/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.4595257]

>"Well if you're trying to learn to juggle, I make my students only juggle with chainsaws. Obviouslly its gonna be difficult and the results wont be good but it helps teach confidence and chainsaw control"
How do penfags think like this?

[Anonymous No.4595259]

>>4595257
being a sociopath

[Anonymous No.4595317]

If you're drawing every day like you should the exercises are pretty fast to complete. If they help or not big deal. Draw more quit bitching.

[Anonymous No.4595320]

Ya I had two life drawing profs and both of them never says "good job" to their students
It just ruins your ambition to get better
This is why a lot of pros or people who get paid just stop improving and just maintain

[Anonymous No.4595486]

>>4595317
Which exercises?

[Anonymous No.4595499]

>>4595257
you are supposed to use fineliners, and yes, you are meant to repeat the drawings until you get them right instead of relying on slowly building them up

[Anonymous No.4595504]

>>4595257
I’m convinced this guy takes some sort of stimulant

[Anonymous No.4595516]

drawing in pen isn't dangerous you fucking pussy, it ain't gonna hurt you lmao

[Anonymous No.4595536]

>>4595257
Drawing with pen is fine, but it shouldn't become a delusion.
Most /beg/s won't be able to put stuff down on paper in 1 go, they will need to do some pencil sketching first.
It can take years to build up the experience and confidence to draw shit immediately with pen.
Even KJG started out doing pencil sketches and then going over it with a pen, there's no shame in doing that.
In the end it's the result that matters.

[Anonymous No.4595542]

>>4595504
how so? does he go at 1.5 x?

[Anonymous No.4595559]

I'm a Draw A Box fag and it uses the same approach as Peter Han, here explains why to use fineliners. https://drawabox.com/article/ink

[Anonymous No.4595560]

i make sketches in pen. am i retarded?

[Anonymous No.4595576]

>>4595542
No just the way he talks, he just sounds mildly high on meth

[Anonymous No.4595578]

>>4595559
/ic/ does not negotiate with terrorists

[Anonymous No.4595585]

The exercises from drawabox and peter han are the biggest waste of time possible if you want to draw living characters instead of concept art robotic looking shit.

[Anonymous No.4595593]

>>4595576
how is he supposed to bulk if he's on stims? come on man think about it lol

[Anonymous No.4595604]

>hurr durrr don't use pen
There is a reason people are forced to use Conte when they do life drawing (even beginners) in art school
That's why I mock people who use a ditigal tablet to do """"'life drawing"""" on ic and make it all pretty by undoing and erasing to show the begs
Conte is almost impossible to erase 100% so it acts like pen

[Anonymous No.4595622]

>>4595593
Just for videos or public appearances, like doing a little line for confidence.
Doesn’t look like a total meth head.

Meth users are surprisingly common, hard to tell sometimes because they manage to keep it under control

[Anonymous No.4595625]

>>4595604
>don't erase!
>eraser bad
Nigger, even professionals erase the fuck out of their drawings over and over again until they get it right.
Hell, just 1 look at peter han's work and it's very clear that maybe you shouldn't take everything this guy says as a fact.
Pretty much all of his drawings have atleast one element that will make you say "huh, he should've probably erased and redone that..."

[Anonymous No.4595643]

>>4595625
>Pros do it so I can!!!!!
The point of not erasing is gaining confidence in your lines, am I saying NEVER EVER erase? No but if you are learning and practicing gain that confidence to draw that line once without making a mistake over and over and over again
It is basically chicken scratching but erasing the evidence
But desu idc you won't listen to me or anybody BC some guy one time you watched erased and undo so you can do it also
Best of luck!

[Anonymous No.4595654]

>>4595643
>It is basically chicken scratching but erasing the evidence
>muh boogeyman chicken scratching
Let me ask you this.
If one artist chicken scratches in pencil, erases the parts he doesn't like and redraws them, and then goes over his chicken scratched lines with confident pen strokes.
And another artist draws immediately in pen because erasing is cheating and makes him a bad artist, but his drawing will have very clear flaws in them.
Who is the better artist at the end of the day?
The guy who actually put effort into his drawing to make it look good or the guy who was too busy with some abstract rules that he had to follow?

[Anonymous No.4595657]

>>4595576
I wouldnt be surprised if he pops Adderall or Provigil every now and then.

[Anonymous No.4595666]

>>4595654
The guy who can make a confident line using pen is the better drawer
Idc about some hypothetical drawing that doesn't exist to compare which drawing is better or worse
The guy who can make the confident line without erasing is better and more efficient at drawing
>Hurr durrr efficiency of drawing don't matter it is just the results
Again you are trying to be become a BETTER artists and drawers
If you don't care about becoming a better drawer and just care about the results just trace

[Anonymous No.4595667]

>>4595654
It’s just a way of practicing man. If a professional artist likes chicken scratch it’s a personal choice after learning it properly

[Anonymous No.4595671]

>>4595604
This post is strange because you get so many things wrong.
The reason why people use Conte pencils is because it behaves like charcoal in that you can get a full value range. It's also easy to erase unless you're using the tip of the pencil but you shouldn't be doing that anyways.

[Anonymous No.4595673]

>>4595559
Because irshad took this course from Peter Han for 3 months

[Anonymous No.4595678]

>>4595654
>the guy who was too busy with some abstract rules that he had to follow?
this
peter han's courses aren't bad, but the people taking the courses are some of the worst motherfuckers out there when it comes to crabbing.
>oh, you don't draw everything immediately with pen? lol you suck dude
all you have to do is ask them to post their work and usually all you get are some retarded unfinished scribbles if you get anything at all.
stop thinking and rules and start thinking about how to make your drawings look good.

[Anonymous No.4595685]

>>4595671
>It's also easy to erase
Ya so easy to erase on newsprint
You sound like an expert who uses the medium a lot and not some guy on /ic/ who don't use anything else than an tablet
Also if the value is the main point of using Conte why not use pencil? A 4B pencil has the same values just use it like a Conte also easy to erase like how you like it
Just gotta make a pretty picture! Who cares of learning the skill of drawing

[Anonymous No.4595688]

>>4595678
>all you have to do is ask them to post their work and usually all you get are some retarded unfinished scribbles if you get anything at all.
let's give it a try.
>>4595685
post your work.

[Anonymous No.4595689]

>>4595678
>You just gotta make it look goooddd add a ton of filters add effects bro they won't notice, just trace that if you don't know how to draw it, the end result is all that matters
>WHY ARE YOU CALLING ME A HACK IM AN ARTIST

[Anonymous No.4595699]

>>4595688
Conte 20 mins
Using one of the croquis cafe videos

[Anonymous No.4595700]

>>4595688
>some retarded unfinished scribbles if you get anything at all.
>>4595699
like fucking clockwork.

[Anonymous No.4595702]

>>4595685
>Ya so easy to erase on newsprint
>what is a kneaded eraser

Are you sure you should be accusing people of never drawing bro?

[Anonymous No.4595703]

>>4595257
post got a nice laff out of me thanks OP

[Anonymous No.4595704]

Just let penfags be penfags.
They'll figure it out eventually, I'm sure...

[Anonymous No.4595706]

>>4595700
Lmao
You do realize 20 mins isnt enough to do a complete value study plus the face
This is 40

[Anonymous No.4595709]

>>4595706
stop posting your work, I was just shitposting.
I didn't mean for you to embarrass yourself publicly I apologize.

[Anonymous No.4595710]

>>4595702
Kneaded earses are used to lift off heavy lines not to totally erase something
I bet you use a kneaded eraser like an eraser and don't roll

[Anonymous No.4595714]

>>4595709
This is 15 I think
I'm not embarrassed lol wtf

[Anonymous No.4595722]

>>4595714
The head is definitely your weakness if I look at >>4595706 , so you probably shouldn't leave it out and maybe do some portraits for practice.

[Anonymous No.4595728]

>>4595257
Working in pen is good for me, but sometimes it's also helpful to have an underlayer for more complicated drawings.

[Anonymous No.4595734]

>>4595722
I do but not for life drawing but I know I should because a lot of people told me the same thing
when I do life drawing I'm just trying to focus on gesture plus value etc

[Anonymous No.4595742]

>>4595685
Conte is pretty easy to erase on newsprint as long as you're not using an unnecessary amount of force. It might be more of a problem on rough newsprint.
Also charcoal and newsprint are the most cost efficient combo for studying, needing to carry around 3-4 pencils just to achieve the same range and having to buy 10-20 dollars drawing pads just for like 30 pages of bristol paper is a waste of money.

[Anonymous No.4595759]

>>4595742
Some people use graphite sticks do life drawing (pic attached)
Again a Conte or charcoal isn't just one value
There are 4B 2B 6B etc Conte sticks like graphite
Using a 4b Conte stick is like using a pencil that's 4b
If you think it is pretty easy to erase Conte hey you have a super good eraser good for you, but I'm going on what my two life drawing prof plus what I experienced
I never erase when I life draw with Conte

[Anonymous No.4595763]

>>4595759
>art students are now literally drawing with dilation sticks
you're just solidifying the stereotype.

[Anonymous No.4595770]

>>4595763
damn I didn't know you cared that much about the gay art school kids
I hope they think about you as much as you do about them

[Anonymous No.4595773]

>>4595734
Damn

[Anonymous No.4595971]

>>4595536
>>4595625
>>4595654
>>4595678
You're misunderstanding completely. He doesn't insist (afaik) that you only ever draw in pen and you're not allowed to use pencil for making underdrawings for finished work. No one is expecting you to be Kim Jung Gi and get it perfect every time. The whole point is to NOT be a perfectionist.
Peter Han has students *sketch* in pen only to force them to get into a mindset of not babying every single sketch like it's your firstborn child, to sketch and discard and sketch again. This has the added benefit of developing line confidence and having more conscious control over your work. So when you ARE using a pencil or some erasable medium, like digital, for actual, planned out work you intend to finish, that skill will carry over and you will become far more efficient because you're less insecure and emotionally invested in your sketches. Your line quality also will improve.

[Anonymous No.4596005]

>>4595971

[Anonymous No.4596029]

I took his class a couple years ago. He really doesn't care if you fuck up your drawings. He's wants to see you go through a design process where you're trying to figure out on paper how something is put together. If a student just did 1 finished drawing he would often be disapproving of them in review, unless the student was really really good and the drawing was perfect. He let you use low opacity markers for underdrawings too if you want to work things out before using pen.

[Anonymous No.4596058]

>>4595971
this doesn't make any sense.

I watched KJG's last stream, and in it he said that when you're beginning it's very important to finish your drawings, that that's what he tells his son, and that he recommends using a media where you can erase so you can finish your drawings.

I don't think the logic of penfags makes any sense, even KJG doesn't agree with it.

[Anonymous No.4596075]

>>4595699
>>4595706
>>4595714
>>4595734
/beg/

[Anonymous No.4596117]

>>4595625
> pros erase so i should too

You getting paid for that design? No, i didnt think so. Erasing when you’re a beg is a crutch. Whether you realize that in one week or ten years i dont care.

[Anonymous No.4596122]

>>4596075
Pyw

[Anonymous No.4596125]

>>4596117
>Erasing when you’re a beg is bad.
>because i say so
fuck off.

[Anonymous No.4596128]

>>4596125
Keep polishing that turd!! Keep erasing and fixing that drawing!!

[Anonymous No.4596131]

>>4596128
Honestly, ink is really good if your goal is draw a lot but it still require a good amount of skill to accurate copy on the fly. I’d say if you’re already good copying in graphite try doing it in ink, it’s free you from being a perfectionist.

[Anonymous No.4596133]

>>4596128
okay retard, i will.

[Anonymous No.4596134]

>>4595486
The ones he gives in his dynamic sketching course, If you don't know what I'm talking about go to the video course thread.

[Anonymous No.4596173]

>>4596058
These aren't mutually exclusive, anon. You're supposed to do both. You can't finish literally every drawing.
Sketching is for studying, practice and for fun. When studying something, sketching helps you understand whatever it is. Practicing would be working on your fundies, like box drawing or whatever. When for fun, it helps you to develop your invention and imagination skills while, naturally, just being fun. It's important to make FINISHED work, because refining work into a finished state is also it's own distinct set of skills you need to learn.
As much as you need to learn to let go, you also need to learn to be decisive and follow through.
If you set your mind to making a finished piece, you're going to burn through some shitty sketches in the planning stage as you figure out exactly what you need/want to do. So again you can't treat just any old sketch like your firstborn, you have to pick your favorite child and abort the rest.

Long story short, listen to Peter Han and learn to sketch with pen. When it makes sense to do so of course. It's only going to help you, especially with the exercises he has in mind.
I personally switch between mediums, colors and whatnot just for the heck of it and I prefer ballpoint pens mostly because of their versatility (super light pencil-like sketching to dark ink lines on demand) and range of colors.

[Anonymous No.4596183]

>>4595604

Begone cumfarti

[Anonymous No.4596188]

>>4595257
>OP doesn't understand what the point of an exercise is
Ah, I see it's /ic/ faggotry as usual today

[Anonymous No.4596445]

>>4596173
Let's say im sketching with a pen, and make a perspective error. Now i can't fix it. So am i supposed to throw the whole thing away and start over? How am i hurting my progress by doing it with pencil and erasing to fix mistakes.

[Anonymous No.4596472]

>>4596445
you take off the cap and take a big whiff of the ink

[Anonymous No.4596475]

>>4596445
You don't fix mistakes by erasing them, you fix them by doing it again but correctly. Erasing just makes it more presentable. Not essential.

[Anonymous No.4596766]

>be a penfag myself
>realise all my drawings look like shit even after months of drawing with only a pen
>start using pencil instead for underdrawings so I can erase and redo stuff
>drawing look almost professional now
>try to give advice to other penfags to stop being penfags
>they never listen
I guess this is one of those things you have to find out the hard way.

[Anonymous No.4596823]

>>4596133
based ngmi

[Anonymous No.4596927]

>>4596173
Most sensible post right here.

Any advice on how to work through Dynamic Sketching?

[Anonymous No.4597317]

>>4596766
And yet still don't post his work and gotta just take his word for it compare to a professional who gets paid for his work and teachings

[Anonymous No.4597333]

>>4596766
>"I just erase all my shitty chicken scratching and make it look all pretty and it takes me 8 hours to finish one sketch. What do me I'm a bad DRAWER LOOK AT MY RESULTS AT THE END I CAN DRAW PRETTY THATS ALL THAT MATTERS!! No I'm an ARTIST even tho my skills suck and I keep erasing and erasing and it takes me 5 hours to finish a sketch"

[Anonymous No.4597361]

>>4596766
>after spending months drawing with only pen, my drawings with pencil look amazing
Sounds like it worked out well. And your conclusion is that people SHOULDN'T practice drawing with only pen?

[Anonymous No.4597391]

>>4596766
same thing happened to me and yes its something you have to find out for yourself.

[Anonymous No.4597717]

>>4595257
Wait, is this an actual quote?
If so, WTF I love peter han now.

[Anonymous No.4600433]

>>4595536
>It can take years to build up the experience and confidence
Thanks to Dunning-Kruger you get KJGfan brainlets who have the confidence but not the fundies

[Anonymous No.4600791]

Rather than wasting your time arguing here, go grab your pen/pencil and start drawing

[Anonymous No.4601335]

>>4595971
>>4596117
you play like you practice.

[Anonymous No.4601520]

>>4595971
Reminds me of a story posted here once where a professor told everyone to make a bunch of drawings and then destroyed them the next day. He said the point was not to get attached to your drawing and you can always draw it again.

[Anonymous No.4601528]

>>4595257
>erasefags cope
Face it you only like pencil because you want to erase shit. And every second spent on erasing is a second not spent on learning.

Every single reputable teacher (Vilppu) says it's important to face your mistakes and acknowledge them rather than sweep them under the rug and get everything right on the 10th time. The goal is to learn drawing one way just forward, not back and forth.

[Anonymous No.4601534]

>>4595625
Practice and actual work are different.
Vilppu says "never erase" and also says "no rules just tools". What does it mean? Is he a hypocrite? NO! It means you practice with discipline but work by any means necessary.

You won't learn shit if you cheat and hack in practice but when you're actually working for a result nothing but the result matters. Shoop and bash and trace all you want.

You need to get your heads out of your asses. When you're practicing your process and discipline matter, when you're working only the result does.

[Anonymous No.4601535]

>>4601528
>Face it you only like pencil because you want to erase shit.
well, duh
>every second spent on erasing is a second not spent on learning.
doesn't make sense.

[Anonymous No.4601540]

>>4595257
>How do penfags think like this?

Penfag here, what the fuck are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.4601543]

>>4595257
Stop being afraid of making mistakes, nobody is perfect. Realizing this will help you work harder and finding flaws in your art more quickly.

[Anonymous No.4601546]

Graphitecels on suicide watch

[Anonymous No.4601552]

penfags like to be smug about being penfags, but almost none of them draw stuff worth looking at.

[Anonymous No.4602120]

>>4601535
Yes it does. You learn when you recognize your mistakes, and you learn when you try to correct them. Erasing is just an extra step in between that teaches you nothing, wastes time and breaks flow.

[Anonymous No.4603206]

>>4602120
>erasing is an extra step in between
>in between
penfags are too stupid to know how to use an eraser. no wonder their posts make no sense.

[Anonymous No.4603227]

>>4595734
Damn, I'm buying an eraser

[Anonymous No.4603465]

>>4603206
Better a penfag than a pedant.