/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.4006332]

Lets settle this once for all, should you be able to depict an underage in a drawing in any way?
Should there be requirements such as context
that is portraying it in a negative light or should lines resembling a naked minor be outright banned?

[Anonymous No.4006336]

>>4006332
if it's for a good cause like OP pic then yes

[Anonymous No.4006339]

>>4006336
>for a good cause
Maybe in the eyes of racists.

[Anonymous No.4006343]

>>4006339

[Anonymous No.4006344]

My personal belief that an illustration crosses the line when it could be reasonably mistaken for an actual photograph or having been produced by referencing actual pizza, meaning that if you walked up to a randomly selected stranger, asked them "is this a realistic depiction of a child?" and they answer "yes", you're probably too close to the real thing for comfort, no matter how smoothly you try to talk your way out of it.

Stylized 2D characters with saucer eyes and :3 expressions (i.e. loli/shota) is fine and I believe it's perfectly reasonable to be drawn towards that type of stylized pornography while still being very much opposed to and disgusted by the real thing. I think the same holds true for fictional/drawn zoophilia ("feral" furry), guro, rape/abuse, etc.

[Anonymous No.4006347]

>>4006336
>>4006332
>>4006344
Its fucking lines on paper.

[Anonymous No.4006348]

>>4006344
>referencing actual pizza
kek

[Anonymous No.4006349]

>>4006332
>did the drawing physically hurt anybody in its making except for the hands of the artist?
no? then fine by me, reasons why it was made means little one way or the other

[Anonymous No.4006352]

>>4006344
I think all pornfaggotry should be banned. You can't choose "yes but in moderation", "yes but do it responsibly" when there's the internet. An IRL equivalent would be helicopters dropping free bags of cocaine from the sky all over the city 24/7. You can't leave this to the people's discretion, especially younger ones in the teenage range.
Porn causes addiction and it tends to escalate into degeneracy, and as 4chan proves every day, it also causes brain damage. This is turning into a huge issue.

I hate modern moral relativism and this "don't judge me!!" attitude, this porn shit is awful. I'm not even religious.

[Anonymous No.4006355]

>>4006352
This, another reason why patreon trendhopper whores must all hang.

[Anonymous No.4006361]

>>4006352
>>4006355
dumb pearl clutching moralfag. Begone with you!

[Anonymous No.4006368]

>>4006352
>Porn causes addiction
only somebody too weak mentally would say that

[Anonymous No.4006377]

>>4006352
A more well-suited analogy is alcohol. Alcohol is easy to access and present in almost every social situtuation. Does there exist people who abuse it? Yes. Does there exist people who drink responsibly? Yes. Should alcohol be banned because some select few people are unable to consume it responsibly without having it take over and possibly destroy their lives?

[Anonymous No.4006379]

>>4006347
Yes, we know it's lines on paper fcking but some books or letters might affect you anyway. Just depict minors in a normal or acceptable setting. Just try to see if you'd really want your kids to see it (if you're a parent or got young siblings) or try to see if your stuff can be shown to 100+ people without them wondering if they should call an asylum for your sake .

[Anonymous No.4006384]

>>4006368
You're right, but it CAN.
And if you have the choice between 1) potentially creating an addict or 2) just drawing something unsafe enough to make them think/draw something safe, why would you choose the 1st option?

[Anonymous No.4006386]

>>4006361
Moralfags > being ok with degeneracy

[Anonymous No.4006389]

>>4006384
because I value lack of censorship more than the life of some weaklings, which if not for porn, they would fall for something else

[Anonymous No.4006391]

>>4006332
h-hot

[Anonymous No.4006392]

anyone who viciously defends loli/shota is just a pedo in denial. And possibly a tranny in the making

[Anonymous No.4006394]

>>4006386
>degeneracy
a word that has never been uttered in this context by anyone who isn't a 300lbs """white""" larper

[Anonymous No.4006397]

>>4006384
Ah, so what you're saying is that the world should be a safe space and that things that are "problematic" should be gotten rid of, correct?

[Anonymous No.4006399]

This is why any character I make that looks underage is never going to state their age until some dipshit asks and then its going to be "above the age of consent"

[Anonymous No.4006400]

>>4006332
I think we should just put the skulls of everybody ever engaged in censorship into a large pyramid as a monument to censorship being bad.

[Anonymous No.4006405]

>>4006377
You are forgetting the fact that you have to buy alcohol, and it's hard to get away with drinking a lot of booze without showing it. Internet is like tap water, it's just there. Imagine having a booze tap in every home, no limit, no traceability, just "don't use the booze tap, son". You should supervision a small child of course, but are you going to supervision a teenager? That's just unrealistic. Kids these days probably start seeing porn before they're double digit age and they can go straight to the most fucked up porn imaginable. All I had when I was a teen was naked chicks on nighttime TV that wouldn't even pass as porn today. I'm not a saint and I dabbled in / drawn weird shit but that's not even close to the shit people watch today and way too many people are literally obsessed.

[Anonymous No.4006406]

>>4006397
Incorrect : read it again. Wanna draw controversial stuff? Sure do, BUT in a tasteful way. You can represent a decapitated child soldier, for instance, in several ways. If you do it in a tasteful way, the viewer is shocked by the subject,the idea. If you don't, the viewer is grossed out & thinks you're a nutjob because you drew the neck with all the details, a crow eating the eyes of a kid, etc... Trying to make it as much "in your face" as possible.
You see what I mean?

[Anonymous No.4006412]

>>4006405
I hope you realize you're the current century's equivalent of someone in the the early 1900s going "what has the world come to? Women shouldn't show their ankles, only whores do that."

[Anonymous No.4006413]

>>4006394
Your description is the complete opposite of me man. Nice try.
>>4006389
Lack of censorship, like control freakiness, isn't what we really should aim for : with no censorship, drawing guro with toddlers with a mix of scat & furry would be accessible to everyone. What do you think about it? Not everyone has the same critical thinking as you, you need to understand that : some spirits are tougher than yours, some are weaker than yours.

[Anonymous No.4006416]

>>4006412
Not him but whats your endgame? You want any kid able to walk & form a sentence to go to a store, buy some booze & get drunk?

[Anonymous No.4006422]

>>4006413
>>4006416
if you are afraid current situation will fuck up the kids, because they have it different than you had, then change nothing, and let the ones who suffered thru it, after they matured, make the necessary chances for stopping others suffer the same, because they will be the best to judge what to change and what not, not you, because you are old and function by old standards, and by trying to implement those you hurt evolution

thats why lack of censorship is good, it allows deviations to happen, and while 90% of them go bad, they will not pass the test of time and let the good deviations trump

[Anonymous No.4006426]

>>4006422
to add

let darwin do its thing with the kids of others, and if you are afraid for your own kids, equip them with the necessary skills to judge for themself

[Anonymous No.4006429]

>>4006405
>internet its just like tap water.its just there
no its not????????

[Anonymous No.4006434]

>>4006332
Wait, why are you asking the pedophile board?

[Anonymous No.4006435]

>>4006429
Its a metaphor : a kid who can boot a pc & open Google image without encountering any password has a very,very wide variety of stuff to see, good & atrocious.

[Anonymous No.4006442]

>>4006435
Then its up to the parents to restrict the child, directly or indirectly. Dont blame the internet when its bad parenting the real problem.

[Anonymous No.4006443]

>>4006434
Am I going to jail for fapping to Luluco?

[Anonymous No.4006444]

>>4006426
>and if you are afraid for your own kids, equip them with the necessary skills to judge for themself
I won't have any kids

[Anonymous No.4006446]

>>4006332
Already been settled, mate.
Children in drawings = BAD
Children in drawings being murdered = OKAY

[Anonymous No.4006451]

>>4006442
>Then its up to the parents to restrict the child, directly or indirectly.
>>4006405
>You should supervision a small child of course, but are you going to supervision a teenager? That's just unrealistic.
Your brain area related to reading comprehension has rotted away, but I wouldn't blame your parents.

[Anonymous No.4006463]

>>4006451
Not even the same anon, insufferable faggot

[Anonymous No.4006466]

>>4006451
The second guy is not me, I zoned out when you proved yourself to just be a spewing a bunch of pseudo-intellectual nonsense dribble.

[Anonymous No.4006472]

>>4006443
stop right there, you criminal scum

[Anonymous No.4006477]

if you dont educated your kids to behave themself in your absence and know whats good for them, then you fail as a parent

[Anonymous No.4006484]

>>4006332
FUck you UN cartoon rights divisions. I'll draw muhamad and loli porn as long as i like.

[Anonymous No.4006533]

What if I draw lolis as social commentary?

[Anonymous No.4006635]

>>4006533
Tried that before on jewbook and my alt account shut off by veybook for children pornography. Fuck posters on boredpanda.
>please provide your id if you want to retrieve your account
to hell with the kikebook

[Anonymous No.4006639]

Spending time and effort for a cause to protect minors is a noble act but they're investing all that energy in the wrong places. Instead of trying to ban drawings go after the real criminals that are victimizing real people.

[Anonymous No.4006649]

>>4006332

I’m ok with censorship as long as it effects everything that I don’t like.

[Anonymous No.4006668]

>>4006332
im not into loli and shota but as long as it's not hurting anyone...it's fine?

though i don't give a shit if websites don't allow cp in their content as i mostly draw teens and adults for the most part.

[Anonymous No.4006670]

>>4006352
i was gonna agree with you but you sound like a pompous asshole.

[Anonymous No.4006672]

>>4006386
sex is most tamest kink i've ever seen.

[Anonymous No.4006674]

>>4006639
>go after the real criminals that are victimizing real people.
It's on the left side of the comic https://ulrich-s.info/photos/ce3aabb0016d85490a2aed0a87ed9856.jpg

[Anonymous No.4006675]

>>4006670
I'm ESL

[Anonymous No.4006680]

>>4006332
It doesn't matter
I'm going to keep doing it regardless of what anyone says

[Anonymous No.4006682]

>>4006668
Most of these people count teens as CP.

[Anonymous No.4006718]

>>4006682
GOD FUCKING DAMN IT

[Anonymous No.4006722]

[Anonymous No.4006752]

>>4006668
>>4006682
>>4006718
But teenagers ARE children.

[Anonymous No.4006762]

>>4006752
Those children are already fucking since they were 13

[Anonymous No.4006778]

>>4006347
This argument wont hold, a photograph of cheese pizza is just ink on paper

[Anonymous No.4006781]

>>4006778
A photograph is merely the capturing of something in real life, like a video. You'd still have to get within proximity of a child and do shit to get the pictures.
A drawing is an entirely fictional depiction of something regardless of whether it actually happened or not and no one was taken advantage of in anyway to create it.

[Anonymous No.4006787]

>>4006332
I'm not into loli or even porn in general but I think outright banning art of any kind is retarded and shouldn't be done under any circumstance, and that includes smut.
In the case of loli there's no harm done to real children, and nothing proving that loli smut turns people into pedophiles or pushes them to act on their urges. There's NO proof of that, zero, it's just like any other fetish, you're just rambling about things you don't like because you don't like them and would rather complain about it rather than getting over yourself and accepting that not everyone shares your sensibilities.

[Anonymous No.4006791]

>>4006332
ITT Americucks that cannot differentiate between fiction and reality. How about we start banning "violent" media such as FPS games that are gorey? You wouldn't be against that, anon, would you? Otherwise you'd be complicit in murder by your logic.

[Anonymous No.4006888]

>>4006722
Based

[Anonymous No.4006931]

>>4006344
the problem with your test is that anime characters are often very close to effect of putting "stylized" 2D face on drawing of roughly regular body.
If you cover the faces I don't believe you would get the same results.

[Anonymous No.4006976]

the argument against loli isnt that it turns people into pedos, its that pedos use it to normalize it and groom teens into thinking its normal

happened to me, a middle aged man sweet talked his shota kink onto me as a teen and convinced me that 14 yr olds having sex with 35 yr olds was normal and actually really sexy

i think theres a study out there on victims that have been groomed using fictional media but idk what id even search to find it so take it with a grain of salt

either way it shouldnt be banned (no form of media should) but people should be careful

[Anonymous No.4007184]

>>4006976
That's a problem and all but parents should be aware and teach their kids from a young age to be wary of pedos. It's not the fault of the artist.

[Anonymous No.4007295]

>>4006332
Children are not some other alien species that suddenly become human when they hit 18yo and there's nothing sacred about them, you were a shit eating kid once, likely still are.

Censorship and banning never works, you give them a hand and they take your whole arm because institutions that exist to uphold denial are always filled with power-hungry busibodies. It also promotes an underground that eventually escalates into worse things.

Baning depictiosn of children even if you only ban certain depictions of children, will invariably lead to even the guys that draw Precious Moments postcards to be chastized as potential pedos because the zealotry of persecutors is never sated. Not banning depictions of children makes it so only those who draw heinous shit get ostracized as is already the case.

[Anonymous No.4007300]

>>4006639
But that's racism!

[Anonymous No.4007309]

>>4006344
this

[Anonymous No.4007315]

>>4006392
Actually it's the opposite
anyone who viciously attacks Lolichads is a closet pedo or a seething roastie who can't fathom the fact that people give attention to something that doesn't exist instead of their instragram

[Anonymous No.4007322]

>>4007315
Is it really a surprise pedos want loli banned when it's linked to the diminishing demand for actual "young" porn in japan?
If loli became the norm no one would ever risk making cheese pizza again, and they can't allow that.

[Anonymous No.4007413]

>>4006332
I had a furious argument with a friend about this the other day. My stance was no drawing should ever be banned, he thought depictions of loli and such should be banned if the average person thinks it should be. To show his point of view he constructed a metaphor: What if there are robots so advanced they are indistinguishable from humans, except they are not sentient? You can do what you want with them, from rape to murder, and privacy is guaranteed. Would that increase related acts in society?

I thought his metaphor was completely retarded because it does not even enter into the discussion of drawings that are purposefully made unrealistic, and pointed out it's literally the exact argument concerned parents made about videogames (real depiction=normalize/increase prevalence). Actually any argument based on ''normalization'' is bullshit because how the hell do you even predict what happens? It's always a completely imaginary scenario

[Anonymous No.4007421]

>>4006787
History has taught us again and again those against Loli/Shota are the real deal cheese pizza pedos almost every time.

[Anonymous No.4007428]

>>4006976
You shitting me?
Pedos use everything to close to kids Pokémon is a big favorite
It’s their racket and they jump for thing to thing just to get closer to kids

[Anonymous No.4007433]

>>4007413
That's more an argument against the 3d stuff. A smiley face with a head too big for its body without breaking its own neck is not indistinguishable from a human.

[Anonymous No.4007449]

>>4007433
The 3D stuff I kind of get
Computer graphics are getting good
Too good Like Siren
https://youtu.be/9owTAISsvwk

Everything about her makes me uncomfortable.
It’s like she’s a human but it scares me because something about it’s not quite right.
It’s like my caveman side of my brain automatically hates it and wants it destroyed

[Anonymous No.4007459]

>>4006332
A PERSON CAN DRAW WHATEVER THEY WANT WHENEVER THEY WANT. END OF DISCUSSION.

I don't draw weird stuff but I don't have the right to decide what you can draw.

Don't give ears to these commie ideas, we all know what they want.

[Anonymous No.4007512]

>>4006752
No lol, I had sex with my male teacher when I was like 11. :D He was in his 20s. I'm a boy btw. If I had to recall back then, my other classmates also had sex, mostly oral because no one actually knows the peepee must penetrated somewhere beneath.

[Anonymous No.4007517]

>>4007449
shes still moving in fps
the world you view through your own eyes can't be defined or described as an arbitrary number of still images

[Anonymous No.4007540]

>>4007428
if you really dont see the specific danger of using porn that visualizes a kid with the adult as opposed to a shared interest you are a brainlet

like what retarded logic are you using there pal

>>4007184
agreed (mostly)
like porn shops and other mature stuff, there are age gates. its harder to put age gates online which is just impossible on the internet.

i was taught all the do's and dont's of online interaction and was restricted online growing up yet my 80 iq ass still found my way onto 4chan

its a really hard subject with no real answer but that doesnt mean we cant look at lolicon critically

[Anonymous No.4007545]

>>4007315
This would never become not funny

[Anonymous No.4007605]

>>4006332
You can and should be allowed to draw whatever. It doesn't harm a irl child so you haven't done something worthy of punishment.

But you also shouldn't expect to not be viewed as a fuckin weirdo if you drawing sexualizedd kids.

So no legal repercussions but all the social ones you would expect for being a neckbeard.

[Anonymous No.4007685]

>>4007315
>goldberg

[Anonymous No.4007702]

>>4006344
>trusting normies to make the definition on realistic or not

they are the reason loli is banned on most platforms, they make instant emotional judgement "well its gross so i dont want it here" garbage takes. trusting them not to fuck up something as basic as the too realistic to tell argument is a mistake

[Anonymous No.4007705]

>>4007702
>normies
anyone who uses this word is, by the very definition of the word, a "normie"

[Anonymous No.4007717]

>>4007705
things are things because i said so

[Anonymous No.4007722]

>>4006332
Anyone who censors art must be shot. The production and consumption of art is the reason for man's existence.

[Anonymous No.4007724]

>>4006332

I have always thought that if we can depict torture, killing, whatever in all kinds of media I don't see how making sexual stuff illegal makes any sense. Many times in anime, manga ,hentai or doujins those controversial characters don't even act like children at all. How do you define mental capacity of a fictional character? Or should we just ban it because of the dark motivations the artist might have? What about a superhero comic artist who might like drawing violence and killing but is never accused of it because "he is just killing the bad guys?"

[Anonymous No.4007725]

>>4007724
Some seriously fucked up shit has happened to 'bad guys' in films. Awful ways to die in many cases.
Violence is fine tho.

[Anonymous No.4007901]

>>4007722
daily reminder that porn is not art

[Anonymous No.4007917]

>>4007724
Anon, it's fine to kill the russians, they are bad, they aren't human, just like all the loli fans, they aren't human either, they are evil and deserve to die.
I on the other hand, the person who wants to see these people tortured and killed am a completely nice human being that would never hurt anyone (who doesn't DESERVE to be hurt, according to me of course) hehe ;)

Just like how I would've loved to kill all the jews if I were a German back in the day. Because it was SOCIALLY acceptable to hate them and see them as lesser humans. But hey, it's not ME that's cruel, it's all the people who deserve to be MURDERED (in my opinion) because they DREW loli porn :DD

[Anonymous No.4007919]

>>4006722
Sauce?

[Anonymous No.4007920]

>>4007315
Friendly reminder.

[Anonymous No.4007921]

>>4007413
> To show his point of view he constructed a metaphor
This is where you should have called him a cocksucker and stopped any further discussion.

[Anonymous No.4007926]

>>4007919
BBC documentary "young sex for sale in japan"

[Anonymous No.4007928]

>>4006682
Your average 14 year old girl has fucked more than most guys on this board.

[Anonymous No.4007985]

>>4006332
cp isn't illegal because society is kinkshaming pedos, it's illegal because in order to produce it it requires the rape of children and demand for it incentivizes more kids being raped.
A drawing is nothing more than 2d lines, 2d lines don't have bodies and cannot be raped, they have no feelings and they will likely not end up traumatized.
You could make a drawing even if you were the last human being in existence, the same could not be said about cp.
tl;dr: cp is child abuse, drawings aren't, so who gives a fuck what people draw?

[Anonymous No.4008011]

>>4007985
> in order to produce it it requires the rape of children and demand for it incentivizes more kids being raped.
Unless the child consents

[Anonymous No.4008814]

>>4007722
Has there even been an instance in history where a censoring institution didn't devolve into a power-hungry tyrant that had to be put down?

[Anonymous No.4009756]

>>4008814
No. Never.

[Anonymous No.4010658]

>>4006722
>>4007919
>>4007926
>BBC
>Legit and honest

[Anonymous No.4011086]

>>4006332

S-sauce?

[Anonymous No.4011127]

>>4007920
the feminist symbol always gets me. it's like they love to be fisted in their nether holes.

[Anonymous No.4011158]

>>4008011
>Child
>Consent
Pick one.

[Anonymous No.4011195]

>>4007322
Evert since watching that Maddie Mccann documentary on Netflix, I've become convinced that it's the rich pedo networks that push to criminalize CGI renders. Not only would CGI devalue actual CP while being far less costly to produce, it would break their underground security system which is based on trading original/self-produced CP. If they can't distinguish CGI and real CP, anyone can infiltrate their networks.

[Anonymous No.4011229]

>>4011086
Its a political comic about immigrants in Sweden

[Anonymous No.4011446]

>>4011229
>that cop
>in sweden
Dumb amerilard, anyway heres a reminder, 56%

[Anonymous No.4011458]

>>4007985
Im pretty sure its illegal because the government cant tax it

[Anonymous No.4011473]

>>4007605
Best post itt

[Anonymous No.4011487]

>>4007605
Fine with that aslong as i get to hide who i am in real life.

[Anonymous No.4011488]

>>4006332
>Lets settle this once for all
>loli thread #237634 / 809534332

[Anonymous No.4012518]

>>4006332
Art is about expression, if you have the ability, you should be able to create anything and not be restricted. As long as no laws were broken making the piece, I don't think there's anything wrong with it. If you draw someone being killed, does that make you a killer? If you draw a man does that make you gay? If you draw a child does it make you a pedophile? I don't think so.

[Anonymous No.4012522]

>>4011086

[Anonymous No.4014703]

>>4011086
>>4012522
full cartoon >>4006674