This is the hardest blackpill to swallow: Art can't be learned

[Anonymous No.6173513]

Before you bluepill me on this hear me out: I have figured out why some people can't never learn to draw while others draw with ease(they are naturally talented).

Part 1

It seems that there are many factors that influence the ability to draw.
1.- Drawing is something highly interpretative: Meaning that no amount of practice or experience will change how someone will draw in the end, everyone has their own way of perceiving the things and interpreting them in lines (style), much like the DNA, how we draw is an individual process that varies from person to person, experience will only allow to understand the basics, but to become as good as another artist, it's virtually impossible since they have their own individual tought process.


2.-Drawing requires a photographic memory: Sometimes misunderstood with "visual library" or "muscle memory". The vast amount of visual information like shapes, gestures, anatomical details,composition, color usage, lightning, stylization requires not only the constant practice, but also requires the ability to keep all of them intact in your memory and to recall these images at will with ease.
This is something that not everyone is able to do since the way of how a brain works differs from person to person,this also accounts for the spatial intelligence and the ability to project in your mind.
Constant practice will only store in the short term memory, this is why you see permabegs relapsing after a time of "nailing it"

[Anonymous No.6173516]

>>6173513
okay i give up

[Anonymous No.6173517]

>>6173513
pyw

[Anonymous No.6173518]

>>6173513
just use reference, bro

[Anonymous No.6173521]

THIS IS THE REAL BLACKPILL
ASIAN GENES,TALENT OR SHIT ART DOESNT MATTER AT ALL

[Anonymous No.6173526]

>>6173513
In summary:
>asian jeans and neuroplascity.

[Anonymous No.6173529]

>>6173526
>>6173521

[Anonymous No.6173533]

>>6173526
Don't forget the ligameme

[Anonymous No.6173538]

>>6173521
you want the true blackpill?

[Anonymous No.6173540]

>>6173521
thought that was just common sense
the moment you want to make art your business you have to appeal to the market, same shit if all you want is useless internet points be it likes or followers

would need to be pretty sheltered or dumb for that to not be the default thought

[Anonymous No.6173542]

Lmao none of this is true.

I have almost no visual memory you just draw an erase until it looks right.

[Anonymous No.6173543]

>>6173538
horrifying

[Anonymous No.6173544]

>>6173542

[Anonymous No.6173545]

Part 2
3.-Drawing isn't considered a library of knowledge: Everything can be learned trough repetition and practice since they are only objective information, but drawing hasn't yet developed a fully scientific method, meaning that everything explained by masters insofar are highly abstract and esoteric ways of explaining something not scientific.
Meaning there is no way an average Joe can pick up a drawing book and learn what some people can naturally do without picking that book in ther lives.Similarly to how some people develop easiness on doing certain activities and yet they can't put in simple words how they do it, it is how some artists can develop and improve over time while others stagnate and keep drawing like little children (default symbol drawing)


4.-Drawing is considered a talent, not an acquired ability: Some people are born with disabilities, some are born with physical deformations, some are born with higher intelligence. The first drawings of a person will determine how this will evolve as an artist in the future.

[Anonymous No.6173568]

>>6173538
What the fuck....

[Anonymous No.6173569]

>>6173538
MODDDDS HE POSTED THE FORBIDDEN WORD BAN HIM

[Anonymous No.6173570]

>>6173542
>you just draw an erase until it looks right.
t.permaprebeg

[Anonymous No.6173574]

[Anonymous No.6173579]

>>6173570
Maybe if you have good visual memory you can just draw it right first try but this is how it's gotta be if I am drawing from imagination.

[Anonymous No.6173605]

>>6173513
>Drawing requires a photographic memory
use reference, dumb nigger.

[Anonymous No.6173610]

>>6173545
>look at this example of a mentally ill incestual rapist, his art never got better so yours won't either!

[Anonymous No.6173663]

>>6173538
absolute mastery requires

no talent: draw 10 hours a day for 50 years before you reach 50% of...what talent below can do

talent: draw 4 hours a day for 5 years

this is the exact same reason why there are 10 year old kids reaching absolute mastery

[Anonymous No.6173671]

>>6173513
blobs on left was when i realized someone with years of fundies still could not draw without a reference.

artists are either stuck as technicians, or ascend to being creators.

[Anonymous No.6173739]

>>6173513
>>6173545
PYW
GO DRAW

[Anonymous No.6174045]

>excuses to not even try
why are you even here OP?
just stop drawing and do something else

[Anonymous No.6174055]

>>6173663
do you know what you're talking about? genuinely asking

[Anonymous No.6174064]

I'm proof that art can be learned. I have every roadblock and disability in the book, yet I still managed to be a /beg/. I spit in the face of science, someone as retarded and unlucky as me shouldn't even be alive, yet here I am. I'm powered by pure spite. And I will never stop drawing.

[Anonymous No.6174240]

ok but how do I know if I have talent

[Anonymous No.6174247]

>>6174240
u will know when u have drawn something.

[Anonymous No.6174293]

>>6173513
you know the point of trolling is to make people mad without much effort

[Anonymous No.6174364]

>>6173610
>>look at this example of a mentally ill incestual rapist, his art never got better so yours won't either!
Too be fair, he could have gotten better if it wasn't for kiwifarms gangstalking him.
Still not a great person, but less likely to be a literal motherfucker.

[Anonymous No.6174378]

>>6174055
He just said there are 10 year olds with absolute mastery, what do you think?

[Anonymous No.6174420]

>>6174378
>10 year olds with absolute mastery
you mean kids being groomed at the age of 1 to have an art career, you mean

[Anonymous No.6174438]

>>6174420
funny thing is all those 10 year old prodigies already have 5-6 years of constant practice imposed by their parents but people keep thinking its some god given talent kek

[Anonymous No.6174522]

>>6173570
Spit the shit out of your throat log eater, cant hear you.

[Anonymous No.6174525]

>>6173574
Did he become an Ai?

[Anonymous No.6174537]

>>6174438
i remember an article about an asian prodigy in math, he can already answer
college calculus problems at an elementary age. At this point already in his mid 40s, he regrets to say that he knows jackshit about arts and sometimes regrets he cant play a single music instrument

[Anonymous No.6174558]

>>6173538
This terrifies 90% of the ‘artists’ here

[Anonymous No.6174582]

>>6174537
well artists and musicians cant put a real man in space so it balances out.

[Anonymous No.6174596]

>>6173538
Fuck! It's over.

[Anonymous No.6174686]

>>6173513
If drawing is highly interprative, it is easily influenced. What are those influences? From many external factors, such as practicing and experiences. Idk how you thought of this, the humans dont exist in a vacuum and exist in an environment where they are forced to adapt, all animals do. Literally everything that can be perceived influences us.

kek if you read the literature you would know that photographic memory is a hindrance to so many aspects. What you want in art is not this hyper-specialized ability where it hinders other aspects, instead just an exceptional memory and what is known as working memory (the ability to keep many thoughts and elements online at once in your brain; think of juggling balls).

Fundamentals dont purely rely on memory, it relies a lot on inductive and deductive reasoning to understand application and proper usage of the fundamentals. Working memory and inductive reasoning is significantly correlated. Photographic memory does nothing to help utilizing references.

>Constant practice will only store in the short term memory
Wrong. It has been shown that repetition consolidates the likelihood of a pattern of neurons firing thus resulting in an action or memory. Look up ebbinghaus effect; where it all started.
There are many parts that is involved in memory processing and storage such as the hippocampus, neocortex, basal ganglia, amydala, etc. It is complex and a process that is well thought of to ensure that humans are capable to learn through the significance of emotion, repetition, and reasoning.

Idk where you got this from but this is misleading. You've barely read literature on learning and understand how the brain works. what are you even trying to figure out?

[Anonymous No.6174691]

>>6173513
>2.-Drawing requires a photographic memory: Sometimes misunderstood with "visual library" or "muscle memory". The vast amount of visual information like shapes, gestures, anatomical details,composition, color usage, lightning, stylization requires not only the constant practice, but also requires the ability to keep all of them intact in your memory and to recall these images at will with ease.
>This is something that not everyone is able to do since the way of how a brain works differs from person to person,this also accounts for the spatial intelligence and the ability to project in your mind.
>Constant practice will only store in the short term memory, this is why you see permabegs relapsing after a time of "nailing it"
Source? You wouldn't just go online and post things based on half-assed hunches without any facts to back them up, right?

[Anonymous No.6174701]

>>6173545
Yes talent is everything regarding potential and half the game. You can be born with very high potential as an artist but if you dont practice it wont matter. Yes I understand that even discipline, focus, and hard-work is predisposed but if you dont like art in the first place you wont even try to be an artist.

Drawing is regarded as a skill or an acquired ability since it is a very specific thing that is understood through learning. Why is it that it takes years and years of learning even for the most talented people to achieve mastery? because it is something that requires a long process for the brain to grasp, thus, an acquired ability.

Youre underestimating the average joe. It is not wrong that art is highly intuitive meaning that it is hard to be given an explicit explanation. Art has many forms and is very broad and it is hard to be given a right or wrong answer, a lot of the times just better, worse, or more appropriate. Even though there are many gaps in explanation and interpretation of the understanding of arts and aesthetics, humans have reasoning, trial and error, memory, and time to grasp elements that are previously unknown to them. The average joe has enough of a reasoning and capability to be "good" at art. But yes, talent is a spectrum that goes from one extreme to the most talented of outliers.

[Anonymous No.6175114]

>>6173521
It's your job to make it appealing to your target audience, retard

[Anonymous No.6175122]

>>6173538

[Anonymous No.6175130]

>>6174686
How do I increase my IQ

[Anonymous No.6175134]

>>6175130
You can stop doing things that effectively decrease your IQ, like browsing /ic/.

[Anonymous No.6175208]

>>6173513
Anything NOT to draw, eh?

[Anonymous No.6175216]

>>6174686
>>6174701

Lmao the cope posting is surreal, PYW

[Anonymous No.6175247]

a general rule of thumb is to avoid blackpills.

[Anonymous No.6175319]

>>6173513
>>6173545
Oh my fucking god I hope this is bait cause you'd have to pay me for me to enlighten you, absolute retard.

At this point you're basically a flat-earther, so I'm gonna treat you like one: how the fuck do you debunk the classic "progress" pics that show that people who actually practise, well, improve? I swear to god if you say the word asian I'm gonna lose my shit.

[Anonymous No.6175328]

>>6175319
He's literally just coping anon. Only perma begs act like there is something beyond their control and that's why they aren't good yet.

In reality they just lazy.

[Anonymous No.6175330]

>>6175319
How do you explain the permabegs who draw everyday for many decades and yet they can't improve?
>inb4 they only draw 3 minutes a day and then they slack off the rest of the day
What about the permabegs who actually draw a lot and make efforts and yet they can't amount to anything

[Anonymous No.6175335]

>>6175330
NTA but either they are lazy or aren't actually practising what they should be. They aren't drawing from real life or practice perspective or are drawing the same thing over and over again for years and wondering why they don't improve.

Pretending that you can't learn is always cope for being bad.

[Anonymous No.6175338]

>>6175335
>they are lazy
Sounds like "it's about personality" in dating stuff from PUA pieces of shit.
You just want to scam and deceive people into believing non sensical stuff, blaming them and mocking their efforts instead of actually acknowledging how rigged the game is.

[Anonymous No.6175359]

>>6175338
Except it's not. Laziness is easily fixable. Just put in the proper work and you will get results. It's about discipline which everyone is capable of.

[Anonymous No.6175392]

>>6175330
I'm gonna say low IQ, unironically.

[Anonymous No.6175399]

>>6175359
>I was born with no arms
>I can't ride a bike
>REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE DURR HURR DURR iTs NoT aBUt ThAT uR JuST lAzY REEEEEEEEEEEEE DUUR HURR HURR


Damn fucking it, fuck you!

[Anonymous No.6175405]

>>6175399
Except you have arms anon so what your excuse.

[Anonymous No.6175422]

>>6175405
That I was born without talent or I have low IQ just as >>6175392 pointed out.
I will never make it.

[Anonymous No.6175557]

Not only that, but Evil artists will always be viewed as trash, both as a person and in their work. I am a lump of human shit who will continue to excrete shit until I croak.
>T. Evil artist who has been drawing for over a decade

[Anonymous No.6175573]

>>6175422
Low IQ retards do art all the time. You can make as many excuses as you want though. Have fun being bad at art.

[Anonymous No.6175584]

>>6173513
Dumbass schizo, since you think so much let me give you something to think about thats the actual truth instead of this talent or no talent crap.

Its all about your environment, ever since you were born up till the present day youre breathing right now. Doing art is a privilege.

[Anonymous No.6175589]

Here's a harder pill:
if you'd put half the effort into deliberate practice that you do into shitposting excuses, you'd already have been miles ahead.

[Anonymous No.6175742]

>>6174537
>i remember an article about an asian prodigy in math, he can already answer
>college calculus problems at an elementary age
Honestly not that impressive.

[Anonymous No.6175791]

>>6173513
just cut off your penis and tell twitter about it, you'll be called a hero every day until you commit suicide, that's what you really want and why you keep making these threads

[Anonymous No.6175900]

>>6173513
I used to suspect this was the case, but I eventually discovered that drawing is simply the most poorly taught skill in existence. Very few of the resources recommended to beginners even make an attempt at explaining the basics of drawing. Most of them seem to assume the reader already spent years as a kid re-inventing the basics, and those that don't generally either contain nothing of substance or are complete bullshit. It took me over a year to improve for the first time ever and reach the bottom rung of /beg/ because I lacked some absolutely critical information that should be in every beginner book, but is instead constantly glossed over.

[Anonymous No.6175930]

>>6173513
>1.- Drawing is something highly interpretative: Meaning that no amount of practice or experience will change how someone will draw in the end
>2.-Drawing requires a photographic memory: Sometimes misunderstood with "visual library" or "muscle memory".

[Anonymous No.6175943]

After a certain point, like when you're at Proko's level, it gets really hard to improve, because you constantly have to question yourself and tear down everything you've been built up. You have to pick new goals, new strategies, new practices, you have to constantly reinvent yourself. If you never consciously agonize over your skill, you won't improve. It's why many ESLs develop a very thick accent, or why many bodybuilders don't get to the high levels: they aren't willing to question themselves, point out their own errors, and do things over again. Be like Garou, from OPM, who died over and over again in order to achieve legendary God-like power

[Anonymous No.6175961]

>>6175943
>ESLs develop a very thick accent
>they aren't willing to question themselves, point out their own errors, and do things over again.
We're only learning English because it's a universal language, we don't care about the accent, I'm sure an average american will understand what we have to say, the world doesn't revolve around USA or England lol. Most of you are completely oblivious regarding anything outside burgerland which is embarrassing.

[Anonymous No.6176114]

>>6173513
pyw

[Anonymous No.6176661]

>>6175216
who said i was coping? im not a talentless retard who doesnt draw.
PYW

[Anonymous No.6176672]

>>6173513
>Drawing requires a photographic memory
bullshit, construction techniques exist for a reason retard. They're used to BUILD stuff on paper, and they require you to know the process/technique, not all individual details.

[Anonymous No.6176675]

>>6175961
>>ESLs develop a very thick accent
>>they aren't willing to question themselves, point out their own errors, and do things over again.
>We're only learning English because it's a universal language, we don't care about the accent, I'm sure an average american will understand what we have to say, the world doesn't revolve around USA or England lol. Most of you are completely oblivious regarding anything outside burgerland which is embarrassing.
this

[Anonymous No.6176884]

>>6175943
>many ESLs develop a very thick accent,
Never heard an American speak any other language in a way that didn't be me want to throw up. Scratch that, American English makes me throw up too

[Anonymous No.6176887]

>>6176884
Didn't *make* me

Pardon the typo, I'm ESL myself

[Anonymous No.6176895]

>>6173513
Wish I knew this before I started. Wouldn't have doomed myself with a fate of a permabeg, this is just pure suffering. I can't give up, because drawing is the only thing that I find interesting besides games and booze, but neithet can I progress because I have no this talent thing or whatever it is.

[Anonymous No.6177178]

I tried to do art. Spent years trying. Sometimes I want to try again, but all it takes is one look at a good drawing and one self-reflecting "could you do that" for me to remember why I stopped.
Talent is everything. You people say it's not because you want it to be true.

[Anonymous No.6177223]

>>6173663
>there are 10 year old kids reaching absolute mastery
no such thing lol

[Anonymous No.6177265]

>>6176895
if you actually believe art is a talent and not a skill you are truly lost.

[Anonymous No.6177975]

>>6177265
were not created equal my friend
some cant draw some cant count

[Anonymous No.6178022]

>>6177178
>Talent is everything
Wrong, you just dont know how to study. Go to uni and study something useful and then once you know how to study and you can sit still, then learn something you love. Or just take dexys

[Anonymous No.6178047]

>>6177223
what about that video with the 12 year old doing realistic drawings?

[Anonymous No.6178052]

>>6173513
Stop doing digital. Problem solved, faggot

[Anonymous No.6178113]

>>6173574
This artist predicted George Floyd.

[Anonymous No.6178168]

>>6178047
that's not even mastery... those realistic drawings are barely impressive; uninsightful.

[Anonymous No.6178227]

>>6173513
this is the exact same cope people use when trying to learn a new language LOL

[Anonymous No.6178246]

>>6173513
stop thinking too hard and go draw. you dont let yourself even get your own process because of this huge fear of failure. it will take some years, dont give up and you will see results

[Anonymous No.6178267]

>>6177178
No I'm saying it because I'm tired of people telling me I'm some god when I KNOW I only learned a series of logical ideas and performed repetitive actions to train my muscle memory.
When I say it can be learned I'm just trying to be honest and humble about it.
But I always stress it's years of hard work. And I'm always amazed by how many beginners manage to completely miss that part even when they're told in clear terms that it's. Hard. Work.

[Anonymous No.6178268]

>>6178267
>I'm some god
PYW

[Anonymous No.6178269]

>>6178268
*meatspin*

[Anonymous No.6178271]

>>6178267
>>6178269
You're a larping faggot giving false hope, just stop

[Anonymous No.6178727]

>>6173513
Can anyone explain why he constructs kangaroo like this? In reality kangaroo is a something like a mix of a tyrannosaur, dog and slug. Of course it has a some frog vibes. But on construction I see only a frog and something like i don't know what.

[Anonymous No.6178735]

>>6175961
Nobody takes you seriously when you have an accent

[Anonymous No.6179760]

>>6175399
>>I can't ride a bike
you can still learn this though

[Anonymous No.6179764]

>>6175961
>we don't care about the accent
speak for yourself, I'm an ESL and I genuinely do

[Anonymous No.6179773]

>>6173542
Pyw

[Kanna No.6179774]

>>6173513
Photographic Memory... like, actual photographic memory not just having a good image of something in your mind... OP I'm sorry to inform you that Photographic Memory is a myth and despite what you may believe anyone can learn to draw well, granted some better than others but everyone has that potential if they work at it enough.

[Anonymous No.6180224]

>>6173513
art, like everything in life, is down to intelligence/pattern recognition which you master through repetition. you do something, then realize where you went wrong, fix the algorithm in your brain where it went wrong and then do it again now with new found knowledge. repeat until satisfied.
creativity is just pattern 'a' combined with pattern 'b' which gives you pattern 'c', a pattern no body yet has made.
any inability to become good at art boils down to you not being intelligent enough to spot your own mistakes and/or not being intelligent enough to then fix those mistakes. a teacher or a mentor who knows more than you and can tell you why it is wrong and how you should do it (basically what a intelligent person can do on their own) fixes this flaw

[Anonymous No.6180298]

>>6173513
>no amount of practice or experience will change how someone will draw in the end, everyone has their own way of perceiving the things and interpreting them in lines
yes and your thought process can be changed and refined
>but also requires the ability to keep all of them intact in your memory and to recall these images at will with ease.
1. no it doesnt
2. you're underestimating the human memory
3. you can just use reference like everyone does

You're still right though, just for different reasons
To be a good at drawing you need
1. Resources
2. Luck (you can be making some dumb mistakes making all your art look like shit and it might take you years to find out what it is (and then you find out you still have more issues)). This is caused by personality quirks or happenstance and unlike coding it's extremely hard to diagnose how you're fucking up)

[Anonymous No.6180301]

>>6173574
he was already good in 2009
everyone of those le motivational progress timeline already have a great start