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2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

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3957911 No.3957911 [Reply] [Original]

Is it more cost effective to get a Cintiq 16, or a Surface (which can be used as an extended display for a higher spec machine)? They're both a similar price

>> No.3957912

>>3957911
i've only ever heard bad things about the surface

>> No.3957933

don't bother with screen tablets unless they're 20+ inches

>> No.3960329

Honestly I’d say just get an iPad unless you really need that extended display on a non mac machine.
I’ve really only heard negative things about the surface also, and they’re comparatively overpriced compared to iPads unless the windows os adds like 1000 in worth to you.

>> No.3960398

>>3957912
This

>> No.3960427
File: 33 KB, 680x544, 902.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3960427

>>3960329
>tfw have a 12.9 ipad pro and the apple pencil coming in the mail
comfy times ahead

>> No.3960496

>>3957911
Best to worse order:
Cintiq Pro 16 > iPad Pro 3 > iPad Air 3 > Cintiq 16 > Kamvas Pro 16 > iPad 6 > generic chinese pen-displays > shit > Android devices > Microsoft Surface

Cost effective order:
iPad 6 > iPad Air 3 > Kamvas Pro 16 > Cintiq 16 > iPad Pro 3 > generic chinese pen-displays > Android devices > Microsoft Surface

>> No.3960542
File: 3.60 MB, 3687x2765, IMG_20190606_151523.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3960542

>>3960427
with iOS 13 coming up, you can start using your fav Xbone/PS4 controller + a game streaming app and start gaming on your ipad too.

>> No.3960605

What specific bad things about the Surface have you heard?

>> No.3960615

>>3960496
Actually Samsun EMR pens are the same ones from Wacom Cintiqs and with virtual tablet can be used as drawing tablets for your PC
So it would be wacom cintiq -> Samsung S3/S4/Note

>> No.3960722

>>3960496
Where does Cintiq 13hd lie on that order?

>> No.3960730

>>3960722
Above Chinese knock-off displays. Same quality and last a lot longer.

>> No.3960749

>>3960329
You can use the iPad pro on a windows machine as an extended display.

>> No.3960750

>>3960542
oh look a NGMIer

>> No.3960755

>>3960615
This
I do lineart on my note 10.1 2014 and finish coloring on photoshop with the virtual tablet app turning the Note into a wacom pad for my PC

>> No.3960778

>>3960605
Terrible support.
Expensive.
Zig-zaggy lines when drawing diagonal straight lines, you are forced to use stabilization if your software has it. So if you're looking to do your manga lineart work on it prepare to use that.
Pen itself is shit, only one button, so it can't be used for 3d modeling or sculpting as many people just assume.
Some SP4 models suffered from Flickergate problem and there was no fix for it so Microsoft just asked customers to return their defective devices. (and if you live in a third world shithole like me you're fucked for good)

Honestly it's simply not worth that much money.
But if you already have one, it's nice for digital painting, and simple college stuff like taking notes. Better than carrying a 6kg gamer laptop in your backpack, sure.
If you plug a mouse and keyboard you can 3D model on it too.

>> No.3960784

>>3960615
but anon
you're wrong

>> No.3960791

get a surface 3 pro you can get one for about 250+ .

>> No.3960839

>>3960784
Nope ^__^
Feel free to shill for whatever company you're paid to. That does not stop the wacom EMR pens being available only on Samsung and Wacom products

>> No.3961042

>>3960755
What app do you use?
I have an old one lying about.

>> No.3961070

>>3960749
Oh yeah, I should've added an asterisk explaining that it's possible but not as smooth of an experience. Plus I think the best options for it involve purchasing/subbing another program

>> No.3961956

>>3960778
You can use a wacom pen on it can't you?

>> No.3962387

>>3961956
I think so yes. The Bamboo pen. But afaik it doesn't make any drastic improvement.
You can also plug in a wacom intuos or similar, but kinda defeats the purpose of the surface.

>> No.3962444

>>3957911
I say go for it if you also need a new laptop and want to take this to draw whereever you go, but if you have a PC at home the better drawing experience will be the Cintiq.

>> No.3962469

>>3960778
This anon is right it pretty much has all these problems, but its still my main machine because what it DOES do that the other alternatives don't.

+Full windows desktop capable of running photoshop CC to full capabilities (16GB Ram needed)
+Way more portable than the Cintiq Companions
+Can run full usb peripherals, I have it setup to use a orbweaver and hooked up to external USB powered tablet monitor when I'm at conventions, using just power bank to supply electricity (I have to be able to fly with my entire setup)
+Very good screen, I don't even need to adjust colors for print on a calibrated screen because its close enough to the final result from my printer that there's no need.

Line jitter can be compensated by drawing fast lines. Since I've been using my SP4 for the last 3 years or so, I no longer draw any slow lines, everything is fast strokes. It's sped up my art process significantly and also made my linework look more natural.

But if you need to ink slowly then you definitely need to use a stabilizer.

Basically my full setup is completely portable and there's no need to switch to a different device when I'm at home vs travelling or at conventions.

But yeah, unless you have very specific needs that require all of these niche things that the Surface Pro does offer, the other alternatives are better.

>> No.3962562

>>3960496
That is one of the most accurate power rankings I’ve seen in years. The only thing I disagree with is the cost effectiveness of the iPads because of the subscription model for CSP and that PS isn’t out. That and the os is trash and the screen size is shit, but I’m a size queen and androidfag so even the 12.9 Pro isn’t delivering other than the screen and size.

>> No.3963052

>>3962469
Good points. Though Photoshop is coming Soon to iPads and calibration for them, especially the pros are probably pretty good.
>>3962562
Fair though as a previous Androidfag (neutral now) I find it's actually good and the 9.7 is comfy.

>> No.3963060

personally I would always opt for a standalone desktop pc.
As for the tablet the cintiq 16 is an amazing piece of hardware a really big change from the flimsy huion like tablet, amazing color calibrstion off the box as welll, probably my best art related purchase so far

>> No.3963561

>>3963052
Forgot the main reason I replied to the second post was to say that Procreate is filling out to be a pretty good replacement. Only one time payment of ten bucks and it now does everything I want besides a better line smoothing tool. Right now it feels different to what other programs have and doesn't smooth as much but I've gotten mostly used to it by just gaining actual steady hand skills.

>> No.3963668

>>3963561
I still think it has a ways to go. Gradients, filters, a binary pen, a few tools that CSP has. It's amazing for 10 bucks but doesn't do that 10 percent of shit that makes Photoshop indispensable. I hate the stabilizer because it's clearly designed for calligraphy and fucks my lines more than it fixes them. Procreate is definitely the strongest selling point and I hope the paradigm and gestures are more widely adopted but as it stands, 1300 dollars and I still have to fire up Photoshop for occasional big boy work. I don't even know if that's a complaint, I really fucking hate Photoshop.

Y'know, maybe the smaller iPads are pretty cost effective. Above 10 inches. I'd get a 15 if it existed so I'm biased but under 10ish and you can't think big or work comfortably. That inch makes a huge difference in my experience. It's like the difference between painting a postcard and a half sheet in how you view the work.

Move the 6 down into wacom territory and the pro above the shittiq (who even gets a babby pro? I bought it over that cintiq) and you may be on to something.

>> No.3963784

>>3957911
I implore you NOT to get a Surface Pro if you want to use it for any sort of serious drawing.

Terrible parralax, line jittter and palm rejection problems plague every one. They are truly an awful drawing experience.

>> No.3963981

>>3957911
SURFACE
IS
NOT
AN
ARTIST
TOOL
It's a gimmick
The cheapest wacoms work better than the best surface.

>> No.3966626

>>3957911
Tech question, should be in /g, I believe.

>> No.3966632

>>3963981
I'm the world's biggest surface fan, and as much as I want to disagree, this is correct.

Too often in my experience (owning every surface since the first - currently on the SP2017) Microsoft deploys updates that make the device unusable for artists with pen wiggle and more - and it takes them months to get even a shitty fix done. I love my surface - but it's not a tool for artists, it's a marketing ploy made to draw artists in, but in the long run, it's far more viable as a crappy drawing pad. Portable but kinda fragile, and its ok if you just want to do a quick study in the park or something, but it's definitely not ideal for longer finished works. Get a real device for that.

Runs games surprisingly well though (mine's i7, 8gb). I do love the device, but it's not a great primary drawing pad.

>> No.3966764

>>3966632
yea i just bought a pro 3 i5 with 8gb.( i wanted the i7 but bf talked me out of it) I think its a great tablet for something on the go for quick sketching and stuff. also its the only tablet atm that strong and cheap (older models)...the chinese window tablets is like a lottery, atleast with the surface youre getting something decent . The jitter problem sounds annoying but i dont really draw slow and i only plan on drawing comp on the tablet.

>> No.3966897

>>3962469
I have a Surface Pro 4, it was my first big purchase after I got my first job at 18 like 3 years ago. I agree with this post, especially with the no longer drawing slow lines and the faster art process. Plus the bonus of not owning an apple product

>> No.3967004

>>3960755
>virtual tablet app
what app? Please tell me.

>> No.3967859

>>3966764
If you're poor use Krita and use the stabalizer in the brush options
While the jitter is terribly annoying, a stabalizer counteracts it while being a crutch to an extent but it does make it more than usual

>>3967004
Here you go
http://www.sunnysidesoft.com/virtualtablet/
I think you can pirate the android APK, not sure.
It takes a few tries for me to make it work over USB but it's fucking great when it does. Wi-fi is pretty laggy and I'm not sure how bluetooth is

>> No.3968199

>>3957912
>>3960329
>"I've only ever heard bad things"
Mac drones parroting the exact same talking points

>> No.3968444

>>3967859
thank you friend