/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.6712208]

Just a reminder that the art gap between Asia and the West isn't "Asian genes." It's literally just that they work harder than you. Start working harder and you can get good like them.

[Anonymous No.6712210]

there is no gap in the first place
asian "art" is shit

[Anonymous No.6712211]

>>6712210
Just say you have shit taste.

[Anonymous No.6712213]

>>6712210
so much bits wasted.

[Anonymous No.6712214]

>>6712211
this belief exists nowhere outside of /ic/ dude
in fact i have known nips who believe the exact opposite, which is how i know /ic/ is just full of weirdos

[Anonymous No.6712230]

>being oveworked is le good

[Anonymous No.6712233]

>>6712208
The gap is insurmountable at this point. Asia is like 20 years ahead because they didn't go all in on digital like the west did.

[Anonymous No.6712235]

>>6712208
No shit, that and not having your head up your ass about being le quirky and ignoring fundies just to stand out
>>6712233
the rise in cgishit anime begs to differ. soon.

[Anonymous No.6712259]

>>6712214
>this belief exists nowhere outside of /ic/ dude
Explain why westoid comics have been getting mogged by their eastern counterparts for more than 2 decades at this point then

[Anonymous No.6712270]

>>6712208
I would have quit too if I had to spend 12 hours a day drawing niggers

[Anonymous No.6712274]

>>6712208
Nobody here wants to work 18 hours per day on Big Mouth and if we want a piece of that slice, one has to work unnecessarily harder than a Japanese is working just to be sitting in the same sweatshop making no money. What part of this do you not understand? Tell me and I'll space out my words.

[Anonymous No.6712301]

>>6712274
>He thinks Big Mouth took 18 hrs work days to finish.

[Anonymous No.6712318]

>>6712301

If I was getting paid big money I would act busy the rest of the day while chatting with coworkers on company time.

[Anonymous No.6712348]

>>6712208
>work almost twice as many hours as your western counterparts
>75% of that time spent is probably trying to jump through Japanese bueacracy to even get approval to get approval to even get shit done or is padding to impress your boss and you spend that time meandering about nothing
>get paid 50% less than your western counterparts
>probably get no benefits or overtime pay
>Barely have time to sleep and eat
>your society pressures you to keep your mouth shut or risk being an outcast if you say anything
Yea no thanks. Westslop kind of sucks and pozzing doesn't help but nipslop is just as bad.

[Anonymous No.6712412]

>>6712210
fpwp
>>6712214
4pwp

[Anonymous No.6712420]

>>6712348
Credit given where it's due, they have mandatory PTO.

[Anonymous No.6712425]

>>6712259
Western comics are notoriously difficult to follow and get into. Manga has single series to understand a plot/story/character. Western comics require you to read 2000 different concurrent comic series by different artists and authors to fully understand a current plot. It has nothing to do with art quality itself and everything to do with how accessible the medium is to the average consumer.

this is what happens to your brain mainlining grorious nippon ichiban!!! cum 24/7

[Anonymous No.6712426]

>>6712208
jap animators arent actually working, its all chinks and gooks
i would also quit if i had to redo my work 5 times every time
thats why i didnt go for master and left my uni at engineer, because precisely i had to constantly redo my work and i just got tired

[Anonymous No.6712438]

>>6712425
You're both right.

[Anonymous No.6712502]

>>6712208
>It's literally just that they work harder than you
This would be an insult from anyone else on the planet, but not the geomancing feng shui "laborer". They purposefully make their lives insufferably harder on purpose and deserve (and enjoy) the toil the reap from it. Don't believe me? Watch these torpid lotus eaters pour a simple cup of tea. It's infuriating as shit to watch, but not as infuriating as hearing others say that the courier works harder that you. I could have poured my own fucking cup of tea in 2 seconds, no need to face mecca and praise Allah or whatever the fuck it is they're worshiping.

>>6712259
Because they have workers rights and aren't homogeneous, physically or mentally.

>>6712425
This too.

>>6712420
Wow, really says a lot about a culture whose so worked to death that their government has to force employers to make them stop slaving. It's hilarious, these are the same people who hate the Chinese.

[Anonymous No.6712507]

>asian animators work like sweatshop slaves and die young or commit anhero
>murricans have higher standards for themselves and still pump out a movie a million times more artistically innovative and highly regarded than your average seasonal anime

[Anonymous No.6712509]

>>6712208
>works hard
>still cant produced good 3d animation at a decent rate
Nice "jeans" kek

[Anonymous No.6712515]

>>6712208
They work harder, but I live longer. It evens out.

[Anonymous No.6712527]

>>6712515
No you don't, you die from cancer at like 40 or getting shot. Nowadays from being a cuck and taking the vaccine too

[Anonymous No.6712530]

>>6712507
Weebs are brainless consoomers, you expect them to comprehend that? They are worse than marvel cucks.

[Anonymous No.6712532]

>>6712527
Focus on your own country, jeet

[Anonymous No.6712533]

>>6712515

[Anonymous No.6712536]

>>6712533
Americans are fat and don't go to the Dr because they can't afford it no surprise there

[Anonymous No.6712542]

>>6712533
> 1st world country with healthcare that the vast majority of its citizens can’t afford is low
Retard

[Anonymous No.6712548]

>>6712542
>vast majority of its citizens can’t afford
You're not paying your own health insurance at 35k a year drawing gooktoons. Chances are, Americans are paying for it.

>Inb4 "Hurr my country has free health care without americans, but I dare not post my tax rate".

[Anonymous No.6712562]

Not sure if this thread is a bait or not, but I sincerely feel sorry for you if you think that working 12-18 hours a day is something remotely desirable

[Anonymous No.6712579]

>>6712208
Yh naw I'd rather work on shit like spiderman and get reputation, collegues and more opportunities than work for ramen just so some coomers can pretend they aren't pedos

Anime is nice and all but the very best ones are still the same rigid archetypes that japan refuses to innovate from

[Anonymous No.6712580]

>>6712259
>garbage sells well
bet you think that transformer movie is a masterpiece.

[Anonymous No.6712591]

>>6712502
> I could have poured my own fucking cup of tea in 2 seconds
Their goal isn't time-efficiency though, quite the contrary. And they don't always spend 2h to drink a cup of tea. Same as you don't eat from 11h30 to 17h, pause for 2h, before starting the evening meal, but on some specific sundays.

Same as saying: why spending a century building a 500m tall cathedral when you can just gather in a cave?
> inb4 nooo but the cathedral lasts you know
and their ceremonies are still practiced today.

Plus, by that same logic, they must be laughing their ass off when seing Westerners building manufacturing plants to make forks while they snap two branches of bamboo straight from the tree.

> They purposefully make their lives insufferably harder on purpose and deserve (and enjoy) the toil the reap from it.
That's a true point of view, from a ignorant perspective.

[Anonymous No.6712596]

>>6712580
rent a whore could sell poorly and still get a 5th season because it's a show that promotes birthrates

[Anonymous No.6712609]

>>6712533
>imagine wanting to live past your 80s when you cant control your bodily functions and no one wants to be there for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p41j6MtIKFI

[Anonymous No.6712612]

>>6712609

Eat healthy now and exercise so you'll never have to degrade bad enough to where you need to wear diapers.

[Anonymous No.6712633]

>>6712591
>Their goal isn't time-efficiency though
Which is why I don't respect their "hard work". You can also think deeply yet still have insane, gibberish, unrespectable opinions.

>quite the contrary
Time wasting? Why do they do this?

>Same as saying: why spending a century building a 500m tall cathedral when you can just gather in a cave?
Yes

> inb4 nooo but the cathedral lasts you know
They serve as adequate monuments to the crumbling empires that build them as they last about as long.

>Plus, by that same logic, they must be laughing their ass off when seing Westerners building manufacturing plants to make forks while they snap two branches of bamboo straight from the tree.
This is what I mean. Formless, shintoist platitudes. It's "k keep me posted" tier.

>That's a true point of view, from a ignorant perspective.
It's a correct description and explanation of what they actually do. They enjoy their suffering, it's tenacious, admirable and would even be desirable if there was any actual wisdom behind it. But there isn't, it's ultimately repetition and idol worship.

[Anonymous No.6712653]

I don't understand these weebfags or asiafags or whatever the hell it is on here. Most actual anime in motion looks like liquid dog shit and even still artists are rife with atrocious errors, "good enough" attitudes towards perspective and anatomy, ugly/naive styling etc, and that's when in theory they have no deadlines. Like a cursory browse through any booru will tell you how low the bar is for anime, hint it's nonexistent.

[Anonymous No.6712662]

>>6712609
>obese Amerimutt can't fathom being still healthy and active in old age
Imagine my surprise.

[Anonymous No.6712691]

>>6712653
bro, boorus are 90% western fanart of anime. Not anime. You've confused

[Anonymous No.6712695]

>>6712596
Not now lol, apparently MC came in a swimming pool to the idea of being cucked, the sugoi japanesu story-telling at its finest.

[Anonymous No.6712879]

Japanese story telling stagnated and their hasn't been a well paced concise told story in anime since FMA. After watching animated series with western pacing like Castlevania and Arcane, trying to watch a jrpg twink cry about being a clone for 40 hours is fucking impossible. It doesn't help that in all of Japanese media, there is now only one singular joke: "what if boobies but accidently" (4th panel reaction face)

[Anonymous No.6713239]

>>6712208
Japanese animators work long hours and get horrible pay to the point that many of them have to take on multiple projects. working 12-18 hours a day for shit pay is bad for you mentally and physically. You either have to love what you do a whole lot or you're doing it because you've got nothing else to fall back on.
As for the Spider-Verse example, that situation is also bullshit for the animators because they could be told to redo something for the smallest little thing or because someone above them changed their mind on a whim. 11 hours a day and putting up with that seven days a week would of course make some people quit.

Being overworked is not good in any country or industry.

[Anonymous No.6713253]

>>6712208
7 day work with unpaid overtime is shit. I had the luck of having to work on 3 weekends back to back and it fucking sucked. It's not entry level job either, and when the boss said to come in for another weekend I just flat out said no.

Working as an animator as a profession is sure to suck the passion out of it.

[Anonymous No.6713261]

>>6712208
>Seriously pointing to japan as an example of "good" work ethic
Yeah, we should all be overworked and underpaid, just because we're passionate about our job.... right?

Also, the fact that Spiderverse animators refused to work more shows your theory is incorrect.

[Anonymous No.6713291]

>>6712542
What happens at the hospital if you can't pay? Do they stop treating you and cart you to the door in a wheelchair?

[Anonymous No.6713296]

>>6713291
The emergency room will still treat you and maybe even admit you overnight but as soon as they find out you have no insurance they'll do everything to kick you out with a fat bill in the mail that will impact your credit score.

[Anonymous No.6713299]

>>6713261
>overworked and underpaid
Animator salaries seem to be above the japanese average. Maybe you read too many clickbait articles

[Anonymous No.6713313]

>>6713299
Firstly, Why you you post some french gobbledygook and expect me to be able to read that?
Secondly, are you really using a twitter post as evidence of anything?
Thirdly, have you forgotten about the "Animator Dormitory Project", which was charity organization for Japanese animators because they weren't earning enough to live?

Hmmm, what should I believe, some twitter post, or the existence of a charity organisation who's soul goal is to help house poor Japanese animators?

[Anonymous No.6713375]

>>6713299
You're thinking about key animators and animation directors (usually one per production). The in-betweeners are the people getting crunched work for slack pay. And if it's not some Japanese in-betweener being overworked, they're getting Koreans to do it (probably for cheaper). Most of the anime studios weren't even giving wages based on hourly work, but production input - which seems like a stressful way to work.

Imo, people on this board have a misguided kind of nip worship. There's no defined standard as to why the eastern approach should be seen as better (anime? manga? korean/chinese illustrators?) so it's stupid to think the economic system is facilitating it. Ditto for the thinking that a high life expectancy is necessarily coming from harsh working conditions (visual arts are a pretty small industry, just well publicized).

[Anonymous No.6713398]

If you're all going to bitch about this topic then at least understand why the animators on the spiderverse movie were complaining.

Lord basically demanded almost fully rendered 3d storyboards meant a lot of animators spent 6 months doing nothing and then had to make up with working overtime. Also even though the movie is released worldwide now Lord STILL wants to do adjustments and Sony is fighting him on it.
Even though Lord was a producer is basically took the role of a director, despite there being like 4 directors.

[Anonymous No.6713399]

>>6712208
artists are so easy to exploit

if you want to get rich, just get yourself some wagie cagie drawpigs animatorfurries, work them to the bone for cheap and promise them credit (artists love to become slaves just to see their stupid names in the credits)
print money
tough out a bit of bad press
then hire them again and promise this time will be different, then unleash the crunch mid production

[Anonymous No.6713443]

I was into anime before the 2000s. I know it's hard to believe, but there was a very mutually positive admiration that went both ways back then. John K. spoke positively about anime on his blog, Craig was very humble and said the Japanese do things way better in the early PPG days, a lot of comics artists back then started slowly implementing manga techniques into their work at some point, and many other animators genuinely thought Japan was just fine. Japanese artists and creators also had always admired western art and animation.
In the 90s, some popular american comics of the time like Jim Lee era X-Men and Spawn were popular in Japan for a while, and were major influences on a number of contemporary japanese franchises like Yu-Gi-Oh!, Digimon, Darkstalkers, etc. be it either just character designs, general atmosphere or story elements.

Fast forward to anime getting actually popular in the west, a bunch of idiots on the internet coined the term weeaboo and the rest is history. Proto ironic weebs and self loathing anime fans started appearing and calling yourself "trash" for liking anime and pretending it was cringe was the norm. Western animation was still strong back then, so anime fans just took pummel after pummeling during the late 2000s/early 2010s. I remember casually recommending some series, and bitter /co/ people hated it just because it was anime. It was like their default setting.

Fast forward today, most current western animation is legit dogshit and japanese animation is unironically better. It's a not a question, it's a fact. They just make things people actually want to see with decent/average quality behind, it's not about politics, etc. Now anime fans just eviscerate western media because they did not forget. They're just the bullied nerd who's strong now.

Anyway, I fucking hate all those retarded east vs west threads and I sincerely hope they're made by an AI because no human being can legit be this retarded.

[Anonymous No.6713458]

>>6713443
artists are just humble people by nature. kopinski kept saying how intimidated he was about being next to kjg at a con even though he's frankly the far superior artist of the two.
also weebs are hated for good reason

[Anonymous No.6713463]

>>6713443
Have you ever met a literal weeb? We're not talking the ironically buys body pillow and watches Demon Slayer kind. We're talking the terrible BO, obnoxious in public defends loli hentai kind. A few rotten apples will spoil the bunch.

[Anonymous No.6713547]

>>6712653
this anon gets it. i've been noticing a ton of lazy approaches to even simple figures in animeslop artists on twitter. Stiff poses, lack of dynamic poses, upper thigh and above busts or busts only, no thought on composition, poorly photobashed backgrounds, multiply layer soft airbrush gradation the list goes on. Western art is plagued with shit too but it's pretty stupid to intentional overlook the flaws of jap artists with muh its japanese so its better!

[Anonymous No.6714176]

>>6712580
First transformers was good and I am tired of pretending it wasn't

[Anonymous No.6714186]

>>6712259
Because capeshit comics is a massive pain in the ass to get into.
Buying a comic is also pretty expensive.
There's also way less gatekeeping in terms of comic publishing compared to most of the mangas get filtered before being imported to the west.
There's a lot of good comics, but there's also a lot of easily accessible shit comics that murks up the pond and makes it look like everything sucks

[Anonymous No.6714349]

>>6712259
Why is popular manga/anime/jap media from 20 years ago much more interesting and unique when it comes to concepts, character designs and art styles than almost all current mainstream shit? At the time, It felt like mangakas and general content creators were writing about the stuff that was interesting and personal to them. You could legit feel their personalities via their stories.
Modern JRPGs and popular shounen manga feel more like American comic books where it's just a streamlined conveyer belt factory.

[Anonymous No.6714556]

I can say for a fact that there are way more anime fans hating on cartoons than viceversa, and even people who says they hate anime often says that there are some they like, while hating non-eastern cartoons and comics with no exception is almost a defining characteristics of the anime community

[Anonymous No.6714560]

>>6714556
Yep, because of those dumbfucks, weebs almost get more hate than furfags

[Anonymous No.6715407]

>>6712208
then why does the average anime look like shit compared to this movie? Recently only demon slayer looks like it has actual effort

[Anonymous No.6715412]

>>6712259
Anime is a very strong marketing tool. The shows also follow the source material. I am not sure if American animated shows do the same thing.

[Anonymous No.6715422]

>>6714349
>Why is popular manga/anime/jap media from 20 years ago much more interesting and unique
Industrialized art. Same thing happened to American comics before that—groundbreaking work by a few visionaries, but as it showed widespread commercial potential the suits got involved and it became a formulaic product devoid of artistry.

[Anonymous No.6715722]

>>6712425
/thread

[Anonymous No.6718126]

>>6712208
what kind of waggie cuck mentality is this? Yes I'm going to kill myself working for some corporative asshole and throw away my best years and sanity for the love of "art". You my fren are the problem this industry is filled with idiots that love to be exploited. For some reason "artistic" personalities are the ones that love being fucked in the ass the most. FUCK YOU OP THANK YOU FOR LOWERING THE WORK EXTPECTATIVES FOR ALL OF US

[Anonymous No.6718136]

>>6715407
Anime “movie” nowadays just means stacking 3 episodes in 1, not enhancing quality.

[Anonymous No.6719073]

>>6713463
>defends loli hentai
Stuff is gross but people shouldn't go to jail over it IMO.

[Anonymous No.6719636]

>>6712214
"asian americans" don't count anon, you should know this by know

>>6712259
westeners are just lazy, that the real truth here

[Anonymous No.6719641]

>>6712507
>>6712530
>deends Calarts

yea, i like my shows to follow or at least vaguely adhere to proportions and anatomy thank you

[Anonymous No.6719700]

>>6714349
i love hellsing so much its unreal

[Anonymous No.6719732]

>>6714349
>>6719700
This is now a Hellsing thread. The way he draws is the greatest art I've seen.

[Anonymous No.6719737]

>>6714349
>>6719700
>>6719732

[Anonymous No.6719749]

>>6714349
>>6719700
>>6719732
>>6719737

[Anonymous No.6719750]

[Anonymous No.6719751]

>>6714349
>>6719700
>>6719732
>>6719737
>>6719749

[Anonymous No.6719754]

[Anonymous No.6719759]

[Anonymous No.6719761]

[Anonymous No.6719766]

[Anonymous No.6719872]

>>6712208
There's no such thing as 'asian art'. Ugly ink blot trash with horrendous anatomy for humans and animals and even plants is the pinnacle of their 'art' before we arrived and taught them how it was done. China has terracotta statues - all greek origin and massive leap forward in their artistic ability from it. It's now illegal for anyone to view the statues outside communist party and illegal to discuss tehse findings, but blatant greek/roman origins and drastic shift in style and ability after them.

For 'manga' or 'anime', its just disney style ripped off and copied and expanded on over the past 75 years to the big eyed bugs they have now. It's not 'japanese'. It's western art mimicked by people with no original ability or imagination.

For manga, in particular, they dont even draw it anymroe. Its all blender and traced 3d models. Cut and paste everything. even 'ugly' art like chainsaw man is just traced 3d models. People with literally no talent are posing 3d shit and calling it 'art'. And mouth breathers like yourself believe its real or that they have talent or even drew something. Tim buckley was made fun of for cut and paste eyes, models and mouths and so like mr potato head dolls - thats how manga is made. ANyone that says otherwise is a moron. You can count on one hand the number of actual artists in modern manga and even they cheat liek fuck. AI has more soul than fucking bugmen.

[Anonymous No.6719879]

>>6719872
Anime and Manga is its own thing. Disney never expanded on 2D like the Japanese did and gave up after Treasure Planet. Stop “we wuz’ing” for Disney.

[Anonymous No.6721159]

>>6712259
Didactic comics and those Disney princess mini storybooks at Walmart and Target magazine racks also outsell western comics.

Capeshit is considered successful at like 30k copies sold lmao.

[Anonymous No.6721202]

>>6714349
because you arent reading the good shit

[Anonymous No.6721234]

https://www.reddit.com/r/vfx/comments/14nabg4/my_time_working_on_nimona_at_the_big_d/

1/ first there is definitely a huge harassment and sexual assault matter going on at dneg. There was a huge meeting after the thread popped up on reddit and it was explosive. I was in the meeting and there have been a few internal animation meetings too. My anim lead on my new project has told me it could be that one of the people responsible is someone who was pretending to be targeted. I wont say my anim leads name as he told me not to. I dont know much else but it is a big internal talking point right now specially amongst animators as a animator was the target.

2/ we were dragged in a nimona meeting and told if we wanted to be good animators and wanted to work on great things we should show it by working overtime and crunching way before crunch was meant to be a thing. I was hitting 100 hour weeks. Many of those hours i was told not to report them and work unpaid.

3/ the movie supervisor who is still there, told me that if I wanted to know where the dicks were to suck to move up in the world, that he would show me as long as he got sucked on first. This was after me confiding in him and telling him about some bad notes I had received. He was not part of the animation supervisors. He seems more high up but he was always a big personality so I didn't take notice of it until he told me recently during a celebration of Nimona that he still wanted to show me how to move up.

[Anonymous No.6721235]

>>6721234
4/The production was a mess right though the department's. Constant changes and broken things being passed to animation, once I was told by my animation peer to put a cock in my mouth if it meant I would shut up and animate.

5/ we were told not to risk being taken off this project by complaining about work conditions and hours, in one meeting they kept telling me about another animator whose life was now going to be a mess becuase they refused to work unpaid.

6/ Before they told many of us about the next project, we were blackmailed and told they would decide to keep us on depending on how willing we were to not stand up and cry foul. I had the director of animation tell me I complained too much an as a woman should know dick jokes and unpaid work will be part of my job until I work my way high enough to change it and that if I complained less he could help me more.

7/ after crying during a 80 hour week and a bad director review asking to speak to my producer I ended up being ignored and Instead the same two people who told me to learn to suck a cock or to stop complaining ended up trying to put their arm around me.

[Anonymous No.6721371]

>>6719872
>thing: :D
>japanese thing: >:(
>murican is superior
murican has been stuck on this for the last two decades lmao

[Anonymous No.6721378]

>>6721371
Couldn’t be. Star Evil ended a long time ago and im pretty sure everything is in rerun hell.

[Anonymous No.6721486]

>japan has taken over, the american animation industry can never compe-

[Anonymous No.6721502]

>>6721234
Is there something about animation that attracts degenerates that think they can get away with these things? It's like their DC staffers or something the amount of sneeding that goes on.

[Anonymous No.6724766]

>>6712208
>12-18 hours a day and not a single one of their works comes close to spider man
Wtf

[Anonymous No.6726141]

>>6721202
>because you arent reading the good shit
Any examples?

[Anonymous No.6726183]

>>6712210
What the fuck is asian art? Just anything not Hollywood slop?
>>6713299
They are well known for being underpaid. That's just a universal with animation artists, though.

[Anonymous No.6726258]

>>6726183
art within a geopolitical landmass called asia

[Anonymous No.6726495]

I would love to die of liver failure at 50 if it means I get to be a great artist for 25 years

[Anonymous No.6726536]

>>6726495
You would die at 50 to be an artist but you wouldn't practice, interesting.

[Anonymous No.6726565]

>>6726536
Yeah, that's the point. I wish I had the iron will and determination to work 12h a day, but I don't. Therefore I will live a mediocre and (potentially) long life

[Anonymous No.6726571]

>>6726565
I'm curious if it depended on the guarantee. If God gave you a guarantee that working X numbers of hours would make you a master artist for 25 years, with any kind of fame/success, would you be able to muster the determination or would you similarly not be able to.

[Anonymous No.6726595]

>>6726571
Frankly I don't even care about the getting good part anymore. I just wish I could be a workaholic

[Anonymous No.6726626]

>>6726595
Amen