should be in. I'm scared shitless of driving/cars in general so I don't have a license. I didn't go to community college until 26 and am now about to transfer to a 4 year (I'm not sure for what, I don't think I want to do graphic design).
I still live with my dad. I am a virgin and never had a gf. I don't have irl friends, the one I DID have moved for a job and to start a family with his wife.
I'm trying to improve in art by any means necessary and am considering hiring a mentor to speed up the process. Yeah, I know "it's not a race it's a marathon" but everything else in my life is a failure, I can't afford my one passion to also be for zilch. A goal of mine is to improve enough so I can get accepted into a prestigious animation school.
No. I won't actually go, I'm not going to put myself into 100k debt. I just want to know that my fundamental skills are good enough to be accepted. And yeah, animation schools require portfolios and you HAVE to be good to be accepted. Their acceptance rates are very low.

[Anonymous No.6941342]

>>6941336
You should have gotten your drivers license during the pandemic. They gave you a walkie talkie and let you drive without someone in the car or you could have had your dad in the car with you (like I did). I was a complete utter retard with driving and thought I’d never be able to do it but the pandemic cheat helped me get the license and then I was free to practice by myself with youtube videos until I got it right.

[Anonymous No.6941345]

>>6941342
That sounds pretty cool, anon. I know I need to learn. I've been in shitty wrecks as a passenger and it spooked the fuck out of me since.

[Anonymous No.6941352]

>>6941229
>late 20s
>"my life is over"
I hate you fags because you remind me of myself at your age. Hell, I was thinking my life is over since 20 years old. Self fulfilling prophecy. I'm a 45 year old virgin now and I was schizo mode from 20 to at least 35. Your life isn't over fag, it's never late to start today, just do it.

[Anonymous No.6941362]

>>6941352
nta but there are benchmarks that someone should achieve at a certain age. Trying to catch up in your 30s will be insanely difficult.

[Anonymous No.6941364]

>>6941362
>there are benchmarks that someone should achieve at a certain age
says who? plenty of people marry the wrong person and feel like they are starting over again when they reach 40

[Anonymous No.6941370]

>>6941184
it's a mystery since animation studios don't even focus on producing quality so it's not even a place to push yourself to see what can be done with the medium

[Anonymous No.6941372]

>>6941362
>there are benchmarks that someone should achieve at a certain age
Please don't believe that. I did. Now I'm divorced because I thought that people were "supposed" to get married right after graduating college.
Life doesn't have checkpoints, just enjoy the journey. Some people accomplish a ton when they're kids and it fucks them up, while others achieve success at an older age.

[Anonymous No.6941380]

>>6941372
>success
And some, most actually, will never succeed in anything. And it's fine. The anticipation of success is ending up holding you back. Just do whatever because you enjoy it now. At the end we will end up dead.

[Anonymous No.6941382]

>>6941364
if your developing brain grows deeply rooted neural pathways that don't help you get shit done, it sure is unlikely your now developed brain can get shit done since the deeply rooted structures are foundational parts of the way your mind operates and developing new pathways on top of a loser mind has limits

[Anonymous No.6941390]

>>6941382
sounds very scientific.

[Anonymous No.6941393]

>>6941382
Surely there are drugs to counteract this?

[Anonymous No.6941395]

>>6941393
adderall? cocaine?

[Anonymous No.6941396]

>>6941390
demented people start reverting to their childhood memories because their brain degrades and everything is built on top of the underlying neural pathways from your early life and then you develop on top of that, like a tree where the branch grows more branches

in therapy they aim to tackle your issues by having you develop new pathways to cope with your issues instead of getting rid of the old shit that's causing your issues

[Anonymous No.6941401]

>>6941395
I'm unwilling to do coke. What about antidepressants? I feel like roping constantly and am always tired. I just got health insurance so I could use them

[Anonymous No.6941403]

Doesn’t animation actually pay well outside of East Asia?
I’ve also heard of workers who are able to choose whether to work overtime or not, and they’re still paid for the overtime.

[Anonymous No.6941407]

>>6941401
Zopiclone maybe

[Anonymous No.6941415]

>>6941395
adderall works in the sense that it made me very invested and immersed in what I was doing instead of blindly fumbling around like a monkey and I actually had the drive to depict things with very clear intent and my minds eye wasn't hazy but it often just ends up in ungodly wanking sessions instead of drawing lol

the clarity and attention to detail in my mind was amazing with that shit no denying that

[doodle guy No.6941820]

>>6941315
32 here. Started animating at 30.

[Anonymous No.6941930]

>>6941184
>no actual job security
Then go get a job that isn't creative you absolute dumb fuck this shit has never been 'secure.'

[Anonymous No.6941946]

>>6941930
I see you missed the point of the OP

[Anonymous No.6941951]

>>6941946
I see you can't read between the lines.

[Anonymous No.6941959]

>>6941951
I can't read at all

[Anonymous No.6941960]

>>6941959
It's okay to be retarded

[Anonymous No.6942248]

>>6941184
Because everyone in LA thinks they're going to be a director and it won't always be like that for them

[Anonymous No.6942279]

>>6941820
Did you get any work yet? Im going in the same path of animation

[doodle guy No.6942726]

>>6942279
No. I am just a small YouTuber. Just learning and enjoying making things.

[Anonymous No.6942732]

>>6941256
sounds tricky. not only youd have to know how to animate flesh, youd have to have a keen sense of what is sexy. and how to make sexy move.

[Anonymous No.6943534]

34 here. Been grinding away since 2014. After 10 years and a lot of online 3d courses.. i'll finally have a good reel.

[Anonymous No.6943932]

>>6941229
Why did millions of americans decide to just have their kids sit around and play video games and learn nothing at public school instead of learning how to play an instrument or paint?

[Anonymous No.6943943]

>>6941184
When I see shit like Dead Fantasy, it makes me want to be an animator

[Anonymous No.6943954]

>>6941229
>Be me
>31 years old, married with 3 kids
>Got a decent chunk of money from investments
>Never gave a shit about animating or even drawing, last time I drew anything I was 15
>Decided 2 months ago I'll learn to draw, make a webcomic, probably learn to animate too
>Hard finding the time but draw every day, nights if need be
>Life is good, drawing is fun

[Anonymous No.6943957]

>>6943932
NTA but most American parents unironically resent their children

[Anonymous No.6943963]

>>6941184
I don't know. Half the people I know who worked in animation are trying to bail on it and the other half are shell-shocked husks desperate for their next gig.

[Anonymous No.6944013]

>>6941184
I'll tell you.

Pioneering artists go to college to study animation because they want a job doing what they love.
70% of them don't make it to the end of their degree, after they realize that animation is very stressful.
The 30% that graduate spend YEARS looking for an entry level position, because their degree left them under-qualified.
The small fraction who DO break into the industry spend so long trying to get in, that they're desperate not to leave, no matter how bad things get. Cant let the last 4+ years be a waste, and you need the experience badly, so you'll let a studio walk all over you if it means working.

There are some GREAT things about the animation industry. You get to do what you love every day. And the people you meet, especially coworkers on your level, are fantastic people who are similar to you. You make friends.

People are well aware that animation relies on crunch... But there are other issues nobody talks about.

Nobody talks about how it can take 3 years to find a job, the sudden and unexplained redundancies, and contracts ending in less than a year, leaving you do the entire gut wrenching soul crushing job hunt all over again.
They don't talk about how you can do an excellent job, receive nothing but praise for your work, and lose your job with 48 hours notice because the film ran out of budget.
They don't talk about how leaving the industry is basically starting at 0, because in the past 4-10 years, you picked up basically no transferable skills or useful contacts outside animation.
They don't talk about having absolutely no job security.

The thing is, if you told me all of this as a student entering into animation... I would have done it anyway. Because, for some reason, nobody thinks this will happen to THEM, and because they love animation despite the industrys flaws. People who keep that love for it will stick around.

[Anonymous No.6944088]

>>6941336
hey I'm exactly in you same position anon, except i do have irl friends, but other then that everything is the same, we are even the same age

[Anonymous No.6944175]

>>6941184
Scott Pilgrim anime looks more like Johnny Test lmfao

[Anonymous No.6944178]

>>6941222
>My life is just like a scene from an anime
Grow the fuck up, the real world requires planning and time, not reckless action.

[Anonymous No.6944185]

>>6941229
I don’t draw or should I say upload what I draw because I’m afraid of the social media Internet landscape and the volatile nature of it all

[Anonymous No.6944187]

>>6944178
Tell me more about the real world anon. You seem to be very confident of what you know of it

[Anonymous No.6944200]

>>6941315
Al the new blood on X/twatter/whateverthefucktheycallit are like 18/19/20 drawing REALLY impressive stuff and its like damnn

[Anonymous No.6944202]

>>6944187
Well, you can’t just rush into posting art online without a plan and start doing spergy shit unless you want to become a failure or worse a lolcow.

Also, opsec, get a good OS other than windows like Ubuntu ditch paying up thr ass for CSP

[Anonymous No.6944321]

>>6944013
This is a pretty good summary, I went to a very good college in a country with a lot of animation work and of the 25ish people in my class only 5 of us are actually working in the industry after 3 years. Only next year am I looking at getting a place permanently in a "good" studio and even then job security isn't guaranteed since if there's no productions the studio cannot afford to keep on staff doing nothing. Getting animation work out of college is by far the worst part of the carreer as you are totally unprepared for the realities of the industry, the issue is that studios don't want to take a gamble on a junior that could be complete dead weight on a project, even if their work is fantastic there's a good chance they don't have the discipline to work the strict deadlines that are required or handle the toxic amount of work expected. For context I'm currently working on some Bento Box shiiiiit just to pay the bills and I'm expected to do about 40 seconds of animaiton a week and while that's pretty easily done at this point for me expecting and fresh college student to work at that level is ridiculous

[Anonymous No.6944371]

>>6944013
Lmfao nigga no way id make my teachers and family always told me I’d never make it in the military so I never pursued college either for this reason

[Anonymous No.6944375]

>>6944202
>Well, you can’t just rush into posting art online without a plan and start doing spergy shit unless you want to become a failure or worse a lolcow

I went through a long period of not posting anything online and it’s extremely lonely. I want whatever it is I’m doing to be seen + I try a little harder since eyes would see it. Yeah there are failures and yeah the goblins come out and say “it’s better off you post nothing, nobody wants to see your /beg/ shit they want high quality coom fresh out the oven” but there is a worse feeling. The worse feeling is letting the days, weeks, months go by and there is no clear record of me existing, doing something that day and sticking with it. If it’s public, I have to stick with it to the end by trusting myself.

But if It’s all private and I save things in a private folder where nobody can see it but me for months on end because I’m {planning} my winning stat on Twitter, well then, that’s a really dumb way to live by calculating my every move just for social maximum social points.

[Anonymous No.6944404]

>>6944371
It never began for animationlets like us

[Anonymous No.6944436]

>>6941364
>says who?
Your family. When you pass a certain age and have achieved little to nothing, they will start to unironically resent you.

[Anonymous No.6944538]

>>6944175
kek

[Anonymous No.6944588]

>>6941184
I have no fucking clue. Why not just animate on your own damn time? Why go through the whole soulless corporate starving artist rigamarole when you could just animate whenever you have time?
>Inb4 what if no time?!?!?!
If you like something enough you'll make time.

[Anonymous No.6944594]

>>6944588
>just do it yourself bro!
>30 years later

[Anonymous No.6944620]

>>6941184
I work in it and the pay and hours are only bad if you work in japan. Otherwise pay is average to good. Also we're full so uh,,, actually scratch that yes it is a terrible industry to work in, please stop trying

[Anonymous No.6944809]

>>6941184
All the reasons you listed is the reason why it's gets outsourced to Korean & Japanese sweatshops.

>>6941210
You'll suffer from burn out at some point. Happens to alot of mangakus & animekus in the industry.

[Anonymous No.6944812]

>>6941229
Become a NEET & focus on your art. That's what helped me. A drawing a day keeps the prebeg away.

[Anonymous No.6944880]

>>6944202
>lolcow
Go back

[Anonymous No.6945069]

>>6944375
bugman mentality

[Anonymous No.6945073]

>>6945069

Maybe but I thought nobody wants to see someone's art progress but I'm picking up a following by doing so and finding others have been doing the same. I trust my own inner voice, not >>6944202 advice on calculated success.

[Anonymous No.6945526]

>>6944812
pyw

[Sage No.6945534]

>>6941184
>Why do people decide to work in animation despite it being well known that the industry is complete trash?
The love of the game

[Anonymous No.6945609]

>>6944588
This. Just give up on sleeping bro.
It's that easy.

[Anonymous No.6945628]

>>6944371
>>6944013

this is one of the hardest things a lot of my friends who graduated with me are going through.

a lot of them graduated with honours over a year ago, and are now STILL looking for an industry job.
their parents and boy/girlfriends are tired of them mooching and have put pressure on a lot of them to get a different job so they can save and pay rent. some have been told to just give up.

a job 'in the meantime' doesnt sound so bad, but youre left with much less time to update your portfolio... which you need to get into the industry. this adds to stress.

people outside the industry dont understand that it really does take time and effort to get an animation job. parents see these graduates as failures sometimes. and sometimes the graduates can feel like failures themselves, when its just a byproduct of the industry.

some classmates got snapped up after graduation- 2 or 3. the rest have been on the hunt the past year.
after over a year, i heard another 2 classmates have FINALLY gotten a trial period offer for a studio job.
all my other classmates are still stuck at square one.
some of them have gotten unpaid internships they've had to move abroad for, then not gotten the job, losing money.
some of the people who got a job straight out of college have since lost their job, and are at square one with everyone else.

a lot of my friends are really depressed about the stress of it. but you can see the ones that will make it- the ones who keep making improvements to their portfolios, doing more projects. you just gotta keep your morale up for long enough to get you through, and keep working on projects in the meantime that are as industry standard as you can.

its not impossible. i did it! im sharing this because if someone graduates knowing whats ahead, it makes it a LOT easier to handle and plan for.

[Anonymous No.6946219]

I just found a type of person, a rare build, MY PEOPLE who is in the animation industry. That just lit a fire under my ass. If she can do it, so can I.

[Anonymous No.6946227]

>>6946219
*Japanese animation to be specific

[Anonymous No.6946652]

>>6945609
then stop sleeping for 16 hours a day

[Anonymous No.6946780]

>>6946219
Give me a detailed post explaining what you mean, I am curious.
>t. person with longtime dreams of entering jap animation

[Anonymous No.6947100]

>>6944594
>>6945609
Just make cute little animations. If the public likes what you got people will help you with your larger vision.

[Anonymous No.6947189]

>>6941184
Only a retard works for the bigwig corpos.
Indie is the future for real art.

[Anonymous No.6948057]

>>6945628
Would it benefit to rely on a secondary art skill for generative income? Say Graphic Design or Typography?

[Anonymous No.6948321]

>>6944436
This.
Not sure why people try to deny it but if you haven't hit the "checkpoints" you're practically garbage to your family

[Anonymous No.6949716]

>>6941184
Because I'm fixated to the bone marrow!

[Anonymous No.6949717]

>>6941184
OP if you think animation is not the thing for you that's fine my man.
But my alignment is more like >>6941222 , it's a fixation.

[Anonymous No.6949718]

>>6941229
spotted the great collider-sama!!!!!

we know you won't actually ever intend to try!!
You just want 2 complain!

[Anonymous No.6949938]

>>6941256
You would be at the mercy of retarded 78IQ coomers that are ready to move on to the next popular artist at the drop of a hat. Also there's no guarantee you'll make a livable wage on top of having to give almost half of your earnings in taxes to the government because your self employed.
You retards have no idea how much these porn artist are struggling outside of the very top, 300k+ accounts. There's a reason most artist are froth at the mouth whenever their patreon shit leaks, cause their already struggling as it is.

[Anonymous No.6949940]

>>6949938
This. I've seen artists start out doing well on patreon only to lose 100+ followers in a month through no wrongdoing of their own. It's incredibly unstable

[Anonymous No.6950722]

>>6948057
As far as I can tell, it's apples and oranges. Working a second job will help you keep the bills paid though, but I don't know anything about graphic design/ typography, whether they're steady work or not, well paid, or if you can just pick it up and put it down between animation contracts. Also, even though both fields are art related, your animation skills wont have much transfer to typography/graphic desigm and visa versa.

[Anonymous No.6950737]

>>6941336
>>6941336
I am exactly you but 2 years younger. I used to draw a lot as a kid but stopped when I entered high school. I am going to start again now so I can achieve my childhood dream (even if its a bit late). If that’s your drawing in the picture, you draw well. Why not make a portfolio?

[Anonymous No.6950763]

>>6950737
Oh god no that isn't mine. That's speedoru. He's a big twitter artist

[Anonymous No.6950835]

>>6941235
https://youtu.be/PKZZJS6H-bI?t=57

[Anonymous No.6950946]

>>6941229
Get the fuck off my board then, pathetic loser faggot.

[Anonymous No.6951167]

>>6950946
If every pathetic loser left this board it'd be even deader than it is now

[Anonymous No.6952553]

Would joining science saru be worth it?…

[Anonymous No.6952647]

>>6952553
>implying they'd take you and not some talented 19 year old Korean American girl with a solid portfolio and a decent following on Twitter

[Anonymous No.6953031]

>>6952647
That demographic seems to have a track record of complaining about work conditions on youtube or ANN, I suspect they might be banned from now on!

[Anonymous No.6953084]

>>6941198
>animating is fun

No it ain't. Imagining animating is fun, actually getting down to brass tacks and spending hours and hours trying to get it right is not.

[Anonymous No.6953096]

>>6953084
Yoh Yoshinari is one of the best animators alive and he would disagree with you and call it a skill issue
it's a skill issue sweetheart if you can't figure out how to get it right early on that is your problen