/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.4221920]

People say to draw skulls so I can understand heads better but when I do draw them, I only get more confused. I don't understand the point of it, simply because I can draw alright heads now, I can do faces too.

What's the point of drawing skulls if I can memorize asaro heads, know all the major landmarks and proportions, can construct heads in perspective from boxes and so on... what is the fucking point? Seriously, skulls are complex and don't bring anything to the table if you already can draw heads and if you really need to draw skulls, you can always look for references, it makes even more sense because you won't retain info on skulls unless you grind them mindlessly for years.

Or to put it another way, the knowledge of a skull can make heads slightly more believable, I get it, but you have to draw a very complex subject, draw it a lot just so you can make a slightly better head. It's not worth it.

[Anonymous No.4221922]

>>4221920
pyw?

[Anonymous No.4221925]

stfu nerd nobody cares

[Anonymous No.4221926]

>>4221920
That's awful advice. Learn perspective instead.

[Anonymous No.4221927]

>>4221920
If you are content at being an "alright" artist, keep doing what you are doing.

[Anonymous No.4221930]

>>4221927
My point is, I really, really improved at drawing heads from loomis, from drawing from photos and just thinking about different things like perspective, form and so on. I didn't draw a skull in my life so I wonder why would I even need it in the first place.

[Anonymous No.4221934]

>>4221920
If you understand the underlying structure you it's easier to manipulate it and see mistakes when drawing faces. You don't need to know the exact dimensions of individual bones, just an understanding of the basic forms. The skull doesn't need to be complex. You can easily break it down into cranium, eyes/nose, cheeks, and mandible. Instead of rendering cranial sutures and fossa draw some low poly simplifications. Studying is not about memorizing every minute detail it's about picking up bits of information that will help you in the future. Aim to remember just one thing.

[Anonymous No.4222002]

>>4221930
To put it bluntly you haven't hit the point where you can recognize the necessity or even really utilize the understanding the skull, or really any other part of anatomy for that matter. I'm not shitting on you, just realize that you're going to be constantly returning to things you already studied or think you knew enough to skip as long as you're willing to always be improving and evolving your standards. This is applicable to everything, not just anatomy.

[Anonymous No.4222026]

>>4221930
I've found it really helps to see subtle plane shifts and simplify things like shadow patterns, half tones and highlights.

[Anonymous No.4222044]

>>4221920
I know you can’t draw decent heads or faces if you don’t understand why you study the skull. All of the landmarks are based on skeletal structure for both head and figure because it stays relatively the same size and place for everyone, where flesh Varies greatly. When looking at a face you should be able to notice the skull shows through for at least 50% of the face, forehead, cheeks, jaw, nose, eye sockets are all visible bone. bone creates structure, we would be blobs and your structure will be lacking without proper understanding.

[Anonymous No.4222054]

there should be a system to encourage OPs to post their work when they make a question

[Anonymous No.4222069]

>>4222044
Everything you mentioned I can learn from asaro heads.

[Anonymous No.4222071]

>I can already draw lol why should I draw skulls
>doesn’t post work
What is the point of this thread, retard? Do you think a single person gives a shit whether you draw skulls on principle?

[Anonymous No.4222075]

>>4221922
>>4222054
>>4222071
here's a head

[Anonymous No.4222081]

>>4222069
>>4222075
skulls help you create stuff like diverse humane faces with different proportions or even monsters, it's not a waste of time
even loomis talks about how pliable the skull is early on, it definitely can't hurt

[Anonymous No.4222082]

>>4222069
I made more progress when I studied from the real thing instead of trying to copy someone else's stylized anatomy. It's useful for how to get an idea on how to simplify things but I think you ultimately get more out of it if you device your own simplified anatomy based on an informed understanding. After all, you can't simplify what you don't know.

[Anonymous No.4222089]

>>4222069
No you cant

[Anonymous No.4222094]

>>4222075

Thumbnail: male.
Zoom: female.

Also. Of course, for a fucking sketch of a front view you don't need to understand the skull too much, good luck for anything more complex (expressions, different angles, face with different proportions).

[Anonymous No.4222099]

>>4221920
It`s not necessary to learn all the skull but the basic landmarks, it`s the same with muscles. Some artists go the extra mile though and they can recite you all the muscles and bones, most of this artists do insane art so it`s probably worth it, just go one step at a time

[Anonymous No.4222101]

>>4221920
Its worth it once you know a little more about drawing in general, be sure to get a real one (foam ones cost like 10 bucks) to be able to draw it under any angle.

[Anonymous No.4222169]

>>4222075
This clearly shows you are just copyng shit, skulls are easy faggot, if you struggle with them and You dont see the point in making studies from them is because you are the absolute brainlet.

[Anonymous No.4222183]

This thread has been closed.

[Anonymous No.4222196]

>>4222183
Yes and it always goes this way.
>OP doesn't post work because he doesn't want to get shit on and wants answers instead
>everyone prompts OP to post work to gauge his skill level
>OP caves in and posts work
>he gets shit on
>thread ends
It's a vicious circle that builds nothing. This could have been a discussion about anatomy where anons share what they have learned.

[Anonymous No.4222238]

>>4221920
I know I'm not the greatest and my art is still pretty soulless BUT. These were drawn before and after only watching Vilppu draw skulls and how faces form on them. So I wouldn't discount drawing bones my friend. You can't build a house on sand and you can't just slap animu on a sphere and call it a day. Watch some lectures of people explaining why it's important if you have to be convinced. If it doesn't work for you, find a different way. It's just art, chill the fuck out.

[Anonymous No.4222309]

>>4222238
that's great. you are making a bit of a mistake with the roundness of the eyes
this is some stuff I've learned

[Anonymous No.4222316]

>>4222309
this was because I couldn't figure out why Kawajiri made eyes look so cool
they're quick sketches but you get the jist

[Anonymous No.4222334]

>>4222316
>>4222309
I’ve struggled with the eyes quite a bit, so I’ll post a couple of pages from the only books that I’ve found to go into any depth on the structure of the eye in any serious manner, these were invaluable, and most sources just skim over the arguably most important feature of the head.

[Anonymous No.4222341]

>>4222334
That was Bargue, btw

Pic related is Asaro

[Anonymous No.4222344]

Also, some of the information is a bit suspect, like then eyeball size and its fit into the socket

[Anonymous No.4222347]

[Anonymous No.4222353]

[Anonymous No.4222356]

>>4222344
I think the biggest issues are understanding that the eyelids have a thickness, how they wrap around the eyeball, and how much the eye recedes into the eyesocket

[Anonymous No.4222363]

>>4222356
For me it’s getting around the fact that the frontal plane of the head isn’t flat and the eyelids are not centered on the eyeball, leading to drastic shift in geometry as the far eye moves away from the viewer.

[Anonymous No.4222365]

>>4222075
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.4222389]

>>4221920
is just a thing of proportions OP, you can learn more specific things that can expand your possibilities, but they are not an obligation.
Just learn the bigger proportions, and just how work the most important things, then if you have some interest in develop one thing more in particular, go for that.
That's why all people teach first the body general proportions than anything, because only with that you are already ok, then all depends of your goals.

[Anonymous No.4222503]

>>4222353
What book is this called?

[OP No.4222505]

>>4222353
>>4222347
>>4222344
>>4222341

Wtf. All that wall text from some random unknown source. Learn it the right way once.

Steve Huston (?) Beginner Head Drawing - https://mega.nz/#F!glxFwLaa!cdBL0K-MOuZbtQYoRR4cBQ

Steve Huston Advanced Head Drawing - https://mega.nz/#F!WsVy1ChK!17B0OTg-UBnPB8mwXy1U8Q

[Anonymous No.4222548]

>>4221920
>>4222069
>>4221930
>>4222075

Every single time.

[Anonymous No.4222609]

>>4222081
>>4222094
>>4222169
>>4222365
>>4222548
I am not OP, i just posted a head as an opportunity to get a crit. Pic rel is a more revised version, what's bad about it?

[Anonymous No.4222623]

>>4222505
>unknown source
>asaro
Also, I have literally the entire NMA archive that I ripped myself, and Huston doesn’t even go into the structure of the eyes. At one point he literally just says do draw a fish shape and that he’d show the eye in detail later. That was years ago and he never went back to it.

[Anonymous No.4222631]

>>4222609
>>4222075
I think you are just being crabbed on, friend. There is no useful criticism to be found here

[Anonymous No.4222901]

>>4222609
it's not bad, but it's a 3/4 average proportioned face with a blank expression

[Anonymous No.4223067]

>>4222609
I don't see anything obviously wrong with the drawing. Can you do a turnaround and keep it on model though?

[Anonymous No.4223085]

>>4222609
Bro you replied to a post specifically asking for op to post their work. Are you op or not? Don't chicken out.